From bcradsafers at hotmail.com Thu Dec 1 03:59:51 2005 From: bcradsafers at hotmail.com (Bjorn Cedervall) Date: Thu, 01 Dec 2005 09:59:51 +0000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] New Radiation Protection Unit? The Taylor (Ty) In-Reply-To: <018f01c5f076$048a8040$6801a8c0@S0029339641> Message-ID: >Personally, I would not want to sully the great reputation of Lauriston Taylor by linking it to some of the recent ruminations of the ICRP. Nowadays there are great opportunities to get involved in the development of the ICRP publications including those related to dosimetry. Next major draft of the recommendations will be very important so please involve with constructive criticism (practical aspects included). Concerning the LNT concept (which was commented again by some Radsafers) - it is mainly there for decision making (chosing between alternatives) - not counting future cancer cases. This aspect has, during recent years, repetedly been emphasized by ICRP representatives. (I usually delete most Radsafers arguments about the LNT because most of the discussion leads nowhere - the epidemiological resolution must always be poor as the dose goes down - the world of cell biology indicates phenomena that could go either way). My personal ideas only, Bjorn Cedervall bcradsafers at hotmail.com From frantaj at aecl.ca Thu Dec 1 07:40:22 2005 From: frantaj at aecl.ca (Franta, Jaroslav) Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2005 08:40:22 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Patrick Moore to speak in Montreal, Monday, December 5, 2005 -- C OP 11/ MOP 1 Message-ID: <0F8BD87EE693D411A1A500508BAC86F70B4F5238@sps13.aecl.ca> Let's Take a Fresh Look at Nuclear as Part of the Solution Side Event organized by ENS YGN and NA-YGN and featuring Dr. Patrick Moore, Co-founder of Greenpeace Founder of Greenspirit Monday, December 5, 2005 19:30-21:00 Room Mackenzie River Palais des Congr?s de Montr?al Theme: As the debates on finding solutions to mitigate global climate change while ensuring the security of electricity supply continue, many leading politicians and scientists are calling for swift reconsideration of the role of nuclear power. This side event aims to present facts and concerns that will lead to an effective discussion on which criteria and values should be considered when determining the possible role of nuclear power in addressing environmental and economic issues. Presenting his thoughts on how nuclear power must be part of the solution to global warming will be Dr. Patrick Moore. Keynote Speaker: Dr. Moore has been a leader in the international environmental field for over 30 years. He is a founding member of Greenpeace and served for nine years as President of Greenpeace Canada and seven years as a Director of Greenpeace International. Dr Moore led many campaigns and was a driving force in shaping the policy and activities that made Greenpeace the world's largest environmental activist organization. Recently, Dr. Moore has worked to promote sustainability and create consensus among those with competing concerns. He was appointed to the British Columbia Round Table on the Environment and Economy and served from 1990 to 1994. In 1990, Dr. Moore founded and chaired the BC Carbon Project, a group that endeavoured to develop a common understanding of climate change In 1991 Dr. Moore founded Greenspirit, a consultancy focusing on environmental policy and communications in natural resources, biodiversity, energy and climate change. In 2000, he published Green Spirit - Trees are the Answer, a book that provides new insight into how forests work and the powerful role they can play in solving many of our current environmental problems. Moderators: * Ms. Lisa Stiles-Shell, President, North American Young Generation in Nuclear (NA-YGN) * Martin Luthander, Representative (Sweden), European Nuclear Society Young Generation Network (ENS YGN) *Snacks and refreshments will be served at the end of the event. For more information, please visit our websites: NA-YGN: http://www.na-ygn.org ENS YGN: http://www.euronuclear.org/aboutus/yg/young.htm CONFIDENTIAL AND PRIVILEGED INFORMATION NOTICE This e-mail, and any attachments, may contain information that is confidential, subject to copyright, or exempt from disclosure. Any unauthorized review, disclosure, retransmission, dissemination or other use of or reliance on this information may be unlawful and is strictly prohibited. AVIS D'INFORMATION CONFIDENTIELLE ET PRIVIL?GI?E Le pr?sent courriel, et toute pi?ce jointe, peut contenir de l'information qui est confidentielle, r?gie par les droits d'auteur, ou interdite de divulgation. Tout examen, divulgation, retransmission, diffusion ou autres utilisations non autoris?es de l'information ou d?pendance non autoris?e envers celle-ci peut ?tre ill?gale et est strictement interdite. From Joseph_Ring at Harvard.edu Thu Dec 1 10:27:41 2005 From: Joseph_Ring at Harvard.edu (Joseph Ring) Date: Thu, 01 Dec 2005 11:27:41 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Lead Technician Opening at Harvard Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20051201112607.042f34f0@camail.harvard.edu> I would appreciate it if you would help me by passing this announcement for a lead HP tech to those who may be interested. If some one is interested in the position they can contact me directly, but the application must be made on the website (see below) to meet University requirements. Joe Ring Harvard University Radiation Protection Office Lead Technician Duties and Responsibilities This position is the lead field person for radiation safety services supporting the world class research at the University and some Harvard affiliated institutions. The Radiation Protection Office (RPO) is a program that currently services over 4,200 users on 10 campuses with an expanding customer base. This position joins a group of more than 40 technical professionals providing safety services to the University. The successful candidate leads the field services to ensure prompt and effective delivery of services. Monitors implementation status and conducts quality assurance of operational services. Candidate must be creative and energetic to motivate and lead staff to deliver exceptionally high quality radiation safety services and outstanding customer service. Required Education: This position requires a college or technical school graduate with course work related to health physics or environmental sciences preferred, or an equivalent combination of education, training and work experience. Three or more years related work experience in radiation protection program required. Candidate must possess a valid Massachusetts license and must have or be capable of obtaining a Commercial Drivers License. Candidate must possess strong oral and written communications skills and must be proficient in the use of computers. Must take initiative, be organized, able to manage multiple priorities, work independently and as part of a team. May be required to wear a respirator and other personal protective equipment. Must be capable of responding to emergencies and receive requisite training. Overtime may be occasionally required. UOS requires pre-employment drug, reference and background screening. Qualified candidates should apply on-line at www.atwork.harvard.edu Requisition #24981. Joseph P. Ring, Ph.D., CHP Radiation Safety Officer Harvard University 175 North Harvard Street Boston, MA 02134 Telephone: 617 495-8795 FAX: 617 496-5509 Email: Joseph_ring at harvard.edu Radiation Protection Office email: radiation_protection at harvard.edu http://www.uos.harvard.edu/ehs/rad.shtml This document may contain information that is privileged, CONFIDENTIAL and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient, please destroy the email and notify me immediately, as the use of this information is strictly prohibited. From fd003f0606 at blueyonder.co.uk Thu Dec 1 11:04:12 2005 From: fd003f0606 at blueyonder.co.uk (Fred Dawson) Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2005 17:04:12 -0000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] It pays to question the media Message-ID: <002301c5f699$409f2d50$0400a8c0@DG47BM0J> I recently had cause to complain to the BBC about an article on their news web site about Iraq, the environment and depleted uranium. The original article contained a photograph of a child with an eye tumour suggesting a link between the tumour and exposure to depleted uranium. I complained on the basis that there was no evidence to support the link between depleted uranium and eye tumours. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4425562.stm The BBC acknowledged my point and changed the caption on the photograph in question, here is their reply Dear Mr Dawson Thank you for your e-mail regarding BBC News Online. May I start by apologising for the delay in replying. We know our correspondents expect a swift response and I am sorry that you have had to wait so long on this occasion. I rasied your concerns about the picture and caption which accompanies the 'UN warns on Iraq environment fate' piece with BBC News Online. They explained that the picture of Alla Saleem was supplied to the BBC as one of a number of cases at Gazwan hospital in Basra which doctors have attributed to depleted uranium shells used by coalition forces. However, as the article itself does not mention the particular case of Alla Saleem they have decided, to amend the caption to a more general point about Iraqi health. The picture caption has now been changed from "Alla Saleem developed an eye tumour linked to depleted uranium (Pic: 2001)" to "Iraqi doctors say cancer cases have increased, especially among children". Thank you again for contacting the BBC. Yours sincerely Stewart McCullough Divisional Advisor BBC Information ---Original Message--- {Comments:} Please can you provide evidence to support your claim in the report on the News WWW site http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4425562.stm releating to Iraq that 'la Saleem developed an eye tumour linked to depleted uranium' To the best of my knowledge there is no scientific or factual basis for this assertion {EndofComments:} ----------------------------------- fwp_dawson at hotmail.com From David.Wesley at ehs.ucr.edu Thu Dec 1 11:56:53 2005 From: David.Wesley at ehs.ucr.edu (Wesley, David) Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2005 09:56:53 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] FW: Call for papers, CSHEMA Conf 2006 Message-ID: <2FDAAD8654C69E4585917F55804580E2CAE504@ehs.ucr.edu> Join us for the 2006 CSHEMA Conference at the Disneyland Resort in Anaheim, California-- The nation's premiere conference on campus health, safety and environmental management! Campus Safety Health and Environmental Management Association CSHEMA CONFERENCE 2006 DISNEYLAND RESORT, ANAHEIM, CALIFORNIA CALL FOR PAPERS Submittals Accepted January 2 - March 31, 2006! Conference dates: July 15-19, 2006 Professional Development Seminars, July 15-16, Technical Sessions, July 17-19 The Nation's Premiere Conference on Campus Health, Safety and Environmental Management! CSHEMA provides information sharing opportunities, continuing education, and professional fellowship to people with environmental health and safety responsibilities in the education and research communities. Visit www.cshema.org/ to learn more about CSHEMA. Real World Solutions! The annual CSHEMA conference focuses on practical and interdisciplinary issues facing university and college campuses. At CSHEMA 2006, you will interact with other campus health, safety and environmental professionals and learn what programs in the following focus areas are successful. Please check the conference website at www.cshema2006.org for more information. Focus Areas Emergency Management Management Issues Health * Severe Weather * Wildfires * Earthquakes * Pandemic Planning * Program Management * Management Systems & Metrics * Biosafety * Nanotechnology Safety Environment Other Issues * Fire/ Life Safety * Accident Prevention * General Safety * Training * Laboratory Safety * Safety for Non-Safety Professionals * Hazardous Materials Security/ Risk Assessment * Sustainability * EPA * Waste * Green Chemistry * Size and Scope * Small Campus Challenges * Regional and International * Canada * Europe * Asia * Southern California Technical Session Format * Presentations * Roundtables * Workshops * An Expanded Poster Session! Schedule Technical Sessions will be scheduled all day Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday. Submittal Information Please see www.cshema2006.org for information on how to submit your abstract. Abstracts submitted from vendors must be partnered with a college or university representative that participates in a presentation. Contact Information Contact the Technical Committee Chair, Ross Grayson at ross.grayson at ucr.edu or 951-827-6324 if you have any questions. Hosted by the University of California, Irvine, and University of California, Riverside Ross Grayson, M.P.H., C.I.H. Director Environmental Health and Safety University of California, Riverside Riverside, CA 92521 ross.grayson at ucr.edu 951-827-6324 Direct 951-827-5528 Admin 951-827-5122 Fax http://ehs.ucr.edu/ Join us for the 2006 CSHEMA Conference at the Disneyland Resort in Anaheim, California-- The nation's premiere conference on campus health, safety and environmental management! From loc at icx.net Thu Dec 1 14:53:06 2005 From: loc at icx.net (Susan Gawarecki) Date: Thu, 01 Dec 2005 15:53:06 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] High court backs 'sloshed' trucker - State justices: Hauler of OR waste disabled, due workers' comp Message-ID: <438F62B2.7030304@icx.net> High court backs 'sloshed' trucker - State justices: Hauler of OR waste disabled, due workers' comp Knoxville News Sentinel By JAMIE SATTERFIELD, satterfield at knews.com December 1, 2005 When William H. "Red" Saylor was "sloshed" with what he believed was radioactive waste, he freaked out. And, in an opinion released Wednesday, the [Tennessee] state Supreme Court is holding his employer responsible. In an opinion drafted by Justice Janice M. Holder, the state's high court upheld a lower court ruling that Saylor, though not physically injured, was rendered mentally disabled by the June 1999 incident and is entitled to collect workers' compensation from Lakeway Trucking Inc. in Morristown. "We conclude that the record and the applicable law support the trial court's determination that the employee's mental injuries arose out of and in the course of his employment and that the employee is 100 percent permanently disabled with respect to his mental faculties," Holder wrote. J. Eric Harrison, a Morristown lawyer who represented the 65-year-old Saylor with attorney J. Randall Shelton, said his client will be "thrilled" at the news. "Obviously, we're pleased and glad it was upheld," Harrison said. "This was an extremely complex and interesting case." Lakeway attorney Gene Paul Gaby was unavailable for comment Wednesday afternoon. Saylor has been a truck driver since he was 15. He dropped out of school in the eighth grade. In June 1999 he was working as a truck driver for Lakeway, which had been contracted to deliver hazardous waste from Oak Ridge to a dump site in Clive, Utah. According to the appellate court opinion, Saylor and fellow driver Lloyd Orrick arrived at the site only to be turned away. "The workers at the disposal site refused to accept either load and ordered Saylor to transport the material from the area because of fears that the material would explode," the opinion stated. After the two truckers parked their rigs at a truck stop overnight and returned to the dump site the next day, they were again turned away. The pair returned to the truck stop. But as Saylor was backing up his rig, "he saw Orrick standing near the trailer and waving his arms," the opinion stated. As it turned out, the pod housing the liquid waste had sprung a leak, Holder wrote. Some of the sludgy waste splashed onto Orrick's shirt. Some "sloshed" onto Saylor's face, chest and shirt, the court stated. "Saylor testified that the liquid went in his mouth and on the side of his face, on his chest and on his shirt," Holder wrote. "Saylor stated to Orrick, 'You've got it on you, and it's going to kill you. Now, if it ain't killed me, too, now.'?" The two showered and contacted a Lakeway employee, who told the pair to sit tight. Orrick apparently handled the wait far better than Saylor, who the court said "felt ill and was afraid that he and Orrick might die." Ultimately, Saylor's shirt was tested and the stuff on it deemed not radioactive. But the court noted that it took "more than two weeks" before Saylor "could be assured that his clothing provided no evidence of radioactivity." By then, Saylor was already in the throes of what doctors later diagnosed as post-traumatic stress syndrome, anxiety and depression, the opinion stated. Neighbors and a caregiver testified that Saylor was beset with anxiety and depression. He had such severe nightmares that his caregiver often tied her ankle to his at night so he wouldn't leap from the bed and hurt himself, the court wrote. A key issue for the high court was whether Saylor's fears were rational, noting that the court had refused to grant benefits in another case to a medical employee who had an "irrational fear of exposure to HIV" after a work-related incident. "In contrast, the hazardousness of the material to which Saylor was exposed was not based upon mere speculation," the court wrote. "The pods were labeled radioactive." http://www.knoxnews.com/kns/local_news/article/0,1406,KNS_347_4279564,00.html From radbloom at comcast.net Thu Dec 1 15:21:49 2005 From: radbloom at comcast.net (Cindy Bloom) Date: Thu, 01 Dec 2005 16:21:49 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] High court backs 'sloshed' trucker - State justices: Hauler of OR waste disabled, due workers' comp In-Reply-To: <438F62B2.7030304@icx.net> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20051201161328.034ca1a8@mail.comcast.net> Wow, This sure does underline the importance of training, putting risks in perspective and providing prompt as well as continuous information to workers who might be exposed to materials or environments that have a potential to cause harm if exposures are sufficiently high. Cindy At 03:53 PM 12/1/2005 -0500, Susan Gawarecki wrote: >High court backs 'sloshed' trucker - State justices: Hauler of OR waste >disabled, due workers' comp >Knoxville News Sentinel >By JAMIE SATTERFIELD, satterfield at knews.com >December 1, 2005 > >When William H. "Red" Saylor was "sloshed" with what he believed was >radioactive waste, he freaked out. And, in an opinion released Wednesday, >the [Tennessee] state Supreme Court is holding his employer responsible. > >In an opinion drafted by Justice Janice M. Holder, the state's high court >upheld a lower court ruling that Saylor, though not physically injured, >was rendered mentally disabled by the June 1999 incident and is entitled >to collect workers' compensation from Lakeway Trucking Inc. in >Morristown. "We conclude that the record and the applicable law support >the trial court's determination that the employee's mental injuries arose >out of and in the course of his employment and that the employee is 100 >percent permanently disabled with respect to his mental faculties," Holder >wrote. > >J. Eric Harrison, a Morristown lawyer who represented the 65-year-old >Saylor with attorney J. Randall Shelton, said his client will be >"thrilled" at the news. "Obviously, we're pleased and glad it was upheld," >Harrison said. "This was an extremely complex and interesting case." > >Lakeway attorney Gene Paul Gaby was unavailable for comment Wednesday >afternoon. > >Saylor has been a truck driver since he was 15. He dropped out of school >in the eighth grade. In June 1999 he was working as a truck driver for >Lakeway, which had been contracted to deliver hazardous waste from Oak >Ridge to a dump site in Clive, Utah. > >According to the appellate court opinion, Saylor and fellow driver Lloyd >Orrick arrived at the site only to be turned away. "The workers at the >disposal site refused to accept either load and ordered Saylor to >transport the material from the area because of fears that the material >would explode," the opinion stated. > >After the two truckers parked their rigs at a truck stop overnight and >returned to the dump site the next day, they were again turned away. The >pair returned to the truck stop. But as Saylor was backing up his rig, "he >saw Orrick standing near the trailer and waving his arms," the opinion >stated. As it turned out, the pod housing the liquid waste had sprung a >leak, Holder wrote. > >Some of the sludgy waste splashed onto Orrick's shirt. Some "sloshed" onto >Saylor's face, chest and shirt, the court stated. "Saylor testified that >the liquid went in his mouth and on the side of his face, on his chest and >on his shirt," Holder wrote. "Saylor stated to Orrick, 'You've got it on >you, and it's going to kill you. Now, if it ain't killed me, too, now.'?" > >The two showered and contacted a Lakeway employee, who told the pair to >sit tight. Orrick apparently handled the wait far better than Saylor, who >the court said "felt ill and was afraid that he and Orrick might die." >Ultimately, Saylor's shirt was tested and the stuff on it deemed not >radioactive. But the court noted that it took "more than two weeks" before >Saylor "could be assured that his clothing provided no evidence of >radioactivity." By then, Saylor was already in the throes of what doctors >later diagnosed as post-traumatic stress syndrome, anxiety and depression, >the opinion stated. Neighbors and a caregiver testified that Saylor was >beset with anxiety and depression. He had such severe nightmares that his >caregiver often tied her ankle to his at night so he wouldn't leap from >the bed and hurt himself, the court wrote. > >A key issue for the high court was whether Saylor's fears were rational, >noting that the court had refused to grant benefits in another case to a >medical employee who had an "irrational fear of exposure to HIV" after a >work-related incident. "In contrast, the hazardousness of the material to >which Saylor was exposed was not based upon mere speculation," the court >wrote. "The pods were labeled radioactive." > >http://www.knoxnews.com/kns/local_news/article/0,1406,KNS_347_4279564,00.html > >_______________________________________________ >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood >the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: >http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings >visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From Roger.Moroney at ctimi.com Thu Dec 1 16:46:25 2005 From: Roger.Moroney at ctimi.com (Roger.Moroney at ctimi.com) Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2005 17:46:25 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] local TV news report on college campus security In-Reply-To: Message-ID: http://www.WATE.com/Global/story.asp?s=4185509 Local television news reported visits Univ of Tennessee (UT) campus based on information found on the UT website. Roger Moroney, CHP Manager, Radiological Compliance & CRSO (PETNET) PETNET Pharmaceuticals, Inc. Siemens Molecular Imaging NOTICE: This e-mail message and all attachments transmitted with it may contain legally privileged and confidential information intended solely for the use of the addressee. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any reading, dissemination, distribution, copying, or other use of this message or its attachments, hyperlinks, or any other files of any kind is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately by telephone (865-218-2000) or by a reply to this electronic mail message and delete this message and all copies and backups thereof. From don.mercado at lmco.com Thu Dec 1 16:25:32 2005 From: don.mercado at lmco.com (Mercado, Don) Date: Thu, 01 Dec 2005 14:25:32 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] High court backs 'sloshed' trucker - State justices: Hauler of OR waste disabled, due workers' comp Message-ID: <3D92CA467E530B4E8295214868F840FE81F633@emss01m12.us.lmco.com> Cindy Bloom "Wow, This sure does underline the importance of training, putting risks in perspective and providing prompt as well as continuous information to workers who might be exposed to materials or environments that have a potential to cause harm if exposures are sufficiently high." Not really. I've been teaching classes on RF safety for years and cover *extensively* the relative risks and the worst case accidents that can happen with the devices we produce; a mild heating of the skin. This information is posted in many places and is reemphasized in the retraining as well. Still, we have had people who thought they were exposed (they weren't) and suffered from mental anguish. One guy felt ill just putting on his personal alarming monitor. Over the years we've added additional layers of "safety", not bec there is any hazard, but to assuage the employee's concerns. Now I'm getting, "If it wasn't that hazardous, we wouldn't have all this safety stuff!" Some people quit rather than work with RF. Can an employer be held responsible for an employee's phobias? Don From rstrickert at signaturescience.com Thu Dec 1 18:24:57 2005 From: rstrickert at signaturescience.com (Strickert, Rick) Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2005 18:24:57 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] local TV news report on college campus security Message-ID: <7D5C72A07835EB4085063AD8555F05DE0121119F@ss-mail2.corp.signaturescience.com> >From http://www.wate.com/Global/story.asp?s=4185509 - "Shockingly, we found detailed information about when and where potentially dangerous radiation is collected on campus.... [UT's Radiation Safety Director Chris] Millsaps would only say the material is primarily Hydrogen-3 and Carbon-14. Both are low-energy, which means low-risk to the public." - WATE6 News reporter, Amelia Graham, B.S. in telecommunications/news, University of Florida (http://www.wate.com/Global/Story.asp?s=1374018) Rick Strickert Austin, TX From radbloom at comcast.net Thu Dec 1 19:35:30 2005 From: radbloom at comcast.net (Cindy Bloom) Date: Thu, 01 Dec 2005 20:35:30 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] High court backs 'sloshed' trucker - State justices: Hauler of OR waste disabled, due workers' comp In-Reply-To: <3D92CA467E530B4E8295214868F840FE81F633@emss01m12.us.lmco.c om> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20051201180513.034945f0@mail.comcast.net> Don, Your note emphasizes my points about putting risks in perspective and about following up with people who might be concerned about risks especially during nonroutine events. Two weeks seems like a long time to find out if a shirt was contaminated. Most of us, who have been involved with compliance issues, can readily attest to regulatory or self-imposed requirements that we wouldn't hesitate to violate under emergency circumstances and where we would consider any negative risks from associated exposures to be very, very low. It is important to differentiate the difference between compliance requirements and health risk. "All that safety stuff" is to help us avoid situations where it is "all that hazardous." It is also very important to be available to discuss workers concerns and to routinely reassure them if need be (and if possible). But it is also important to counsel those workers, who are extremely uncomfortable with the idea of a given risk, to consider looking/training for a type of employment that does not include the risk of concern. It's important to remind people that worrying about risk can be a health risk in itself, too. I will never be a race car driver and some people should not choose radiation work. Cindy At 02:25 PM 12/1/2005 -0800, Mercado, Don wrote: >Cindy Bloom > >"Wow, > >This sure does underline the importance of training, putting risks in >perspective and providing prompt as well as continuous information to >workers who might be exposed to materials or environments that have a >potential to cause harm if exposures are sufficiently high." > > >Not really. > >I've been teaching classes on RF safety for years and cover >*extensively* the relative risks and the worst case accidents that can >happen with the devices we produce; a mild heating of the skin. This >information is posted in many places and is reemphasized in the >retraining as well. Still, we have had people who thought they were >exposed (they weren't) and suffered from mental anguish. One guy felt >ill just putting on his personal alarming monitor. Over the years we've >added additional layers of "safety", not bec there is any hazard, but to >assuage the employee's concerns. Now I'm getting, "If it wasn't that >hazardous, we wouldn't have all this safety stuff!" Some people quit >rather than work with RF. Can an employer be held responsible for an >employee's phobias? > >Don From Douglas.Minnema at nnsa.doe.gov Fri Dec 2 09:42:21 2005 From: Douglas.Minnema at nnsa.doe.gov (Minnema, Douglas) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 10:42:21 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group Message-ID: <38982F237333D5119E6100508BB0CC6D0CA76CF3@nsgtnexch1.ns.doe.gov> All, I have two unrelated questions that I'm combining into one e-mail for convenience. The first one has to do with Am-241 sources in smoke detectors. What happens when the smoke detector is burned in a building fire? Is the source expected to survive intact or is there a potential for a release of some type? I would assume this has been considered multiple times, but I haven't found the answer yet. If somebody can point me in the right direction I'd appreciate it. Second question: My 15-year old son has a subscription to "Air & Space Smithonian" magazine, and in the December 2005/January 2006 issue there is an article entitled "The Invisible Killers: Can Astronauts Survive the Radiation on a Journey to Mars?". Has anybody seen this yet? I'm not familiar with current efforts in protecting astronauts from space radiation, but some of the statements made in this article are clearly wrong, which leads me to suspect that either the article was designed to be inflammatory or the author just didn't understand the information he was given. A couple examples: "From World War II atomic bomb detonations in Japan and the 1986 accident at the Chernobyl nuclear reactor near Kiev, Russia, we know the effects of brief but intense pulses of radiation: nausea, immune system shutdown, central nervous system damage, and death within minutes to hours." "Derek Lowenstein, chairman of Brookhaven's collider accelerator program, has given voice to deep fears among scientists by asking: "Will astronauts come back as blithering idiots or not?"" "The U.S. Occupational Safety and Health Administration treats astronauts as radiation workers." "Today, the law limits the amount of radiation that nuclear workers, including astronauts, receive to 5,000 millirem over the course of their careers." Since my son's long-held goal is to pilot the first spacecraft to Mars (and yes, he is working hard towards that goal), he was obviously curious about the article. He does understand that ionizing radiation is often misunderstood or mis-stated in the media (he is the son of an HP), but in this case I can't answer all of his questions. If somebody knows about this article or would be willing to look at it for me, I'd much appreciate it. Please contact me directly and I'll get a copy of the article to you if necessary. Thanks, Doug Minnema PhD, CHP From jmarshall.reber at comcast.net Fri Dec 2 10:17:27 2005 From: jmarshall.reber at comcast.net (J. Marshall Reber) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 11:17:27 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group In-Reply-To: <38982F237333D5119E6100508BB0CC6D0CA76CF3@nsgtnexch1.ns.doe.gov> Message-ID: <212A552C-634F-11DA-B8F7-0003939BB85A@comcast.net> The Smithsonian, you might recall, was forced to greatly modify an exhibit not too long ago that portrayed how terrible the U.S.A. was in causing the "atrocities" of the atomic bombing of Japan. On Friday, December 2, 2005, at 10:42 , Minnema, Douglas wrote: > Second question: My 15-year old son has a subscription to "Air & Space > Smithonian" magazine, and in the December 2005/January 2006 issue there > is > an article entitled "The Invisible Killers: Can Astronauts Survive the > Radiation on a Journey to Mars?". Has anybody seen this yet? I'm not > familiar with current efforts in protecting astronauts from space > radiation, > but some of the statements made in this article are clearly wrong, which > leads me to suspect that either the article was designed to be > inflammatory > or the author just didn't understand the information he was given. From joel.baumbaugh at navy.mil Fri Dec 2 10:38:47 2005 From: joel.baumbaugh at navy.mil (Baumbaugh, Joel SPAWAR) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 08:38:47 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group Message-ID: <7DB6DF83D2CD9140ADA0622B1A05BF2F01667895@nawespscez02.nadsuswe.nads.navy.mil> Doug, Question one: I have a Americium source from a smoke detector which survived a wooden-building fire (I assume its double-walled stainless steel?). I've swiped it and the LSC has never shown any leakage. I couldn't/wouldn't throw it away because out of the detector its no longer exempt, so I use it as a check-source and a "show-and-tell" when I train new users. Just my 2-cents (my own personal observation). Question 2: I can't help you with your other question although I'm very interested in the projected/potential dose to the astronauts (both in-flight and once they're on the ground) - I think that NASA's discussed a specially shielded room to hover in, in case of solar flares. Joel Baumbaugh (baumbaug at nosc.mil) SSC-SD All, I have two unrelated questions that I'm combining into one e-mail for convenience. The first one has to do with Am-241 sources in smoke detectors. What happens when the smoke detector is burned in a building fire? Is the source expected to survive intact or is there a potential for a release of some type? Second question: From nardiaj at westinghouse.com Fri Dec 2 10:48:14 2005 From: nardiaj at westinghouse.com (Nardi, A. Joseph) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 11:48:14 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group Message-ID: <2052C51FEE2DD611AE5F0002A59305F10BFEA5EA@swec9900bk.pgh.wec.com> With respect to the smoke detectors look at NUREG-1717, section 2.15. This document should answer your questions. The document is available from the NRC. http://www.nrc.gov/reading-rm/doc-collections/nuregs/staff/sr1717/ A. Joseph Nardi Westinghouse Electric Company P.O. Box 355 Pittsburgh, PA 15230 Phone - 412-374-4652 FAX - 412-374-3832 email - nardiaj at westinghouse.com -----Original Message----- From: Minnema, Douglas [mailto:Douglas.Minnema at nnsa.doe.gov] Sent: Friday, December 02, 2005 10:42 AM To: Radsafe (E-mail) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group All, I have two unrelated questions that I'm combining into one e-mail for convenience. The first one has to do with Am-241 sources in smoke detectors. What happens when the smoke detector is burned in a building fire? Is the source expected to survive intact or is there a potential for a release of some type? I would assume this has been considered multiple times, but I haven't found the answer yet. If somebody can point me in the right direction I'd appreciate it. Second question: My 15-year old son has a subscription to "Air & Space Smithonian" magazine, and in the December 2005/January 2006 issue there is an article entitled "The Invisible Killers: Can Astronauts Survive the Radiation on a Journey to Mars?". Has anybody seen this yet? I'm not familiar with current efforts in protecting astronauts from space radiation, but some of the statements made in this article are clearly wrong, which leads me to suspect that either the article was designed to be inflammatory or the author just didn't understand the information he was given. A couple examples: "From World War II atomic bomb detonations in Japan and the 1986 accident at the Chernobyl nuclear reactor near Kiev, Russia, we know the effects of brief but intense pulses of radiation: nausea, immune system shutdown, central nervous system damage, and death within minutes to hours." "Derek Lowenstein, chairman of Brookhaven's collider accelerator program, has given voice to deep fears among scientists by asking: "Will astronauts come back as blithering idiots or not?"" "The U.S. Occupational Safety and Health Administration treats astronauts as radiation workers." "Today, the law limits the amount of radiation that nuclear workers, including astronauts, receive to 5,000 millirem over the course of their careers." Since my son's long-held goal is to pilot the first spacecraft to Mars (and yes, he is working hard towards that goal), he was obviously curious about the article. He does understand that ionizing radiation is often misunderstood or mis-stated in the media (he is the son of an HP), but in this case I can't answer all of his questions. If somebody knows about this article or would be willing to look at it for me, I'd much appreciate it. Please contact me directly and I'll get a copy of the article to you if necessary. Thanks, Doug Minnema PhD, CHP _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From rdgallagher at nssihouston.com Fri Dec 2 12:15:30 2005 From: rdgallagher at nssihouston.com (Robert D Gallagher) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 12:15:30 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group In-Reply-To: <7DB6DF83D2CD9140ADA0622B1A05BF2F01667895@nawespscez02.nadsuswe.nads.navy.mil> Message-ID: The Am-241 sources used in smoke detectors are not sealed sources. The sources are manufactured by mixing the Am-241 powder with a powdered metal such as gold and rolled into a very thin sheet. The sheet active sheet is sandwiched between two sheets of soft metal and again rolled to form a laminated sheet with non active metal on the outside and the active metal sheet in the middle. When the rolling is completed, small discs are punched from the laminate. These discs are the foils contained in the smoke detectors. In the early days of smoke detectors, the various vendors subjected the foils to all sorts of environmental tests including soaking them in simulated human digestion system liquids to see if the Am-241 leached out. As a result of these very extensive tests,the manufacturers were able to get the NRC to authorize their distribution to the public as generally licensed devices. Numerous smoke detectors have been burned and otherwise mistreated. With only a few exceptions, I am not aware of any that ever resuted in contamination. Bob Gallagher NSSI Houston -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl]On Behalf Of Baumbaugh, Joel SPAWAR Sent: Friday, December 02, 2005 10:39 AM To: Radsafe (E-mail) Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group Doug, Question one: I have a Americium source from a smoke detector which survived a wooden-building fire (I assume its double-walled stainless steel?). I've swiped it and the LSC has never shown any leakage. I couldn't/wouldn't throw it away because out of the detector its no longer exempt, so I use it as a check-source and a "show-and-tell" when I train new users. Just my 2-cents (my own personal observation). Question 2: I can't help you with your other question although I'm very interested in the projected/potential dose to the astronauts (both in-flight and once they're on the ground) - I think that NASA's discussed a specially shielded room to hover in, in case of solar flares. Joel Baumbaugh (baumbaug at nosc.mil) SSC-SD All, I have two unrelated questions that I'm combining into one e-mail for convenience. The first one has to do with Am-241 sources in smoke detectors. What happens when the smoke detector is burned in a building fire? Is the source expected to survive intact or is there a potential for a release of some type? Second question: _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From lboing at anl.gov Fri Dec 2 13:09:46 2005 From: lboing at anl.gov (Boing, Lawrence E.) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 13:09:46 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Sensorcoat Message-ID: <637FE1FE13221C4F8BFC590A42B8478921C768@NE-EXCH.ne.anl.gov> Looking for some additional information - like a technical paper or conf paper - on Sensorcoat technology for decontamination at LANL. Larry Boing Lawrence E. (Larry) Boing Argonne National Laboratory 9700 South Cass Avenue Argonne, IL 60439 P-630.252.6729 F-630.252.7577 lboing at anl.gov http://www.dd.anl.gov/ http://www.orau.gov/ddsc/ From Rainer.Facius at dlr.de Fri Dec 2 13:10:13 2005 From: Rainer.Facius at dlr.de (Rainer.Facius at dlr.de) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 20:10:13 +0100 Subject: AW: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group References: <38982F237333D5119E6100508BB0CC6D0CA76CF3@nsgtnexch1.ns.doe.gov> Message-ID: <1B5EBED4E01074419C07EEF9D3802FDA159010@exbe02.intra.dlr.de> Douglas, I address your second question: Since I don not know this article I can comment only with some general remarks. For long term missions outside the shielding provided by the geomagnetic field planning manned space missions has to make allowance for two sources of ionising radiation. One is the rather regularly varying irradiation by galactic cosmic radiation (GCR). During maximum solar activity - as we had it about 3 years ago and will have it about every other 11 years, their intensity is minimal and vice versa. Without dramatic progress in propulsion technology the most feasible (also financially) mission to Mars will take some 422 days in space (round-trip) and 525 days on Mars' surface. For such a mission, depending on the mass of shielding material available, the equivalent dose from GCRs to the blood forming organs (BFO - a proxy for the effective dose) according to present prediction capabilities will range between 280 to 918 mSv depending further on the solar activity during the mission and it s atomic composition. Hydrogen rich material like polyethylene (PE) performs better as shielding material due to its smaller contribution to secondary fragmented ions in comparison to Aluminium (AL). In the table below, Min refers to a mission during solar minimum, Max to solar maximum and the numbers give BFO equivalent dose in mSv. AL.....918 Min PE.....846 5 g/cm**2 AL.....383 Max PE....353 ------------------------------------- AL.....852 Min PE.....748 10 g/cm**2 AL.....364 Max PE....317 ------------------------------------- AL.....769 Min PE.....649 20 g/cm**2 AL.....339 Max PE....280 ------------------------------------- Obviously, planning the mission with respect to its position in the solar cycle would argue to have it during solar maximum. As regards shielding by matter, the energies of the GCR heavy ions make them very difficult to shield against. A factor of 4 in mass (that has to be propelled too) at most yields a reduction in dose by a factor of 1.3! The physics behind these predictions is sufficiently well understood by now. The great uncertainty is whether the radiation quality factors used in the conversion of absorbed dose to equivalent dose truly reflect the radiobiological effectiveness of the GCR ions. I would not be surprised if finally it turns out that they do not. Assuming that they do, the above doses accumulated during nearly 3 years may appear gigantic for terrestrial radiation workers. Nevertheless, the safe return of the crew will not be compromised by health effects ensuing from these exposures. A second unresolved longstanding uncertainty in this statement of course is that the cellular and tissue reactions which under terrestrial 1 g conditions counteract and control the development of radiogenic cancers retain their normal efficiency under the numerous and persistent physiological changes brought about by long duration weightlessness. Even if not, a health detriment which might jeopardize a safe return is unlikely, yet, increased late mortality from cancer will be a likely risk. The second radiation component in interplanetary space is energetic charged particle radiation, mainly protons, from solar particle events (SPE) commonly called flares. Unfortunately, the probability that large events will occur is maximum during solar maximum and essentially nil during minimum solar activity! In contrast to GCR heavy ions, however, their lower energies make them easier to shield against. Nevertheless, the intensities in extreme SPEs may reach levels where in interplanetary space behind a shielding of even 10 g/cm**2 (often called a "radiation storm shelter"; whether AL or PE does no more matter here) still acute doses of about 1.3 Gy to the bone marrow, 2.5 to the lens and 2.6 to the skin are to be expected for what we may call a worst case event according to our present experience. Only if the sensitivity to induction of early deterministic radiation effects had been significantly enhanced by weightlessness (again the same question mark!) would we expect that such exposures could trigger a fatal mission abort. Some kind of transient performance decrement might be expected and then it could depend on the criticality of the mission phase where such an SPE occurs. The frequency of such extreme events (one in 50 years is our current sample size) is too far low to have us expect more than one such extreme SPE during a mission. One most essential prerequisite of course is that mission planning and control can ensure that indeed under all conceivable circumstances the crew will have time to find shelter. We have some indications that our sun might enter into an era of more violent activity. When and to what amount that might invalidate our 'worst case' predictions can only be answered by prophets. I hope that helps and reinforces your son's resolve to go ahead. Best regards, Rainer Dr. Rainer Facius DLR, German Aerospace Center Institute of Aerospace Medicine Dept. Radiation Biology 51147 Cologne GERAMNY +49 2203 601 3147 ________________________________ Von: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl im Auftrag von Minnema, Douglas Gesendet: Fr 02.12.2005 16:42 An: Radsafe (E-mail) Betreff: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group All, I have two unrelated questions that I'm combining into one e-mail for convenience. The first one has to do with Am-241 sources in smoke detectors. What happens when the smoke detector is burned in a building fire? Is the source expected to survive intact or is there a potential for a release of some type? I would assume this has been considered multiple times, but I haven't found the answer yet. If somebody can point me in the right direction I'd appreciate it. Second question: My 15-year old son has a subscription to "Air & Space Smithonian" magazine, and in the December 2005/January 2006 issue there is an article entitled "The Invisible Killers: Can Astronauts Survive the Radiation on a Journey to Mars?". Has anybody seen this yet? I'm not familiar with current efforts in protecting astronauts from space radiation, but some of the statements made in this article are clearly wrong, which leads me to suspect that either the article was designed to be inflammatory or the author just didn't understand the information he was given. A couple examples: "From World War II atomic bomb detonations in Japan and the 1986 accident at the Chernobyl nuclear reactor near Kiev, Russia, we know the effects of brief but intense pulses of radiation: nausea, immune system shutdown, central nervous system damage, and death within minutes to hours." "Derek Lowenstein, chairman of Brookhaven's collider accelerator program, has given voice to deep fears among scientists by asking: "Will astronauts come back as blithering idiots or not?"" "The U.S. Occupational Safety and Health Administration treats astronauts as radiation workers." "Today, the law limits the amount of radiation that nuclear workers, including astronauts, receive to 5,000 millirem over the course of their careers." Since my son's long-held goal is to pilot the first spacecraft to Mars (and yes, he is working hard towards that goal), he was obviously curious about the article. He does understand that ionizing radiation is often misunderstood or mis-stated in the media (he is the son of an HP), but in this case I can't answer all of his questions. If somebody knows about this article or would be willing to look at it for me, I'd much appreciate it. Please contact me directly and I'll get a copy of the article to you if necessary. Thanks, Doug Minnema PhD, CHP _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From Douglas.Minnema at nnsa.doe.gov Fri Dec 2 13:26:46 2005 From: Douglas.Minnema at nnsa.doe.gov (Minnema, Douglas) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 14:26:46 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group Message-ID: <38982F237333D5119E6100508BB0CC6D0CA76CFA@nsgtnexch1.ns.doe.gov> Rainer and all of you who have responded, Thank you all, your responses have been very helpful to answer both of my questions. NUREG-1717 does answer all my smoke detector questions, and much more on that topic. As for the Mars trip, Rainer's response is very helpful, and is in line with what I thought I had seen before. The article does not discuss dose numbers at all, but it does mention some of the shielding concepts that Rainer discusses. I was wondering why they were looking at hydrogen for a shield. much appreciated, Doug Minnema From hacrad at comcast.net Fri Dec 2 18:25:38 2005 From: hacrad at comcast.net (Hal C) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 16:25:38 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group References: <38982F237333D5119E6100508BB0CC6D0CA76CF3@nsgtnexch1.ns.doe.gov> Message-ID: <007201c5f7a0$16a139a0$6401a8c0@exe8l> A good resource is the web site: http://science.msfc.nasa.gov/ >From there you can pull up multiple stories on NASA's attempts to consider and control the radiation environment in inter-planetary space and on Mars. But it's not clear whether such large dose levels are compatible with long term flights. Let your son do the research and tell you what he finds. hal careway Sent: Friday, December 02, 2005 7:42 AM Subject: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group > > All, > > I have two unrelated questions that I'm combining into one e-mail for > convenience. > > The first one .... > > > Second question: My 15-year old son has a subscription to "Air & Space > Smithonian" magazine, and in the December 2005/January 2006 issue there is > an article entitled "The Invisible Killers: Can Astronauts Survive the > Radiation on a Journey to Mars?". Has anybody seen this yet? I'm not > familiar with current efforts in protecting astronauts from space > radiation, > but some of the statements made in this article are clearly wrong, which > leads me to suspect that either the article was designed to be > inflammatory > or the author just didn't understand the information he was given. A > couple > examples: > From srebro at bgumail.bgu.ac.il Sun Dec 4 00:50:22 2005 From: srebro at bgumail.bgu.ac.il (srebro) Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2005 08:50:22 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Am-241 Message-ID: <20051204064412.12F6033E76@smtp2.bgu.ac.il> Hi I know of one case of alpha contamination after a fire. A big hotel was completely burn in a fire. The smoke detectors were very old containing about 70 mCi Am-241 each. The result alpha contamination found in the ashes and ruins . Rafi From srebro at bgumail.bgu.ac.il Sun Dec 4 02:15:01 2005 From: srebro at bgumail.bgu.ac.il (srebro) Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2005 10:15:01 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Am-241 Message-ID: <20051204080850.6DF9033E77@smtp2.bgu.ac.il> The activity was 70 micro-Ci . (some computer replace the micro with an m) Rafi From joseroze at netvision.net.il Sun Dec 4 03:53:20 2005 From: joseroze at netvision.net.il (Jose Julio Rozental) Date: Sun, 04 Dec 2005 12:53:20 +0300 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Am-241 References: <20051204064412.12F6033E76@smtp2.bgu.ac.il> Message-ID: <006801c5f8b8$8f849970$840118ac@userqzqxd9wnct> Dear Rafi and colleagues, Ionizing Chamber Smoke Detectors - ICSDs, has an interesting study made by Nuclear Energy Agency NEA - Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development OECD, 1977 to justify its use. The document is "Recommendations for ICSDs in implementation of radiation protection standards" and followed recommendations of the ICRP and the NEA Guide 1970 on Basic approach for safety analysis and control of products containing radionuclides and available to the general public. The Basic Requirements for Am-241 were activity and dose equivalent rate. About the activity, per detector, shall not exceed 20 microCi. At that time, considering Am-241, the great majority of ICSDs used sources in the range of 0.5 to 130 micoCi, and activities above 80 microCi were found only in types of detectors no longer being produced. So please take a look again on the value that you have mentioned 70 mCi per detector. The NEA Study took into consideration Incidents involving ICSDs in UK, from 1966 to 1977, as fire, theft, bomb explosion, bomb explosion and subsequent fire, mutilation of detectors, etc. The document present results of the incidents. Appendix III present fire and incineration tests on ICSDs - Two fire tests are described 600 and 1200 degrees. Jose Julio Rozental joseroze at netvision.net.il Israel ----- Original Message ----- From: "srebro" To: Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2005 9:50 AM Subject: [ RadSafe ] Am-241 > Hi > > I know of one case of alpha contamination after a fire. A big hotel was > completely burn in a fire. The smoke detectors were very old containing > about 70 mCi Am-241 each. The result alpha contamination found in the ashes > and ruins . > > > > > Rafi > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From jaro-10kbq at sympatico.ca Sun Dec 4 10:11:46 2005 From: jaro-10kbq at sympatico.ca (Jaro) Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2005 11:11:46 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Sternglass, Gofman & co. at it again..... Message-ID: http://www.news-journalonline.com/NewsJournalOnline/Opinion/Editorials/03OpO PN45120405.htm Plutonium is considered the most lethal radioactive substance because a millionth of a gram of plutonium dust lodged in the lung can be a fatal dose. "The problem is that it takes just a tiny amount of plutonium to cause cancer," says Dr. Sternglass. .....accidents have already happened. Of the 25 U.S. space missions using plutonium fuel, three have undergone accidents, admits the NASA impact statement on New Horizons. That's a 1-in-8 record. The worst occurred in 1964 and involved, notes the impact statement, the SNAP-9A RTG with 2.1 pounds of plutonium fuel. A satellite it was to provide electricity to failed to achieve orbit and dropped to Earth. The RTG disintegrated in the fall, spreading plutonium widely. Release of that plutonium caused an increase in global lung cancer rates, says Dr. John Gofman, professor emeritus of medical physics at the University of California at Berkeley. Letters to the Editor The News-Journal Daytona Beach, FL E-mail: letters at news-jrnl.com -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.362 / Virus Database: 267.13.11/191 - Release Date: 12/2/2005 From Bevelresou at aol.com Sun Dec 4 17:34:29 2005 From: Bevelresou at aol.com (Bevelresou at aol.com) Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2005 18:34:29 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] HEALTH PHTSICS E-JOURNAL Message-ID: <1ef.4862f65d.30c4d705@aol.com> Hello: This note seeks to solicit opinions and comments regarding the establishment of a new, electronic health physics journal. The e-journal concept is not intended as an indication of issues with existing journals or publication outlets. It is intended to foster publication of ideas from the widest possible collection of health physicists throughout the world. It is hoped that the e-journal would also document in a more formal manner the views of health physicists regarding contemporary issues (e.g., BEIR-VII, LNT, hormesis, and the new ICRP Recommendations). From recent RADSAFE discussion, it appears that there is some disagreement with recent recommendations and guidance, and the e-journal would serve to provide another source of feedback to the organizations promulgating these recommendations. A straw-man e-journal concept follows. The e-Journal would foster the development and growth of the health physics profession. Its goals would include (1) timely publication and dissemination of health physics research and operational information, (2) the publication of papers that might not be published in existing journals because of their unique or controversial nature, (3) fostering interest, research, and debate on emerging health physics areas, (4) disseminating information that will enhance worker protection, (5) fostering the professional development of health physicists, (6) respectfully challenging or supporting proposed regulations and guidance, and (7) providing an electronic archive of articles for research and historical purposes. The e-Journal would also emphasize cutting-edge areas of the profession as well as disseminating topics of interest and benefit to the health physics community. Health physics contributions would be accepted in a wide variety of areas including contemporary, operational, and regulatory topics. The e-Journal would be peer reviewed, but the final publication decision would rest with the author since it is the author that ultimately defends the work. I would appreciate receiving comments and suggestions regarding the aforementioned e-journal concept. If there is interest in participating in the e-journal as a subject editor or contributor, I would also appreciate receiving that information directly to my e-mail address Regards, Joe Bevelacqua Dr. Joseph John Bevelacqua, President Bevelacqua Resources 343 Adair Drive Richland, WA 99352 _bevelresou at aol.com_ (mailto:bevelresou at aol.com) From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Sun Dec 4 19:53:31 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 01:53:31 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] HEALTH PHTSICS E-JOURNAL In-Reply-To: <1ef.4862f65d.30c4d705@aol.com> Message-ID: <20051205015331.51177.qmail@web26412.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear Dr Joseph Bevelacqua, Best wishes for the proposal to start a journal. As a member of this newsgroup for some time, I felt that there is justification for starting the type of journal you propose .It may give continuity to some of the discusssions, though the advantages of appropriate peer reveiw may not be feasible. I have a suggestion. There must be provision to publish historical accounts of the development of radiation safety related articles in various countries. While commenting on an article on Elezabeth Rona (a contemporary of Madame Curie)in the Health Physics, I proposed that stalwarts like Taylor, Spiers, Parker and others may be requested to write their accounts of the subject including the historical developments in the Health Physics Journal. I suggested it in a letter to the Health Physics during the early eighties. We had a few such accounts in the Health Physics. Health physicists and radiation protection specialists need stories.They provide a powerful tool to engage the attention of indifferent participants of training programmes! Most of them attend such programmes because they have to attend as there is a mandatory need to get qualified! They are generally a heterogenous group; old and young I attempted to collect details about the developments in India. I could not locate persons who could contribute to the venture. Indians are notoriously inefficient in keeping a record of the past!. The success of the blog writer inspires me to make the current proposal.My occasional interactions with the elders in our profession gave me opportunity to understand the past. For instance, I came to know from Dr. Allan Brodsky, how Alice Stewart,the darling of the antinuclear movement started her epidemiological work related to Handford workers. Regards Dr.K.S.Parthasarathy (Formerly, Secretary, Atomic Energy Regulatory Board) Raja Ramanna Fellow Department of Atomic Energy GN 18, Vikram Sarabhai Bhavan Mumbai 400094, India 91+22 27706048 (R) 91+22 25555327 (O) 91+22 25486081(O) Bevelresou at aol.com wrote: Hello: This note seeks to solicit opinions and comments regarding the establishment of a new, electronic health physics journal. The e-journal concept is not intended as an indication of issues with existing journals or publication outlets. It is intended to foster publication of ideas from the widest possible collection of health physicists throughout the world. It is hoped that the e-journal would also document in a more formal manner the views of health physicists regarding contemporary issues (e.g., BEIR-VII, LNT, hormesis, and the new ICRP Recommendations). From recent RADSAFE discussion, it appears that there is some disagreement with recent recommendations and guidance, and the e-journal would serve to provide another source of feedback to the organizations promulgating these recommendations. A straw-man e-journal concept follows. The e-Journal would foster the development and growth of the health physics profession. Its goals would include (1) timely publication and dissemination of health physics research and operational information, (2) the publication of papers that might not be published in existing journals because of their unique or controversial nature, (3) fostering interest, research, and debate on emerging health physics areas, (4) disseminating information that will enhance worker protection, (5) fostering the professional development of health physicists, (6) respectfully challenging or supporting proposed regulations and guidance, and (7) providing an electronic archive of articles for research and historical purposes. The e-Journal would also emphasize cutting-edge areas of the profession as well as disseminating topics of interest and benefit to the health physics community. Health physics contributions would be accepted in a wide variety of areas including contemporary, operational, and regulatory topics. The e-Journal would be peer reviewed, but the final publication decision would rest with the author since it is the author that ultimately defends the work. I would appreciate receiving comments and suggestions regarding the aforementioned e-journal concept. If there is interest in participating in the e-journal as a subject editor or contributor, I would also appreciate receiving that information directly to my e-mail address Regards, Joe Bevelacqua Dr. Joseph John Bevelacqua, President Bevelacqua Resources 343 Adair Drive Richland, WA 99352 _bevelresou at aol.com_ (mailto:bevelresou at aol.com) _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Mon Dec 5 10:25:07 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 08:25:07 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Article: Reliability of Information -- (not radiation-related, but of interest) Message-ID: <20051205162507.7253.qmail@web54306.mail.yahoo.com> >From the New York Times, http://www.nytimes.com/2005/12/04/weekinreview/04seelye.html?th&emc=th -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- December 4, 2005 Rewriting History Snared in the Web of a Wikipedia Liar By KATHARINE Q. SEELYE ACCORDING to Wikipedia, the online encyclopedia, John Seigenthaler Sr. is 78 years old and the former editor of The Tennessean in Nashville. But is that information, or anything else in Mr. Seigenthaler's biography, true? The question arises because Mr. Seigenthaler recently read about himself on Wikipedia and was shocked to learn that he "was thought to have been directly involved in the Kennedy assassinations of both John and his brother Bobby." "Nothing was ever proven," the biography added. Mr. Seigenthaler discovered that the false information had been on the site for several months and that an unknown number of people had read it, and possibly posted it on or linked it to other sites. If any assassination was going on, Mr. Seigenthaler (who is 78 and did edit The Tennessean) wrote last week in an op-ed article in USA Today, it was of his character. The case triggered extensive debate on the Internet over the value and reliability of Wikipedia, and more broadly, over the nature of online information. Wikipedia is a kind of collective brain, a repository of knowledge, maintained on servers in various countries and built by anyone in the world with a computer and an Internet connection who wants to share knowledge about a subject. Literally hundreds of thousands of people have written Wikipedia entries. Mistakes are expected to be caught and corrected by later contributors and users. The whole nonprofit enterprise began in January 2001, the brainchild of Jimmy Wales, 39, a former futures and options trader who lives in St. Petersburg, Fla. He said he had hoped to advance the promise of the Internet as a place for sharing information. It has, by most measures, been a spectacular success. Wikipedia is now the biggest encyclopedia in the history of the world. As of Friday, it was receiving 2.5 billion page views a month, and offering at least 1,000 articles in 82 languages. The number of articles, already close to two million, is growing by 7 percent a month. And Mr. Wales said that traffic doubles every four months. Still, the question of Wikipedia, as of so much of what you find online, is: Can you trust it? And beyond reliability, there is the question of accountability. Mr. Seigenthaler, after discovering that he had been defamed, found that his "biographer" was anonymous. He learned that the writer was a customer of BellSouth Internet, but that federal privacy laws shield the identity of Internet customers, even if they disseminate defamatory material. And the laws protect online corporations from libel suits. He could have filed a lawsuit against BellSouth, he wrote, but only a subpoena would compel BellSouth to reveal the name. In the end, Mr. Seigenthaler decided against going to court, instead alerting the public, through his article, "that Wikipedia is a flawed and irresponsible research tool." Mr. Wales said in an interview that he was troubled by the Seigenthaler episode, and noted that Wikipedia was essentially in the same boat. "We have constant problems where we have people who are trying to repeatedly abuse our sites," he said. Still, he said, he was trying to make Wikipedia less vulnerable to tampering. He said he was starting a review mechanism by which readers and experts could rate the value of various articles. The reviews, which he said he expected to start in January, would show the site's strengths and weaknesses and perhaps reveal patterns to help them address the problems. In addition, he said, Wikipedia may start blocking unregistered users from creating new pages, though they would still be able to edit them. The real problem, he said, was the volume of new material coming in; it is so overwhelming that screeners cannot keep up with it. All of this struck close to home for librarians and researchers. On an electronic mailing list for them, J. Stephen Bolhafner, a news researcher at The St. Louis Post-Dispatch, wrote, "The best defense of the Wikipedia, frankly, is to point out how much bad information is available from supposedly reliable sources." Jessica Baumgart, a news researcher at Harvard University, wrote that there were librarians voluntarily working behind the scenes to check information on Wikipedia. "But, honestly," she added, "in some ways, we're just as fallible as everyone else in some areas because our own knowledge is limited and we can't possibly fact-check everything." In an interview, she said that her rule of thumb was to double-check everything and to consider Wikipedia as only one source. "Instead of figuring out how to 'fix' Wikipedia - something that cannot be done to our satisfaction," wrote Derek Willis, a research database manager at The Washington Post, who was speaking for himself and not The Post, "we should focus our energies on educating the Wikipedia users among our colleagues." Some cyberexperts said Wikipedia already had a good system of checks and balances. Lawrence Lessig, a law professor at Stanford and an expert in the laws of cyberspace, said that contrary to popular belief, true defamation was easily pursued through the courts because almost everything on the Internet was traceable and subpoenas were not that hard to obtain. (For real anonymity, he advised, use a pay phone.) "People will be defamed," he said. "But that's the way free speech is. Think about the gossip world. It spreads. There's no way to correct it, period. Wikipedia is not immune from that kind of maliciousness, but it is, relative to other features of life, more easily corrected." Indeed, Esther Dyson, editor of Release 1.0 and a longtime Internet analyst, said Wikipedia may, in that sense, be better than real life. "The Internet has done a lot more for truth by making things easier to discuss," she said. "Transparency and sunlight are better than a single point of view that can't be questioned." For Mr. Seigenthaler, whose biography on Wikipedia has since been corrected, the lesson is simple: "We live in a universe of new media with phenomenal opportunities for worldwide communications and research, but populated by volunteer vandals with poison-pen intellects." Copyright 2005 The New York Times Company Home Privacy Policy Search Corrections XML Help Contact Us Work for Us Site Map Back to Top +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Mon Dec 5 10:42:26 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 08:42:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Another definition for the Sv? Message-ID: <20051205164226.99068.qmail@web54309.mail.yahoo.com> >From another list server: Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 10:59:50 -0500 Subject: Replication of unit abbreviation While reading a new article in Nature about measurements showing that the velocity of the Gulf Stream has slowed by 30% since 1992, I came across a unit used by oceanographers called the Sverdrup (abbreviated Sv and not to be confused with our beloved Sievert.) This unit measures the volumetric flow of water and is equal to 1 million cubic meters per second. Measurements in the North Atlantic at 25deg north latitude had been running about 25 Sv but new data has put that value around 14 Sv leading to speculation that the Gulf Stream heat conveyor belt may be weakening. Our Sv (Sievert) is a registered SI unit, but what about the Sverdrup.... +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - Make it your home page! http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs From lists at richardhess.com Mon Dec 5 11:17:29 2005 From: lists at richardhess.com (Richard L. Hess) Date: Mon, 05 Dec 2005 12:17:29 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Article: Reliability of Information -- (not radiation-related, but of interest) In-Reply-To: <20051205162507.7253.qmail@web54306.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20051205162507.7253.qmail@web54306.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <7.0.0.16.2.20051205120143.0651f690@richardhess.com> At 11:25 AM 12/5/2005, John Jacobus passed along: > >From the New York Times, >http://www.nytimes.com/2005/12/04/weekinreview/04seelye.html?th&emc=th > I find the Seigenthaler case to be troubling, but I am not sure that one case (and perhaps the many others like it) still invalidate the Wikipedia concept. I have been favourably impressed with many articles on Wikipedia which were clearly written by people who were passionate about the topic. In areas where I have expertise, the articles I've read have been mostly correct with only minor discrepancies and who is to say that my version is more accurate? We did have an issue here about six months ago when our already high-profile Member of Parliament garnered even more attention by switching parties (very rare in Canadian politics). The article about Belinda Stronach in Wikipedia was locked before she switched parties and the editors were having a struggle with someone who wanted to change it based on his opinions vs. what could be documented. Although, at the time, she was a member of the Conservative Party, the wannabe-author lauded her for having New Democratic Party leaning. When she switched, she went to the Liberal Party. The wannabe was not actually derogatory, but rather was painting a picture of the politician which did not stand up to scrutiny. It appeared to be a fantasy about what he hoped she would do politically. I find the reliability of Wikipedia to be as good as anything else turned up in a Google search. After all, there are Web sites which are put up to deliberately mislead and mis-state the facts in order to bolster their point. I'm sure we all have our own examples of that, and this discipline is probably rife with them. I think we just raised the issue of Sternglass. Don't forget how Wasserman can use press clippings pre-Google in "Killing our Own" http://www.ratical.org/radiation/KillingOurOwn/ to state a case which appears to be totally meaningless, but is quite convincing as a first read considering all the footnotes. This book is sort of like the concentration of toxins up the food chain. He is at the top of selecting reports that meet his point of view and referring to them. I think that overall Wikipedia is a hugely beneficial resource. While it is not the only tool that my family or I use, it is one of the five "first-look" icons on our desktops: - Encyclopedia Britannica (on disc) - Encarta (on disc) - Wikipedia (on line) - The Canadian Encyclopedia (on line) - Google (on line - we have yet to implement our local search options though we are all building an interesting collection of stuff in the "Info" share on our server. It's an electronic version of the traditional library "topic file." Cheers, Richard Richard L. Hess richard at richardhess.com Aurora, Ontario, Canada http://www.richardhess.com/ Detailed contact information: http://www.richardhess.com/tape/contact.htm From David.Wesley at ehs.ucr.edu Mon Dec 5 12:10:56 2005 From: David.Wesley at ehs.ucr.edu (Wesley, David) Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 10:10:56 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Job Opening Message-ID: <2FDAAD8654C69E4585917F55804580E2CAE570@ehs.ucr.edu> The University of California, Riverside is hiring a Radiation Safety Specialist II. For details on the position and how to apply, please go to http://humanresources.ucr.edu/jobs/JobsBrowse.aspx?@strJobNumber=05- 11-019 . Please pass this information along to anyone you know who may be interested. Thanks David Wesley, CHP Radiation Safety Officer Environmental Health and Safety University of California Riverside, CA 92521-0306 david.wesley at ehs.ucr.edu 951-827-5746 Direct 951-827-5528 Admin 951-827-5122 Fax http://www.ehs.ucr.edu Join us for the 2006 CSHEMA Conference at the Disneyland Resort in Anaheim, California-- The nation's premiere conference on campus health, safety and environmental management! From loc at icx.net Mon Dec 5 14:23:33 2005 From: loc at icx.net (Susan Gawarecki) Date: Mon, 05 Dec 2005 15:23:33 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Contrast Agent for Appendicitis Confirmation Linked to Cardiopulmonary Deaths Message-ID: <4394A1C5.9060702@icx.net> Contrast Agent for Appendicitis Confirmation Linked to Cardiopulmonary Deaths ROCKVILLE, Md., Dec. 2 - The FDA warned today that NeutroSpec, a contrast agent used to aid the diagnosis of appendicitis, has been linked two deaths from cardiopulmonary failure. The FDA warning noted that cardiopulmonary reactions occur within 30 minutes of injection with the agent, which is a murine IgM monoclonal antibody to be labeled with Technetium. In addition to the two deaths, there have been reports of serious cardiopulmonary events including "cardiac arrest, hypoxia, dyspnea, and hyptension requiring resuscitation with fluids, vassopressors and oxygen," the FDA said. The FDA advised close monitoring of all NeutroSpec patients for at least an hour after injection. In addition, clinicians using this agent are advised to have resuscitation equipment and appropriately trained resuscitation personnel available. Patients with underlying cardiopulmonary conditions may be at higher risk, so use of NeutroSpec in these patients requires careful consideration of "known and potential risks and benefits." NeutroSpec [Technetium (99m Tc) fanolesomab] is used for scintigraphic imaging of patients with equivocal signs and symptoms of appendicitis. The agent is approved for use in patients age five and older. Technetium binds with high affinity to polymophonuclear leucocytes which migrate to the site of an infected appendix. Technetium emits gamma rays, which are detected with a gamma camera, thereby pinpointing the infection. NeutroSpec is marketed by Mallinckrodt, Palatin Technologies. From kjkrs at hotmail.com Mon Dec 5 15:00:01 2005 From: kjkrs at hotmail.com (KJ Kearfott) Date: Mon, 05 Dec 2005 16:00:01 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Looking for DU slab In-Reply-To: <6.1.2.0.2.20051121101600.02c0f3d8@pop.nam.slb.com> Message-ID: Hi I am looking for a slab of DU which could be donated to UM for some experiments. Thanks Kim Kearfott Professor, Dept. of Nuclear Engineering and Radiological Physics From fd003f0606 at blueyonder.co.uk Mon Dec 5 16:13:39 2005 From: fd003f0606 at blueyonder.co.uk (Fred Dawson) Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 22:13:39 -0000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Man installs a nuclear particle accelerator in his home Message-ID: <002a01c5f9e9$27160d60$0400a8c0@DG47BM0J> http://www.wired.com/news/politics/0,1283,69726,00.html?tw=rss.TOP Albert Swank Jr., a 55-year-old civil engineer in Anchorage, Alaska, is a man with a mission. He wants to install a nuclear particle accelerator in his home. But when neighbors learned of plans to place the 20-ton device inside the house where Swank operates his engineering firm, their response was swift: Not in my backyard. Local lawmakers rushed to introduce emergency legislation banning the use of cyclotrons in home businesses. State health officials took similar steps, and have suspended Swank's permit to operate cyclotrons on his property. "Some of the neighbors who are upset about the cyclotron have started calling it SHAFT -- Swank's high-energy accelerator for tomography," attorney Alan Tesche said. "Part of what's got everyone so upset is we're not sure when it's going to arrive on the barge. We know Anchorage is gonna get the SHAFT, but we just don't know when." Tesche is also the local assemblyman who represents the area where Swank and his cyclotron would reside. Johns Hopkins University agreed to donate the used cyclotron, which is roughly six feet tall by eight feet wide, to Swank's business, Langdon Engineering and Management. The devices are relatively scarce in Alaska, and are used to produce radioactive substances that can be injected into patients undergoing PET scans. Short for positron emission tomography, a PET scan is similar to an X-ray. During the imaging procedure, radioactive material administered to the patient can help medical professionals detect cancerous tissue inside the body. The substance typically remains radioactive for only a couple of hours. For Swank, the backyard cyclotron is a personal quest: He lost his father to cancer years ago, and he says his community needs the medical resource. He also wants to use it to inspire young people to learn about science. "My father worked with me while I was building my first cyclotron at age 17 in this same home, and he encouraged all of the educational pursuits that resulted in who I am," Swank said. "Because of that and my desire to not see other cancer patients suffer -- if I can use this technology to prevent one hour of suffering, or stimulate one young person's mind to pursue science, I will devote every resource that I possess to that." Swank maintains the device is not dangerous for nearby residents. But assemblyman Tesche says noble intentions don't outweigh potential risks and nuisances. He and others fear a particle accelerator could pose hazards such as radiation leak risks to nearby residences. They also think the large amount of electricity it consumes could drain available power in the neighborhood. "We in Alaska embrace technology, and we love it -- but we would like to see this in a hospital or industrial area, where it belongs," Tesche said. "We don't need cyclotrons operating out of back alleys, or in someone's garage." In a letter to the city assembly, the South Addition Community Council compared potential damage from a cyclotron mishap to the Three Mile Island nuclear reactor accident. "Cyclotrons are not nuclear reactors," explains Roger Dixon of the Fermi National Accelerator laboratory or Fermilab in Illinois, funded by the U.S. Department of Energy. "Probably the worst thing that could happen with small cyclotrons is that the operator might electrocute themselves." At Fermilab, Dixon oversees the world's highest-energy collider, about four miles in circumference. It smashes matter and antimatter together so scientists can study the nature of energy. Dixon told Wired News that shielding from concrete walls or lead sheets is typically used to prevent the electrical beams produced by smaller cyclotrons from escaping. "Our neighbors here at Fermilab like us," said Dixon. "But then, our particle accelerator is not installed in a living room." Some of Swank's neighbors are not worried. Veronica Martinson, a homemaker who has lived next door to Swank for 36 years, thinks a cyclotron next door might be a good thing. "Albert was a star science student when he was a child," Martinson said. "He wants schoolchildren to be around this, so they'll learn how this works, and be curious about physics. One of them might turn out to be our next big scientist." Johns Hopkins University public affairs officer Gary Stephenson says the institution agreed to donate the used cyclotron to Swank's engineering firm "with understanding and assurances that it was to benefit the citizens of Alaska for medical needs," and only with proper permission from local authorities. Despite having had his operating permits suspended, Swank plans to remove the cyclotron from its current site at Johns Hopkins in Baltimore on Jan. 23, then ship it by truck and barge to Alaska. But the Anchorage Assembly plan to hold an emergency public hearing on Dec. 20 to determine whether he will be permitted to install the device at his lifelong residence. Fred Dawson From ncohen12 at comcast.net Mon Dec 5 17:06:41 2005 From: ncohen12 at comcast.net (Norm Cohen) Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 18:06:41 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP Message-ID: Dear Friends: This is an article that appeared in the Hampton Union on Friday Dec. 2. The paper is located in Hampton Beach NH, near the Seabrook nuclear power plant. Study: children's cancer up ... 12/02/2005 Hampton Union Date: 12/02/2005 Section: news Page: a1 Word Count: 633 word Study: children's cancer up N-plant, CDC say they have no knowledge of report By Susan Morse smorse at seacoastonline.com SEABROOK - Childhood cancer deaths in the last two decades increased by 19 percent in communities surrounding Seabrook Station, according to the group awarding the nuclear power plant a Dirty Dozen award on Tuesday. In a released statement, Paul Schramski of the Toxics Action Center in Massachusetts said the information came from a study by the Center for Disease Control (CDC) in Atlanta. However, neither CDC spokeswoman Susan Asher nor Seabrook Station spokesman Al Griffith had any knowledge of such a study, they said. Further information released by Schramski said the research was done by Joseph Mangano, an epidemiologist with a master's degree in public health who is the national coordinator for the Radiation and Public Health Project. Its Web site says the project is "a nonprofit educational and scientific organization, established by scientists and physicians dedicated to understanding the relationships between low-level, nuclear radiation and public health." Mangano, reached at his office in Norristown, Pa., on Wednesday, said he used CDC statistics in his study. Anyone can access the same information at wonder.cdc.gov, he said. Infant death rates in four counties surrounding Seabrook Station increased by 4 percent from the two years prior to the plant going on line in 1989, to two years after, he said. The childhood cancer death rate increased by 19 percent between 1981 and 2002, he said. The CDC's Asher said on Wednesday that the federal center does release statistics on race, gender, age, and how people died. She could not confirm the results obtained by Mangano. The CDC does look into the veracity of any study, she said, when it gets a request to do so. "The CDC gets involved when it gets a petition to get involved," she said. "We just don't go out on our own. It can come from anyone." "We've never had a request to go out to the Seabrook place," Asher said. Mangano said the impetus for his research came from Guy Chichester, a Rye resident who co-founded the Clamshell Alliance. The alliance opposed the building of the Seabrook plant. Mangano and Chichester are also working on a study to determine the level of strontium 90 found in baby teeth. Strontium 90 is one component of ionized radiation and is like calcium in that it heads for teeth and bone, said Mangano. So far Mangano has gathered 4,500 teeth nationwide. He expects to release his results in 2006. Of his cancer study, Mangano admits factors other than the nuclear power plant may play a role in the increased statistics. Similar studies of cancer rates in areas surrounding other nuclear power plants have yielded similar results, he said. "Seabrook should be put in a list of factors," he said. "The general trend is, open a plant, the rate goes up, close a plant the rate goes down." Mangano looked at infant death rates for the years 1987 to 1988, and after the plant started operating, from 1989 to 1990, in four counties near Seabrook Station: Essex County in Massachusetts; Rockingham County; Strafford County; and York County in Maine. "In the four-county area it went up by 4 percent," he said. "In the rest of the three-state area - Massachusetts, New Hampshire and Maine - it was down 7 percent. In the rest of the U.S. it was down by 5 percent." He then looked at long-term changes in the childhood cancer death rate, of children dying before the age of 15 in the same four counties. Mangano compared the CDC statistics for the years 1981 through 1989 and 1990 through 2002. "The change in the rates increased by 19 percent," he said. "Elsewhere in the three states it was down by 23 percent and in the U.S., down 26 percent." The Radiation and Public Health Project is not an advocate organization, he said. From Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au Mon Dec 5 20:55:50 2005 From: Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au (Rogers Brent) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 13:55:50 +1100 Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? Message-ID: Dear Colleagues For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website (www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be accessible again? Brent Rogers Manager Radiation Operations Unit NSW Environment Protection Authority Department of Environment and Conservation *+61 2 9995 5986 *+61 2 9995 6603 * PO Box A290 Sydney South 1232 This email is intended for the addressee(s) named and may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then delete it immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of the individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority states them to be the views of the Department of Environment and Conservation (NSW). From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Mon Dec 5 21:56:59 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 03:56:59 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051206035659.2277.qmail@web26406.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> I have been experiencing this for several weeks now. Regards K.S.Parthasarathy Rogers Brent wrote: Dear Colleagues For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website (www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be accessible again? Brent Rogers Manager Radiation Operations Unit NSW Environment Protection Authority Department of Environment and Conservation *+61 2 9995 5986 *+61 2 9995 6603 * PO Box A290 Sydney South 1232 This email is intended for the addressee(s) named and may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then delete it immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of the individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority states them to be the views of the Department of Environment and Conservation (NSW). _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- Play Santa's Celebrity Xmas Party, an exclusive game from Yahoo! From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Mon Dec 5 22:39:22 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 04:39:22 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Man installs a nuclear particle accelerator in his home, storms in the tea cup In-Reply-To: <002a01c5f9e9$27160d60$0400a8c0@DG47BM0J> Message-ID: <20051206043922.86370.qmail@web26413.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear Dr Dawson, Thank you for this message. Public perception of anything nuclear related or radiation related is difficult to fathom. In india, we had smaller "storms in the tea cup" due to CT scan units and diagnostic x-ray installations in residential areas. Regards K.S.Parthasarathy Fred Dawson wrote: http://www.wired.com/news/politics/0,1283,69726,00.html?tw=rss.TOP Albert Swank Jr., a 55-year-old civil engineer in Anchorage, Alaska, is a man with a mission. He wants to install a nuclear particle accelerator in his home. But when neighbors learned of plans to place the 20-ton device inside the house where Swank operates his engineering firm, their response was swift: Not in my backyard. Local lawmakers rushed to introduce emergency legislation banning the use of cyclotrons in home businesses. State health officials took similar steps, and have suspended Swank's permit to operate cyclotrons on his property. "Some of the neighbors who are upset about the cyclotron have started calling it SHAFT -- Swank's high-energy accelerator for tomography," attorney Alan Tesche said. "Part of what's got everyone so upset is we're not sure when it's going to arrive on the barge. We know Anchorage is gonna get the SHAFT, but we just don't know when." Tesche is also the local assemblyman who represents the area where Swank and his cyclotron would reside. Johns Hopkins University agreed to donate the used cyclotron, which is roughly six feet tall by eight feet wide, to Swank's business, Langdon Engineering and Management. The devices are relatively scarce in Alaska, and are used to produce radioactive substances that can be injected into patients undergoing PET scans. Short for positron emission tomography, a PET scan is similar to an X-ray. During the imaging procedure, radioactive material administered to the patient can help medical professionals detect cancerous tissue inside the body. The substance typically remains radioactive for only a couple of hours. For Swank, the backyard cyclotron is a personal quest: He lost his father to cancer years ago, and he says his community needs the medical resource. He also wants to use it to inspire young people to learn about science. "My father worked with me while I was building my first cyclotron at age 17 in this same home, and he encouraged all of the educational pursuits that resulted in who I am," Swank said. "Because of that and my desire to not see other cancer patients suffer -- if I can use this technology to prevent one hour of suffering, or stimulate one young person's mind to pursue science, I will devote every resource that I possess to that." Swank maintains the device is not dangerous for nearby residents. But assemblyman Tesche says noble intentions don't outweigh potential risks and nuisances. He and others fear a particle accelerator could pose hazards such as radiation leak risks to nearby residences. They also think the large amount of electricity it consumes could drain available power in the neighborhood. "We in Alaska embrace technology, and we love it -- but we would like to see this in a hospital or industrial area, where it belongs," Tesche said. "We don't need cyclotrons operating out of back alleys, or in someone's garage." In a letter to the city assembly, the South Addition Community Council compared potential damage from a cyclotron mishap to the Three Mile Island nuclear reactor accident. "Cyclotrons are not nuclear reactors," explains Roger Dixon of the Fermi National Accelerator laboratory or Fermilab in Illinois, funded by the U.S. Department of Energy. "Probably the worst thing that could happen with small cyclotrons is that the operator might electrocute themselves." At Fermilab, Dixon oversees the world's highest-energy collider, about four miles in circumference. It smashes matter and antimatter together so scientists can study the nature of energy. Dixon told Wired News that shielding from concrete walls or lead sheets is typically used to prevent the electrical beams produced by smaller cyclotrons from escaping. "Our neighbors here at Fermilab like us," said Dixon. "But then, our particle accelerator is not installed in a living room." Some of Swank's neighbors are not worried. Veronica Martinson, a homemaker who has lived next door to Swank for 36 years, thinks a cyclotron next door might be a good thing. "Albert was a star science student when he was a child," Martinson said. "He wants schoolchildren to be around this, so they'll learn how this works, and be curious about physics. One of them might turn out to be our next big scientist." Johns Hopkins University public affairs officer Gary Stephenson says the institution agreed to donate the used cyclotron to Swank's engineering firm "with understanding and assurances that it was to benefit the citizens of Alaska for medical needs," and only with proper permission from local authorities. Despite having had his operating permits suspended, Swank plans to remove the cyclotron from its current site at Johns Hopkins in Baltimore on Jan. 23, then ship it by truck and barge to Alaska. But the Anchorage Assembly plan to hold an emergency public hearing on Dec. 20 to determine whether he will be permitted to install the device at his lifelong residence. Fred Dawson _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- Win a Yahoo! Vespa NEW - Yahoo! Cars has 3 Vespa LX125s to be won Enter Now! From BLHamrick at aol.com Mon Dec 5 22:42:24 2005 From: BLHamrick at aol.com (BLHamrick at aol.com) Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 23:42:24 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? Message-ID: <1d5.49af5b91.30c670b0@aol.com> In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website (www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be accessible again? I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an overseas issue. Barbara L. Hamrick From Morten.Sickel at nrpa.no Tue Dec 6 02:23:24 2005 From: Morten.Sickel at nrpa.no (Morten Sickel) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 09:23:24 +0100 Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? Message-ID: <2326C830ADA651438DC694248E5FEF60698CFD@mailix.NRPA.LOCAL> -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of BLHamrick at aol.com > In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: >> For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website (www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not >> responsing" error page. Has this been the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to >> connect from an overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be accessible >> again? > I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an overseas issue. Works just fine from Norway. Morten -- Morten Sickel Norwegian Radiation Protection Authority From fd003f0606 at blueyonder.co.uk Tue Dec 6 02:29:32 2005 From: fd003f0606 at blueyonder.co.uk (Fred Dawson) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 08:29:32 -0000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] It pays to question the media Message-ID: <002c01c5fa3f$2ea472a0$0400a8c0@DG47BM0J> I recently had cause to complain to the BBC about an article on their news web site about Iraq, the environment and depleted uranium. The original article contained a photograph of a child with an eye tumour suggesting a link between the tumour and exposure to depleted uranium. I complained on the basis that there was no evidence to support the link between depleted uranium and eye tumours. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4425562.stm The BBC acknowledged my point and changed the caption on the photograph in question, here is their reply Dear Mr Dawson Thank you for your e-mail regarding BBC News Online. May I start by apologising for the delay in replying. We know our correspondents expect a swift response and I am sorry that you have had to wait so long on this occasion. I rasied your concerns about the picture and caption which accompanies the 'UN warns on Iraq environment fate' piece with BBC News Online. They explained that the picture of Alla Saleem was supplied to the BBC as one of a number of cases at Gazwan hospital in Basra which doctors have attributed to depleted uranium shells used by coalition forces. However, as the article itself does not mention the particular case of Alla Saleem they have decided, to amend the caption to a more general point about Iraqi health. The picture caption has now been changed from "Alla Saleem developed an eye tumour linked to depleted uranium (Pic: 2001)" to "Iraqi doctors say cancer cases have increased, especially among children". Thank you again for contacting the BBC. Yours sincerely Stewart McCullough Divisional Advisor BBC Information ---Original Message--- {Comments:} Please can you provide evidence to support your claim in the report on the News WWW site http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4425562.stm releating to Iraq that 'la Saleem developed an eye tumour linked to depleted uranium' To the best of my knowledge there is no scientific or factual basis for this assertion {EndofComments:} ----------------------------------- fwp_dawson at hotmail.com From srebro at bgumail.bgu.ac.il Tue Dec 6 02:33:58 2005 From: srebro at bgumail.bgu.ac.il (srebro) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 10:33:58 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] nrc Message-ID: <20051206082739.46E6733E76@smtp2.bgu.ac.il> Hi No problem from Israel Rafi From radbloom at comcast.net Tue Dec 6 06:06:04 2005 From: radbloom at comcast.net (Cindy Bloom) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 07:06:04 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? In-Reply-To: <1d5.49af5b91.30c670b0@aol.com> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20051206070131.01e895e0@mail.comcast.net> I'm in the U.S. I tried to get to NRC's website this morning and it sent me to http://www.nrc.gov.edgesuite.net/failover.html. These Radsafe messages remind me that I've encountered this message several times in the last couple of weeks. Cindy At 11:42 PM 12/5/2005 -0500, BLHamrick at aol.com wrote: > >In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, >ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: > >For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website >(www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been >the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an >overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be >accessible again? > > >I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an >overseas issue. > >Barbara L. Hamrick >_______________________________________________ >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood >the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: >http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings >visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From didi at tgi-sci.com Tue Dec 6 06:42:43 2005 From: didi at tgi-sci.com (=?ISO-8859-5?Q?Dimiter=20Popoff?=) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 14:42:43 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? Message-ID: <20051206124243.12946.qmail@server318.com> ww.nrc.gov appears to work from here (Bulgaria). Destination dependent contents? Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ > -------Original Message------- > From: Cindy Bloom > Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? > Sent: Dec 06 '05 14:06 > > I'm in the U.S. I tried to get to NRC's website this morning and it sent > me to http://www.nrc.gov.edgesuite.net/failover.html. These Radsafe > messages remind me that I've encountered this message several times in the > last couple of weeks. > > Cindy > > At 11:42 PM 12/5/2005 -0500, BLHamrick at aol.com wrote: > > > >In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, > >ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: > > > >For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website > >(www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been > >the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an > >overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be > >accessible again? > > > > > >I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an > >overseas issue. > > > >Barbara L. Hamrick > >_______________________________________________ > >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > >the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > >http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > >visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV Tue Dec 6 07:47:06 2005 From: EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV (Baratta, Edmond J) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 08:47:06 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP Message-ID: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA4A@orsnewea002.fda.gov> I'm always amazed how data is obtained from 'baby' teeth. What 'low-level' method is used to for the deter minion of Strontium-90. The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency had listed as the limits of detection for Strontium-90 as 2 pCi/kg (0.074 Bq/kg). Certainly the amount of sample used must be very small. Do they combine a large amount of teeth or are they from individual teeth? I would be interested in knowing more about this method. Edmond J. Baratta Radiation Safety Officer Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 Fax: 781-729-3593 The above represent my thoughts and not that of my agency. -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Norm Cohen Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 6:07 PM To: Know_Nukes at yahoogroups.com; Radsafe Subject: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP Dear Friends: This is an article that appeared in the Hampton Union on Friday Dec. 2. The paper is located in Hampton Beach NH, near the Seabrook nuclear power plant. Study: children's cancer up ... 12/02/2005 Hampton Union Date: 12/02/2005 Section: news Page: a1 Word Count: 633 word Study: children's cancer up N-plant, CDC say they have no knowledge of report By Susan Morse smorse at seacoastonline.com SEABROOK - Childhood cancer deaths in the last two decades increased by 19 percent in communities surrounding Seabrook Station, according to the group awarding the nuclear power plant a Dirty Dozen award on Tuesday. In a released statement, Paul Schramski of the Toxics Action Center in Massachusetts said the information came from a study by the Center for Disease Control (CDC) in Atlanta. However, neither CDC spokeswoman Susan Asher nor Seabrook Station spokesman Al Griffith had any knowledge of such a study, they said. Further information released by Schramski said the research was done by Joseph Mangano, an epidemiologist with a master's degree in public health who is the national coordinator for the Radiation and Public Health Project. Its Web site says the project is "a nonprofit educational and scientific organization, established by scientists and physicians dedicated to understanding the relationships between low-level, nuclear radiation and public health." Mangano, reached at his office in Norristown, Pa., on Wednesday, said he used CDC statistics in his study. Anyone can access the same information at wonder.cdc.gov, he said. Infant death rates in four counties surrounding Seabrook Station increased by 4 percent from the two years prior to the plant going on line in 1989, to two years after, he said. The childhood cancer death rate increased by 19 percent between 1981 and 2002, he said. The CDC's Asher said on Wednesday that the federal center does release statistics on race, gender, age, and how people died. She could not confirm the results obtained by Mangano. The CDC does look into the veracity of any study, she said, when it gets a request to do so. "The CDC gets involved when it gets a petition to get involved," she said. "We just don't go out on our own. It can come from anyone." "We've never had a request to go out to the Seabrook place," Asher said. Mangano said the impetus for his research came from Guy Chichester, a Rye resident who co-founded the Clamshell Alliance. The alliance opposed the building of the Seabrook plant. Mangano and Chichester are also working on a study to determine the level of strontium 90 found in baby teeth. Strontium 90 is one component of ionized radiation and is like calcium in that it heads for teeth and bone, said Mangano. So far Mangano has gathered 4,500 teeth nationwide. He expects to release his results in 2006. Of his cancer study, Mangano admits factors other than the nuclear power plant may play a role in the increased statistics. Similar studies of cancer rates in areas surrounding other nuclear power plants have yielded similar results, he said. "Seabrook should be put in a list of factors," he said. "The general trend is, open a plant, the rate goes up, close a plant the rate goes down." Mangano looked at infant death rates for the years 1987 to 1988, and after the plant started operating, from 1989 to 1990, in four counties near Seabrook Station: Essex County in Massachusetts; Rockingham County; Strafford County; and York County in Maine. "In the four-county area it went up by 4 percent," he said. "In the rest of the three-state area - Massachusetts, New Hampshire and Maine - it was down 7 percent. In the rest of the U.S. it was down by 5 percent." He then looked at long-term changes in the childhood cancer death rate, of children dying before the age of 15 in the same four counties. Mangano compared the CDC statistics for the years 1981 through 1989 and 1990 through 2002. "The change in the rates increased by 19 percent," he said. "Elsewhere in the three states it was down by 23 percent and in the U.S., down 26 percent." The Radiation and Public Health Project is not an advocate organization, he said. _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From wesvanpelt at att.net Tue Dec 6 09:55:18 2005 From: wesvanpelt at att.net (Wesley) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 10:55:18 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] HEALTH PHTSICS E-JOURNAL In-Reply-To: <1ef.4862f65d.30c4d705@aol.com> Message-ID: Radsafers, I am responding to the suggestion of establishment of a new, electronic health physics journal. As a model or concept, I invite you to look at the link below that describes a "living journal" in which the original authors continue to update their articles. http://relativity.livingreviews.org/About/concept.html Best regards, Wes Wesley R. Van Pelt, PhD, CIH, CHP Wesley R. Van Pelt Associates, Inc. From mrdupray at lbl.gov Tue Dec 6 10:23:29 2005 From: mrdupray at lbl.gov (Michael R. Dupray) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 08:23:29 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? In-Reply-To: <1d5.49af5b91.30c670b0@aol.com> References: <1d5.49af5b91.30c670b0@aol.com> Message-ID: <4395BB01.4010707@lbl.gov> Its probably a security setting at your lan or on your mail settings BLHamrick at aol.com wrote: > >In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, >ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: > >For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website >(www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been >the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an >overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be >accessible again? > > >I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an >overseas issue. > >Barbara L. Hamrick >_______________________________________________ >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > -- From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Tue Dec 6 10:52:25 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 16:52:25 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Which other countries are not having access to NRC website? In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.2.20051206070131.01e895e0@mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <20051206165225.94994.qmail@web26415.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear Cindy Bloom, When I tried to use the link you gave I got the following message: "Server not responding. Our website is experiencing technical difficulties. We are aware of the problem and hope to have it resolved shortly. Thank you for your patience." I have been getting this message for the past several weeks. It appears that NRC website is facing some prolonged technical difficulties!. They are unable to fix it. I thought that a "snag" which appeared to be temporary and technical could be corrected without difficulty. A few years ago, the website of the Indian Atomic Energy Regulatory Board was hacked by miscreants; They pasted some unwanted messages on the site; our staff could correct them in an hour. Indian press reported the event widely.I had several calls from the print and electronic media as I was then Secretary of the Board and the Director, Information and Technical Services Division. The hacking was a blessing in disguise! our site had unusually large number of hits for the following several days. Some members of the media wanted to know whether any secrets have been stolen. I had a hard time convincing the gullible that we do not have any secrets in our web site! I am keen to know which other countries are facing the difficulty with the NRC site. It appears that the snag is not hitting USA,Bulgaria,Israel and Norway. The NRCsite is not accessible from Australia and India. I shall appreciate receiving status messages from other countries to me personally and not to the group. Regards K.S.Parthasarathy Cindy Bloom wrote: I'm in the U.S. I tried to get to NRC's website this morning and it sent me to http://www.nrc.gov.edgesuite.net/failover.html. These Radsafe messages remind me that I've encountered this message several times in the last couple of weeks. Cindy At 11:42 PM 12/5/2005 -0500, BLHamrick at aol.com wrote: > >In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, >ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: > >For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website >(www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been >the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an >overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be >accessible again? > > >I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an >overseas issue. > >Barbara L. Hamrick >_______________________________________________ >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood >the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: >http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings >visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. From radbloom at comcast.net Tue Dec 6 11:45:38 2005 From: radbloom at comcast.net (Cindy Bloom) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 12:45:38 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Re: Which other countries are not having access to NRC website? In-Reply-To: <20051206165225.94994.qmail@web26415.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <5.2.0.9.2.20051206070131.01e895e0@mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20051206123757.036db7a8@mail.comcast.net> As noted before, I'm in the USA and have been having the problem intermittently. The URL that I sent to Radsafe before was to show others the link to the error message where I was redirected. I could not get to any of the other menu options (such as Contact Web Site Staff) from there. Right now, I can get to NRC's web site. Odd. Cindy At 04:52 PM 12/6/2005 +0000, you wrote: >Dear Cindy Bloom, > >When I tried to use the link you gave I got the following message: > >"Server not responding. >Our website is experiencing technical difficulties. >We are aware of the problem and hope to have it resolved shortly. Thank >you for your patience." > >I have been getting this message for the past several weeks. It appears >that NRC website is facing some prolonged technical difficulties!. They >are unable to fix it. I thought that a "snag" which appeared to be >temporary and technical could be corrected without difficulty. > >A few years ago, the website of the Indian Atomic Energy Regulatory Board >was hacked by miscreants; They pasted some unwanted messages on the site; >our staff could correct them in an hour. Indian press reported the event >widely.I had several calls from the print and electronic media as I was >then Secretary of the Board and the Director, Information and Technical >Services Division. > >The hacking was a blessing in disguise! our site had unusually large >number of hits for the following several days. Some members of the media >wanted to know whether any secrets have been stolen. I had a hard time >convincing the gullible that we do not have any secrets in our web site! > >I am keen to know which other countries are facing the difficulty with the >NRC site. It appears that the snag is not hitting USA,Bulgaria,Israel and >Norway. The NRCsite is not accessible from Australia and India. > >I shall appreciate receiving status messages from other countries to me >personally and not to the group. > >Regards > >K.S.Parthasarathy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Cindy Bloom wrote: >I'm in the U.S. I tried to get to NRC's website this morning and it sent >me to http://www.nrc.gov.edgesuite.net/failover.html. These Radsafe >messages remind me that I've encountered this message several times in the >last couple of weeks. > >Cindy > >At 11:42 PM 12/5/2005 -0500, BLHamrick at aol.com wrote: > > > >In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, > >ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: > > > >For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website > >(www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been > >the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an > >overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be > >accessible again? > > > > > >I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an > >overseas issue. > > > >Barbara L. Hamrick > >_______________________________________________ > >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > >the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > >http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > >visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > >_______________________________________________ >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood >the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: >http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings >visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > > >To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new >Yahoo! >Security Centre. From kjkrs at hotmail.com Tue Dec 6 13:10:55 2005 From: kjkrs at hotmail.com (KJ Kearfott) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 14:10:55 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] WE 2001 Panasonic Irradiator source installation In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi I am looking for somebody with experience installing or de-installing a WE 2001 Panasonic Irradiator source. Thanks Kim Kearfott U. Michigan From didi at tgi-sci.com Tue Dec 6 13:28:48 2005 From: didi at tgi-sci.com (=?ISO-8859-5?Q?Dimiter=20Popoff?=) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 21:28:48 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Re: Which other countries are not having access to NRC website? Message-ID: <20051206192848.29915.qmail@server318.com> > Right now, I can get to NRC's web site. Odd. Or may be not that odd. Word has spread there are anomalies, perhaps peceived as revealing by someone who know their meaning, and the problem was fixed Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ > -------Original Message------- > From: Cindy Bloom > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Re: Which other countries are not having access to NRC website? > Sent: Dec 06 '05 19:45 > > As noted before, I'm in the USA and have been having the problem > intermittently. The URL that I sent to Radsafe before was to show others > the link to the error message where I was redirected. I could not get to > any of the other menu options (such as Contact Web Site Staff) from > there. Right now, I can get to NRC's web site. Odd. > > Cindy > > At 04:52 PM 12/6/2005 +0000, you wrote: > >Dear Cindy Bloom, > > > >When I tried to use the link you gave I got the following message: > > > >"Server not responding. > >Our website is experiencing technical difficulties. > >We are aware of the problem and hope to have it resolved shortly. Thank > >you for your patience." > > > >I have been getting this message for the past several weeks. It appears > >that NRC website is facing some prolonged technical difficulties!. They > >are unable to fix it. I thought that a "snag" which appeared to be > >temporary and technical could be corrected without difficulty. > > > >A few years ago, the website of the Indian Atomic Energy Regulatory Board > >was hacked by miscreants; They pasted some unwanted messages on the site; > >our staff could correct them in an hour. Indian press reported the event > >widely.I had several calls from the print and electronic media as I was > >then Secretary of the Board and the Director, Information and Technical > >Services Division. > > > >The hacking was a blessing in disguise! our site had unusually large > >number of hits for the following several days. Some members of the media > >wanted to know whether any secrets have been stolen. I had a hard time > >convincing the gullible that we do not have any secrets in our web site! > > > >I am keen to know which other countries are facing the difficulty with the > >NRC site. It appears that the snag is not hitting USA,Bulgaria,Israel and > >Norway. The NRCsite is not accessible from Australia and India. > > > >I shall appreciate receiving status messages from other countries to me > >personally and not to the group. > > > >Regards > > > >K.S.Parthasarathy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Cindy Bloom wrote: > >I'm in the U.S. I tried to get to NRC's website this morning and it sent > >me to http://www.nrc.gov.edgesuite.net/failover.html. These Radsafe > >messages remind me that I've encountered this message several times in the > >last couple of weeks. > > > >Cindy > > > >At 11:42 PM 12/5/2005 -0500, BLHamrick at aol.com wrote: > > > > > >In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, > > >ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: > > > > > >For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website > > >(www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been > > >the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an > > >overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be > > >accessible again? > > > > > > > > >I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an > > >overseas issue. > > > > > >Barbara L. Hamrick > > >_______________________________________________ > > >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > > > > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > > >the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > > >http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > > > > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > > >visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > > >_______________________________________________ > >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > >the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > >http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > >visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > > > > > > >To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new > >Yahoo! > >Security Centre. > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From Marty.Bourquin at grace.com Tue Dec 6 13:28:08 2005 From: Marty.Bourquin at grace.com (Marty.Bourquin at grace.com) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 14:28:08 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? Message-ID: I am in the USA and have this problem intermittently. I have the same issue with OSHA web site. I dont know why this solution works but it always seems to for me. I go to Google and search for NRC then click on the link that appears in the search results and I am in. As I said I dont know why it works but for me it does. Marty Bourquin Manager EHS W.R. Grace - Chattanooga -----Original Message----- From: Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au [mailto:Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au] Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 9:56 PM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? Dear Colleagues For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website (www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be accessible again? Brent Rogers Manager Radiation Operations Unit NSW Environment Protection Authority Department of Environment and Conservation *+61 2 9995 5986 *+61 2 9995 6603 * PO Box A290 Sydney South 1232 This email is intended for the addressee(s) named and may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then delete it immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of the individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority states them to be the views of the Department of Environment and Conservation (NSW). _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From mike.bohan at yale.edu Tue Dec 6 14:28:38 2005 From: mike.bohan at yale.edu (Michael Bohan) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 15:28:38 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Re: Which other countries are not having access Message-ID: <7ac8408a2868d853af89f8160c53ff82@yale.edu> Hello RadSafers, It also might be a browser problem. Try using a different browser and/or clear out your browser's cache. It might just be reloading the stored error message from your hard drive. Regards, Mike Bohan, RSO Yale-New Haven Hospital Radiological Physics 20 York St. - WWW 204 New Haven, CT 06510 Tele: (203) 688-2950 Fax: (203) 688-8682 Email: mike.bohan at yale.edu This message originates from Yale New Haven Health System. The information contained in this message may be privileged and confidential. If you are the intended recipient, you must maintain this message in a secure and confidential manner. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately and destroy this message. Thank you. From didi at tgi-sci.com Tue Dec 6 16:53:42 2005 From: didi at tgi-sci.com (=?ISO-8859-5?Q?Dimiter=20Popoff?=) Date: Wed, 07 Dec 2005 00:53:42 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: NRC website? Message-ID: <20051206225342.23893.qmail@server318.com> Well this sounds like some new epidemic on the systems many people use in the US. Perhaps something in the way they do nameserver requests or whatever. Does not seem to be destination dependent content, though. Just some software glitch, most likely OS related. Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ > -------Original Message------- > From: Marty.Bourquin at grace.com > Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? > Sent: Dec 06 '05 21:28 > > I am in the USA and have this problem intermittently. I have the same > issue with OSHA web site. I dont know why this solution works but it > always seems to for me. I go to Google and search for NRC then click on > the link that appears in the search results and I am in. As I said I > dont know why it works but for me it does. > > Marty Bourquin > Manager EHS > W.R. Grace - Chattanooga > > -----Original Message----- > From: Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au > [mailto:Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au] > Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 9:56 PM > To: radsafe at radlab.nl > Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? > > > Dear Colleagues > > For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website > (www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this > been > the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect > from an > overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be > accessible again? > > Brent Rogers > Manager Radiation Operations Unit > NSW Environment Protection Authority > Department of Environment and Conservation > *+61 2 9995 5986 > *+61 2 9995 6603 > * PO Box A290 Sydney South 1232 > > > > This email is intended for the addressee(s) named and may contain > confidential and/or privileged information. > > If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then > delete it immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of > the individual sender except where the sender expressly and with > authority states them to be the views of the Department of Environment > and Conservation (NSW). > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au Tue Dec 6 15:17:49 2005 From: Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au (Rogers Brent) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 08:17:49 +1100 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Man installs a nuclear particle accelerator in hi s home, storms in the tea cup Message-ID: Mr Dixon from Fermilab is probably right, the worst thing he could do is electrocute himself. But if he did that, he'd be dead, and there're a lot of 'bad' things that can happen short of death. My worry is less about the cyclotron as what comes out of it. The first thing I thought of when reading the article was he said he was interested in making PET substances. Nuclear pharmacists that produce PET drugs use a myriad of dose reducing techniques when working with high dose-rate F-18, and many still have to take measures (such as doing lower dose tasks in the pharmacy) to prevent exceeding their 500 mSv (50 R) annual extremity limit. If Mr Swank wasn't equally trained and sufficiently careful, our pro-hormesis friends might be using him as an example. Or not. Brent Rogers Manager Radiation Operations Unit NSW Environment Protection Authority Department of Environment and Conservation *+61 2 9995 5986 *+61 2 9995 6603 * PO Box A290 Sydney South 1232 Fred Dawson wrote: http://www.wired.com/news/politics/0,1283,69726,00.html?tw=rss.TOP Albert Swank Jr., a 55-year-old civil engineer in Anchorage, Alaska, is a man with a mission. He wants to install a nuclear particle accelerator in his home. But when neighbors learned of plans to place the 20-ton device inside the house where Swank operates his engineering firm, their response was swift: Not in my backyard. Local lawmakers rushed to introduce emergency legislation banning the use of cyclotrons in home businesses. State health officials took similar steps, and have suspended Swank's permit to operate cyclotrons on his property. "Some of the neighbors who are upset about the cyclotron have started calling it SHAFT -- Swank's high-energy accelerator for tomography," attorney Alan Tesche said. "Part of what's got everyone so upset is we're not sure when it's going to arrive on the barge. We know Anchorage is gonna get the SHAFT, but we just don't know when." Tesche is also the local assemblyman who represents the area where Swank and his cyclotron would reside. Johns Hopkins University agreed to donate the used cyclotron, which is roughly six feet tall by eight feet wide, to Swank's business, Langdon Engineering and Management. The devices are relatively scarce in Alaska, and are used to produce radioactive substances that can be injected into patients undergoing PET scans. Short for positron emission tomography, a PET scan is similar to an X-ray. During the imaging procedure, radioactive material administered to the patient can help medical professionals detect cancerous tissue inside the body. The substance typically remains radioactive for only a couple of hours. For Swank, the backyard cyclotron is a personal quest: He lost his father to cancer years ago, and he says his community needs the medical resource. He also wants to use it to inspire young people to learn about science. "My father worked with me while I was building my first cyclotron at age 17 in this same home, and he encouraged all of the educational pursuits that resulted in who I am," Swank said. "Because of that and my desire to not see other cancer patients suffer -- if I can use this technology to prevent one hour of suffering, or stimulate one young person's mind to pursue science, I will devote every resource that I possess to that." Swank maintains the device is not dangerous for nearby residents. But assemblyman Tesche says noble intentions don't outweigh potential risks and nuisances. He and others fear a particle accelerator could pose hazards such as radiation leak risks to nearby residences. They also think the large amount of electricity it consumes could drain available power in the neighborhood. "We in Alaska embrace technology, and we love it -- but we would like to see this in a hospital or industrial area, where it belongs," Tesche said. "We don't need cyclotrons operating out of back alleys, or in someone's garage." In a letter to the city assembly, the South Addition Community Council compared potential damage from a cyclotron mishap to the Three Mile Island nuclear reactor accident. "Cyclotrons are not nuclear reactors," explains Roger Dixon of the Fermi National Accelerator laboratory or Fermilab in Illinois, funded by the U.S. Department of Energy. "Probably the worst thing that could happen with small cyclotrons is that the operator might electrocute themselves." At Fermilab, Dixon oversees the world's highest-energy collider, about four miles in circumference. It smashes matter and antimatter together so scientists can study the nature of energy. Dixon told Wired News that shielding from concrete walls or lead sheets is typically used to prevent the electrical beams produced by smaller cyclotrons from escaping. "Our neighbors here at Fermilab like us," said Dixon. "But then, our particle accelerator is not installed in a living room." Some of Swank's neighbors are not worried. Veronica Martinson, a homemaker who has lived next door to Swank for 36 years, thinks a cyclotron next door might be a good thing. "Albert was a star science student when he was a child," Martinson said. "He wants schoolchildren to be around this, so they'll learn how this works, and be curious about physics. One of them might turn out to be our next big scientist." Johns Hopkins University public affairs officer Gary Stephenson says the institution agreed to donate the used cyclotron to Swank's engineering firm "with understanding and assurances that it was to benefit the citizens of Alaska for medical needs," and only with proper permission from local authorities. Despite having had his operating permits suspended, Swank plans to remove the cyclotron from its current site at Johns Hopkins in Baltimore on Jan. 23, then ship it by truck and barge to Alaska. But the Anchorage Assembly plan to hold an emergency public hearing on Dec. 20 to determine whether he will be permitted to install the device at his lifelong residence. Fred Dawson _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- Win a Yahoo! Vespa NEW - Yahoo! Cars has 3 Vespa LX125s to be won Enter Now! _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ This email is intended for the addressee(s) named and may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then delete it immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of the individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority states them to be the views of the Department of Environment and Conservation (NSW). From farbersa at optonline.net Tue Dec 6 17:16:56 2005 From: farbersa at optonline.net (farbersa at optonline.net) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 18:16:56 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP In-Reply-To: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA4A@orsnewea002.fda.gov> References: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA4A@orsnewea002.fda.gov> Message-ID: Hi all, The most recent post by Norm Cohen relates to claims by Mangano, et. al that have nothing to do with baby teeth and Sr-90. Mangano is merely using the discredited techniques of Sternglass of using a narrow window of time and picking a time period of some health statistic to compare to another narrow window of time to claim some effect. Mangano is merely a Sternglass wannabe whose work fails on a first order analysis. Regarding the supposed effects of Sr-90 from nuclear plants that they claim to measuring in baby teeth, we know that 99++% of all Sr-90 in the environment near any nuclear plant is from open air testing of nuclear weapons. The variations in Sr-90 and Cs-137 in the environment from nuclear bomb test fallout are so large as to dwarf any trivial releases of these isotopes from any given nuclear plant. I've discussed this point before in earlier posts to Radsafe related to Cs-137 in woodash varying from 300 pCi/kg of ash in CA to 30,000 pCi/kg of wood ash from northern FL, no where near a nuclear plant. Sr-90 deposition in various parts of the country would have varied by similar amounts since there is a certain average ratio of Sr-90/Cs-137 in weapon's test fallout. Despite the claims of the TFP, Mangano, and Sternglass, their aggegate of work irregardless of the technique for measurements of Sr-90 in baby teeth, is nothing more than agenda science, the conclusions of which were determined before the first tooth was ever analyzed. Stewart Farber, MS Public Health The Prometheus Group, LLC 203 367-0791 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Baratta, Edmond J" Date: Tuesday, December 6, 2005 8:47 am Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP > I'm always amazed how data is obtained from 'baby' teeth. What > 'low-level' > method is used to for the deter minion of Strontium-90. The U.S. > Environmental Protection Agency had listed as the limits of > detection for > Strontium-90 as 2 pCi/kg (0.074 Bq/kg). Certainly the amount of > sample used > must be very small. Do they combine a large amount of teeth or > are they > from individual teeth? I would be interested in knowing more > about this > method. > > > Edmond J. Baratta > Radiation Safety Officer > Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 > Fax: 781-729-3593 > > The above represent my thoughts and not that of my agency. > > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] > On Behalf > Of Norm Cohen > Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 6:07 PM > To: Know_Nukes at yahoogroups.com; Radsafe > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP > > > > > > > > > Dear Friends: This is an article that appeared in the Hampton > Union on > Friday Dec. 2. The paper is located in Hampton Beach NH, near the > Seabrooknuclear power plant. > > > > > Study: children's cancer up ... 12/02/2005 > Hampton Union > Date: 12/02/2005 Section: news Page: a1 > Word Count: 633 word > > > Study: children's cancer up > N-plant, CDC say they have no knowledge of report > By Susan Morse smorse at seacoastonline.com > SEABROOK - Childhood cancer deaths in the last two decades > increased by 19 > percent in communities surrounding Seabrook Station, according to > the group > awarding the nuclear power plant a Dirty Dozen award on Tuesday. > In a released statement, Paul Schramski of the Toxics Action > Center in > Massachusetts said the information came from a study by the Center for > Disease Control (CDC) in Atlanta. > However, neither CDC spokeswoman Susan Asher nor Seabrook Station > spokesman Al Griffith had any knowledge of such a study, they said. > Further information released by Schramski said the research was > done by > Joseph Mangano, an epidemiologist with a master's degree in public > healthwho is the national coordinator for the Radiation and Public > Health Project. > Its Web site says the project is "a nonprofit educational and > scientificorganization, established by scientists and physicians > dedicated to > understanding the relationships between low-level, nuclear > radiation and > public health." > Mangano, reached at his office in Norristown, Pa., on > Wednesday, said he > used CDC statistics in his study. Anyone can access the same > information at > wonder.cdc.gov, he said. > Infant death rates in four counties surrounding Seabrook Station > increased by 4 percent from the two years prior to the plant going > on line > in 1989, to two years after, he said. > The childhood cancer death rate increased by 19 percent between > 1981 and > 2002, he said. > The CDC's Asher said on Wednesday that the federal center does > releasestatistics on race, gender, age, and how people died. > She could not confirm the results obtained by Mangano. > The CDC does look into the veracity of any study, she said, > when it gets > a request to do so. > "The CDC gets involved when it gets a petition to get > involved," she > said. "We just don't go out on our own. It can come from anyone." > "We've never had a request to go out to the Seabrook place," > Asher said. > Mangano said the impetus for his research came from Guy > Chichester, a Rye > resident who co-founded the Clamshell Alliance. The alliance > opposed the > building of the Seabrook plant. > Mangano and Chichester are also working on a study to determine > the level > of strontium 90 found in baby teeth. Strontium 90 is one component of > ionized radiation and is like calcium in that it heads for teeth > and bone, > said Mangano. > So far Mangano has gathered 4,500 teeth nationwide. He expects > to release > his results in 2006. > Of his cancer study, Mangano admits factors other than the > nuclear power > plant may play a role in the increased statistics. > Similar studies of cancer rates in areas surrounding other > nuclear power > plants have yielded similar results, he said. > "Seabrook should be put in a list of factors," he said. "The > generaltrend is, open a plant, the rate goes up, close a plant the > rate goes down." > Mangano looked at infant death rates for the years 1987 to > 1988, and > after the plant started operating, from 1989 to 1990, in four > counties near > Seabrook Station: Essex County in Massachusetts; Rockingham County; > Strafford County; and York County in Maine. > "In the four-county area it went up by 4 percent," he said. "In > the rest > of the three-state area - Massachusetts, New Hampshire and Maine - > it was > down 7 percent. In the rest of the U.S. it was down by 5 percent." > He then looked at long-term changes in the childhood cancer > death rate, > of children dying before the age of 15 in the same four counties. > Mangano compared the CDC statistics for the years 1981 through > 1989 and > 1990 through 2002. > "The change in the rates increased by 19 percent," he said. > "Elsewhere in > the three states it was down by 23 percent and in the U.S., down 26 > percent." > The Radiation and Public Health Project is not an advocate > organization,he said. > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and > understood the > RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other > settings visit: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and > understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other > settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From MZittle at FACNET.UCLA.EDU Tue Dec 6 18:22:27 2005 From: MZittle at FACNET.UCLA.EDU (Zittle, Mike) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 16:22:27 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Operational Health Physics Training By H.J. Moe Message-ID: Hi I am trying to download the Moe Handbook from http://www.nukeworker.com/study/hp/moe/index.shtml Apparently the link to Chapter 3 - 03. Properties of Alpha, Beta, Gamma, X-Rays, and Neutrons is damaged and cannot be repaired. Does anyone have the electronic pdf for Chapter 3 that they could please send me? Thanks Mike Michael J. Zittle Health Physicist UCLA Environment, Health and Safety 501 Westwood Plaza, 4th floor Box 951605 Los Angeles, CA 90095-1605 (310) 825-8797 fax (310) 206-9051 mzittle at admin.ucla.edu From maurysis at ev1.net Tue Dec 6 18:43:23 2005 From: maurysis at ev1.net (Maury Siskel) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 18:43:23 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: NRC website? In-Reply-To: <20051206225342.23893.qmail@server318.com> References: <20051206225342.23893.qmail@server318.com> Message-ID: <4396302B.9010105@ev1.net> http://www.nrc.gov/ After many repeated trials last couple days, site works fine from Ft. Worth Tx. on Netscape 7.2 via EV1. Cheers, Maury&Dog (maurysis at ev1.net =================== Dimiter Popoff wrote: > Well this sounds like some new epidemic on the systems many > people use in the US. Perhaps something in the way they do > nameserver requests or whatever. Does not seem to be > destination dependent content, though. Just some software glitch, most > likely OS related. > Dimiter > ------------------------------------------------------ > Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments > http://www.tgi-sci.com > -------------- snipped ----------------- From lists at richardhess.com Tue Dec 6 19:19:18 2005 From: lists at richardhess.com (Richard L. Hess) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 20:19:18 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? In-Reply-To: <1d5.49af5b91.30c670b0@aol.com> References: <1d5.49af5b91.30c670b0@aol.com> Message-ID: <7.0.0.16.2.20051206201840.06509ec8@richardhess.com> I just tried it from the Great White North here in Canada and it seemed to work. At 11:42 PM 12/5/2005, BLHamrick at aol.com wrote: > >In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, >ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: > >For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website >(www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been >the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an >overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be >accessible again? > > >I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an >overseas issue. > Richard L. Hess richard at richardhess.com Aurora, Ontario, Canada http://www.richardhess.com/ Detailed contact information: http://www.richardhess.com/tape/contact.htm From sjd at swcp.com Tue Dec 6 20:42:33 2005 From: sjd at swcp.com (Steven Dapra) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 19:42:33 -0700 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.1.20051206193751.009ec940@mail.swcp.com> Dec. 6 If you want the partisan's view on the Tooth Fairy Project, go to . Mangano et al. have published an article in The Science of the Total Environment, Volume 317, Issus 1-3, 30 December 2003, Pages 37-51; (An unexpected rise in strontium-90 in US deciduous teeth in the 1990s.) RPHP links to the abstract, and if you want the entire article you can pay American Elsevier $30.00. Steven Dapra sjd at swcp.com From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Tue Dec 6 22:15:38 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 04:15:38 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] People with an agenda can exploit the frailties and uncertainties of epidemiological studies. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051207041539.10523.qmail@web26412.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear Mr Stewart Farber, Claims such as the one made by Mangano et. al are accepted by lay people primarily because they do not have knowledge about fall out etc. People with hidden agenda are a committed lot. They will exploit the frailtiesand uncertainties inherent in epidemiological studies ruthlessly and to some extent irrationally to their advantage. Let me assure you that it is a very frustrating experience. Your detailed note on variation of weapons fall out will convince any one. But people conditioned by fear will be less amenable to reasoning. Still we have to try. Regards K.S.Parthasarathy farbersa at optonline.net wrote: Hi all, The most recent post by Norm Cohen relates to claims by Mangano, et. al that have nothing to do with baby teeth and Sr-90. Mangano is merely using the discredited techniques of Sternglass of using a narrow window of time and picking a time period of some health statistic to compare to another narrow window of time to claim some effect. Mangano is merely a Sternglass wannabe whose work fails on a first order analysis. Regarding the supposed effects of Sr-90 from nuclear plants that they claim to measuring in baby teeth, we know that 99++% of all Sr-90 in the environment near any nuclear plant is from open air testing of nuclear weapons. The variations in Sr-90 and Cs-137 in the environment from nuclear bomb test fallout are so large as to dwarf any trivial releases of these isotopes from any given nuclear plant. I've discussed this point before in earlier posts to Radsafe related to Cs-137 in woodash varying from 300 pCi/kg of ash in CA to 30,000 pCi/kg of wood ash from northern FL, no where near a nuclear plant. Sr-90 deposition in various parts of the country would have varied by similar amounts since there is a certain average ratio of Sr-90/Cs-137 in weapon's test fallout. Despite the claims of the TFP, Mangano, and Sternglass, their aggegate of work irregardless of the technique for measurements of Sr-90 in baby teeth, is nothing more than agenda science, the conclusions of which were determined before the first tooth was ever analyzed. Stewart Farber, MS Public Health The Prometheus Group, LLC 203 367-0791 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Baratta, Edmond J" Date: Tuesday, December 6, 2005 8:47 am Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP > I'm always amazed how data is obtained from 'baby' teeth. What > 'low-level' > method is used to for the deter minion of Strontium-90. The U.S. > Environmental Protection Agency had listed as the limits of > detection for > Strontium-90 as 2 pCi/kg (0.074 Bq/kg). Certainly the amount of > sample used > must be very small. Do they combine a large amount of teeth or > are they > from individual teeth? I would be interested in knowing more > about this > method. > > > Edmond J. Baratta > Radiation Safety Officer > Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 > Fax: 781-729-3593 > > The above represent my thoughts and not that of my agency. > > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] > On Behalf > Of Norm Cohen > Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 6:07 PM > To: Know_Nukes at yahoogroups.com; Radsafe > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP > > > > > > > > > Dear Friends: This is an article that appeared in the Hampton > Union on > Friday Dec. 2. The paper is located in Hampton Beach NH, near the > Seabrooknuclear power plant. > > > > > Study: children's cancer up ... 12/02/2005 > Hampton Union > Date: 12/02/2005 Section: news Page: a1 > Word Count: 633 word > > > Study: children's cancer up > N-plant, CDC say they have no knowledge of report > By Susan Morse smorse at seacoastonline.com > SEABROOK - Childhood cancer deaths in the last two decades > increased by 19 > percent in communities surrounding Seabrook Station, according to > the group > awarding the nuclear power plant a Dirty Dozen award on Tuesday. > In a released statement, Paul Schramski of the Toxics Action > Center in > Massachusetts said the information came from a study by the Center for > Disease Control (CDC) in Atlanta. > However, neither CDC spokeswoman Susan Asher nor Seabrook Station > spokesman Al Griffith had any knowledge of such a study, they said. > Further information released by Schramski said the research was > done by > Joseph Mangano, an epidemiologist with a master's degree in public > healthwho is the national coordinator for the Radiation and Public > Health Project. > Its Web site says the project is "a nonprofit educational and > scientificorganization, established by scientists and physicians > dedicated to > understanding the relationships between low-level, nuclear > radiation and > public health." > Mangano, reached at his office in Norristown, Pa., on > Wednesday, said he > used CDC statistics in his study. Anyone can access the same > information at > wonder.cdc.gov, he said. > Infant death rates in four counties surrounding Seabrook Station > increased by 4 percent from the two years prior to the plant going > on line > in 1989, to two years after, he said. > The childhood cancer death rate increased by 19 percent between > 1981 and > 2002, he said. > The CDC's Asher said on Wednesday that the federal center does > releasestatistics on race, gender, age, and how people died. > She could not confirm the results obtained by Mangano. > The CDC does look into the veracity of any study, she said, > when it gets > a request to do so. > "The CDC gets involved when it gets a petition to get > involved," she > said. "We just don't go out on our own. It can come from anyone." > "We've never had a request to go out to the Seabrook place," > Asher said. > Mangano said the impetus for his research came from Guy > Chichester, a Rye > resident who co-founded the Clamshell Alliance. The alliance > opposed the > building of the Seabrook plant. > Mangano and Chichester are also working on a study to determine > the level > of strontium 90 found in baby teeth. Strontium 90 is one component of > ionized radiation and is like calcium in that it heads for teeth > and bone, > said Mangano. > So far Mangano has gathered 4,500 teeth nationwide. He expects > to release > his results in 2006. > Of his cancer study, Mangano admits factors other than the > nuclear power > plant may play a role in the increased statistics. > Similar studies of cancer rates in areas surrounding other > nuclear power > plants have yielded similar results, he said. > "Seabrook should be put in a list of factors," he said. "The > generaltrend is, open a plant, the rate goes up, close a plant the > rate goes down." > Mangano looked at infant death rates for the years 1987 to > 1988, and > after the plant started operating, from 1989 to 1990, in four > counties near > Seabrook Station: Essex County in Massachusetts; Rockingham County; > Strafford County; and York County in Maine. > "In the four-county area it went up by 4 percent," he said. "In > the rest > of the three-state area - Massachusetts, New Hampshire and Maine - > it was > down 7 percent. In the rest of the U.S. it was down by 5 percent." > He then looked at long-term changes in the childhood cancer > death rate, > of children dying before the age of 15 in the same four counties. > Mangano compared the CDC statistics for the years 1981 through > 1989 and > 1990 through 2002. > "The change in the rates increased by 19 percent," he said. > "Elsewhere in > the three states it was down by 23 percent and in the U.S., down 26 > percent." > The Radiation and Public Health Project is not an advocate > organization,he said. > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and > understood the > RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other > settings visit: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and > understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other > settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. From burcin.okyar at taek.gov.tr Wed Dec 7 06:02:12 2005 From: burcin.okyar at taek.gov.tr (burcin.okyar at taek.gov.tr) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 14:02:12 +0200 Subject: =?iso-8859-9?B?3WxnaTpSZTog?=[ RadSafe ] NRC website? Message-ID: <20051207120212.LBQ13550.lale@[195.155.1.6]> It seems OK from Turkey. Burcin OKYAR > > Kimden: "Richard L. Hess" > Tarih: 2005/12/06 Tue PM 08:19:18 GMT+02:00 > Kime: radsafe at radlab.nl > Konu: Re: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? > > I just tried it from the Great White North here in Canada and it > seemed to work. > > At 11:42 PM 12/5/2005, BLHamrick at aol.com wrote: > > > >In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, > >ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: > > > >For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website > >(www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been > >the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an > >overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be > >accessible again? > > > > > >I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an > >overseas issue. > > > > Richard L. Hess richard at richardhess.com > Aurora, Ontario, Canada http://www.richardhess.com/ > Detailed contact information: http://www.richardhess.com/tape/contact.htm > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > From mccartmj at michigan.gov Wed Dec 7 08:03:46 2005 From: mccartmj at michigan.gov (Michael McCarty) Date: Wed, 07 Dec 2005 09:03:46 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? Message-ID: For what it's worth, I never (well hardly ever) have a problem entering the NRC website to check current power levels on 'our' reactors. Today I got a message: "Server Not Responding Our web site is experiencing technical difficulties. We are aware of the problem and hope to have it resolved shortly. Thank you for your patience. Click here to return to the home page." Mike Michael J. McCarty Physicist, MDEQ Radiological Laboratory Michigan Department of Environmental Quality Waste and Hazardous Materials Division Radiological Protection and Medical Waste Section Environmental Monitoring Unit 815 Terminal Road Lansing, MI 48906 phone: 517-335-8196 fax: 517-335-9551 e-mail: mccartmj at michigan.gov From EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV Wed Dec 7 08:09:12 2005 From: EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV (Baratta, Edmond J) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 09:09:12 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP Message-ID: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA54@orsnewea002.fda.gov> When I went to the site below, I found that the eminent 'Scientist' Alec Baldwin being quoted and realize that this information must be 'accurate'. We analyzed thousands of samples after TMI and did not detect any Strontium-90 or Cesium-137 in any of the milk samples from farms in that region. Therefore I fail to see where the Strontium-90 came from. Possibly from the 'Fallout' of the late 50's and early 60's. Certainly not from TMI. However, if it came from 'Fallout' and or TMI, how can one determine the origin? If Strontium-89 had been present in samples from the latter, it would have come from TMI. Again, where did the 'new' Strontium-90 come from that showed up in the 90's? Edmond J. Baratta Radiation Safety Officer Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 Fax: 781-729-3593 edmond.baratta at fda.gov The above represents my view and not that of my Agency. -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Steven Dapra Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2005 9:43 PM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP Dec. 6 If you want the partisan's view on the Tooth Fairy Project, go to . Mangano et al. have published an article in The Science of the Total Environment, Volume 317, Issus 1-3, 30 December 2003, Pages 37-51; (An unexpected rise in strontium-90 in US deciduous teeth in the 1990s.) RPHP links to the abstract, and if you want the entire article you can pay American Elsevier $30.00. Steven Dapra sjd at swcp.com _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From pottert at erols.com Wed Dec 7 08:43:44 2005 From: pottert at erols.com (Thomas Potter) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 09:43:44 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Moe Handbook (ANL-88-26) In-Reply-To: <4jsh0m$hchmsq@mx01.mrf.mail.rcn.net> Message-ID: <4iore0$5cm5im@smtp02.mrf.mail.rcn.net> Can't provide a PDF of Section 3 as requested in earlier post, but the entire document can be downloaded as one PDF file from following link: http://www.osti.gov/bridge/purl.cover.jsp?purl=/145829-CHcdiA/webviewable/ From bbjorndal at radiationsafety.ca Wed Dec 7 09:05:18 2005 From: bbjorndal at radiationsafety.ca (Brian Bjorndal) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 09:05:18 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Williston Elin TLD Irradiator Message-ID: <001501c5fb3f$a3660210$6401a8c0@Manager> I am looking for a companies in the US who service Williston Elin TLD Irradiators. Brian Bjorndal, MSc, PPhys Manager/Senior Scientist, National Laboratories Radiation Safety Institute of Canada 102 - 110 Research Drive Saskatoon, Saskatchewan Canada S7N 3R3 Tel: (306) 975-0566 Fax: (306) 975-0494 Email: bbjorndal at RadiationSafety.ca Website: www.RadiationSafety.ca From sandyfl at earthlink.net Wed Dec 7 09:20:16 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Wed, 07 Dec 2005 07:20:16 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Doctors warn against nuclear industry Message-ID: <43968D30.29956.53BF29B@localhost> Index: Doctors warn against nuclear industry Chinese PM, on visit to France, eyes nuclear future India becomes partner in multinational nuclear fusion reactor project Russian nuclear company prepares bid for Bulgarian NPP tender Doyle's reversal on nuclear plant sale followed donations Huntsman optimistic his D.C. visit has helped bar material from Utah ============================= Doctors warn against nuclear industry Dec 7 (Sydney Morning Herald) Radioactive waste from nuclear power plants cannot be dealt with in a safe and effective way, a group of eminent doctors has warned. As debate over the government's plans to force a nuclear waste dump on the Northern Territory continued in the Senate on Wednesday, the 18 doctors released a statement warning against the expansion of the nuclear industry. Citing concerns that any expansion of nuclear power would increase the proliferation of nuclear weapons, increase the risk of nuclear terrorism and increase the risk of nuclear accidents, the doctors said the industry should not be encouraged. "Calls for Australians to consider nuclear power for domestic use are unnecessary and counterproductive," they said. "Jumping out of the climate change frying pan into the fire of increased nuclear risk would at best be swapping one set of serious problems for another, while setting back the work of implementing real, sustainable solutions to climate change." Science Minister Brendan Nelson also has proposed a $1 million research study into a nuclear power industry for Australia. The doctors said the issue of radioactive waste was insurmountable. "The problem of nuclear waste is intractable, a burden irresponsibly imposed on countless future generations. "No nation has in place a satisfactory plan to deal with the tens of tonnes of high-level radioactive waste produced by each nuclear power plant each year. "No human institution has survived for the length of time necessary to safeguard this waste." The Senate is debating two bills that will give the federal government power to override a range of laws, including any passed by the NT government, that might frustrate a nuclear waste dump there. The move came after the government last year abandoned plans for a dump in South Australia following community protest. The government will now canvass three sites on commonwealth land in the NT - Mount Everard and Harts Range near Alice Springs and Fishers Ridge, near Katherine. The Australian Greens have suggested a number of amendments to the legislation, including preventing overseas nuclear waste making its way to Australia, reinstating the right of indigenous communities to veto a dump on sacred sites, and removing absolute ministerial power over where the dump will be. The doctors, from a range of backgrounds at various universities across the country, released their statement through the Medical Association for Prevention of War (MAPW) ----------------- Chinese PM, on visit to France, eyes nuclear future CADARACHE, France (AFP) Dec 6 - China's push to develop its nuclear technology to meet skyrocketing energy needs dominated the third day of a visit to France by Chinese Prime Minister Wen Jiabao. He emphasized that goal on a trip to inspect the site of the future International Thermonuclear Experimental Reactor (ITER) to be built over the next decade in Cadarache, southern France. "The energy issue elicits great attention in the whole world, and the ITER site also attracts great attention in the world," he said as he stood on a hilltop clearing upon which will built the cutting-edge fusion reactor facility. China is one of the seven partners financing the ITER project and providing scientific staff and equipment. The others are the European Union, Japan, the United States, Russia, South Korea -- and, as of Tuesday, India. "I'll come back in 10 years," Wen quipped, referring to the scheduled date when the reactor is expected to be operational. The EU is putting up half the 4.6-billion-euro construction (5.4- billion-dollar) cost, with the rest equally divided up among the other partners. Wen added that he was "very happy to see the ITER established in France." The decision to locate the site in France was made in June after lengthy negotiations marked by strong competition to host the reactor from Japan -- China's rival in Asia. ITER aims to create fusion energy -- the same sort of process that occurs at the heart of the Sun, one that is much more powerful than in conventional nuclear power plants -- and find ways to harness it to one day supplant the world's reliance on dwindling fossil fuels. It will be home to 400 scientists, two-thirds of them foreign. The reactor is expected to have a life-span of 40 years. Alain Bugat, the head of France's Commission for Atomic Energy, the body overseeing the Cadarache site, where a much smaller fusion reactor is already located, showed Wen a model of what ITER will look like. China, Bugat told AFP, was "working out what portion of the project it is going to contribute," along with the other partners. He declined to elaborate. Beyond the research possibilities of ITER, Wen on Tuesday also made reference to France's bid to win an eight-billion-dollar (6.8-billion- euro) deal to construct four third-generation nuclear energy reactors in China. "China hopes that France will offer more attractive conditions on technology transfer as well as price so that Franco-Chinese cooperation in this field can develop," he said at an elite French science university in the southern Paris suburbs before travelling to Cadarache. The French company Areva is fighting to win the contract, but is facing stiff competition from Westinghouse of the United States as well as the Russian AtomStroyExport. China was to have announced a winner by the end of 2005 but has put off a decision till early next year in the hope of squeezing better terms from the bidders. Wen, addressing students, professors and business chiefs, insisted that his country's advances in nuclear development and other fields were not a threat, implicitly addressing fears by some analysts that China aims to become a formidable military power. "Having suffered enormously from foreign invasions, China knows the price of peace. This choice is a logical choice, imposed by China's history and culture. China's development is not a threat but an opportunity for the world," he said. The Asian giant, which has become the top target for Western companies keen to benefit from its burgeoning economy, has proved adept at making technology transfer a condition for any major deals. On Monday in Paris, Wen oversaw the signing of a Chinese order to buy 150 Airbus mid-range jets, worth nearly 10 billion dollars at list price. But the windfall for the European plane-maker only came after it committed to exploring the feasibility of setting up an assembly plant in China. Other technology products also grabbed Wen's interest. Before inspecting the ITER site, he spent 30 minutes touring the headquarters of Eurcopter, the helicopter subisidiary of the European Aeronoautic, Defence and Space (EADS) company which also has a controlling share of Airbus. On Monday Eurocopter announced a 600-million-euro partnership deal with China to share development and production of a new 16-seat aircraft dubbed the EC175. After his ITER visit, Wen went to Marseille to meet Chinese business leaders and community representatives living in France. On Wednesday, the last day of his four-day French visit, he was to tour the satellite facility of the telecommunications giant Alcatel at Cannes before leaving for Slovakia, the Czech Republic and Portugal. ------------------- India becomes partner in multinational nuclear fusion reactor project Dec 7 (India Daily ) India will become a partner in a multinational project to build an experimental nuclear-fusion reactor, the Indian government said Wednesday. The decision by the United States, the European Union, Japan, China, Russia and South Korea to accept India "as a full partner is an acknowledgment of India as a responsible nuclear state with advanced nuclear technology including in the field of fusion research," the Indian foreign ministry said in a statement. "It also recognizes that India can significantly contribute to such endeavors." The decision to let India take part in the International Thermonuclear Experimental Reactor being built in France was made Tuesday at a meeting in Jeju, South Korea, of the project's partners, the U.S. Embassy in New Delhi said in a statement. Scientists hope the plant will produce clean, safe and endless energy and help phase out polluting fossil fuels, like oil and coal. India carried out multiple nuclear tests in May 1998, provoking sanctions from the United States and other Western countries. But it later imposed a ban on further tests and most of the sanctions have been lifted. India also does not have a record of exporting nuclear technologies. New Delhi's desire to participate in the thermonuclear reactor project got a boost earlier this year when U.S. President George W. Bush proposed sharing civilian nuclear technology with New Delhi. "U.S. support was instrumental in ensuring the final agreement (in Jeju)," the U.S. Embassy in New Delhi said late Tuesday. The decision "represents the first tangible and concrete step toward greater cooperation between the U.S. and India in the nuclear field." Several European nations have also been keen on India's participation in the A10 billion (US$12 billion) project. ------------------- Russian nuclear company prepares bid for Bulgarian NPP tender MOSCOW, December 7 (RIA Novosti) - Atomstroiexport, Russia's nuclear power equipment and service export monopoly, has prepared the technical aspect of its bid for the tender to build a nuclear power plant (NPP) in Bulgaria, the company said Wednesday. The documentation, which will be submitted to the Bulgarian National Electric Company December 15, was compiled with the help of Framatome ANP and major Russian engineering and supply companies, including the Atomenergoproyekt institute, the Kurchatov institute, the Gidropress experimental design bureau, Silovye Mashiny, and the Izhora plants. The documentation will have been translated into Bulgarian by December 12. The construction site for the NPP is situated in Belene, 250 kilometers (over 150 miles) from Sofia, the capital of Bulgaria. The project was being developed in coordination with Soviet experts until Bulgarian authorities stopped the work in 1992. ------------------- Doyle's reversal on nuclear plant sale followed donations MILWAUKEE Dec 7 (AP) A campaign finance watchdog group is questioning whether donations from utility executives to Gov. Jim Doyle's re-election campaign helped reverse the state's rejection of the sale of a nuclear power plant to an out-of-state bidder. The Wisconsin Democracy Campaign says Doyle's campaign accepted $41,550 from executives of Wisconsin Public Service Corp. and Alliant Energy Corp. in the six months after the state Public Service Commission, on Nov. 19, 2004, rejected their sale of the Kewaunee nuclear plant to Dominion Resources Inc. of Richmond, Va. The three-member commission, which included two Doyle appointees, reversed its decision on March 17 and allowed the sale to go through. "A state commission controlled by the governor made one decision, and then they did an about-face and reversed that decision," said Mike McCabe, the Wisconsin Democracy Campaign's executive director. "That change of heart corresponded with some very large campaign donations flowing into the Doyle campaign. That alone raises major new questions." McCabe said former commission Chairwoman Burnie Bridge and Commissioner Mark Meyer were Doyle appointees who could have been influenced by the governor to change their minds. "If Jim Doyle wanted this plant sale, he had a friend on the PSC that he could obviously talk to," he said. The governor's spokeswoman, Melanie Fonder, called the allegation "ridiculous." "The Public Service Commission is an independent regulatory agency and it has no connection to this report," she said. Commission members are appointed by the governor and then confirmed by the state Senate. Meyer said in a statement the accusation was "baseless and absurd." A message left with an assistant to Bridge by the Associated Press was not immediately returned. The commission rejected the first sale request 2-1 with Bridge and Meyer voting against the deal, saying the terms "exempted it (the plant) from state regulation." The commission reversed its decision March 17, approving the sale unanimously after Dominion promised to give the panel a say in a future sale of the plant, agreed to return unused fees to dismantle it at the end of its life and to increase its payments to WPS and Alliant if it failed to supply them power. A group of utility watchdogs challenged the sale approval in Dane County Circuit Court on May 20, but Judge William Foust dismissed the case Monday, court records showed. The utilities denied accusations of decision-buying. "We're not going to dignify this with a comment," said spokesman Richard Zuercher of Dominion, which bought the plant for $191.5 million in July. Wisconsin Public Service spokesman Tom Meinz said company employees and executives donated to Doyle because he is "pro-business." "We want to support people that are pro-business, doesn't make any difference what side of the aisle they're on," Meinz said. ----------------- Huntsman optimistic his D.C. visit has helped bar material from Utah WASHINGTON Dec 7 (Deseret Morning News) Gov. Jon Huntsman Jr. left the nation's capital Tuesday "hopeful and optimistic" that the legislative attempt to block nuclear waste from coming to Utah will move forward, his general counsel Mike Lee said. Huntsman spent two days in Washington, D.C., meeting with senators and House members working on the National Defense Authorization Bill and the state's own congressional delegation. The bill contains a provision by Rep. Bob Bishop, R-Utah, that would create 100,000 acres of wilderness area that would block a potential railroad route to the proposed Private Fuel Storage nuclear waste site on the Goshute Indian Reservation. Lee said the matter is still in play right now, but he would likely know more by the end of the week. He did not want to speculate on the overall status of the language after Huntsman's visit but said the governor is an effective lobbyist for the state. "It's uncertain who the real enemies of the proposal are," Lee said. "Over the next 48 hours it will become clearer of what will happen. The lobbying effort has not stopped." Lee said the Air Force told lawmakers Tuesday that it supported the provision. If passed, the wilderness area designation would protect Cedar Mountains, near the Utah Test and Training Range, the Defense Department's largest training range used by pilots at Hill Air Force Base. Former Utah Rep. Jim Hansen, a Republican, tried to get the language passed before he left office but failed to do so. Lee said this time is different because of the Air Force's support, along with a flip in position by Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., and environmental groups, who opposed the idea in the past. Private Fuel Storage spokeswoman Sue Martin said the final language of the wilderness area designation would need to be examined before its exact impact would be known. Martin said the site's license application, which the Nuclear Regulatory Commission has approved, allowed for a rail route to be built as well as using heavy-haul trucks to bring waste in from the road versus building a rail line. If approved, the designated wilderness area would block a rail line from being built but may not have much effect on a truck shipping plan because the road already exist. "That's my impression," Martin said. "We'd have to look at it more closely." ------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 E-Mail: sperle at dosimetry.com E-Mail: sandyfl at earthlink.net Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From sam_iverstine at yahoo.com Wed Dec 7 10:05:29 2005 From: sam_iverstine at yahoo.com (Sam Iverstine) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 08:05:29 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Looking for used 137Cs meter Calibration source < $4K Message-ID: <20051207160529.69883.qmail@web50112.mail.yahoo.com> I have a licensed client in FL that would like to purchase a 137Cs source between 85-120 mCi for calibration of G-M survey meters for < $4K. Please email me if you have one for sale of know of someone who may. Thank you, Sam Iverstine, M.S., C.H.P. Miami, FL --------------------------------- Yahoo! Shopping Find Great Deals on Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping From farbersa at optonline.net Wed Dec 7 10:36:20 2005 From: farbersa at optonline.net (farbersa at optonline.net) Date: Wed, 07 Dec 2005 11:36:20 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP In-Reply-To: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA54@orsnewea002.fda.gov> References: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA54@orsnewea002.fda.gov> Message-ID: Hi all, On the point made by Ed Baratta. In 1977, I presented a paper to the New England Chapter of the HPS on the total environmental inventories of Cs-137, Sr-90, and Pu-239 from prior nuclear weapon's test fallout. A very important point I showed was that the annual decay of the pre-existing inventory of each of these isotopes was larger than the releases to the environment were there to be 1,000 nuclear reactors in operation in the year 2000. For any given location, given the areal deposition from prior fallout, the same would be true. The existing concentration of Sr-90 per unit area near any nuclear plant could NOT even be MAINTAINED given the annual decline due to radiological decay of the existing environmental inventory, and the actual current or maximally allowed releases of Sr-90 from any given plant. The same held for Cs-137 and Pu-239. The recent "claims" of Mangano, Sternglass, et. al. are nothing but manipulated statistics that would and should be laughable if they did not get the unwarranted attention by media and concerned, but gullible members of the public which have no ability to critique the claims. One would hope that some real data as is the case with the analyses from the FDA lab would have some impact. Regretably, this is not the case since actual, supportable radiological data and the implications of it is not reaching the public, media, or legislators in an understandable and impactful manner. Stewart Farber, MS Public Health The Prometheus Group, LLC 203 367-0791 "No matter how cynical I get, it's hard to keep up." --Lili Tomlin ================ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Baratta, Edmond J" Date: Wednesday, December 7, 2005 9:09 am Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP > When I went to the site below, I found that the eminent > 'Scientist' Alec > Baldwin being quoted and realize that this information must be > 'accurate'.We analyzed thousands of samples after TMI and did not > detect any > Strontium-90 or Cesium-137 in any of the milk samples from farms > in that > region. Therefore I fail to see where the Strontium-90 came from. > > Possibly from the 'Fallout' of the late 50's and early 60's. > Certainly not > from TMI. However, if it came from 'Fallout' and or TMI, how can one > determine the origin? If Strontium-89 had been present in samples > from the > latter, it would have come from TMI. Again, where did the 'new' > Strontium-90 come from that showed up in the 90's? > > Edmond J. Baratta > Radiation Safety Officer > Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 > Fax: 781-729-3593 > edmond.baratta at fda.gov > > From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Wed Dec 7 11:32:08 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 17:32:08 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? I get the same error message In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051207173208.42298.qmail@web26409.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear Mike, I have been getting this error message for the past several weeks.I hoped that some radsafe member from the NRC may clarify. I tried to access NRC through different servers.I did not succeed. Regards Michael McCarty wrote: For what it's worth, I never (well hardly ever) have a problem entering the NRC website to check current power levels on 'our' reactors. Today I got a message: "Server Not Responding Our web site is experiencing technical difficulties. We are aware of the problem and hope to have it resolved shortly. Thank you for your patience. Click here to return to the home page." Mike Michael J. McCarty Physicist, MDEQ Radiological Laboratory Michigan Department of Environmental Quality Waste and Hazardous Materials Division Radiological Protection and Medical Waste Section Environmental Monitoring Unit 815 Terminal Road Lansing, MI 48906 phone: 517-335-8196 fax: 517-335-9551 e-mail: mccartmj at michigan.gov _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos. Get Yahoo! Photos From sam_iverstine at yahoo.com Wed Dec 7 11:56:15 2005 From: sam_iverstine at yahoo.com (Sam Iverstine) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 09:56:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Looking for a used 137Cs source for survey meter calibration Message-ID: <20051207175615.93490.qmail@web50109.mail.yahoo.com> I have a licensed client in FL who is seeking an 85mCi - 120 mCi 137Cs source to calibrate survey meters. Please email me if you or someone you know has one they may want to sell. Thank you for any response. Sam Iverstine, MS, CHP Miami, FL --------------------------------- Yahoo! Shopping Find Great Deals on Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping From joel.baumbaugh at navy.mil Wed Dec 7 12:56:05 2005 From: joel.baumbaugh at navy.mil (Baumbaugh, Joel SPAWAR) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 10:56:05 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Free sources - you pay shipping... Message-ID: <7DB6DF83D2CD9140ADA0622B1A05BF2F016678BA@nawespscez02.nadsuswe.nads.navy.mil> RADSAFERS, I have a researcher who has two sources which are utilized at another facility (and not under any of my licenses). He no longer has any use for these sources and has given me the following information to post on RADSAFE. PLEASE DO NOT CONTACT ME ABOUT THESE SOURCES... There are two (Co-60) sources which are GFE at Maxwell Labs. These (2 sources) were delivered in 1990 totaling 5820 Ci. By his calculations they are down to about 700 Ci (364 Ci and 342 Ci) These sources were made by Neutron Products and he has some drawings that could be scanned and attached to someone if they'd like. The sources capsule is 3.9 inches from bottom to top of threaded tip. Diameter is 0.382 inches. The sources were custom made so he doesn't think they have a model number associated with them. These are FREE to a good (appropriately licensed) home. You pay the shipping. Please contact Dr. Russ Clement via email at russ.clement at navy.mil if you are interested. Joel Baumbaugh (joel.baumbaugh at navy.mil) SSC-SD From jimm at WPI.EDU Wed Dec 7 14:32:52 2005 From: jimm at WPI.EDU (Muckerheide, James) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 15:32:52 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Building the PBMR Message-ID: <71A6142F930A1E4C9300D4088D9765C854D1F4@EXCHDB.admin.wpi.edu> Friends, The following report from Japan indicates South African progress and (hopeful?) schedule on the PBMR! Regards, Jim Muckerheide =================== Kyodo: M'bishi Heavy Wins Order for Key Structure of S. Africa's Nuke Plant JPP20051206969070 Tokyo Kyodo World Service in English 1407 GMT 06 Dec 05 Computer selected and disseminated without FBIS editorial intervention] Tokyo, Dec. 6 Kyodo -- Mitsubishi Heavy Industries Ltd. said Tuesday it has received two orders for the core structure of a demonstration reactor of an advanced nuclear power plant to be built in South Africa. The contracts are worth approximately $15 million or 1.8 billion yen in total. One is for the basic design of a key structure called a core barrel assembly (CBA), part of the pebble bed modular reactor (PBMR), and the other is for provision of forgings and procurement of items for the CBA. Mitsubishi Heavy will start constructing the core structure for the PBMR with 165,000 kilowatt output in 2007 and will deliver the structure in 2011 to South Africa's national power utility, which plans to introduce the reactor into the country's grid system in 2013, the company said. The South African government intends to increase the number of PBMRs in commercial use to 24 by 2020, according to the company. According to Mitsubishi Heavy, the PBMR is a safe and cost-efficient reactor that uses silicon carbide-coated uranium particles encased in graphite for fuel, making it free from risk of reactor core meltdown. Helium gas is used as the coolant and energy transfer medium to a closed-cycle gas turbine and generator. From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Wed Dec 7 16:52:46 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 14:52:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: NRC website? In-Reply-To: <4396302B.9010105@ev1.net> Message-ID: <20051207225246.8838.qmail@web54310.mail.yahoo.com> I always thought that Ft. Worth was like a foreign country. Maybe I am correct. --- Maury Siskel wrote: > http://www.nrc.gov/ > After many repeated trials last couple days, site > works fine from Ft. > Worth Tx. on Netscape 7.2 via EV1. > Cheers, > Maury&Dog (maurysis at ev1.net > =================== > Dimiter Popoff wrote: > > > Well this sounds like some new epidemic on the > systems many > > people use in the US. Perhaps something in the way > they do > > nameserver requests or whatever. Does not seem to > be > > destination dependent content, though. Just some > software glitch, most > > likely OS related. > > Dimiter > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments > > http://www.tgi-sci.com > > -------------- snipped ----------------- > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing > list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have > read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be > found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe > and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL ? Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com From maurysis at ev1.net Wed Dec 7 21:11:18 2005 From: maurysis at ev1.net (Maury Siskel) Date: Wed, 07 Dec 2005 21:11:18 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: NRC website? In-Reply-To: <20051207225246.8838.qmail@web54310.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20051207225246.8838.qmail@web54310.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4397A456.1090805@ev1.net> Hi John, You might be closer to the mark than one might suppose. We were a foreign country once -- a genuine independent nation! We also ratain a few unique reservations which were stipulated as conditions for our agreement to join the Union. And I enjoy and appreciate your poke in the ribs. Come visit to enjoy Six Flags Over Texas and our history. Cheers, Maury&Dog ====================== John Jacobus wrote: > <>I always thought that Ft. Worth was like a foreign country. Maybe I > am correct. > > --- Maury Siskel wrote: http://www.nrc.gov/ > <>After many repeated trials last couple days, site > works fine from Ft. Worth Tx. on Netscape 7.2 via EV1. > Cheers, > Maury&Dog (maurysis at ev1.net) > =================== > Dimiter Popoff wrote: > >>> <>Well this sounds like some new epidemic on the systems many people >>> use in the US. Perhaps something in the way they do nameserver >>> requests or whatever. Does not seem to be destination dependent >>> content, though. Just some software glitch, mostlikely OS related. >> >>>Dimiter >>> >------------------------------------- > > >>>Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments >>>http://www.tgi-sci.com >>>-------------- snipped ---------- >>> >>> > > From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Thu Dec 8 09:59:56 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2005 07:59:56 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Editorial: No convincing evidence to increase Pu at LLNL Message-ID: <20051208155956.20381.qmail@web54304.mail.yahoo.com> >From Nature 438, 712 (8 December 2005) Enough, already Abstract:No convincing case has been made for increasing the amount of plutonium held at a Californian lab. The US Department of Energy is planning to double the amount of plutonium that can be stored at the Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory in California. Under new rules announced last week, the nuclear-weapons lab can keep up to 1,400 kilograms, or enough for around 300 bombs. Not surprisingly, antinuclear activists are up in arms about having so much bomb-grade metal in such a heavily populated area. But researchers who want the US nuclear-weapons laboratories to set a good example for the rest of the world should be equally dismayed at the plan. Since 1992, the United States has maintained a moratorium on the testing and development of new nuclear weapons. There's no real need for this research lab, which accommodates an outstanding civilian research programme next to its weapons-related activity, to be playing with this quantity of plutonium. Livermore is expected to use some of the expanded inventory in nuclear-weapons research, including experiments at the National Ignition Facility (NIF), a massive laser facility that will recreate some of the conditions inside nuclear weapons at detonation. The facility's original function was to perform such experiments on hydrogen isotopes, rather than plutonium. Officials at the Department of Energy never formally excluded the option of using plutonium in the NIF, but a 1995 report prepared by scientists in the department's non-proliferation office warned that its use at the facility could be seen as provocative by other nations. The other main reason why Livermore wants to hold more plutonium, according to energy-department documents, is that it will start to lay the groundwork for the renewed mass production of plutonium pits, used in US nuclear weapons. Livermore will be charged with developing new technologies for manufacturing the pits, for use at a proposed industrial-sized production facility. But questions remain over whether this facility is either necessary or appropriate, and this year Congress declined to appropriate the money needed to begin planning for its construction. Most of Livermore's new plutonium stocks would be shipped there from the Los Alamos National Laboratory in New Mexico, where the Department of Energy's track record in handling plutonium does not inspire much confidence. According to a report released on 29 November by the Institute for Energy and Environmental Research, a watchdog group based near Washington DC, Los Alamos has managed to lose between 300 kg and 600 kg of the material over the years. The group suggests that much of it was dumped indiscriminately in the desert during the early days of the nuclear age, or was mislabelled when shipped off elsewhere for long-term storage. And Livermore has had its own problems with plutonium. In January, its plutonium facility, where scientists work with the metal under heavily controlled conditions, was shut down amid safety concerns. Problems cited at the time included cracks in the building's ventilation systems and poorly constructed 'hot boxes' for handling the metal. The facility was allowed to reopen at a reduced capacity last month. The laboratory is wasting its time researching pit production for a facility that may never actually be built. In light of all this, Livermore's plan to double its inventory of plutonium is ill-advised. A case for plutonium experiments at the NIF has not been made, even to review groups that have the security clearance needed to assess it. And the laboratory is wasting its time researching pit production for a facility that may never actually be built. For a mixed-use scientific facility in a residential area, 700 kg of plutonium is enough, already +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From didi at tgi-sci.com Thu Dec 8 11:02:30 2005 From: didi at tgi-sci.com (=?ISO-8859-5?Q?Dimiter=20Popoff?=) Date: Thu, 08 Dec 2005 19:02:30 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Re: Editorial: No convincing evidence to increase Pu at LLNL Message-ID: <20051208170230.1079.qmail@server318.com> Frankly I do not see the difference it would make to the public if they store 700 rather than 1400 kg - or am I missing something? Yet another easy to use attention grabber, I suppose. Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ > -------Original Message------- > From: John Jacobus > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Editorial: No convincing evidence to increase Pu at LLNL > Sent: Dec 08 '05 17:59 > > >From Nature 438, 712 (8 December 2005) > > Enough, already > > Abstract:No convincing case has been made for > increasing the amount of plutonium held at a > Californian lab. > > The US Department of Energy is planning to double the > amount of plutonium that can be stored at the Lawrence > Livermore National Laboratory in California. Under new > rules announced last week, the nuclear-weapons lab can > keep up to 1,400 kilograms, or enough for around 300 > bombs. > > Not surprisingly, antinuclear activists are up in arms > about having so much bomb-grade metal in such a > heavily populated area. But researchers who want the > US nuclear-weapons laboratories to set a good example > for the rest of the world should be equally dismayed > at the plan. > > Since 1992, the United States has maintained a > moratorium on the testing and development of new > nuclear weapons. There's no real need for this > research lab, which accommodates an outstanding > civilian research programme next to its > weapons-related activity, to be playing with this > quantity of plutonium. > > Livermore is expected to use some of the expanded > inventory in nuclear-weapons research, including > experiments at the National Ignition Facility (NIF), a > massive laser facility that will recreate some of the > conditions inside nuclear weapons at detonation. The > facility's original function was to perform such > experiments on hydrogen isotopes, rather than > plutonium. Officials at the Department of Energy never > formally excluded the option of using plutonium in the > NIF, but a 1995 report prepared by scientists in the > department's non-proliferation office warned that its > use at the facility could be seen as provocative by > other nations. > > The other main reason why Livermore wants to hold more > plutonium, according to energy-department documents, > is that it will start to lay the groundwork for the > renewed mass production of plutonium pits, used in US > nuclear weapons. Livermore will be charged with > developing new technologies for manufacturing the > pits, for use at a proposed industrial-sized > production facility. But questions remain over whether > this facility is either necessary or appropriate, and > this year Congress declined to appropriate the money > needed to begin planning for its construction. > > Most of Livermore's new plutonium stocks would be > shipped there from the Los Alamos National Laboratory > in New Mexico, where the Department of Energy's track > record in handling plutonium does not inspire much > confidence. According to a report released on 29 > November by the Institute for Energy and Environmental > Research, a watchdog group based near Washington DC, > Los Alamos has managed to lose between 300 kg and 600 > kg of the material over the years. The group suggests > that much of it was dumped indiscriminately in the > desert during the early days of the nuclear age, or > was mislabelled when shipped off elsewhere for > long-term storage. > > And Livermore has had its own problems with plutonium. > In January, its plutonium facility, where scientists > work with the metal under heavily controlled > conditions, was shut down amid safety concerns. > Problems cited at the time included cracks in the > building's ventilation systems and poorly constructed > 'hot boxes' for handling the metal. The facility was > allowed to reopen at a reduced capacity last month. > > The laboratory is wasting its time researching pit > production for a facility that may never actually be > built. > In light of all this, Livermore's plan to double its > inventory of plutonium is ill-advised. A case for > plutonium experiments at the NIF has not been made, > even to review groups that have the security clearance > needed to assess it. And the laboratory is wasting its > time researching pit production for a facility that > may never actually be built. For a mixed-use > scientific facility in a residential area, 700 kg of > plutonium is enough, already > > +++++++++++++++++++ > "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." > "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer > > -- John > John Jacobus, MS > Certified Health Physicist > e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From don.mercado at lmco.com Thu Dec 8 11:40:03 2005 From: don.mercado at lmco.com (Mercado, Don) Date: Thu, 08 Dec 2005 09:40:03 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] High court backs 'sloshed' trucker Message-ID: <3D92CA467E530B4E8295214868F840FE81F637@emss01m12.us.lmco.com> Cindy Bloom wrote: "All that safety stuff" is to help us avoid situations where it is "all that hazardous." The problem comes when it *can't* be "all that hazardous." Safety stuff is supplied to comfort the employees and can't provide additional protection. The RF *can't* be hazardous, but the employees complain to the union and upper management if they don't get all these layers of safety for something that they -perceive- may harm them. I've explained until I'm blue in the face, brought in outside consultants, etc. that the stuff isn't harmful, but they still think its going to kill them. It was relatively easy to provide the safety stuff, temporarily assuage their fears, so it was done. I've resisted the additional layers of safety as unnecessary, expensive, and increases the chance of a human-in-the-loop failure of the system. That has happened and it decreases credibility of the system, which requires more fixes, more complexity and more chances of failure, and on and on. It is difficult to be a safety guy and say, "No, don't give it to them." I try, but it doesn't always work. Providing safety equipment when it isn't necessary is alarmist and overemphasizes the relative risk of the hazard. Its like putting up lead walls for a lab that only handles uCi quantities of Fe-55. Kind of like being an anti-nuke! "But it is also important to counsel those workers, who are extremely uncomfortable with the idea of a given risk, to consider looking/training for a type of employment that does not include the risk of concern. It's important to remind people that worrying about risk can be a health risk in itself, too." Who wants to represent management and tell a union worker that they can't have safety equipment, their phobias may be the source of their ills, and if that makes them uncomfortable to go find another job? ;^) Don From jjcohen at prodigy.net Thu Dec 8 12:17:43 2005 From: jjcohen at prodigy.net (jjcohen at prodigy.net) Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2005 10:17:43 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Re: Editorial: No convincing evidence to increase Pu atLLNL References: <20051208170230.1079.qmail@server318.com> Message-ID: <001301c5fc23$af6c6a60$25dce245@domainnotset.invalid> Dimiter, To a technologically ignorant public, any amount of plutonium is deadly. Twice as much is twice as dangerous. Unfortunately, LLNL officials cannot effectively defend their plutonium operations without the possibility of breaching security. Anyway, they probably do not want to, because the increased level of public concern allows them to obtain increased budgets ostensibly to control this "serious hazard". Jerry Cohen. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dimiter Popoff" To: Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 9:02 AM Subject: [ RadSafe ] Re: Editorial: No convincing evidence to increase Pu atLLNL > Frankly I do not see the difference it would make to the public > if they store 700 rather than 1400 kg - or am I missing something? > Yet another easy to use attention grabber, I suppose. > > Dimiter > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments > > http://www.tgi-sci.com > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > -------Original Message------- > > From: John Jacobus > > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Editorial: No convincing evidence to increase Pu at LLNL > > Sent: Dec 08 '05 17:59 > > > > >From Nature 438, 712 (8 December 2005) > > > > Enough, already > > > > Abstract:No convincing case has been made for > > increasing the amount of plutonium held at a > > Californian lab. > > > > The US Department of Energy is planning to double the > > amount of plutonium that can be stored at the Lawrence > > Livermore National Laboratory in California. Under new > > rules announced last week, the nuclear-weapons lab can > > keep up to 1,400 kilograms, or enough for around 300 > > bombs. > > > > Not surprisingly, antinuclear activists are up in arms > > about having so much bomb-grade metal in such a > > heavily populated area. But researchers who want the > > US nuclear-weapons laboratories to set a good example > > for the rest of the world should be equally dismayed > > at the plan. > > > > Since 1992, the United States has maintained a > > moratorium on the testing and development of new > > nuclear weapons. There's no real need for this > > research lab, which accommodates an outstanding > > civilian research programme next to its > > weapons-related activity, to be playing with this > > quantity of plutonium. > > > > Livermore is expected to use some of the expanded > > inventory in nuclear-weapons research, including > > experiments at the National Ignition Facility (NIF), a > > massive laser facility that will recreate some of the > > conditions inside nuclear weapons at detonation. The > > facility's original function was to perform such > > experiments on hydrogen isotopes, rather than > > plutonium. Officials at the Department of Energy never > > formally excluded the option of using plutonium in the > > NIF, but a 1995 report prepared by scientists in the > > department's non-proliferation office warned that its > > use at the facility could be seen as provocative by > > other nations. > > > > The other main reason why Livermore wants to hold more > > plutonium, according to energy-department documents, > > is that it will start to lay the groundwork for the > > renewed mass production of plutonium pits, used in US > > nuclear weapons. Livermore will be charged with > > developing new technologies for manufacturing the > > pits, for use at a proposed industrial-sized > > production facility. But questions remain over whether > > this facility is either necessary or appropriate, and > > this year Congress declined to appropriate the money > > needed to begin planning for its construction. > > > > Most of Livermore's new plutonium stocks would be > > shipped there from the Los Alamos National Laboratory > > in New Mexico, where the Department of Energy's track > > record in handling plutonium does not inspire much > > confidence. According to a report released on 29 > > November by the Institute for Energy and Environmental > > Research, a watchdog group based near Washington DC, > > Los Alamos has managed to lose between 300 kg and 600 > > kg of the material over the years. The group suggests > > that much of it was dumped indiscriminately in the > > desert during the early days of the nuclear age, or > > was mislabelled when shipped off elsewhere for > > long-term storage. > > > > And Livermore has had its own problems with plutonium. > > In January, its plutonium facility, where scientists > > work with the metal under heavily controlled > > conditions, was shut down amid safety concerns. > > Problems cited at the time included cracks in the > > building's ventilation systems and poorly constructed > > 'hot boxes' for handling the metal. The facility was > > allowed to reopen at a reduced capacity last month. > > > > The laboratory is wasting its time researching pit > > production for a facility that may never actually be > > built. > > In light of all this, Livermore's plan to double its > > inventory of plutonium is ill-advised. A case for > > plutonium experiments at the NIF has not been made, > > even to review groups that have the security clearance > > needed to assess it. And the laboratory is wasting its > > time researching pit production for a facility that > > may never actually be built. For a mixed-use > > scientific facility in a residential area, 700 kg of > > plutonium is enough, already > > > > +++++++++++++++++++ > > "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." > > "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer > > > > -- John > > John Jacobus, MS > > Certified Health Physicist > > e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > _______________________________________________ > > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From jimm at WPI.EDU Thu Dec 8 12:56:12 2005 From: jimm at WPI.EDU (Muckerheide, James) Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2005 13:56:12 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Nuclear "debate" at the Montreal Climate Conference Message-ID: <71A6142F930A1E4C9300D4088D9765C854D366@EXCHDB.admin.wpi.edu> Friends, This makes a strong report on the "debate" as articulated by Patrick Moore and his former associates, in a significant venue, along with the "related article." Regards, Jim Muckerheide =================== http://www.cnsnews.com/news/viewstory.asp?Page=%5CCulture%5Carchive%5C200512% 5CCUL20051208b.html Nuclear Energy Debate Turns Radioactive at Climate Conference By Marc Morano CNSNews.com Senior Staff Writer December 08, 2005 Montreal (CNSNews.com) - Nuclear energy would reduce the world's dependence on fossil fuels and help cut greenhouse gas emissions, said advocates at the United Nations Climate Change Conference in Montreal. "Expanding nuclear energy is one way that we can actually [reduce] reliance on fossil fuels in a big way," said Patrick Moore, a founding member of Greenpeace. Moore left the group in the 1980s after becoming disillusioned with what he considered the group's radical approach to environmental concerns. He currently heads the Canadian-based environmental advocacy group Greenspirit Strategies, and he blames liberal green groups for halting the expansion of nuclear energy. "It is the environmental movement itself that is the primary impediment to the reduction of CO2 emission and fossil fuel consumption because they refuse to support the obvious alternatives" (nuclear power and hydro power), Moore told Cybercast News Service. Moore's pro-nuclear discussion at the U.N. conference on Monday evening drew skepticism and jeers from his former environmental colleagues. Moore, who rejects alarmist predictions of human-caused "global warming," also praised the United States for refusing to ratify the Kyoto Protocol, calling the treaty "a colossal waste of time and money." (See related article ) But it was Moore's promotion of nuclear energy that met swift resistance by the movement he helped to found. "History has shown [nuclear energy] is a problematic technology," said Kaisa Kosonen, an energy campaigner for Greenpeace Nordic, told Cybercast News Service. Kosonen wants to see existing nuclear power phased out. She warned that creating more nuclear material creates attractive targets for terrorists. "I would not take that risk," she said. Friends of the Earth International (FOEI) shared Greenpeace's anti-nuclear position. "We don't support it. [Nuclear] represents a massive challenge, not only economically, but radioactive waste still represents a massive problem and quite frankly it's not particularly popular with the public," said Catherine Pearce, an international climate campaigner for FOEI. Both Greenpeace and FOEI want to encourage the world to turn to renewable energy sources such as solar and wind power. Fossil fuels currently make up about 85 percent of the world's energy consumption, followed by nuclear and hydro power at seven percent each. Only one percent of energy consumption comes from sources such as solar, wind and geothermal, according to Moore. "We don't see any scenario where windmills and solar panels alone can solve the problem [of fossil fuel dependence,]" Moore said. Moore praised nuclear energy for its reactor safety record and waste storage methods. He also dismissed concerns about two high-profile nuclear reactor accidents in the past. "[Pennsylvania's] Three Mile Island was a success story," he said. "Radiation did not escape from Three Mile Island [in 1979]," Moore said, because a containment structure prevented radioactive leakage. "[The Soviet Union's] Chernobyl [accident] was a sad accident waiting to happen because of the Soviet design and bad management," Moore said of the 1986 incident that killed 56 people. Moore also dismissed fears of a nuclear plant being the target of terrorism. "Sure there is a possibility of nuclear terrorism, but all technology can be used for harm," he said. "You don't ban technologies that are being used for good purposes just because they can also be used for evil," he added. Anti-nuclear movies such as the Jane Fonda's "The China Syndrome" in 1979 further raised public fears about nuclear energy, Moore said. "We have a population that is more afraid of nuclear when its record is far safer than many other technologies that we have," he said. "There is no basis for this fear. Nuclear is safe." More than 8,000 government leaders, environmentalists and scientists are attending the U.N. conference to discuss ways of further limiting greenhouse gases beyond the provision set out in the Kyoto Protocol. Organizers are calling the conference, which runs until Dec. 9, the largest meeting since the Kyoto Climate Change Conference in 1997. See Related Articles: Former Greenpeace Co-Founder Praises US for Rejecting Kyoto (Dec. 8, 2005) From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Thu Dec 8 14:36:47 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2005 12:36:47 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Article: Neutron science: Back on track? Message-ID: <20051208203647.649.qmail@web54307.mail.yahoo.com> >From Nature 438, 730-731 (8 December 2005) Neutron science: Back on track? Karen Fox (Karen Fox is a science writer based in Washington DC.) Top of pageAbstractNext June, a $1.4-billion neutron-scattering facility will come online in the United States. Karen Fox finds out whether this machine really can breathe fresh life into the ageing Tennessee lab that is its home. Oak Ridge National Laboratory is more than 60 years old and, until recently, it looked that way. Despite its track record in nuclear research, the host of wildlife that wanders on campus, and the pretty sunsets over the rolling hills of eastern Tennessee, it looked unlikely to entice the energetic people who are the lifeblood of any great laboratory. Salvation may be at hand. The Spallation Neutron Source (SNS), the largest scientific facility to be built in the United States for a decade, will become operational at Oak Ridge by next June. The $1.4-billion machine will generate neutron beams by firing high-energy protons at liquid mercury. Hundreds of visiting researchers are expected to descend on the laboratory and use these beams to probe the structures of molecules and crystals. "What this brings to the table is the opportunity to do an entirely new class of experiment," says Jack Rush, who retired earlier this year as director of neutron scattering at the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST) in Gaithersburg, Maryland. Researchers around the world will be keen to assess the popularity and capabilities of the new facility. Once there would have been no question about the usefulness of such a resource. But in the two decades since the US Department of Energy (DOE) first planned a neutron facility at Oak Ridge, the options available for mapping molecular and crystalline structures have widened. Facilities that use X-rays to probe these structures, such as the Advanced Photon Source at Argonne National Laboratory in Illinois, have become vastly more powerful. Meanwhile, the number of researchers who work with neutrons has declined as several ageing neutron-source facilities have closed. Despite this, Japan is building a research facility similar to the SNS at Tokai, which will be ready in 2007. European plans for an even more advanced spallation source hit political setbacks a couple of years ago; their proponents are keen to revive them as a way of preserving the continent's long-standing lead in neutron science. Building excitement At Oak Ridge, the new neutron source is generating a palpable buzz. The facility managers are aware that many potential users of the technique have learned to live without it. So to bring them to a site far from the universities where they work will require exceptional management and technical support. "You can have a philosophy of 'if you build it, they will come'," says Paul Butler, team leader for NIST's small-angle neutron-scattering instrument. "But in my experience that doesn't work. You have to do more." Butler is on the SNS users group committee, formed when construction began in 1999, to make sure the neutron source goes that extra mile to meet scientists' needs. Oak Ridge managers know they face a challenge. They anticipate that just a few hundred researchers will use the facility during its first two years of operation, while its neutron output slowly ramps up to its full potential. But they expect this to build up to 2,000 users a year by 2015, as researchers currently accustomed to using advanced X-ray sources begin to be converted to the subtler and sometimes complementary charms of neutrons. Supporters of the neutron source say that it does things that other mapping tools can't do. X-rays bounce off electrons, and so scatter much more spectacularly from heavier elements that have many electrons than from lighter ones, such as hydrogen, which has only one. It has been estimated that, as a result, the placement of about half of the hydrogen atoms in published protein structures derived from X-ray studies are not known. Neutrons interact directly with nuclei, making lighter atoms easy to identify. Structured approach Dean Myles, head of structural biology at Oak Ridge, points out that another advantage of dealing with nuclei, rather than electrons, is the ability to distinguish between different isotopes of the same element. This means that researchers can, for example, use deuterium ? a heavy isotope of hydrogen ? as a marker for the position of a particular atom in a molecule or structure. "I liken it to a black cat in a snow field," says Myles. Because neutron sources can map structures over time, a molecule labelled with deuterium could, for instance, be watched as it wanders across the surface of a sample that mimics a cell membrane. Oak Ridge is keen to teach its users the chemical tricks necessary for such work, and the lab is also growing bacteria in deuterium-rich media so that they produce deuterated proteins. Neutrons can also probe magnetic moments in solids and phenomena such as high-temperature superconductivity. Theories explaining superconductivity can be tested by mapping the position and movement of oscillations of the magnetic moment at a range of different atomic energy levels, Rush says. And the SNS should be able to collect these data some ten times more quickly than existing neutron facilities, owing to its high neutron flux. This high flux level ? up to 1017 neutrons per square centimetre per second ? will also allow users of the facility to extract useful information from smaller samples. This, says Rush, is a valuable capacity for people studying things in short supply, such as proteins or newly developed polymers. The facility also incorporates specialized equipment to cater for different research needs. One instrument will place samples under extremely high pressure, helping planetary scientists who want to model the hydrogen-rich interior of Jupiter. Until now, it has been a struggle to reach pressures above 25 kilobars simply because of a lack of beam intensity at neutron sources, says Richard Nelmes, who specializes in high-pressure neutron science at ISIS, the British neutron facility near Oxford, which is currently the most powerful spallation source in the world. For Oak Ridge ? the largest of the DOE's civilian laboratories ? the new facility provides a badly needed opportunity to regain scientific momentum. "It's a little bit of an engine you get rolling," says Jeff Wadsworth, Oak Ridge's director. "It generates an optimism that feeds on itself." Face lift Oak Ridge was built in 1943 to produce uranium and plutonium for the Manhattan Project, and a major new facility hasn't been added since the high-flux isotope reactor was built in 1966. "There was first-class research and great people, but it looked like a decrepit 1950s lab," says Thomas Mason, who joined the SNS project at Oak Ridge in 1998, becoming the lab's associate director three years later. "People weren't working with state-of-the-art facilities." Next year's opening is the culmination of a prolonged struggle to rectify that. Back in 1984, a National Academy of Sciences panel recommended the distribution of various scientific facilities to different DOE labs, with the largest one ? a proposed advanced neutron-source reactor ? allocated to Oak Ridge. But in 1995 Congress halted the $2.9-billion project just before construction began. The DOE decided to build a less expensive, accelerator-based neutron source instead: the SNS. Developed as a joint project between a number of the department's laboratories, including Los Alamos in New Mexico and Brookhaven in New York state, it was decided to locate the facility at Oak Ridge, in the home state of then-vice-president Al Gore. After construction began, Oak Ridge's management contract was taken over by the University of Tennessee and Battelle, a contract research organization based in Ohio. The new management team has been working hard to secure extra investment for the lab: for instance, it has borrowed $115 million from private banks to build associated infrastructure, including a new centre for computational sciences. On the back of that, Oak Ridge has won leadership of a large DOE supercomputing initiative. "There is a substantial amount of risk that goes along with the debt," says Wadsworth. "But we believed it would help to attract more contracts and to grow our business, and so far we've been successful." Ultimately, Oak Ridge will measure its success by its ability to attract world-quality researchers ? both as visitors and as staff. "You put enough bright people together and interesting things happen," says Butler. "There are all these buildings going up on the hill, and then you put in these people and resources, and add 1,500 users with all their new ideas." In these gentle southern hills, he predicts, "it's going to be a melting pot of ideas, bubbling away". +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From jimm at WPI.EDU Thu Dec 8 15:48:35 2005 From: jimm at WPI.EDU (Muckerheide, James) Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2005 16:48:35 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] (no subject) Message-ID: <71A6142F930A1E4C9300D4088D9765C854D3D2@EXCHDB.admin.wpi.edu> Friends, FYI. This was distributed on another mailing list by Paul Primavera. Thanks, Paul! Note the references to the work of Zbigniew Jaworowski, Sohei Kondo, and Bernie Cohen! Regards, Jim Muckerheide =================== http://www.techcentralstation.com/092805C.html Deadly Assumptions: Radiation and Risk By Theo Richel Published 09/28/2005 A new report tells us that the number of future cancer deaths as a consequence of the disaster in Chernobyl has been adjusted downward from tens or even hundreds of thousands to 4,000. But even this estimate may be way too high. It is quite likely that Russian health statisticians will one day have to register a cancer deficit among the people who were irradiated in 1986 -- that many people in the area do not have cancer as a result of their extra doses of radiation. This is the view of Prof. Dr. Zbigniew Jaworowski, from Poland, a longtime member of the United Nations Scientific Commission on the Effects of Atomic Radiation (Unscear) and author of hundreds of studies in the peer reviewed radiological literature. In 1986 he was responsible for the distribution of supplemental Iodine to 18 million Poles (to protect their thyroid glands), but afterwards he considered those and other measures a complete waste of time and money. Only about 140 people around the reactor received very high doses (28 of them died as a result), the rest of the population received an extra dose that was lower than normal background radiation (some were evacuated, to a place where natural background radiation was substantially higher). The 4,000 future cancer cases, Jaworowski tells me over the phone, "are just a theoretical construction. We will never see them." One reason for this is that epidemiologists lack the instruments to identify these people in the group of 600,000 that received extra radiation. But more important is that these cancer deaths will never occur. Or better: no doubt some of these people will develop cancer but it will have nothing to do with the radiation they received from the exploding power plant. The massive (some might say hysterical) reaction to the explosion in Chernobyl has its roots in the year 1958, when radiation scientists concluded that any amount of radiation could be dangerous and thus should be avoided. They had their data from the consequences of the nuclear bombs that fell on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. They had calculated the doses that the people in different circles around Ground Zero had received and correlated those with statistics of disease and death. A straight line emerged, which seemed to confirm a dose effect relationship: the more radiation one receives the higher the chance of death. Not completely, however. Some people had received an amount of radiation that was about 50-100 times the normal, natural, background radiation that the rest of the Japanese receive (about 2.5 milliSieverts/year). In this group of so called Habakushas (bomb survivors) they could not find enough cancer deaths to create a decent statistic that showed radiation is carcinogenic even at these low doses. So the straight line of dose and effect suddenly stopped. The graphic should have read: No more data available but instead the scientists simply assumed that the dose-effect relationship would continue: any amount of radiation is dangerous. There is no level below which radiation is safe (a threshold) it was claimed, and they called it the LNT-hypothesis for "Linear No-Threshold." So soon after the devastating explosions of the two bombs this reasoning may be understandable, but even at the time several scientists protested it. A scientist bases work on data, not on assumptions, they said, but they were ignored. The LNT-hypothesis still has no scientific basis, but it is nevertheless the rule and the major cause of the disaster that Chernobyl ultimately became. In the past half century it became clear that there are many places on earth where background radiation is 50, 100 or more times higher than the sea level average of 2.5 milliSievert. Parts of Iran and India and China, the beaches of Brazil, parts of Central Europe, the southwest of France, Norway. In all these places epidemiological studies were started and they produced a remarkably consistent picture: the people there have either the same or a slightly lower chance of cancer compared to their less-irradiated countrymen. They live just as long or a little bit longer. Studies among radiologists and workers in nuclear factories gave similar results: a little extra radiation is either harmless or beneficial. And the same goes for studies of accidental exposure: high levels are dangerous, lower levers are harmless or are even beneficial. Researcher Sohei Kondo found in Hiroshima and Nagasaki that some people have a higher life expectancy after the bomb and a lower chance of cancer. And in Chernobyl it is shown again: the thousands of liquidators -- the firemen and emergency workers -- have the same chance of cancer as the average Russian population (somewhat lower, though not significant). This is why Jaworowski is convinced that the 4,000 radiation-induced cancer victims will never materialize in Chernobyl. The authors of the report of the Chernobyl Forum make much of the sociological and psychological problems of the 350,000 people evacuated from the area. The evacuation has disrupted their lives, they have no knowledge of radiation, are fatalistic, have adopted "poverty lifestyles" (e.g. alcoholism). These problems are probably very real but the focus should not be so much on Russians who have no clue about radiation, but on the scientists who started the scare in the first place: those who are responsible for the continuation of the LNT-hypothesis. If you are told that "any amount" of radiation is dangerous, then it is not illogical to be scared when you are in the vicinity of "any amount" of radiation. The whole, enormous rescue operation, the evacuations, everything that happened in the past 20 years was inspired by the LNT-hypothesis, by an assumption that low levels of radiation are dangerous. Many billions were spent. Belarus and the Ukraine together claim that they have lost a total of $400 billion. These countries may not be known for accuracy, but these numbers give an indication of the enormous sums involved (the international community also contributed considerably). It is clear now that many of these billions were wasted; no extra lives were saved with them. Research has shown that the average amount of money a hospital in the US spends to save a life is $44,000. That implies that if you waste a billion dollars you do not have enough money to keep more than 20,000 people alive. These are the real ethics of radiation protection (or protection against any other risk). If you spend your money on small risks you have nothing left for the big risks. And that is exactly what radiation scientists have forced us to do. The rescue operations in Chernobyl saved lives at a price of $2.5 billion each, according to Jaworowski. The scientists who support the LNT-hypothesis are confronted with the darker side of their views, since the next Chernobyl-like disaster is waiting to happen. Not an explosion of a nuclear power plant, but another wave of useless measures to protect us against the dangers of radiation. Several governments in Europe are now preparing measures to ventilate houses where the concentrations of the natural radioactive gas radon are too high. The dangers are exaggerated. An Austrian scientist found that the LNT-based prognosis of radon deaths in his country exceeds the real numbers of total mortality from all causes. Other researchers have shown that many so-called radon deaths are in fact tobacco-deaths. American researcher Bernard Cohen has shown that a very low level of radon is correlated with a higher chance of cancer. Meanwhile many thousands of people in Germany, Poland, the Czech Republic and Japan visit radon spas to breath radioactive air for their health (and these benefits are scientifically confirmed). It is already known that these measures to ventilate homes will divert money from more worthy causes and the number of lives saved will be negligible. From JGinniver at aol.com Thu Dec 8 16:49:33 2005 From: JGinniver at aol.com (JGinniver at aol.com) Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2005 17:49:33 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] other radionuclide impurities in Co-60 sources Message-ID: <46.76823f57.30ca127d@aol.com> Does anyone on the list have any information, or references to publications that can provide information on the manufacture of Cobalt-60 sources. In particular whether Cobalt enriched steel is used and if so what other radionuclides may be produced at the same time e.g. Fe-55 or Ni-63. Regards, Julian From maurysis at ev1.net Thu Dec 8 19:29:09 2005 From: maurysis at ev1.net (Maury Siskel) Date: Thu, 08 Dec 2005 19:29:09 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] One upon a time in a land far away .... Message-ID: <4398DDE5.4030701@ev1.net> 64 years 7 DEC From joseroze at netvision.net.il Fri Dec 9 02:29:26 2005 From: joseroze at netvision.net.il (Jose Julio Rozental) Date: Fri, 09 Dec 2005 11:29:26 +0300 Subject: [ RadSafe ] IAEA text References: <46.76823f57.30ca127d@aol.com> Message-ID: <00d501c5fc9a$acf30ce0$840118ac@userqzqxd9wnct> Colleagues two recent IAEA doc available to download "Management of Waste from the Use of Radioactive Materials in Medicine, Industry, Agriculture, Research and Education Safety Guide" April 2005. IAEA Safety Standards Series No. WS-G-2.7 http://www-pub.iaea.org/MTCD/publications/PDF/Pub1217_web.pdf "Overview of Training Methodology for Accident Management at Nuclear Power Plants." April 2005. IAEA TECDOC Series No. 1440. http://www-pub.iaea.org/MTCD/publications/PDF/TE_1440_web.pdf Jose Julio Rozental joseroze at netvision.net.il Israel From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Fri Dec 9 04:13:48 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Fri, 9 Dec 2005 10:13:48 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC staff appears to have the fixed the problem with their web site In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051209101348.66294.qmail@web26408.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear colleague, It appears NRC software specialists fixed the problem with their site. I had access today. The site is accessible from other servers in India also. The problem persisted for several weeks. You may try today and let me know. Regards K.S.Parthasarathy Rogers Brent wrote: Dear Colleagues For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website (www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be accessible again? Brent Rogers Manager Radiation Operations Unit NSW Environment Protection Authority Department of Environment and Conservation *+61 2 9995 5986 *+61 2 9995 6603 * PO Box A290 Sydney South 1232 This email is intended for the addressee(s) named and may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then delete it immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of the individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority states them to be the views of the Department of Environment and Conservation (NSW). _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. From EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV Fri Dec 9 07:06:25 2005 From: EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV (Baratta, Edmond J) Date: Fri, 9 Dec 2005 08:06:25 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] other radionuclide impurities in Co-60 sources Message-ID: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA5C@orsnewea002.fda.gov> Check with MDS Nordion of Canada. They make Co-60 sources for irradiation and other uses. Edmond J. Baratta Radioactivity/Radiation Safety Officer Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 Fax: 781-729-3593 edmond.baratta at fda.gov -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of JGinniver at aol.com Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 5:50 PM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] other radionuclide impurities in Co-60 sources Does anyone on the list have any information, or references to publications that can provide information on the manufacture of Cobalt-60 sources. In particular whether Cobalt enriched steel is used and if so what other radionuclides may be produced at the same time e.g. Fe-55 or Ni-63. Regards, Julian _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Fri Dec 9 07:42:49 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Fri, 9 Dec 2005 05:42:49 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Article; PET/CT shows potential for detecting unknown primary cancers Message-ID: <20051209134249.94062.qmail@web54304.mail.yahoo.com> >From a news service I belong to. Note that each subject already had a cancer or was treated for a secondary lesion. I heard that the typical PET/CT scan was about $3,000 The original is at http://www.auntminnie.com/index.asp?Sec=sup&Sub=mol&Pag=dis&ItemId=69097&wf=529 PET/CT shows potential for detecting unknown primary cancers 12/8/2005 By: Jonathan S. Batchelor Detecting the primary lesion in patients presenting with cancer and an unknown primary is one of the more demanding tasks in diagnostic medical imaging. It's imperative that the primary be identified so that the patient can receive therapy that is adequate for the malignancy. Generally, the most common unknown primary cancers are adenocarcinoma, squamous cell carcinoma, and poorly differentiated carcinoma. At the recent RSNA conference in Chicago, a pair of presentations put PET/CT to the task of detecting unknown primary cancers. Dr. Mehmet ?ks?z from the department of radiology at the Katharinen Hospital in Stuttgart, Germany, investigated the impact of coregistered F-18 FDG-PET/CT imaging on the identification and exact anatomic localization of primary tumors. "One of the major disadvantages in the past was the lack of exact anatomic localization of F-18 FDG-PET foci, leading to several false-positive findings," ?ks?z said. His research team evaluated 87 consecutive F-18 FDG-PET/CT exams of 43 patients with metastatic cervical adenopathy and 44 patients with extracervical metastases. The scans were conducted on a Discovery LS PET/CT system (GE Healthcare, Chalfont St. Giles, U.K.) one hour after intravenous injection of 360 MBq of F-18 FDG. According to ?ks?z, the group assessed whether a possible primary tumor could be identified by PET or only in the fused images of the PET/CT system. The team also sought to determine if the localization of lesions by CT contributed to therapeutic management. ?ks?z said that a possible primary tumor, determined by F-18 FDG foci, was detected in 35 cases, or 42% of the cohort. In 21 of these cases, nontumor-like lesions were found in the PET/CT images. However, in the remaining 14 cases tumor-like lesions were depicted and histologically identified as five ear, nose, and throat (ENT) tumors; two gastric wall tumors; two cases of thyroid cancer; and one case each of cancer of the esophagus, mandible, breast, ovary, and kidney. In the 14 patients with primary lesions, nine had disseminated FDG foci, observed ?ks?z. He added that in four of these nine patients, the PET/CT images showed potential local complications, which needed additional therapeutic measures. Overall, the researchers' use of PET/CT allowed them to definitely identify 16% (14 of 87 patients) of the primary lesions in cancer of unknown origin. ?ks?z attributed the success to capability of the PET/CT system to precisely localize pathological F-18 FDG uptake via its CT component. He said that this made the histological verification by biopsy easier for the clinicians, particularly in complex anatomic areas such as the ENT region. In the second RSNA presentation, Dr. Stefano Fanti, from the nuclear medicine department, PET unit, at the Policlinico S. Orsola-Malpighi in Bologna, Italy, presented the results of a study carried out to evaluate the role of FDG-PET/CT for detecting unknown primary cancer in patients with biopsy-proven secondary lesions. His group's study population consisted of 36 patients, 14 female and 22 male with a mean age of 64.5 years. All the patients had at least one biopsied secondary lesion, a negative physical examination, and negative or inconclusive conventional imaging tests performed on modalities such as CT, ultrasound, or MR. Fanti said that 15 of these patients had adenocarcinoma; seven patients had a nondefined epithelial carcinoma, six had squamous cell carcinoma, two were determined to have poorly differentiated carcinoma, and one patient each had transitional cell carcinoma, a germ cell tumor, a flat cell tumor, melanoma, a spinocellular carcinoma, and a spindle cell carcinoma. Each patient underwent a FDG-PET/CT scan on a Discovery LS PET/CT and their results were evaluated by the team, according to Fanti. The Italian team showed that in 44% of the patients, 17 cases, PET/CT detected the primary occult lesion. This was found in the lung of seven patients, the tongue of two patients, and one each in the testis, tonsil, ovary, biliary system, colon, hypopharynx, tongue, and pharynx of the remaining patients. In one case, noted Fanti, PET/CT detected an equivocal gastric hypermetabolic area consistent with primary lesion but, as gastroscopy was negative, this finding was not considered definitive. In 53% of the patients, 18 cases, PET/CT was not conclusive for detecting the primary occult lesion, he said. Fanti, like ?ks?z, attributed the team's success to detecting unknown primary lesions to the utilization of PET/CT. "This may be due to the correlation of metabolic data provided by the PET scan and the morphological data provided by CT attenuation correction, making it easier for the reader to study anatomically complicated areas such as the head, neck, pelvis, and abdomen," he said. By Jonathan S. Batchelor AuntMinnie.com staff writer December 8, 2005 +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From joseroze at netvision.net.il Fri Dec 9 09:02:07 2005 From: joseroze at netvision.net.il (Jose Julio Rozental) Date: Fri, 09 Dec 2005 18:02:07 +0300 Subject: [ RadSafe ] other radionuclide impurities in Co-60 sources References: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA5C@orsnewea002.fda.gov> Message-ID: <028c01c5fcd1$878d5c80$840118ac@userqzqxd9wnct> Look at COBALT-60 PRODUCTION IN CANDU POWER REACTORS http://www.nuclearfaq.ca/malkoskie_cobalt_paper.pdf If you understand spanish look at PRODUCCI?N Y SERVICIOS DE ASISTENCIA TECNOL?GICA http://www.cnea.gov.ar/cac/ci/02_8cap5.pdf Jose Julio Rozental joseroze at netvision.net.il Israel ----- Original Message ----- From: "Baratta, Edmond J" To: ; Sent: Friday, December 09, 2005 4:06 PM Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] other radionuclide impurities in Co-60 sources > Check with MDS Nordion of Canada. They make Co-60 sources for irradiation > and other uses. > > > Edmond J. Baratta > Radioactivity/Radiation Safety Officer > Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 > Fax: 781-729-3593 > edmond.baratta at fda.gov > > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf > Of JGinniver at aol.com > Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 5:50 PM > To: radsafe at radlab.nl > Subject: [ RadSafe ] other radionuclide impurities in Co-60 sources > > Does anyone on the list have any information, or references to publications > > that can provide information on the manufacture of Cobalt-60 sources. In > particular whether Cobalt enriched steel is used and if so what other > radionuclides may be produced at the same time e.g. Fe-55 or Ni-63. > > Regards, > Julian > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the > RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Fri Dec 9 09:07:57 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Fri, 9 Dec 2005 07:07:57 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Abstract: Age-at-exposure effects on risk estimates for non-cancer mortality in the Japanese atomic bomb survivors Message-ID: <20051209150757.58248.qmail@web54311.mail.yahoo.com> Age-at-exposure effects on risk estimates for non-cancer mortality in the Japanese atomic bomb survivors Wei Zhang, Colin R Muirhead and Nezahat Hunter 2005 J. Radiol. Prot. 25 393-404 Abstract: http://www.iop.org/EJ/abstract/-alert=1221/0952-4746/25/4/003 Full text PDF: http://www.iop.org/EJ/article/-alert=1221/0952-4746/25/4/003/jrp5_4_003.pdf Statistically significant increases in non-cancer disease mortality with radiation dose have been observed among survivors of the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. The increasing trends arise particularly for diseases of the circulatory, digestive, and respiratory systems. Rates for survivors exposed to a dose of 1 Sv are elevated by about 10%, a smaller relative increase than that for cancer. The aetiology of this increased risk is not yet understood. Neither animal nor human studies have found clear evidence for excess non-cancer mortality at the lower range of doses received by A-bomb survivors. In this paper, we examine the age and time patterns of excess risks in the A-bomb survivors. The results suggest that the excess relative risk of non-cancer disease mortality might be highest for exposure at ages 30-49 years, and that those exposed at ages 0-29 years might have a very low excess relative risk compared with those exposed at older ages. The differences in excess relative risk for different age-at-exposure groups imply that the dose response relationships for non-cancer disease mortality need to be modelled with adjustment for age-at-exposure. +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From jim.dukelow at pnl.gov Fri Dec 9 17:26:18 2005 From: jim.dukelow at pnl.gov (Dukelow, James S Jr) Date: Fri, 09 Dec 2005 15:26:18 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Abstract: Age-at-exposure effects on risk estimates fornon-cancer mortality in the Japanese atomic bomb survivors Message-ID: I thank John Jacobus for providing a link to this interesting paper. I have a few comments following a first pass through the Zhang et al. paper. This appears to be an example of the old adage that if you torture a data set long enough it will tell you what you want to hear. Perhaps national policy should be that we torture neither prisoners/detainees nor data sets. Table 1 of the paper gives numbers of subjects and numbers of non-cancer death for various dose ranges. I have added a calculation of the death rate per 1000 subjects for each dose range <0.005 Sv 37458 subjects 12660 deaths 337.98 deaths per 1000 0.005 to 0.1 Sv 31648 deaths 10650 deaths 336.51 deaths per 1000 0.1 to 0.2 Sv 5732 subjects 1975 deaths 344.56 deaths per 1000 0.2 to 0.5 Sv 6332 subjects 2226 deaths 351.55 deaths per 1000 0.5 to 1 Sv 3983 subjects 1292 deaths 324.38 deaths per 1000 1 to 2 Sv 927 subjects 274 deaths 295.58 deaths per 1000 2 to 4 Sv 228 subjects 56 deaths 245.61 deaths per 1000 Totals 86308 subjects 29133 deaths 337.55 deaths per 1000 A Chi-square test (df = 6) of the hypothesis that excess relative risk per Sv (ERR) = 0 for the overall data set is rejected the two-tailed 2% level, but the reason for rejection is that ERR = 0 over-predicts deaths in the 0.5 Sv to 4 Sv groups. Chi-square tests of hypotheses with ERR > 0 would be rejected at even higher levels (that is smaller values of the tail probabilities alpha). The hypothesis that ERR has a small negative value would be accepted, but I haven't had a chance yet to calculate the range of such ERR values. Looking at the rest of the paper, most values of ERR calculated for the dozens (hundreds?) of confidence intervals reports have confidence intervals that include negative values of ERR. A few of the calculated ERRs are positive with positive confidence intervals. Several ERRs are negative, but all have confidence intervals including ERR = 0. The authors appear to be using standard methods of epidemiology, which is another story. No corrections appear to have been made for multiple tests of hypothesis. The authors manage to extract a scary abstract from this trash. Best regards. Jim Dukelow Pacific Northwest National Laboratory Richland, WA jim.dukelow at pnl.gov These comments are mine and have not been reviewed and/or approved by my management or by the U.S. Department of Energy. -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of John Jacobus Sent: Friday, December 09, 2005 7:08 AM To: radsafe; know_nukes at yahoogroups.com Subject: [ RadSafe ] Abstract: Age-at-exposure effects on risk estimates fornon-cancer mortality in the Japanese atomic bomb survivors Age-at-exposure effects on risk estimates for non-cancer mortality in the Japanese atomic bomb survivors Wei Zhang, Colin R Muirhead and Nezahat Hunter 2005 J. Radiol. Prot. 25 393-404 Abstract: http://www.iop.org/EJ/abstract/-alert=1221/0952-4746/25/4/003 Full text PDF: http://www.iop.org/EJ/article/-alert=1221/0952-4746/25/4/003/jrp5_4_003. pdf Statistically significant increases in non-cancer disease mortality with radiation dose have been observed among survivors of the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. The increasing trends arise particularly for diseases of the circulatory, digestive, and respiratory systems. Rates for survivors exposed to a dose of 1 Sv are elevated by about 10%, a smaller relative increase than that for cancer. The aetiology of this increased risk is not yet understood. Neither animal nor human studies have found clear evidence for excess non-cancer mortality at the lower range of doses received by A-bomb survivors. In this paper, we examine the age and time patterns of excess risks in the A-bomb survivors. The results suggest that the excess relative risk of non-cancer disease mortality might be highest for exposure at ages 30-49 years, and that those exposed at ages 0-29 years might have a very low excess relative risk compared with those exposed at older ages. The differences in excess relative risk for different age-at-exposure groups imply that the dose response relationships for non-cancer disease mortality need to be modelled with adjustment for age-at-exposure. +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From JPreisig at aol.com Sat Dec 10 22:57:49 2005 From: JPreisig at aol.com (JPreisig at aol.com) Date: Sat, 10 Dec 2005 23:57:49 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Space Travel (Fission, Fusion, etc.) Message-ID: <1a2.416b3dd7.30cd0bcd@aol.com> Hmmmmmm, This is from: jpreisig at aol.com . Greetings Radsafers!!!! Hope all is well with you. A while back, someone was asking about travel to the Moon and/or Mars, and Cosmic Rays and all that. The Radsafe archives should have considerable e-mail discussion of these matters, especially concerning the use of fission/fusion propulsion. Consult the archives, if you wish. For fundamental discussions of Cosmic Rays, charged particles, neutral particles, please read: Patterson & Thomas "Accelerator Health Physics" and the Accelerator Health Physics course notes by Coissairt. Flights to Mars using chemical propulsion probably take too long for sane astronauts. Fission/Fusion propulsion flights would probably be quicker. Mr./Dr. Facius's recent comments about cosmic rays are probably in the recent radsafe archives. Clearly, if one uses fission/fusion propulsion, one might have to limit maximum spacecraft accelerations, to not injure astronauts. I don't know how reasonable it is to have an extra shielded area in a spacecraft, because I don't know how quickly astronauts could be warned about dangerous cosmic rays, solar flares and the like. Such cosmic ray phenomena might possibly be lethal. Space flight is still a dangerous business --- if one examines the early Mercury (NASA) capsules, one will probably appreciate the bravery of the Mercury astronauts. Clearly, charged particles will be shielded using high Z materials, and neutrons can be shielded using hydrogenous materials (polyethylene, water, etc.). As for somebody's son wanting to be a spacecraft pilot, Go For It. NASA's websites probably have information on Pilot and/or mission specialist requirements. If your kid has eyeglasses already, think about not applying. NASA pilots need considerable flight hour training and pilot (hour) experience. There is at least one fission propelled spacecraft (recent vintage--- Prometheus???). See the internet for more information. Best wishes for safe and happy holidays....INL (formerly INEL --- USA) appears to be getting the nod for US reactor development for future US reactors. Take care. Joseph R. (Joe) Preisig, Ph.D. From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Sun Dec 11 09:27:39 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Sun, 11 Dec 2005 07:27:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Abstract: Age-at-exposure effects on risk estimates fornon-cancer mortality in the Japanese atomic bomb survivors In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051211152739.68915.qmail@web54310.mail.yahoo.com> Jim, Glad you appreciated seeing this paper, and thank you for the comments. I am not an epidemologist, and appreciate any comments as that other-than-cancer risks have appeared and will continue to appear in the literature. I would appreciate any comments on the validity of the results for comparison. --- "Dukelow, James S Jr" wrote: > > I thank John Jacobus for providing a link to this > interesting paper. > > I have a few comments following a first pass through > the Zhang et al. > paper. > > This appears to be an example of the old adage that > if you torture a > data set long enough it will tell you what you want > to hear. Perhaps > national policy should be that we torture neither > prisoners/detainees > nor data sets. > > Table 1 of the paper gives numbers of subjects and > numbers of non-cancer > death for various dose ranges. I have added a > calculation of the death > rate per 1000 subjects for each dose range > > <0.005 Sv 37458 subjects 12660 deaths 337.98 > deaths per 1000 > 0.005 to 0.1 Sv 31648 deaths 10650 deaths > 336.51 deaths per 1000 > 0.1 to 0.2 Sv 5732 subjects 1975 deaths 344.56 > deaths per 1000 > 0.2 to 0.5 Sv 6332 subjects 2226 deaths 351.55 > deaths per 1000 > 0.5 to 1 Sv 3983 subjects 1292 deaths 324.38 > deaths per 1000 > 1 to 2 Sv 927 subjects 274 deaths 295.58 > deaths per 1000 > 2 to 4 Sv 228 subjects 56 deaths 245.61 > deaths per 1000 > > Totals 86308 subjects 29133 deaths > 337.55 deaths per 1000 > > A Chi-square test (df = 6) of the hypothesis that > excess relative risk > per Sv (ERR) = 0 for the overall data set is > rejected the two-tailed 2% > level, but the reason for rejection is that ERR = 0 > over-predicts deaths > in the 0.5 Sv to 4 Sv groups. Chi-square tests of > hypotheses with ERR > > 0 would be rejected at even higher levels (that is > smaller values of the > tail probabilities alpha). The hypothesis that ERR > has a small negative > value would be accepted, but I haven't had a chance > yet to calculate the > range of such ERR values. > > Looking at the rest of the paper, most values of ERR > calculated for the > dozens (hundreds?) of confidence intervals reports > have confidence > intervals that include negative values of ERR. A > few of the calculated > ERRs are positive with positive confidence > intervals. Several ERRs are > negative, but all have confidence intervals > including ERR = 0. > > The authors appear to be using standard methods of > epidemiology, which > is another story. No corrections appear to have > been made for multiple > tests of hypothesis. > > The authors manage to extract a scary abstract from > this trash. > > Best regards. > > Jim Dukelow > Pacific Northwest National Laboratory > Richland, WA > jim.dukelow at pnl.gov > > These comments are mine and have not been reviewed > and/or approved by my > management or by the U.S. Department of Energy. > > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl > [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On > Behalf Of John Jacobus > Sent: Friday, December 09, 2005 7:08 AM > To: radsafe; know_nukes at yahoogroups.com > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Abstract: Age-at-exposure > effects on risk estimates > fornon-cancer mortality in the Japanese atomic bomb > survivors > > Age-at-exposure effects on risk estimates for > non-cancer mortality in > the Japanese atomic bomb survivors > Wei Zhang, Colin R Muirhead and Nezahat Hunter > 2005 J. Radiol. Prot. 25 393-404 > > Abstract: > http://www.iop.org/EJ/abstract/-alert=1221/0952-4746/25/4/003 > > Full text PDF: > http://www.iop.org/EJ/article/-alert=1221/0952-4746/25/4/003/jrp5_4_003. > pdf > . . . +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From BScott at lrri.org Sun Dec 11 15:42:13 2005 From: BScott at lrri.org (Scott, Bobby) Date: Sun, 11 Dec 2005 14:42:13 -0700 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Comments on thyroid cancer paper by E. Cardis et al. Message-ID: <5219BF1785792545A95B0401000AF6EF02C7B603@neuvo.lobos.lrri.org> Comments on Thyroid Cancer Paper by E. Cardis et al. Paper: E. Cardis et al., Risk of Cancer After Exposure to I-131 in Childhood Journal: Journal of the National Cancer Institute Vol. 97, No. 10 pages 724-732, May 18, 2005. The authors carried out a population-based, case-control study of thyroid cancer in Belarus and the Russian Federation to evaluate the risk of thyroid cancer after exposure to radioactive iodine (mainly I-131) from the 1986 Chernobyl accident and to investigate environmental and host factors that may modify the risk. The study involved 276 case patients with thyroid cancer through 1998 and 1300 matched control subjects, all younger than 15 years at the time of the Chernobyl accident. Linear and linear-quadratic excess relative risk models were fit to the data using conditional logistic regression. A strong dose-response relationship was found between the calculated absorbed radiation dose to the thyroid received in childhood and thyroid cancer (P<0.001). A linear dose-response relationship was stated to have been observed up to 1.5 - 2 Gy. This e-mail questions the claim of a linear dose-response relationship in light of the large errors associated with the derived odd ratios (OR) and also questions the methods used for employing nonlinear dose-response models. The data reported in Figure 1 of the paper that were used to obtain odds ratio (an estimate of relative risk) are provided below: Dose interval (mGy), cases in the interval, controls in the interval: Interval 0-15 mGy, cases=16, controls=138; Interval 16-199 mGy, cases=76, controls=503; Interval 200-399 mGy, cases=40, controls=200; Interval 400-599 mGy, cases=31, controls=141; Interval 600-799 mGy, cases=29; controls=92; Interval 800-999 mGy, cases=26, controls=67; Interval 1000-1249 mGy, case=14, controls=60; Interval 1250-1499 mGy, cases=10, controls=22; Interval 1500-1999 mGy, cases=10, controls=23; Interval 2000-2999 mGy, cases=15, controls=25; Interval 3000 mGy and larger, cases=9, controls=29; OR was apparently evaluated relative to the interval 0-15 mGy. The crude OR I get for the interval 16-199 mGy is: 1.303 (0.736, 2.307). The two values within the parenthesis defines the 95% confidence interval. Note that the result is not significant > 0 and based on the lower confidence value is consistent with the possibility of either a threshold or a hormetic response. Neither a threshold or hormetic model were considered by the researchers. The indicated results related to the threshold and hormetic models are especially important in that there was no actual unexposed group. Not having an unexposed group and using a case-control study design can greatly favor LNT over threshold and hormetic models. Also, given that reconstructed doses (dose estimates) are likely at best crude approximations, doses for some persons stated to be in the dose interval 0-15 mGy could be much higher. The OR results I got appear to differ from those reported by Cardis et al. However, how they got their OR values was not explained in their paper. Possibly some unreported adjustments were made. The excess relative risk (RR) model used by Cardis et al. for OR (an estimate of RR) had the structure: OR = 1 + beta*D + gamma*D*D, where D is the individual absorbed dose (usual definition in risk assessment). Beta and gamma are fixed model parameters. In the regression analysis, the above equation was apparently regressed against average dose for each dose group. A fixed observed OR was assigned to each dose interval. Please note that this implies that OR averaged over each dose interval was assumed. For the linear model (gamma=0), there is no problem because average OR (here indicated as Av{OR}) equals 1 + beta*Av{D}, where Av{} again indicates average. However, for gamma not equal to zero, Av{OR} is not only a function of Av{D}, but also a function of Av{D*D}. Av{OR} is not a function of Av{D}*Av{D} as was apparently used by Cardis et al. (systematic error in model application?). Thus, conclusions obtained by the authors related to application of the linear-quadratic function may not be valid. For some analyses, instead of use of the excess RR model the authors used and exponential form of OR, where OR = exp(beta*D + gamma*D*D + ...). However, they apparently did not realize that in using this exponential model that Av{OR} does not equal exp(beta*Av{D} + gamma*Av{D}*Av{D} + ...), but has a more complicated structure that should have been used. Thus, results reported by the authors based on this modeling may not be valid. Radsafe Digest readers, comments on the above would be welcomed. Sincerely, Bobby R. Scott, Ph.D. Senior Scientist Lovelace Respiratory Research Institute 2425 Ridgecrest Drive SE Albuquerque, NM 87108 USA From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Sun Dec 11 16:23:30 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Sun, 11 Dec 2005 14:23:30 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Comments on thyroid cancer paper by E. Cardis et al. In-Reply-To: <5219BF1785792545A95B0401000AF6EF02C7B603@neuvo.lobos.lrri.org> Message-ID: <20051211222330.29467.qmail@web54312.mail.yahoo.com> Dr. Scott, Have you sent a letter to the Journal of the National Cancer Institute? It would seem to me that any challenges or questions you have in the data should be made to the editors and those involved with the review of this article. They should respond to your concerns. If the principal authors do not know about your questions, how can they respond? --- "Scott, Bobby" wrote: > Comments on Thyroid Cancer Paper by E. Cardis et al. > > > > > Paper: E. Cardis et al., Risk of Cancer After > Exposure to I-131 in > Childhood > > Journal: Journal of the National Cancer Institute > Vol. 97, No. 10 pages > 724-732, May 18, 2005. > > > > The authors carried out a population-based, > case-control study of > thyroid cancer in Belarus and the Russian Federation > to evaluate the > risk of thyroid cancer after exposure to radioactive > iodine (mainly > I-131) from the 1986 Chernobyl accident and to > investigate environmental > and host factors that may modify the risk. The > study involved 276 case > patients with thyroid cancer through 1998 and 1300 > matched control > subjects, all younger than 15 years at the time of > the Chernobyl > accident. Linear and linear-quadratic excess > relative risk models were > fit to the data using conditional logistic > regression. A strong > dose-response relationship was found between the > calculated absorbed > radiation dose to the thyroid received in childhood > and thyroid cancer > (P<0.001). A linear dose-response relationship was > stated to have been > observed up to 1.5 - 2 Gy. > > . . . > > Radsafe Digest readers, comments on the above would > be welcomed. > > > > Sincerely, > > Bobby R. Scott, Ph.D. > > Senior Scientist > > Lovelace Respiratory Research Institute > > 2425 Ridgecrest Drive SE > > Albuquerque, NM 87108 USA > > > > > > === message truncated === +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Sun Dec 11 20:08:22 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2005 02:08:22 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Comments on scientific papers must also be subjected to peer review In-Reply-To: <20051211222330.29467.qmail@web54312.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20051212020822.57519.qmail@web26414.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Friends, I agree with John. Very few of us have the expertise in epidemiology to evaluate the comments. Even if we are experts, it is appropriate that the comments or any analysis should appear in open literature; ideally in the same journal. That way the authors of the original paper will get a chance to respond, even to re-analyse their data. This is not to dismiss the validity of the comments or analysis in the present instance. Regards, K.S.Parthasarathy Raja Ramanna fellow Department of Atomic Energy India John Jacobus wrote: Dr. Scott, Have you sent a letter to the Journal of the National Cancer Institute? It would seem to me that any challenges or questions you have in the data should be made to the editors and those involved with the review of this article. They should respond to your concerns. If the principal authors do not know about your questions, how can they respond? --- "Scott, Bobby" wrote: > Comments on Thyroid Cancer Paper by E. Cardis et al. > > > > > Paper: E. Cardis et al., Risk of Cancer After > Exposure to I-131 in > Childhood > > Journal: Journal of the National Cancer Institute > Vol. 97, No. 10 pages > 724-732, May 18, 2005. > > > > The authors carried out a population-based, > case-control study of > thyroid cancer in Belarus and the Russian Federation > to evaluate the > risk of thyroid cancer after exposure to radioactive > iodine (mainly > I-131) from the 1986 Chernobyl accident and to > investigate environmental > and host factors that may modify the risk. The > study involved 276 case > patients with thyroid cancer through 1998 and 1300 > matched control > subjects, all younger than 15 years at the time of > the Chernobyl > accident. Linear and linear-quadratic excess > relative risk models were > fit to the data using conditional logistic > regression. A strong > dose-response relationship was found between the > calculated absorbed > radiation dose to the thyroid received in childhood > and thyroid cancer > (P<0.001). A linear dose-response relationship was > stated to have been > observed up to 1.5 - 2 Gy. > > . . . > > Radsafe Digest readers, comments on the above would > be welcomed. > > > > Sincerely, > > Bobby R. Scott, Ph.D. > > Senior Scientist > > Lovelace Respiratory Research Institute > > 2425 Ridgecrest Drive SE > > Albuquerque, NM 87108 USA > > > > > > === message truncated === +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- Yahoo! Messenger NEW - crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail From maurysis at ev1.net Mon Dec 12 02:50:12 2005 From: maurysis at ev1.net (Maury Siskel) Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2005 02:50:12 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Googling World Energy Reserves Message-ID: <439D39C4.7050000@ev1.net> http://www.lewrockwell.com/walker/walker16.html Links to an interesting perspective of energy and especially nuclear power. Wish I could correctly evaluate the validity or correctness of the Walker's cited data, but that is beyond my knowledge. I am convinced that energy prices include a very large fear/apprehension premium and that there is no shortage (neither present nor prospective) of energy raw materials (i.e., gas, coal, etc). I would like to read the opinions of others on this List who might be inclined to comment. Cheers, Maury&Dog maurysis at ev1.net From mark.hogue at srs.gov Mon Dec 12 08:30:23 2005 From: mark.hogue at srs.gov (mark.hogue at srs.gov) Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2005 09:30:23 -0500 Subject: Fw: [ RadSafe ] Comments on thyroid cancer paper by E. Cardis et al. Message-ID: Bobby, Thank you for the interesting post. It seems appropriate to me that you post this relevant question. I don't have an immediate response to your technical questions, but would like to offset the discouraging responses posted so far: 1. One post suggested you should write to the journal rather than Radsafe. Obviously, you know about journal correspondence and are just determining if there is a proper case. Some people on Radsafe feel they have to respond to every post though and will state the obvious if they know nothing else. 2. The other post stated that there is very little knowledge of epidemiology on Radsafe. I hope this is not true, but it is bizarre to discourage a technical post amid the irrelevant nuisance posts on the basis that this one is too hard to think about. Good luck in your endeavor. Mark G. Hogue, CHP mark.hogue at srs.gov "But we surely overrate the usefulness of what we like to call "stimulation" and underrate the need for time, peace of mind, mature reflection." - Susan Haack "DISCLAIMER: The opinions expressed are mine and do not necessarily represent Westinghouse Savannah River Co. or the United States Department of Energy." "Scott, Bobby" Sent by: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl 12/11/2005 04:42 PM To cc Subject [ RadSafe ] Comments on thyroid cancer paper by E. Cardis et al. Comments on Thyroid Cancer Paper by E. Cardis et al. Paper: E. Cardis et al., Risk of Cancer After Exposure to I-131 in Childhood Journal: Journal of the National Cancer Institute Vol. 97, No. 10 pages 724-732, May 18, 2005. The authors carried out a population-based, case-control study of thyroid cancer in Belarus and the Russian Federation to evaluate the risk of thyroid cancer after exposure to radioactive iodine (mainly I-131) from the 1986 Chernobyl accident and to investigate environmental and host factors that may modify the risk. The study involved 276 case patients with thyroid cancer through 1998 and 1300 matched control subjects, all younger than 15 years at the time of the Chernobyl accident. Linear and linear-quadratic excess relative risk models were fit to the data using conditional logistic regression. A strong dose-response relationship was found between the calculated absorbed radiation dose to the thyroid received in childhood and thyroid cancer (P<0.001). A linear dose-response relationship was stated to have been observed up to 1.5 - 2 Gy. This e-mail questions the claim of a linear dose-response relationship in light of the large errors associated with the derived odd ratios (OR) and also questions the methods used for employing nonlinear dose-response models. The data reported in Figure 1 of the paper that were used to obtain odds ratio (an estimate of relative risk) are provided below: Dose interval (mGy), cases in the interval, controls in the interval: Interval 0-15 mGy, cases=16, controls=138; Interval 16-199 mGy, cases=76, controls=503; Interval 200-399 mGy, cases=40, controls=200; Interval 400-599 mGy, cases=31, controls=141; Interval 600-799 mGy, cases=29; controls=92; Interval 800-999 mGy, cases=26, controls=67; Interval 1000-1249 mGy, case=14, controls=60; Interval 1250-1499 mGy, cases=10, controls=22; Interval 1500-1999 mGy, cases=10, controls=23; Interval 2000-2999 mGy, cases=15, controls=25; Interval 3000 mGy and larger, cases=9, controls=29; OR was apparently evaluated relative to the interval 0-15 mGy. The crude OR I get for the interval 16-199 mGy is: 1.303 (0.736, 2.307). The two values within the parenthesis defines the 95% confidence interval. Note that the result is not significant > 0 and based on the lower confidence value is consistent with the possibility of either a threshold or a hormetic response. Neither a threshold or hormetic model were considered by the researchers. The indicated results related to the threshold and hormetic models are especially important in that there was no actual unexposed group. Not having an unexposed group and using a case-control study design can greatly favor LNT over threshold and hormetic models. Also, given that reconstructed doses (dose estimates) are likely at best crude approximations, doses for some persons stated to be in the dose interval 0-15 mGy could be much higher. The OR results I got appear to differ from those reported by Cardis et al. However, how they got their OR values was not explained in their paper. Possibly some unreported adjustments were made. The excess relative risk (RR) model used by Cardis et al. for OR (an estimate of RR) had the structure: OR = 1 + beta*D + gamma*D*D, where D is the individual absorbed dose (usual definition in risk assessment). Beta and gamma are fixed model parameters. In the regression analysis, the above equation was apparently regressed against average dose for each dose group. A fixed observed OR was assigned to each dose interval. Please note that this implies that OR averaged over each dose interval was assumed. For the linear model (gamma=0), there is no problem because average OR (here indicated as Av{OR}) equals 1 + beta*Av{D}, where Av{} again indicates average. However, for gamma not equal to zero, Av{OR} is not only a function of Av{D}, but also a function of Av{D*D}. Av{OR} is not a function of Av{D}*Av{D} as was apparently used by Cardis et al. (systematic error in model application?). Thus, conclusions obtained by the authors related to application of the linear-quadratic function may not be valid. For some analyses, instead of use of the excess RR model the authors used and exponential form of OR, where OR = exp(beta*D + gamma*D*D + ...). However, they apparently did not realize that in using this exponential model that Av{OR} does not equal exp(beta*Av{D} + gamma*Av{D}*Av{D} + ...), but has a more complicated structure that should have been used. Thus, results reported by the authors based on this modeling may not be valid. Radsafe Digest readers, comments on the above would be welcomed. Sincerely, Bobby R. Scott, Ph.D. Senior Scientist Lovelace Respiratory Research Institute 2425 Ridgecrest Drive SE Albuquerque, NM 87108 USA _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From Peter.Sandgren at po.state.ct.us Mon Dec 12 08:34:54 2005 From: Peter.Sandgren at po.state.ct.us (Sandgren, Peter) Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2005 09:34:54 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Sternglass and a goat Message-ID: WTNH.com - Anti-Millstone activists bring iconic goat to town (Sternglass to appear at press conference) http://www.wtnh.com/Global/story.asp?S=4231555 Peter Sandgren Connecticut Department of Emergency Management & Homeland Security Radiological Emergency Preparedness (REP) GIS Operations phone (860) 566-4586 fax (860) 566-6017 "Most people are about as happy as they make up their minds to be." -- Abraham Lincoln From BScott at lrri.org Mon Dec 12 15:00:00 2005 From: BScott at lrri.org (Scott, Bobby) Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2005 14:00:00 -0700 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Comments on scientific papers must also be subjected to peer review Message-ID: <5219BF1785792545A95B0401000AF6EF02C7B60D@neuvo.lobos.lrri.org> Colleagues: I plan to submit a letter to the editor of the JNCI related to the paper by E. Cardis et al. on thyroid cancer after the Chernobyl accident. For readers of the Radsafe Digest that may have an interest, I have a pdf version of my seminar given on November 10, 2005 at Los Alamos National Laboratory entitled "The LNT Hypothesis May Have Outlived Its Usefulness". The seminar presents evidence that diagnostic X rays (e.g., CT scans, mammograms, chest X-rays), elevated natural background radiation, and radon in our homes may be protecting us from cancer and possibly also from other diseases via activating cooperative protective processes. The protection is attributed to the low-LET component of the dose in case of radon and background radiation. I would be happy to e-mail the pdf version of the seminar to interested persons. Sincerely, Bobby R. Scott ________________________________ From: parthasarathy k s [mailto:ksparth at yahoo.co.uk] Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 7:08 PM To: John Jacobus; Scott, Bobby; radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: Comments on scientific papers must also be subjected to peer review Friends, I agree with John. Very few of us have the expertise in epidemiology to evaluate the comments. Even if we are experts, it is appropriate that the comments or any analysis should appear in open literature; ideally in the same journal. That way the authors of the original paper will get a chance to respond, even to re-analyse their data. This is not to dismiss the validity of the comments or analysis in the present instance. Regards, K.S.Parthasarathy Raja Ramanna fellow Department of Atomic Energy India From didi at tgi-sci.com Mon Dec 12 15:26:20 2005 From: didi at tgi-sci.com (=?ISO-8859-5?Q?Dimiter=20Popoff?=) Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2005 23:26:20 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Googling World Energy Reserves Message-ID: <20051212212620.16998.qmail@server318.com> Maury, I am not going to comment on the link you posted, but here is the bit of information I have: about 10 years ago, I knew from insiders that the costs per kWh at Kozloduy NPP were something between 1.5 and 2.5 cents (I just do not remember precisely). Now they are cheerfully selling us their product at >10 cents/kWh; just try asking about the costs and you'll be drowned in as much pointless babble as it takes to bore you away (I am sure this is the standard procedure not only here). Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ > -------Original Message------- > From: Maury Siskel > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Googling World Energy Reserves > Sent: Dec 12 '05 10:50 > > http://www.lewrockwell.com/walker/walker16.html > > Links to an interesting perspective of energy and especially nuclear > power. Wish I could correctly evaluate the validity or correctness of > the Walker's cited data, but that is beyond my knowledge. I am > convinced that energy prices include a very large fear/apprehension > premium and that there is no shortage (neither present nor prospective) > of energy raw materials (i.e., gas, coal, etc). > > I would like to read the opinions of others on this List who might be > inclined to comment. > Cheers, > Maury&Dog maurysis at ev1.net > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From kaleissa at kacst.edu.sa Mon Dec 12 16:04:40 2005 From: kaleissa at kacst.edu.sa (Khalid Aleissa) Date: Tue, 13 Dec 2005 01:04:40 +0300 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Spirulina plantensis Message-ID: <00b501c5ff68$0d1ccc80$9501810a@KALEISSA> I really want to know any experience of any radsafer about Spirulina plantensis and its behavior with heavy elements and Uranium. Also, if there is any DNA aberration observation in correlation with the uptake. Regards. Khalid Aleissa From loc at icx.net Mon Dec 12 16:17:04 2005 From: loc at icx.net (Susan Gawarecki) Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2005 17:17:04 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Conspiracy theory could be on right wavelength Message-ID: <439DF6E0.3000506@icx.net> I've seen a lot of material posted on RadSafe that would qualify for Goldacre's "Bad Science" column. Enjoy! Susan Conspiracy theory could be on right wavelength http://www.guardian.co.uk/life/badscience/ Ben Goldacre Saturday December 10, 2005 The Guardian The reason that I am so fabulously wealthy (girls) is, of course, that I am paid by the government and the pharmaceutical industry to rubbish alternative therapies and MMR conspiracy theorists, and so maintain what you humanities graduates like to call "the hegemony". After last week's excellent "magnetic wine improver" debunking I seem to be deluged with Bad Science projects being lined up for publication in academic journals. King among them all is On the Effectiveness of Aluminium Foil Helmets: An Empirical Study by Ali Rahimi et al, of the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. You will all doubtless be familiar with the use of radio signals by the government to monitor your thoughts and control your behaviour. Aluminium helmets and hat-linings have been recommended in the conspiracy theory community for many years as a protective measure against this government interference. However, although theoretically plausible, until now the foil hat had, surprisingly, never been experimentally validated. Rahimi et al have healed this gap using a network analyser and a directional antenna to calculate the ability of each of three aluminum helmet designs to reduce the strength of the radio signals entering the brains of a sample group of four individuals. The receiver antenna was placed at various places on the cranium of each experimental subject: over the frontal, occipital and parietal lobes. Measurements were taken, once with the helmet off, and once with the helmet on. As per best practice, the foil helmets were constructed with the double layering technique described elsewhere in the literature. The network analyser then plotted the amount by which the signal was attenuated - or reduced - by the foil hats, across a wide range of frequencies. Their results are more startling than anyone could possibly have predicted. Although the helmets did reduce the strength of the signal by around 10dB across most of the spectrum, there was an unexpected second finding: the helmets did in fact amplify signals, in certain very specific frequency ranges, by a huge 30dB at 2.6GHz, and by 20dB around 1.5GHz. What are those frequencies used for? I'll tell you. The 1.5GHz range coincides almost perfectly with frequencies allocated to the US government, between 1.2 Ghz and 1.4 Ghz. "According to the FCC," explain the authors, "these bands are supposedly reserved for 'radio location' (ie, GPS), and other communications with satellites." And what about the other frequency that's amplified into your brain? "The 2.6 Ghz band coincides with mobile phone technology. Though not affiliated by government, these bands are at the hands of multinational corporations." To the authors of the paper, the meaning of all this is very clear. "Statistical evidence suggests the use of helmets may in fact enhance the government's invasive abilities," they conclude. "We speculate that the government may in fact have started the helmet craze for this reason." To me, it's a lot simpler than that. This paper is itself a transparent attempt by the government to prevent us from taking simple and effective protective measures. Keep wearing the helmets. Unless, of course, what the alternative therapy conspiracy theorists say about me is true. ? Full references available at www.badscience.net Please send your bad science to bad.science at guardian.co.uk From Rainer.Facius at dlr.de Mon Dec 12 18:11:23 2005 From: Rainer.Facius at dlr.de (Rainer.Facius at dlr.de) Date: Tue, 13 Dec 2005 01:11:23 +0100 Subject: [ RadSafe ] "much sought after" Brazilian 70 mSv/a HBRA Message-ID: <1B5EBED4E01074419C07EEF9D3802FDA159030@exbe02.intra.dlr.de> Ballot by feet? "Additionally, the highest annual dose rate, 70 mSv, was found at Areia Preta beach (Guarapari) and the hazard indices reach about 350 times the limit recommended by OECD (1979). Guarapari and some sites of the south Esp?rito Santo State show towns built on the monazite sand region along the Atlantic coast in Brazil, which is one of the most widely known high background radiation areas in the world. The Areia Preta beach in Guarapari, which means black sand in Portuguese, is so much sought after by Brazilian people for their alleged benefits to health that they come from long distances to spend their vacations on the black sands." p. 195 Veiga R, Sanches N, Anjos R M, Macario K, Bastos J, Iguatemy M, Aguiar J G, Santos A M A, Mosquera B, Carvalho C, Baptista Filho M, Umisedo N K, Measurement of natural radioactivity in Brazilian beach sands. Radiation Measurements 41#2(2006)189-196 Regards, Rainer From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Tue Dec 13 10:36:45 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Tue, 13 Dec 2005 08:36:45 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Comments on scientific papers must also be subjected to peer review In-Reply-To: <5219BF1785792545A95B0401000AF6EF02C7B60D@neuvo.lobos.lrri.org> Message-ID: <20051213163645.53530.qmail@web54304.mail.yahoo.com> Dr. Scott, I hope you will keep us appraised of all responses that agree with and opposed to your letter on this article. --- "Scott, Bobby" wrote: > Colleagues: > > > > I plan to submit a letter to the editor of the JNCI > related to the paper > by E. Cardis et al. on thyroid cancer after the > Chernobyl accident. > > > > For readers of the Radsafe Digest that may have an > interest, I have a > pdf version of my seminar given on November 10, 2005 > at Los Alamos > National Laboratory entitled "The LNT Hypothesis May > Have Outlived Its > Usefulness". The seminar presents evidence that > diagnostic X rays > (e.g., CT scans, mammograms, chest X-rays), elevated > natural background > radiation, and radon in our homes may be protecting > us from cancer and > possibly also from other diseases via activating > cooperative protective > processes. The protection is attributed to the > low-LET component of the > dose in case of radon and background radiation. I > would be happy to > e-mail the pdf version of the seminar to interested > persons. > > > > Sincerely, > > Bobby R. Scott > > > > ________________________________ > > From: parthasarathy k s [mailto:ksparth at yahoo.co.uk] > > Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 7:08 PM > To: John Jacobus; Scott, Bobby; radsafe at radlab.nl > Subject: Comments on scientific papers must also be > subjected to peer > review > > > > Friends, > > I agree with John. Very few of us have the expertise > in epidemiology to > evaluate the comments. Even if we are experts, it > is appropriate that > the comments or any analysis should appear in open > literature; ideally > in the same journal. That way the authors of the > original paper will get > a chance to respond, even to re-analyse their data. > This is not to > dismiss the validity of the comments or analysis in > the present > instance. > +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From RadSafeInst at cableone.net Tue Dec 13 20:36:10 2005 From: RadSafeInst at cableone.net (RadSafeInst) Date: Tue, 13 Dec 2005 20:36:10 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Hormesis Message-ID: <004901c60057$24dd3770$7cc85c45@yourfulkl1oh2q> Thank you, Jim Muckerheide, for your work in support of sanity and science! I read your web page and skimmed your books on hormetic data today, and was amazed at the effort that required. Keep up your fight against LNT. If you don't mind, tell the list where they can get some of your material.................. Ed Battle From Tom_Johnston at nymc.edu Wed Dec 14 09:05:21 2005 From: Tom_Johnston at nymc.edu (Johnston, Thomas) Date: Wed, 14 Dec 2005 10:05:21 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Monitoring cadavers at Medical Schools Message-ID: <70C50B8807B54A429AC206E83A3BA6BC0B84D96C@mail.nymc.edu> Question? What procedure, if any, is in place to monitor cadavers upon arrival at your Medical School, for radioactive material? Thomas P. Johnston Radiation Safety Officer New York Medical College Valhalla, NY 10595 914-594-4448 office 914-594-3665 fax 914-557-5950 mobile tom_johnston at nymc.edu From lboing at anl.gov Wed Dec 14 09:38:38 2005 From: lboing at anl.gov (Boing, Lawrence E.) Date: Wed, 14 Dec 2005 09:38:38 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] (no subject) Message-ID: <637FE1FE13221C4F8BFC590A42B8478921C9DA@NE-EXCH.ne.anl.gov> Looking for the names of larger radioanalytical labs for environmental samples in the Las Vegas area. L Boing Lawrence E. (Larry) Boing Argonne National Laboratory 9700 South Cass Avenue Argonne, IL 60439 P-630.252.6729 F-630.252.7577 lboing at anl.gov http://www.dd.anl.gov/ http://www.orau.gov/ddsc/ From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Wed Dec 14 09:54:50 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Wed, 14 Dec 2005 07:54:50 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Monitoring cadavers at Medical Schools In-Reply-To: <70C50B8807B54A429AC206E83A3BA6BC0B84D96C@mail.nymc.edu> Message-ID: <20051214155450.71139.qmail@web54304.mail.yahoo.com> Tom, First, check the chart. We had a cadaver that had I-125 prostate seed implants. (It was the first we have had with implants.) They started to remove the organs when they found "these little particles in the prostate." The corpse had the implants 2 years, as noted in the medical chart, before he died and was shipped to us. We supplied the morgue with a thin-window NaI probe and meter, but I would not swear they check each cadaver. --- "Johnston, Thomas" wrote: > Question? > > What procedure, if any, is in place to monitor > cadavers upon arrival at > your Medical School, for radioactive material? > > > > > > Thomas P. Johnston > > Radiation Safety Officer > > New York Medical College > > Valhalla, NY 10595 > > 914-594-4448 office > > 914-594-3665 fax > > 914-557-5950 mobile > > tom_johnston at nymc.edu > > +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From james at bovik.org Wed Dec 14 14:37:05 2005 From: james at bovik.org (James Salsman) Date: 14 Dec 2005 20:37:05 -0000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] where to refer birth defect victims? Message-ID: <20051214203705.11097.qmail@bovik.org> > From: im4gbayp at yahoo.com > Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 8:37 AM > >... Our son-in-law served in Desert Storm and was exposed to several > chemicals. On his return home we all were concerns about the > chemicals he was exposed to, exposed to several chemicals - I can't > recall all the types. > > Our 1st granddaughter, born 1992, was born with a very small hole in > her spine, showed no other effects of her dads exposer to chemicals. > Our 2st granddaughter, born 1993, was born with a very smal hole in > her spine, showed no other effects of her dads exposer to chemicals. > We were aware of Vet's children born with Spina Bifida, parent who > served in Desert Storm. > > My request to all Vets now is: > > Our 1st granddaughter, born 1992 - now 13, has been diagnosed with > Childhood soft tissue sarcoma, the very rare type. I've been search > the web for any and all information about this cancer. I came across > a small article related to Desert Storm Vets & chemical exposer and > their children developing cancers, there was a small piece that > mentioned soft tissue Sarcoma. Doctors, Cancer Research Hospitals etc > have been working hard on this cancer - very little information is > known about this rare cancer. > > "Please" does any Vet have ANY information on Vet's children and > cancers and can provide us links. > > We don't have much time, she is seriously ill, will be under going > Chemo and radiation very soon. > > Please sent links to my e-mail address: im4gbayp at yahoo.com. If you > are aware of other families please forward this request. > > Please keep Destiny in your prayers, we love her so very much. She is > a good child - loved by family, friends, neighbors, teachers, her > doctors. She helps other's always, mentor to LD children, never curl > to others. She does not speak about her illness, does not want to > worry others. > > Note: my husband - Destiny's papa, retired from the US Army, served > mostly out of Ft.Campbell 22 years, in 1990. > > Thank you for taking time to read this, Thank you for any information > that can be sent to us. > > Destiny's grandmother Perhaps Drs. Johnson and Parkhurst should be required to sort this all out? Or maybe, as Dr. Rabbe has suggested, the public should not have access to such information because we might misinterpret it. http://www.annalsofepidemiology.org/article/PIIS1047279701002459/abstract Sincerely, James Salsman From frantaj at aecl.ca Thu Dec 15 09:31:06 2005 From: frantaj at aecl.ca (Franta, Jaroslav) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 10:31:06 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] " Port Hope responds to LLRW survey " Message-ID: <0F8BD87EE693D411A1A500508BAC86F70B4F5273@sps13.aecl.ca> Port Hope responds to LLRW survey Port Hope Evening Guide, Tue 13 Dec 2005 Karen Lloyd To most Port Hope residents, low-level radioactive waste is still the biggest issue facing their community. But according to the results of a public attitude survey conducted in October, which polled 351 Ward 1 and Ward 2 residents, the public is more confident than ever that historic waste can be managed safely for the long term. The results also show a marked increase in awareness of the Port Hope Area Initiative, says project communications officer Sue Stickley. "We got a very good response to the calls," she said, pointing out that unlike the previous three annual surveys, many people were willing and eager to respond. The survey, conducted by IntelliPulse, a public affairs and marketing research firm, engaged by the the Low-Level Radioactive Waste Management Office (LLRWMO) made 2,455 calls to get the number of responses it required. The first public attitudes survey conducted in 2001 required pollsters to call more 10,000 residents in order to get 500 responses. "Fewer calls to conduct a survey is indicative that people are becoming more and more confident and aware," said Ms. Stickley. In fact 79 per cent of them said they knew at least something about radioactive waste in their community. Yet living in a community dealing with LLRW is not something many residents, less than 30 per cent, appear to dwell on. But not dwelling on the issue doesn't mean they do not consider it important. Similar to 2004, 29 per cent of them identify the presence of this historic waste as a key issue facing the community. The same percentage feels it contributes to a negative image. However, satisfaction with living in Port Hope remains high. Over 90 per cent of those polled report being very or somewhat satisfied with living here. They say it's a quiet community with friendly people. They enjoy the scenery, and say the downtown area is "wonderful." When asked what they liked least about the community, some said the presence of LLRW. But concerns also included taxes, their proximity to Northumberland Hills Hospital located in Cobourg and according to one respondent, "There's nothing I don't like about it." While confident that the waste can be safely managed at the proposed facility -- located north of Highway 401 west of Baulch road -- they still have concerns that include, the proximity of community, the transportation of the waste and whether the management site will safely store the waste. One person said, "I don't have any fears about it. We're all going to go sometime." Another person said, "The next generation could forget about it or neglect it and things will start to corrode." The most frequently mentioned concerns relate to public health and safety, transportation, protection against environmental contamination and safely containing the waste. The purpose of this annual survey is to find out how knowledgeable residents are about the initiative to manage the waste, to identify and track public issues and concerns and to assess the LLRWMO's performance in meeting the community's needs. The results of the survey will be studied by LLRWMO staff and applied to community programs and newsletters to better inform residents. "We want to deal with the issues the public is interested," said Ms. Stickley, adding they want to be informed, they want the facility, when it's built, to be monitored, and they want to continue to provide the the LLRWMO with their input. Analysis of the survey responses indicates that the more knowledgeable people are, the more confident they are about the project, and keeping them informed is exactly what the LLRWMO intends to do. Over the past four years, more and more residents appear to feel the LLRWMO does a "very good" or "good" job of addressing their questions. Over four-fifths of the respondents said they are satisfied with the accessibility of the information and the manner in which they are able to provide input. Eighty-five per cent say their input was considered at least partially by the LLRWMO. The poll also found that both the LLRWMO and independent scientists are the preferred sources for reliable information about the Port Hope Area Initiative. The complete public attitude surveys can be reviewed at the new location of the Project Information Exchange at 196 Toronto Road in Port Hope. From 1 to 5 p.m. Monday to Friday visitors can drop-in, discuss their views and pick up information on the Port Hope Area Initiative. CONFIDENTIAL AND PRIVILEGED INFORMATION NOTICE This e-mail, and any attachments, may contain information that is confidential, subject to copyright, or exempt from disclosure. Any unauthorized review, disclosure, retransmission, dissemination or other use of or reliance on this information may be unlawful and is strictly prohibited. AVIS D'INFORMATION CONFIDENTIELLE ET PRIVIL?GI?E Le pr?sent courriel, et toute pi?ce jointe, peut contenir de l'information qui est confidentielle, r?gie par les droits d'auteur, ou interdite de divulgation. Tout examen, divulgation, retransmission, diffusion ou autres utilisations non autoris?es de l'information ou d?pendance non autoris?e envers celle-ci peut ?tre ill?gale et est strictement interdite. From didi at tgi-sci.com Thu Dec 15 09:34:17 2005 From: didi at tgi-sci.com (=?ISO-8859-5?Q?Dimiter=20Popoff?=) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 17:34:17 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Wikipedia survives research test Message-ID: <20051215153417.30996.qmail@server318.com> Somewhat off topic, but recently there was a thread on that, perhaps it will be of some interest. The free online resource Wikipedia is about as accurate on science as the Encyclopedia Britannica, a study shows. The British journal Nature examined a range of scientific entries on both works of reference and found few differences in accuracy. Wikipedia is produced by volunteers, who add entries and edit any page. But it has been criticised for the correctness of entries, most recently over the biography of prominent US journalist John Seigenthaler. ...... Full text at http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/4530930.stm Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Thu Dec 15 09:33:58 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 07:33:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Article: Australian law could force nuclear dump on territory Message-ID: <20051215153358.296.qmail@web54304.mail.yahoo.com> >From Nature Nature 438, 902 (15 December 2005) at http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v438/n7070/full/438902a.html Australian law could force nuclear dump on territory Australia has moved closer to selecting a permanent site for the nation's first nuclear waste dump. On 8 December, the Australian government passed legislation allowing the facility to be built at one of three sites in the Northern Territory. The decision has angered local communities and indigenous people's groups, and follows years of wrangling between federal and state governments over where to put the site. State political pressure killed an earlier proposal to house the facility in South Australia. The new federal legislation will overrule any opposition from the Northern Territory government. The site will serve as a repository for nuclear waste from agencies such as the Australian Nuclear Science and Technology Organisation, which runs the country's only nuclear reactor near Sydney. Australia's nuclear waste is currently stored in universities, hospitals and research facilities across the country. +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Thu Dec 15 10:43:12 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 08:43:12 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Press Release: 220 Radioactive Sources Removed From Georgia School Message-ID: <20051215164312.75782.qmail@web54315.mail.yahoo.com> This was pointed out to me through another list server. The whole body irradiator where I worked was orginially loaded with 320,000 Ci of Co-60. NNSA Press Release - 220 Radioactive Sources Removed >From Georgia College http://www.nnsa.doe.gov/docs/newsreleases/2005/PR_2005-12-13_NA-05-33.htm ========== FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE December 13, 2005 220 Radioactive Sources Removed From Georgia School Material that could have been be used for "dirty bombs" is now safe and secure WASHINGTON, D.C. - The National Nuclear Security Administration (NNSA) announced today the removal of 68,000 curies of radioactive cobalt-60 from the Neally Nuclear Research Center at the Georgia Institute of Technology campus in downtown Atlanta. The successful operation was recently completed and the material has been secured. The 220 sealed sources of cobalt-60 were recovered in three separate loads by the Los Alamos National Laboratory (LANL) for NNSA's Global Threat Reduction Initiative (GTRI) program and sent to the Nevada Test Site for permanent disposal. The material had been used by the school for research in the fields of materials science, genetics, radiation shielding, and biological materials processing, and was housed in a 15-foot deep pool that provided shielding. Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory also provided support for the operation. NNSA Administrator Linton F. Brooks commended the operation, saying it was important to keep dirty bomb material safe and secure from terrorists. "It is critical to our national security efforts that excess and unwanted radiological sources be disposed of in a responsible manner. Together, NNSA and two of our national laboratories have safely disposed of material from Georgia Tech that could have been used for dirty bombs. We will continue aggressively working to keep this kind of material out of the hands of terrorists," he said. One of NNSA's top priorities is removing and securing materials that pose a safety hazard and national security risk. To date, NNSA has recovered almost 12,000 radiation sources and placed them in safe and secure storage away from the public and environmentally sensitive areas. The effort is managed by the LANL Nuclear Nonproliferation Division. Following the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, the Bush administration accelerated the recovery of unwanted radioactive sources and material that could be used to make a dirty bomb. LANL supports the GTRI program by assisting in the recovery and disposition of excess, unwanted, and/or abandoned radioactive sealed sources and other radioactive material. Sources containing radioactive plutonium, americium, cesium, cobalt and strontium have been recovered from medical, agricultural, research and industrial locations throughout the nation. Established by Congress in 2000, NNSA is a semi-autonomous agency within the U.S. Department of Energy responsible for enhancing national security through the military application of nuclear energy. NNSA maintains and enhances the safety, security, reliability and performance of the U.S. nuclear weapons stockpile without nuclear testing; works to reduce global danger from weapons of mass destruction; provides the U.S. Navy with safe and effective nuclear propulsion; and responds to nuclear and radiological emergencies in the U.S. and abroad. Media Contacts: Bryan Wilkes, NNSA (202) 586-7371 Release No. NA-05-33 ===== +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From frantaj at aecl.ca Thu Dec 15 11:46:08 2005 From: frantaj at aecl.ca (Franta, Jaroslav) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 12:46:08 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] AGR fuel dimensions ? Message-ID: <0F8BD87EE693D411A1A500508BAC86F70B4F5279@sps13.aecl.ca> Hello, Would someone please send me the dimensions (overall, pin diameter, etc.) for British AGR reactor fuel ? Thanks in advance. Jaro Franta, P.Eng. Tel.: (514) 875-3444 Montr?al, Qu?bec frantaj at aecl.ca <><><><><><><><><><><> CONFIDENTIAL AND PRIVILEGED INFORMATION NOTICE This e-mail, and any attachments, may contain information that is confidential, subject to copyright, or exempt from disclosure. Any unauthorized review, disclosure, retransmission, dissemination or other use of or reliance on this information may be unlawful and is strictly prohibited. AVIS D'INFORMATION CONFIDENTIELLE ET PRIVIL?GI?E Le pr?sent courriel, et toute pi?ce jointe, peut contenir de l'information qui est confidentielle, r?gie par les droits d'auteur, ou interdite de divulgation. Tout examen, divulgation, retransmission, diffusion ou autres utilisations non autoris?es de l'information ou d?pendance non autoris?e envers celle-ci peut ?tre ill?gale et est strictement interdite. From Gerald.Rood at shawgrp.com Thu Dec 15 12:33:29 2005 From: Gerald.Rood at shawgrp.com (Rood, Gerald) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 12:33:29 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Employment Opportunity Message-ID: <298F12649A19A1409E97F864573090B0C74AC3@entbtrxmb02.shawgrp.com> Shaw Environmental and Infrastructure, Inc., a subsidiary of The Shaw Group, Inc., is a leading, full-service, environmental and facilities management firm that recognizes that it takes a group of highly talented and motivated individuals working together to achieve the kind of outstanding results we continue to accomplish through technical quality. We are currently seeking the following in our St. Louis, MO offices: Project Scientist 3 - Reference # 129621 Position summary: This individual will direct the radiation protection foreman and technicians in the implementation of the site radiological protection program at a project in St. Louis. This individual will be accountable to ensure that work is conducted in accordance with the Site Safety and Health Plan, site Radiological Work Instructions, U.S. Army Corps of Engineers requirements, and the requirements of 10CFR20. This individual must possess good communication and organizational skills, must be flexible and receptive to change, be willing to act as a mentor to employees under their direction, and be capable of motivating others by example. Requirements: The ideal candidate will possess a Bachelor of Science degree in health physics, environmental science, or engineering; and a minimum of four years experience in the implementation of an operational health physics program. This individual should also possess experience in the remediation of radioactively-contaminated soils, MARSSIM radiation survey and soil sampling protocols, and the use of GIS equipment and associated software. You can go directly to the position description, by cutting & pasting the below link into your browser: http://www.recruitingsite.com/csbsites/shaweandi/JobDescription.asp?Site ID=10175&JobNumber=129621 Shaw Environmental & Infrastructure, Inc. offers competitive starting salaries and an attractive benefits package. Please forward your resume via our website at www.shawgrp.com select the Careers tab, Shaw E & I Career Opportunities, search on Ref. No.1296211. EEO M/F/D/V. Gerald J. Rood Project Radiation Safety Officer Shaw Environmental and Infrastructure, Inc. 110 James S. McDonnell Blvd. Hazelwood, MO 63042 314.895.2262 direct 314.565.6352 cell 314.895-2200 fax ----------------------------------------- *****************Internet Email Confidentiality Footer****************** Privileged/Confidential Information may be contained in this message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this message (or responsible for delivery of the message to such person), you may not copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, you should destroy this message and notify the sender by reply email. Please advise immediately if you or your employer do not consent to Internet email for messages of this kind. Opinions, conclusions and other information in this message that do not relate to the official business of The Shaw Group Inc. or its subsidiaries shall be understood as neither given nor endorsed by it. _______________________________________________________________________ _ The Shaw Group Inc. http://www.shawgrp.com From cobdw at tds.net Thu Dec 15 14:09:20 2005 From: cobdw at tds.net (cobdw at tds.net) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 20:09:20 +0000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Prep class for CHP EXAM Message-ID: <20051215200920.FZXF23063.outaamta02.mail.tds.net@smtp.tds.net> I am interested in attending a prep class for Part 1 of the CHP Exam. Any information leading me to where I may attend such a class would be greatly appreciated. I currently reside near Oak Ridge, TN so the closer the better but I will travel for the class. Thank you in advance, Douglas Coble Project Manager Chase Environmental Group Knoxville, TN dcoble at chaseenv.com From JGinniver at aol.com Thu Dec 15 14:58:31 2005 From: JGinniver at aol.com (JGinniver at aol.com) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 15:58:31 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Press Release: 220 Radioactive Sources Removed From Georgia S... Message-ID: <19a.42331e8f.30d332f7@aol.com> >From recent investigations into the properties of Co-60 sources It would appear that these sources were pieces of neutron activated metal. Does anyone have a feel for how easy it is to vaporise these in an explosion? If they can't be vaporised there is little risk of an inhalation hazard from a "dirty bomb" containing these sources. Instead there would be shards of metal that would be easy to identify and remove. The real risk of injury to the public would have been from explosion I would have thought that the greatest risk from terrorists obtaining these sources would be if they could expose them for a prolonged period of time in a public area without anyone knowing. But given that their loss would have been noted, the chance of exposing them for an extended period would have been small as they would have been easy to detect using airborne or ground based systems. While I do think that it appropriate to dispose of redundant sources to a suitable facility and in a timely fashion, I don't think that these types of sources are the greatest risk for dirty bombs, and it isn't helpful to suggest that they are. Any thoughts? Julian From Jim_Hardeman at dnr.state.ga.us Thu Dec 15 15:52:27 2005 From: Jim_Hardeman at dnr.state.ga.us (Jim Hardeman) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 16:52:27 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Press Release: 220 Radioactive Sources Removed From Georgia S... Message-ID: Julian et al. I don't think vaporization would have been the problem. We DID do some analyses prior to the 1996 Olympic Games in Atlanta that indicated that a small, determined hostile force (don't want to say too much here, but along the lines of what was specified in DBT at the time) could have caused an incident that would have ejected some of the sources from the pool and/or caused the pool water (i.e. the shielding) to go away. Due to the radiation levels, it is doubtful that anyone could have just walked out with one of these sources ... they probably wouldn't have walked too far before CNS set in. IMHO, the homeland security aspects of this source removal were greatly overplayed. The source removal was a pre-planned part of the decommissioning of the Neely (Nuclear) Research Center in anticipation of its demolition. My $0.02 worth ... Jim Hardeman, Manager Environmental Radiation Program Environmental Protection Division Georgia Department of Natural Resources 4220 International Parkway, Suite 100 Atlanta, GA 30354 (404) 362-2675 Fax: (404) 362-2653 E-mail: Jim_Hardeman at dnr.state.ga.us >>> 12/15/2005 15:58:31 >>> >From recent investigations into the properties of Co-60 sources It would appear that these sources were pieces of neutron activated metal. Does anyone have a feel for how easy it is to vaporise these in an explosion? If they can't be vaporised there is little risk of an inhalation hazard from a "dirty bomb" containing these sources. Instead there would be shards of metal that would be easy to identify and remove. The real risk of injury to the public would have been from explosion I would have thought that the greatest risk from terrorists obtaining these sources would be if they could expose them for a prolonged period of time in a public area without anyone knowing. But given that their loss would have been noted, the chance of exposing them for an extended period would have been small as they would have been easy to detect using airborne or ground based systems. While I do think that it appropriate to dispose of redundant sources to a suitable facility and in a timely fashion, I don't think that these types of sources are the greatest risk for dirty bombs, and it isn't helpful to suggest that they are. Any thoughts? Julian _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au Thu Dec 15 15:00:53 2005 From: Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au (Rogers Brent) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 08:00:53 +1100 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Wikipedia survives research test Message-ID: Just to add my own anecdotal experience, I recently Googled "Pebble Bed Reactor", out of intellectual curiosity, and chose the Wikipedia entry for it. Although I can't vouch for the accuracy of the article (I was just learning the info myself), I did find it to be very useful. It was written in what I consider to be that right balance of not being overly scholarly, yet not dumbed down either. In other word, just right if you want to gain useful knowledge without being confronted with differential equations. I have, and will continue to recommend the article to people wanting to learn more about this new reactor technology. Brent Rogers Manager Radiation Operations Unit NSW Environment Protection Authority Department of Environment and Conservation *+61 2 9995 5986 *+61 2 9995 6603 * PO Box A290 Sydney South 1232 -----Original Message----- From: Dimiter Popoff [mailto:didi at tgi-sci.com] Sent: Friday, 16 December 2005 2:34 AM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] Wikipedia survives research test Somewhat off topic, but recently there was a thread on that, perhaps it will be of some interest. The free online resource Wikipedia is about as accurate on science as the Encyclopedia Britannica, a study shows. The British journal Nature examined a range of scientific entries on both works of reference and found few differences in accuracy. Wikipedia is produced by volunteers, who add entries and edit any page. But it has been criticised for the correctness of entries, most recently over the biography of prominent US journalist John Seigenthaler. ...... Full text at http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/4530930.stm Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ This email is intended for the addressee(s) named and may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then delete it immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of the individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority states them to be the views of the Department of Environment and Conservation (NSW). From royherren2005 at yahoo.com Thu Dec 15 19:04:15 2005 From: royherren2005 at yahoo.com (ROY HERREN) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 17:04:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Slightly off subject article...DOE Atmospheric Radiation Measurement program mobile facility moves to Niger Message-ID: <20051216010415.37908.qmail@web81611.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Public release date: 15-Dec-2005 Contact: Chris Burroughs coburro at sandia.gov 505-844-0948 DOE/Sandia National Laboratories DOE Atmospheric Radiation Measurement program mobile facility moves to Niger Sandia researcher Mark Ivey spends a week in Africa on site survey for climate monitoring equipmentAfter a six-month stint taking cloud and aerosol measurements at Point Reyes National Seashore on the California coast, a mobile suite of climate monitoring equipment was moved to Niamey, Niger, in October for a year's deployment there. Going along to help survey the site and prepare for the deployment of the climate monitoring equipment was Sandia National Laboratories engineer Mark Ivey, who spent a week in the West African country. Sandia is a National Nuclear Security Administration lab. ARM - for Atmospheric Radiation Measurement - is the largest global climate change research program supported by the U.S. Department of Energy (DOE). It was created in 1989 as part of the Global Change Research Program to help resolve scientific uncertainties related to global change, focusing on the role of clouds. ARM has three permanent research sites around the globe, plus the ARM Mobile Facility (AMF) that recently was deployed to Niger. "This is the mobile unit's second deployment," Ivey says. "For the next year, the ARM Mobile Facility will be measuring cloud properties, solar and thermal radiation, and meteorological conditions at the surface." He adds that a multi-national experiment is investigating how mineral dust from the Sahara and biomass burning play a role in the West African monsoon and the climate in general. The belief is that these aerosols, as well as deep tropical convection in the sub-Saharan wet season, have a big impact on climate in that region, and possibly well beyond Africa. "This experiment will help us better understand how solar and thermal radiation are transferred in the atmosphere when deep convection and aerosols are present," Ivey says. While the mobile unit will be taking climate measurements on the ground, a European satellite positioned over the Sahara will be taking them from the sky. The combined measurements will provide the first well-sampled, direct estimates of changes of solar and thermal radiation across the atmosphere. The mobile unit will also be used to study the impact of clouds, aerosol, and water vapor on the surface. Niger is one of the hottest countries in the world, with heat so intense that it often causes rain to evaporate before it hits the ground. Ivey calls the Sahara "the biggest dust aerosol generator on the planet." Teams from the participating organizations will be spending time at the research site on a rotating basis. A program technician will be there for more than a year to take care of the equipment and work with local meteorological observers. Ivey, a member of the first rotation team, arrived in Niamey, Niger's capital, on Oct. 11, three days after a chartered 747 jumbo jet carrying the equipment landed at the airport. The AMF equipment includes seven containers, each 8 feet tall, 8 feet wide, between 12 and 20 feet long, and 5,000-10,000 pounds. One extra container with equipment will arrive in January. A separate container for batteries and other types of potentially hazardous materials was shipped from California to Niger, taking 12 weeks to get there by sea. The mobile unit has its own power generation, communication system, and state-of-the-art climate measurement instrumentation. Ivey worked closely with colleagues at Los Alamos National Laboratory in planning the Niger deployment. His involvement in the ARM Program dates back to the late 1990s when he led a team at Sandia that designed, built, and integrated ARCS - Atmospheric Radiation and Cloud Stations. The ARCS systems are still used at the Tropical Western Pacific ARM sites, and two ARCS vans were included in the AMF deployment in Niger. Among Ivey's responsibilities as part of the first working team at the Niger sites was the on-site electrical engineering expertise required to install and operate the Mobile Facility. The U.S. Embassy in Niamey assisted with obtaining the formal procurement contracts required for local communications, utility, and meteorological support services. ARM players The Atmospheric Radiation Measurement (ARM) Mobile Unit is part of the African Monsoon Multidisciplinary Analysis (AMMA) research program that is scheduled to be in Niger for seven years. However, the ARM unit will be there only one year to support a Department of Energy-funded experiment called RADAGAST, short for Radiative Atmospheric Divergence using the ARM Mobile Facility, GERB Data, and AMMA Stations. The principal investigator for RADAGAST is Anthony Slingo from the University of Reading in the UK. The ARM team includes science colleagues from DOE national laboratories Sandia, Los Alamos, Pacific Northwest (PNNL), Argonne, and Brookhaven; the Australian Bureau of Meteorology; and several other countries. PNNL initially designed and built the mobile unit, then turned the completed unit over to LANL for deployment. Sandia is handling engineering issues related to operations. The ARM program is funded through DOE's Office of Science. ARM facilities The DOE Atmospheric Radiation Measurement (ARM) Program established permanent instrumented research sites at three locales around the world for studying cloud formation and their influence on climate. Recently designated as "user facilities" by DOE, the ARM Climate Research Facility is now available to visiting scientists for experimentation. The three regional sites include the Southern Great Plains site near the Oklahoma/Kansas border; the Tropical Western Pacific locale consisting of sites at Darwin, Australia, Manus Island, Papua New Guinea, and Nauru Island; and the North Slope of Alaska sites at Barrow and Atqasuk. There is no fee for scientists using the facilities or data. However, to qualify for ARM funding for any incremental costs associated with an experiment, they must submit proposals to the ACRF Science Board, which reviews the proposals based on scientific merit and the feasibility and costs associated with using the facility. The board then provides recommendations to DOE for a final decision. ### Sandia is a multiprogram laboratory operated by Sandia Corporation, a Lockheed Martin company, for the U.S. Department of Energy's National Nuclear Security Administration. With main facilities in Albuquerque, N.M., and Livermore, Calif., Sandia has major R&D responsibilities in national security, energy and environmental technologies, and economic competitiveness. Release and image are available at http://www.sandia.gov/news-center/news-releases/2005/environ-waste-mgmt/arm.html Sandia media contact: Chris Burroughs, coburro at sandia.gov, (505) 844-0948 Sandia technical contact: Mark Ivey, mdivey at sandia.gov, (505) 284-9092 Sandia National Laboratories' World Wide Web home page is located at http://www.sandia.gov. Sandia news releases, news tips, science photo gallery, and periodicals can be found at the News Center button. --------------------------------- Roy Herren --------------------------------- Yahoo! Shopping Find Great Deals on Holiday Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping From wesvanpelt at att.net Thu Dec 15 20:37:23 2005 From: wesvanpelt at att.net (Wesley) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 21:37:23 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Wikipedia survives research test In-Reply-To: Message-ID: All, I have made much use of www.Wikipedia.com , and find it quite accurate. As a hobby, I have been reading about cosmology, general relativity, string theory, etc. For example, the wiki site below seems very authentic to me. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_relativity Best regards, Wes Wesley R. Van Pelt, PhD, CIH, CHP Wesley R. Van Pelt Associates, Inc. ................ The free online resource Wikipedia is about as accurate on science as the Encyclopedia Britannica, a study shows. The British journal Nature examined a range of scientific entries on both works of reference and found few differences in accuracy. Wikipedia is produced by volunteers, who add entries and edit any page. But it has been criticised for the correctness of entries, most recently over the biography of prominent US journalist John Seigenthaler. ...... From Bill.Garner at ky.gov Fri Dec 16 08:16:49 2005 From: Bill.Garner at ky.gov (Garner, Bill (CHFS DPH Franklin)) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 09:16:49 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Blast at Russian Nuclear Plant Kills One Message-ID: <0F75F9887A43FE4A9CCE712A74AD19D3027BCB73@agency29.eas.ds.ky.gov> Blast at Russian Nuclear Plant Kills One By IRINA TITOVA, Associated Press Writer 33 minutes ago An explosion at a Russian nuclear power plant complex killed one worker and badly hurt two others, but Russia's nuclear agency said Friday no reactors were affected. The Rosenergoatom agency said radiation levels remained normal as the reactor in that part of the Leningrad nuclear plant was undergoing repairs and was not in operation. But Thursday's blast threw a spotlight on what environmentalists called uncontrolled operations at Russian nuclear sites. The blast happened in a smelter at the plant in the closed nuclear town of Sosnovy Bor, 50 miles west of the northern city of St. Petersburg. The smelter is operated by Ekomet-S, a company reprocessing scrap metal. "The enterprise ... functions illegally because there was no mandatory (state) environmental impact assessment on its construction," Dmitry Artamonov, head of the St. Petersburg branch of Greenpeace, told The Associated Press. He said Greenpeace had complained against Ekomet-S to the Sosnovy Bor prosecutors' office but it took no action. The nuclear plant has four units, or reactors, in all. Rosenergoatom said that the smelter was on the grounds of the plant's second unit, and plant spokesman Sergei Averyanov said it was about half a mile from the reactor. Oleg Bodrov, a physicist who heads the Green World ecological group in Sosnovy Bor, said that the reactor was only some 700 yards from the smelter, which is about 50 yards from a liquid radioactive waste pond. A 33-year-old worker died of his injuries Friday morning, and two others were injured, Yuri Lameko, chief doctor of the Sosnovy Bor hospital, told the AP. "There were no violations of safety levels and operating conditions of the energy units of the Leningrad nuclear plant," Rosenergoatom said in a statement. The second unit had been shut down for planned major repairs in July, it said. The plant spokesman, Averyanov, said that the blast had caused molten metal to spurt out of the smelter. Usually Ekomet-S reprocesses scrap with low levels of radioactivity, but on Thursday the metal was clear of radiation, Averyanov said. He blamed the blast on violations of technical and production rules. Bodrov said Ekomet-S began operating two years ago and was in violation of the law since it had undergone no state environmental impact assessment. When the firm was founded, the only environmental monitoring laboratory in the town of 65,000 was shut down for lack of funding, he said. "There is no independent environmental monitoring in the nuclear city of Sosnovy Bor," Bodrov said. He said this was the second accident to occur at Ekomet-S. The first happened in summer 2003, injuring some workers. In March 1992, an accident at the Sosnovy Bor plant caused radioactive gases and iodine to be leaked into the air, according to nuclear watchdog groups. One of the reactors at the 30-year-old plant is of the same type as the one at the Chernobyl nuclear power plant that exploded in Soviet Ukraine in 1986 in the world's worst nuclear accident. The station is the main supplier of electricity to St. Petersburg, and there are plans to transport some of its power to Finland. Sosnovy Bor, a center of nuclear technology, was founded 25 years ago and has 60,000 people. In addition to the nuclear plant, the town is home to a regional radioactive waste reservoir, and an experimental laboratory and training center for nuclear submarines. Almost everyone in Sosnovy Bor, which means Pine Forest, is connected with nuclear technology, and most are not native to the region. In an unrelated development, Chechen prosecutors said they have opened a criminal investigation into the improper storage of radioactive waste by a state-owned company, Prosecutors said a "catastrophic radioactivity situation" had developed at the Grozny Chemical Factory in the breakaway province in southern Russia. Grozny is Chechnya's capital. Radiation levels at one storage center at the plant are 58,000 times higher than normal, the Russian Prosecutor General's office said Friday. "It's a threat to the population because the leadership of the plant is taking no steps whatsoever to remove the radioactive material or isolate access to the plant," Chechen Prosecutor Valery Kuznetsov said. Copyright (c) 2005 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. The information contained in the AP News report may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed without the prior written authority of The Associated Press. Bill Garner Radioactive Materials Specialist Radioactive Materials Section Radiation Health Branch 275 East Main Street Mailstop HS1CA Frankfort, Kentucky 40621 502-564-3700 EXT. 4515 Fax: 502-564-1492 This e-mail including any attachments, is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential information that is legally privileged and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified that any review, use, disclosure, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. <> From mcnaught at lanl.gov Fri Dec 16 08:34:06 2005 From: mcnaught at lanl.gov (Michael McNaughton) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 07:34:06 -0700 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Wikipedia survives research test In-Reply-To: <200512160324.jBG3O0Q0011731@proofpoint2.lanl.gov> References: <200512160324.jBG3O0Q0011731@proofpoint2.lanl.gov> Message-ID: <6.0.0.22.2.20051216072940.022352c8@esh-mail.lanl.gov> At 07:37 PM 12/15/2005, Wesley wrote: >I have made much use of www.Wikipedia.com , >and find it quite accurate. I suggest the "depleted uranium" entry would benefit from contributions by Radsafe subscribers. mike Mike McNaughton Los Alamos National Lab. email: mcnaught at LANL.gov or mcnaughton at LANL.gov phone: 505-667-6130; page: 505-664-7733 From rstrickert at signaturescience.com Fri Dec 16 09:06:42 2005 From: rstrickert at signaturescience.com (Strickert, Rick) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 09:06:42 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Blast at Russian Nuclear Plant Kills One Message-ID: <7D5C72A07835EB4085063AD8555F05DE01211C1B@ss-mail2.corp.signaturescience.com> Inside the AP report: "The blast happened in a smelter at the plant... Rosenergoatom said that the smelter was on the grounds of the plant's second unit, and plant spokesman Sergei Averyanov said it was about half a mile from the reactor." Another posting (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,178896,00.html) of the AP report included the agency's claim that the second unit was shut down for major repairs in July. Now if a toilet at the smelter had backed up, the AP article could have included "area highly contaminated" in its sensationalist headline. Rick Strickert Austin, TX From Jim_Hardeman at dnr.state.ga.us Fri Dec 16 10:03:39 2005 From: Jim_Hardeman at dnr.state.ga.us (Jim Hardeman) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 11:03:39 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Documentation request Message-ID: Colleagues * Does anybody out there have a manual for an Eberline MS-3 mini scaler, preferably in a form (PDF) that can be e-mailed? Thanks! Jim Hardeman, Manager Environmental Radiation Program Environmental Protection Division Georgia Department of Natural Resources 4220 International Parkway, Suite 100 Atlanta, GA 30354 (404) 362-2675 Fax: (404) 362-2653 E-mail: Jim_Hardeman at dnr.state.ga.us From didi at tgi-sci.com Fri Dec 16 11:54:15 2005 From: didi at tgi-sci.com (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Dimiter=20Popoff?=) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 19:54:15 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Radiation alert at Chechen plant Message-ID: <20051216175415.1479.qmail@server318.com> Actually I see this report as yet another example of how this should not be done - 58000 times, "at one place" (how big a place?), "in Chernobyl" (where exactly in Chernobyl?) etc. ----- Prosecutors in Chechnya have opened a criminal investigation after finding "catastrophic" levels of radioactivity at a chemical factory. Investigators say the radiation - in one place reportedly 58,000 times the usual level - poses a danger to people in the region's capital, Grozny. The case has also raised fears militants could take radioactive waste to use in a so-called "dirty bomb". The plant has reportedly not been secured since Russia bombed it in 1999. For years, rebels in Chechnya have been fighting a separatist struggle against Russian forces. They have been blamed for bomb attacks on airliners in Moscow, and the deadly sieges at a school in Beslan, North Ossetia, and in a Moscow theatre. 'No safety steps' Chechen prosecutors say radioactive materials have been improperly stored at the Grozny Chemical Factory, run by the Chechen Oil and Chemical Industry, and that a "catastrophic radioactivity situation" has developed. "It's a threat to the population because the leadership of the plant is taking no steps whatsoever to remove the radioactive material or isolate access to the plant," prosecutor Valery Kuznetsov said on Friday, according to the Associated Press. The Russian prosecutor general's office said between 27 and 29 radioactive elements had been identified at the plant, with the cobalt-60 isotope considered particularly dangerous. Radioactive materials have a variety of uses in the manufacturing industry. If not disposed of properly, they can pose a serious threat to people nearby. The radioactive cloud released by the explosion at the Chernobyl nuclear plant in Ukraine in 1986 may be responsible for 4,000 deaths, according to a recent study. The radioactivity at one storage centre in the Grozny plant is half that recorded at Chernobyl, Rossiya state television said. Vladimir Slivyak of the Ecodefense environmental group in Moscow urged the Russian government to remove and secure radioactive materials from the plant as a matter of urgency, warning of the dangers of them falling into the wrong hands. -------- >From http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4535452.stm . Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ From LNMolino at aol.com Fri Dec 16 16:07:35 2005 From: LNMolino at aol.com (LNMolino at aol.com) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 17:07:35 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: <241.3cd60f5.30d494a7@aol.com> recently eBay the online auction site has "banned radioactive" items from their site. In a recent letter to a person offering unprocessed ores on the site (a seemingly common practice) the following statement was made by eBay. "Please also remember that anything that has a specific activity greater than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is not permitted on eBay under any conditions." So to that end I pose this question. Why the above "limit" what makes 70 Bq the "magic number" or rather might there be a "scientific basis for such a "limit"? Thanks. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino at aol.com 979-690-7559 (Office) 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the original author. From maurysis at ev1.net Fri Dec 16 16:37:18 2005 From: maurysis at ev1.net (Maury Siskel) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 16:37:18 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Wikipedia and DU Message-ID: <43A3419E.4050004@ev1.net> If one does a search of Wikipedia for [ depleted uranium ] (without brackets) then 140 items will be cited. I've shown the first four and the last citation with Wikipedia's relevancy scores. "depleted uranium" Relevancy: 100.0% - - Depleted Uranium Relevancy: 100.0% - - Depleted uranium Relevancy: 92.9% - - Depleted uranium ammunition Relevancy: 81.8% - - ................ Geology of the Moon Relevancy: 0.1% - - Wikipedia has been useful to me from time to time and I've encountered no apparent errors. However, surely it would benefit all concerned if any subject matter experts on this List would review/contribute Wikipedia entries. Cheers, Maury&Dog From jjcohen at prodigy.net Fri Dec 16 18:09:33 2005 From: jjcohen at prodigy.net (jjcohen at prodigy.net) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 16:09:33 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question References: <241.3cd60f5.30d494a7@aol.com> Message-ID: <001601c6029e$2998b5c0$5330e345@domainnotset.invalid> Several years ago, we did a study for the NRC, that recommended that anything <1.0 nci/g (regardless of the radionuclides(s) involved) could be considered "essentially not radioactive" for regulatory purposes. They did not accept the recommendation, largely due to prevailing LNT beliefs. Just out of curiosity, does anyone know of any dire health and safety consequence that might have resulted if this recommendation had been implemented. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, December 16, 2005 2:07 PM Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question > recently eBay the online auction site has "banned radioactive" items from > their site. In a recent letter to a person offering unprocessed ores on the site > (a seemingly common practice) the following statement was made by eBay. > > "Please also remember that anything that has a specific activity greater > than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is not permitted on eBay under > any conditions." > > So to that end I pose this question. Why the above "limit" what makes 70 Bq > the "magic number" or rather might there be a "scientific basis for such a > "limit"? > > Thanks. > > Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET > FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI > LNMolino at aol.com > 979-690-7559 (Office) > 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) > 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) > > "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" > > The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the > author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or > organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I > specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its > stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials > retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the > original author. > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From radsafe at painahawaii.com Fri Dec 16 18:16:44 2005 From: radsafe at painahawaii.com (Andrew Buchan) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 14:16:44 -1000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MOSFET Dosimetry Message-ID: Anyone have any experience using off the shelf prepackaged MOSFETS for dosimetry? Please contact me off list. Thank you, Andrew Andrew Buchan Pa'ina Hawaii POBOX 30542 Tel: 808-834-0496 Honolulu, HI 96744 Fax:808-834-0578 radsafe at painahawaii.com www.painahawaii.com From JGinniver at aol.com Fri Dec 16 18:18:07 2005 From: JGinniver at aol.com (JGinniver at aol.com) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 19:18:07 EST Subject: Fwd: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: <6a.63f180b4.30d4b33f@aol.com> Whoops, forgot to include the list in the original reply. Sorry! From DonJordan at ramservicesinc.com Fri Dec 16 17:27:06 2005 From: DonJordan at ramservicesinc.com (Don Jordan) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 17:27:06 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question References: <241.3cd60f5.30d494a7@aol.com> Message-ID: <009101c60298$3ca022d0$4501a8c0@RAMSERVICE1> 70 Bq/g was the old DOT limit for treating an item as non-radioactive. It has been replaced by isotope-specific limits, so some of the things that ebay might allow would now have to be shipped as limited quantities. Somebody should tell them. Don Jordan From GRMarshall at philotechnics.com Fri Dec 16 19:03:49 2005 From: GRMarshall at philotechnics.com (Glenn R. Marshall) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 20:03:49 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: <5B0DA358D2061D47A3BB00647C29D12F28F036@tnor-fpe.philotechnics.int> Probably because under the "old" U.S. DOT regulations (before 10/1/2004), anything over .002 uCi/g was considered radioactive material for transportation purposes; material having a lower specific activity was exempt from regulation as a hazardous material. Of course use of that limit today has no regulatory basis. Glenn Marshall, CHP -----Original Message----- From: LNMolino at aol.com [mailto:LNMolino at aol.com] Sent: Friday, December 16, 2005 5:08 PM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question recently eBay the online auction site has "banned radioactive" items from their site. In a recent letter to a person offering unprocessed ores on the site (a seemingly common practice) the following statement was made by eBay. "Please also remember that anything that has a specific activity greater than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is not permitted on eBay under any conditions." So to that end I pose this question. Why the above "limit" what makes 70 Bq the "magic number" or rather might there be a "scientific basis for such a "limit"? Thanks. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino at aol.com 979-690-7559 (Office) 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the original author. _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From Jim_Hardeman at dnr.state.ga.us Fri Dec 16 17:17:00 2005 From: Jim_Hardeman at dnr.state.ga.us (Jim Hardeman) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 18:17:00 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: Lou * 70 Bq/g "used" to be the magic number under DOT Hazardous Materials regulations. Until 2003 (I think) "radioactive material" was defined under DOT regulations as anything exceeding 70 Bq/g (.002 microcurie per gram). Current DOT radioactive materials regulations contain nuclide-specific exemption limits, some greater than 70 Bq/g and others less. One popular item on eBay is "radioactive marbles" containing uranium. My wife, who teaches physics labs at a local community college, bought some of these a few years back for a radioactivity lab ... and we routinely order old Fiesta-ware for show and tell items. Well, guess what? The exemption limit for natural uranium is 1 Bq/g, not 70 ... but in order to be considered "radioactive material" you also have to exceed the "Activity Limit for Exempt Consignment" ... in this case 1,000 Bq. Per 49 CFR 173.403, "Radioactive material means any material containing radionuclides where both the activity concentration and the total activity in the consignment exceed the values specified in the table in Sec. 173.436 or values derived according to the instructions in Sec. 173.433." You can look up these references at http://www.gpoaccess.gov/cfr/retrieve.html For the record, the "old" DOT exemption language in 49 CFR 173.403 used to read "Radioactive material means any material having a specific activity greater than 70 Bq per gram (0.002 microcurie per gram) (see definition of "specific activity'')." Jim Hardeman, Manager Environmental Radiation Program Environmental Protection Division Georgia Department of Natural Resources 4220 International Parkway, Suite 100 Atlanta, GA 30354 (404) 362-2675 Fax: (404) 362-2653 E-mail: Jim_Hardeman at dnr.state.ga.us >>> 12/16/2005 17:07:35 >>> recently eBay the online auction site has "banned radioactive" items from their site. In a recent letter to a person offering unprocessed ores on the site (a seemingly common practice) the following statement was made by eBay. "Please also remember that anything that has a specific activity greater than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is not permitted on eBay under any conditions." So to that end I pose this question. Why the above "limit" what makes 70 Bq the "magic number" or rather might there be a "scientific basis for such a "limit"? Thanks. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino at aol.com 979-690-7559 (Office) 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the original author. _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From joseroze at netvision.net.il Sat Dec 17 03:31:24 2005 From: joseroze at netvision.net.il (Jose Julio Rozental) Date: Sat, 17 Dec 2005 12:31:24 +0300 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question References: <241.3cd60f5.30d494a7@aol.com> Message-ID: <006101c602ec$a9f019e0$840118ac@userqzqxd9wnct> GO TO RADSAFE SITE 3 March 1997 to understand the reason why 70 Bq per gram was selected http://www.vanderbilt.edu/radsafe/9703/msg00016.html GO TO RADSAFE SITE 22 Nov 2000 and find part of the answer -- today's approach http://www.vanderbilt.edu/radsafe/0011/msg00367.html Jose Julio Rozental joseroze at netvision.net.il Israel ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, December 17, 2005 1:07 AM Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question > recently eBay the online auction site has "banned radioactive" items from > their site. In a recent letter to a person offering unprocessed ores on the site > (a seemingly common practice) the following statement was made by eBay. > > "Please also remember that anything that has a specific activity greater > than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is not permitted on eBay under > any conditions." > > So to that end I pose this question. Why the above "limit" what makes 70 Bq > the "magic number" or rather might there be a "scientific basis for such a > "limit"? > > Thanks. > > Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET > FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI > LNMolino at aol.com > 979-690-7559 (Office) > 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) > 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) > > "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" > > The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the > author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or > organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I > specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its > stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials > retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the > original author. > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au Sun Dec 18 03:11:44 2005 From: Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au (Rogers Brent) Date: Sun, 18 Dec 2005 20:11:44 +1100 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: Does anyone know if the post-2003 specific activity thresholds are in line with or itdentical to the IAEA document BSS-115 (BSS = Basic Safety Series)? Brent Rogers Manager Radiation Operations Unit NSW Environment Protection Authority Department of Environment and Conservation *+61 2 9995 5986 *+61 2 9995 6603 * PO Box A290 Sydney South 1232 -----Original Message----- From: Don Jordan [mailto:DonJordan at ramservicesinc.com] Sent: Saturday, 17 December 2005 10:27 AM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] Activity question 70 Bq/g was the old DOT limit for treating an item as non-radioactive. It has been replaced by isotope-specific limits, so some of the things that ebay might allow would now have to be shipped as limited quantities. Somebody should tell them. Don Jordan _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ This email is intended for the addressee(s) named and may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then delete it immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of the individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority states them to be the views of the Department of Environment and Conservation (NSW). From Orion1111 at aol.com Sun Dec 18 20:56:37 2005 From: Orion1111 at aol.com (Orion1111 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 18 Dec 2005 21:56:37 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Edward W. Webster (1922-2005) Message-ID: <1a4.454fc5ad.30d77b65@aol.com> Dear friends and colleagues, The worlds of medical physics and health physics mourns the passing of one of its cherished leaders, Edward W. Webster, on the very early morning of December 17th. "Ted" as he was affectionately known by friends and colleagues, was the fifth president of the AAPM, in 1964. Receiving the ACR Gold medal in 1991, the Coolidge Award in 1983 and giving the 1992 Lauriston S. Taylor Lecture were among Ted's very many honors. Condolences may be extended to his wife, Dorothea, and daughter, Sue MacPhee and family at the following email address: _jcmacphee at verizon.net_ (mailto:jcmacphee at verizon.net) Sincerely, Bob Gorson From luke.mccormick at dhs.gov Mon Dec 19 07:37:37 2005 From: luke.mccormick at dhs.gov (Mccormick, Luke I) Date: Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:37:37 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: 70 Bq used to be where DOT defined something as radioactive for transportation. ____________________Reply Separator____________________ Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Author: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl Date: 12/16/2005 5:07 PM recently eBay the online auction site has "banned radioactive" items from their site. In a recent letter to a person offering unprocessed ores on the site (a seemingly common practice) the following statement was made by eBay. "Please also remember that anything that has a specific activity greater than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is not permitted on eBay under any conditions." So to that end I pose this question. Why the above "limit" what makes 70 Bq the "magic number" or rather might there be a "scientific basis for such a "limit"? Thanks. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino at aol.com 979-690-7559 (Office) 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the original author. _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From bsdnuke at gmail.com Mon Dec 19 08:53:31 2005 From: bsdnuke at gmail.com (Scott Davidson) Date: Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:53:31 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Does anyone know if the post-2003 specific activity thresholds are in line with or itdentical to the IAEA document BSS-115 (BSS = Basic Safety Series)? Yes, the HM-230 change was supposed to do that. On 12/18/05, Rogers Brent wrote: > > Does anyone know if the post-2003 specific activity thresholds are in line > with or itdentical to the IAEA document BSS-115 (BSS = Basic Safety > Series)? > > Brent Rogers > Manager Radiation Operations Unit > NSW Environment Protection Authority > Department of Environment and Conservation > *+61 2 9995 5986 > *+61 2 9995 6603 > * PO Box A290 Sydney South 1232 > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Don Jordan [mailto:DonJordan at ramservicesinc.com] > Sent: Saturday, 17 December 2005 10:27 AM > To: radsafe at radlab.nl > Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] Activity question > > > 70 Bq/g was the old DOT limit for treating an item as non-radioactive. It > has been replaced by isotope-specific limits, so some of the things that > ebay might allow would now have to be shipped as limited quantities. > Somebody should tell them. > > Don Jordan > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > the > RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > visit: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > > This email is intended for the addressee(s) named and may contain > confidential and/or privileged information. > > If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then > delete it immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of the > individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority > states them to be the views of the Department of Environment and > Conservation (NSW). > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From obbugg at gsp.net Mon Dec 19 09:17:38 2005 From: obbugg at gsp.net (O.Bruce Bugg) Date: Mon, 19 Dec 2005 10:17:38 -0500 Subject: Spam:Re: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: Two possible exceptions: Cf-252 and Mo-99 in the U.S. A1 = 0.1 TBq (2.7 Ci) and A2 = 0.001 TBq (0.027 Ci) for Cf-252 for domestic use. A2 = 0.74 TBq (20 Ci) for Mo-99 for domestic use. Also, there were some rounding errors in the A1/A2 tables from TBq to Ci; the SI units are the regulatory standard. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Capt. Bruce Bugg Georgia Department of Public Safety Motor Carrier Compliance Division P.O. Box 1456 Atlanta , GA 30371-1456 Phone: 404.624.7211 or 7210 Fax: 404.624.7295 e-mail: obbugg(at)gsp.net [replace "(at)" with "@"] -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Scott Davidson Sent: Monday, December 19, 2005 09:54 To: Rogers Brent Cc: Don Jordan; radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: Spam:Re: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Does anyone know if the post-2003 specific activity thresholds are in line with or itdentical to the IAEA document BSS-115 (BSS = Basic Safety Series)? Yes, the HM-230 change was supposed to do that. From jjcohen at prodigy.net Mon Dec 19 10:12:05 2005 From: jjcohen at prodigy.net (jjcohen at prodigy.net) Date: Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:12:05 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question References: Message-ID: <000401c604b6$f55fe7e0$f0ffe245@domainnotset.invalid> I believe the original question related to the scientific/technical basis for the 70Bq level rather than the administrative/bureaucratic basis. Why was 70bq selected-- as opposed to 10, 50, 100, or 63.749 Bq ??? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mccormick, Luke I" To: ; Sent: Monday, December 19, 2005 5:37 AM Subject: Re:[ RadSafe ] Activity question > > 70 Bq used to be where DOT defined something as radioactive for > transportation. > > ____________________Reply Separator____________________ > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question > Author: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl > Date: 12/16/2005 5:07 PM > > > > > recently eBay the online auction site has "banned radioactive" > items from > their site. In a recent letter to a person offering unprocessed > ores on the site > (a seemingly common practice) the following statement was made > by eBay. > > "Please also remember that anything that has a specific > activity greater > than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is not permitted > on eBay under > any conditions." > > So to that end I pose this question. Why the above "limit" what > makes 70 Bq > the "magic number" or rather might there be a "scientific basis > for such a > "limit"? > > Thanks. > > Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET > FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI > LNMolino at aol.com > 979-690-7559 (Office) > 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) > 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) > > "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" > > The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the > author and the > author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person > or > organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or > associated with unless I > specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is > intended only for its > stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential > materials > retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the > public domain by the > original author. > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and > understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other > settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From luke.mccormick at dhs.gov Mon Dec 19 11:01:51 2005 From: luke.mccormick at dhs.gov (Mccormick, Luke I) Date: Mon, 19 Dec 2005 12:01:51 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: You are making the assumption that bureaucrats used a scientific/technical basis for setting the level. My guess is that it probably had to do with either a 1 nCi commodity like a lantern mantle or a detectability issue. ____________________Reply Separator____________________ Subject: Re: Re:[ RadSafe ] Activity question Author: Date: 12/19/2005 11:12 AM I believe the original question related to the scientific/technical basis for the 70Bq level rather than the administrative/bureaucratic basis. Why was 70bq selected-- as opposed to 10, 50, 100, or 63.749 Bq ??? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mccormick, Luke I" To: ; Sent: Monday, December 19, 2005 5:37 AM Subject: Re:[ RadSafe ] Activity question > > 70 Bq used to be where DOT defined something as radioactive for > transportation. > > ____________________Reply Separator____________________ > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question > Author: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl > Date: 12/16/2005 5:07 PM > > > > > recently eBay the online auction site has "banned radioactive" > items from > their site. In a recent letter to a person offering unprocessed > ores on the site > (a seemingly common practice) the following statement was made > by eBay. > > "Please also remember that anything that has a specific > activity greater > than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is not permitted > on eBay under > any conditions." > > So to that end I pose this question. Why the above "limit" what > makes 70 Bq > the "magic number" or rather might there be a "scientific basis > for such a > "limit"? > > Thanks. > > Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET > FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI > LNMolino at aol.com > 979-690-7559 (Office) > 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) > 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) > > "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" > > The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the > author and the > author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person > or > organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or > associated with unless I > specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is > intended only for its > stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential > materials > retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the > public domain by the > original author. > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and > understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other > settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From BLHamrick at aol.com Mon Dec 19 19:50:52 2005 From: BLHamrick at aol.com (BLHamrick at aol.com) Date: Mon, 19 Dec 2005 20:50:52 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: <287.28a1552.30d8bd7c@aol.com> I also think that when it comes to setting low-level threshholds, scientists recognize there is little difference between 10, 50, 70 or 100 Bq/g, but you have to settle on some number eventually for regulatory purposes. Barbara L. Hamrick, CHP, JD In a message dated 12/19/2005 9:33:52 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, luke.mccormick at dhs.gov writes: You are making the assumption that bureaucrats used a scientific/technical basis for setting the level. My guess is that it probably had to do with either a 1 nCi commodity like a lantern mantle or a detectability issue. ____________________Reply Separator____________________ Subject: Re: Re:[ RadSafe ] Activity question Author: Date: 12/19/2005 11:12 AM I believe the original question related to the scientific/technical basis for the 70Bq level rather than the administrative/bureaucratic basis. Why was 70bq selected-- as opposed to 10, 50, 100, or 63.749 Bq ??? From Fred.Dawson199 at mod.uk Tue Dec 20 03:09:00 2005 From: Fred.Dawson199 at mod.uk (Dawson, Fred Mr) Date: Tue, 20 Dec 2005 09:09:00 -0000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] NS reports Bomb-disposal robot scoops up radioactive source Message-ID: Bomb-disposal robot scoops up radioactive source http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn8480 A robot designed for bomb disposal has rolled to the rescue of a US military lab and fixed a jammed radiation source that was too powerful for humans to approach. The Gamma Irradiation Facility at White Sands Missile Range in New Mexico uses a cobalt-60 radiation source the size of a salt shaker to test how electronic components will hold up under high radiation. Normally, technicians use air to blow the source out of a shielded chamber and through a metal tube, then reverse the process when finished. But in late October, the source got stuck in the tube, and no amount of air would budge it. The radiation from the source would be lethal to a human in just 30 seconds, and was too strong to be approached even in a protective suit. So White Sands officials called Sandia National Laboratory in Albuquerque, New Mexico, to see if their robot could help. "We called these guys and they came down and worked their magic," says Larry Furrow, a White Sands spokesman. Hope on a rope Sandia brought in a 270-kilogram bomb-disposal robot, dubbed Mighty Mouse, that rolls on treads and has a long articulated arm. At first the robot could not get the cylinder unstuck, and then after 90 minutes its electronics began to fail, and it had to be hauled out of the room with a rope. The next day the Sandia team made trips to local DIY stores and modified the robot's arm so that it could unscrew a metal plate and get at the radioactive cylinder from a different direction. Eventually the robot cleared the tube and the radiation source was blown back into its container. Gamma radiation does not leave metal radioactive, so the robot was not permanently damaged and has since been restored to full working order, a Sandia spokesman said. Furrow said the Gamma Irradiation Facility is also now operating normally Fred Dawson Fred Dawson Health Physics Assistant Director & Team Leader Directorate of Safety & Claims 6-D-30 MOD Main Building Whitehall, LONDON SW1A 2HB email dsc-hpad at mod.uk http://www.mod.uk/dsc/ From robert.atkinson at genetix.com Tue Dec 20 05:20:40 2005 From: robert.atkinson at genetix.com (Robert Atkinson) Date: Tue, 20 Dec 2005 11:20:40 -0000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: 70Bq was not selected; it is a conversion and round down from 2nCi. I'd guess that if the limit had been set in Becquerel's it would have been 50 or 100. Robert Atkinson. -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of jjcohen at prodigy.net Sent: 19 December 2005 16:12 To: Mccormick, Luke I; LNMolino at aol.com; radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: Re: Re:[ RadSafe ] Activity question I believe the original question related to the scientific/technical basis for the 70Bq level rather than the administrative/bureaucratic basis. Why was 70bq selected-- as opposed to 10, 50, 100, or 63.749 Bq ??? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mccormick, Luke I" To: ; Sent: Monday, December 19, 2005 5:37 AM Subject: Re:[ RadSafe ] Activity question > > 70 Bq used to be where DOT defined something as radioactive for > transportation. > > ____________________Reply Separator____________________ > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question > Author: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl > Date: 12/16/2005 5:07 PM > > > > > recently eBay the online auction site has "banned radioactive" > items from > their site. In a recent letter to a person offering unprocessed > ores on the site > (a seemingly common practice) the following statement was made > by eBay. > > "Please also remember that anything that has a specific > activity greater > than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is not permitted > on eBay under > any conditions." > > So to that end I pose this question. Why the above "limit" what > makes 70 Bq > the "magic number" or rather might there be a "scientific basis > for such a > "limit"? > > Thanks. > > Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET > FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI > LNMolino at aol.com > 979-690-7559 (Office) > 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) > 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) > > "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" > > The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the > author and the > author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person > or > organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or > associated with unless I > specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is > intended only for its > stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential > materials > retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the > public domain by the > original author. > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and > understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other > settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ Any opinions expressed in this email are those of the individual and not necessarily Genetix Ltd (Genetix) or any company associated with it. This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and solely for the use of the intended recipient. If you are not the intended recipient or the person responsible for delivering to the intended recipient, be advised that you have received this email in error and that any use is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify Genetix by telephone on +44 (0)1425 624600. The unauthorised use, disclosure, copying or alteration of this message is strictly forbidden. This mail and any attachments have been scanned for viruses prior to leaving the Genetix network. Genetix will not be liable for direct, special, indirect or consequential damages as a result of any virus being passed on, or arising from alteration of the contents of this message by a third party. From danny.mcclung at louisville.edu Tue Dec 20 09:15:38 2005 From: danny.mcclung at louisville.edu (Danny K McClung) Date: Tue, 20 Dec 2005 10:15:38 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RSO Recharges for University and/or Govt. programs Message-ID: I have sent this around before, but now it is CRUNCH TIME with administration. Any input will be appreciated. Previous repliers (you know who you are) need not reply again. Thanks in advance and Seasons Greetings! Greetings Colleagues: We here at UofL are curious about how the rest of the group makes ends meet. More specifically, how do you raise your operating budget? We currently have a recharge system that includes RAM package receipt and personnel dosimetry. We do not charge for anything else at this time, as we are only responsible for raising a portion of our own funds. We have had discussion on this topic with some of you previously (SEURSO conference, Apr '05, here in Louisville). We now wish to include everyone who frequents the AMRSO and RADSAFE list. We will compile a summary of this information in an Excel document and share it with the group after replies are received. Please provide a list of services you are charging for and the dollar amounts. Any other pertinent information is welcome. Thanks in advance for your participation. Danny K. McClung, RRPT Health Physicist/Asst. RSO ******************** University of Louisville Radiation Safety Office 319 Abraham Flexner Way Room 102, Building 55A Louisville, KY 40202 502-852-5231 (phone) 502-852-8911 (fax) GO CARDS !! From jim_hoerner at hotmail.com Wed Dec 21 20:18:39 2005 From: jim_hoerner at hotmail.com (Jim Hoerner) Date: Wed, 21 Dec 2005 21:18:39 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 Message-ID: [Sorry if this has already been posted to RadSafe; I get the digest. I would appreciate any solid debunking, which should probably be fairly easy since Mangano's calulator has been broken for a while. I don't have the time to do it myself in the near future. Thanks. - JH] Article Published: Tuesday, December 20, 2005 - 2:15:20 AM EST Radiation levels measured in rainwater Editor of the Reformer: Vermont state health official Larry Crist is quoted as saying there has been no increase in environmental radiation levels near the Vermont Yankee nuclear plant since the 1970s, when the plant opened ("Studies differ on radiation levels near VY," Reformer, Nov. 29). Crist's claim contradicts what the federal Environmental Protection Agency has found across the nation. The EPA measures levels of beta-emitting radiation in rainwater each month at about 50 U.S. locations. Since the late 1980s, average beta levels have risen about 40 percent around the nation (one can see reports on www.epa.gov/narel, environmental radiation data). While no EPA monitoring stations are located in Vermont, the closest ones are in Concord, N.H. and Hartford Conn., 50 and 60 miles from Vermont Yankee. Beta levels in both locations are increasing, similar to the nation. The EPA finding that beta levels are rising corresponds to our research group's study of Strontium-90 in baby teeth, the levels of which jumped around the nation since the late 1980s. Nuclear reactors in this country are aging, and being operated more of the time. Vermont Yankee, the 10th oldest of 103 U.S. reactors, has operated at 95 percent of capacity in the past six years, versus only 83 percent before that. Meanwhile, cancer death rates in Windham County are rising even though they are falling elsewhere in the state. We need to understand whether running an old reactor like Vermont Yankee into the ground is putting more radiation into our environment and bodies and making us more likely to become cancer victims. Health officials like Crist need to present their results publicly, to better understand these crucial matters. Joseph J. Mangano, National Coordinator Radiation and Public Health Project Norristown, Pa., Dec. 5 http://www.reformer.com/Stories/0,1413,102~8855~3173752,00.html -- Hold the door for the stranger behind you. When the driver in the adjacent lane signals to get over, slow down. Smile and say "hi" to the folks you pass on the sidewalk. Give blood. Volunteer. From JGinniver at aol.com Thu Dec 22 08:19:32 2005 From: JGinniver at aol.com (JGinniver at aol.com) Date: Thu, 22 Dec 2005 09:19:32 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 Message-ID: <241.429a130.30dc0ff4@aol.com> In a message dated 22/12/2005 02:32:41 GMT Standard Time, jim_hoerner at hotmail.com writes: www.epa.gov/narel, environmental radiation data The above link doesn't work. I've had a cursory look and think that this is the link to the data that is referenced in the article. _http://www.epa.gov/narel/radnet/erdonline.html_ (http://www.epa.gov/narel/radnet/erdonline.html) The article states SNIP>The EPA measures levels of beta-emitting radiation in rainwater each month at about 50 U.S. locations. Since the late 1980s, average beta levels have risen about 40 percent around the nation The EPA finding that beta levels are rising corresponds to our research group's study of Strontium-90 in baby teeth, the levels of which jumped around the nation since the late 1980s. Dear Colleagues The 1st Human, Life and Radiation Conference (HLR-2006) and the 3rd Asia Pacific Conference on Risk Management for Preventive Medicine joint meeting will be held at the President Museum, Rafsanjan, Iran from Sunday, October 29 through Tuesday, October 31, 2006. The deadline for abstract submission for Human, Life and Radiation Young Investigator Award is approaching! Please note that the *Feb 2, 2006* deadline cannot be extended. In case you have any comments/questions regarding the submission of abstracts and/or abstract selection criteria, please don't hesitate to contact the HLR-2006 secretarial office. Further information can be found on the conference home page at URL: http://hlrjournal.f2g.net/hlr2006 Best regards SMJ Mortazavi, Ph.D Associate Professor HLR-2006 Scientific Secretary HLR Conference Secretariat Office, Central Building of Rafsanjan University of Medical Sciences Imam Ali Blvd. Rafsanjan, Iran Tel: 98-391-822-0054 Fax: 98-391-822? 0053 E-mail: hlr2006 at hlrjournal.f2g.net Home page: http://hlrjournal.f2g.net/hlr2006 From ograabe at ucdavis.edu Thu Dec 22 17:22:19 2005 From: ograabe at ucdavis.edu (Otto G. Raabe) Date: Thu, 22 Dec 2005 15:22:19 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6.0.1.1.2.20051222145015.02ee0dc8@mailbox.ucdavis.edu> At 06:18 PM 12/21/2005, Jim Hoerner sent: >[We need to understand whether running an old reactor like Vermont Yankee >into the ground is putting more radiation into our environment and bodies >and making us more likely to become cancer victims. Health officials like >Crist need to present their results publicly, to better understand these >crucial matters. > >Joseph J. Mangano, > >National Coordinator >Radiation and Public Health Project >Norristown, Pa., Dec. 5 ***************************************************** December 22., 2005 Mangano's statement is seriously in error. The average American gets 1 mrem per day EDE from natural and normal background sources. People in Colorado may get up to 3 mrem EDE per day (mostly from inhaled radon decay products). The total ANNUAL dose to Americans from nuclear power, fallout (including Sr-90 found in teeth by RPHP), and all nuclear technolgies is about 3 mrem EDE PER YEAR (ICRP 93). If Mangano and his group were correct, we would have to evacuate Colorado and several other higher radiation States. Actually, Colorado has one of the lowest cancer rates of all the States (47th out of 50). As all nuclear power HP's know, there are no serious releases of Sr-90 (or other metabolizable radionuclides) to the environment from Nuclear Power stations. Otto ********************************************** Prof. Otto G. Raabe, Ph.D., CHP Center for Health & the Environment University of California, Davis One Shields Avenue Davis, CA 95616 E-Mail: ograabe at ucdavis.edu Phone: (530) 752-7754 FAX: (530) 758-6140 *********************************************** From mavrokp at otenet.gr Fri Dec 23 10:23:41 2005 From: mavrokp at otenet.gr (Paris M) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 18:23:41 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] IAEA Printed Material Stolen? Message-ID: <000201c607e1$e79deac0$e1b2673e@HP26370125339> I would like to pose a security question concerning printed IAEA material (IAEA Publications). If IAEA downloadable and printed material like TECDOCS and SAFETY SERIES is mysteriously missing or perhaps stolen then what can we conclude from the security point of view? What actions (if any) must follow? With Appreciation PIM Medical Physicist From sandyfl at earthlink.net Fri Dec 23 11:13:55 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 09:13:55 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] IAEA Printed Material Stolen? In-Reply-To: <000201c607e1$e79deac0$e1b2673e@HP26370125339> Message-ID: <43ABBFD3.20939.C6DB3@localhost> On 23 Dec 2005 at 18:23, Paris M wrote: > I would like to pose a security question concerning printed IAEA > material (IAEA Publications). > > If IAEA downloadable and printed material like TECDOCS and SAFETY > SERIES is mysteriously missing or perhaps stolen then what can we > conclude from the security point of view? > > What actions (if any) must follow? I am not sure what you are asking. I assume that the documents you are referring to our on-line and available from the IAEA website. If that is the case, are these documents not public information? Are these downloadable from a log-on with password? If the documents are not available, perhaps there is a server issue, or, the link to the documents have been removed. I am not sure that this is a security issue, and if these are public domain documents, there is definitely not a security issue. Perhaps you can provide additional details? ---------------------------------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From didi at tgi-sci.com Fri Dec 23 11:39:36 2005 From: didi at tgi-sci.com (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Dimiter=20Popoff?=) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 19:39:36 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Re: IAEA Printed Material Stolen? Message-ID: <20051223173936.24654.qmail@server318.com> I am really inexperienced in that administrative sort of things, but stealing downloadable (publically available, if I understand it correctly) material strikes me as pointless? Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ > -------Original Message------- > From: Paris M > Subject: [ RadSafe ] IAEA Printed Material Stolen? > Sent: Dec 23 '05 18:23 > > I would like to pose a security question concerning printed IAEA material (IAEA Publications). > > If IAEA downloadable and printed material like TECDOCS and SAFETY SERIES is mysteriously missing or perhaps stolen then what can we conclude from the security point of view? > > What actions (if any) must follow? > > > > With Appreciation > > PIM > > Medical Physicist > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From idias at interchange.ubc.ca Fri Dec 23 11:42:29 2005 From: idias at interchange.ubc.ca (John R Johnson) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 09:42:29 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] IAEA Printed Material Stolen? In-Reply-To: <000201c607e1$e79deac0$e1b2673e@HP26370125339> Message-ID: PIM What do you mean by "mysteriously missing or perhaps stolen"? _________________ John R Johnson, Ph.D. ***** President, IDIAS, Inc 4535 West 9-Th Ave Vancouver B. C. V6R 2E2 (604) 222-9840 idias at interchange.ubc.ca ***** or most mornings Consultant in Radiation Protection TRIUMF 4004 Wesbrook Mall Vancouver B. C. V6R 2E2 (604) 222-1047 Ext. 6610 Fax: (604) 222-7309 johnsjr at triumf.ca -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl]On Behalf Of Paris M Sent: December 23, 2005 8:24 AM To: RadiatSafety Subject: [ RadSafe ] IAEA Printed Material Stolen? I would like to pose a security question concerning printed IAEA material (IAEA Publications). If IAEA downloadable and printed material like TECDOCS and SAFETY SERIES is mysteriously missing or perhaps stolen then what can we conclude from the security point of view? What actions (if any) must follow? With Appreciation PIM Medical Physicist _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From goldinem at songs.sce.com Fri Dec 23 12:09:54 2005 From: goldinem at songs.sce.com (goldinem at songs.sce.com) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 10:09:54 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 Message-ID: Regarding the Mangano claim that Vermont rainwater gross beta levels have increased over the years (due presumably to the operation of Vermont Yankee), Health Physics just published a paper on the analysis of 22 years of air samples in New York State (Health Phys. 90 (1): 31-37; 2006. Kitto, et al, Long-Term Monitoring of Radioactivity in Surface Air and Deposition in New York State). Great stuff, all kinds of conclusions about how weather patterns affect gross beta and airborne cosmogenic radioactivity. Note the sample locations were selected in part because of proximity to three New York nuclear power plant sites. However, the only anthropogenic (wow, what a word) radionuclides were correlated with sewage sludge incineration and a tritium-processing facility. Also noteworthy, some analyses were conducted specifically for Sr-90 and/or Sr-89. Nothing was ever detected in any samples so "they will not be discussed further." So much for increasing trends in environmental strontium and baby teeth. By the way, the final argument by Mangano about "increased generation" by these "aging" power plants is actually quite wrong. When plants run well, as indicated by a 95% capacity factor, airborne releases are typically reduced. Startups and shutdowns are usually responsible for greater effluent releases. So the "increased" Sr-90 in rainwater (if true, which I doubt) is negatively correlated with Vermont Yankee's operation. Plus I'm quite sure that VY's Radiological Environmental Monitoring Program confirms no radiological impact from plant operation on the local environs. Eric M. Goldin, CHP From farbersa at optonline.net Fri Dec 23 15:26:10 2005 From: farbersa at optonline.net (farbersa at optonline.net) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 16:26:10 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Happy Holidays to all: If it were not for the fact that Mangano is so effective in fooling gullible members of the media and the public with his unscientific claims related to his being a 2nd generation Sternglass wannabe, his "claims" would be laughable. However, in relation to his claims, the EPA has not even had a consistent network of rainwater monitoring over the past 20 years because there has been nothing worth monitoring outside of a brief period in the aftermath of the Chernobyl accident. As an example of the absurdity of Mangano's environmental radioactivity claims in relation to Vermont Yankee, back in 1989-90, I carried out a small study of Cs-137 in woodash derived from home fireplace burning of mature hardwoods all over the US. Several samples were collected from Vermont. One came from my own fireplace at a vacation home I had in Warren, VT over 100 miles from Vermont Yankee. The Cs-137 measured was approx. 15,000 picoCuries per kg of ash after hardwoods grown from the area around Warren, VT were burned and analyzed by quantitative gamma spec analysis. Another sample of wood ash collected from the burning of mature hardwoods growing around Vermont Yankee, was found to have only 1,500 picoCuries of Cs-137 per kg of woodash --or 1/10 the concentration of Cs-137 100 miles to the north, no where near a nuclear plant. Hmmmm. All the Cs-137 being measured in woodash in my study was derived from the deposition of fallout from open air testing of nuclear weapons which ended [except for a few small open air tests by the Chinese] and the Chernobyl fallout in 1986 [which added about 1% to the pre-existing Cs-137 deposition in New England based on my extensive review of environmental rad data gathered around all the nuclear plants in New England]. Actual areal deposition of Cs-137 around New England is fairly constant and cannot account for the 10 fold variability of Cs-137 measured in woodash from samples only 100 miles apart. The factors that appear to make a difference in the Cs-137 level in biomass are the potassium levels in soil [low K, high Cs-137 uptake] and the stable Cs variability [high stable Cs in soil, high uptake of Cs-137 from soil to plant -too complex to explain this counterintuitive behavior here] in soil from one location to another. Any Sr-90 deposition in the environment would be in proportion to the Cs-137 given the relatively constant ratio of Sr-90/Cs-137 in fresh fallout. So given the 10 fold lower concentration of Cs-137 in biomass near Vermont Yankee measured in woodash, are we to conclude that being in the proximity to a nuclear plant operating almost 20 years since 1972 to 1990, reduced Cs-137 [and perhaps Sr-90] in the environment?? :-) Perhaps the intake of air into the Vermont Yankee plant, and its filtration before discharge up the stack cleans up the local environment? Offered for your amusement only. But we could make an argument of this sort that has absolutely no significance if we wanted to have some fun and mislead gullible readers. If we wanted to play the games Mangano enjoys playing, we could argue based on real environmental data that running a nuclear plant for 20 or so years reduces Cs-137 in the nearby environment dramatically vs. a background area 100 miles away. Is this true. Of course not. It is just an indication of how variable environmental radioactivity including Cs-137 and Sr-90 in biomass and other biota can be from one location to another. If you pick your data points selectively, or look at narrow windows of time for one set of measurements vs. another, you can make "conclusions" that appear credible on a first glance, but which are only supported by that one set of data. Going back to 1972, the National Academy of Science harshly criticicized Dr. Ernest Sternglass and his inflammatory claims because his claims were based on choosing only data which supported his hypothesis and ignoring data which did not. Mangano has learned a lot from his mentor Dr. Sternglass and is doing the same intellectually dishonest, and unscientific manipulations that led to Dr. Sternglass being chastised in an Appendix to the National Academy of Sciences 1972 Biological Effects of Ionizing Radiation [BEIR] report. Stewart Farber, MS Public Health Consulting Scientist radproject at optonline.net [203] 367-0791 ----- Original Message ----- From: goldinem at songs.sce.com Date: Friday, December 23, 2005 1:09 pm Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 > > Regarding the Mangano claim that Vermont rainwater gross beta > levels have > increased over the years (due presumably to the operation of Vermont > Yankee), Health Physics just published a paper on the analysis of > 22 years > of air samples in New York State (Health Phys. 90 (1): 31-37; > 2006. Kitto, > et al, Long-Term Monitoring of Radioactivity in Surface Air and > Depositionin New York State). Great stuff, all kinds of > conclusions about how > weather patterns affect gross beta and airborne cosmogenic > radioactivity.Note the sample locations were selected in part > because of proximity to > three New York nuclear power plant sites. However, the only > anthropogenic(wow, what a word) radionuclides were correlated with > sewage sludge > incineration and a tritium-processing facility. Also noteworthy, some > analyses were conducted specifically for Sr-90 and/or Sr-89. > Nothing was > ever detected in any samples so "they will not be discussed > further." So > much for increasing trends in environmental strontium and baby teeth. > > By the way, the final argument by Mangano about "increased > generation" by > these "aging" power plants is actually quite wrong. When plants > run well, > as indicated by a 95% capacity factor, airborne releases are typically > reduced. Startups and shutdowns are usually responsible for greater > effluent releases. So the "increased" Sr-90 in rainwater (if > true, which I > doubt) is negatively correlated with Vermont Yankee's operation. > Plus I'm > quite sure that VY's Radiological Environmental Monitoring Program > confirmsno radiological impact from plant operation on the local > environs. > Eric M. Goldin, CHP > From gaitan at impulsedevices.com Fri Dec 23 15:30:07 2005 From: gaitan at impulsedevices.com (Felipe Gaitan) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 13:30:07 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Background from Static Electricity in Tritium counters Message-ID: Dear Radsafers, Does any body have a suggestion for minimizing the effects of static electricity in tritium counters? I'm using glass vials. The effect has become obvious since the weather turned cold and subsequently the air became drier. I can measure the background slowing decreasing over a couple of days as long as I leave the vial in the counter. As soon as I take it out and then put it back, the background counts jump up again, sometimes by as much as a factor of two. It appears to affect some vials and not others. Thanks for your help, Felipe -- D. Felipe Gaitan, Ph.D. Chief Scientific Officer Impulse Devices, Inc. 13366 Grass Valley Av. Unit H Grass Valley, CA 95945 Phone: 530-273-6500 Ext. 112 Fax: 806-498-6731 email: gaitan at impulsedevices.com From bobcat167 at earthlink.net Fri Dec 23 16:28:03 2005 From: bobcat167 at earthlink.net (Bob) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 15:28:03 -0700 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Background from Static Electricity in Tritium counters In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <012601c60810$24073970$6601a8c0@Bob> Felipe - Try using laundry anti-static wipes (or anti-static spray applied to a lab wipe). You might also need to consider treating the carriers (racks) as well. Do make sure, though, to verify that there are no residues that impact the optical integrity of the scintillation vials. Bob Shannon Kaiser Analytical Management Services Broomfield Colorado 303-432-1137 -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Felipe Gaitan Sent: Friday, December 23, 2005 2:30 PM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] Background from Static Electricity in Tritium counters Dear Radsafers, Does any body have a suggestion for minimizing the effects of static electricity in tritium counters? I'm using glass vials. The effect has become obvious since the weather turned cold and subsequently the air became drier. I can measure the background slowing decreasing over a couple of days as long as I leave the vial in the counter. As soon as I take it out and then put it back, the background counts jump up again, sometimes by as much as a factor of two. It appears to affect some vials and not others. Thanks for your help, Felipe -- D. Felipe Gaitan, Ph.D. Chief Scientific Officer Impulse Devices, Inc. 13366 Grass Valley Av. Unit H Grass Valley, CA 95945 Phone: 530-273-6500 Ext. 112 Fax: 806-498-6731 email: gaitan at impulsedevices.com _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From JGinniver at aol.com Fri Dec 23 16:27:03 2005 From: JGinniver at aol.com (JGinniver at aol.com) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 17:27:03 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Background from Static Electricity in Tritium counters Message-ID: <25c.42dca3b.30ddd3b7@aol.com> Felipe, Am I correct in thinking that you are taling about a liquid scintillation counter? If so it might be worth providing details of the model of counter, make of vials, scintillant cocktail as the issue might be relevant to one of these. I've not encountered problems in the past using both polythene and glass vials. Regards, Julian From lists at richardhess.com Fri Dec 23 16:41:47 2005 From: lists at richardhess.com (Richard L. Hess) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 17:41:47 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Background from Static Electricity in Tritium counters In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <7.0.0.16.2.20051223173227.09914ca8@richardhess.com> Dear Dr. Gaitan, Years and years ago, a product called the Zerostat was made in England. It looks ever so much like a white gun with a large chrome trigger. In the front of the gun is a needle and inside is a piezo electric crystal of some flavour. You squeeze the trigger and it ionizes the air which drains off static. It was originally designed for helping to clean phono records. I have used it for helping with static cling on my wife's dresses. Although it is still working, it wasn't up to the challenge of a large cardboard box filled with foam packing peanuts at 35% RH at 21C. I ended up using a vacuum cleaner and sacrificing a bag to getting all of them out of my room. Anyway, if you could use something like this to discharge the static before the measurement, I wonder if that would help. There is also a spray called "Static Guard" that my wife now uses with her clothes. She prefers that to me shooting her with invisible ions . The Zerostat stays next near my turntable, although I won't admit to restoring discs commercially as I do tapes. I don't know if these excess ions will affect your measurements in other ways, but it's one way of getting rid of small static charges. Another way -- and I suspect that you don't want any of this loose in your facility -- was in the 1960s, you used to be able to purchase anti-static brushes that had a block of polonium in them (I hope I remembered that correctly--it's been close to 40 years since I saw one of those in action). These were for cleaning negatives in photographic darkrooms. Finally, the electronics manufacturing and repair industries have a wide variety of tools and protocols for draining static charges as many semiconductor devices are sensitive to static discharge. There are mats, wrist straps, and I don't know what else, as I've never actually had to spec one of these workstations other than generically. (i.e. provide industry-standard static-safe circuit board rework station). Cheers and best of the season to everyone! Richard At 04:30 PM 12/23/2005, Felipe Gaitan wrote: >Dear Radsafers, > >Does any body have a suggestion for minimizing the effects of static >electricity in tritium counters? > >I'm using glass vials. The effect has become obvious since the >weather turned cold and subsequently the air became drier. I can >measure the background slowing decreasing over a couple of days as >long as I leave the vial in the counter. As soon as I take it out >and then put it back, the background counts jump up again, sometimes >by as much as a factor of two. It appears to affect some vials and not others. Richard L. Hess richard at richardhess.com Aurora, Ontario, Canada http://www.richardhess.com/ Detailed contact information: http://www.richardhess.com/tape/contact.htm From sandyfl at earthlink.net Fri Dec 23 20:06:08 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 18:06:08 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] FBI Official Defends Radiation Monitoring Message-ID: <43AC3C90.2093.45B5BD@localhost> FBI Official Defends Radiation Monitoring WASHINGTON - A classified radiation monitoring program, conducted without warrants, has targeted private U.S. property in an effort to prevent an al-Qaida attack, federal law enforcement officials confirmed Friday. While declining to provide details including the number of cities and sites monitored, the officials said the air monitoring took place since the Sept. 11 attacks and from publicly accessible areas ? which they said made warrants and court orders unnecessary. U.S. News and World Report first reported the program on Friday. The magazine said the monitoring was conducted at more than 100 Muslim sites in the Washington, D.C., area ? including Maryland and Virginia suburbs ? and at least five other cities when threat levels had risen: Chicago, Detroit, Las Vegas, New York and Seattle. The magazine said that at its peak, three vehicles in Washington monitored 120 sites a day, nearly all of them Muslim targets identified by the FBI. Targets included mosques, homes and businesses, the magazine said. The revelation of the surveillance program came just days after The New York Times disclosed that the Bush administration spied on suspected terrorist targets in the United States without court orders. President Bush has said he approved the program to protect Americans from attack. Ibrahim Hooper, spokesman for the Council on American-Islamic Relations, a Washington-based civil rights group, said Friday the program "comes as a complete shock to us and everyone in the Muslim community." "This creates the appearance that Muslims are targeted simply for being Muslims. I don't think this is the message the government wants to send at this time," he said. Hooper said his organization has serious concerns about the constitutionality of monitoring on private property without a court order. Brian Roehrkasse, a Justice Department spokesman, said Friday that the administration "is very concerned with a growing body of sensitive reporting that continues to show al-Qaida has a clear intention to obtain and ultimately use chemical, biological, radiological and nuclear" weapons or high energy explosives. To meet that threat, the government "monitors the air for imminent threats to health and safety," but acts only on specific information about a potential attack without targeting any individual or group, he said. "FBI agents do not intrude across any constitutionally protected areas without the proper legal authority," the spokesman said. In a 2001 decision, the Supreme Court ruled 5-4 that police must get warrants before using devices that search through walls for criminal activity. That decision struck down the use without a warrant of a heat-sensing device that led to marijuana charges against an Oregon man. Roehrkasse said the Justice Department believes that case does not apply to air monitoring in publicly accessible areas. Two federal law enforcement officials, speaking on condition of anonymity because the program is classified, said the monitoring did not occur only at Muslim-related sites. Douglas Kmiec, a professor of constitutional law at Pepperdine University, said the location of the surveillance matters when determining if a court order is needed. "The greatest expectation of privacy is in the home," said Kmiec, a Justice Department official under former presidents Ronald Reagan and George H.W. Bush. "As you move away from the home to a parking lot or a place of public accommodation or an office, there are a set of factors that are a balancing test for the court," he said. Despite federal promises to inform state and local officials of security concerns, that never formally happened with the radiation monitoring program, said an official who spoke on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the information. The official said that after discussions with attorneys, some state and local authorities decided the surveillance was legal, equating it to air quality monitors set up around Washington that regularly sniff for suspicious materials. "They weren't targeting specific people, they were just doing it by random, driving around (commercial) storage sheds and parking lots," the official said. Asked about the program's status, the official said, "I'd understood it had been stopped or significantly rolled back" as early as eight months ago. Such information-sharing with state and local officials is the responsibility of the Homeland Security Department, which spokesman Brian Doyle said was not involved in the program. ------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 E-Mail: sperle at dosimetry.com E-Mail: sandyfl at earthlink.net Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From jim_hoerner at hotmail.com Sat Dec 24 08:06:48 2005 From: jim_hoerner at hotmail.com (Jim Hoerner) Date: Sat, 24 Dec 2005 09:06:48 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] 'Twas the night before Christmas (recycled humor?) Message-ID: An oldie, but a goodie... -------- Original Message ---------------- Man oh man did those stink, Norm. I can do better than that with half my brain tied behind my back. Considering I only have half a brain to start with, that would be quite a handicap. "Rudolph the glowing green reindeer"... Nah. I got it... Here's an original one by me. It stinks, too, so don't bother telling me about it. Saint Nuke and all that. If you enjoy witty humor, you'll hate this. Apologies to Clement Clarke Moore... 'Twas the night before Christmas, when all through the home, Not a lightbulb was burning, 9th night, none shone; The stockings were hung by the chimney with care, They hoped that their neighbors' firewood could be shared; The children were nestled, shivering in their beds, While visions of spoiled pudding haunted their heads; And mamma in her 'kerchief, and I in silk pants, We cursed what had led to this, UNINFORMED ANTI-NUKE RANTS. When out on the lawn, there arose such a clatter, I sprang from the bed to see what was the matter. Away to the window, I flew like a blue flash, Tore open the shutters and threw up the sash. The moon on the breast of the new-fallen snow, A nice, warm, almost Cherenkov-like glow, The solar panels on the roof were producing no power, Because of the snow, and clouds, and the sun doesn't shine at this hour. I looked in the backyard, watching the motionless turbine. I was about to give up all hope for a nice gust of wind. When, what to my wondering eyes should appear, But a miniature sleigh, and eight radioactive reindeer. With a little old driver, so lively and astute, I knew in a moment, IT MUST BE SAINT NUKE. Fast as thermal neutrons, his coursers they came, And he whistled, and shouted, and called them by name; "Now, EINSTEIN! Now, FERMI! Now, PROTON and NEUTRON! On, ATOM! on STRONG FORCE! on, FISSION and FUSION! To the top of the porch! To the top of the wall! Now dash away! Dash away! Dash away all!" Like steam from the cooling towers used to fly, Westchester would not approve as they mounted to the sky, So over to Indian Point, the coursers they flew, With the sleigh full of uranium dioxide, AND SAINT NUCLEUS TOO. And then, in a twinkling, I saw in the distance, The fat man take to his slide rule, what a powerful prince. As I drew in my hand, and was turning around, Into the containment Saint Nucleus went with a bound. He was dressed all in white, from his head to his foot, His protective clothes were not tarnished with ashes and soot; A bundle of UO2 he had flung into the core, He looked into his dosimeter, and then went back for more. The thoughts in his head were really rather droll, He decided to give all the naughty anti-nukes MUCH-DESERVED COAL; He had a broad face and a little round belly, That shook when he laughed like a detector of GeLi. He was chubby and plump, a jolly elf, even if old, And I laughed when I saw him, in spite of the cold; A wink of his eye and a twist of his head, Soon erased all of my irrational fears and dread; He spoke not a word, but went straight to his work, And filled ALL THE CORE; then turned with a jerk, He laid finger to nose, as if to itch, Then he bolted to the control room, where he FLIPPED THE SWITCH; He sprang to his sleigh, to his team he gave a nod, And away they all flew, after raising the last control rod. THANK GOODNESS WE'RE SAVED! No more frost burn or blight! Happy Christmas to all, and to all, GOOD LIGHT! Best wishes for happiness, peace, health, and propserity to all! Particularly, those unable to be with their families for the holidays, folks who aren't rich like me (I eat every day), and any folks whom I have wronged. Jim -- Hold the door for the stranger behind you. When the driver in the adjacent lane signals to get over, slow down. Smile and say "hi" to the folks you pass on the sidewalk. Give blood. Volunteer. --- In Know_Nukes at y..., Norman Cohen wrote: >Subject: anti-nuke carols >Date: Fri Dec 14, 2001 2:05 pm >From the Indian Point folks: (Rudolph the Red Nose Reindeer) In the city of Buchanan There?s a greedy company They own the local nuke plant Really close to you and me None of the other nuke plants Going back in history (are) located near such heavy Population density Then one day the NRC Said something is not right Indian Point your corner stones Are de-gra-ded RED tonight None of the other nuke plants Going back in history (are) located near such heavy Population density (I Have a Little Dreidel) We have a little nuke plant We wish would go away But they don?t want to close it They think it still can pay Close it close it close it Please make it go away Close it close it close it So we can dance and play (Jingle Bells) Shut down nukes Shut down nukes We don?t need the power Guarded by security That costs more by the hour Shut down nukes Shut down nukes We don?t need the power Now?s the time to close the plants Before it all goes sour We don?t need the fear We don?t need the risk We don?t need the vulner?bility to terrorists We can close them down We can do what?s right We can find alternatives That let us sleep at night Shut down nukes? (Silent Night) Indian Point Indian Point Radiation does anoint Mothers fathers daughters and sons Radiation affects everyone How can we sleep in peace How can we sleep in peace (We Wish You a Merry Christmas) We wish you would shut the nuke plants We wish you would shut the nuke plants We wish you would shut the nuke plants For a Happy New Year (2X) Petitions we bring to you NRC We wish you would shut the nuke plants For a happy New Year From bobcat167 at earthlink.net Sat Dec 24 15:43:48 2005 From: bobcat167 at earthlink.net (Bob Shannon) Date: Sat, 24 Dec 2005 14:43:48 -0700 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <015a01c608d3$218c91e0$6601a8c0@Bob> Excerpted paragraph from the editorial in the Brattleboro Reformer: Crist's claim contradicts what the federal Environmental Protection Agency has found across the nation. The EPA measures levels of beta-emitting radiation in rainwater each month at about 50 U.S. locations. Since the late 1980s, average beta levels have risen about 40 percent around the nation (one can see reports on www.epa.gov/narel, environmental radiation data). I was intrigued to hear about a dramatic rise in gross beta activity in rainwater so I decided to followed Mr. Mangano's invitation to take a look at the referenced data. I accessed the database (downloaded all >10,000 gross beta results for precipitation at 67 different locations from the ten different EPA regions since 1977 - an exercise in patience). I figured that the best way to start would be to check for a trend in the data. I excluded all data prior 1990 (thus the time frame coincides with that referenced) and normalized all the results for each location to the earliest result from that location. I plotted all 6200+ normalized results on a single chart and fit a trendline to the data. Based on my (admittedly quick and dirty) analysis of what appears to be the same dataset used by Mr. Mangano, I would conclude that there is no evidence of a positive trend, let alone indications of a 40% increase in gross beta since the late 1980's. In fact, the fitted line trends slightly downward. The slope is so negligible, though, that I would more fairly characterize it as 'flat'. (Without spending more time doing statistics, I decided to let it be at that.) Originally, I expected that if there was a change in Gross Beta results, the result would possibly an artifact of changes in calibration nuclides, etc., over the years and that I might have to dig into the isotopic data to get a more meaningful answer. For the time being though, I guess I won't invest any more time looking for evidence to corroborate a trend that does not appear to exist. If I am missing something, I still have a whole lot of data here. Let me know and I can take a second run at the data. Bob Shannon BobShannon91 at earthlink.net Kaiser Analytical Management Services Broomfield, Colorado 303-432-1137 -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Jim Hoerner Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2005 7:19 PM To: Know_Nukes at yahoogroups.com Cc: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 [Sorry if this has already been posted to RadSafe; I get the digest. I would appreciate any solid debunking, which should probably be fairly easy since Mangano's calulator has been broken for a while. I don't have the time to do it myself in the near future. Thanks. - JH] Article Published: Tuesday, December 20, 2005 - 2:15:20 AM EST Radiation levels measured in rainwater Editor of the Reformer: Vermont state health official Larry Crist is quoted as saying there has been no increase in environmental radiation levels near the Vermont Yankee nuclear plant since the 1970s, when the plant opened ("Studies differ on radiation levels near VY," Reformer, Nov. 29). Crist's claim contradicts what the federal Environmental Protection Agency has found across the nation. The EPA measures levels of beta-emitting radiation in rainwater each month at about 50 U.S. locations. Since the late 1980s, average beta levels have risen about 40 percent around the nation (one can see reports on www.epa.gov/narel, environmental radiation data). While no EPA monitoring stations are located in Vermont, the closest ones are in Concord, N.H. and Hartford Conn., 50 and 60 miles from Vermont Yankee. Beta levels in both locations are increasing, similar to the nation. The EPA finding that beta levels are rising corresponds to our research group's study of Strontium-90 in baby teeth, the levels of which jumped around the nation since the late 1980s. Nuclear reactors in this country are aging, and being operated more of the time. Vermont Yankee, the 10th oldest of 103 U.S. reactors, has operated at 95 percent of capacity in the past six years, versus only 83 percent before that. Meanwhile, cancer death rates in Windham County are rising even though they are falling elsewhere in the state. We need to understand whether running an old reactor like Vermont Yankee into the ground is putting more radiation into our environment and bodies and making us more likely to become cancer victims. Health officials like Crist need to present their results publicly, to better understand these crucial matters. Joseph J. Mangano, National Coordinator Radiation and Public Health Project Norristown, Pa., Dec. 5 http://www.reformer.com/Stories/0,1413,102~8855~3173752,00.html -- Hold the door for the stranger behind you. When the driver in the adjacent lane signals to get over, slow down. Smile and say "hi" to the folks you pass on the sidewalk. Give blood. Volunteer. _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From BLHamrick at aol.com Sat Dec 24 19:30:10 2005 From: BLHamrick at aol.com (BLHamrick at aol.com) Date: Sat, 24 Dec 2005 20:30:10 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 Message-ID: <294.2c61f11.30df5022@aol.com> In a message dated 12/24/2005 2:00:48 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, bobcat167 at earthlink.net writes: Originally, I expected that if there was a change in Gross Beta results, the result would possibly an artifact of changes in calibration nuclides, etc., over the years and that I might have to dig into the isotopic data to get a more meaningful answer. For the time being though, I guess I won't invest any more time looking for evidence to corroborate a trend that does not appear to exist. If I am missing something, I still have a whole lot of data here. Let me know and I can take a second run at the data. Thank you for taking the time to do this. I really wanted to, but knew I just didn't have the time right now. I expected to find pretty much what you describe. No trend. The problem with Mangano-types is that they can often get away with histrionic claims, because actually doing the work to examine the data is very tedious and time-consuming, and most professional HPs simply don't have that kind of "spare" time to spend, solely to refute these types of claims. In truth, I expect that if we did make a concerted professional effort to put some of this nonsense to rest, we would actually save time and money in the long run. Barbara L. Hamrick, CHP, JD From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Sat Dec 24 21:37:40 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Sat, 24 Dec 2005 19:37:40 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question In-Reply-To: <001601c6029e$2998b5c0$5330e345@domainnotset.invalid> Message-ID: <20051225033740.55443.qmail@web54313.mail.yahoo.com> Jerry, It appears that 70Bq/g (approximately 2 nCi/gm is more liberal than your < 1.0 nCi/gm. Obviously, the LNT had no part in the NRC's decision, otherwise they would have picked your more conservative limit. --- jjcohen at prodigy.net wrote: > Several years ago, we did a study for the NRC, that > recommended that > anything <1.0 nci/g (regardless of the > radionuclides(s) involved) could be > considered "essentially not radioactive" for > regulatory purposes. They did > not accept the recommendation, largely due to > prevailing LNT beliefs. Just > out of curiosity, does anyone know of any dire > health and safety > consequence that might have resulted if this > recommendation had been > implemented. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Friday, December 16, 2005 2:07 PM > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question > > > > recently eBay the online auction site has "banned > radioactive" items from > > their site. In a recent letter to a person > offering unprocessed ores on > the site > > (a seemingly common practice) the following > statement was made by eBay. > > > > "Please also remember that anything that has a > specific activity greater > > than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is > not permitted on eBay > under > > any conditions." > > > > So to that end I pose this question. Why the above > "limit" what makes 70 > Bq > > the "magic number" or rather might there be a > "scientific basis for such a > > "limit"? > > > > Thanks. > > > > Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET > > FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI > > LNMolino at aol.com > > 979-690-7559 (Office) > > 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) > > 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) > > > > "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" > > > > The comments contained in this E-mail are the > opinions of the author and > the > > author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak > for any person or > > organization that I am in any way whatsoever > involved or associated with > unless I > > specifically state that I am doing so. Further > this E-mail is intended > only for its > > stated recipient and may contain private and or > confidential materials > > retransmission is strictly prohibited unless > placed in the public domain > by the > > original author. > > _______________________________________________ > > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe > mailing list > > > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to > have read and understood > the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe > and other settings > visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing > list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have > read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be > found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe > and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL ? Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com From MosheK at sviva.gov.il Sun Dec 25 03:22:48 2005 From: MosheK at sviva.gov.il (=?windows-1255?Q?=EE=F9=E4_=F7=F8=EF____Moshe_Keren?=) Date: Sun, 25 Dec 2005 11:22:48 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Radiation detectors at ports Message-ID: <2724DA0176E72D40880EB245D28AFC5001196B93@moe_exch.sviva.gov.il> Happy Hanuca to all, This was posted at May 16: "Robert Bonner, commissioner of U.S. Customs and Border Protection, told a Senate subcommittee on homeland security that since the first such devices were installed in May 2000, they had picked up over 10,000 radiation hits in vehicles or cargo shipments entering the country. All proved harmless." Has any one an idea what were the radiation levels caused those hits, was cargo type considered (bannanas, fertilizers, etc.), what about patients with residues of radioactive material or implanted barchitherapy sources? Regards, Moshe Keren ISRAEL From mavrokp at otenet.gr Sun Dec 25 12:59:09 2005 From: mavrokp at otenet.gr (Paris M) Date: Sun, 25 Dec 2005 20:59:09 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] IAEA Printed Material Stolen? References: Message-ID: <000701c60985$69e31d30$c46aa7c3@HP26370125339> Mysteriously=Impossible to determine how and when the IAEA documents have disappeared form a certain place. Missing =the first logical conclusion is that this material has been lost Stolen= failure of all efforts to find the printed material (and a few VERY weird events) forces me to examine the extreme (?) possibility of being stolen ----- Original Message ----- From: "John R Johnson" To: "Paris M" ; "RadiatSafety" Sent: Friday, December 23, 2005 7:42 PM Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] IAEA Printed Material Stolen? > PIM > > What do you mean by "mysteriously missing or perhaps stolen"? > > _________________ > John R Johnson, Ph.D. > ***** > President, IDIAS, Inc > 4535 West 9-Th Ave > Vancouver B. C. > V6R 2E2 > (604) 222-9840 > idias at interchange.ubc.ca > ***** > or most mornings > Consultant in Radiation Protection > TRIUMF > 4004 Wesbrook Mall > Vancouver B. C. > V6R 2E2 > (604) 222-1047 Ext. 6610 > Fax: (604) 222-7309 > johnsjr at triumf.ca > > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl]On > Behalf > Of Paris M > Sent: December 23, 2005 8:24 AM > To: RadiatSafety > Subject: [ RadSafe ] IAEA Printed Material Stolen? > > > I would like to pose a security question concerning printed IAEA material > (IAEA Publications). > > If IAEA downloadable and printed material like TECDOCS and SAFETY SERIES > is > mysteriously missing or perhaps stolen then what can we conclude from the > security point of view? > > What actions (if any) must follow? > > > > With Appreciation > > PIM > > Medical Physicist > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > the > RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > visit: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > > From bobcherry at cox.net Mon Dec 26 13:05:25 2005 From: bobcherry at cox.net (bobcherry at cox.net) Date: Mon, 26 Dec 2005 14:05:25 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 Message-ID: <20051226190359.DCYI29285.eastrmmtao03.cox.net@[172.18.52.8]> Stewart's comment below gave me an idea. Internet newsgroups and listservers often have awards voted upon by their members. Should Radsafe have an annual "St******ss Disinformation Award"? Actually, I am hesitant to name it after anyone for liability reasons. If this is deemed a good idea, we would have to come up with an appropriate name, a nomination process, a voting process, and, hopefully, a process for publicizing it to the media. Just a thought, and I am not prepared to run this program. Bob >>If it were not for the fact that Mangano is so effective in fooling gullible members of the media and the public with his unscientific claims related to his being a 2nd generation Sternglass wannabe, From jimm at WPI.EDU Mon Dec 26 17:57:10 2005 From: jimm at WPI.EDU (Muckerheide, James) Date: Mon, 26 Dec 2005 18:57:10 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 Message-ID: <71A6142F930A1E4C9300D4088D9765C85FF7C9@EXCHDB.admin.wpi.edu> You could call it the "Sternman and Gofass Disinformation Award"!? :-) Regards, Jim Muckerheide > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On > Behalf Of bobcherry at cox.net > Sent: Monday, December 26, 2005 2:05 PM > To: radsafe at radlab.nl > Subject: Re: Re: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 > > Stewart's comment below gave me an idea. Internet newsgroups and > listservers often have awards voted upon by their members. Should Radsafe > have an annual "St******ss Disinformation Award"? > > Actually, I am hesitant to name it after anyone for liability reasons. If > this is deemed a good idea, we would have to come up with an appropriate > name, a nomination process, a voting process, and, hopefully, a process > for publicizing it to the media. > > Just a thought, and I am not prepared to run this program. > > Bob > > > >>If it were not for the fact that Mangano is so effective in fooling > gullible > members of the media and the public with his unscientific claims related > to his > being a 2nd generation Sternglass wannabe, > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Mon Dec 26 18:34:52 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 00:34:52 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980; disinformation must be corrected by relentless effort In-Reply-To: <20051226190359.DCYI29285.eastrmmtao03.cox.net@[172.18.52.8]> Message-ID: <20051227003452.99488.qmail@web26409.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear friends, Specialists in health physics and radiological protection are members of a totally isolated community. Most of them have a smug feeling that a few individuals remaining in isolation cannot do much damage. The individuals who come up with fresh findings to stoke the fears of lay public knew exactly what they are doing. They must be nailed not by isolating them, but by following them up constantly. It is a thankless job. Instituting " disinformation awards" may make them martyrs. Specialists may identify these "martyrs", effortlessly. But what about the public who willingly become victims of their propaganda. We will be successful only if they are exposed by the discerning members of the public. Those who wanted to scare the public choose the right subject, the right audience and proceed with their task with evangelic zeal. Their arguments seldom stand scientific scrutiny. Their task is easy. All they have to do is to appeal to the heart and not to the head. While they address women, they talk about leukemic children, birth defects,generations which will suffer from unknown maladies! I understand that many surveys have shown that women are more sympathetic to their cause. The biggest problem we face is isolation from the mainstream. When we get well integrated into the community at large,our credibility will improve, public will trust us.Those who promoted "nuclear" science and related technology in the early years contributed immensely, but part of these contributions was admittedly negative. It will take years of effort to remove ignorance. A geiger counter put to effective use can dispel ignorance; glossy brochures may not. My two cents worth K.S.Parthasarathy Raja Ramanna Fellow Department of Atomic Energy GN 18, Vikram Sarabhai Bhavan Mumbai 400094 bobcherry at cox.net wrote: Stewart's comment below gave me an idea. Internet newsgroups and listservers often have awards voted upon by their members. Should Radsafe have an annual "St******ss Disinformation Award"? Actually, I am hesitant to name it after anyone for liability reasons. If this is deemed a good idea, we would have to come up with an appropriate name, a nomination process, a voting process, and, hopefully, a process for publicizing it to the media. Just a thought, and I am not prepared to run this program. Bob >>If it were not for the fact that Mangano is so effective in fooling gullible members of the media and the public with his unscientific claims related to his being a 2nd generation Sternglass wannabe, _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- Yahoo! Messenger NEW - crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail From Peter.Sandgren at po.state.ct.us Tue Dec 27 08:17:24 2005 From: Peter.Sandgren at po.state.ct.us (Sandgren, Peter) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 09:17:24 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 Message-ID: I hope some of you learned folks have also sent your highly informative letters to the publications that have seen fit to print Mangano's unscientific claims. For my 2 cents, I believe that anybody who announces he/she has scientific and controversial "information" to share will always find a reporter or newspaper to put their claims in print. The best defense and the strongest safeguard we have is the knowledge and experience of you folks on radsafe. For every distorted claim that makes it into print, if two or three letters (with supporting scientific references) come to contradict those claims, at least one of those letters will be printed, and rad-fearful minds will be calmed. These email rebuttals that come into radsafe could, with a little polishing, go far to hold back the tide of fear that threatens to close nuclear plants around the country. So, thanks to all of you who take the time to write! Please keep it up, and send them on to the newspapers. Most papers will accept email letters as long as the name and address (and credentials!) of the writer are included. Happy New Year to all, Peter Sandgren -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of farbersa at optonline.net Sent: Friday, December 23, 2005 4:26 PM To: goldinem at songs.sce.com Cc: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 Happy Holidays to all: If it were not for the fact that Mangano is so effective in fooling gullible members of the media and the public with his unscientific claims related to his being a 2nd generation Sternglass wannabe, his "claims" would be laughable. However, in relation to his claims, the EPA has not even had a consistent network of rainwater monitoring over the past 20 years because there has been nothing worth monitoring outside of a brief period in the aftermath of the Chernobyl accident. As an example of the absurdity of Mangano's environmental radioactivity claims in relation to Vermont Yankee, back in 1989-90, I carried out a small study of Cs-137 in woodash derived from home fireplace burning of mature hardwoods all over the US. Several samples were collected from Vermont. One came from my own fireplace at a vacation home I had in Warren, VT over 100 miles from Vermont Yankee. The Cs-137 measured was approx. 15,000 picoCuries per kg of ash after hardwoods grown from the area around Warren, VT were burned and analyzed by quantitative gamma spec analysis. Another sample of wood ash collected from the burning of mature hardwoods growing around Vermont Yankee, was found to have only 1,500 picoCuries of Cs-137 per kg of woodash --or 1/10 the concentration of Cs-137 100 miles to the north, no where near a nuclear plant. Hmmmm. All the Cs-137 being measured in woodash in my study was derived from the deposition of fallout from open air testing of nuclear weapons which ended [except for a few small open air tests by the Chinese] and the Chernobyl fallout in 1986 [which added about 1% to the pre-existing Cs-137 deposition in New England based on my extensive review of environmental rad data gathered around all the nuclear plants in New England]. Actual areal deposition of Cs-137 around New England is fairly constant and cannot account for the 10 fold variability of Cs-137 measured in woodash from samples only 100 miles apart. The factors that appear to make a difference in the Cs-137 level in biomass are the potassium levels in soil [low K, high Cs-137 uptake] and the stable Cs variability [high stable Cs in soil, high uptake of Cs-137 from soil to plant -too complex to explain this counterintuitive behavior here] in soil from one location to another. Any Sr-90 deposition in the environment would be in proportion to the Cs-137 given the relatively constant ratio of Sr-90/Cs-137 in fresh fallout. So given the 10 fold lower concentration of Cs-137 in biomass near Vermont Yankee measured in woodash, are we to conclude that being in the proximity to a nuclear plant operating almost 20 years since 1972 to 1990, reduced Cs-137 [and perhaps Sr-90] in the environment?? :-) Perhaps the intake of air into the Vermont Yankee plant, and its filtration before discharge up the stack cleans up the local environment? Offered for your amusement only. But we could make an argument of this sort that has absolutely no significance if we wanted to have some fun and mislead gullible readers. If we wanted to play the games Mangano enjoys playing, we could argue based on real environmental data that running a nuclear plant for 20 or so years reduces Cs-137 in the nearby environment dramatically vs. a background area 100 miles away. Is this true. Of course not. It is just an indication of how variable environmental radioactivity including Cs-137 and Sr-90 in biomass and other biota can be from one location to another. If you pick your data points selectively, or look at narrow windows of time for one set of measurements vs. another, you can make "conclusions" that appear credible on a first glance, but which are only supported by that one set of data. Going back to 1972, the National Academy of Science harshly criticicized Dr. Ernest Sternglass and his inflammatory claims because his claims were based on choosing only data which supported his hypothesis and ignoring data which did not. Mangano has learned a lot from his mentor Dr. Sternglass and is doing the same intellectually dishonest, and unscientific manipulations that led to Dr. Sternglass being chastised in an Appendix to the National Academy of Sciences 1972 Biological Effects of Ionizing Radiation [BEIR] report. Stewart Farber, MS Public Health Consulting Scientist radproject at optonline.net [203] 367-0791 ----- Original Message ----- From: goldinem at songs.sce.com Date: Friday, December 23, 2005 1:09 pm Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 > > Regarding the Mangano claim that Vermont rainwater gross beta > levels have > increased over the years (due presumably to the operation of Vermont > Yankee), Health Physics just published a paper on the analysis of > 22 years > of air samples in New York State (Health Phys. 90 (1): 31-37; > 2006. Kitto, > et al, Long-Term Monitoring of Radioactivity in Surface Air and > Depositionin New York State). Great stuff, all kinds of > conclusions about how > weather patterns affect gross beta and airborne cosmogenic > radioactivity.Note the sample locations were selected in part > because of proximity to > three New York nuclear power plant sites. However, the only > anthropogenic(wow, what a word) radionuclides were correlated with > sewage sludge > incineration and a tritium-processing facility. Also noteworthy, some > analyses were conducted specifically for Sr-90 and/or Sr-89. > Nothing was > ever detected in any samples so "they will not be discussed > further." So > much for increasing trends in environmental strontium and baby teeth. > > By the way, the final argument by Mangano about "increased > generation" by > these "aging" power plants is actually quite wrong. When plants > run well, > as indicated by a 95% capacity factor, airborne releases are typically > reduced. Startups and shutdowns are usually responsible for greater > effluent releases. So the "increased" Sr-90 in rainwater (if > true, which I > doubt) is negatively correlated with Vermont Yankee's operation. > Plus I'm > quite sure that VY's Radiological Environmental Monitoring Program > confirmsno radiological impact from plant operation on the local > environs. > Eric M. Goldin, CHP > _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From DonJordan at ramservicesinc.com Tue Dec 27 08:50:36 2005 From: DonJordan at ramservicesinc.com (Don Jordan) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 08:50:36 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Background from Static Electricity in Tritium counters References: Message-ID: <002c01c60af4$e5cea160$4501a8c0@RAMSERVICE1> Using natural latex gloves causes a lot of static problems. Switching to nitrile gloves will solve the problem. I believe that vinyl gloves also do not cause static, but I have not used them. The fabric softener wipes will eventually deposit a lot of crud in your scintillation counter. My experience with static is that one gets very erratic counts. In one count you'll get 10,000 counts, the next one will be a few hundred, and the one after that will be 20,000. The problem you describe sounds more like chemiluminescence, except for the increase when you remove a vial from the counter. This sounds more like phosphorescence caused by fluorescent lights or direct sunlight. Don Jordan RAM Services, Inc. 510 County Highway V Two Rivers, WI 54241 DonJordan at ramservicesinc.com Voice: +1-920-686-3889 From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Tue Dec 27 10:27:54 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 08:27:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051227162754.86101.qmail@web54308.mail.yahoo.com> Peter, I think your idea is good, but most people on this list would rather talk the subject to death within the list. --- "Sandgren, Peter" wrote: > I hope some of you learned folks have also sent your > highly informative > letters to the publications that have seen fit to > print Mangano's > unscientific claims. For my 2 cents, I believe that > anybody who > announces he/she has scientific and controversial > "information" to share > will always find a reporter or newspaper to put > their claims in print. > > The best defense and the strongest safeguard we have > is the knowledge > and experience of you folks on radsafe. For every > distorted claim that > makes it into print, if two or three letters (with > supporting scientific > references) come to contradict those claims, at > least one of those > letters will be printed, and rad-fearful minds will > be calmed. These > email rebuttals that come into radsafe could, with a > little polishing, > go far to hold back the tide of fear that threatens > to close nuclear > plants around the country. So, thanks to all of you > who take the time > to write! Please keep it up, and send them on to > the newspapers. Most > papers will accept email letters as long as the name > and address (and > credentials!) of the writer are included. > > Happy New Year to all, > Peter Sandgren > > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl > [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On > Behalf Of farbersa at optonline.net > Sent: Friday, December 23, 2005 4:26 PM > To: goldinem at songs.sce.com > Cc: radsafe at radlab.nl > Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels > Up 40% Since 1980 > > Happy Holidays to all: > > If it were not for the fact that Mangano is so > effective in fooling > gullible members of the media and the public with > his unscientific > claims related to his being a 2nd generation > Sternglass wannabe, his > "claims" would be laughable. > > However, in relation to his claims, the EPA has not > even had a > consistent network of rainwater monitoring over the > past 20 years > because there has been nothing worth monitoring > outside of a brief > period in the aftermath of the Chernobyl accident. > > As an example of the absurdity of Mangano's > environmental radioactivity > claims in relation to Vermont Yankee, back in > 1989-90, I carried out a > small study of Cs-137 in woodash derived from home > fireplace burning of > mature hardwoods all over the US. Several samples > were collected from > Vermont. One came from my own fireplace at a > vacation home I had in > Warren, VT over 100 miles from Vermont Yankee. The > Cs-137 measured was > approx. 15,000 picoCuries per kg of ash after > hardwoods grown from the > area around Warren, VT were burned and analyzed by > quantitative gamma > spec analysis. > > Another sample of wood ash collected from the > burning of mature > hardwoods growing around Vermont Yankee, was found > to have only 1,500 > picoCuries of Cs-137 per kg of woodash --or 1/10 the > concentration of > Cs-137 100 miles to the north, no where near a > nuclear plant. Hmmmm. > > All the Cs-137 being measured in woodash in my study > was derived from > the deposition of fallout from open air testing of > nuclear weapons which > ended [except for a few small open air tests by the > Chinese] and the > Chernobyl fallout in 1986 [which added about 1% to > the pre-existing > Cs-137 deposition in New England based on my > extensive review of > environmental rad data gathered around all the > nuclear plants in New > England]. Actual areal deposition of Cs-137 around > New England is > fairly constant and cannot account for the 10 fold > variability of Cs-137 > measured in woodash from samples only 100 miles > apart. The factors that > appear to make a difference in the Cs-137 level in > biomass are the > potassium levels in soil [low K, high Cs-137 uptake] > and the stable Cs > variability [high stable Cs in soil, high uptake of > Cs-137 from soil to > plant -too complex to explain this counterintuitive > behavior here] in > soil from one location to another. > > Any Sr-90 deposition in the environment would be in > proportion to the > Cs-137 given the relatively constant ratio of > Sr-90/Cs-137 in fresh > fallout. So given the 10 fold lower concentration of > Cs-137 in biomass > near Vermont Yankee measured in woodash, are we to > conclude that being > in the proximity to a nuclear plant operating almost > 20 years since 1972 > to 1990, reduced Cs-137 [and perhaps Sr-90] in the > environment?? :-) > Perhaps the intake of air into the Vermont Yankee > plant, and its > filtration before discharge up the stack cleans up > the local > environment? Offered for your amusement only. But > we could make an > argument of this sort that has absolutely no > significance if we wanted > to have some fun and mislead gullible readers. > > If we wanted to play the games Mangano enjoys > playing, we could argue > based on real environmental data that running a > nuclear plant for 20 or > so years reduces Cs-137 in the nearby environment > dramatically vs. a > background area 100 miles away. Is this true. Of > course not. It is just > an indication of how variable environmental > radioactivity including > Cs-137 and Sr-90 in biomass and other biota can be > from one location to > another. If you pick your data points selectively, > or look at narrow > windows of time for one set of measurements vs. > another, you can make > "conclusions" that appear credible on a first > glance, but which are > only supported by that one set of data. > > Going back to 1972, the National Academy of Science > harshly criticicized > Dr. Ernest Sternglass and his inflammatory claims > because his claims > were based on choosing only data which supported his > hypothesis and > ignoring data which did not. Mangano has learned a > lot from his mentor > Dr. Sternglass and is doing the same intellectually > dishonest, and > unscientific manipulations that led to Dr. > Sternglass being chastised in > an Appendix to the National Academy of Sciences 1972 > Biological Effects > of Ionizing Radiation [BEIR] report. > > > Stewart Farber, MS Public Health > Consulting Scientist > radproject at optonline.net > [203] 367-0791 > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: goldinem at songs.sce.com > Date: Friday, December 23, 2005 1:09 pm > Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up > 40% Since 1980 > > > > > Regarding the Mangano claim that Vermont rainwater > gross beta > > levels have > > increased over the years (due presumably to the > operation of Vermont > > Yankee), Health Physics just published a paper on > the analysis of > > 22 years > > of air samples in New York State (Health Phys. 90 > (1): 31-37; > === message truncated === +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL ? Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com From sandyfl at earthlink.net Tue Dec 27 11:24:16 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 09:24:16 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 In-Reply-To: <20051227162754.86101.qmail@web54308.mail.yahoo.com> References: Message-ID: <43B10840.19659.4930FF@localhost> On 27 Dec 2005 at 8:27, John Jacobus wrote: > I think your idea is good, but most people on this > list would rather talk the subject to death within the > list. John, It's a good thing that there is LNT, Linear Non-Threshold to "pain", per your comment above! ---------------------------------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From franz.schoenhofer at chello.at Tue Dec 27 11:47:27 2005 From: franz.schoenhofer at chello.at (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Franz_Sch=F6nhofer?=) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 18:47:27 +0100 Subject: AW: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP In-Reply-To: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA4A@orsnewea002.fda.gov> Message-ID: <001a01c60b0d$9d63c680$bf572fd5@pc1> Edmond and RADSAFErs, Having returned from a longer stay in Tunesia I find information about the most recent, ridiculous TFP nonsense on RADSAFE - it is a good laugh. As to the analytical aspects of determination of Sr-90 in teeth: We carried out a research programme on retrospective determination of Sr-90 in red-deer antlers (an excellent bioindicator!!) in order to determine the environmental contamination by Sr-90 during the late fifties up to the mid 90's. We developed a method in which we used 1 to 2 g of material from the antlers, using the ultra low-level liquid scintillation counter "Quantulus" and this amount was more than sufficient to perform at least two parallel determinations. The laboratory which performs Sr-90 analyses for the TFP uses a "Quantulus" and as far as I have been able to gather information about the chemical separation methods used, Ra-226 is separated (and anyway hardly present in teeth) and correct protocols are followed. Therefore the results seem to me to be trustworthy. The "gag" with the TFP is that it is an excellent example for how correct data can be easily used to support nonsensical claims, to distort facts, to make ridiculous correlations "confirming" totally wrong statements and how to manipulate scientific evidence and results for self-serving purposes. Best regards, Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone -43-0699-1168-1319 ---------------------------------------------------------------- > -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] Im > Auftrag von Baratta, Edmond J > Gesendet: Dienstag, 06. Dezember 2005 14:47 > An: 'Norm Cohen'; Know_Nukes at yahoogroups.com; Radsafe > Betreff: RE: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP > > I'm always amazed how data is obtained from 'baby' teeth. What 'low- > level' > method is used to for the deter minion of Strontium-90. The U.S. > Environmental Protection Agency had listed as the limits of detection for > Strontium-90 as 2 pCi/kg (0.074 Bq/kg). Certainly the amount of sample > used > must be very small. Do they combine a large amount of teeth or are they > from individual teeth? I would be interested in knowing more about this > method. > From EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV Tue Dec 27 11:57:21 2005 From: EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV (Baratta, Edmond J) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 12:57:21 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Radiation detectors at ports Message-ID: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA7F@orsnewea002.fda.gov> There are several products that cause detectors to register. One is any fruit that contains potassium (Potassium-40) such as bananas. Ceramic tiles contain naturally occurring radionuclides. Concentrated fruit juices and 'wild' mushrooms that contain both Cesium-137 and Potassium-40 from Eastern Europe and/or the former Republics of the USSR. Edmond J. Baratta Radiation Safety Officer Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 Fax: 781-729-3593 edmond.baratta at fda.gov The above are my comments and not those of my Agency! -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of MosheK at sviva.gov.il Sent: Sunday, December 25, 2005 4:23 AM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] Radiation detectors at ports Happy Hanuca to all, This was posted at May 16: "Robert Bonner, commissioner of U.S. Customs and Border Protection, told a Senate subcommittee on homeland security that since the first such devices were installed in May 2000, they had picked up over 10,000 radiation hits in vehicles or cargo shipments entering the country. All proved harmless." Has any one an idea what were the radiation levels caused those hits, was cargo type considered (bannanas, fertilizers, etc.), what about patients with residues of radioactive material or implanted barchitherapy sources? Regards, Moshe Keren ISRAEL _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From LNMolino at aol.com Tue Dec 27 12:23:02 2005 From: LNMolino at aol.com (LNMolino at aol.com) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 13:23:02 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Funny one Message-ID: <8e.34c9a19e.30e2e086@aol.com> The Physics of Santa and His Reindeer No known species of reindeer can fly. BUT there are 300,000 species of living organisms yet to be classified, and while most of these are insects and germs, this does not COMPLETELY rule out flying reindeer which only Santa has ever seen. There are two billion children (persons under 18) in the world. BUT since Santa doesn't appear to handle the Muslim, Hindu, Jewish and Buddhist children, that reduces the workload to 15% of the total ? There are two according to Population Reference Bureau. At an average (census) rate of 3.5 children per household, that's per house homes. One presumes there's at least one good child in each. Santa has 31 hours of Christmas to work with, thanks to the different time zones and the rotation of the earth, assuming he travels east to west (which seems logical). This works out to Santa has 31 h per second. This is to say that for each Christian household with good children, Santa has 1/1000th of a second to park, hop out of the sleigh, jump down the chimney, fill the stockings, distribute the remaining presents under the tree, eat whatever snacks have been left, get back up the chimney, get back into the sleigh and move on to the next house. Assuming that each of these This is to s stops are evenly distributed around the earth (which, of course, we know to be false but for the purposes of our calculations we will accept), we are now talking about stops ar per household, a total trip of 75? million miles, not counting stops to do what most of us must do at least once every per ho plus feeding and etc. This means that Santa's sleigh is moving at 650 miles per second, 3,000 times the speed of sound. For purposes of comparison, the fastest man-made vehicle on earth, the Ulysses space probe, moves at a poky This means t per second - a conventional reindeer can run, tops, per secon per hour. If every one of the 91.8 million homes with good children were to put out a single chocolate chip cookie and an If every glass of glass o the total calories (needless to say other vitamins and minerals) would be approximately the total c (100 for the cookie, give or take, and 125 for the milk, give or take). Multiplying the number of calories per house by the number of homes (225 x 91.8 x 1000000), we get the total number of calories Santa consumes that night, which is 20,655,000,000 calories. To break it down further, (100 is equal to is equal to Dividing our total number of calories by the number of calories in a pound (20655000000/3500) and we get the number of pounds Santa gains, 5901428.6, which is Dividing ou The payload on the sleigh adds another interesting element. Assuming that each child gets nothing more than a medium-sized lego set (two pounds), the sleigh is carrying 321,300 tons, not counting Santa, who is invariably described as overweight. On land, conventional reindeer can pull no more than The payload Even granting that "flying reindeer" (see above) could pull TEN TIMES the normal amount, we cannot do the job with eight, or even nine. We need 214,200 reindeer. This increases the payload (not even counting the weight of the sleigh) - to 353,430 tons. Again, for comparison - this is four times the weight of the Queen Elizabeth. 353,000 tons traveling at Even gra per second creates enormous air resistance - this will heat the reindeer up in the same fashion as spacecraft per seco the earth's atmosphere. The lead pair of reindeer will absorb the earth's atm joules of energy. Per second. Each. In short, they will burst into flame almost instantaneously, exposing the reindeer behind them, and create deafening sonic booms in their wake. The entire reindeer team will be vaporized within In short, they w of a second. Santa, meanwhile, will be subjected to centrifugal forces 17,500.06 times greater than gravity. A 250-pound Santa (which seems ludicrously slim) would be pinned to the back of his sleigh by 4,315,015 pounds of force. In conclusion: If Santa ever DID deliver presents on Christmas Eve, he's dead now. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino at aol.com 979-690-7559 (Office) 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the original author. From farbersa at optonline.net Tue Dec 27 12:54:41 2005 From: farbersa at optonline.net (farbersa at optonline.net) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 13:54:41 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Peter, Your suggestion is a good one. However, just debunking exaggerated or erroneous claims after the fact while vitally important is not enough. It's also important that nuclear endeavors find creative, impactful ways using radiation issues to reach the public, gain their interest, and get across the points that are vital to the public and regulators not fearing every Bq or stray photo bouncing around. On the first point about debunking critics, unfortunately, this objective is made all the more difficult by the fact that corporations that have the most to gain by highlighting the errors and even lies of critics often try to keep a low profile and avoid the public debate. I've sadly witnessed the latter issue, time and again. In one case, I was invited by one company to debate Dr. Najarian who had authored a "study" published by the Boston Globe "Spotlight Investigation Team" claiming a 10 fold excess of leukemia among the Portsmouth Naval Shipyard workers. I put in a request to my then employer to engage in this activity which would have involved an on-air debate on a Boston radio station with the VA physician Najarian who authored the study. I carefully noted in my request I would do it on my own time, would mention I was speaking as a private citizen, and would do it at a time approved by my supervisor so as not to interfere with any priority work. Shortly after making the request to participate in this on-air debate, I was summoned to the Chairman's office of my "public benefit corporation" employer and found myself in a room with a dozen lawyers positioned down the length of a 40 foot table with the Chairman on one end of the table and me on the other. I was told point blank by the Chairman of this multiple nuclear plant operator [and the largest non-Federal power generating company in the US]: "I want you to understand one thing regarding your request. If it ever comes to my attention that you have a made a statement in favor of nuclear energy, you will no longer be an employee of the XY Power Authority." I asked if I might ask one question and was told yes. My question was: "Why?" The answer was: "The Governor of this State does not approve of nuclear energy." Case closed. Subsequently, it took 10 years after a study was dragged out by NIOSH, for it to put out a study where the claims of Najerian were found lacking, and the results criticizing the original claims of a 10 fold excess of leukemia, were buried in the literature with essentially no public outreach. This tendency of many corporations to think that if they avoid getting into the fray and engaging their critics and at the extreme their enemies intent on destroying them, is a large part of why nuclear endeavors have withered. Most companies will not provide any time or support to technical people to get involved in debunking critics and as I have seen will often interfere with a staffperson who is willing to do it on their own time and initiative. Many years later, after I authored a satire during the 1988 election campaign on the "health hazards of Strepdukakis antinucleosis", I was invited to give a talk to the New England Chapter of the ANS on any subject I wished. Put together a talk about my personal experiences in trying to do various things in nuclear public information -some which turned out to be positive, some negative in terms of my corporate employers. The title of this talk was: "Nuclear Power and Public Information -- Suicide on the Installment Plan." The title says a lot about what the nuclear industry has and has not done in promoting its own, and the publics interest regarding the incentives for nuclear technologies. Regarding the Cs-137 in wood ash study I mentioned in a prior post. This study ended up being criticized by my then employer whose PR manager told reporters who inquired after I gave a paper about the results to an annual meeting of the HPS in Washington in 1991 [after going thru the paper approval process of my employer, having it peer reviewed by other staff, etc.] that it was not supported by the company, and that the company was "distancing itself" from the study. Nonetheless, I arranged to speak with dozens of reporters who wanted information about the subject from my home and was able to get dozens of articles in the popular press [newspapers, periodicals including Organic Gardening Magazine with a monthly paid subscriber base of 1,000,000 at the time] highlighting that despite wood ash having been found to have up to 20,000 picoCuries per kg of ash, it presented a trivial dose and a trivial risk. However, wastes of this concentration from nuclear plants and hospitals were having to be disposed of as radwaste at great cost. These results proved irresistable to the public and companies like the pulp and paper industry which generates tens of millions of tons of wood ash per year approached me and wanted the environmental lab with which I was affiliated to perform gamma spectroscopy analyses of the ash so this Wisconson based paper company had some data on the Cs-137 in their wood ash. My employer refused to do these radiological analyses. The paper company involved in making this request then asked me what kind of scam was I running where I raise a potential problem and then would not help them get some analyses done? Good question. Related to this same issue, the Nuclear Safety Advisor to the State of Maine called me to discuss my survey. He told me that the public was bombarding his office with questions about radioactivity in wood ash after about 3 or 4 Maine papers ran lengthy stories on the issue highlighting the inconsistent regulation of hospital and nuclear plant wastes vs. other radioactive waste streams. He said he had gotten multiple calls from upset Maine residents who had called my employer, asked to get some information, or talk to someone about the results and had their calls routed to the PR Manager. The callers were told the company, my employer, would not discuss the issue with any callers. Hmmmm, curioser and curioser. There was an underlying reason why the nuclear company involved would not talk about radioactivity in wood ash as I later found out which related to the use of biomass in power generation by certain utilities who did not want the issue to get any attention. A 50 MW[ e] biomass plant generates on the order of 1,000 cubic meters of woodash per year. The disposal of this ash can be made a lot more complicated if it is viewed as a waste, rather than mixed with manure and spread on the fields of large organic farming coops for soil amendment to replenish depleted potassium So once again, rather than a nuclear company establishing an optimal relationship with interested members of the public, other companies, and regulators on a radiation related risk perception issue, where they would have been able to develop a good working relationship based on their expertise, the nuclear endeavor ended up looking like it had something to hide by refusing to talk with the various publics involved. Another perfect example of "natching defeat from the jaws of victory" as is said. Too bad. Regards and Best Wishes for getting it right in the New Year, Stewart Farber, MS Public Health Consulting Scientist The Prometheus Group, LLC [203] 367-0791 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sandgren, Peter" Date: Tuesday, December 27, 2005 9:17 am Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 > I hope some of you learned folks have also sent your highly > informativeletters to the publications that have seen fit to print > Mangano'sunscientific claims. For my 2 cents, I believe that > anybody who > announces he/she has scientific and controversial "information" to > sharewill always find a reporter or newspaper to put their claims > in print. > > The best defense and the strongest safeguard we have is the knowledge > and experience of you folks on radsafe. For every distorted claim > thatmakes it into print, if two or three letters (with supporting > scientificreferences) come to contradict those claims, at least > one of those > letters will be printed, and rad-fearful minds will be calmed. These > email rebuttals that come into radsafe could, with a little polishing, > go far to hold back the tide of fear that threatens to close nuclear > plants around the country. So, thanks to all of you who take the time > to write! Please keep it up, and send them on to the newspapers. > Mostpapers will accept email letters as long as the name and > address (and > credentials!) of the writer are included. > > Happy New Year to all, > Peter Sandgren > > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On > Behalf Of farbersa at optonline.net > Sent: Friday, December 23, 2005 4:26 PM > To: goldinem at songs.sce.com > Cc: radsafe at radlab.nl > Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 > > Happy Holidays to all: > > If it were not for the fact that Mangano is so effective in fooling > gullible members of the media and the public with his unscientific > claims related to his being a 2nd generation Sternglass wannabe, his > "claims" would be laughable. > > However, in relation to his claims, the EPA has not even had a > consistent network of rainwater monitoring over the past 20 years > because there has been nothing worth monitoring outside of a brief > period in the aftermath of the Chernobyl accident. > > As an example of the absurdity of Mangano's environmental > radioactivityclaims in relation to Vermont Yankee, back in 1989- > 90, I carried out a > small study of Cs-137 in woodash derived from home fireplace > burning of > mature hardwoods all over the US. Several samples were collected from > Vermont. One came from my own fireplace at a vacation home I had in > Warren, VT over 100 miles from Vermont Yankee. The Cs-137 measured was > approx. 15,000 picoCuries per kg of ash after hardwoods grown from the > area around Warren, VT were burned and analyzed by quantitative gamma > spec analysis. > > Another sample of wood ash collected from the burning of mature > hardwoods growing around Vermont Yankee, was found to have only 1,500 > picoCuries of Cs-137 per kg of woodash --or 1/10 the concentration of > Cs-137 100 miles to the north, no where near a nuclear plant. Hmmmm. > > All the Cs-137 being measured in woodash in my study was derived from > the deposition of fallout from open air testing of nuclear weapons > whichended [except for a few small open air tests by the Chinese] > and the > Chernobyl fallout in 1986 [which added about 1% to the pre-existing > Cs-137 deposition in New England based on my extensive review of > environmental rad data gathered around all the nuclear plants in New > England]. Actual areal deposition of Cs-137 around New England is > fairly constant and cannot account for the 10 fold variability of > Cs-137 > measured in woodash from samples only 100 miles apart. The factors > thatappear to make a difference in the Cs-137 level in biomass are the > potassium levels in soil [low K, high Cs-137 uptake] and the > stable Cs > variability [high stable Cs in soil, high uptake of Cs-137 from > soil to > plant -too complex to explain this counterintuitive behavior here] in > soil from one location to another. > > Any Sr-90 deposition in the environment would be in proportion to the > Cs-137 given the relatively constant ratio of Sr-90/Cs-137 in fresh > fallout. So given the 10 fold lower concentration of Cs-137 in biomass > near Vermont Yankee measured in woodash, are we to conclude that being > in the proximity to a nuclear plant operating almost 20 years > since 1972 > to 1990, reduced Cs-137 [and perhaps Sr-90] in the environment?? > :-) > Perhaps the intake of air into the Vermont Yankee plant, and its > filtration before discharge up the stack cleans up the local > environment? Offered for your amusement only. But we could make an > argument of this sort that has absolutely no significance if we wanted > to have some fun and mislead gullible readers. > > If we wanted to play the games Mangano enjoys playing, we could argue > based on real environmental data that running a nuclear plant for > 20 or > so years reduces Cs-137 in the nearby environment dramatically vs. a > background area 100 miles away. Is this true. Of course not. It > is just > an indication of how variable environmental radioactivity including > Cs-137 and Sr-90 in biomass and other biota can be from one > location to > another. If you pick your data points selectively, or look at narrow > windows of time for one set of measurements vs. another, you can make > "conclusions" that appear credible on a first glance, but which are > only supported by that one set of data. > > Going back to 1972, the National Academy of Science harshly > criticicizedDr. Ernest Sternglass and his inflammatory claims > because his claims > were based on choosing only data which supported his hypothesis and > ignoring data which did not. Mangano has learned a lot from his mentor > Dr. Sternglass and is doing the same intellectually dishonest, and > unscientific manipulations that led to Dr. Sternglass being > chastised in > an Appendix to the National Academy of Sciences 1972 Biological > Effectsof Ionizing Radiation [BEIR] report. > > > Stewart Farber, MS Public Health > Consulting Scientist > radproject at optonline.net > [203] 367-0791 > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: goldinem at songs.sce.com > Date: Friday, December 23, 2005 1:09 pm > Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 > > > > > Regarding the Mangano claim that Vermont rainwater gross beta > > levels have > > increased over the years (due presumably to the operation of Vermont > > Yankee), Health Physics just published a paper on the analysis > of > > 22 years > > of air samples in New York State (Health Phys. 90 (1): 31-37; > > 2006. Kitto, > > et al, Long-Term Monitoring of Radioactivity in Surface Air and > > Depositionin New York State). Great stuff, all kinds of > > conclusions about how > > weather patterns affect gross beta and airborne cosmogenic > > radioactivity.Note the sample locations were selected in part > > because of proximity to > > three New York nuclear power plant sites. However, the only > > anthropogenic(wow, what a word) radionuclides were correlated > with > > sewage sludge > > incineration and a tritium-processing facility. Also > noteworthy, some > > analyses were conducted specifically for Sr-90 and/or Sr-89. > > Nothing was > > ever detected in any samples so "they will not be discussed > > further." So > > much for increasing trends in environmental strontium and baby > teeth.> > > By the way, the final argument by Mangano about "increased > > generation" by > > these "aging" power plants is actually quite wrong. When plants > > run well, > > as indicated by a 95% capacity factor, airborne releases are > typically> reduced. Startups and shutdowns are usually > responsible for greater > > effluent releases. So the "increased" Sr-90 in rainwater (if > > true, which I > > doubt) is negatively correlated with Vermont Yankee's operation. > > > Plus I'm > > quite sure that VY's Radiological Environmental Monitoring > Program > > confirmsno radiological impact from plant operation on the local > > environs. > > Eric M. Goldin, CHP > > > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and > understoodthe RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > From franz.schoenhofer at chello.at Tue Dec 27 15:54:16 2005 From: franz.schoenhofer at chello.at (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Franz_Sch=F6nhofer?=) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 22:54:16 +0100 Subject: AW: RE: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <007a01c60b30$1887da50$bf572fd5@pc1> Stewart, I have said it over and over again and will continue to do so: Nuclear power and radioactivity is not a scientific issue. It is a political one. You confirm it. Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone -43-0699-1168-1319 > -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] Im > Auftrag von farbersa at optonline.net > Gesendet: Dienstag, 27. Dezember 2005 19:55 > An: Sandgren, Peter > Cc: Philip.Mikan at po.state.ct.us; radsafe at radlab.nl > Betreff: Re: RE: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 > > Hi Peter, > Your suggestion is a good one. However, just debunking exaggerated or > erroneous claims after the fact while vitally important is not enough. > It's also important that nuclear endeavors find creative, impactful ways > using radiation issues to reach the public, gain their interest, and get > across the points that are vital to the public and regulators not fearing > every Bq or stray photo bouncing around. > > On the first point about debunking critics, unfortunately, this objective > is made all the more difficult by the fact that corporations that have the > most to gain by highlighting the errors and even lies of critics often try > to keep a low profile and avoid the public debate. > > I've sadly witnessed the latter issue, time and again. In one case, I was > invited by one company to debate Dr. Najarian who had authored a "study" > published by the Boston Globe "Spotlight Investigation Team" claiming a 10 > fold excess of leukemia among the Portsmouth Naval Shipyard workers. I > put in a request to my then employer to engage in this activity which > would have involved an on-air debate on a Boston radio station with the VA > physician Najarian who authored the study. I carefully noted in my > request I would do it on my own time, would mention I was speaking as a > private citizen, and would do it at a time approved by my supervisor so as > not to interfere with any priority work. > > Shortly after making the request to participate in this on-air debate, I > was summoned to the Chairman's office of my "public benefit corporation" > employer and found myself in a room with a dozen lawyers positioned down > the length of a 40 foot table with the Chairman on one end of the table > and me on the other. I was told point blank by the Chairman of this > multiple nuclear plant operator [and the largest non-Federal power > generating company in the US]: > > "I want you to understand one thing regarding your request. If it ever > comes to my attention that you have a made a statement in favor of nuclear > energy, you will no longer be an employee of the XY Power Authority." > > I asked if I might ask one question and was told yes. My question was: > "Why?" > > The answer was: "The Governor of this State does not approve of nuclear > energy." Case closed. > > Subsequently, it took 10 years after a study was dragged out by NIOSH, > for it to put out a study where the claims of Najerian were found lacking, > and the results criticizing the original claims of a 10 fold excess of > leukemia, were buried in the literature with essentially no public > outreach. > > This tendency of many corporations to think that if they avoid getting > into the fray and engaging their critics and at the extreme their enemies > intent on destroying them, is a large part of why nuclear endeavors have > withered. Most companies will not provide any time or support to > technical people to get involved in debunking critics and as I have seen > will often interfere with a staffperson who is willing to do it on their > own time and initiative. > > Many years later, after I authored a satire during the 1988 election > campaign on the "health hazards of Strepdukakis antinucleosis", I was > invited to give a talk to the New England Chapter of the ANS on any > subject I wished. Put together a talk about my personal experiences in > trying to do various things in nuclear public information -some which > turned out to be positive, some negative in terms of my corporate > employers. The title of this talk was: > > "Nuclear Power and Public Information -- Suicide on the Installment Plan." > > The title says a lot about what the nuclear industry has and has not done > in promoting its own, and the publics interest regarding the incentives > for nuclear technologies. > > Regarding the Cs-137 in wood ash study I mentioned in a prior post. This > study ended up being criticized by my then employer whose PR manager told > reporters who inquired after I gave a paper about the results to an annual > meeting of the HPS in Washington in 1991 [after going thru the paper > approval process of my employer, having it peer reviewed by other staff, > etc.] that it was not supported by the company, and that the company was > "distancing itself" from the study. Nonetheless, I arranged to speak with > dozens of reporters who wanted information about the subject from my home > and was able to get dozens of articles in the popular press [newspapers, > periodicals including Organic Gardening Magazine with a monthly paid > subscriber base of 1,000,000 at the time] highlighting that despite wood > ash having been found to have up to 20,000 picoCuries per kg of ash, it > presented a trivial dose and a trivial risk. However, wastes of this > concentration from nuclear plants and hospitals > were having to be disposed of as radwaste at great cost. > > These results proved irresistable to the public and companies like the > pulp and paper industry which generates tens of millions of tons of wood > ash per year approached me and wanted the environmental lab with which I > was affiliated to perform gamma spectroscopy analyses of the ash so this > Wisconson based paper company had some data on the Cs-137 in their wood > ash. My employer refused to do these radiological analyses. The paper > company involved in making this request then asked me what kind of scam > was I running where I raise a potential problem and then would not help > them get some analyses done? Good question. > > Related to this same issue, the Nuclear Safety Advisor to the State of > Maine called me to discuss my survey. He told me that the public was > bombarding his office with questions about radioactivity in wood ash after > about 3 or 4 Maine papers ran lengthy stories on the issue highlighting > the inconsistent regulation of hospital and nuclear plant wastes vs. other > radioactive waste streams. He said he had gotten multiple calls from > upset Maine residents who had called my employer, asked to get some > information, or talk to someone about the results and had their calls > routed to the PR Manager. The callers were told the company, my employer, > would not discuss the issue with any callers. Hmmmm, curioser and > curioser. There was an underlying reason why the nuclear company involved > would not talk about radioactivity in wood ash as I later found out which > related to the use of biomass in power generation by certain utilities who > did not want the issue to get any attention. A 50 MW[ > e] biomass plant generates on the order of 1,000 cubic meters of woodash > per year. The disposal of this ash can be made a lot more complicated > if it is viewed as a waste, rather than mixed with manure and spread on > the fields of large organic farming coops for soil amendment to replenish > depleted potassium > > So once again, rather than a nuclear company establishing an optimal > relationship with interested members of the public, other companies, and > regulators on a radiation related risk perception issue, where they would > have been able to develop a good working relationship based on their > expertise, the nuclear endeavor ended up looking like it had something to > hide by refusing to talk with the various publics involved. Another > perfect example of "natching defeat from the jaws of victory" as is said. > Too bad. > > > Regards and Best Wishes for getting it right in the New Year, > > Stewart Farber, MS Public Health > Consulting Scientist > The Prometheus Group, LLC > [203] 367-0791 From franz.schoenhofer at chello.at Tue Dec 27 17:21:24 2005 From: franz.schoenhofer at chello.at (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Franz_Sch=F6nhofer?=) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 00:21:24 +0100 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Information on TFP etc. urgently needed Message-ID: <007c01c60b3c$411cfd40$bf572fd5@pc1> Dear RADSAFErs, I need urgently some information about the TFP and ?publications? of the ?scientists? involved in it and other nonsense like the ?elevated gross-beta? story, Sternglass etc.: Does anybody know about papers of these persons which have been published in peer reviewed journals? (I think to remember that recently one journal has been mentioned on RADSAFE which published something about the TFP.) Has anybody the link to the description of the Sr-90 analytical method at hand? I know that it exists and I commented at RADSAFE about it, stating that it seems to be o.k., but I obviously lost the link. Please no arguments why those ?scientists? are wrong, I have myself more than enough and even better ones than I read at RADSAFE recently. Thanks! Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Tue Dec 27 18:27:16 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 00:27:16 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Background from Static Electricity in Tritium counters In-Reply-To: <002c01c60af4$e5cea160$4501a8c0@RAMSERVICE1> Message-ID: <20051228002716.17798.qmail@web26406.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Don, I found that I did not mark a copy of my response to all. Since it may be of interest to all handling liquid scintillation counters let me mark a copy for all. "A research group in a University in India, while carrying out study of photosynthesis using plankton grown in an atmosphere CO2 labelled with C-14, experienced serious background fluctuations. Some of the amateurs inthe group felt that they discovered some new effect. They were getting more counts than what was estmated from the activity in the sample! It took some time for them to identify the source. Plankton exposed to light glows for some time. The erratic background got stabilized after they kept the samples to be counted in the light tight liquid scintillation counter for a few days! K.S.Parthasarathy" Don Jordan wrote: Using natural latex gloves causes a lot of static problems. Switching to nitrile gloves will solve the problem. I believe that vinyl gloves also do not cause static, but I have not used them. The fabric softener wipes will eventually deposit a lot of crud in your scintillation counter. My experience with static is that one gets very erratic counts. In one count you'll get 10,000 counts, the next one will be a few hundred, and the one after that will be 20,000. The problem you describe sounds more like chemiluminescence, except for the increase when you remove a vial from the counter. This sounds more like phosphorescence caused by fluorescent lights or direct sunlight. Don Jordan RAM Services, Inc. 510 County Highway V Two Rivers, WI 54241 DonJordan at ramservicesinc.com Voice: +1-920-686-3889 _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. From hflong at pacbell.net Tue Dec 27 18:31:15 2005 From: hflong at pacbell.net (howard long) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 16:31:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Hope for science, vs "US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980" In-Reply-To: <007a01c60b30$1887da50$bf572fd5@pc1> Message-ID: <20051228003115.65033.qmail@web81806.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Franz, scientific facts used in nuclear power do not go away. Politicians do. Happy New Year Howard Long Franz Sch?nhofer wrote: Stewart, I have said it over and over again and will continue to do so: Nuclear power and radioactivity is not a scientific issue. It is a political one. You confirm it. Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone -43-0699-1168-1319 From BLHamrick at aol.com Tue Dec 27 19:47:09 2005 From: BLHamrick at aol.com (BLHamrick at aol.com) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 20:47:09 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 Message-ID: It is not just corporate America, but also the government agencies (who, in my opinion, have a duty to address these issues head on), that decline to provide appropriate information in public fora, because they are afraid of political fallout, so to speak. Barbara In a message dated 12/27/2005 12:59:24 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, farbersa at optonline.net writes: On the first point about debunking critics, unfortunately, this objective is made all the more difficult by the fact that corporations that have the most to gain by highlighting the errors and even lies of critics often try to keep a low profile and avoid the public debate. From luke.mccormick at dhs.gov Wed Dec 28 07:32:55 2005 From: luke.mccormick at dhs.gov (Mccormick, Luke I) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 08:32:55 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Radiation detectors at ports Message-ID: Radiation hits at the border are common and are usually mundane; a container of bananas, Italian granite, TV set components from China, ceramic bathroom fixtures. Most all of the radiopharmaceuticals are shipped into this country. At Bota alone we hit on 25 people per month who have gone to Mexico either after having radiotherapy or to obtain cheap radiotherapy. Utensils made of contaminated steel, as well as radioactive commodities such as lantern mantles have been stopped. By "harmless" the commissioner meant none were dirty bombs or nuclear weapons. ____________________Reply Separator____________________ Subject: [ RadSafe ] Radiation detectors at ports Author: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl Date: 12/25/2005 4:22 AM Happy Hanuca to all, This was posted at May 16: "Robert Bonner, commissioner of U.S. Customs and Border Protection, told a Senate subcommittee on homeland security that since the first such devices were installed in May 2000, they had picked up over 10,000 radiation hits in vehicles or cargo shipments entering the country. All proved harmless." Has any one an idea what were the radiation levels caused those hits, was cargo type considered (bannanas, fertilizers, etc.), what about patients with residues of radioactive material or implanted barchitherapy sources? Regards, Moshe Keren ISRAEL _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Wed Dec 28 08:48:08 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 06:48:08 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Article: Scientists Try to Resolve Nuclear Problem With an Old Technology Made New Again Message-ID: <20051228144808.7129.qmail@web54305.mail.yahoo.com> I apologize is this has been posted before. From the New York Times, at http://www.nytimes.com/2005/12/27/science/27nuke.html?th&emc=th ------------------------------------------------------------------ December 27, 2005 Scientists Try to Resolve Nuclear Problem With an Old Technology Made New Again By MATTHEW L. WALD WASHINGTON, Dec. 25 - Decades ago, scientists and engineers thought it would be easy enough to deal with the radioactive waste from nuclear power plants: sort out and save the small portion that was reusable, and put the rest in a hole in the ground. It did not work out that way. Reprocessing the waste proved to be both expensive and risky: the main material being scavenged, plutonium, is a nuclear bomb fuel. And that hole in the ground - the proposed Yucca Mountain repository in Nevada - is years behind schedule, bogged down in politics and environmental disputes. Even if it opens, it will be far too small for the amount of waste that is being generated. So last month, Congress voted $50 million for the Energy Department to explore a new kind of reprocessing, one that would reuse a much larger fraction of the waste. The idea is extremely ambitious. It would require perfecting not only a new method of reprocessing, but also a new class of reactors to burn the salvaged material. Still, proponents said it would have two great advantages: It would mean that Yucca Mountain would be big enough to accommodate the waste that could not be recycled. And it would make Yucca easier to open, because the material still to be buried would generate less heat in the centuries to come. "Reprocessing, or processing spent fuel before it's put in the repository, is a very good way to buy time," said Roger W. Gale, a former Energy Department official who is now an electricity consultant. "It's a fail-safe in case we continue to have problems with Yucca Mountain." Many experts are skeptical that the new strategy, which would involve separating the components of spent fuel and putting the salvaged material in reactors using higher-energy neutrons, will work. Another former Energy Department official, Robert Alvarez, noted that the idea of reprocessing had been around for at least 40 years, each time with a different rationale. "Once, it was part of breeder program," Mr. Alvarez said, referring to a scheme to use reactors to make more nuclear fuel than the reactor consumed. "Then it became a proliferation thing," with supporters reasoning that such a system would safely consume materials that could be used for a bomb. "And now it's a waste-management thing," he said. "But the whole problem is they're pouring money into something that's cutting-edge for the late 1960's." Some scientists argue that recycling is essential. At a recent Washington forum on nuclear waste and its possible uses, Phillip J. Finck, deputy associate director of the Argonne National Laboratory, an Energy Department complex, said that by 2010, long before Yucca Mountain can open (if, indeed, it ever does), the United States would have more than the 70,000 metric tons of fuel that will fit there. Moreover, Mr. Finck argued, without recycled fuel, the world will have to rely on finite reserves of uranium. At the forum, sponsored by the Foundation for Nuclear Studies of Washington, Ernest J. Moniz, a physics professor at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology and a former under secretary of energy, said that if the world built enough reactors to provide energy without contributing to global warming, a new Yucca Mountain would be needed every three and a half years. But Professor Moniz and others expressed caution about reprocessing. Frank N. von Hippel, a physicist at Princeton, said that a new generation of reactors would cost tens of billions of dollars and that it would be a long time before it was clear that reprocessed fuel was needed. The fuel to be reprocessed would be too radioactive to move very far; hence the idea was that the reprocessing plant would be adjacent to the reactor. Ivan Oelrich, vice president of the Federation of American Scientists, said that building scores of new reactors, with a reprocessing plant adjacent, was unlikely, and that while opening Yucca would be hard, switching to this kind of reprocessing was "trading one difficult political problem for an impossible problem." Still, concern over global warming and the increase in natural gas prices have given hope to nuclear advocates, who want new waste techniques as well as new reactors. The reprocessing strategy is subtle - to extract more use out of used fuel and to reduce the heat created by waste that cannot be recycled and still has to be buried. The heat is not a problem in the first few decades, when a repository could be left open for ventilation. The harder time is the next 1,500 years, when heat would be given off by longer-lived radioactive materials, mostly a category called actinides, and also the isotopes that are created as those actinides go through radioactive decay. Heat, not volume or weight, determines the physical capacity of Yucca or any other underground repository, because designers want to keep the repository below the boiling point of water. Above the boiling point, the resulting steam could damage the containers and possibly the rock as well. Reprocessing means chopping up nuclear fuel and separating the ingredients, uranium that was not used in the reactor and other elements that were created in the reactor and could be used as fuel, including plutonium and neptunium. Gulf Oil tried to do that in the early 60's in West Valley, in upstate New York, but dropped it as uneconomical, leaving the taxpayers with a cleanup bill of more than $1 billion. At that plant, and at plants still operated in Britain and France, the plutonium is recovered by chemical separation. The new plan is for "electrometallurgical" reprocessing, in which giant electrodes are inserted in a mix of waste components, somewhat like electroplating. The salvaged materials include uranium 235, the isotope used in bombs, which splits easily, and uranium 238, which makes up more than 99 percent of uranium in nature but is harder to split. One use of uranium 238 in a reactor is as a "fertile" material that can absorb stray neutrons and become plutonium 239, which can be used in reactors and bombs. But existing reactors split the uranium using "thermal" neutrons. The new ones would use "fast" neutrons, which travel thousands of times as fast. The current generation of American power reactors uses water to slow the neutrons to the speed optimal for splitting uranium 235. The water also carries off the heat, which is used to make electricity. Fast neutrons, in contrast, have enough energy to split uranium 238. But to make use of them, reactors would need a heat transfer fluid that does not slow down the neutrons, probably molten sodium. The water-based reactors are kept under high pressure to keep the water from boiling. A sodium reactor could run with the sodium at atmospheric pressure. At some point, the sodium has to be run through a heat exchanger, a cluster of thin-walled metal tubes, to give off its energy to ordinary water, which turns to steam and spins a turbine for electricity. And if there is a leak and the sodium and water come into contact, the sodium burns. There are other problems. Plutonium and neptunium are potential bomb fuels; the risk that they might be illicitly diverted, or that other countries might follow the United States' example and build their own reprocessing centers, led two presidents, Gerald R. Ford and Jimmy Carter, to block General Electric from opening a reprocessing center in Morris, Ill. Further, the companies that run reactors are showing no interest in new kinds of reactors and little interest in plutonium. When the Energy Department decided to get rid of some surplus weapons-type plutonium by turning it into nuclear fuel, no utilities would take it, even at no charge. The Tennessee Valley Authority finally agreed to take the fuel. It described the transaction as selling the government "irradiation services." Copyright 2005 The New York Times Company +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL ? Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com From franz.schoenhofer at chello.at Wed Dec 28 14:00:54 2005 From: franz.schoenhofer at chello.at (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Franz_Sch=F6nhofer?=) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 21:00:54 +0100 Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Message-ID: <00cf01c60be9$698fe000$bf572fd5@pc1> Dear RADSAFErs, Thanks to those who gave me hints and links which help me with my first questions. The next question is, whether anybody has data available about the concentration of Radium-226 (and Ra-228) in human teeth and/or bones. One of the links showed, that actually the Ra-226 was not separated contrary to what I had in memory. The description of the analytical process in one of the links was further obscured by false information about the instrument used (Quantulus). Therefore I would like to estimate what the error in Sr-90 concentration could be when not taking Ra-226 into account. Of course I know, that the Ra-226 concentration will depend on the environment ? as well as the Sr-90 concentration. One more question to the US-American RADSAFErs: I find a Joseph J. Mangano, MPH MBA not only as the National Coordinator of the RPHP website, but also as an author of ?Radioactive Strontium-90 in baby teeth of New Jersey children and the link with cancer: A special report. I know that MBA means ?Master of Business Administration?, but what does MPH mean? Master of Physics? Master of Philosophy? That MBA does not really point towards a scientific background seems to be clear, but does MPH? Thanks again for a very fast reply. Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 From jimm at WPI.EDU Wed Dec 28 14:25:50 2005 From: jimm at WPI.EDU (Muckerheide, James) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 15:25:50 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Message-ID: <71A6142F930A1E4C9300D4088D9765C85FF7DC@EXCHDB.admin.wpi.edu> Master of Public Health Regards, Jim Muckerheide =================== > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On > Behalf Of Franz Sch?nhofer > Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:01 PM > To: RADSAFE > Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions > > Dear RADSAFErs, > > > > Thanks to those who gave me hints and links which help me with my first > questions. The next question is, whether anybody has data available about > the concentration of Radium-226 (and Ra-228) in human teeth and/or bones. > One of the links showed, that actually the Ra-226 was not separated > contrary > to what I had in memory. The description of the analytical process in one > of > the links was further obscured by false information about the instrument > used (Quantulus). Therefore I would like to estimate what the error in Sr- > 90 > concentration could be when not taking Ra-226 into account. Of course I > know, that the Ra-226 concentration will depend on the environment - as > well > as the Sr-90 concentration. > > > > One more question to the US-American RADSAFErs: I find a Joseph J. Mangano, > MPH MBA not only as the National Coordinator of the RPHP website, but > also > as an author of "Radioactive Strontium-90 in baby teeth of New Jersey > children and the link with cancer: A special report. I know that MBA means > "Master of Business Administration", but what does MPH mean? Master of > Physics? Master of Philosophy? That MBA does not really point towards a > scientific background seems to be clear, but does MPH? > > > > Thanks again for a very fast reply. > > > > Franz > > > > Franz Schoenhofer > > PhD, MR iR > > Habicherg. 31/7 > > A-1160 Vienna > > AUSTRIA > > phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 > > phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 > > > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From kerrembaev at yahoo.com Wed Dec 28 14:26:25 2005 From: kerrembaev at yahoo.com (Emil) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 12:26:25 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] (chernobyl mushrooms)Re: Radiation detectors at ports Message-ID: <20051228202625.23101.qmail@web51611.mail.yahoo.com> Greetings, What MDA's are you talking about? Concentrated juices and "wild" mushrooms from the eastern Europe would alarm? I don't think so! I counted on HPGe gamma spec a...huuuge 10 pound-er mushroom in Chernobyl in 1988, just traces of Cs-137 a few pCi/g. We eat it!!! After that I had whole body counts done at 15 USA plants(some counts 1 hour long) and they never showed ANY traces of Cs-137. Just potassium-40 :-) I just left Vegas but if I still were there, I would bet 1000:1 on: "No port screening system would alarm on Chernobyl mushrooms". If you worked with gamma counting systems, you would know that we are talking about "Environmental" levels pCi of Cs-137, it is less than 1 dpm.... I can imagine scenario when somebody brought Chernobyl mushrooms and you counted it in lab conditions with low BKG. Field units..... I don't think so. Regards, Emil. > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 12:57:21 -0500 > From: "Baratta, Edmond J" > Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] Radiation detectors at ports > To: '??? ??? Moshe Keren' , > radsafe at radlab.nl > Message-ID: > <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA7F at orsnewea002.fda.gov> > Content-Type: text/plain > > There are several products that cause detectors to register. One > is any > fruit that contains potassium (Potassium-40) such as bananas. > Ceramic tiles > contain naturally occurring radionuclides. Concentrated fruit > juices and > 'wild' mushrooms that contain both Cesium-137 and Potassium-40 from > Eastern > Europe and/or the former Republics of the USSR. > > > Edmond J. Baratta > Radiation Safety Officer > Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 > Fax: 781-729-3593 > edmond.baratta at fda.gov > > The above are my comments and not those of my Agency! > > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] > On Behalf > Of MosheK at sviva.gov.il > Sent: Sunday, December 25, 2005 4:23 AM > To: radsafe at radlab.nl > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Radiation detectors at ports > > Happy Hanuca to all, > > This was posted at May 16: > > "Robert Bonner, commissioner of U.S. Customs and Border Protection, > told a > Senate subcommittee on homeland security that since the first such > devices > were installed in May 2000, they had picked up over 10,000 > radiation hits in > vehicles or cargo shipments entering the country. All proved > harmless." > > Has any one an idea what were the radiation levels caused those > hits, was > cargo type considered (bannanas, fertilizers, etc.), what about > patients > with residues of radioactive material or implanted barchitherapy > sources? > > Regards, > > Moshe Keren > > ISRAEL > __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL ? Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com From jmarshall.reber at comcast.net Wed Dec 28 14:26:32 2005 From: jmarshall.reber at comcast.net (J. Marshall Reber) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 15:26:32 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions In-Reply-To: <00cf01c60be9$698fe000$bf572fd5@pc1> Message-ID: <3BD5FCF0-77E0-11DA-B6C3-0003939BB85A@comcast.net> From one website: MPH Master of Public Health (conferee) or Masters in Public Health (program). From another website: Also an abbreviation for the Master of Public Health degree. People in an MPH program learn about topics such as nutrition, epidemiology, health education, occupational health, and so on. MPH programs usually require a year or two of study, depending in part on whether students go full-time or part-time. Some people enter MPH programs straight out of college; others earn an MPH while they're in medical school or law school; still others are practicing doctors or nurses who have returned to school to broaden their understanding of public health issues. Graduates of MPH programs can work in a variety of fields; people with an MPH alone frequently work as nutritionists, administrators, or policymakers; people with a doctoral degree often work as scientists, doctors, nurses, or lawyers with a special focus on public health. From ncohen12 at comcast.net Wed Dec 28 14:31:38 2005 From: ncohen12 at comcast.net (Norm Cohen) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 15:31:38 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions In-Reply-To: <00cf01c60be9$698fe000$bf572fd5@pc1> Message-ID: Masters in Public Health. Norm Coalition for Peace and Justice; UNPLUG Salem Campaign, 321 Barr Ave, Linwood; NJ08221; 609-601-8583 -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Franz Sch?nhofer Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:01 PM To: RADSAFE Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Dear RADSAFErs, Thanks to those who gave me hints and links which help me with my first questions. The next question is, whether anybody has data available about the concentration of Radium-226 (and Ra-228) in human teeth and/or bones. One of the links showed, that actually the Ra-226 was not separated contrary to what I had in memory. The description of the analytical process in one of the links was further obscured by false information about the instrument used (Quantulus). Therefore I would like to estimate what the error in Sr-90 concentration could be when not taking Ra-226 into account. Of course I know, that the Ra-226 concentration will depend on the environment ? as well as the Sr-90 concentration. One more question to the US-American RADSAFErs: I find a Joseph J. Mangano, MPH MBA not only as the National Coordinator of the RPHP website, but also as an author of ?Radioactive Strontium-90 in baby teeth of New Jersey children and the link with cancer: A special report. I know that MBA means ?Master of Business Administration?, but what does MPH mean? Master of Physics? Master of Philosophy? That MBA does not really point towards a scientific background seems to be clear, but does MPH? Thanks again for a very fast reply. Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Wed Dec 28 15:12:51 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 13:12:51 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions In-Reply-To: <71A6142F930A1E4C9300D4088D9765C85FF7DC@EXCHDB.admin.wpi.edu> Message-ID: <20051228211251.87027.qmail@web54304.mail.yahoo.com> How about Master of Public Hype. --- "Muckerheide, James" wrote: > Master of Public Health > > Regards, Jim Muckerheide > =================== > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl > [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On > > Behalf Of Franz Sch?nhofer > > Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:01 PM > > To: RADSAFE > > Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions > > > > Dear RADSAFErs, > > > > +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________ Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year. http://brand.yahoo.com/cybergivingweek2005/ From franz.schoenhofer at chello.at Wed Dec 28 15:18:43 2005 From: franz.schoenhofer at chello.at (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Franz_Sch=F6nhofer?=) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 22:18:43 +0100 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH Message-ID: <00dc01c60bf4$47f433f0$bf572fd5@pc1> Dear collegues, Thank you for your multiple responses, which interpret MPH as ?Master of Public Health?. Not really an exciting title for somebody who submits ?scientific? papers on radiation protection. Once again RADSAFE has proved to be the ultimate source of information! Now I wait for responses for the first part of my inquiry .. Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 From franz.schoenhofer at chello.at Wed Dec 28 15:19:37 2005 From: franz.schoenhofer at chello.at (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Franz_Sch=F6nhofer?=) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 22:19:37 +0100 Subject: AW: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions In-Reply-To: <20051228211251.87027.qmail@web54304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <00e101c60bf4$6b108b90$bf572fd5@pc1> This would apply to the person I mentioned....... Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone -43-0699-1168-1319 > -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: John Jacobus [mailto:crispy_bird at yahoo.com] > Gesendet: Mittwoch, 28. Dezember 2005 22:13 > An: Muckerheide, James; Franz Sch?nhofer; RADSAFE > Betreff: RE: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions > > How about Master of Public Hype. > > --- "Muckerheide, James" wrote: > > > Master of Public Health > > > > Regards, Jim Muckerheide > > =================== > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl > > [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On > > > Behalf Of Franz Sch?nhofer > > > Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:01 PM > > > To: RADSAFE > > > Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions > > > > > > Dear RADSAFErs, > > > > > > > > +++++++++++++++++++ > "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." > "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer > > -- John > John Jacobus, MS > Certified Health Physicist > e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year. > http://brand.yahoo.com/cybergivingweek2005/ From wattsa at ohio.edu Wed Dec 28 15:34:21 2005 From: wattsa at ohio.edu (Alan Watts) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 16:34:21 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions In-Reply-To: <00cf01c60be9$698fe000$bf572fd5@pc1> References: <00cf01c60be9$698fe000$bf572fd5@pc1> Message-ID: <113769093.1135787661@dhcp-110-041.cns.ohiou.edu> MPH is a Masters of Public Health. I think that is more related to food borne illnesses and diseases. Alan Alan Watts RSO Ohio University --On Wednesday, December 28, 2005 9:00 PM +0100 Franz Sch?nhofer wrote: > Dear RADSAFErs, > > > > Thanks to those who gave me hints and links which help me with my first > questions. The next question is, whether anybody has data available about > the concentration of Radium-226 (and Ra-228) in human teeth and/or bones. > One of the links showed, that actually the Ra-226 was not separated > contrary to what I had in memory. The description of the analytical > process in one of the links was further obscured by false information > about the instrument used (Quantulus). Therefore I would like to estimate > what the error in Sr-90 concentration could be when not taking Ra-226 > into account. Of course I know, that the Ra-226 concentration will depend > on the environment ? as well as the Sr-90 concentration. > > > > One more question to the US-American RADSAFErs: I find a Joseph J. > Mangano, MPH MBA not only as the National Coordinator of the RPHP > website, but also as an author of ?Radioactive Strontium-90 in baby teeth > of New Jersey children and the link with cancer: A special report. I know > that MBA means ?Master of Business Administration?, but what does MPH > mean? Master of Physics? Master of Philosophy? That MBA does not really > point towards a scientific background seems to be clear, but does MPH? > > > > Thanks again for a very fast reply. > > > > Franz > > > > Franz Schoenhofer > > PhD, MR iR > > Habicherg. 31/7 > > A-1160 Vienna > > AUSTRIA > > phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 > > phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 > > > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From NSSIHOU at aol.com Wed Dec 28 19:44:34 2005 From: NSSIHOU at aol.com (NSSIHOU at aol.com) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 20:44:34 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Background from Static Electricity in Tritium counters Message-ID: <157.5e4fedd1.30e49982@aol.com> The problem with the scint vials in liquid scintillation sounds more like chemoluminescence than static charge. bob gallagher NSSI From JPreisig at aol.com Wed Dec 28 20:57:17 2005 From: JPreisig at aol.com (JPreisig at aol.com) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 21:57:17 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Static Electricity Message-ID: <261.45f44d9.30e4aa8d@aol.com> Hmmmmmm, This is from: jpreisig at aol.com . Hi Radsafers, Static electricity in the laboratory??? How about installing a (highly stable) humidifier for the wintertime??? Has anyone tried this??? Brookhaven AGS/RHIC news: Seems like the heavy ion accelerator run for 2005-2006 is in peril. Cashflow problems at Brookhaven. See their website. A human capital crisis in accelerator health physics??? Perhaps??? LHC is being built at CERN. A linear collider is eventually slated for Fermilab. The Spallation Neutron Source is being constructed at Oak Ridge (ORNL). Are any other actual construction projects slated for the USA??? Well, enjoy 2006. Regards, Joseph (Joe) R. Preisig, Ph.D. From farbersa at optonline.net Wed Dec 28 23:34:23 2005 From: farbersa at optonline.net (farbersa at optonline.net) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 00:34:23 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH In-Reply-To: <00dc01c60bf4$47f433f0$bf572fd5@pc1> References: <00dc01c60bf4$47f433f0$bf572fd5@pc1> Message-ID: Many MPH or MSPH programs involve extensive coursework in biostatistics and epidemiology so don't be too quick to dismiss an analysis of some issue based solely on the individual having an MPH degree. I have no idea what coursework or concentration within Public Health Mr. Mangano may have had. In my own case, having taken a two year MSPH degree with a concentration in Air Pollution Control, the program involved a core of courses in Micrometerology, Civil Engineering, Chemical Engineering and two years of coursework in biostatistics and a year course in Epidemiology, and various electives like Radiological Health, as well as a research thesis to develop an ultrasensitive technique for measuring ambient Hg in air and running an air monitoring network for a time. My program also involved all the basic Public Health courses [Public Health Practice, Environmental Sciences] which might be more common alone in a one year MPH degree. Happy New Year to all, Stewart Farber, MS Public Health [Air Pollution Control] UMass Amherst School of Public Health '73 [203] 367-0791 ----- Original Message ----- From: Franz Sch?nhofer Date: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 4:18 pm Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH > Dear collegues, > > > > Thank you for your multiple responses, which interpret MPH as > ?Master of > Public Health?. Not really an exciting title for somebody who submits > ?scientific? papers on radiation protection. > > > > Once again RADSAFE has proved to be the ultimate source of > information! > > > Now I wait for responses for the first part of my inquiry .. > > > > Franz > > > > Franz Schoenhofer > > PhD, MR iR > > Habicherg. 31/7 > > A-1160 Vienna > > AUSTRIA > > phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 > > phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 > > > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and > understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other > settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV Thu Dec 29 07:57:13 2005 From: EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV (Baratta, Edmond J) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 08:57:13 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Message-ID: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA84@orsnewea002.fda.gov> Good morning Franz: I had asked that question earlier about Strontium-90. The amount of Radium-226 in foods (where it would be ingested from) was been shown to be <0.037 Bq/kg). The U.S. Public Health Service in the 60's (1964-1967) did Studies on Diets of children. It was reported in "Evaluation of Radium-226 in Total Diet Samples, June 1964 to July 1967" U.S. Public Health Service, Radiological Health Data and Reports 6:371-377 (1969). Also similar work was done by Fisenne, J.M.and H. W. Walker "Radium-226 in the Diet in two Cities", U.S. AEC Report HASL-24 (1970). Strontium-90 in bones was also done during that time. The samples were taken from accident victims. The samples were much larger and it did show the trend that younger person's Strontium-90 content was higher than older ones. The article was "Strontium-90 in Human Bone from infancy to Adulthood 1962-1963" by Gaffney, G.W. et al, Radiological Health Data and Reports, 7:383-386 (1966). This was during the during the above ground weapons testing days. The samples of infants teeth are very small and unless they are composited, it is difficult to see how they could measure these low levels. Ed Edmond J. Baratta Radiation Safety Officer Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 Fax: 781-729-3593 edmond.baratta at fda.gov -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Franz Sch?nhofer Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:01 PM To: RADSAFE Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Dear RADSAFErs, Thanks to those who gave me hints and links which help me with my first questions. The next question is, whether anybody has data available about the concentration of Radium-226 (and Ra-228) in human teeth and/or bones. One of the links showed, that actually the Ra-226 was not separated contrary to what I had in memory. The description of the analytical process in one of the links was further obscured by false information about the instrument used (Quantulus). Therefore I would like to estimate what the error in Sr-90 concentration could be when not taking Ra-226 into account. Of course I know, that the Ra-226 concentration will depend on the environment - as well as the Sr-90 concentration. One more question to the US-American RADSAFErs: I find a Joseph J. Mangano, MPH MBA not only as the National Coordinator of the RPHP website, but also as an author of "Radioactive Strontium-90 in baby teeth of New Jersey children and the link with cancer: A special report. I know that MBA means "Master of Business Administration", but what does MPH mean? Master of Physics? Master of Philosophy? That MBA does not really point towards a scientific background seems to be clear, but does MPH? Thanks again for a very fast reply. Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From Sreenivas.Komanduri at dep.state.nj.us Thu Dec 29 08:36:15 2005 From: Sreenivas.Komanduri at dep.state.nj.us (Sreenivas Komanduri) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 09:36:15 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Key chain radiation detectors Message-ID: My question is about 'toy' like radiation detectors a couple of them being marketed on the internet. Pictures show real small, can be attached to the key ring of your car keys and they are marketed as 'dirty bomb detectors'. Does anyone have any experience of having bought and used them for any purpose such as training or demo etc.? Would you please share your experience? I believe this may not be the first time this is being asked, you may send your replies to me directly. Thanks. Vas Komanduri; Ph.D. NJ Department of Environmental Protection Office of Quality Assurance 9 Ewing Street P.O Box 424 Trenton, NJ 08625 Phone: (609) 984 - 0855 Fax: (609) 777 - 1774 -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: Sreenivas Komanduri.vcf URL: From sandyfl at earthlink.net Thu Dec 29 09:36:57 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 07:36:57 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH In-Reply-To: References: <00dc01c60bf4$47f433f0$bf572fd5@pc1> Message-ID: <43B39219.28389.547552F@localhost> On 29 Dec 2005 at 0:34, farbersa at optonline.net wrote: > Many MPH or MSPH programs involve extensive coursework in > biostatistics and epidemiology so don't be too quick to dismiss an > analysis of some issue based solely on the individual having an MPH > degree. I agree! Dr. Phil Plato, formerly at University of Michigan and responsible for the first Draft NVLAP Program, and also responsible for leading the 1st Performance Test Lab back in the '80s, has a MPH. Sad how some automatically judge a person by their credentials, without any real evidence, background or knowledge. Not very scientific ... is it? ------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 E-Mail: sperle at dosimetry.com E-Mail: sandyfl at earthlink.net Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From sandyfl at earthlink.net Thu Dec 29 10:27:53 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 08:27:53 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] China's $8 Billion Nuclear Deal Postponed Indefinitely Message-ID: <43B39E09.27190.576000D@localhost> Index: China's $8 Billion Nuclear Deal Postponed Indefinitely University of California Wins Los Alamos Contract Town Has Nuclear-Powered Plans ====================================== China's $8 Billion Nuclear Deal Postponed Indefinitely BEIJING, China (Dec. 20) - China will miss a year-end deadline for handing out an $8 billion contract to build four nuclear reactors, and plans to postpone its choice indefinitely, an industry source close to the bidding said on Tuesday. Pittsburgh-based Westinghouse Electric Co., France's Areva and Russia's Atomstroiexport are vying for the contract to build China's first third-generation reactors. Beijing's original plan was to make a final decision by the end of this year but officials have decided to put it off because of the high price of the foreign reactors, the source said. Even though China was considering importing only those parts of the plants that could not be produced domestically, the prices offered by the bidders were still considered unreasonably high. "There will be no new deadline for the decision. When the government announces the result will depend on how the talks are going," he added. During a visit to France earlier this month, Premier Wen Jiabao indicated Paris would have to improve its offer in terms of both price and transfer of nuclear technology, the source said, adding the same message had been passed to other bidders. "The ball has been kicked to the foreign side again. We will wait and see how they react," he said. Industry officials have said both Westinghouse's AP 1000 and Areva's EPR technology are very competitive, while the Russian offer is less so. In contrast with the delay in introducing foreign technology, Beijing is accelerating the construction of nuclear reactors that use existing domestic technology. Work began last week on the second phase of the Ling'ao plant in southern Guangdong province. It will put two 1.0-gigawatt reactors into commercial operation in 2010 and 2011. "These projects have nothing to do with the third-generation technology and will not be influenced by it," the source said. The energy-guzzling nation plans to invest some 400 billion yuan ($49.56 billion) in building around 30 new nuclear reactors by 2020, bringing its total installed nuclear capacity to 40 gigawatts. It currently has nine working reactors that supply around 2.3 percent of its electricity, but aims to boost the amount of power it gets from nuclear plants to 4 percent within 15 years. -------------------- University of California Wins Los Alamos Contract LOS ALAMOS, N.M. (Dec. 21) - The University of California has retained the contract to manage troubled Los Alamos National Laboratory, the Energy Department announced Wednesday. The contract to run the nation's pre-eminent nuclear lab had gone out to bid earlier this year for the first time in the lab's 63-year history. Energy Secretary Samuel Bodman said UC, which will team with Bechtel Corp., had prevailed in its bid over a rival team comprised of Lockheed Martin and the University of Texas. --------------- Town Has Nuclear-Powered Plans USA TODAY (Dec. 19) - Some people here have lived their whole lives in the shadow of the twin cooling towers of the Bellefonte Nuclear Plant. Their fathers and grandfathers helped build the facility, which the Tennessee Valley Authority began constructing in the 1970s but never completed. The TVA operates three other nuclear plants within a 125-mile radius, so many here are comfortable with the idea of a nuclear neighbor. They celebrated in September when a consortium of utility companies chose Bellefonte as one of two sites for new nuclear plants. "Everybody from 35 to 40 years old that grew up around this county in the '70s, they've seen the towers, they knew what it was," says Tommy Bryant, 36, a utility company manager whose father worked a construction job at Bellefonte. "Most people are really glad about what they're planning." Americans' confidence in nuclear power waned after the partial meltdown of a reactor at Pennsylvania's Three Mile Island in 1979 and the explosion in 1986 at the Chernobyl plant in Ukraine that spread radioactive material across Europe. Today, surging demand for electricity, concerns about air pollution and the Bush administration's push to reduce the nation's dependence on foreign oil are prompting renewed interest in nuclear energy. President Bush signed an energy bill in August that includes extensive subsidies and incentives for the industry. The bill contains subsidies for construction delays, offers loan guarantees to utilities and limits industry liability for accidents. Scottsboro is one of several communities around the USA that are wooing utility companies that build nuclear plants, eager to tap the economic benefits of an industry attempting a comeback. More demand for electricity The USA's existing 103 nuclear plants produce about 20% of the nation's power. "To maintain that 20%, we will have to add new nuclear plants, because the demand is going to go up," says Marilyn Kray, president of NuStart Energy, the consortium that has selected sites near Scottsboro and Port Gibson, Miss., for new nuclear plants. Towns that also vied for the plants were Aiken, S.C.; St. Francisville, La.; Lusby, Md.; and Scriba, N.Y. Industry opponents say new nuclear plants aren't economically feasible without huge federal subsidies. Protecting plants from terrorists and disposing of spent fuel, which remains lethal for 250,000 years, are also top concerns. "The nuclear power champions are now looking to hook up an umbilical cord to the U.S. Treasury and the American taxpayer to jump-start their all-but-moribund industry," says Paul Gunter of the Nuclear Information and Resource Service in Washington, D.C. "This is a failed technology. The fact the Cheney-Bush administration is looking to lead us back into this quagmire is more a relapse than a revival." The industry promotes nuclear power as a non-polluting form of energy that doesn't consume finite fuels such as coal and natural gas. But the main selling point for Scottsboro is economic: 2,400 to 2,800 jobs during a three- to four-year construction period, followed by 400 to 600 full-time jobs once the plant starts operating, Scottsboro Mayor Dan Deason says. "That's going to be a tremendous shot in the arm," he says. 'We will leave here' Scottsboro is football and bass-fishing country. Fans declare allegiance to the University of Alabama Crimson Tide or the Auburn University Tigers. Lake Guntersville hosts 100 largemouth bass- fishing tournaments a year. This town of about 15,000 is the county seat and one of 13 municipalities in Jackson County. Each of those cities' governments passed resolutions supporting a new nuclear facility at Bellefonte, says Rick Roden, CEO of the Greater Jackson County Chamber of Commerce. That's partly because people here are familiar with TVA nuclear plants near Athens, Ala., Soddy-Daisy, Tenn., and Spring City, Tenn., says Goodrich Rogers, who recruits new industry as head of the Jackson County Economic Development Authority. "We understand the technology," Rogers says. "We've all got friends who work at nuclear power plants. They come to Sunday school with us, and none of them glow in the dark." Not everyone is eager to see NuStart move ahead. "If it comes, we will leave here," says Carol Womacks, 52, a former flight attendant who has lived here for 18 years. Her house is about 5 miles from Bellefonte. Womacks worries about an accident. "I don't think the city is prepared," she says. Local opposition has not yet galvanized because people in Alabama don't believe nuclear plants are actually going to happen, says Stephen Smith, executive director of the Southern Alliance for Clean Energy, an environmental and energy policy group based in Knoxville, Tenn. "There will be more organized opposition as more people get up to speed on it," he says. Economic linchpin Scottsboro's fortunes have long been tied to Bellefonte. "In the mid- to late '70s, when TVA was moving ahead with Bellefonte, this was one of the fastest-growing places in Alabama," Roden says. Bellefonte never opened because "the projected demand for electricity did not materialize," TVA board Chairman Bill Baxter says. During the mid-1980s, after many textile jobs disappeared and TVA decided not to finish the Bellefonte plant, unemployment soared to 23%. The local economy is more diverse now. There's even a building boom. An eight-screen movie theater is planned, as is an $8 million, 320- acre industrial park. Tourism is up 22% the past three years, and unemployment is 4%. NuStart's Kray says the plan is to "start from scratch" at the Bellefonte site, building twin reactors using safer, more efficient technology developed since the 1970s. Her consortium, made up of nine utilities, two nuclear reactor manufacturers and the TVA, will apply for plant licenses from the Nuclear Regulatory Commission. At Scottsboro, Kray says, the application probably will be submitted in late 2007. If the NRC approves, construction could begin in 2011 and be completed by 2015. After NuStart narrowed its list of potential sites to six, the competition heated up, Kray says: "What we were surprised at was the level of enthusiasm and the overwhelming support we received." "All six states made substantive offers," NuStart spokesman Carl Crawford says. "They were in the hundreds of millions of dollars in incentives." ------------------ Blast at Russian Nuclear Plant Kills One ST. PETERSBURG, Russia AP (Dec. 16) - Molten metal splashed from a smelter at a Russian nuclear power plant, killing one worker and severely burning two others, but authorities said Friday that no reactors were affected and no radiation escaped. While relatively minor, the accident Thursday occurred on the same day prosecutors announced a "catastrophic radioactivity situation" involving improperly stored materials at a chemical factory in the southern Russian region of Chechnya. The incidents were the latest to draw questions about how Russia stores, handles and disposes of nuclear materials and waste in the wake of the 1986 explosion of a reactor at Chernobyl that spewed out radioactivity for days in the world's worst civilian atomic accident. "The level of nuclear safety, although it has been significantly increased after the Chernobyl disaster, is still not sufficient," said Vladimir Slivyak at Ecodefense, a Russian environmental group. "They used to think that there is no need for extra safety measures and they still think that now." The smelter accident happened at the Leningrad electricity generating station in the closed nuclear town of Sosnovy Bor, 50 miles west of St. Petersburg. Russia's nuclear agency, Rosenergoatom, initially reported an explosion. It later changed course and described the incident as a "splash." It said radiation levels remained normal. The Norwegian environmental group Bellona, a longtime critic of Russia's nuclear programs, and officials in nearby Finland also said they had not detected any spread of radiation. A 33-year-old worker died of injuries Friday, and two others were injured, Yuri Lameko, chief doctor of the Sosnovy Bor hospital, told The Associated Press. The Emergency Situations Ministry said two of those involved suffered burns over 90 percent of their bodies. Rosenergoatom said the smelter - run by a scrap metal reprocessing company called Ekomet-S - is on the grounds of the plant's second unit, where a reactor was shut down for repairs in July. The plant has four reactors in all, including one of the same type that blew up in Chernobyl during the Soviet era. Plant spokesman Sergei Averyanov said the smelter is a half-mile from the reactor. Oleg Bodrov, a physicist who heads the Green World ecological group in Sosnovy Bor, said the facility is also about 150 feet from a covered liquid radioactive waste pond. Averyanov blamed the accident on violations of technical and production rules. Bodrov accused Ekomet-S, which also reprocesses metal from nuclear submarines and disassembled oil and gas pipelines, of violating environmental laws. He also complained a lack of funding had caused the shutdown of the only environmental monitoring laboratory in the town of 65,000. "There is no independent environmental monitoring in the nuclear city of Sosnovy Bor," Bodrov said, adding that he visited the Ekomet-S facility Friday afternoon and found radiation levels were normal. He said Ekomet-S workers told him more than two tons of molten metal were in the smelter and several hundred pounds splashed out for unknown reasons. He said a previous accident involving Ekomet-S injured two workers in summer 2003. In March 1992, an accident at the power plant let radioactive gases and iodine leak into the air, according to nuclear watchdog groups. Experts and environmentalists say Russia's nuclear industries and companies that handle radioactive materials have improved procedures in the years since the Soviet collapse. Washington has provided an estimated $7 billion the past 14 years to help Russia and other former Soviet republics destroy and safeguard atomic weapons. Still, Russia's nuclear industries, which often escape detailed federal monitoring, are prone to industrial accidents. Russian prosecutors opened a criminal investigation Thursday into the improper storage of radioactive materials by a state-owned company in the Chechen capital, Grozny. Tests found radiation at the Grozny Chemical Factory, which stands not far from residential buildings and a bus station, exceeded normal levels by tens of thousands of times, prosecutors said. They called it a "catastrophic radioactivity situation." Nikolai Petrov of the Carnegie Moscow Center said that situation smacked of "the usual disorder and negligence" by Russian officials in dealing with potentially harmful materials. ------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 E-Mail: sperle at dosimetry.com E-Mail: sandyfl at earthlink.net Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From hflong at pacbell.net Thu Dec 29 10:36:03 2005 From: hflong at pacbell.net (howard long) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 08:36:03 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Key chain radiation detectors - Insurance for all HPs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051229163603.56408.qmail@web81806.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I wear the Nukalert (details at www.Nukalert.com) I met the inventor at a meeting of Doctors for Disaster Preparedness, which has investigated, supports and even helps fund distribution to first responders (c$100). Simply, it indicates time before 100 Rad at that level of total radiation, enabling putting mass and distance between the holder and source with confidence that no damaging dose results, and thus no panic disaster. I also have a palmRAD 907 Nuclear Radiation Meter (c $550), details at www.berkeleynucleonics.com which would need a user with more knowledge of the effects of radiation. Howard Long Sreenivas Komanduri wrote: My question is about 'toy' like radiation detectors a couple of them being marketed on the internet. Pictures show real small, can be attached to the key ring of your car keys and they are marketed as 'dirty bomb detectors'. Does anyone have any experience of having bought and used them for any purpose such as training or demo etc.? Would you please share your experience? I believe this may not be the first time this is being asked, you may send your replies to me directly. Thanks. Vas Komanduri; Ph.D. NJ Department of Environmental Protection Office of Quality Assurance 9 Ewing Street P.O Box 424 Trenton, NJ 08625 Phone: (609) 984 - 0855 Fax: (609) 777 - 1774 BEGIN:VCARD VERSION:2.1 X-GWTYPE:USER FN:Komanduri, Sreenivas TEL;WORK:609-984-0855 ORG:;Env. Regulation EMAIL;WORK;PREF;NGW:Sreenivas.Komanduri at dep.state.nj.us N:Komanduri;Sreenivas END:VCARD _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From bobcat167 at earthlink.net Thu Dec 29 10:41:39 2005 From: bobcat167 at earthlink.net (Bob Shannon) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 09:41:39 -0700 Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions In-Reply-To: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA84@orsnewea002.fda.gov> Message-ID: <000001c60c96$be3fd580$6601a8c0@Bob> I have taken some time to look through the Radsafe archives but to no avail. So I would like to pose this question again. At some point several years ago, there was a semi-detailed description of the method being used by the tooth fairy project to analyze teeth for Sr. Can anyone point me to this post? Thanks! Bob Shannon Kaiser Analytical Management Services 303-432-1137 -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Baratta, Edmond J Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 6:57 AM To: 'Franz Sch?nhofer'; RADSAFE Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Good morning Franz: I had asked that question earlier about Strontium-90. The amount of Radium-226 in foods (where it would be ingested from) was been shown to be <0.037 Bq/kg). The U.S. Public Health Service in the 60's (1964-1967) did Studies on Diets of children. It was reported in "Evaluation of Radium-226 in Total Diet Samples, June 1964 to July 1967" U.S. Public Health Service, Radiological Health Data and Reports 6:371-377 (1969). Also similar work was done by Fisenne, J.M.and H. W. Walker "Radium-226 in the Diet in two Cities", U.S. AEC Report HASL-24 (1970). Strontium-90 in bones was also done during that time. The samples were taken from accident victims. The samples were much larger and it did show the trend that younger person's Strontium-90 content was higher than older ones. The article was "Strontium-90 in Human Bone from infancy to Adulthood 1962-1963" by Gaffney, G.W. et al, Radiological Health Data and Reports, 7:383-386 (1966). This was during the during the above ground weapons testing days. The samples of infants teeth are very small and unless they are composited, it is difficult to see how they could measure these low levels. Ed Edmond J. Baratta Radiation Safety Officer Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 Fax: 781-729-3593 edmond.baratta at fda.gov -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Franz Sch?nhofer Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:01 PM To: RADSAFE Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Dear RADSAFErs, Thanks to those who gave me hints and links which help me with my first questions. The next question is, whether anybody has data available about the concentration of Radium-226 (and Ra-228) in human teeth and/or bones. One of the links showed, that actually the Ra-226 was not separated contrary to what I had in memory. The description of the analytical process in one of the links was further obscured by false information about the instrument used (Quantulus). Therefore I would like to estimate what the error in Sr-90 concentration could be when not taking Ra-226 into account. Of course I know, that the Ra-226 concentration will depend on the environment - as well as the Sr-90 concentration. One more question to the US-American RADSAFErs: I find a Joseph J. Mangano, MPH MBA not only as the National Coordinator of the RPHP website, but also as an author of "Radioactive Strontium-90 in baby teeth of New Jersey children and the link with cancer: A special report. I know that MBA means "Master of Business Administration", but what does MPH mean? Master of Physics? Master of Philosophy? That MBA does not really point towards a scientific background seems to be clear, but does MPH? Thanks again for a very fast reply. Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From Floyd.Flanigan at nmcco.com Thu Dec 29 11:53:29 2005 From: Floyd.Flanigan at nmcco.com (Flanigan, Floyd) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 11:53:29 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Key chain radiation detectors Message-ID: <7A9B2084CC9CEC45828E829CBF20D6380AD66A@enex02.ft.nmcco.net> Is there any associated nomenclature which might identify these 'detectors'? Or perhaps a link to the marketing site? Floyd W. Flanigan B.S.Nuc.H.P. -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Sreenivas Komanduri Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 8:36 AM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] Key chain radiation detectors My question is about 'toy' like radiation detectors a couple of them being marketed on the internet. Pictures show real small, can be attached to the key ring of your car keys and they are marketed as 'dirty bomb detectors'. Does anyone have any experience of having bought and used them for any purpose such as training or demo etc.? Would you please share your experience? I believe this may not be the first time this is being asked, you may send your replies to me directly. Thanks. Vas Komanduri; Ph.D. NJ Department of Environmental Protection Office of Quality Assurance 9 Ewing Street P.O Box 424 Trenton, NJ 08625 Phone: (609) 984 - 0855 Fax: (609) 777 - 1774 From ncohen12 at comcast.net Thu Dec 29 12:09:23 2005 From: ncohen12 at comcast.net (Norm Cohen) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 13:09:23 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] sr90 from noble gases Message-ID: Guys and gals, Somewhere I read that sr90 could be produced from the decay of noble gases emitted from nuke plants. What can you all tell me about this? Norm Coalition for Peace and Justice; UNPLUG Salem Campaign, 321 Barr Ave, Linwood; NJ08221; 609-601-8583 From Sreenivas.Komanduri at dep.state.nj.us Thu Dec 29 12:19:53 2005 From: Sreenivas.Komanduri at dep.state.nj.us (Sreenivas Komanduri) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 13:19:53 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Key chain radiation detectors Message-ID: There are two 'key chain detectors' I came across. Here are the links . www.nukepills.com and www.nukalert.com There is no nomenclature I could find, except 'dirty bomb detector' as I see. >>> "Flanigan, Floyd" 12/29/2005 12:53 PM >>> Is there any associated nomenclature which might identify these 'detectors'? Or perhaps a link to the marketing site? Floyd W. Flanigan B.S.Nuc.H.P. -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Sreenivas Komanduri Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 8:36 AM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] Key chain radiation detectors My question is about 'toy' like radiation detectors a couple of them being marketed on the internet. Pictures show real small, can be attached to the key ring of your car keys and they are marketed as 'dirty bomb detectors'. Does anyone have any experience of having bought and used them for any purpose such as training or demo etc.? Would you please share your experience? I believe this may not be the first time this is being asked, you may send your replies to me directly. Thanks. Vas Komanduri; Ph.D. NJ Department of Environmental Protection Office of Quality Assurance 9 Ewing Street P.O Box 424 Trenton, NJ 08625 Phone: (609) 984 - 0855 Fax: (609) 777 - 1774 From idias at interchange.ubc.ca Thu Dec 29 12:51:14 2005 From: idias at interchange.ubc.ca (John R Johnson) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 10:51:14 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions In-Reply-To: <000001c60c96$be3fd580$6601a8c0@Bob> Message-ID: Bob et al The concentrations of radium in bones is 260 mBq/Kg Ra-226 in 31 countries and 39-230 mBq/Kg Ra-228 in the US. This and other numbers are in UNSCEAR at http://www.unscear.org/reports/2000_1.html Happy New Year _________________ John R Johnson, Ph.D. ***** President, IDIAS, Inc 4535 West 9-Th Ave Vancouver B. C. V6R 2E2 (604) 222-9840 idias at interchange.ubc.ca ***** or most mornings Consultant in Radiation Protection TRIUMF 4004 Wesbrook Mall Vancouver B. C. V6R 2E2 (604) 222-1047 Ext. 6610 Fax: (604) 222-7309 johnsjr at triumf.ca -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl]On Behalf Of Bob Shannon Sent: December 29, 2005 8:42 AM To: 'RADSAFE' Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions I have taken some time to look through the Radsafe archives but to no avail. So I would like to pose this question again. At some point several years ago, there was a semi-detailed description of the method being used by the tooth fairy project to analyze teeth for Sr. Can anyone point me to this post? Thanks! Bob Shannon Kaiser Analytical Management Services 303-432-1137 -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Baratta, Edmond J Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 6:57 AM To: 'Franz Sch?nhofer'; RADSAFE Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Good morning Franz: I had asked that question earlier about Strontium-90. The amount of Radium-226 in foods (where it would be ingested from) was been shown to be <0.037 Bq/kg). The U.S. Public Health Service in the 60's (1964-1967) did Studies on Diets of children. It was reported in "Evaluation of Radium-226 in Total Diet Samples, June 1964 to July 1967" U.S. Public Health Service, Radiological Health Data and Reports 6:371-377 (1969). Also similar work was done by Fisenne, J.M.and H. W. Walker "Radium-226 in the Diet in two Cities", U.S. AEC Report HASL-24 (1970). Strontium-90 in bones was also done during that time. The samples were taken from accident victims. The samples were much larger and it did show the trend that younger person's Strontium-90 content was higher than older ones. The article was "Strontium-90 in Human Bone from infancy to Adulthood 1962-1963" by Gaffney, G.W. et al, Radiological Health Data and Reports, 7:383-386 (1966). This was during the during the above ground weapons testing days. The samples of infants teeth are very small and unless they are composited, it is difficult to see how they could measure these low levels. Ed Edmond J. Baratta Radiation Safety Officer Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 Fax: 781-729-3593 edmond.baratta at fda.gov -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Franz Sch?nhofer Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:01 PM To: RADSAFE Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Dear RADSAFErs, Thanks to those who gave me hints and links which help me with my first questions. The next question is, whether anybody has data available about the concentration of Radium-226 (and Ra-228) in human teeth and/or bones. One of the links showed, that actually the Ra-226 was not separated contrary to what I had in memory. The description of the analytical process in one of the links was further obscured by false information about the instrument used (Quantulus). Therefore I would like to estimate what the error in Sr-90 concentration could be when not taking Ra-226 into account. Of course I know, that the Ra-226 concentration will depend on the environment - as well as the Sr-90 concentration. One more question to the US-American RADSAFErs: I find a Joseph J. Mangano, MPH MBA not only as the National Coordinator of the RPHP website, but also as an author of "Radioactive Strontium-90 in baby teeth of New Jersey children and the link with cancer: A special report. I know that MBA means "Master of Business Administration", but what does MPH mean? Master of Physics? Master of Philosophy? That MBA does not really point towards a scientific background seems to be clear, but does MPH? Thanks again for a very fast reply. Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From Sreenivas.Komanduri at dep.state.nj.us Thu Dec 29 13:56:50 2005 From: Sreenivas.Komanduri at dep.state.nj.us (Sreenivas Komanduri) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 14:56:50 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Key chain radiation detectors Message-ID: Floyd, See the links to marketing sites below. www.nukepills.com and www.nukalert.com You will have to ask the manufacturers on nomenclature. My understanding is either a 'civil defense meter' or a 'dirty bomb detector'. >>> "Flanigan, Floyd" 12/29/2005 12:53 PM >>> Is there any associated nomenclature which might identify these 'detectors'? Or perhaps a link to the marketing site? Floyd W. Flanigan B.S.Nuc.H.P. -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Sreenivas Komanduri Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 8:36 AM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] Key chain radiation detectors My question is about 'toy' like radiation detectors a couple of them being marketed on the internet. Pictures show real small, can be attached to the key ring of your car keys and they are marketed as 'dirty bomb detectors'. Does anyone have any experience of having bought and used them for any purpose such as training or demo etc.? Would you please share your experience? I believe this may not be the first time this is being asked, you may send your replies to me directly. Thanks. Vas Komanduri; Ph.D. NJ Department of Environmental Protection Office of Quality Assurance 9 Ewing Street P.O Box 424 Trenton, NJ 08625 Phone: (609) 984 - 0855 Fax: (609) 777 - 1774 _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From ograabe at ucdavis.edu Thu Dec 29 14:14:26 2005 From: ograabe at ucdavis.edu (Otto G. Raabe) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 12:14:26 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Key chain radiation detectors In-Reply-To: <7A9B2084CC9CEC45828E829CBF20D6380AD66A@enex02.ft.nmcco.net > References: <7A9B2084CC9CEC45828E829CBF20D6380AD66A@enex02.ft.nmcco.net> Message-ID: <6.0.1.1.2.20051229121246.02af05b0@mailbox.ucdavis.edu> At 09:53 AM 12/29/2005, Flanigan, Floyd wrote: >Is there any associated nomenclature which might identify these >'detectors'? Or perhaps a link to the marketing site? **************************************************** This one is said to habe been shown at the 2003 HPS Annual Meeting: >http://www.nukalert.com/ Otto ********************************************** Prof. Otto G. Raabe, Ph.D., CHP Center for Health & the Environment (Street Address: Bldg. 3792, Old Davis Road) University of California, Davis, CA 95616 E-Mail: ograabe at ucdavis.edu Phone: (530) 752-7754 FAX: (530) 758-6140 *********************************************** From ncohen12 at comcast.net Thu Dec 29 14:16:31 2005 From: ncohen12 at comcast.net (Norm Cohen) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 15:16:31 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions In-Reply-To: <000001c60c96$be3fd580$6601a8c0@Bob> Message-ID: Bob It was a few years ago. As I recall, I emailed Dr Hari Sharma of the Univ of Toronto who was doing the actual TFP tests, and psoted his answers to the radsafe list. There may have been some personal communication from individual radsafers to Dr Sharma. I no longer have Sr Sharma's email addy, but I'm sure an enterprising radsafer could dig it up & ask him your questions. Norm Coalition for Peace and Justice; UNPLUG Salem Campaign, 321 Barr Ave, Linwood; NJ08221; 609-601-8583 -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Bob Shannon Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 11:42 AM To: 'RADSAFE' Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions I have taken some time to look through the Radsafe archives but to no avail. So I would like to pose this question again. At some point several years ago, there was a semi-detailed description of the method being used by the tooth fairy project to analyze teeth for Sr. Can anyone point me to this post? Thanks! Bob Shannon Kaiser Analytical Management Services 303-432-1137 -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Baratta, Edmond J Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 6:57 AM To: 'Franz Sch?nhofer'; RADSAFE Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Good morning Franz: I had asked that question earlier about Strontium-90. The amount of Radium-226 in foods (where it would be ingested from) was been shown to be <0.037 Bq/kg). The U.S. Public Health Service in the 60's (1964-1967) did Studies on Diets of children. It was reported in "Evaluation of Radium-226 in Total Diet Samples, June 1964 to July 1967" U.S. Public Health Service, Radiological Health Data and Reports 6:371-377 (1969). Also similar work was done by Fisenne, J.M.and H. W. Walker "Radium-226 in the Diet in two Cities", U.S. AEC Report HASL-24 (1970). Strontium-90 in bones was also done during that time. The samples were taken from accident victims. The samples were much larger and it did show the trend that younger person's Strontium-90 content was higher than older ones. The article was "Strontium-90 in Human Bone from infancy to Adulthood 1962-1963" by Gaffney, G.W. et al, Radiological Health Data and Reports, 7:383-386 (1966). This was during the during the above ground weapons testing days. The samples of infants teeth are very small and unless they are composited, it is difficult to see how they could measure these low levels. Ed Edmond J. Baratta Radiation Safety Officer Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 Fax: 781-729-3593 edmond.baratta at fda.gov -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Franz Sch?nhofer Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:01 PM To: RADSAFE Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Dear RADSAFErs, Thanks to those who gave me hints and links which help me with my first questions. The next question is, whether anybody has data available about the concentration of Radium-226 (and Ra-228) in human teeth and/or bones. One of the links showed, that actually the Ra-226 was not separated contrary to what I had in memory. The description of the analytical process in one of the links was further obscured by false information about the instrument used (Quantulus). Therefore I would like to estimate what the error in Sr-90 concentration could be when not taking Ra-226 into account. Of course I know, that the Ra-226 concentration will depend on the environment - as well as the Sr-90 concentration. One more question to the US-American RADSAFErs: I find a Joseph J. Mangano, MPH MBA not only as the National Coordinator of the RPHP website, but also as an author of "Radioactive Strontium-90 in baby teeth of New Jersey children and the link with cancer: A special report. I know that MBA means "Master of Business Administration", but what does MPH mean? Master of Physics? Master of Philosophy? That MBA does not really point towards a scientific background seems to be clear, but does MPH? Thanks again for a very fast reply. Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From idias at interchange.ubc.ca Thu Dec 29 14:50:13 2005 From: idias at interchange.ubc.ca (John R Johnson) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 12:50:13 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] sr90 from noble gases In-Reply-To: <200512292025.jBTKPpwD022944@mta6.mail-relay.ubc.ca> Message-ID: Norm et al Sr-90 (halflife ~= 27 years) is the progeny of Rb-90 (halflife ~= 3 minutes) which is the progeny of Kr-90 (halflife ~= 35 seconds). All 3 are fission products so the amount of Sr-90 produced from decay will depend on the time and filtering of that fission gases have. John _________________ John R Johnson, Ph.D. ***** President, IDIAS, Inc 4535 West 9-Th Ave Vancouver B. C. V6R 2E2 (604) 222-9840 idias at interchange.ubc.ca ***** or most mornings Consultant in Radiation Protection TRIUMF 4004 Wesbrook Mall Vancouver B. C. V6R 2E2 (604) 222-1047 Ext. 6610 Fax: (604) 222-7309 johnsjr at triumf.ca -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl]On Behalf Of Norm Cohen Sent: December 29, 2005 10:09 AM To: 'RADSAFE' Subject: [ RadSafe ] sr90 from noble gases Guys and gals, Somewhere I read that sr90 could be produced from the decay of noble gases emitted from nuke plants. What can you all tell me about this? Norm Coalition for Peace and Justice; UNPLUG Salem Campaign, 321 Barr Ave, Linwood; NJ08221; 609-601-8583 _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From GRAHNK at comcast.net Thu Dec 29 14:55:58 2005 From: GRAHNK at comcast.net (GRAHNK at comcast.net) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 20:55:58 +0000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH Message-ID: <122920052055.14716.43B44D5E00099B1E0000397C2206824693B5B2B8BEADB9@comcast.net> Thanks Sandy, As a graduate of the University of Michigan Radiation Protection Program, and one of Phil Plato's students, I can tell you that rad protection requirements for graduation for either an MS or an MPH degree were identical and included a thesis and an internship. The MPH takes a semester longer because of the additional required coursework in General Environmental Health, Epidemiology, and Biostatistics. The MPH is administered by the School of Public Health, and the MS is administered by the Rackham Graduate School. Essentially no difference. Kelly F. Grahn (MS, Uof M SPH '89) Radioactive Materials Specialist Illinois Emergency Management Agency Division of Nuclear Safety, Bureau of Environmental Safety 800 Weyrauch Street West Chicago, IL 60185 phone 630-293-6348 fax 630-293-6349 cell 630-947-2721 24 Hour: 217-782-7860 -------------- Original message -------------- From: "Sandy Perle" > On 29 Dec 2005 at 0:34, farbersa at optonline.net wrote: > > > Many MPH or MSPH programs involve extensive coursework in > > biostatistics and epidemiology so don't be too quick to dismiss an > > analysis of some issue based solely on the individual having an MPH > > degree. > > I agree! Dr. Phil Plato, formerly at University of Michigan and > responsible for the first Draft NVLAP Program, and also responsible > for leading the 1st Performance Test Lab back in the '80s, has a MPH. > > Sad how some automatically judge a person by their credentials, > without any real evidence, background or knowledge. Not very > scientific ... is it? > > ------------------------------------- > Sandy Perle > Senior Vice President, Technical Operations > Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. > 2652 McGaw Avenue > Irvine, CA 92614 > > Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 > Fax:(949) 296-1144 > > E-Mail: sperle at dosimetry.com > E-Mail: sandyfl at earthlink.net > > Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ > Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the > RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From loc at icx.net Thu Dec 29 16:47:29 2005 From: loc at icx.net (Susan Gawarecki) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 17:47:29 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Spallation Neutron Source Amazing Science Facts Message-ID: <43B46781.6050200@icx.net> Spallation Neutron Source Amazing Science Facts OAK RIDGE, Tenn. Dec. 22, 2005 -- The New Year is bringing the science community a grand present: The Spallation Neutron Source at Oak Ridge National Laboratory. On schedule for completion in 2006, the Department of Energy's new science facility will provide researchers with the world's most powerful and most advanced tool for analyzing a host of materials with neutrons. As they home in on the fruition of seven years of construction, SNS staff members have compiled the following list of SNS Amazing Science Facts to illustrate what's in store for the neutron science community once this state-of-the-art, world-class materials research facility starts up around mid-year. Read on and prepare to say "Wow." Around the world: The energy of the SNS's proton beam, expressed in terms of voltage, is 1 billion electron volts. That is equivalent to 666 million 1.5-volt D-cell batteries joined end to end. Such a string of these batteries would nearly reach around the Earth! Fast off the line: The proton beam accelerates through the linear accelerator (linac) from a standstill to approximately 90 percent of the speed of light in two microseconds! Now that's cold: The SNS's linac takes advantage of superconducting technology: Approximately two-thirds of the linac's total 1000 feet is at superconducting temperature, chilled with liquid helium to 2 degrees above absolute zero, or 2 Kelvin. How cold is that? By comparison, a December night-game spectator at the Green Bay Packers' Lambeau Field should dress to endure a comparatively toasty 275 Kelvin! Flurry of punches: Following 1,060 turns around an accumulator ring, 150 trillion accelerated protons (150,000,000,000,000) strike the target in a pulse that lasts only one millionth of a second. These pulses strike the target 60 times per second! Ouch: The pulses strike the target vessel at enough energy to release neutrons from atoms--neutrons that are then used for research. That energy is similar to a 200-pound block of steel hitting the vessel at 50 mph! Over the horizon: The SNS requires the tuning of the beam lines to be so precise that the Earth's curvature was factored into the construction of the linear accelerator?a tiny but critical difference of 7 millimeters from one end of the 1,000-foot linac to the other! Fine as frog's hair: All components on the SNS that comprise the accelerator and the target, independent of size, shape and weight, are installed to specifications within a mite-sized 2/10 of a millimeter! Plugged in: Beam power in the linac is 1.4 megawatts, enough juice to power 1,400 homes. It will require 42 megawatts of electricity to generate those 1.4 megawatts of beam power. The total SNS electric bill will be, at current rates, $10 million a year, or enough power to serve a town of roughly 30,000! Admiration from afar: The SNS will increase the number and intensity of neutrons for research by factors from 10- to 100-fold. So intense that, once the SNS is operational, no one will ever again enter the target bay. All maintenance operations inside the target--even changing light bulbs--will be performed remotely, with state-of-the-art robotic manipulators Because they have to be performed robotically, all anticipated remote operations inside the target facility, for the 40-year design life of the SNS, have been planned and practiced beforehand! Thick as a brick: Shielding over the tunnel into the target facility "monolith" consists of 7 feet of steel and 2 feet of concrete. The target facility floor is 5 feet thick. There are 12 million pounds of steel shielding in the monolith alone, and 4 million pounds of concrete! Chock full o'neutrons: The SNS is the first facility to use pure mercury as a target material. Why? The liquid mercury can be continuously circulated, thus dissipating the enormous heat and energy. Mercury is also rich in neutrons--the average mercury nucleus has 120 neutrons--and consequently, has a very large mass. The target's 20 tons of mercury is only one cubic meter in size! Come together: Five Department of Energy Office of Science laboratories--Argonne, Berkeley, Brookhaven, Jefferson and Los Alamos--participated with Oak Ridge in the design of the SNS project. The $1.4 billion Basic Energy Sciences project has been constructed on time and on budget with an excellent safety record. But the most remarkable aspect of the SNS is the science that will be performed there in the years ahead. Researchers from the United States and abroad--an estimated 2,000 a year--are poised to come to the SNS to study materials that will form the basis for new technologies in telecommunications, manufacturing, transportation, information, biotechnology and health. This broad range of scientific impact will strengthen the nation?s economy, energy security and national security. Oak Ridge National Laboratory is a multiprogram laboratory managed for the Department of Energy by UT-Battelle. From jmarshall.reber at comcast.net Thu Dec 29 17:21:15 2005 From: jmarshall.reber at comcast.net (J. Marshall Reber) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 18:21:15 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA Message-ID: Holy Moly! A pickup truck carrying EMPTY radioactive and biohazard containers turns over but the highway is shut down for hours because the driver can't speak English and verify their emptyness. From StevenFrey at aol.com Thu Dec 29 17:35:27 2005 From: StevenFrey at aol.com (StevenFrey at aol.com) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 18:35:27 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] sr90 from noble gases Message-ID: <222.5793db6.30e5ccbf@aol.com> We certainly can, Norm. Your question shows that you don't understand this science. With due respect, why should we waste our time educating you? You don't trust any of us in here, anyway. We're all nuclear liars in your mind. Recommendation: enroll in a radiation sciences program at a credible college or university. See. Learn. Do. You might even enjoy the academic journey toward enlightenment. Your old friend, Steve In a message dated 12/29/2005 3:52:10 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, ncohen12 at comcast.net writes: Guys and gals, Somewhere I read that sr90 could be produced from the decay of noble gases emitted from nuke plants. What can you all tell me about this? Norm Coalition for Peace and Justice; UNPLUG Salem Campaign, 321 Barr Ave, Linwood; NJ08221; 609-601-8583 _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From radiation at cox.net Thu Dec 29 21:29:47 2005 From: radiation at cox.net (Mitchell W. Davis) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 21:29:47 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH In-Reply-To: <43B39219.28389.547552F@localhost> Message-ID: <20051230032748.MWUU4002.centrmmtao06.cox.net@yourae066c3a9b> Sandy wrote: Sad how some automatically judge a person by their credentials, without any real evidence, background or knowledge. Not very scientific ... is it? Or lack there of (the illustrious "piece of paper"...Seems I raised the hackles of many on here sometime back about the requirement for a BS (take that however you wish) degree as a requirement to become a CHP). Seems credentials were the ONLY thing that meant an individual was "qualified" to sit for the CHP exam. What is sad is that so many take stock in a piece of paper than an individual's true knowledge base. Was this argument hypocrisy? I do believe it was. Mitchell Davis, RRPT (Soon to be RN and leaving this industry for greener pastures) Midland, TX -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Sandy Perle Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 9:37 AM To: Franz Sch?nhofer; farbersa at optonline.net Cc: RADSAFE Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] MPH On 29 Dec 2005 at 0:34, farbersa at optonline.net wrote: > Many MPH or MSPH programs involve extensive coursework in > biostatistics and epidemiology so don't be too quick to dismiss an > analysis of some issue based solely on the individual having an MPH > degree. I agree! Dr. Phil Plato, formerly at University of Michigan and responsible for the first Draft NVLAP Program, and also responsible for leading the 1st Performance Test Lab back in the '80s, has a MPH. Sad how some automatically judge a person by their credentials, without any real evidence, background or knowledge. Not very scientific ... is it? ------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 E-Mail: sperle at dosimetry.com E-Mail: sandyfl at earthlink.net Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From sandyfl at earthlink.net Thu Dec 29 21:37:13 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 19:37:13 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH In-Reply-To: <20051230032748.MWUU4002.centrmmtao06.cox.net@yourae066c3a9b> References: <43B39219.28389.547552F@localhost> Message-ID: <43B43AE9.30179.CC71508@localhost> On 29 Dec 2005 at 21:29, Mitchell W. Davis wrote: > Seems I raised the > hackles of many on here sometime back about the requirement for a BS > (take that however you wish) degree as a requirement to become a CHP). > Seems credentials were the ONLY thing that meant an individual was > "qualified" to sit for the CHP exam. What is sad is that so many take > stock in a piece of paper than an individual's true knowledge base. > Was this argument hypocrisy? I do believe it was. Mitchell, I hope that you'e not putting me in the camp of those that push for a degree before the CHP can be pursued. I for one stated that to me I'd rather have a person working for me who has an extensive knowledge of whatever field they are in when compared to many with a specific degree. In my 21 years at FPL, I worked with many who did not have a degree, but were the individuals I'd put my confidence in when a significant problem arose. However, there are many instances where a degree is essential. For whatever reason, when in front of a jury, the credentials are absolutely necessary, when very technical issues are discussed. I don't always agree that this is the case, but in many instances it is. There's nothing wrong with credentials. However, the case we're discussing here is criticism of an individual because of what is credentials are perceived to be. That is not correct either. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From radiation at cox.net Thu Dec 29 21:50:31 2005 From: radiation at cox.net (Mitchell W. Davis) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 21:50:31 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH In-Reply-To: <43B43AE9.30179.CC71508@localhost> Message-ID: <20051230034809.LVRD613.centrmmtao03.cox.net@yourae066c3a9b> No Sandy I was not putting you in "the camp"...And I appreciate your understand of true knowledge base. As far as credentials go, would you agree that the credential of CHP is the most significant in our field and would stand up in a litigious environment regardless of college degree? Mitch Davis -----Original Message----- From: Sandy Perle [mailto:sandyfl at earthlink.net] Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 9:37 PM To: 'Franz Sch?nhofer'; farbersa at optonline.net; Mitchell W. Davis Cc: 'RADSAFE' Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] MPH On 29 Dec 2005 at 21:29, Mitchell W. Davis wrote: > Seems I raised the > hackles of many on here sometime back about the requirement for a BS > (take that however you wish) degree as a requirement to become a CHP). > Seems credentials were the ONLY thing that meant an individual was > "qualified" to sit for the CHP exam. What is sad is that so many take > stock in a piece of paper than an individual's true knowledge base. > Was this argument hypocrisy? I do believe it was. Mitchell, I hope that you'e not putting me in the camp of those that push for a degree before the CHP can be pursued. I for one stated that to me I'd rather have a person working for me who has an extensive knowledge of whatever field they are in when compared to many with a specific degree. In my 21 years at FPL, I worked with many who did not have a degree, but were the individuals I'd put my confidence in when a significant problem arose. However, there are many instances where a degree is essential. For whatever reason, when in front of a jury, the credentials are absolutely necessary, when very technical issues are discussed. I don't always agree that this is the case, but in many instances it is. There's nothing wrong with credentials. However, the case we're discussing here is criticism of an individual because of what is credentials are perceived to be. That is not correct either. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From sandyfl at earthlink.net Thu Dec 29 21:59:19 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 19:59:19 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH In-Reply-To: <20051230034809.LVRD613.centrmmtao03.cox.net@yourae066c3a9b> References: <43B43AE9.30179.CC71508@localhost> Message-ID: <43B44017.20222.CDB51E1@localhost> On 29 Dec 2005 at 21:50, Mitchell W. Davis wrote: > As far as credentials go, would you > agree that the credential of CHP is the most significant in our field > and would stand up in a litigious environment regardless of college > degree? I personally don't subscribe to the notion that the CHP behind one's name is the most significant validation point, be it in the work environment or in a court litigation. I think what is important is the entire picture, and the CHP is certainly one of the important factors. A CHP is like any other individual, and their expertise may be in one or several areas. Therefore, unless they have real experience to go along with the CHP, they're only as good as what they read about, and not actually living the subject. Those who I've had the most respect for in my power reactor days are those who not only didn't have a CHP, but no degree at all. They did know how to solve problems though, and I know too many CHPs, Ph.Ds and others who simply can't think on their feet. In other words, unless they have the map in front of them, they trip over their own feet. I want to reiterate that this is not a generalization. It is based on my 35 years in the industry. Maybe I'm getting too cynical in my old age! :) ---------------------------------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From didi at tgi-sci.com Thu Dec 29 22:52:22 2005 From: didi at tgi-sci.com (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Dimiter=20Popoff?=) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 06:52:22 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Re: Rt. 9 in MA Message-ID: <20051230045222.10639.qmail@server318.com> Seems to be a plague nowadays... These days I heard an English football coach complain that some of his substitute players were running wild over the pitch rather than take the position he had told them because they did not speak a word English. Just imagine the guy slowly giving his explanations to a nodding player and his face seconds after the player takes off... His English was not the easiest to understand, though - came close (well, not too close) to my limit. At least when interviewed by the media. Unlike another, more famous colleague of his, who hopelessly crosses this limit of mine. The fact that he is Scottish does not alter much since he is the only Scottsman I fail to understand so far over the radio... But wait, not so long ago, when I thought he was the only person speaking on the BBC some language I could not understand his team was joined by an English youth, a very talented player, whose speech is a duplica of that of his Scottish coach as far as my input channels are concerned... :-) :-) :-) Have a lot of fun during the upcoming year, Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ > -------Original Message------- > From: J. Marshall Reber > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA > Sent: Dec 30 '05 01:21 > > Holy Moly! A pickup truck carrying EMPTY radioactive and biohazard > containers turns over but the highway is shut down for hours because the > driver can't speak English and verify their emptyness. > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From sandyfl at earthlink.net Thu Dec 29 23:03:01 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 21:03:01 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <43B44F05.10262.D15A2C6@localhost> On 29 Dec 2005 at 18:21, J. Marshall Reber wrote: > highway is shut down for hours because the > driver can't speak English and verify their emptyness And there wasn't a detector in sight! Anyone really believe that we're ready to handle a real radiation type incident! If one should ever occur, it will make the response to Hurricane Katrina look like a walk in the park! ---------------------------------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From obbugg at gsp.net Fri Dec 30 07:40:21 2005 From: obbugg at gsp.net (O.Bruce Bugg) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 08:40:21 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA Message-ID: Any links to other news articles? The only ones I found don't mention a language barrier. http://www.boston.com/news/local/massachusetts/articles/2005/12/29/truck _rollover_causing_problems_on_route_9/ Two stories http://www.thebostonchannel.com/newsarchive/5710505/detail.html and http://www1.whdh.com/news/articles/local/BOS11702/ indicate that there were meters present. With what I understand to be THE major manufacturer of radiopharmaceuticals in the greater Boston area, one would hope that responders are a little better versed. But maybe not, because like everywhere else, the number of incidents involving radioactive materials transport is virtually non-existent. I think I've been to four in Georgia in 20 years, and one of those was precipitated by theft of the courier vehicle. If the driver ever carries Yellow-III, then he needs CDL and is subject to the English language requirements of the Motor Carrier Safety Regulations. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Capt. Bruce Bugg Georgia Department of Public Safety Motor Carrier Compliance Division P.O. Box 1456 Atlanta , GA 30371-1456 Phone: 404.624.7211 or 7210 Fax: 404.624.7295 e-mail: obbugg(at)gsp.net [replace "(at)" with "@"] -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of J.Marshall Reber Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 18:21 To: RadSafe Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA Holy Moly! A pickup truck carrying EMPTY radioactive and biohazard containers turns over but the highway is shut down for hours because the driver can't speak English and verify their emptyness. _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From jmarshall.reber at comcast.net Fri Dec 30 07:54:18 2005 From: jmarshall.reber at comcast.net (J. Marshall Reber) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 08:54:18 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA In-Reply-To: Message-ID: My source of info was a TV news report. On Friday, December 30, 2005, at 08:40 , O.Bruce Bugg wrote: > Any links to other news articles? The only ones I found don't mention a > language barrier. From LNMolino at aol.com Fri Dec 30 07:55:19 2005 From: LNMolino at aol.com (LNMolino at aol.com) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 08:55:19 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA Message-ID: <42.77a94626.30e69647@aol.com> In a message dated 12/30/2005 7:52:49 A.M. Central Standard Time, obbugg at gsp.net writes: With what I understand to be THE major manufacturer of radiopharmaceuticals in the greater Boston area, one would hope that responders are a little better versed. I think you'd be wrong to hope that and foolish to believe it was true! I agree BTW that it's the shear lack of incidents even in 2005 post 9/11 with all the WMD/CBRNE training and money and at times hype that causes the "failures" we see like this. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino at aol.com 979-690-7559 (Office) 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the original author. From jmarshall.reber at comcast.net Fri Dec 30 08:02:28 2005 From: jmarshall.reber at comcast.net (J. Marshall Reber) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 09:02:28 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA In-Reply-To: <43B44F05.10262.D15A2C6@localhost> Message-ID: The TV news mentioned the use of a "geiger counter by the suited, state HazMat Team; the implication was the highway was shut down until they arrived and assessed the situation. The other implication was that the first responders had no ability to assess the radiation. On Friday, December 30, 2005, at 12:03 , Sandy Perle wrote: > And there wasn't a detector in sight! From blc+ at pitt.edu Fri Dec 30 09:03:19 2005 From: blc+ at pitt.edu (Bernard Cohen) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 10:03:19 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] sr90 from noble gases In-Reply-To: <01LX51BVTFB000SO17@mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu> References: <01LX51BVTFB000SO17@mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu> Message-ID: <43B54C37.8080805@pitt.edu> Kr-90 decays into Rb-90 which decays into Sr-90, but the half life of Kr-90 is only 33 seconds, so it would have to diffuse out of the fuel pin (if that pin was defective) and carried with the water to the point where a small fraction of the water is diverted to and through the demineralizer bed before its decay products could escape removal in the demineralizer bed. Only a tiny fraction of Kr-90 atoms could do all of this within their 33 second half life limitation. Norm Cohen wrote: >Guys and gals, > >Somewhere I read that sr90 could be produced from the decay of noble gases >emitted from nuke plants. What can you all tell me about this? > > > >Norm > > > >Coalition for Peace and Justice; UNPLUG Salem Campaign, 321 Barr Ave, >Linwood; NJ08221; 609-601-8583 > > > >_______________________________________________ >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > From joel.baumbaugh at navy.mil Fri Dec 30 09:07:26 2005 From: joel.baumbaugh at navy.mil (Baumbaugh, Joel SPAWAR) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 07:07:26 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH Message-ID: <7DB6DF83D2CD9140ADA0622B1A05BF2F0166797E@nawespscez02.nadsuswe.nads.navy.mil> All, I started reading this "thread" a little late (too much to read, too little time), but I agree with Kelly's explanation below. I have both an MHP AND a MPH from San Diego State University. Both degree programs were, in my opinion, equally rigorous and quite complementary in their outlook/viewpoint on the world around us. I also TOTALLY agree with Sandy's observation of those with degrees not always being able to think on their feet (i.e. being totally dependent on their book-learning). Some of the "STUPIDEST" (not a politically correct word, I know) people I've ever met have the letters BS, MS, PHD and MD after their names, and some of the smartest have, or should have had, SHK (school of hard knocks) after theirs. My personal opinion only, not necessarily that of my employer (the U.S. Navy)... Joel Baumbaugh SSC-SD. Thanks Sandy, As a graduate of the University of Michigan Radiation Protection Program, and one of Phil Plato's students, I can tell you that rad protection requirements for graduation for either an MS or an MPH degree were identical and included a thesis and an internship. The MPH takes a semester longer because of the additional required coursework in General Environmental Health, Epidemiology, and Biostatistics. The MPH is administered by the School of Public Health, and the MS is administered by the Rackham Graduate School. Essentially no difference. -------------- Original message -------------- From: "Sandy Perle" > On 29 Dec 2005 at 0:34, farbersa at optonline.net wrote: > > > Many MPH or MSPH programs involve extensive coursework in > > biostatistics and epidemiology so don't be too quick to dismiss an > > analysis of some issue based solely on the individual having an MPH > > degree. > > I agree! Dr. Phil Plato, formerly at University of Michigan and > responsible for the first Draft NVLAP Program, and also responsible > for leading the 1st Performance Test Lab back in the '80s, has a MPH. > > Sad how some automatically judge a person by their credentials, > without any real evidence, background or knowledge. Not very > scientific ... is it? > > From sandyfl at earthlink.net Fri Dec 30 09:23:25 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 07:23:25 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA In-Reply-To: References: <43B44F05.10262.D15A2C6@localhost> Message-ID: <43B4E06D.10714.85ACB@localhost> On 30 Dec 2005 at 9:02, J. Marshall Reber wrote: > The other implication was that the first responders had no ability to > assess the radiation. Thanks for update ... the above seems to be the norm, unfortunately. Taking hours to clear an area where there was "most likely" no radiation readings, and I assume there were no residual readings from whatever the empty cannistres carried, is unacceptable. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From LNMolino at aol.com Fri Dec 30 11:34:10 2005 From: LNMolino at aol.com (LNMolino at aol.com) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 12:34:10 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA Message-ID: <66.66169e2b.30e6c992@aol.com> In a message dated 12/30/2005 10:37:30 A.M. Central Standard Time, jmarshall.reber at comcast.net writes: "geiger counter by the suited, state HazMat Team To me there is also an issue over "suited". Did anyone see the Level of Protection worn? I bet it was way more than Anti- C's as in likely Level A. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino at aol.com 979-690-7559 (Office) 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the original author. From EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV Fri Dec 30 11:56:15 2005 From: EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV (Baratta, Edmond J) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 12:56:15 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA Message-ID: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA86@orsnewea002.fda.gov> The Massachusetts State Police have detectors in their Patrol Cars!! Edmond J. Baratta Radiation Safety Officer Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 Fax: 781-729-3593 edmond.baratta at fda.gov -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of J. Marshall Reber Sent: Friday, December 30, 2005 9:02 AM To: sandyfl at earthlink.net Cc: RadSafe Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA The TV news mentioned the use of a "geiger counter by the suited, state HazMat Team; the implication was the highway was shut down until they arrived and assessed the situation. The other implication was that the first responders had no ability to assess the radiation. On Friday, December 30, 2005, at 12:03 , Sandy Perle wrote: > And there wasn't a detector in sight! _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From d-i-menchaca at tamu.edu Fri Dec 30 12:09:27 2005 From: d-i-menchaca at tamu.edu (Menchaca, Daniel I) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 12:09:27 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Job Opportunity at Texas A&M University. Message-ID: <9D876F823E07C64C945268B8D245671173DCC5@vpfn4.tamu.edu> All, Here is a posting for a Health Physicist at Texas A&M University in College Station, Texas. It is a full-time job with benefits. To view the job posting, navigate to http://tamujobs.tamu.edu/ and select 'Search Postings' on the left navigation pane. Enter 060502 in the 'N.O.V. Number' search box, press the 'Search' button and the job should pop up. To review the specifics (or apply), click on 'View' in the Position Title box. To apply, select 'Apply for This Position'. Please do not send resumes directly to me, I can only consider applicants who apply through the web site. Regards, Dan Daniel I. Menchaca, MS, CHP Radiological Safety Environmental Health and Safety Department (EHSD) Texas A&M University 4472 TAMU College Station, Texas 77843-4472 Voice: 979-845-0063 Fax: 979-845-1348 mailto:d-i-menchaca at tamu.edu http://ehsd.tamu.edu From LNMolino at aol.com Fri Dec 30 14:46:30 2005 From: LNMolino at aol.com (LNMolino at aol.com) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 15:46:30 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA Message-ID: <26d.360d8d1.30e6f6a6@aol.com> In a message dated 12/30/2005 1:14:11 P.M. Central Standard Time, sandyfl at earthlink.net writes: Thanks for update ... the above seems to be the norm, unfortunately. Taking hours to clear an area where there was "most likely" no radiation readings, and I assume there were no residual readings from whatever the empty canisters carried, is unacceptable. >From my perspective it's more likely an inability to accurately assess any reading that is gotten background or above background. A trained dog can operate a meter, you have to have someone that can interpret said readings then make a decision on actions or inactions with some type of realistic risk assessment in place. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino at aol.com 979-690-7559 (Office) 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the original author. From LNMolino at aol.com Fri Dec 30 15:18:18 2005 From: LNMolino at aol.com (LNMolino at aol.com) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 16:18:18 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA Message-ID: <242.487680d.30e6fe1a@aol.com> In a message dated 12/30/2005 3:14:48 P.M. Central Standard Time, EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV writes: The Massachusetts State Police have detectors in their Patrol Cars!! And their level of training and UNDERSTANDING of the units use and limitations and intent of such use? Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino at aol.com 979-690-7559 (Office) 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the original author. From sandyfl at earthlink.net Fri Dec 30 17:53:57 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 15:53:57 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA In-Reply-To: <26d.360d8d1.30e6f6a6@aol.com> Message-ID: <43B55815.22726.1DBC33A@localhost> On 30 Dec 2005 at 15:46, LNMolino at aol.com wrote: > A trained dog can operate a meter, you have to have someone that can > interpret said readings then make a decision on actions or inactions > with some type of realistic risk assessment in place. I agree absolutely. The problem is there are detectors out there, but the majority of those using the detectors don't have a clue as to what the readings mean. Hence, businesses and roads continue to be closed for hours where there is no need to do so. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From joseroze at netvision.net.il Sat Dec 31 01:05:51 2005 From: joseroze at netvision.net.il (Jose Julio Rozental) Date: Sat, 31 Dec 2005 10:05:51 +0300 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA References: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA86@orsnewea002.fda.gov> Message-ID: <008a01c60dd8$a4a1c500$840118ac@userqzqxd9wnct> IAEA Training customs, police http://www.iaea.org/NewsCenter/Features/NuclearSecurity/index.html http://www.iaea.org/Publications/Factsheets/English/nuclsecurity.pdf http://www.iaea.org/NewsCenter/News/2005/securityconf.html http://www.iaea.org/NewsCenter/News/2005/nuclear_security.html Jose Julio Rozental joseroze at netvision.net.il Israel ----- Original Message ----- From: "Baratta, Edmond J" To: "'J. Marshall Reber'" ; Cc: "RadSafe" Sent: Friday, December 30, 2005 8:56 PM Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA > The Massachusetts State Police have detectors in their Patrol Cars!! > > Edmond J. Baratta > Radiation Safety Officer > Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 > Fax: 781-729-3593 > edmond.baratta at fda.gov > > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf > Of J. Marshall Reber > Sent: Friday, December 30, 2005 9:02 AM > To: sandyfl at earthlink.net > Cc: RadSafe > Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA > > The TV news mentioned the use of a "geiger counter by the suited, state > HazMat Team; the implication was the highway was shut down until they > arrived and assessed the situation. The other implication was that the > first responders had no ability to assess the radiation. > > On Friday, December 30, 2005, at 12:03 , Sandy Perle wrote: > > > And there wasn't a detector in sight! > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the > RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From bcradsafers at hotmail.com Thu Dec 1 03:59:51 2005 From: bcradsafers at hotmail.com (Bjorn Cedervall) Date: Thu, 01 Dec 2005 09:59:51 +0000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] New Radiation Protection Unit? The Taylor (Ty) In-Reply-To: <018f01c5f076$048a8040$6801a8c0@S0029339641> Message-ID: >Personally, I would not want to sully the great reputation of Lauriston Taylor by linking it to some of the recent ruminations of the ICRP. Nowadays there are great opportunities to get involved in the development of the ICRP publications including those related to dosimetry. Next major draft of the recommendations will be very important so please involve with constructive criticism (practical aspects included). Concerning the LNT concept (which was commented again by some Radsafers) - it is mainly there for decision making (chosing between alternatives) - not counting future cancer cases. This aspect has, during recent years, repetedly been emphasized by ICRP representatives. (I usually delete most Radsafers arguments about the LNT because most of the discussion leads nowhere - the epidemiological resolution must always be poor as the dose goes down - the world of cell biology indicates phenomena that could go either way). My personal ideas only, Bjorn Cedervall bcradsafers at hotmail.com From frantaj at aecl.ca Thu Dec 1 07:40:22 2005 From: frantaj at aecl.ca (Franta, Jaroslav) Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2005 08:40:22 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Patrick Moore to speak in Montreal, Monday, December 5, 2005 -- C OP 11/ MOP 1 Message-ID: <0F8BD87EE693D411A1A500508BAC86F70B4F5238@sps13.aecl.ca> Let's Take a Fresh Look at Nuclear as Part of the Solution Side Event organized by ENS YGN and NA-YGN and featuring Dr. Patrick Moore, Co-founder of Greenpeace Founder of Greenspirit Monday, December 5, 2005 19:30-21:00 Room Mackenzie River Palais des Congr?s de Montr?al Theme: As the debates on finding solutions to mitigate global climate change while ensuring the security of electricity supply continue, many leading politicians and scientists are calling for swift reconsideration of the role of nuclear power. This side event aims to present facts and concerns that will lead to an effective discussion on which criteria and values should be considered when determining the possible role of nuclear power in addressing environmental and economic issues. Presenting his thoughts on how nuclear power must be part of the solution to global warming will be Dr. Patrick Moore. Keynote Speaker: Dr. Moore has been a leader in the international environmental field for over 30 years. He is a founding member of Greenpeace and served for nine years as President of Greenpeace Canada and seven years as a Director of Greenpeace International. Dr Moore led many campaigns and was a driving force in shaping the policy and activities that made Greenpeace the world's largest environmental activist organization. Recently, Dr. Moore has worked to promote sustainability and create consensus among those with competing concerns. He was appointed to the British Columbia Round Table on the Environment and Economy and served from 1990 to 1994. In 1990, Dr. Moore founded and chaired the BC Carbon Project, a group that endeavoured to develop a common understanding of climate change In 1991 Dr. Moore founded Greenspirit, a consultancy focusing on environmental policy and communications in natural resources, biodiversity, energy and climate change. In 2000, he published Green Spirit - Trees are the Answer, a book that provides new insight into how forests work and the powerful role they can play in solving many of our current environmental problems. Moderators: * Ms. Lisa Stiles-Shell, President, North American Young Generation in Nuclear (NA-YGN) * Martin Luthander, Representative (Sweden), European Nuclear Society Young Generation Network (ENS YGN) *Snacks and refreshments will be served at the end of the event. For more information, please visit our websites: NA-YGN: http://www.na-ygn.org ENS YGN: http://www.euronuclear.org/aboutus/yg/young.htm CONFIDENTIAL AND PRIVILEGED INFORMATION NOTICE This e-mail, and any attachments, may contain information that is confidential, subject to copyright, or exempt from disclosure. Any unauthorized review, disclosure, retransmission, dissemination or other use of or reliance on this information may be unlawful and is strictly prohibited. AVIS D'INFORMATION CONFIDENTIELLE ET PRIVIL?GI?E Le pr?sent courriel, et toute pi?ce jointe, peut contenir de l'information qui est confidentielle, r?gie par les droits d'auteur, ou interdite de divulgation. Tout examen, divulgation, retransmission, diffusion ou autres utilisations non autoris?es de l'information ou d?pendance non autoris?e envers celle-ci peut ?tre ill?gale et est strictement interdite. From Joseph_Ring at Harvard.edu Thu Dec 1 10:27:41 2005 From: Joseph_Ring at Harvard.edu (Joseph Ring) Date: Thu, 01 Dec 2005 11:27:41 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Lead Technician Opening at Harvard Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20051201112607.042f34f0@camail.harvard.edu> I would appreciate it if you would help me by passing this announcement for a lead HP tech to those who may be interested. If some one is interested in the position they can contact me directly, but the application must be made on the website (see below) to meet University requirements. Joe Ring Harvard University Radiation Protection Office Lead Technician Duties and Responsibilities This position is the lead field person for radiation safety services supporting the world class research at the University and some Harvard affiliated institutions. The Radiation Protection Office (RPO) is a program that currently services over 4,200 users on 10 campuses with an expanding customer base. This position joins a group of more than 40 technical professionals providing safety services to the University. The successful candidate leads the field services to ensure prompt and effective delivery of services. Monitors implementation status and conducts quality assurance of operational services. Candidate must be creative and energetic to motivate and lead staff to deliver exceptionally high quality radiation safety services and outstanding customer service. Required Education: This position requires a college or technical school graduate with course work related to health physics or environmental sciences preferred, or an equivalent combination of education, training and work experience. Three or more years related work experience in radiation protection program required. Candidate must possess a valid Massachusetts license and must have or be capable of obtaining a Commercial Drivers License. Candidate must possess strong oral and written communications skills and must be proficient in the use of computers. Must take initiative, be organized, able to manage multiple priorities, work independently and as part of a team. May be required to wear a respirator and other personal protective equipment. Must be capable of responding to emergencies and receive requisite training. Overtime may be occasionally required. UOS requires pre-employment drug, reference and background screening. Qualified candidates should apply on-line at www.atwork.harvard.edu Requisition #24981. Joseph P. Ring, Ph.D., CHP Radiation Safety Officer Harvard University 175 North Harvard Street Boston, MA 02134 Telephone: 617 495-8795 FAX: 617 496-5509 Email: Joseph_ring at harvard.edu Radiation Protection Office email: radiation_protection at harvard.edu http://www.uos.harvard.edu/ehs/rad.shtml This document may contain information that is privileged, CONFIDENTIAL and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient, please destroy the email and notify me immediately, as the use of this information is strictly prohibited. From fd003f0606 at blueyonder.co.uk Thu Dec 1 11:04:12 2005 From: fd003f0606 at blueyonder.co.uk (Fred Dawson) Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2005 17:04:12 -0000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] It pays to question the media Message-ID: <002301c5f699$409f2d50$0400a8c0@DG47BM0J> I recently had cause to complain to the BBC about an article on their news web site about Iraq, the environment and depleted uranium. The original article contained a photograph of a child with an eye tumour suggesting a link between the tumour and exposure to depleted uranium. I complained on the basis that there was no evidence to support the link between depleted uranium and eye tumours. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4425562.stm The BBC acknowledged my point and changed the caption on the photograph in question, here is their reply Dear Mr Dawson Thank you for your e-mail regarding BBC News Online. May I start by apologising for the delay in replying. We know our correspondents expect a swift response and I am sorry that you have had to wait so long on this occasion. I rasied your concerns about the picture and caption which accompanies the 'UN warns on Iraq environment fate' piece with BBC News Online. They explained that the picture of Alla Saleem was supplied to the BBC as one of a number of cases at Gazwan hospital in Basra which doctors have attributed to depleted uranium shells used by coalition forces. However, as the article itself does not mention the particular case of Alla Saleem they have decided, to amend the caption to a more general point about Iraqi health. The picture caption has now been changed from "Alla Saleem developed an eye tumour linked to depleted uranium (Pic: 2001)" to "Iraqi doctors say cancer cases have increased, especially among children". Thank you again for contacting the BBC. Yours sincerely Stewart McCullough Divisional Advisor BBC Information ---Original Message--- {Comments:} Please can you provide evidence to support your claim in the report on the News WWW site http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4425562.stm releating to Iraq that 'la Saleem developed an eye tumour linked to depleted uranium' To the best of my knowledge there is no scientific or factual basis for this assertion {EndofComments:} ----------------------------------- fwp_dawson at hotmail.com From David.Wesley at ehs.ucr.edu Thu Dec 1 11:56:53 2005 From: David.Wesley at ehs.ucr.edu (Wesley, David) Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2005 09:56:53 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] FW: Call for papers, CSHEMA Conf 2006 Message-ID: <2FDAAD8654C69E4585917F55804580E2CAE504@ehs.ucr.edu> Join us for the 2006 CSHEMA Conference at the Disneyland Resort in Anaheim, California-- The nation's premiere conference on campus health, safety and environmental management! Campus Safety Health and Environmental Management Association CSHEMA CONFERENCE 2006 DISNEYLAND RESORT, ANAHEIM, CALIFORNIA CALL FOR PAPERS Submittals Accepted January 2 - March 31, 2006! Conference dates: July 15-19, 2006 Professional Development Seminars, July 15-16, Technical Sessions, July 17-19 The Nation's Premiere Conference on Campus Health, Safety and Environmental Management! CSHEMA provides information sharing opportunities, continuing education, and professional fellowship to people with environmental health and safety responsibilities in the education and research communities. Visit www.cshema.org/ to learn more about CSHEMA. Real World Solutions! The annual CSHEMA conference focuses on practical and interdisciplinary issues facing university and college campuses. At CSHEMA 2006, you will interact with other campus health, safety and environmental professionals and learn what programs in the following focus areas are successful. Please check the conference website at www.cshema2006.org for more information. Focus Areas Emergency Management Management Issues Health * Severe Weather * Wildfires * Earthquakes * Pandemic Planning * Program Management * Management Systems & Metrics * Biosafety * Nanotechnology Safety Environment Other Issues * Fire/ Life Safety * Accident Prevention * General Safety * Training * Laboratory Safety * Safety for Non-Safety Professionals * Hazardous Materials Security/ Risk Assessment * Sustainability * EPA * Waste * Green Chemistry * Size and Scope * Small Campus Challenges * Regional and International * Canada * Europe * Asia * Southern California Technical Session Format * Presentations * Roundtables * Workshops * An Expanded Poster Session! Schedule Technical Sessions will be scheduled all day Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday. Submittal Information Please see www.cshema2006.org for information on how to submit your abstract. Abstracts submitted from vendors must be partnered with a college or university representative that participates in a presentation. Contact Information Contact the Technical Committee Chair, Ross Grayson at ross.grayson at ucr.edu or 951-827-6324 if you have any questions. Hosted by the University of California, Irvine, and University of California, Riverside Ross Grayson, M.P.H., C.I.H. Director Environmental Health and Safety University of California, Riverside Riverside, CA 92521 ross.grayson at ucr.edu 951-827-6324 Direct 951-827-5528 Admin 951-827-5122 Fax http://ehs.ucr.edu/ Join us for the 2006 CSHEMA Conference at the Disneyland Resort in Anaheim, California-- The nation's premiere conference on campus health, safety and environmental management! From loc at icx.net Thu Dec 1 14:53:06 2005 From: loc at icx.net (Susan Gawarecki) Date: Thu, 01 Dec 2005 15:53:06 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] High court backs 'sloshed' trucker - State justices: Hauler of OR waste disabled, due workers' comp Message-ID: <438F62B2.7030304@icx.net> High court backs 'sloshed' trucker - State justices: Hauler of OR waste disabled, due workers' comp Knoxville News Sentinel By JAMIE SATTERFIELD, satterfield at knews.com December 1, 2005 When William H. "Red" Saylor was "sloshed" with what he believed was radioactive waste, he freaked out. And, in an opinion released Wednesday, the [Tennessee] state Supreme Court is holding his employer responsible. In an opinion drafted by Justice Janice M. Holder, the state's high court upheld a lower court ruling that Saylor, though not physically injured, was rendered mentally disabled by the June 1999 incident and is entitled to collect workers' compensation from Lakeway Trucking Inc. in Morristown. "We conclude that the record and the applicable law support the trial court's determination that the employee's mental injuries arose out of and in the course of his employment and that the employee is 100 percent permanently disabled with respect to his mental faculties," Holder wrote. J. Eric Harrison, a Morristown lawyer who represented the 65-year-old Saylor with attorney J. Randall Shelton, said his client will be "thrilled" at the news. "Obviously, we're pleased and glad it was upheld," Harrison said. "This was an extremely complex and interesting case." Lakeway attorney Gene Paul Gaby was unavailable for comment Wednesday afternoon. Saylor has been a truck driver since he was 15. He dropped out of school in the eighth grade. In June 1999 he was working as a truck driver for Lakeway, which had been contracted to deliver hazardous waste from Oak Ridge to a dump site in Clive, Utah. According to the appellate court opinion, Saylor and fellow driver Lloyd Orrick arrived at the site only to be turned away. "The workers at the disposal site refused to accept either load and ordered Saylor to transport the material from the area because of fears that the material would explode," the opinion stated. After the two truckers parked their rigs at a truck stop overnight and returned to the dump site the next day, they were again turned away. The pair returned to the truck stop. But as Saylor was backing up his rig, "he saw Orrick standing near the trailer and waving his arms," the opinion stated. As it turned out, the pod housing the liquid waste had sprung a leak, Holder wrote. Some of the sludgy waste splashed onto Orrick's shirt. Some "sloshed" onto Saylor's face, chest and shirt, the court stated. "Saylor testified that the liquid went in his mouth and on the side of his face, on his chest and on his shirt," Holder wrote. "Saylor stated to Orrick, 'You've got it on you, and it's going to kill you. Now, if it ain't killed me, too, now.'?" The two showered and contacted a Lakeway employee, who told the pair to sit tight. Orrick apparently handled the wait far better than Saylor, who the court said "felt ill and was afraid that he and Orrick might die." Ultimately, Saylor's shirt was tested and the stuff on it deemed not radioactive. But the court noted that it took "more than two weeks" before Saylor "could be assured that his clothing provided no evidence of radioactivity." By then, Saylor was already in the throes of what doctors later diagnosed as post-traumatic stress syndrome, anxiety and depression, the opinion stated. Neighbors and a caregiver testified that Saylor was beset with anxiety and depression. He had such severe nightmares that his caregiver often tied her ankle to his at night so he wouldn't leap from the bed and hurt himself, the court wrote. A key issue for the high court was whether Saylor's fears were rational, noting that the court had refused to grant benefits in another case to a medical employee who had an "irrational fear of exposure to HIV" after a work-related incident. "In contrast, the hazardousness of the material to which Saylor was exposed was not based upon mere speculation," the court wrote. "The pods were labeled radioactive." http://www.knoxnews.com/kns/local_news/article/0,1406,KNS_347_4279564,00.html From radbloom at comcast.net Thu Dec 1 15:21:49 2005 From: radbloom at comcast.net (Cindy Bloom) Date: Thu, 01 Dec 2005 16:21:49 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] High court backs 'sloshed' trucker - State justices: Hauler of OR waste disabled, due workers' comp In-Reply-To: <438F62B2.7030304@icx.net> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20051201161328.034ca1a8@mail.comcast.net> Wow, This sure does underline the importance of training, putting risks in perspective and providing prompt as well as continuous information to workers who might be exposed to materials or environments that have a potential to cause harm if exposures are sufficiently high. Cindy At 03:53 PM 12/1/2005 -0500, Susan Gawarecki wrote: >High court backs 'sloshed' trucker - State justices: Hauler of OR waste >disabled, due workers' comp >Knoxville News Sentinel >By JAMIE SATTERFIELD, satterfield at knews.com >December 1, 2005 > >When William H. "Red" Saylor was "sloshed" with what he believed was >radioactive waste, he freaked out. And, in an opinion released Wednesday, >the [Tennessee] state Supreme Court is holding his employer responsible. > >In an opinion drafted by Justice Janice M. Holder, the state's high court >upheld a lower court ruling that Saylor, though not physically injured, >was rendered mentally disabled by the June 1999 incident and is entitled >to collect workers' compensation from Lakeway Trucking Inc. in >Morristown. "We conclude that the record and the applicable law support >the trial court's determination that the employee's mental injuries arose >out of and in the course of his employment and that the employee is 100 >percent permanently disabled with respect to his mental faculties," Holder >wrote. > >J. Eric Harrison, a Morristown lawyer who represented the 65-year-old >Saylor with attorney J. Randall Shelton, said his client will be >"thrilled" at the news. "Obviously, we're pleased and glad it was upheld," >Harrison said. "This was an extremely complex and interesting case." > >Lakeway attorney Gene Paul Gaby was unavailable for comment Wednesday >afternoon. > >Saylor has been a truck driver since he was 15. He dropped out of school >in the eighth grade. In June 1999 he was working as a truck driver for >Lakeway, which had been contracted to deliver hazardous waste from Oak >Ridge to a dump site in Clive, Utah. > >According to the appellate court opinion, Saylor and fellow driver Lloyd >Orrick arrived at the site only to be turned away. "The workers at the >disposal site refused to accept either load and ordered Saylor to >transport the material from the area because of fears that the material >would explode," the opinion stated. > >After the two truckers parked their rigs at a truck stop overnight and >returned to the dump site the next day, they were again turned away. The >pair returned to the truck stop. But as Saylor was backing up his rig, "he >saw Orrick standing near the trailer and waving his arms," the opinion >stated. As it turned out, the pod housing the liquid waste had sprung a >leak, Holder wrote. > >Some of the sludgy waste splashed onto Orrick's shirt. Some "sloshed" onto >Saylor's face, chest and shirt, the court stated. "Saylor testified that >the liquid went in his mouth and on the side of his face, on his chest and >on his shirt," Holder wrote. "Saylor stated to Orrick, 'You've got it on >you, and it's going to kill you. Now, if it ain't killed me, too, now.'?" > >The two showered and contacted a Lakeway employee, who told the pair to >sit tight. Orrick apparently handled the wait far better than Saylor, who >the court said "felt ill and was afraid that he and Orrick might die." >Ultimately, Saylor's shirt was tested and the stuff on it deemed not >radioactive. But the court noted that it took "more than two weeks" before >Saylor "could be assured that his clothing provided no evidence of >radioactivity." By then, Saylor was already in the throes of what doctors >later diagnosed as post-traumatic stress syndrome, anxiety and depression, >the opinion stated. Neighbors and a caregiver testified that Saylor was >beset with anxiety and depression. He had such severe nightmares that his >caregiver often tied her ankle to his at night so he wouldn't leap from >the bed and hurt himself, the court wrote. > >A key issue for the high court was whether Saylor's fears were rational, >noting that the court had refused to grant benefits in another case to a >medical employee who had an "irrational fear of exposure to HIV" after a >work-related incident. "In contrast, the hazardousness of the material to >which Saylor was exposed was not based upon mere speculation," the court >wrote. "The pods were labeled radioactive." > >http://www.knoxnews.com/kns/local_news/article/0,1406,KNS_347_4279564,00.html > >_______________________________________________ >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood >the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: >http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings >visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From Roger.Moroney at ctimi.com Thu Dec 1 16:46:25 2005 From: Roger.Moroney at ctimi.com (Roger.Moroney at ctimi.com) Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2005 17:46:25 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] local TV news report on college campus security In-Reply-To: Message-ID: http://www.WATE.com/Global/story.asp?s=4185509 Local television news reported visits Univ of Tennessee (UT) campus based on information found on the UT website. Roger Moroney, CHP Manager, Radiological Compliance & CRSO (PETNET) PETNET Pharmaceuticals, Inc. Siemens Molecular Imaging NOTICE: This e-mail message and all attachments transmitted with it may contain legally privileged and confidential information intended solely for the use of the addressee. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any reading, dissemination, distribution, copying, or other use of this message or its attachments, hyperlinks, or any other files of any kind is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately by telephone (865-218-2000) or by a reply to this electronic mail message and delete this message and all copies and backups thereof. From don.mercado at lmco.com Thu Dec 1 16:25:32 2005 From: don.mercado at lmco.com (Mercado, Don) Date: Thu, 01 Dec 2005 14:25:32 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] High court backs 'sloshed' trucker - State justices: Hauler of OR waste disabled, due workers' comp Message-ID: <3D92CA467E530B4E8295214868F840FE81F633@emss01m12.us.lmco.com> Cindy Bloom "Wow, This sure does underline the importance of training, putting risks in perspective and providing prompt as well as continuous information to workers who might be exposed to materials or environments that have a potential to cause harm if exposures are sufficiently high." Not really. I've been teaching classes on RF safety for years and cover *extensively* the relative risks and the worst case accidents that can happen with the devices we produce; a mild heating of the skin. This information is posted in many places and is reemphasized in the retraining as well. Still, we have had people who thought they were exposed (they weren't) and suffered from mental anguish. One guy felt ill just putting on his personal alarming monitor. Over the years we've added additional layers of "safety", not bec there is any hazard, but to assuage the employee's concerns. Now I'm getting, "If it wasn't that hazardous, we wouldn't have all this safety stuff!" Some people quit rather than work with RF. Can an employer be held responsible for an employee's phobias? Don From rstrickert at signaturescience.com Thu Dec 1 18:24:57 2005 From: rstrickert at signaturescience.com (Strickert, Rick) Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2005 18:24:57 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] local TV news report on college campus security Message-ID: <7D5C72A07835EB4085063AD8555F05DE0121119F@ss-mail2.corp.signaturescience.com> >From http://www.wate.com/Global/story.asp?s=4185509 - "Shockingly, we found detailed information about when and where potentially dangerous radiation is collected on campus.... [UT's Radiation Safety Director Chris] Millsaps would only say the material is primarily Hydrogen-3 and Carbon-14. Both are low-energy, which means low-risk to the public." - WATE6 News reporter, Amelia Graham, B.S. in telecommunications/news, University of Florida (http://www.wate.com/Global/Story.asp?s=1374018) Rick Strickert Austin, TX From radbloom at comcast.net Thu Dec 1 19:35:30 2005 From: radbloom at comcast.net (Cindy Bloom) Date: Thu, 01 Dec 2005 20:35:30 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] High court backs 'sloshed' trucker - State justices: Hauler of OR waste disabled, due workers' comp In-Reply-To: <3D92CA467E530B4E8295214868F840FE81F633@emss01m12.us.lmco.c om> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20051201180513.034945f0@mail.comcast.net> Don, Your note emphasizes my points about putting risks in perspective and about following up with people who might be concerned about risks especially during nonroutine events. Two weeks seems like a long time to find out if a shirt was contaminated. Most of us, who have been involved with compliance issues, can readily attest to regulatory or self-imposed requirements that we wouldn't hesitate to violate under emergency circumstances and where we would consider any negative risks from associated exposures to be very, very low. It is important to differentiate the difference between compliance requirements and health risk. "All that safety stuff" is to help us avoid situations where it is "all that hazardous." It is also very important to be available to discuss workers concerns and to routinely reassure them if need be (and if possible). But it is also important to counsel those workers, who are extremely uncomfortable with the idea of a given risk, to consider looking/training for a type of employment that does not include the risk of concern. It's important to remind people that worrying about risk can be a health risk in itself, too. I will never be a race car driver and some people should not choose radiation work. Cindy At 02:25 PM 12/1/2005 -0800, Mercado, Don wrote: >Cindy Bloom > >"Wow, > >This sure does underline the importance of training, putting risks in >perspective and providing prompt as well as continuous information to >workers who might be exposed to materials or environments that have a >potential to cause harm if exposures are sufficiently high." > > >Not really. > >I've been teaching classes on RF safety for years and cover >*extensively* the relative risks and the worst case accidents that can >happen with the devices we produce; a mild heating of the skin. This >information is posted in many places and is reemphasized in the >retraining as well. Still, we have had people who thought they were >exposed (they weren't) and suffered from mental anguish. One guy felt >ill just putting on his personal alarming monitor. Over the years we've >added additional layers of "safety", not bec there is any hazard, but to >assuage the employee's concerns. Now I'm getting, "If it wasn't that >hazardous, we wouldn't have all this safety stuff!" Some people quit >rather than work with RF. Can an employer be held responsible for an >employee's phobias? > >Don From Douglas.Minnema at nnsa.doe.gov Fri Dec 2 09:42:21 2005 From: Douglas.Minnema at nnsa.doe.gov (Minnema, Douglas) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 10:42:21 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group Message-ID: <38982F237333D5119E6100508BB0CC6D0CA76CF3@nsgtnexch1.ns.doe.gov> All, I have two unrelated questions that I'm combining into one e-mail for convenience. The first one has to do with Am-241 sources in smoke detectors. What happens when the smoke detector is burned in a building fire? Is the source expected to survive intact or is there a potential for a release of some type? I would assume this has been considered multiple times, but I haven't found the answer yet. If somebody can point me in the right direction I'd appreciate it. Second question: My 15-year old son has a subscription to "Air & Space Smithonian" magazine, and in the December 2005/January 2006 issue there is an article entitled "The Invisible Killers: Can Astronauts Survive the Radiation on a Journey to Mars?". Has anybody seen this yet? I'm not familiar with current efforts in protecting astronauts from space radiation, but some of the statements made in this article are clearly wrong, which leads me to suspect that either the article was designed to be inflammatory or the author just didn't understand the information he was given. A couple examples: "From World War II atomic bomb detonations in Japan and the 1986 accident at the Chernobyl nuclear reactor near Kiev, Russia, we know the effects of brief but intense pulses of radiation: nausea, immune system shutdown, central nervous system damage, and death within minutes to hours." "Derek Lowenstein, chairman of Brookhaven's collider accelerator program, has given voice to deep fears among scientists by asking: "Will astronauts come back as blithering idiots or not?"" "The U.S. Occupational Safety and Health Administration treats astronauts as radiation workers." "Today, the law limits the amount of radiation that nuclear workers, including astronauts, receive to 5,000 millirem over the course of their careers." Since my son's long-held goal is to pilot the first spacecraft to Mars (and yes, he is working hard towards that goal), he was obviously curious about the article. He does understand that ionizing radiation is often misunderstood or mis-stated in the media (he is the son of an HP), but in this case I can't answer all of his questions. If somebody knows about this article or would be willing to look at it for me, I'd much appreciate it. Please contact me directly and I'll get a copy of the article to you if necessary. Thanks, Doug Minnema PhD, CHP From jmarshall.reber at comcast.net Fri Dec 2 10:17:27 2005 From: jmarshall.reber at comcast.net (J. Marshall Reber) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 11:17:27 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group In-Reply-To: <38982F237333D5119E6100508BB0CC6D0CA76CF3@nsgtnexch1.ns.doe.gov> Message-ID: <212A552C-634F-11DA-B8F7-0003939BB85A@comcast.net> The Smithsonian, you might recall, was forced to greatly modify an exhibit not too long ago that portrayed how terrible the U.S.A. was in causing the "atrocities" of the atomic bombing of Japan. On Friday, December 2, 2005, at 10:42 , Minnema, Douglas wrote: > Second question: My 15-year old son has a subscription to "Air & Space > Smithonian" magazine, and in the December 2005/January 2006 issue there > is > an article entitled "The Invisible Killers: Can Astronauts Survive the > Radiation on a Journey to Mars?". Has anybody seen this yet? I'm not > familiar with current efforts in protecting astronauts from space > radiation, > but some of the statements made in this article are clearly wrong, which > leads me to suspect that either the article was designed to be > inflammatory > or the author just didn't understand the information he was given. From joel.baumbaugh at navy.mil Fri Dec 2 10:38:47 2005 From: joel.baumbaugh at navy.mil (Baumbaugh, Joel SPAWAR) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 08:38:47 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group Message-ID: <7DB6DF83D2CD9140ADA0622B1A05BF2F01667895@nawespscez02.nadsuswe.nads.navy.mil> Doug, Question one: I have a Americium source from a smoke detector which survived a wooden-building fire (I assume its double-walled stainless steel?). I've swiped it and the LSC has never shown any leakage. I couldn't/wouldn't throw it away because out of the detector its no longer exempt, so I use it as a check-source and a "show-and-tell" when I train new users. Just my 2-cents (my own personal observation). Question 2: I can't help you with your other question although I'm very interested in the projected/potential dose to the astronauts (both in-flight and once they're on the ground) - I think that NASA's discussed a specially shielded room to hover in, in case of solar flares. Joel Baumbaugh (baumbaug at nosc.mil) SSC-SD All, I have two unrelated questions that I'm combining into one e-mail for convenience. The first one has to do with Am-241 sources in smoke detectors. What happens when the smoke detector is burned in a building fire? Is the source expected to survive intact or is there a potential for a release of some type? Second question: From nardiaj at westinghouse.com Fri Dec 2 10:48:14 2005 From: nardiaj at westinghouse.com (Nardi, A. Joseph) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 11:48:14 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group Message-ID: <2052C51FEE2DD611AE5F0002A59305F10BFEA5EA@swec9900bk.pgh.wec.com> With respect to the smoke detectors look at NUREG-1717, section 2.15. This document should answer your questions. The document is available from the NRC. http://www.nrc.gov/reading-rm/doc-collections/nuregs/staff/sr1717/ A. Joseph Nardi Westinghouse Electric Company P.O. Box 355 Pittsburgh, PA 15230 Phone - 412-374-4652 FAX - 412-374-3832 email - nardiaj at westinghouse.com -----Original Message----- From: Minnema, Douglas [mailto:Douglas.Minnema at nnsa.doe.gov] Sent: Friday, December 02, 2005 10:42 AM To: Radsafe (E-mail) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group All, I have two unrelated questions that I'm combining into one e-mail for convenience. The first one has to do with Am-241 sources in smoke detectors. What happens when the smoke detector is burned in a building fire? Is the source expected to survive intact or is there a potential for a release of some type? I would assume this has been considered multiple times, but I haven't found the answer yet. If somebody can point me in the right direction I'd appreciate it. Second question: My 15-year old son has a subscription to "Air & Space Smithonian" magazine, and in the December 2005/January 2006 issue there is an article entitled "The Invisible Killers: Can Astronauts Survive the Radiation on a Journey to Mars?". Has anybody seen this yet? I'm not familiar with current efforts in protecting astronauts from space radiation, but some of the statements made in this article are clearly wrong, which leads me to suspect that either the article was designed to be inflammatory or the author just didn't understand the information he was given. A couple examples: "From World War II atomic bomb detonations in Japan and the 1986 accident at the Chernobyl nuclear reactor near Kiev, Russia, we know the effects of brief but intense pulses of radiation: nausea, immune system shutdown, central nervous system damage, and death within minutes to hours." "Derek Lowenstein, chairman of Brookhaven's collider accelerator program, has given voice to deep fears among scientists by asking: "Will astronauts come back as blithering idiots or not?"" "The U.S. Occupational Safety and Health Administration treats astronauts as radiation workers." "Today, the law limits the amount of radiation that nuclear workers, including astronauts, receive to 5,000 millirem over the course of their careers." Since my son's long-held goal is to pilot the first spacecraft to Mars (and yes, he is working hard towards that goal), he was obviously curious about the article. He does understand that ionizing radiation is often misunderstood or mis-stated in the media (he is the son of an HP), but in this case I can't answer all of his questions. If somebody knows about this article or would be willing to look at it for me, I'd much appreciate it. Please contact me directly and I'll get a copy of the article to you if necessary. Thanks, Doug Minnema PhD, CHP _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From rdgallagher at nssihouston.com Fri Dec 2 12:15:30 2005 From: rdgallagher at nssihouston.com (Robert D Gallagher) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 12:15:30 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group In-Reply-To: <7DB6DF83D2CD9140ADA0622B1A05BF2F01667895@nawespscez02.nadsuswe.nads.navy.mil> Message-ID: The Am-241 sources used in smoke detectors are not sealed sources. The sources are manufactured by mixing the Am-241 powder with a powdered metal such as gold and rolled into a very thin sheet. The sheet active sheet is sandwiched between two sheets of soft metal and again rolled to form a laminated sheet with non active metal on the outside and the active metal sheet in the middle. When the rolling is completed, small discs are punched from the laminate. These discs are the foils contained in the smoke detectors. In the early days of smoke detectors, the various vendors subjected the foils to all sorts of environmental tests including soaking them in simulated human digestion system liquids to see if the Am-241 leached out. As a result of these very extensive tests,the manufacturers were able to get the NRC to authorize their distribution to the public as generally licensed devices. Numerous smoke detectors have been burned and otherwise mistreated. With only a few exceptions, I am not aware of any that ever resuted in contamination. Bob Gallagher NSSI Houston -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl]On Behalf Of Baumbaugh, Joel SPAWAR Sent: Friday, December 02, 2005 10:39 AM To: Radsafe (E-mail) Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group Doug, Question one: I have a Americium source from a smoke detector which survived a wooden-building fire (I assume its double-walled stainless steel?). I've swiped it and the LSC has never shown any leakage. I couldn't/wouldn't throw it away because out of the detector its no longer exempt, so I use it as a check-source and a "show-and-tell" when I train new users. Just my 2-cents (my own personal observation). Question 2: I can't help you with your other question although I'm very interested in the projected/potential dose to the astronauts (both in-flight and once they're on the ground) - I think that NASA's discussed a specially shielded room to hover in, in case of solar flares. Joel Baumbaugh (baumbaug at nosc.mil) SSC-SD All, I have two unrelated questions that I'm combining into one e-mail for convenience. The first one has to do with Am-241 sources in smoke detectors. What happens when the smoke detector is burned in a building fire? Is the source expected to survive intact or is there a potential for a release of some type? Second question: _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From lboing at anl.gov Fri Dec 2 13:09:46 2005 From: lboing at anl.gov (Boing, Lawrence E.) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 13:09:46 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Sensorcoat Message-ID: <637FE1FE13221C4F8BFC590A42B8478921C768@NE-EXCH.ne.anl.gov> Looking for some additional information - like a technical paper or conf paper - on Sensorcoat technology for decontamination at LANL. Larry Boing Lawrence E. (Larry) Boing Argonne National Laboratory 9700 South Cass Avenue Argonne, IL 60439 P-630.252.6729 F-630.252.7577 lboing at anl.gov http://www.dd.anl.gov/ http://www.orau.gov/ddsc/ From Rainer.Facius at dlr.de Fri Dec 2 13:10:13 2005 From: Rainer.Facius at dlr.de (Rainer.Facius at dlr.de) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 20:10:13 +0100 Subject: AW: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group References: <38982F237333D5119E6100508BB0CC6D0CA76CF3@nsgtnexch1.ns.doe.gov> Message-ID: <1B5EBED4E01074419C07EEF9D3802FDA159010@exbe02.intra.dlr.de> Douglas, I address your second question: Since I don not know this article I can comment only with some general remarks. For long term missions outside the shielding provided by the geomagnetic field planning manned space missions has to make allowance for two sources of ionising radiation. One is the rather regularly varying irradiation by galactic cosmic radiation (GCR). During maximum solar activity - as we had it about 3 years ago and will have it about every other 11 years, their intensity is minimal and vice versa. Without dramatic progress in propulsion technology the most feasible (also financially) mission to Mars will take some 422 days in space (round-trip) and 525 days on Mars' surface. For such a mission, depending on the mass of shielding material available, the equivalent dose from GCRs to the blood forming organs (BFO - a proxy for the effective dose) according to present prediction capabilities will range between 280 to 918 mSv depending further on the solar activity during the mission and it s atomic composition. Hydrogen rich material like polyethylene (PE) performs better as shielding material due to its smaller contribution to secondary fragmented ions in comparison to Aluminium (AL). In the table below, Min refers to a mission during solar minimum, Max to solar maximum and the numbers give BFO equivalent dose in mSv. AL.....918 Min PE.....846 5 g/cm**2 AL.....383 Max PE....353 ------------------------------------- AL.....852 Min PE.....748 10 g/cm**2 AL.....364 Max PE....317 ------------------------------------- AL.....769 Min PE.....649 20 g/cm**2 AL.....339 Max PE....280 ------------------------------------- Obviously, planning the mission with respect to its position in the solar cycle would argue to have it during solar maximum. As regards shielding by matter, the energies of the GCR heavy ions make them very difficult to shield against. A factor of 4 in mass (that has to be propelled too) at most yields a reduction in dose by a factor of 1.3! The physics behind these predictions is sufficiently well understood by now. The great uncertainty is whether the radiation quality factors used in the conversion of absorbed dose to equivalent dose truly reflect the radiobiological effectiveness of the GCR ions. I would not be surprised if finally it turns out that they do not. Assuming that they do, the above doses accumulated during nearly 3 years may appear gigantic for terrestrial radiation workers. Nevertheless, the safe return of the crew will not be compromised by health effects ensuing from these exposures. A second unresolved longstanding uncertainty in this statement of course is that the cellular and tissue reactions which under terrestrial 1 g conditions counteract and control the development of radiogenic cancers retain their normal efficiency under the numerous and persistent physiological changes brought about by long duration weightlessness. Even if not, a health detriment which might jeopardize a safe return is unlikely, yet, increased late mortality from cancer will be a likely risk. The second radiation component in interplanetary space is energetic charged particle radiation, mainly protons, from solar particle events (SPE) commonly called flares. Unfortunately, the probability that large events will occur is maximum during solar maximum and essentially nil during minimum solar activity! In contrast to GCR heavy ions, however, their lower energies make them easier to shield against. Nevertheless, the intensities in extreme SPEs may reach levels where in interplanetary space behind a shielding of even 10 g/cm**2 (often called a "radiation storm shelter"; whether AL or PE does no more matter here) still acute doses of about 1.3 Gy to the bone marrow, 2.5 to the lens and 2.6 to the skin are to be expected for what we may call a worst case event according to our present experience. Only if the sensitivity to induction of early deterministic radiation effects had been significantly enhanced by weightlessness (again the same question mark!) would we expect that such exposures could trigger a fatal mission abort. Some kind of transient performance decrement might be expected and then it could depend on the criticality of the mission phase where such an SPE occurs. The frequency of such extreme events (one in 50 years is our current sample size) is too far low to have us expect more than one such extreme SPE during a mission. One most essential prerequisite of course is that mission planning and control can ensure that indeed under all conceivable circumstances the crew will have time to find shelter. We have some indications that our sun might enter into an era of more violent activity. When and to what amount that might invalidate our 'worst case' predictions can only be answered by prophets. I hope that helps and reinforces your son's resolve to go ahead. Best regards, Rainer Dr. Rainer Facius DLR, German Aerospace Center Institute of Aerospace Medicine Dept. Radiation Biology 51147 Cologne GERAMNY +49 2203 601 3147 ________________________________ Von: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl im Auftrag von Minnema, Douglas Gesendet: Fr 02.12.2005 16:42 An: Radsafe (E-mail) Betreff: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group All, I have two unrelated questions that I'm combining into one e-mail for convenience. The first one has to do with Am-241 sources in smoke detectors. What happens when the smoke detector is burned in a building fire? Is the source expected to survive intact or is there a potential for a release of some type? I would assume this has been considered multiple times, but I haven't found the answer yet. If somebody can point me in the right direction I'd appreciate it. Second question: My 15-year old son has a subscription to "Air & Space Smithonian" magazine, and in the December 2005/January 2006 issue there is an article entitled "The Invisible Killers: Can Astronauts Survive the Radiation on a Journey to Mars?". Has anybody seen this yet? I'm not familiar with current efforts in protecting astronauts from space radiation, but some of the statements made in this article are clearly wrong, which leads me to suspect that either the article was designed to be inflammatory or the author just didn't understand the information he was given. A couple examples: "From World War II atomic bomb detonations in Japan and the 1986 accident at the Chernobyl nuclear reactor near Kiev, Russia, we know the effects of brief but intense pulses of radiation: nausea, immune system shutdown, central nervous system damage, and death within minutes to hours." "Derek Lowenstein, chairman of Brookhaven's collider accelerator program, has given voice to deep fears among scientists by asking: "Will astronauts come back as blithering idiots or not?"" "The U.S. Occupational Safety and Health Administration treats astronauts as radiation workers." "Today, the law limits the amount of radiation that nuclear workers, including astronauts, receive to 5,000 millirem over the course of their careers." Since my son's long-held goal is to pilot the first spacecraft to Mars (and yes, he is working hard towards that goal), he was obviously curious about the article. He does understand that ionizing radiation is often misunderstood or mis-stated in the media (he is the son of an HP), but in this case I can't answer all of his questions. If somebody knows about this article or would be willing to look at it for me, I'd much appreciate it. Please contact me directly and I'll get a copy of the article to you if necessary. Thanks, Doug Minnema PhD, CHP _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From Douglas.Minnema at nnsa.doe.gov Fri Dec 2 13:26:46 2005 From: Douglas.Minnema at nnsa.doe.gov (Minnema, Douglas) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 14:26:46 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group Message-ID: <38982F237333D5119E6100508BB0CC6D0CA76CFA@nsgtnexch1.ns.doe.gov> Rainer and all of you who have responded, Thank you all, your responses have been very helpful to answer both of my questions. NUREG-1717 does answer all my smoke detector questions, and much more on that topic. As for the Mars trip, Rainer's response is very helpful, and is in line with what I thought I had seen before. The article does not discuss dose numbers at all, but it does mention some of the shielding concepts that Rainer discusses. I was wondering why they were looking at hydrogen for a shield. much appreciated, Doug Minnema From hacrad at comcast.net Fri Dec 2 18:25:38 2005 From: hacrad at comcast.net (Hal C) Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 16:25:38 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group References: <38982F237333D5119E6100508BB0CC6D0CA76CF3@nsgtnexch1.ns.doe.gov> Message-ID: <007201c5f7a0$16a139a0$6401a8c0@exe8l> A good resource is the web site: http://science.msfc.nasa.gov/ >From there you can pull up multiple stories on NASA's attempts to consider and control the radiation environment in inter-planetary space and on Mars. But it's not clear whether such large dose levels are compatible with long term flights. Let your son do the research and tell you what he finds. hal careway Sent: Friday, December 02, 2005 7:42 AM Subject: [ RadSafe ] Two unrelated questions for the group > > All, > > I have two unrelated questions that I'm combining into one e-mail for > convenience. > > The first one .... > > > Second question: My 15-year old son has a subscription to "Air & Space > Smithonian" magazine, and in the December 2005/January 2006 issue there is > an article entitled "The Invisible Killers: Can Astronauts Survive the > Radiation on a Journey to Mars?". Has anybody seen this yet? I'm not > familiar with current efforts in protecting astronauts from space > radiation, > but some of the statements made in this article are clearly wrong, which > leads me to suspect that either the article was designed to be > inflammatory > or the author just didn't understand the information he was given. A > couple > examples: > From srebro at bgumail.bgu.ac.il Sun Dec 4 00:50:22 2005 From: srebro at bgumail.bgu.ac.il (srebro) Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2005 08:50:22 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Am-241 Message-ID: <20051204064412.12F6033E76@smtp2.bgu.ac.il> Hi I know of one case of alpha contamination after a fire. A big hotel was completely burn in a fire. The smoke detectors were very old containing about 70 mCi Am-241 each. The result alpha contamination found in the ashes and ruins . Rafi From srebro at bgumail.bgu.ac.il Sun Dec 4 02:15:01 2005 From: srebro at bgumail.bgu.ac.il (srebro) Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2005 10:15:01 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Am-241 Message-ID: <20051204080850.6DF9033E77@smtp2.bgu.ac.il> The activity was 70 micro-Ci . (some computer replace the micro with an m) Rafi From joseroze at netvision.net.il Sun Dec 4 03:53:20 2005 From: joseroze at netvision.net.il (Jose Julio Rozental) Date: Sun, 04 Dec 2005 12:53:20 +0300 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Am-241 References: <20051204064412.12F6033E76@smtp2.bgu.ac.il> Message-ID: <006801c5f8b8$8f849970$840118ac@userqzqxd9wnct> Dear Rafi and colleagues, Ionizing Chamber Smoke Detectors - ICSDs, has an interesting study made by Nuclear Energy Agency NEA - Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development OECD, 1977 to justify its use. The document is "Recommendations for ICSDs in implementation of radiation protection standards" and followed recommendations of the ICRP and the NEA Guide 1970 on Basic approach for safety analysis and control of products containing radionuclides and available to the general public. The Basic Requirements for Am-241 were activity and dose equivalent rate. About the activity, per detector, shall not exceed 20 microCi. At that time, considering Am-241, the great majority of ICSDs used sources in the range of 0.5 to 130 micoCi, and activities above 80 microCi were found only in types of detectors no longer being produced. So please take a look again on the value that you have mentioned 70 mCi per detector. The NEA Study took into consideration Incidents involving ICSDs in UK, from 1966 to 1977, as fire, theft, bomb explosion, bomb explosion and subsequent fire, mutilation of detectors, etc. The document present results of the incidents. Appendix III present fire and incineration tests on ICSDs - Two fire tests are described 600 and 1200 degrees. Jose Julio Rozental joseroze at netvision.net.il Israel ----- Original Message ----- From: "srebro" To: Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2005 9:50 AM Subject: [ RadSafe ] Am-241 > Hi > > I know of one case of alpha contamination after a fire. A big hotel was > completely burn in a fire. The smoke detectors were very old containing > about 70 mCi Am-241 each. The result alpha contamination found in the ashes > and ruins . > > > > > Rafi > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From jaro-10kbq at sympatico.ca Sun Dec 4 10:11:46 2005 From: jaro-10kbq at sympatico.ca (Jaro) Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2005 11:11:46 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Sternglass, Gofman & co. at it again..... Message-ID: http://www.news-journalonline.com/NewsJournalOnline/Opinion/Editorials/03OpO PN45120405.htm Plutonium is considered the most lethal radioactive substance because a millionth of a gram of plutonium dust lodged in the lung can be a fatal dose. "The problem is that it takes just a tiny amount of plutonium to cause cancer," says Dr. Sternglass. .....accidents have already happened. Of the 25 U.S. space missions using plutonium fuel, three have undergone accidents, admits the NASA impact statement on New Horizons. That's a 1-in-8 record. The worst occurred in 1964 and involved, notes the impact statement, the SNAP-9A RTG with 2.1 pounds of plutonium fuel. A satellite it was to provide electricity to failed to achieve orbit and dropped to Earth. The RTG disintegrated in the fall, spreading plutonium widely. Release of that plutonium caused an increase in global lung cancer rates, says Dr. John Gofman, professor emeritus of medical physics at the University of California at Berkeley. Letters to the Editor The News-Journal Daytona Beach, FL E-mail: letters at news-jrnl.com -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.362 / Virus Database: 267.13.11/191 - Release Date: 12/2/2005 From Bevelresou at aol.com Sun Dec 4 17:34:29 2005 From: Bevelresou at aol.com (Bevelresou at aol.com) Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2005 18:34:29 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] HEALTH PHTSICS E-JOURNAL Message-ID: <1ef.4862f65d.30c4d705@aol.com> Hello: This note seeks to solicit opinions and comments regarding the establishment of a new, electronic health physics journal. The e-journal concept is not intended as an indication of issues with existing journals or publication outlets. It is intended to foster publication of ideas from the widest possible collection of health physicists throughout the world. It is hoped that the e-journal would also document in a more formal manner the views of health physicists regarding contemporary issues (e.g., BEIR-VII, LNT, hormesis, and the new ICRP Recommendations). From recent RADSAFE discussion, it appears that there is some disagreement with recent recommendations and guidance, and the e-journal would serve to provide another source of feedback to the organizations promulgating these recommendations. A straw-man e-journal concept follows. The e-Journal would foster the development and growth of the health physics profession. Its goals would include (1) timely publication and dissemination of health physics research and operational information, (2) the publication of papers that might not be published in existing journals because of their unique or controversial nature, (3) fostering interest, research, and debate on emerging health physics areas, (4) disseminating information that will enhance worker protection, (5) fostering the professional development of health physicists, (6) respectfully challenging or supporting proposed regulations and guidance, and (7) providing an electronic archive of articles for research and historical purposes. The e-Journal would also emphasize cutting-edge areas of the profession as well as disseminating topics of interest and benefit to the health physics community. Health physics contributions would be accepted in a wide variety of areas including contemporary, operational, and regulatory topics. The e-Journal would be peer reviewed, but the final publication decision would rest with the author since it is the author that ultimately defends the work. I would appreciate receiving comments and suggestions regarding the aforementioned e-journal concept. If there is interest in participating in the e-journal as a subject editor or contributor, I would also appreciate receiving that information directly to my e-mail address Regards, Joe Bevelacqua Dr. Joseph John Bevelacqua, President Bevelacqua Resources 343 Adair Drive Richland, WA 99352 _bevelresou at aol.com_ (mailto:bevelresou at aol.com) From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Sun Dec 4 19:53:31 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 01:53:31 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] HEALTH PHTSICS E-JOURNAL In-Reply-To: <1ef.4862f65d.30c4d705@aol.com> Message-ID: <20051205015331.51177.qmail@web26412.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear Dr Joseph Bevelacqua, Best wishes for the proposal to start a journal. As a member of this newsgroup for some time, I felt that there is justification for starting the type of journal you propose .It may give continuity to some of the discusssions, though the advantages of appropriate peer reveiw may not be feasible. I have a suggestion. There must be provision to publish historical accounts of the development of radiation safety related articles in various countries. While commenting on an article on Elezabeth Rona (a contemporary of Madame Curie)in the Health Physics, I proposed that stalwarts like Taylor, Spiers, Parker and others may be requested to write their accounts of the subject including the historical developments in the Health Physics Journal. I suggested it in a letter to the Health Physics during the early eighties. We had a few such accounts in the Health Physics. Health physicists and radiation protection specialists need stories.They provide a powerful tool to engage the attention of indifferent participants of training programmes! Most of them attend such programmes because they have to attend as there is a mandatory need to get qualified! They are generally a heterogenous group; old and young I attempted to collect details about the developments in India. I could not locate persons who could contribute to the venture. Indians are notoriously inefficient in keeping a record of the past!. The success of the blog writer inspires me to make the current proposal.My occasional interactions with the elders in our profession gave me opportunity to understand the past. For instance, I came to know from Dr. Allan Brodsky, how Alice Stewart,the darling of the antinuclear movement started her epidemiological work related to Handford workers. Regards Dr.K.S.Parthasarathy (Formerly, Secretary, Atomic Energy Regulatory Board) Raja Ramanna Fellow Department of Atomic Energy GN 18, Vikram Sarabhai Bhavan Mumbai 400094, India 91+22 27706048 (R) 91+22 25555327 (O) 91+22 25486081(O) Bevelresou at aol.com wrote: Hello: This note seeks to solicit opinions and comments regarding the establishment of a new, electronic health physics journal. The e-journal concept is not intended as an indication of issues with existing journals or publication outlets. It is intended to foster publication of ideas from the widest possible collection of health physicists throughout the world. It is hoped that the e-journal would also document in a more formal manner the views of health physicists regarding contemporary issues (e.g., BEIR-VII, LNT, hormesis, and the new ICRP Recommendations). From recent RADSAFE discussion, it appears that there is some disagreement with recent recommendations and guidance, and the e-journal would serve to provide another source of feedback to the organizations promulgating these recommendations. A straw-man e-journal concept follows. The e-Journal would foster the development and growth of the health physics profession. Its goals would include (1) timely publication and dissemination of health physics research and operational information, (2) the publication of papers that might not be published in existing journals because of their unique or controversial nature, (3) fostering interest, research, and debate on emerging health physics areas, (4) disseminating information that will enhance worker protection, (5) fostering the professional development of health physicists, (6) respectfully challenging or supporting proposed regulations and guidance, and (7) providing an electronic archive of articles for research and historical purposes. The e-Journal would also emphasize cutting-edge areas of the profession as well as disseminating topics of interest and benefit to the health physics community. Health physics contributions would be accepted in a wide variety of areas including contemporary, operational, and regulatory topics. The e-Journal would be peer reviewed, but the final publication decision would rest with the author since it is the author that ultimately defends the work. I would appreciate receiving comments and suggestions regarding the aforementioned e-journal concept. If there is interest in participating in the e-journal as a subject editor or contributor, I would also appreciate receiving that information directly to my e-mail address Regards, Joe Bevelacqua Dr. Joseph John Bevelacqua, President Bevelacqua Resources 343 Adair Drive Richland, WA 99352 _bevelresou at aol.com_ (mailto:bevelresou at aol.com) _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Mon Dec 5 10:25:07 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 08:25:07 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Article: Reliability of Information -- (not radiation-related, but of interest) Message-ID: <20051205162507.7253.qmail@web54306.mail.yahoo.com> >From the New York Times, http://www.nytimes.com/2005/12/04/weekinreview/04seelye.html?th&emc=th -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- December 4, 2005 Rewriting History Snared in the Web of a Wikipedia Liar By KATHARINE Q. SEELYE ACCORDING to Wikipedia, the online encyclopedia, John Seigenthaler Sr. is 78 years old and the former editor of The Tennessean in Nashville. But is that information, or anything else in Mr. Seigenthaler's biography, true? The question arises because Mr. Seigenthaler recently read about himself on Wikipedia and was shocked to learn that he "was thought to have been directly involved in the Kennedy assassinations of both John and his brother Bobby." "Nothing was ever proven," the biography added. Mr. Seigenthaler discovered that the false information had been on the site for several months and that an unknown number of people had read it, and possibly posted it on or linked it to other sites. If any assassination was going on, Mr. Seigenthaler (who is 78 and did edit The Tennessean) wrote last week in an op-ed article in USA Today, it was of his character. The case triggered extensive debate on the Internet over the value and reliability of Wikipedia, and more broadly, over the nature of online information. Wikipedia is a kind of collective brain, a repository of knowledge, maintained on servers in various countries and built by anyone in the world with a computer and an Internet connection who wants to share knowledge about a subject. Literally hundreds of thousands of people have written Wikipedia entries. Mistakes are expected to be caught and corrected by later contributors and users. The whole nonprofit enterprise began in January 2001, the brainchild of Jimmy Wales, 39, a former futures and options trader who lives in St. Petersburg, Fla. He said he had hoped to advance the promise of the Internet as a place for sharing information. It has, by most measures, been a spectacular success. Wikipedia is now the biggest encyclopedia in the history of the world. As of Friday, it was receiving 2.5 billion page views a month, and offering at least 1,000 articles in 82 languages. The number of articles, already close to two million, is growing by 7 percent a month. And Mr. Wales said that traffic doubles every four months. Still, the question of Wikipedia, as of so much of what you find online, is: Can you trust it? And beyond reliability, there is the question of accountability. Mr. Seigenthaler, after discovering that he had been defamed, found that his "biographer" was anonymous. He learned that the writer was a customer of BellSouth Internet, but that federal privacy laws shield the identity of Internet customers, even if they disseminate defamatory material. And the laws protect online corporations from libel suits. He could have filed a lawsuit against BellSouth, he wrote, but only a subpoena would compel BellSouth to reveal the name. In the end, Mr. Seigenthaler decided against going to court, instead alerting the public, through his article, "that Wikipedia is a flawed and irresponsible research tool." Mr. Wales said in an interview that he was troubled by the Seigenthaler episode, and noted that Wikipedia was essentially in the same boat. "We have constant problems where we have people who are trying to repeatedly abuse our sites," he said. Still, he said, he was trying to make Wikipedia less vulnerable to tampering. He said he was starting a review mechanism by which readers and experts could rate the value of various articles. The reviews, which he said he expected to start in January, would show the site's strengths and weaknesses and perhaps reveal patterns to help them address the problems. In addition, he said, Wikipedia may start blocking unregistered users from creating new pages, though they would still be able to edit them. The real problem, he said, was the volume of new material coming in; it is so overwhelming that screeners cannot keep up with it. All of this struck close to home for librarians and researchers. On an electronic mailing list for them, J. Stephen Bolhafner, a news researcher at The St. Louis Post-Dispatch, wrote, "The best defense of the Wikipedia, frankly, is to point out how much bad information is available from supposedly reliable sources." Jessica Baumgart, a news researcher at Harvard University, wrote that there were librarians voluntarily working behind the scenes to check information on Wikipedia. "But, honestly," she added, "in some ways, we're just as fallible as everyone else in some areas because our own knowledge is limited and we can't possibly fact-check everything." In an interview, she said that her rule of thumb was to double-check everything and to consider Wikipedia as only one source. "Instead of figuring out how to 'fix' Wikipedia - something that cannot be done to our satisfaction," wrote Derek Willis, a research database manager at The Washington Post, who was speaking for himself and not The Post, "we should focus our energies on educating the Wikipedia users among our colleagues." Some cyberexperts said Wikipedia already had a good system of checks and balances. Lawrence Lessig, a law professor at Stanford and an expert in the laws of cyberspace, said that contrary to popular belief, true defamation was easily pursued through the courts because almost everything on the Internet was traceable and subpoenas were not that hard to obtain. (For real anonymity, he advised, use a pay phone.) "People will be defamed," he said. "But that's the way free speech is. Think about the gossip world. It spreads. There's no way to correct it, period. Wikipedia is not immune from that kind of maliciousness, but it is, relative to other features of life, more easily corrected." Indeed, Esther Dyson, editor of Release 1.0 and a longtime Internet analyst, said Wikipedia may, in that sense, be better than real life. "The Internet has done a lot more for truth by making things easier to discuss," she said. "Transparency and sunlight are better than a single point of view that can't be questioned." For Mr. Seigenthaler, whose biography on Wikipedia has since been corrected, the lesson is simple: "We live in a universe of new media with phenomenal opportunities for worldwide communications and research, but populated by volunteer vandals with poison-pen intellects." Copyright 2005 The New York Times Company Home Privacy Policy Search Corrections XML Help Contact Us Work for Us Site Map Back to Top +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Mon Dec 5 10:42:26 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 08:42:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Another definition for the Sv? Message-ID: <20051205164226.99068.qmail@web54309.mail.yahoo.com> >From another list server: Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 10:59:50 -0500 Subject: Replication of unit abbreviation While reading a new article in Nature about measurements showing that the velocity of the Gulf Stream has slowed by 30% since 1992, I came across a unit used by oceanographers called the Sverdrup (abbreviated Sv and not to be confused with our beloved Sievert.) This unit measures the volumetric flow of water and is equal to 1 million cubic meters per second. Measurements in the North Atlantic at 25deg north latitude had been running about 25 Sv but new data has put that value around 14 Sv leading to speculation that the Gulf Stream heat conveyor belt may be weakening. Our Sv (Sievert) is a registered SI unit, but what about the Sverdrup.... +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - Make it your home page! http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs From lists at richardhess.com Mon Dec 5 11:17:29 2005 From: lists at richardhess.com (Richard L. Hess) Date: Mon, 05 Dec 2005 12:17:29 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Article: Reliability of Information -- (not radiation-related, but of interest) In-Reply-To: <20051205162507.7253.qmail@web54306.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20051205162507.7253.qmail@web54306.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <7.0.0.16.2.20051205120143.0651f690@richardhess.com> At 11:25 AM 12/5/2005, John Jacobus passed along: > >From the New York Times, >http://www.nytimes.com/2005/12/04/weekinreview/04seelye.html?th&emc=th > I find the Seigenthaler case to be troubling, but I am not sure that one case (and perhaps the many others like it) still invalidate the Wikipedia concept. I have been favourably impressed with many articles on Wikipedia which were clearly written by people who were passionate about the topic. In areas where I have expertise, the articles I've read have been mostly correct with only minor discrepancies and who is to say that my version is more accurate? We did have an issue here about six months ago when our already high-profile Member of Parliament garnered even more attention by switching parties (very rare in Canadian politics). The article about Belinda Stronach in Wikipedia was locked before she switched parties and the editors were having a struggle with someone who wanted to change it based on his opinions vs. what could be documented. Although, at the time, she was a member of the Conservative Party, the wannabe-author lauded her for having New Democratic Party leaning. When she switched, she went to the Liberal Party. The wannabe was not actually derogatory, but rather was painting a picture of the politician which did not stand up to scrutiny. It appeared to be a fantasy about what he hoped she would do politically. I find the reliability of Wikipedia to be as good as anything else turned up in a Google search. After all, there are Web sites which are put up to deliberately mislead and mis-state the facts in order to bolster their point. I'm sure we all have our own examples of that, and this discipline is probably rife with them. I think we just raised the issue of Sternglass. Don't forget how Wasserman can use press clippings pre-Google in "Killing our Own" http://www.ratical.org/radiation/KillingOurOwn/ to state a case which appears to be totally meaningless, but is quite convincing as a first read considering all the footnotes. This book is sort of like the concentration of toxins up the food chain. He is at the top of selecting reports that meet his point of view and referring to them. I think that overall Wikipedia is a hugely beneficial resource. While it is not the only tool that my family or I use, it is one of the five "first-look" icons on our desktops: - Encyclopedia Britannica (on disc) - Encarta (on disc) - Wikipedia (on line) - The Canadian Encyclopedia (on line) - Google (on line - we have yet to implement our local search options though we are all building an interesting collection of stuff in the "Info" share on our server. It's an electronic version of the traditional library "topic file." Cheers, Richard Richard L. Hess richard at richardhess.com Aurora, Ontario, Canada http://www.richardhess.com/ Detailed contact information: http://www.richardhess.com/tape/contact.htm From David.Wesley at ehs.ucr.edu Mon Dec 5 12:10:56 2005 From: David.Wesley at ehs.ucr.edu (Wesley, David) Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 10:10:56 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Job Opening Message-ID: <2FDAAD8654C69E4585917F55804580E2CAE570@ehs.ucr.edu> The University of California, Riverside is hiring a Radiation Safety Specialist II. For details on the position and how to apply, please go to http://humanresources.ucr.edu/jobs/JobsBrowse.aspx?@strJobNumber=05- 11-019 . Please pass this information along to anyone you know who may be interested. Thanks David Wesley, CHP Radiation Safety Officer Environmental Health and Safety University of California Riverside, CA 92521-0306 david.wesley at ehs.ucr.edu 951-827-5746 Direct 951-827-5528 Admin 951-827-5122 Fax http://www.ehs.ucr.edu Join us for the 2006 CSHEMA Conference at the Disneyland Resort in Anaheim, California-- The nation's premiere conference on campus health, safety and environmental management! From loc at icx.net Mon Dec 5 14:23:33 2005 From: loc at icx.net (Susan Gawarecki) Date: Mon, 05 Dec 2005 15:23:33 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Contrast Agent for Appendicitis Confirmation Linked to Cardiopulmonary Deaths Message-ID: <4394A1C5.9060702@icx.net> Contrast Agent for Appendicitis Confirmation Linked to Cardiopulmonary Deaths ROCKVILLE, Md., Dec. 2 - The FDA warned today that NeutroSpec, a contrast agent used to aid the diagnosis of appendicitis, has been linked two deaths from cardiopulmonary failure. The FDA warning noted that cardiopulmonary reactions occur within 30 minutes of injection with the agent, which is a murine IgM monoclonal antibody to be labeled with Technetium. In addition to the two deaths, there have been reports of serious cardiopulmonary events including "cardiac arrest, hypoxia, dyspnea, and hyptension requiring resuscitation with fluids, vassopressors and oxygen," the FDA said. The FDA advised close monitoring of all NeutroSpec patients for at least an hour after injection. In addition, clinicians using this agent are advised to have resuscitation equipment and appropriately trained resuscitation personnel available. Patients with underlying cardiopulmonary conditions may be at higher risk, so use of NeutroSpec in these patients requires careful consideration of "known and potential risks and benefits." NeutroSpec [Technetium (99m Tc) fanolesomab] is used for scintigraphic imaging of patients with equivocal signs and symptoms of appendicitis. The agent is approved for use in patients age five and older. Technetium binds with high affinity to polymophonuclear leucocytes which migrate to the site of an infected appendix. Technetium emits gamma rays, which are detected with a gamma camera, thereby pinpointing the infection. NeutroSpec is marketed by Mallinckrodt, Palatin Technologies. From kjkrs at hotmail.com Mon Dec 5 15:00:01 2005 From: kjkrs at hotmail.com (KJ Kearfott) Date: Mon, 05 Dec 2005 16:00:01 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Looking for DU slab In-Reply-To: <6.1.2.0.2.20051121101600.02c0f3d8@pop.nam.slb.com> Message-ID: Hi I am looking for a slab of DU which could be donated to UM for some experiments. Thanks Kim Kearfott Professor, Dept. of Nuclear Engineering and Radiological Physics From fd003f0606 at blueyonder.co.uk Mon Dec 5 16:13:39 2005 From: fd003f0606 at blueyonder.co.uk (Fred Dawson) Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 22:13:39 -0000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Man installs a nuclear particle accelerator in his home Message-ID: <002a01c5f9e9$27160d60$0400a8c0@DG47BM0J> http://www.wired.com/news/politics/0,1283,69726,00.html?tw=rss.TOP Albert Swank Jr., a 55-year-old civil engineer in Anchorage, Alaska, is a man with a mission. He wants to install a nuclear particle accelerator in his home. But when neighbors learned of plans to place the 20-ton device inside the house where Swank operates his engineering firm, their response was swift: Not in my backyard. Local lawmakers rushed to introduce emergency legislation banning the use of cyclotrons in home businesses. State health officials took similar steps, and have suspended Swank's permit to operate cyclotrons on his property. "Some of the neighbors who are upset about the cyclotron have started calling it SHAFT -- Swank's high-energy accelerator for tomography," attorney Alan Tesche said. "Part of what's got everyone so upset is we're not sure when it's going to arrive on the barge. We know Anchorage is gonna get the SHAFT, but we just don't know when." Tesche is also the local assemblyman who represents the area where Swank and his cyclotron would reside. Johns Hopkins University agreed to donate the used cyclotron, which is roughly six feet tall by eight feet wide, to Swank's business, Langdon Engineering and Management. The devices are relatively scarce in Alaska, and are used to produce radioactive substances that can be injected into patients undergoing PET scans. Short for positron emission tomography, a PET scan is similar to an X-ray. During the imaging procedure, radioactive material administered to the patient can help medical professionals detect cancerous tissue inside the body. The substance typically remains radioactive for only a couple of hours. For Swank, the backyard cyclotron is a personal quest: He lost his father to cancer years ago, and he says his community needs the medical resource. He also wants to use it to inspire young people to learn about science. "My father worked with me while I was building my first cyclotron at age 17 in this same home, and he encouraged all of the educational pursuits that resulted in who I am," Swank said. "Because of that and my desire to not see other cancer patients suffer -- if I can use this technology to prevent one hour of suffering, or stimulate one young person's mind to pursue science, I will devote every resource that I possess to that." Swank maintains the device is not dangerous for nearby residents. But assemblyman Tesche says noble intentions don't outweigh potential risks and nuisances. He and others fear a particle accelerator could pose hazards such as radiation leak risks to nearby residences. They also think the large amount of electricity it consumes could drain available power in the neighborhood. "We in Alaska embrace technology, and we love it -- but we would like to see this in a hospital or industrial area, where it belongs," Tesche said. "We don't need cyclotrons operating out of back alleys, or in someone's garage." In a letter to the city assembly, the South Addition Community Council compared potential damage from a cyclotron mishap to the Three Mile Island nuclear reactor accident. "Cyclotrons are not nuclear reactors," explains Roger Dixon of the Fermi National Accelerator laboratory or Fermilab in Illinois, funded by the U.S. Department of Energy. "Probably the worst thing that could happen with small cyclotrons is that the operator might electrocute themselves." At Fermilab, Dixon oversees the world's highest-energy collider, about four miles in circumference. It smashes matter and antimatter together so scientists can study the nature of energy. Dixon told Wired News that shielding from concrete walls or lead sheets is typically used to prevent the electrical beams produced by smaller cyclotrons from escaping. "Our neighbors here at Fermilab like us," said Dixon. "But then, our particle accelerator is not installed in a living room." Some of Swank's neighbors are not worried. Veronica Martinson, a homemaker who has lived next door to Swank for 36 years, thinks a cyclotron next door might be a good thing. "Albert was a star science student when he was a child," Martinson said. "He wants schoolchildren to be around this, so they'll learn how this works, and be curious about physics. One of them might turn out to be our next big scientist." Johns Hopkins University public affairs officer Gary Stephenson says the institution agreed to donate the used cyclotron to Swank's engineering firm "with understanding and assurances that it was to benefit the citizens of Alaska for medical needs," and only with proper permission from local authorities. Despite having had his operating permits suspended, Swank plans to remove the cyclotron from its current site at Johns Hopkins in Baltimore on Jan. 23, then ship it by truck and barge to Alaska. But the Anchorage Assembly plan to hold an emergency public hearing on Dec. 20 to determine whether he will be permitted to install the device at his lifelong residence. Fred Dawson From ncohen12 at comcast.net Mon Dec 5 17:06:41 2005 From: ncohen12 at comcast.net (Norm Cohen) Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 18:06:41 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP Message-ID: Dear Friends: This is an article that appeared in the Hampton Union on Friday Dec. 2. The paper is located in Hampton Beach NH, near the Seabrook nuclear power plant. Study: children's cancer up ... 12/02/2005 Hampton Union Date: 12/02/2005 Section: news Page: a1 Word Count: 633 word Study: children's cancer up N-plant, CDC say they have no knowledge of report By Susan Morse smorse at seacoastonline.com SEABROOK - Childhood cancer deaths in the last two decades increased by 19 percent in communities surrounding Seabrook Station, according to the group awarding the nuclear power plant a Dirty Dozen award on Tuesday. In a released statement, Paul Schramski of the Toxics Action Center in Massachusetts said the information came from a study by the Center for Disease Control (CDC) in Atlanta. However, neither CDC spokeswoman Susan Asher nor Seabrook Station spokesman Al Griffith had any knowledge of such a study, they said. Further information released by Schramski said the research was done by Joseph Mangano, an epidemiologist with a master's degree in public health who is the national coordinator for the Radiation and Public Health Project. Its Web site says the project is "a nonprofit educational and scientific organization, established by scientists and physicians dedicated to understanding the relationships between low-level, nuclear radiation and public health." Mangano, reached at his office in Norristown, Pa., on Wednesday, said he used CDC statistics in his study. Anyone can access the same information at wonder.cdc.gov, he said. Infant death rates in four counties surrounding Seabrook Station increased by 4 percent from the two years prior to the plant going on line in 1989, to two years after, he said. The childhood cancer death rate increased by 19 percent between 1981 and 2002, he said. The CDC's Asher said on Wednesday that the federal center does release statistics on race, gender, age, and how people died. She could not confirm the results obtained by Mangano. The CDC does look into the veracity of any study, she said, when it gets a request to do so. "The CDC gets involved when it gets a petition to get involved," she said. "We just don't go out on our own. It can come from anyone." "We've never had a request to go out to the Seabrook place," Asher said. Mangano said the impetus for his research came from Guy Chichester, a Rye resident who co-founded the Clamshell Alliance. The alliance opposed the building of the Seabrook plant. Mangano and Chichester are also working on a study to determine the level of strontium 90 found in baby teeth. Strontium 90 is one component of ionized radiation and is like calcium in that it heads for teeth and bone, said Mangano. So far Mangano has gathered 4,500 teeth nationwide. He expects to release his results in 2006. Of his cancer study, Mangano admits factors other than the nuclear power plant may play a role in the increased statistics. Similar studies of cancer rates in areas surrounding other nuclear power plants have yielded similar results, he said. "Seabrook should be put in a list of factors," he said. "The general trend is, open a plant, the rate goes up, close a plant the rate goes down." Mangano looked at infant death rates for the years 1987 to 1988, and after the plant started operating, from 1989 to 1990, in four counties near Seabrook Station: Essex County in Massachusetts; Rockingham County; Strafford County; and York County in Maine. "In the four-county area it went up by 4 percent," he said. "In the rest of the three-state area - Massachusetts, New Hampshire and Maine - it was down 7 percent. In the rest of the U.S. it was down by 5 percent." He then looked at long-term changes in the childhood cancer death rate, of children dying before the age of 15 in the same four counties. Mangano compared the CDC statistics for the years 1981 through 1989 and 1990 through 2002. "The change in the rates increased by 19 percent," he said. "Elsewhere in the three states it was down by 23 percent and in the U.S., down 26 percent." The Radiation and Public Health Project is not an advocate organization, he said. From Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au Mon Dec 5 20:55:50 2005 From: Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au (Rogers Brent) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 13:55:50 +1100 Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? Message-ID: Dear Colleagues For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website (www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be accessible again? Brent Rogers Manager Radiation Operations Unit NSW Environment Protection Authority Department of Environment and Conservation *+61 2 9995 5986 *+61 2 9995 6603 * PO Box A290 Sydney South 1232 This email is intended for the addressee(s) named and may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then delete it immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of the individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority states them to be the views of the Department of Environment and Conservation (NSW). From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Mon Dec 5 21:56:59 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 03:56:59 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051206035659.2277.qmail@web26406.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> I have been experiencing this for several weeks now. Regards K.S.Parthasarathy Rogers Brent wrote: Dear Colleagues For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website (www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be accessible again? Brent Rogers Manager Radiation Operations Unit NSW Environment Protection Authority Department of Environment and Conservation *+61 2 9995 5986 *+61 2 9995 6603 * PO Box A290 Sydney South 1232 This email is intended for the addressee(s) named and may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then delete it immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of the individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority states them to be the views of the Department of Environment and Conservation (NSW). _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- Play Santa's Celebrity Xmas Party, an exclusive game from Yahoo! From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Mon Dec 5 22:39:22 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 04:39:22 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Man installs a nuclear particle accelerator in his home, storms in the tea cup In-Reply-To: <002a01c5f9e9$27160d60$0400a8c0@DG47BM0J> Message-ID: <20051206043922.86370.qmail@web26413.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear Dr Dawson, Thank you for this message. Public perception of anything nuclear related or radiation related is difficult to fathom. In india, we had smaller "storms in the tea cup" due to CT scan units and diagnostic x-ray installations in residential areas. Regards K.S.Parthasarathy Fred Dawson wrote: http://www.wired.com/news/politics/0,1283,69726,00.html?tw=rss.TOP Albert Swank Jr., a 55-year-old civil engineer in Anchorage, Alaska, is a man with a mission. He wants to install a nuclear particle accelerator in his home. But when neighbors learned of plans to place the 20-ton device inside the house where Swank operates his engineering firm, their response was swift: Not in my backyard. Local lawmakers rushed to introduce emergency legislation banning the use of cyclotrons in home businesses. State health officials took similar steps, and have suspended Swank's permit to operate cyclotrons on his property. "Some of the neighbors who are upset about the cyclotron have started calling it SHAFT -- Swank's high-energy accelerator for tomography," attorney Alan Tesche said. "Part of what's got everyone so upset is we're not sure when it's going to arrive on the barge. We know Anchorage is gonna get the SHAFT, but we just don't know when." Tesche is also the local assemblyman who represents the area where Swank and his cyclotron would reside. Johns Hopkins University agreed to donate the used cyclotron, which is roughly six feet tall by eight feet wide, to Swank's business, Langdon Engineering and Management. The devices are relatively scarce in Alaska, and are used to produce radioactive substances that can be injected into patients undergoing PET scans. Short for positron emission tomography, a PET scan is similar to an X-ray. During the imaging procedure, radioactive material administered to the patient can help medical professionals detect cancerous tissue inside the body. The substance typically remains radioactive for only a couple of hours. For Swank, the backyard cyclotron is a personal quest: He lost his father to cancer years ago, and he says his community needs the medical resource. He also wants to use it to inspire young people to learn about science. "My father worked with me while I was building my first cyclotron at age 17 in this same home, and he encouraged all of the educational pursuits that resulted in who I am," Swank said. "Because of that and my desire to not see other cancer patients suffer -- if I can use this technology to prevent one hour of suffering, or stimulate one young person's mind to pursue science, I will devote every resource that I possess to that." Swank maintains the device is not dangerous for nearby residents. But assemblyman Tesche says noble intentions don't outweigh potential risks and nuisances. He and others fear a particle accelerator could pose hazards such as radiation leak risks to nearby residences. They also think the large amount of electricity it consumes could drain available power in the neighborhood. "We in Alaska embrace technology, and we love it -- but we would like to see this in a hospital or industrial area, where it belongs," Tesche said. "We don't need cyclotrons operating out of back alleys, or in someone's garage." In a letter to the city assembly, the South Addition Community Council compared potential damage from a cyclotron mishap to the Three Mile Island nuclear reactor accident. "Cyclotrons are not nuclear reactors," explains Roger Dixon of the Fermi National Accelerator laboratory or Fermilab in Illinois, funded by the U.S. Department of Energy. "Probably the worst thing that could happen with small cyclotrons is that the operator might electrocute themselves." At Fermilab, Dixon oversees the world's highest-energy collider, about four miles in circumference. It smashes matter and antimatter together so scientists can study the nature of energy. Dixon told Wired News that shielding from concrete walls or lead sheets is typically used to prevent the electrical beams produced by smaller cyclotrons from escaping. "Our neighbors here at Fermilab like us," said Dixon. "But then, our particle accelerator is not installed in a living room." Some of Swank's neighbors are not worried. Veronica Martinson, a homemaker who has lived next door to Swank for 36 years, thinks a cyclotron next door might be a good thing. "Albert was a star science student when he was a child," Martinson said. "He wants schoolchildren to be around this, so they'll learn how this works, and be curious about physics. One of them might turn out to be our next big scientist." Johns Hopkins University public affairs officer Gary Stephenson says the institution agreed to donate the used cyclotron to Swank's engineering firm "with understanding and assurances that it was to benefit the citizens of Alaska for medical needs," and only with proper permission from local authorities. Despite having had his operating permits suspended, Swank plans to remove the cyclotron from its current site at Johns Hopkins in Baltimore on Jan. 23, then ship it by truck and barge to Alaska. But the Anchorage Assembly plan to hold an emergency public hearing on Dec. 20 to determine whether he will be permitted to install the device at his lifelong residence. Fred Dawson _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- Win a Yahoo! Vespa NEW - Yahoo! Cars has 3 Vespa LX125s to be won Enter Now! From BLHamrick at aol.com Mon Dec 5 22:42:24 2005 From: BLHamrick at aol.com (BLHamrick at aol.com) Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 23:42:24 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? Message-ID: <1d5.49af5b91.30c670b0@aol.com> In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website (www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be accessible again? I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an overseas issue. Barbara L. Hamrick From Morten.Sickel at nrpa.no Tue Dec 6 02:23:24 2005 From: Morten.Sickel at nrpa.no (Morten Sickel) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 09:23:24 +0100 Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? Message-ID: <2326C830ADA651438DC694248E5FEF60698CFD@mailix.NRPA.LOCAL> -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of BLHamrick at aol.com > In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: >> For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website (www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not >> responsing" error page. Has this been the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to >> connect from an overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be accessible >> again? > I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an overseas issue. Works just fine from Norway. Morten -- Morten Sickel Norwegian Radiation Protection Authority From fd003f0606 at blueyonder.co.uk Tue Dec 6 02:29:32 2005 From: fd003f0606 at blueyonder.co.uk (Fred Dawson) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 08:29:32 -0000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] It pays to question the media Message-ID: <002c01c5fa3f$2ea472a0$0400a8c0@DG47BM0J> I recently had cause to complain to the BBC about an article on their news web site about Iraq, the environment and depleted uranium. The original article contained a photograph of a child with an eye tumour suggesting a link between the tumour and exposure to depleted uranium. I complained on the basis that there was no evidence to support the link between depleted uranium and eye tumours. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4425562.stm The BBC acknowledged my point and changed the caption on the photograph in question, here is their reply Dear Mr Dawson Thank you for your e-mail regarding BBC News Online. May I start by apologising for the delay in replying. We know our correspondents expect a swift response and I am sorry that you have had to wait so long on this occasion. I rasied your concerns about the picture and caption which accompanies the 'UN warns on Iraq environment fate' piece with BBC News Online. They explained that the picture of Alla Saleem was supplied to the BBC as one of a number of cases at Gazwan hospital in Basra which doctors have attributed to depleted uranium shells used by coalition forces. However, as the article itself does not mention the particular case of Alla Saleem they have decided, to amend the caption to a more general point about Iraqi health. The picture caption has now been changed from "Alla Saleem developed an eye tumour linked to depleted uranium (Pic: 2001)" to "Iraqi doctors say cancer cases have increased, especially among children". Thank you again for contacting the BBC. Yours sincerely Stewart McCullough Divisional Advisor BBC Information ---Original Message--- {Comments:} Please can you provide evidence to support your claim in the report on the News WWW site http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4425562.stm releating to Iraq that 'la Saleem developed an eye tumour linked to depleted uranium' To the best of my knowledge there is no scientific or factual basis for this assertion {EndofComments:} ----------------------------------- fwp_dawson at hotmail.com From srebro at bgumail.bgu.ac.il Tue Dec 6 02:33:58 2005 From: srebro at bgumail.bgu.ac.il (srebro) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 10:33:58 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] nrc Message-ID: <20051206082739.46E6733E76@smtp2.bgu.ac.il> Hi No problem from Israel Rafi From radbloom at comcast.net Tue Dec 6 06:06:04 2005 From: radbloom at comcast.net (Cindy Bloom) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 07:06:04 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? In-Reply-To: <1d5.49af5b91.30c670b0@aol.com> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20051206070131.01e895e0@mail.comcast.net> I'm in the U.S. I tried to get to NRC's website this morning and it sent me to http://www.nrc.gov.edgesuite.net/failover.html. These Radsafe messages remind me that I've encountered this message several times in the last couple of weeks. Cindy At 11:42 PM 12/5/2005 -0500, BLHamrick at aol.com wrote: > >In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, >ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: > >For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website >(www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been >the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an >overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be >accessible again? > > >I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an >overseas issue. > >Barbara L. Hamrick >_______________________________________________ >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood >the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: >http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings >visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From didi at tgi-sci.com Tue Dec 6 06:42:43 2005 From: didi at tgi-sci.com (=?ISO-8859-5?Q?Dimiter=20Popoff?=) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 14:42:43 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? Message-ID: <20051206124243.12946.qmail@server318.com> ww.nrc.gov appears to work from here (Bulgaria). Destination dependent contents? Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ > -------Original Message------- > From: Cindy Bloom > Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? > Sent: Dec 06 '05 14:06 > > I'm in the U.S. I tried to get to NRC's website this morning and it sent > me to http://www.nrc.gov.edgesuite.net/failover.html. These Radsafe > messages remind me that I've encountered this message several times in the > last couple of weeks. > > Cindy > > At 11:42 PM 12/5/2005 -0500, BLHamrick at aol.com wrote: > > > >In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, > >ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: > > > >For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website > >(www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been > >the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an > >overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be > >accessible again? > > > > > >I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an > >overseas issue. > > > >Barbara L. Hamrick > >_______________________________________________ > >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > >the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > >http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > >visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV Tue Dec 6 07:47:06 2005 From: EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV (Baratta, Edmond J) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 08:47:06 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP Message-ID: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA4A@orsnewea002.fda.gov> I'm always amazed how data is obtained from 'baby' teeth. What 'low-level' method is used to for the deter minion of Strontium-90. The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency had listed as the limits of detection for Strontium-90 as 2 pCi/kg (0.074 Bq/kg). Certainly the amount of sample used must be very small. Do they combine a large amount of teeth or are they from individual teeth? I would be interested in knowing more about this method. Edmond J. Baratta Radiation Safety Officer Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 Fax: 781-729-3593 The above represent my thoughts and not that of my agency. -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Norm Cohen Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 6:07 PM To: Know_Nukes at yahoogroups.com; Radsafe Subject: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP Dear Friends: This is an article that appeared in the Hampton Union on Friday Dec. 2. The paper is located in Hampton Beach NH, near the Seabrook nuclear power plant. Study: children's cancer up ... 12/02/2005 Hampton Union Date: 12/02/2005 Section: news Page: a1 Word Count: 633 word Study: children's cancer up N-plant, CDC say they have no knowledge of report By Susan Morse smorse at seacoastonline.com SEABROOK - Childhood cancer deaths in the last two decades increased by 19 percent in communities surrounding Seabrook Station, according to the group awarding the nuclear power plant a Dirty Dozen award on Tuesday. In a released statement, Paul Schramski of the Toxics Action Center in Massachusetts said the information came from a study by the Center for Disease Control (CDC) in Atlanta. However, neither CDC spokeswoman Susan Asher nor Seabrook Station spokesman Al Griffith had any knowledge of such a study, they said. Further information released by Schramski said the research was done by Joseph Mangano, an epidemiologist with a master's degree in public health who is the national coordinator for the Radiation and Public Health Project. Its Web site says the project is "a nonprofit educational and scientific organization, established by scientists and physicians dedicated to understanding the relationships between low-level, nuclear radiation and public health." Mangano, reached at his office in Norristown, Pa., on Wednesday, said he used CDC statistics in his study. Anyone can access the same information at wonder.cdc.gov, he said. Infant death rates in four counties surrounding Seabrook Station increased by 4 percent from the two years prior to the plant going on line in 1989, to two years after, he said. The childhood cancer death rate increased by 19 percent between 1981 and 2002, he said. The CDC's Asher said on Wednesday that the federal center does release statistics on race, gender, age, and how people died. She could not confirm the results obtained by Mangano. The CDC does look into the veracity of any study, she said, when it gets a request to do so. "The CDC gets involved when it gets a petition to get involved," she said. "We just don't go out on our own. It can come from anyone." "We've never had a request to go out to the Seabrook place," Asher said. Mangano said the impetus for his research came from Guy Chichester, a Rye resident who co-founded the Clamshell Alliance. The alliance opposed the building of the Seabrook plant. Mangano and Chichester are also working on a study to determine the level of strontium 90 found in baby teeth. Strontium 90 is one component of ionized radiation and is like calcium in that it heads for teeth and bone, said Mangano. So far Mangano has gathered 4,500 teeth nationwide. He expects to release his results in 2006. Of his cancer study, Mangano admits factors other than the nuclear power plant may play a role in the increased statistics. Similar studies of cancer rates in areas surrounding other nuclear power plants have yielded similar results, he said. "Seabrook should be put in a list of factors," he said. "The general trend is, open a plant, the rate goes up, close a plant the rate goes down." Mangano looked at infant death rates for the years 1987 to 1988, and after the plant started operating, from 1989 to 1990, in four counties near Seabrook Station: Essex County in Massachusetts; Rockingham County; Strafford County; and York County in Maine. "In the four-county area it went up by 4 percent," he said. "In the rest of the three-state area - Massachusetts, New Hampshire and Maine - it was down 7 percent. In the rest of the U.S. it was down by 5 percent." He then looked at long-term changes in the childhood cancer death rate, of children dying before the age of 15 in the same four counties. Mangano compared the CDC statistics for the years 1981 through 1989 and 1990 through 2002. "The change in the rates increased by 19 percent," he said. "Elsewhere in the three states it was down by 23 percent and in the U.S., down 26 percent." The Radiation and Public Health Project is not an advocate organization, he said. _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From wesvanpelt at att.net Tue Dec 6 09:55:18 2005 From: wesvanpelt at att.net (Wesley) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 10:55:18 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] HEALTH PHTSICS E-JOURNAL In-Reply-To: <1ef.4862f65d.30c4d705@aol.com> Message-ID: Radsafers, I am responding to the suggestion of establishment of a new, electronic health physics journal. As a model or concept, I invite you to look at the link below that describes a "living journal" in which the original authors continue to update their articles. http://relativity.livingreviews.org/About/concept.html Best regards, Wes Wesley R. Van Pelt, PhD, CIH, CHP Wesley R. Van Pelt Associates, Inc. From mrdupray at lbl.gov Tue Dec 6 10:23:29 2005 From: mrdupray at lbl.gov (Michael R. Dupray) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 08:23:29 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? In-Reply-To: <1d5.49af5b91.30c670b0@aol.com> References: <1d5.49af5b91.30c670b0@aol.com> Message-ID: <4395BB01.4010707@lbl.gov> Its probably a security setting at your lan or on your mail settings BLHamrick at aol.com wrote: > >In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, >ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: > >For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website >(www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been >the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an >overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be >accessible again? > > >I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an >overseas issue. > >Barbara L. Hamrick >_______________________________________________ >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > -- From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Tue Dec 6 10:52:25 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 16:52:25 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Which other countries are not having access to NRC website? In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.2.20051206070131.01e895e0@mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <20051206165225.94994.qmail@web26415.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear Cindy Bloom, When I tried to use the link you gave I got the following message: "Server not responding. Our website is experiencing technical difficulties. We are aware of the problem and hope to have it resolved shortly. Thank you for your patience." I have been getting this message for the past several weeks. It appears that NRC website is facing some prolonged technical difficulties!. They are unable to fix it. I thought that a "snag" which appeared to be temporary and technical could be corrected without difficulty. A few years ago, the website of the Indian Atomic Energy Regulatory Board was hacked by miscreants; They pasted some unwanted messages on the site; our staff could correct them in an hour. Indian press reported the event widely.I had several calls from the print and electronic media as I was then Secretary of the Board and the Director, Information and Technical Services Division. The hacking was a blessing in disguise! our site had unusually large number of hits for the following several days. Some members of the media wanted to know whether any secrets have been stolen. I had a hard time convincing the gullible that we do not have any secrets in our web site! I am keen to know which other countries are facing the difficulty with the NRC site. It appears that the snag is not hitting USA,Bulgaria,Israel and Norway. The NRCsite is not accessible from Australia and India. I shall appreciate receiving status messages from other countries to me personally and not to the group. Regards K.S.Parthasarathy Cindy Bloom wrote: I'm in the U.S. I tried to get to NRC's website this morning and it sent me to http://www.nrc.gov.edgesuite.net/failover.html. These Radsafe messages remind me that I've encountered this message several times in the last couple of weeks. Cindy At 11:42 PM 12/5/2005 -0500, BLHamrick at aol.com wrote: > >In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, >ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: > >For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website >(www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been >the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an >overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be >accessible again? > > >I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an >overseas issue. > >Barbara L. Hamrick >_______________________________________________ >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood >the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: >http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings >visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. From radbloom at comcast.net Tue Dec 6 11:45:38 2005 From: radbloom at comcast.net (Cindy Bloom) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 12:45:38 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Re: Which other countries are not having access to NRC website? In-Reply-To: <20051206165225.94994.qmail@web26415.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <5.2.0.9.2.20051206070131.01e895e0@mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20051206123757.036db7a8@mail.comcast.net> As noted before, I'm in the USA and have been having the problem intermittently. The URL that I sent to Radsafe before was to show others the link to the error message where I was redirected. I could not get to any of the other menu options (such as Contact Web Site Staff) from there. Right now, I can get to NRC's web site. Odd. Cindy At 04:52 PM 12/6/2005 +0000, you wrote: >Dear Cindy Bloom, > >When I tried to use the link you gave I got the following message: > >"Server not responding. >Our website is experiencing technical difficulties. >We are aware of the problem and hope to have it resolved shortly. Thank >you for your patience." > >I have been getting this message for the past several weeks. It appears >that NRC website is facing some prolonged technical difficulties!. They >are unable to fix it. I thought that a "snag" which appeared to be >temporary and technical could be corrected without difficulty. > >A few years ago, the website of the Indian Atomic Energy Regulatory Board >was hacked by miscreants; They pasted some unwanted messages on the site; >our staff could correct them in an hour. Indian press reported the event >widely.I had several calls from the print and electronic media as I was >then Secretary of the Board and the Director, Information and Technical >Services Division. > >The hacking was a blessing in disguise! our site had unusually large >number of hits for the following several days. Some members of the media >wanted to know whether any secrets have been stolen. I had a hard time >convincing the gullible that we do not have any secrets in our web site! > >I am keen to know which other countries are facing the difficulty with the >NRC site. It appears that the snag is not hitting USA,Bulgaria,Israel and >Norway. The NRCsite is not accessible from Australia and India. > >I shall appreciate receiving status messages from other countries to me >personally and not to the group. > >Regards > >K.S.Parthasarathy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Cindy Bloom wrote: >I'm in the U.S. I tried to get to NRC's website this morning and it sent >me to http://www.nrc.gov.edgesuite.net/failover.html. These Radsafe >messages remind me that I've encountered this message several times in the >last couple of weeks. > >Cindy > >At 11:42 PM 12/5/2005 -0500, BLHamrick at aol.com wrote: > > > >In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, > >ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: > > > >For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website > >(www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been > >the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an > >overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be > >accessible again? > > > > > >I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an > >overseas issue. > > > >Barbara L. Hamrick > >_______________________________________________ > >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > >the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > >http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > >visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > >_______________________________________________ >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood >the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: >http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings >visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > > >To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new >Yahoo! >Security Centre. From kjkrs at hotmail.com Tue Dec 6 13:10:55 2005 From: kjkrs at hotmail.com (KJ Kearfott) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 14:10:55 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] WE 2001 Panasonic Irradiator source installation In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi I am looking for somebody with experience installing or de-installing a WE 2001 Panasonic Irradiator source. Thanks Kim Kearfott U. Michigan From didi at tgi-sci.com Tue Dec 6 13:28:48 2005 From: didi at tgi-sci.com (=?ISO-8859-5?Q?Dimiter=20Popoff?=) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 21:28:48 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Re: Which other countries are not having access to NRC website? Message-ID: <20051206192848.29915.qmail@server318.com> > Right now, I can get to NRC's web site. Odd. Or may be not that odd. Word has spread there are anomalies, perhaps peceived as revealing by someone who know their meaning, and the problem was fixed Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ > -------Original Message------- > From: Cindy Bloom > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Re: Which other countries are not having access to NRC website? > Sent: Dec 06 '05 19:45 > > As noted before, I'm in the USA and have been having the problem > intermittently. The URL that I sent to Radsafe before was to show others > the link to the error message where I was redirected. I could not get to > any of the other menu options (such as Contact Web Site Staff) from > there. Right now, I can get to NRC's web site. Odd. > > Cindy > > At 04:52 PM 12/6/2005 +0000, you wrote: > >Dear Cindy Bloom, > > > >When I tried to use the link you gave I got the following message: > > > >"Server not responding. > >Our website is experiencing technical difficulties. > >We are aware of the problem and hope to have it resolved shortly. Thank > >you for your patience." > > > >I have been getting this message for the past several weeks. It appears > >that NRC website is facing some prolonged technical difficulties!. They > >are unable to fix it. I thought that a "snag" which appeared to be > >temporary and technical could be corrected without difficulty. > > > >A few years ago, the website of the Indian Atomic Energy Regulatory Board > >was hacked by miscreants; They pasted some unwanted messages on the site; > >our staff could correct them in an hour. Indian press reported the event > >widely.I had several calls from the print and electronic media as I was > >then Secretary of the Board and the Director, Information and Technical > >Services Division. > > > >The hacking was a blessing in disguise! our site had unusually large > >number of hits for the following several days. Some members of the media > >wanted to know whether any secrets have been stolen. I had a hard time > >convincing the gullible that we do not have any secrets in our web site! > > > >I am keen to know which other countries are facing the difficulty with the > >NRC site. It appears that the snag is not hitting USA,Bulgaria,Israel and > >Norway. The NRCsite is not accessible from Australia and India. > > > >I shall appreciate receiving status messages from other countries to me > >personally and not to the group. > > > >Regards > > > >K.S.Parthasarathy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Cindy Bloom wrote: > >I'm in the U.S. I tried to get to NRC's website this morning and it sent > >me to http://www.nrc.gov.edgesuite.net/failover.html. These Radsafe > >messages remind me that I've encountered this message several times in the > >last couple of weeks. > > > >Cindy > > > >At 11:42 PM 12/5/2005 -0500, BLHamrick at aol.com wrote: > > > > > >In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, > > >ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: > > > > > >For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website > > >(www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been > > >the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an > > >overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be > > >accessible again? > > > > > > > > >I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an > > >overseas issue. > > > > > >Barbara L. Hamrick > > >_______________________________________________ > > >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > > > > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > > >the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > > >http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > > > > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > > >visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > > >_______________________________________________ > >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > >the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > >http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > >visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > > > > > > >To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new > >Yahoo! > >Security Centre. > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From Marty.Bourquin at grace.com Tue Dec 6 13:28:08 2005 From: Marty.Bourquin at grace.com (Marty.Bourquin at grace.com) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 14:28:08 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? Message-ID: I am in the USA and have this problem intermittently. I have the same issue with OSHA web site. I dont know why this solution works but it always seems to for me. I go to Google and search for NRC then click on the link that appears in the search results and I am in. As I said I dont know why it works but for me it does. Marty Bourquin Manager EHS W.R. Grace - Chattanooga -----Original Message----- From: Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au [mailto:Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au] Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 9:56 PM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? Dear Colleagues For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website (www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be accessible again? Brent Rogers Manager Radiation Operations Unit NSW Environment Protection Authority Department of Environment and Conservation *+61 2 9995 5986 *+61 2 9995 6603 * PO Box A290 Sydney South 1232 This email is intended for the addressee(s) named and may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then delete it immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of the individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority states them to be the views of the Department of Environment and Conservation (NSW). _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From mike.bohan at yale.edu Tue Dec 6 14:28:38 2005 From: mike.bohan at yale.edu (Michael Bohan) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 15:28:38 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Re: Which other countries are not having access Message-ID: <7ac8408a2868d853af89f8160c53ff82@yale.edu> Hello RadSafers, It also might be a browser problem. Try using a different browser and/or clear out your browser's cache. It might just be reloading the stored error message from your hard drive. Regards, Mike Bohan, RSO Yale-New Haven Hospital Radiological Physics 20 York St. - WWW 204 New Haven, CT 06510 Tele: (203) 688-2950 Fax: (203) 688-8682 Email: mike.bohan at yale.edu This message originates from Yale New Haven Health System. The information contained in this message may be privileged and confidential. If you are the intended recipient, you must maintain this message in a secure and confidential manner. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately and destroy this message. Thank you. From didi at tgi-sci.com Tue Dec 6 16:53:42 2005 From: didi at tgi-sci.com (=?ISO-8859-5?Q?Dimiter=20Popoff?=) Date: Wed, 07 Dec 2005 00:53:42 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: NRC website? Message-ID: <20051206225342.23893.qmail@server318.com> Well this sounds like some new epidemic on the systems many people use in the US. Perhaps something in the way they do nameserver requests or whatever. Does not seem to be destination dependent content, though. Just some software glitch, most likely OS related. Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ > -------Original Message------- > From: Marty.Bourquin at grace.com > Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? > Sent: Dec 06 '05 21:28 > > I am in the USA and have this problem intermittently. I have the same > issue with OSHA web site. I dont know why this solution works but it > always seems to for me. I go to Google and search for NRC then click on > the link that appears in the search results and I am in. As I said I > dont know why it works but for me it does. > > Marty Bourquin > Manager EHS > W.R. Grace - Chattanooga > > -----Original Message----- > From: Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au > [mailto:Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au] > Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 9:56 PM > To: radsafe at radlab.nl > Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? > > > Dear Colleagues > > For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website > (www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this > been > the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect > from an > overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be > accessible again? > > Brent Rogers > Manager Radiation Operations Unit > NSW Environment Protection Authority > Department of Environment and Conservation > *+61 2 9995 5986 > *+61 2 9995 6603 > * PO Box A290 Sydney South 1232 > > > > This email is intended for the addressee(s) named and may contain > confidential and/or privileged information. > > If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then > delete it immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of > the individual sender except where the sender expressly and with > authority states them to be the views of the Department of Environment > and Conservation (NSW). > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au Tue Dec 6 15:17:49 2005 From: Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au (Rogers Brent) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 08:17:49 +1100 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Man installs a nuclear particle accelerator in hi s home, storms in the tea cup Message-ID: Mr Dixon from Fermilab is probably right, the worst thing he could do is electrocute himself. But if he did that, he'd be dead, and there're a lot of 'bad' things that can happen short of death. My worry is less about the cyclotron as what comes out of it. The first thing I thought of when reading the article was he said he was interested in making PET substances. Nuclear pharmacists that produce PET drugs use a myriad of dose reducing techniques when working with high dose-rate F-18, and many still have to take measures (such as doing lower dose tasks in the pharmacy) to prevent exceeding their 500 mSv (50 R) annual extremity limit. If Mr Swank wasn't equally trained and sufficiently careful, our pro-hormesis friends might be using him as an example. Or not. Brent Rogers Manager Radiation Operations Unit NSW Environment Protection Authority Department of Environment and Conservation *+61 2 9995 5986 *+61 2 9995 6603 * PO Box A290 Sydney South 1232 Fred Dawson wrote: http://www.wired.com/news/politics/0,1283,69726,00.html?tw=rss.TOP Albert Swank Jr., a 55-year-old civil engineer in Anchorage, Alaska, is a man with a mission. He wants to install a nuclear particle accelerator in his home. But when neighbors learned of plans to place the 20-ton device inside the house where Swank operates his engineering firm, their response was swift: Not in my backyard. Local lawmakers rushed to introduce emergency legislation banning the use of cyclotrons in home businesses. State health officials took similar steps, and have suspended Swank's permit to operate cyclotrons on his property. "Some of the neighbors who are upset about the cyclotron have started calling it SHAFT -- Swank's high-energy accelerator for tomography," attorney Alan Tesche said. "Part of what's got everyone so upset is we're not sure when it's going to arrive on the barge. We know Anchorage is gonna get the SHAFT, but we just don't know when." Tesche is also the local assemblyman who represents the area where Swank and his cyclotron would reside. Johns Hopkins University agreed to donate the used cyclotron, which is roughly six feet tall by eight feet wide, to Swank's business, Langdon Engineering and Management. The devices are relatively scarce in Alaska, and are used to produce radioactive substances that can be injected into patients undergoing PET scans. Short for positron emission tomography, a PET scan is similar to an X-ray. During the imaging procedure, radioactive material administered to the patient can help medical professionals detect cancerous tissue inside the body. The substance typically remains radioactive for only a couple of hours. For Swank, the backyard cyclotron is a personal quest: He lost his father to cancer years ago, and he says his community needs the medical resource. He also wants to use it to inspire young people to learn about science. "My father worked with me while I was building my first cyclotron at age 17 in this same home, and he encouraged all of the educational pursuits that resulted in who I am," Swank said. "Because of that and my desire to not see other cancer patients suffer -- if I can use this technology to prevent one hour of suffering, or stimulate one young person's mind to pursue science, I will devote every resource that I possess to that." Swank maintains the device is not dangerous for nearby residents. But assemblyman Tesche says noble intentions don't outweigh potential risks and nuisances. He and others fear a particle accelerator could pose hazards such as radiation leak risks to nearby residences. They also think the large amount of electricity it consumes could drain available power in the neighborhood. "We in Alaska embrace technology, and we love it -- but we would like to see this in a hospital or industrial area, where it belongs," Tesche said. "We don't need cyclotrons operating out of back alleys, or in someone's garage." In a letter to the city assembly, the South Addition Community Council compared potential damage from a cyclotron mishap to the Three Mile Island nuclear reactor accident. "Cyclotrons are not nuclear reactors," explains Roger Dixon of the Fermi National Accelerator laboratory or Fermilab in Illinois, funded by the U.S. Department of Energy. "Probably the worst thing that could happen with small cyclotrons is that the operator might electrocute themselves." At Fermilab, Dixon oversees the world's highest-energy collider, about four miles in circumference. It smashes matter and antimatter together so scientists can study the nature of energy. Dixon told Wired News that shielding from concrete walls or lead sheets is typically used to prevent the electrical beams produced by smaller cyclotrons from escaping. "Our neighbors here at Fermilab like us," said Dixon. "But then, our particle accelerator is not installed in a living room." Some of Swank's neighbors are not worried. Veronica Martinson, a homemaker who has lived next door to Swank for 36 years, thinks a cyclotron next door might be a good thing. "Albert was a star science student when he was a child," Martinson said. "He wants schoolchildren to be around this, so they'll learn how this works, and be curious about physics. One of them might turn out to be our next big scientist." Johns Hopkins University public affairs officer Gary Stephenson says the institution agreed to donate the used cyclotron to Swank's engineering firm "with understanding and assurances that it was to benefit the citizens of Alaska for medical needs," and only with proper permission from local authorities. Despite having had his operating permits suspended, Swank plans to remove the cyclotron from its current site at Johns Hopkins in Baltimore on Jan. 23, then ship it by truck and barge to Alaska. But the Anchorage Assembly plan to hold an emergency public hearing on Dec. 20 to determine whether he will be permitted to install the device at his lifelong residence. Fred Dawson _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- Win a Yahoo! Vespa NEW - Yahoo! Cars has 3 Vespa LX125s to be won Enter Now! _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ This email is intended for the addressee(s) named and may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then delete it immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of the individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority states them to be the views of the Department of Environment and Conservation (NSW). From farbersa at optonline.net Tue Dec 6 17:16:56 2005 From: farbersa at optonline.net (farbersa at optonline.net) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 18:16:56 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP In-Reply-To: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA4A@orsnewea002.fda.gov> References: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA4A@orsnewea002.fda.gov> Message-ID: Hi all, The most recent post by Norm Cohen relates to claims by Mangano, et. al that have nothing to do with baby teeth and Sr-90. Mangano is merely using the discredited techniques of Sternglass of using a narrow window of time and picking a time period of some health statistic to compare to another narrow window of time to claim some effect. Mangano is merely a Sternglass wannabe whose work fails on a first order analysis. Regarding the supposed effects of Sr-90 from nuclear plants that they claim to measuring in baby teeth, we know that 99++% of all Sr-90 in the environment near any nuclear plant is from open air testing of nuclear weapons. The variations in Sr-90 and Cs-137 in the environment from nuclear bomb test fallout are so large as to dwarf any trivial releases of these isotopes from any given nuclear plant. I've discussed this point before in earlier posts to Radsafe related to Cs-137 in woodash varying from 300 pCi/kg of ash in CA to 30,000 pCi/kg of wood ash from northern FL, no where near a nuclear plant. Sr-90 deposition in various parts of the country would have varied by similar amounts since there is a certain average ratio of Sr-90/Cs-137 in weapon's test fallout. Despite the claims of the TFP, Mangano, and Sternglass, their aggegate of work irregardless of the technique for measurements of Sr-90 in baby teeth, is nothing more than agenda science, the conclusions of which were determined before the first tooth was ever analyzed. Stewart Farber, MS Public Health The Prometheus Group, LLC 203 367-0791 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Baratta, Edmond J" Date: Tuesday, December 6, 2005 8:47 am Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP > I'm always amazed how data is obtained from 'baby' teeth. What > 'low-level' > method is used to for the deter minion of Strontium-90. The U.S. > Environmental Protection Agency had listed as the limits of > detection for > Strontium-90 as 2 pCi/kg (0.074 Bq/kg). Certainly the amount of > sample used > must be very small. Do they combine a large amount of teeth or > are they > from individual teeth? I would be interested in knowing more > about this > method. > > > Edmond J. Baratta > Radiation Safety Officer > Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 > Fax: 781-729-3593 > > The above represent my thoughts and not that of my agency. > > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] > On Behalf > Of Norm Cohen > Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 6:07 PM > To: Know_Nukes at yahoogroups.com; Radsafe > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP > > > > > > > > > Dear Friends: This is an article that appeared in the Hampton > Union on > Friday Dec. 2. The paper is located in Hampton Beach NH, near the > Seabrooknuclear power plant. > > > > > Study: children's cancer up ... 12/02/2005 > Hampton Union > Date: 12/02/2005 Section: news Page: a1 > Word Count: 633 word > > > Study: children's cancer up > N-plant, CDC say they have no knowledge of report > By Susan Morse smorse at seacoastonline.com > SEABROOK - Childhood cancer deaths in the last two decades > increased by 19 > percent in communities surrounding Seabrook Station, according to > the group > awarding the nuclear power plant a Dirty Dozen award on Tuesday. > In a released statement, Paul Schramski of the Toxics Action > Center in > Massachusetts said the information came from a study by the Center for > Disease Control (CDC) in Atlanta. > However, neither CDC spokeswoman Susan Asher nor Seabrook Station > spokesman Al Griffith had any knowledge of such a study, they said. > Further information released by Schramski said the research was > done by > Joseph Mangano, an epidemiologist with a master's degree in public > healthwho is the national coordinator for the Radiation and Public > Health Project. > Its Web site says the project is "a nonprofit educational and > scientificorganization, established by scientists and physicians > dedicated to > understanding the relationships between low-level, nuclear > radiation and > public health." > Mangano, reached at his office in Norristown, Pa., on > Wednesday, said he > used CDC statistics in his study. Anyone can access the same > information at > wonder.cdc.gov, he said. > Infant death rates in four counties surrounding Seabrook Station > increased by 4 percent from the two years prior to the plant going > on line > in 1989, to two years after, he said. > The childhood cancer death rate increased by 19 percent between > 1981 and > 2002, he said. > The CDC's Asher said on Wednesday that the federal center does > releasestatistics on race, gender, age, and how people died. > She could not confirm the results obtained by Mangano. > The CDC does look into the veracity of any study, she said, > when it gets > a request to do so. > "The CDC gets involved when it gets a petition to get > involved," she > said. "We just don't go out on our own. It can come from anyone." > "We've never had a request to go out to the Seabrook place," > Asher said. > Mangano said the impetus for his research came from Guy > Chichester, a Rye > resident who co-founded the Clamshell Alliance. The alliance > opposed the > building of the Seabrook plant. > Mangano and Chichester are also working on a study to determine > the level > of strontium 90 found in baby teeth. Strontium 90 is one component of > ionized radiation and is like calcium in that it heads for teeth > and bone, > said Mangano. > So far Mangano has gathered 4,500 teeth nationwide. He expects > to release > his results in 2006. > Of his cancer study, Mangano admits factors other than the > nuclear power > plant may play a role in the increased statistics. > Similar studies of cancer rates in areas surrounding other > nuclear power > plants have yielded similar results, he said. > "Seabrook should be put in a list of factors," he said. "The > generaltrend is, open a plant, the rate goes up, close a plant the > rate goes down." > Mangano looked at infant death rates for the years 1987 to > 1988, and > after the plant started operating, from 1989 to 1990, in four > counties near > Seabrook Station: Essex County in Massachusetts; Rockingham County; > Strafford County; and York County in Maine. > "In the four-county area it went up by 4 percent," he said. "In > the rest > of the three-state area - Massachusetts, New Hampshire and Maine - > it was > down 7 percent. In the rest of the U.S. it was down by 5 percent." > He then looked at long-term changes in the childhood cancer > death rate, > of children dying before the age of 15 in the same four counties. > Mangano compared the CDC statistics for the years 1981 through > 1989 and > 1990 through 2002. > "The change in the rates increased by 19 percent," he said. > "Elsewhere in > the three states it was down by 23 percent and in the U.S., down 26 > percent." > The Radiation and Public Health Project is not an advocate > organization,he said. > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and > understood the > RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other > settings visit: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and > understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other > settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From MZittle at FACNET.UCLA.EDU Tue Dec 6 18:22:27 2005 From: MZittle at FACNET.UCLA.EDU (Zittle, Mike) Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 16:22:27 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Operational Health Physics Training By H.J. Moe Message-ID: Hi I am trying to download the Moe Handbook from http://www.nukeworker.com/study/hp/moe/index.shtml Apparently the link to Chapter 3 - 03. Properties of Alpha, Beta, Gamma, X-Rays, and Neutrons is damaged and cannot be repaired. Does anyone have the electronic pdf for Chapter 3 that they could please send me? Thanks Mike Michael J. Zittle Health Physicist UCLA Environment, Health and Safety 501 Westwood Plaza, 4th floor Box 951605 Los Angeles, CA 90095-1605 (310) 825-8797 fax (310) 206-9051 mzittle at admin.ucla.edu From maurysis at ev1.net Tue Dec 6 18:43:23 2005 From: maurysis at ev1.net (Maury Siskel) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 18:43:23 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: NRC website? In-Reply-To: <20051206225342.23893.qmail@server318.com> References: <20051206225342.23893.qmail@server318.com> Message-ID: <4396302B.9010105@ev1.net> http://www.nrc.gov/ After many repeated trials last couple days, site works fine from Ft. Worth Tx. on Netscape 7.2 via EV1. Cheers, Maury&Dog (maurysis at ev1.net =================== Dimiter Popoff wrote: > Well this sounds like some new epidemic on the systems many > people use in the US. Perhaps something in the way they do > nameserver requests or whatever. Does not seem to be > destination dependent content, though. Just some software glitch, most > likely OS related. > Dimiter > ------------------------------------------------------ > Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments > http://www.tgi-sci.com > -------------- snipped ----------------- From lists at richardhess.com Tue Dec 6 19:19:18 2005 From: lists at richardhess.com (Richard L. Hess) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 20:19:18 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? In-Reply-To: <1d5.49af5b91.30c670b0@aol.com> References: <1d5.49af5b91.30c670b0@aol.com> Message-ID: <7.0.0.16.2.20051206201840.06509ec8@richardhess.com> I just tried it from the Great White North here in Canada and it seemed to work. At 11:42 PM 12/5/2005, BLHamrick at aol.com wrote: > >In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, >ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: > >For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website >(www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been >the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an >overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be >accessible again? > > >I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an >overseas issue. > Richard L. Hess richard at richardhess.com Aurora, Ontario, Canada http://www.richardhess.com/ Detailed contact information: http://www.richardhess.com/tape/contact.htm From sjd at swcp.com Tue Dec 6 20:42:33 2005 From: sjd at swcp.com (Steven Dapra) Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 19:42:33 -0700 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.1.20051206193751.009ec940@mail.swcp.com> Dec. 6 If you want the partisan's view on the Tooth Fairy Project, go to . Mangano et al. have published an article in The Science of the Total Environment, Volume 317, Issus 1-3, 30 December 2003, Pages 37-51; (An unexpected rise in strontium-90 in US deciduous teeth in the 1990s.) RPHP links to the abstract, and if you want the entire article you can pay American Elsevier $30.00. Steven Dapra sjd at swcp.com From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Tue Dec 6 22:15:38 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 04:15:38 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] People with an agenda can exploit the frailties and uncertainties of epidemiological studies. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051207041539.10523.qmail@web26412.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear Mr Stewart Farber, Claims such as the one made by Mangano et. al are accepted by lay people primarily because they do not have knowledge about fall out etc. People with hidden agenda are a committed lot. They will exploit the frailtiesand uncertainties inherent in epidemiological studies ruthlessly and to some extent irrationally to their advantage. Let me assure you that it is a very frustrating experience. Your detailed note on variation of weapons fall out will convince any one. But people conditioned by fear will be less amenable to reasoning. Still we have to try. Regards K.S.Parthasarathy farbersa at optonline.net wrote: Hi all, The most recent post by Norm Cohen relates to claims by Mangano, et. al that have nothing to do with baby teeth and Sr-90. Mangano is merely using the discredited techniques of Sternglass of using a narrow window of time and picking a time period of some health statistic to compare to another narrow window of time to claim some effect. Mangano is merely a Sternglass wannabe whose work fails on a first order analysis. Regarding the supposed effects of Sr-90 from nuclear plants that they claim to measuring in baby teeth, we know that 99++% of all Sr-90 in the environment near any nuclear plant is from open air testing of nuclear weapons. The variations in Sr-90 and Cs-137 in the environment from nuclear bomb test fallout are so large as to dwarf any trivial releases of these isotopes from any given nuclear plant. I've discussed this point before in earlier posts to Radsafe related to Cs-137 in woodash varying from 300 pCi/kg of ash in CA to 30,000 pCi/kg of wood ash from northern FL, no where near a nuclear plant. Sr-90 deposition in various parts of the country would have varied by similar amounts since there is a certain average ratio of Sr-90/Cs-137 in weapon's test fallout. Despite the claims of the TFP, Mangano, and Sternglass, their aggegate of work irregardless of the technique for measurements of Sr-90 in baby teeth, is nothing more than agenda science, the conclusions of which were determined before the first tooth was ever analyzed. Stewart Farber, MS Public Health The Prometheus Group, LLC 203 367-0791 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Baratta, Edmond J" Date: Tuesday, December 6, 2005 8:47 am Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP > I'm always amazed how data is obtained from 'baby' teeth. What > 'low-level' > method is used to for the deter minion of Strontium-90. The U.S. > Environmental Protection Agency had listed as the limits of > detection for > Strontium-90 as 2 pCi/kg (0.074 Bq/kg). Certainly the amount of > sample used > must be very small. Do they combine a large amount of teeth or > are they > from individual teeth? I would be interested in knowing more > about this > method. > > > Edmond J. Baratta > Radiation Safety Officer > Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 > Fax: 781-729-3593 > > The above represent my thoughts and not that of my agency. > > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] > On Behalf > Of Norm Cohen > Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 6:07 PM > To: Know_Nukes at yahoogroups.com; Radsafe > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP > > > > > > > > > Dear Friends: This is an article that appeared in the Hampton > Union on > Friday Dec. 2. The paper is located in Hampton Beach NH, near the > Seabrooknuclear power plant. > > > > > Study: children's cancer up ... 12/02/2005 > Hampton Union > Date: 12/02/2005 Section: news Page: a1 > Word Count: 633 word > > > Study: children's cancer up > N-plant, CDC say they have no knowledge of report > By Susan Morse smorse at seacoastonline.com > SEABROOK - Childhood cancer deaths in the last two decades > increased by 19 > percent in communities surrounding Seabrook Station, according to > the group > awarding the nuclear power plant a Dirty Dozen award on Tuesday. > In a released statement, Paul Schramski of the Toxics Action > Center in > Massachusetts said the information came from a study by the Center for > Disease Control (CDC) in Atlanta. > However, neither CDC spokeswoman Susan Asher nor Seabrook Station > spokesman Al Griffith had any knowledge of such a study, they said. > Further information released by Schramski said the research was > done by > Joseph Mangano, an epidemiologist with a master's degree in public > healthwho is the national coordinator for the Radiation and Public > Health Project. > Its Web site says the project is "a nonprofit educational and > scientificorganization, established by scientists and physicians > dedicated to > understanding the relationships between low-level, nuclear > radiation and > public health." > Mangano, reached at his office in Norristown, Pa., on > Wednesday, said he > used CDC statistics in his study. Anyone can access the same > information at > wonder.cdc.gov, he said. > Infant death rates in four counties surrounding Seabrook Station > increased by 4 percent from the two years prior to the plant going > on line > in 1989, to two years after, he said. > The childhood cancer death rate increased by 19 percent between > 1981 and > 2002, he said. > The CDC's Asher said on Wednesday that the federal center does > releasestatistics on race, gender, age, and how people died. > She could not confirm the results obtained by Mangano. > The CDC does look into the veracity of any study, she said, > when it gets > a request to do so. > "The CDC gets involved when it gets a petition to get > involved," she > said. "We just don't go out on our own. It can come from anyone." > "We've never had a request to go out to the Seabrook place," > Asher said. > Mangano said the impetus for his research came from Guy > Chichester, a Rye > resident who co-founded the Clamshell Alliance. The alliance > opposed the > building of the Seabrook plant. > Mangano and Chichester are also working on a study to determine > the level > of strontium 90 found in baby teeth. Strontium 90 is one component of > ionized radiation and is like calcium in that it heads for teeth > and bone, > said Mangano. > So far Mangano has gathered 4,500 teeth nationwide. He expects > to release > his results in 2006. > Of his cancer study, Mangano admits factors other than the > nuclear power > plant may play a role in the increased statistics. > Similar studies of cancer rates in areas surrounding other > nuclear power > plants have yielded similar results, he said. > "Seabrook should be put in a list of factors," he said. "The > generaltrend is, open a plant, the rate goes up, close a plant the > rate goes down." > Mangano looked at infant death rates for the years 1987 to > 1988, and > after the plant started operating, from 1989 to 1990, in four > counties near > Seabrook Station: Essex County in Massachusetts; Rockingham County; > Strafford County; and York County in Maine. > "In the four-county area it went up by 4 percent," he said. "In > the rest > of the three-state area - Massachusetts, New Hampshire and Maine - > it was > down 7 percent. In the rest of the U.S. it was down by 5 percent." > He then looked at long-term changes in the childhood cancer > death rate, > of children dying before the age of 15 in the same four counties. > Mangano compared the CDC statistics for the years 1981 through > 1989 and > 1990 through 2002. > "The change in the rates increased by 19 percent," he said. > "Elsewhere in > the three states it was down by 23 percent and in the U.S., down 26 > percent." > The Radiation and Public Health Project is not an advocate > organization,he said. > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and > understood the > RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other > settings visit: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and > understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other > settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. From burcin.okyar at taek.gov.tr Wed Dec 7 06:02:12 2005 From: burcin.okyar at taek.gov.tr (burcin.okyar at taek.gov.tr) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 14:02:12 +0200 Subject: =?iso-8859-9?B?3WxnaTpSZTog?=[ RadSafe ] NRC website? Message-ID: <20051207120212.LBQ13550.lale@[195.155.1.6]> It seems OK from Turkey. Burcin OKYAR > > Kimden: "Richard L. Hess" > Tarih: 2005/12/06 Tue PM 08:19:18 GMT+02:00 > Kime: radsafe at radlab.nl > Konu: Re: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? > > I just tried it from the Great White North here in Canada and it > seemed to work. > > At 11:42 PM 12/5/2005, BLHamrick at aol.com wrote: > > > >In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:32:57 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, > >ksparth at yahoo.co.uk writes: > > > >For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website > >(www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been > >the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an > >overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be > >accessible again? > > > > > >I use it everyday from the U.S. and have no trouble. I expect it may be an > >overseas issue. > > > > Richard L. Hess richard at richardhess.com > Aurora, Ontario, Canada http://www.richardhess.com/ > Detailed contact information: http://www.richardhess.com/tape/contact.htm > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > From mccartmj at michigan.gov Wed Dec 7 08:03:46 2005 From: mccartmj at michigan.gov (Michael McCarty) Date: Wed, 07 Dec 2005 09:03:46 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? Message-ID: For what it's worth, I never (well hardly ever) have a problem entering the NRC website to check current power levels on 'our' reactors. Today I got a message: "Server Not Responding Our web site is experiencing technical difficulties. We are aware of the problem and hope to have it resolved shortly. Thank you for your patience. Click here to return to the home page." Mike Michael J. McCarty Physicist, MDEQ Radiological Laboratory Michigan Department of Environmental Quality Waste and Hazardous Materials Division Radiological Protection and Medical Waste Section Environmental Monitoring Unit 815 Terminal Road Lansing, MI 48906 phone: 517-335-8196 fax: 517-335-9551 e-mail: mccartmj at michigan.gov From EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV Wed Dec 7 08:09:12 2005 From: EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV (Baratta, Edmond J) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 09:09:12 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP Message-ID: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA54@orsnewea002.fda.gov> When I went to the site below, I found that the eminent 'Scientist' Alec Baldwin being quoted and realize that this information must be 'accurate'. We analyzed thousands of samples after TMI and did not detect any Strontium-90 or Cesium-137 in any of the milk samples from farms in that region. Therefore I fail to see where the Strontium-90 came from. Possibly from the 'Fallout' of the late 50's and early 60's. Certainly not from TMI. However, if it came from 'Fallout' and or TMI, how can one determine the origin? If Strontium-89 had been present in samples from the latter, it would have come from TMI. Again, where did the 'new' Strontium-90 come from that showed up in the 90's? Edmond J. Baratta Radiation Safety Officer Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 Fax: 781-729-3593 edmond.baratta at fda.gov The above represents my view and not that of my Agency. -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Steven Dapra Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2005 9:43 PM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP Dec. 6 If you want the partisan's view on the Tooth Fairy Project, go to . Mangano et al. have published an article in The Science of the Total Environment, Volume 317, Issus 1-3, 30 December 2003, Pages 37-51; (An unexpected rise in strontium-90 in US deciduous teeth in the 1990s.) RPHP links to the abstract, and if you want the entire article you can pay American Elsevier $30.00. Steven Dapra sjd at swcp.com _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From pottert at erols.com Wed Dec 7 08:43:44 2005 From: pottert at erols.com (Thomas Potter) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 09:43:44 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Moe Handbook (ANL-88-26) In-Reply-To: <4jsh0m$hchmsq@mx01.mrf.mail.rcn.net> Message-ID: <4iore0$5cm5im@smtp02.mrf.mail.rcn.net> Can't provide a PDF of Section 3 as requested in earlier post, but the entire document can be downloaded as one PDF file from following link: http://www.osti.gov/bridge/purl.cover.jsp?purl=/145829-CHcdiA/webviewable/ From bbjorndal at radiationsafety.ca Wed Dec 7 09:05:18 2005 From: bbjorndal at radiationsafety.ca (Brian Bjorndal) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 09:05:18 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Williston Elin TLD Irradiator Message-ID: <001501c5fb3f$a3660210$6401a8c0@Manager> I am looking for a companies in the US who service Williston Elin TLD Irradiators. Brian Bjorndal, MSc, PPhys Manager/Senior Scientist, National Laboratories Radiation Safety Institute of Canada 102 - 110 Research Drive Saskatoon, Saskatchewan Canada S7N 3R3 Tel: (306) 975-0566 Fax: (306) 975-0494 Email: bbjorndal at RadiationSafety.ca Website: www.RadiationSafety.ca From sandyfl at earthlink.net Wed Dec 7 09:20:16 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Wed, 07 Dec 2005 07:20:16 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Doctors warn against nuclear industry Message-ID: <43968D30.29956.53BF29B@localhost> Index: Doctors warn against nuclear industry Chinese PM, on visit to France, eyes nuclear future India becomes partner in multinational nuclear fusion reactor project Russian nuclear company prepares bid for Bulgarian NPP tender Doyle's reversal on nuclear plant sale followed donations Huntsman optimistic his D.C. visit has helped bar material from Utah ============================= Doctors warn against nuclear industry Dec 7 (Sydney Morning Herald) Radioactive waste from nuclear power plants cannot be dealt with in a safe and effective way, a group of eminent doctors has warned. As debate over the government's plans to force a nuclear waste dump on the Northern Territory continued in the Senate on Wednesday, the 18 doctors released a statement warning against the expansion of the nuclear industry. Citing concerns that any expansion of nuclear power would increase the proliferation of nuclear weapons, increase the risk of nuclear terrorism and increase the risk of nuclear accidents, the doctors said the industry should not be encouraged. "Calls for Australians to consider nuclear power for domestic use are unnecessary and counterproductive," they said. "Jumping out of the climate change frying pan into the fire of increased nuclear risk would at best be swapping one set of serious problems for another, while setting back the work of implementing real, sustainable solutions to climate change." Science Minister Brendan Nelson also has proposed a $1 million research study into a nuclear power industry for Australia. The doctors said the issue of radioactive waste was insurmountable. "The problem of nuclear waste is intractable, a burden irresponsibly imposed on countless future generations. "No nation has in place a satisfactory plan to deal with the tens of tonnes of high-level radioactive waste produced by each nuclear power plant each year. "No human institution has survived for the length of time necessary to safeguard this waste." The Senate is debating two bills that will give the federal government power to override a range of laws, including any passed by the NT government, that might frustrate a nuclear waste dump there. The move came after the government last year abandoned plans for a dump in South Australia following community protest. The government will now canvass three sites on commonwealth land in the NT - Mount Everard and Harts Range near Alice Springs and Fishers Ridge, near Katherine. The Australian Greens have suggested a number of amendments to the legislation, including preventing overseas nuclear waste making its way to Australia, reinstating the right of indigenous communities to veto a dump on sacred sites, and removing absolute ministerial power over where the dump will be. The doctors, from a range of backgrounds at various universities across the country, released their statement through the Medical Association for Prevention of War (MAPW) ----------------- Chinese PM, on visit to France, eyes nuclear future CADARACHE, France (AFP) Dec 6 - China's push to develop its nuclear technology to meet skyrocketing energy needs dominated the third day of a visit to France by Chinese Prime Minister Wen Jiabao. He emphasized that goal on a trip to inspect the site of the future International Thermonuclear Experimental Reactor (ITER) to be built over the next decade in Cadarache, southern France. "The energy issue elicits great attention in the whole world, and the ITER site also attracts great attention in the world," he said as he stood on a hilltop clearing upon which will built the cutting-edge fusion reactor facility. China is one of the seven partners financing the ITER project and providing scientific staff and equipment. The others are the European Union, Japan, the United States, Russia, South Korea -- and, as of Tuesday, India. "I'll come back in 10 years," Wen quipped, referring to the scheduled date when the reactor is expected to be operational. The EU is putting up half the 4.6-billion-euro construction (5.4- billion-dollar) cost, with the rest equally divided up among the other partners. Wen added that he was "very happy to see the ITER established in France." The decision to locate the site in France was made in June after lengthy negotiations marked by strong competition to host the reactor from Japan -- China's rival in Asia. ITER aims to create fusion energy -- the same sort of process that occurs at the heart of the Sun, one that is much more powerful than in conventional nuclear power plants -- and find ways to harness it to one day supplant the world's reliance on dwindling fossil fuels. It will be home to 400 scientists, two-thirds of them foreign. The reactor is expected to have a life-span of 40 years. Alain Bugat, the head of France's Commission for Atomic Energy, the body overseeing the Cadarache site, where a much smaller fusion reactor is already located, showed Wen a model of what ITER will look like. China, Bugat told AFP, was "working out what portion of the project it is going to contribute," along with the other partners. He declined to elaborate. Beyond the research possibilities of ITER, Wen on Tuesday also made reference to France's bid to win an eight-billion-dollar (6.8-billion- euro) deal to construct four third-generation nuclear energy reactors in China. "China hopes that France will offer more attractive conditions on technology transfer as well as price so that Franco-Chinese cooperation in this field can develop," he said at an elite French science university in the southern Paris suburbs before travelling to Cadarache. The French company Areva is fighting to win the contract, but is facing stiff competition from Westinghouse of the United States as well as the Russian AtomStroyExport. China was to have announced a winner by the end of 2005 but has put off a decision till early next year in the hope of squeezing better terms from the bidders. Wen, addressing students, professors and business chiefs, insisted that his country's advances in nuclear development and other fields were not a threat, implicitly addressing fears by some analysts that China aims to become a formidable military power. "Having suffered enormously from foreign invasions, China knows the price of peace. This choice is a logical choice, imposed by China's history and culture. China's development is not a threat but an opportunity for the world," he said. The Asian giant, which has become the top target for Western companies keen to benefit from its burgeoning economy, has proved adept at making technology transfer a condition for any major deals. On Monday in Paris, Wen oversaw the signing of a Chinese order to buy 150 Airbus mid-range jets, worth nearly 10 billion dollars at list price. But the windfall for the European plane-maker only came after it committed to exploring the feasibility of setting up an assembly plant in China. Other technology products also grabbed Wen's interest. Before inspecting the ITER site, he spent 30 minutes touring the headquarters of Eurcopter, the helicopter subisidiary of the European Aeronoautic, Defence and Space (EADS) company which also has a controlling share of Airbus. On Monday Eurocopter announced a 600-million-euro partnership deal with China to share development and production of a new 16-seat aircraft dubbed the EC175. After his ITER visit, Wen went to Marseille to meet Chinese business leaders and community representatives living in France. On Wednesday, the last day of his four-day French visit, he was to tour the satellite facility of the telecommunications giant Alcatel at Cannes before leaving for Slovakia, the Czech Republic and Portugal. ------------------- India becomes partner in multinational nuclear fusion reactor project Dec 7 (India Daily ) India will become a partner in a multinational project to build an experimental nuclear-fusion reactor, the Indian government said Wednesday. The decision by the United States, the European Union, Japan, China, Russia and South Korea to accept India "as a full partner is an acknowledgment of India as a responsible nuclear state with advanced nuclear technology including in the field of fusion research," the Indian foreign ministry said in a statement. "It also recognizes that India can significantly contribute to such endeavors." The decision to let India take part in the International Thermonuclear Experimental Reactor being built in France was made Tuesday at a meeting in Jeju, South Korea, of the project's partners, the U.S. Embassy in New Delhi said in a statement. Scientists hope the plant will produce clean, safe and endless energy and help phase out polluting fossil fuels, like oil and coal. India carried out multiple nuclear tests in May 1998, provoking sanctions from the United States and other Western countries. But it later imposed a ban on further tests and most of the sanctions have been lifted. India also does not have a record of exporting nuclear technologies. New Delhi's desire to participate in the thermonuclear reactor project got a boost earlier this year when U.S. President George W. Bush proposed sharing civilian nuclear technology with New Delhi. "U.S. support was instrumental in ensuring the final agreement (in Jeju)," the U.S. Embassy in New Delhi said late Tuesday. The decision "represents the first tangible and concrete step toward greater cooperation between the U.S. and India in the nuclear field." Several European nations have also been keen on India's participation in the A10 billion (US$12 billion) project. ------------------- Russian nuclear company prepares bid for Bulgarian NPP tender MOSCOW, December 7 (RIA Novosti) - Atomstroiexport, Russia's nuclear power equipment and service export monopoly, has prepared the technical aspect of its bid for the tender to build a nuclear power plant (NPP) in Bulgaria, the company said Wednesday. The documentation, which will be submitted to the Bulgarian National Electric Company December 15, was compiled with the help of Framatome ANP and major Russian engineering and supply companies, including the Atomenergoproyekt institute, the Kurchatov institute, the Gidropress experimental design bureau, Silovye Mashiny, and the Izhora plants. The documentation will have been translated into Bulgarian by December 12. The construction site for the NPP is situated in Belene, 250 kilometers (over 150 miles) from Sofia, the capital of Bulgaria. The project was being developed in coordination with Soviet experts until Bulgarian authorities stopped the work in 1992. ------------------- Doyle's reversal on nuclear plant sale followed donations MILWAUKEE Dec 7 (AP) A campaign finance watchdog group is questioning whether donations from utility executives to Gov. Jim Doyle's re-election campaign helped reverse the state's rejection of the sale of a nuclear power plant to an out-of-state bidder. The Wisconsin Democracy Campaign says Doyle's campaign accepted $41,550 from executives of Wisconsin Public Service Corp. and Alliant Energy Corp. in the six months after the state Public Service Commission, on Nov. 19, 2004, rejected their sale of the Kewaunee nuclear plant to Dominion Resources Inc. of Richmond, Va. The three-member commission, which included two Doyle appointees, reversed its decision on March 17 and allowed the sale to go through. "A state commission controlled by the governor made one decision, and then they did an about-face and reversed that decision," said Mike McCabe, the Wisconsin Democracy Campaign's executive director. "That change of heart corresponded with some very large campaign donations flowing into the Doyle campaign. That alone raises major new questions." McCabe said former commission Chairwoman Burnie Bridge and Commissioner Mark Meyer were Doyle appointees who could have been influenced by the governor to change their minds. "If Jim Doyle wanted this plant sale, he had a friend on the PSC that he could obviously talk to," he said. The governor's spokeswoman, Melanie Fonder, called the allegation "ridiculous." "The Public Service Commission is an independent regulatory agency and it has no connection to this report," she said. Commission members are appointed by the governor and then confirmed by the state Senate. Meyer said in a statement the accusation was "baseless and absurd." A message left with an assistant to Bridge by the Associated Press was not immediately returned. The commission rejected the first sale request 2-1 with Bridge and Meyer voting against the deal, saying the terms "exempted it (the plant) from state regulation." The commission reversed its decision March 17, approving the sale unanimously after Dominion promised to give the panel a say in a future sale of the plant, agreed to return unused fees to dismantle it at the end of its life and to increase its payments to WPS and Alliant if it failed to supply them power. A group of utility watchdogs challenged the sale approval in Dane County Circuit Court on May 20, but Judge William Foust dismissed the case Monday, court records showed. The utilities denied accusations of decision-buying. "We're not going to dignify this with a comment," said spokesman Richard Zuercher of Dominion, which bought the plant for $191.5 million in July. Wisconsin Public Service spokesman Tom Meinz said company employees and executives donated to Doyle because he is "pro-business." "We want to support people that are pro-business, doesn't make any difference what side of the aisle they're on," Meinz said. ----------------- Huntsman optimistic his D.C. visit has helped bar material from Utah WASHINGTON Dec 7 (Deseret Morning News) Gov. Jon Huntsman Jr. left the nation's capital Tuesday "hopeful and optimistic" that the legislative attempt to block nuclear waste from coming to Utah will move forward, his general counsel Mike Lee said. Huntsman spent two days in Washington, D.C., meeting with senators and House members working on the National Defense Authorization Bill and the state's own congressional delegation. The bill contains a provision by Rep. Bob Bishop, R-Utah, that would create 100,000 acres of wilderness area that would block a potential railroad route to the proposed Private Fuel Storage nuclear waste site on the Goshute Indian Reservation. Lee said the matter is still in play right now, but he would likely know more by the end of the week. He did not want to speculate on the overall status of the language after Huntsman's visit but said the governor is an effective lobbyist for the state. "It's uncertain who the real enemies of the proposal are," Lee said. "Over the next 48 hours it will become clearer of what will happen. The lobbying effort has not stopped." Lee said the Air Force told lawmakers Tuesday that it supported the provision. If passed, the wilderness area designation would protect Cedar Mountains, near the Utah Test and Training Range, the Defense Department's largest training range used by pilots at Hill Air Force Base. Former Utah Rep. Jim Hansen, a Republican, tried to get the language passed before he left office but failed to do so. Lee said this time is different because of the Air Force's support, along with a flip in position by Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., and environmental groups, who opposed the idea in the past. Private Fuel Storage spokeswoman Sue Martin said the final language of the wilderness area designation would need to be examined before its exact impact would be known. Martin said the site's license application, which the Nuclear Regulatory Commission has approved, allowed for a rail route to be built as well as using heavy-haul trucks to bring waste in from the road versus building a rail line. If approved, the designated wilderness area would block a rail line from being built but may not have much effect on a truck shipping plan because the road already exist. "That's my impression," Martin said. "We'd have to look at it more closely." ------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 E-Mail: sperle at dosimetry.com E-Mail: sandyfl at earthlink.net Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From sam_iverstine at yahoo.com Wed Dec 7 10:05:29 2005 From: sam_iverstine at yahoo.com (Sam Iverstine) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 08:05:29 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Looking for used 137Cs meter Calibration source < $4K Message-ID: <20051207160529.69883.qmail@web50112.mail.yahoo.com> I have a licensed client in FL that would like to purchase a 137Cs source between 85-120 mCi for calibration of G-M survey meters for < $4K. Please email me if you have one for sale of know of someone who may. Thank you, Sam Iverstine, M.S., C.H.P. Miami, FL --------------------------------- Yahoo! Shopping Find Great Deals on Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping From farbersa at optonline.net Wed Dec 7 10:36:20 2005 From: farbersa at optonline.net (farbersa at optonline.net) Date: Wed, 07 Dec 2005 11:36:20 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP In-Reply-To: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA54@orsnewea002.fda.gov> References: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA54@orsnewea002.fda.gov> Message-ID: Hi all, On the point made by Ed Baratta. In 1977, I presented a paper to the New England Chapter of the HPS on the total environmental inventories of Cs-137, Sr-90, and Pu-239 from prior nuclear weapon's test fallout. A very important point I showed was that the annual decay of the pre-existing inventory of each of these isotopes was larger than the releases to the environment were there to be 1,000 nuclear reactors in operation in the year 2000. For any given location, given the areal deposition from prior fallout, the same would be true. The existing concentration of Sr-90 per unit area near any nuclear plant could NOT even be MAINTAINED given the annual decline due to radiological decay of the existing environmental inventory, and the actual current or maximally allowed releases of Sr-90 from any given plant. The same held for Cs-137 and Pu-239. The recent "claims" of Mangano, Sternglass, et. al. are nothing but manipulated statistics that would and should be laughable if they did not get the unwarranted attention by media and concerned, but gullible members of the public which have no ability to critique the claims. One would hope that some real data as is the case with the analyses from the FDA lab would have some impact. Regretably, this is not the case since actual, supportable radiological data and the implications of it is not reaching the public, media, or legislators in an understandable and impactful manner. Stewart Farber, MS Public Health The Prometheus Group, LLC 203 367-0791 "No matter how cynical I get, it's hard to keep up." --Lili Tomlin ================ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Baratta, Edmond J" Date: Wednesday, December 7, 2005 9:09 am Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP > When I went to the site below, I found that the eminent > 'Scientist' Alec > Baldwin being quoted and realize that this information must be > 'accurate'.We analyzed thousands of samples after TMI and did not > detect any > Strontium-90 or Cesium-137 in any of the milk samples from farms > in that > region. Therefore I fail to see where the Strontium-90 came from. > > Possibly from the 'Fallout' of the late 50's and early 60's. > Certainly not > from TMI. However, if it came from 'Fallout' and or TMI, how can one > determine the origin? If Strontium-89 had been present in samples > from the > latter, it would have come from TMI. Again, where did the 'new' > Strontium-90 come from that showed up in the 90's? > > Edmond J. Baratta > Radiation Safety Officer > Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 > Fax: 781-729-3593 > edmond.baratta at fda.gov > > From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Wed Dec 7 11:32:08 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 17:32:08 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC website? I get the same error message In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051207173208.42298.qmail@web26409.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear Mike, I have been getting this error message for the past several weeks.I hoped that some radsafe member from the NRC may clarify. I tried to access NRC through different servers.I did not succeed. Regards Michael McCarty wrote: For what it's worth, I never (well hardly ever) have a problem entering the NRC website to check current power levels on 'our' reactors. Today I got a message: "Server Not Responding Our web site is experiencing technical difficulties. We are aware of the problem and hope to have it resolved shortly. Thank you for your patience. Click here to return to the home page." Mike Michael J. McCarty Physicist, MDEQ Radiological Laboratory Michigan Department of Environmental Quality Waste and Hazardous Materials Division Radiological Protection and Medical Waste Section Environmental Monitoring Unit 815 Terminal Road Lansing, MI 48906 phone: 517-335-8196 fax: 517-335-9551 e-mail: mccartmj at michigan.gov _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos. Get Yahoo! Photos From sam_iverstine at yahoo.com Wed Dec 7 11:56:15 2005 From: sam_iverstine at yahoo.com (Sam Iverstine) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 09:56:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Looking for a used 137Cs source for survey meter calibration Message-ID: <20051207175615.93490.qmail@web50109.mail.yahoo.com> I have a licensed client in FL who is seeking an 85mCi - 120 mCi 137Cs source to calibrate survey meters. Please email me if you or someone you know has one they may want to sell. Thank you for any response. Sam Iverstine, MS, CHP Miami, FL --------------------------------- Yahoo! Shopping Find Great Deals on Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping From joel.baumbaugh at navy.mil Wed Dec 7 12:56:05 2005 From: joel.baumbaugh at navy.mil (Baumbaugh, Joel SPAWAR) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 10:56:05 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Free sources - you pay shipping... Message-ID: <7DB6DF83D2CD9140ADA0622B1A05BF2F016678BA@nawespscez02.nadsuswe.nads.navy.mil> RADSAFERS, I have a researcher who has two sources which are utilized at another facility (and not under any of my licenses). He no longer has any use for these sources and has given me the following information to post on RADSAFE. PLEASE DO NOT CONTACT ME ABOUT THESE SOURCES... There are two (Co-60) sources which are GFE at Maxwell Labs. These (2 sources) were delivered in 1990 totaling 5820 Ci. By his calculations they are down to about 700 Ci (364 Ci and 342 Ci) These sources were made by Neutron Products and he has some drawings that could be scanned and attached to someone if they'd like. The sources capsule is 3.9 inches from bottom to top of threaded tip. Diameter is 0.382 inches. The sources were custom made so he doesn't think they have a model number associated with them. These are FREE to a good (appropriately licensed) home. You pay the shipping. Please contact Dr. Russ Clement via email at russ.clement at navy.mil if you are interested. Joel Baumbaugh (joel.baumbaugh at navy.mil) SSC-SD From jimm at WPI.EDU Wed Dec 7 14:32:52 2005 From: jimm at WPI.EDU (Muckerheide, James) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 15:32:52 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Building the PBMR Message-ID: <71A6142F930A1E4C9300D4088D9765C854D1F4@EXCHDB.admin.wpi.edu> Friends, The following report from Japan indicates South African progress and (hopeful?) schedule on the PBMR! Regards, Jim Muckerheide =================== Kyodo: M'bishi Heavy Wins Order for Key Structure of S. Africa's Nuke Plant JPP20051206969070 Tokyo Kyodo World Service in English 1407 GMT 06 Dec 05 Computer selected and disseminated without FBIS editorial intervention] Tokyo, Dec. 6 Kyodo -- Mitsubishi Heavy Industries Ltd. said Tuesday it has received two orders for the core structure of a demonstration reactor of an advanced nuclear power plant to be built in South Africa. The contracts are worth approximately $15 million or 1.8 billion yen in total. One is for the basic design of a key structure called a core barrel assembly (CBA), part of the pebble bed modular reactor (PBMR), and the other is for provision of forgings and procurement of items for the CBA. Mitsubishi Heavy will start constructing the core structure for the PBMR with 165,000 kilowatt output in 2007 and will deliver the structure in 2011 to South Africa's national power utility, which plans to introduce the reactor into the country's grid system in 2013, the company said. The South African government intends to increase the number of PBMRs in commercial use to 24 by 2020, according to the company. According to Mitsubishi Heavy, the PBMR is a safe and cost-efficient reactor that uses silicon carbide-coated uranium particles encased in graphite for fuel, making it free from risk of reactor core meltdown. Helium gas is used as the coolant and energy transfer medium to a closed-cycle gas turbine and generator. From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Wed Dec 7 16:52:46 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 14:52:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: NRC website? In-Reply-To: <4396302B.9010105@ev1.net> Message-ID: <20051207225246.8838.qmail@web54310.mail.yahoo.com> I always thought that Ft. Worth was like a foreign country. Maybe I am correct. --- Maury Siskel wrote: > http://www.nrc.gov/ > After many repeated trials last couple days, site > works fine from Ft. > Worth Tx. on Netscape 7.2 via EV1. > Cheers, > Maury&Dog (maurysis at ev1.net > =================== > Dimiter Popoff wrote: > > > Well this sounds like some new epidemic on the > systems many > > people use in the US. Perhaps something in the way > they do > > nameserver requests or whatever. Does not seem to > be > > destination dependent content, though. Just some > software glitch, most > > likely OS related. > > Dimiter > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments > > http://www.tgi-sci.com > > -------------- snipped ----------------- > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing > list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have > read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be > found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe > and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL ? Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com From maurysis at ev1.net Wed Dec 7 21:11:18 2005 From: maurysis at ev1.net (Maury Siskel) Date: Wed, 07 Dec 2005 21:11:18 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: NRC website? In-Reply-To: <20051207225246.8838.qmail@web54310.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20051207225246.8838.qmail@web54310.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4397A456.1090805@ev1.net> Hi John, You might be closer to the mark than one might suppose. We were a foreign country once -- a genuine independent nation! We also ratain a few unique reservations which were stipulated as conditions for our agreement to join the Union. And I enjoy and appreciate your poke in the ribs. Come visit to enjoy Six Flags Over Texas and our history. Cheers, Maury&Dog ====================== John Jacobus wrote: > <>I always thought that Ft. Worth was like a foreign country. Maybe I > am correct. > > --- Maury Siskel wrote: http://www.nrc.gov/ > <>After many repeated trials last couple days, site > works fine from Ft. Worth Tx. on Netscape 7.2 via EV1. > Cheers, > Maury&Dog (maurysis at ev1.net) > =================== > Dimiter Popoff wrote: > >>> <>Well this sounds like some new epidemic on the systems many people >>> use in the US. Perhaps something in the way they do nameserver >>> requests or whatever. Does not seem to be destination dependent >>> content, though. Just some software glitch, mostlikely OS related. >> >>>Dimiter >>> >------------------------------------- > > >>>Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments >>>http://www.tgi-sci.com >>>-------------- snipped ---------- >>> >>> > > From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Thu Dec 8 09:59:56 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2005 07:59:56 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Editorial: No convincing evidence to increase Pu at LLNL Message-ID: <20051208155956.20381.qmail@web54304.mail.yahoo.com> >From Nature 438, 712 (8 December 2005) Enough, already Abstract:No convincing case has been made for increasing the amount of plutonium held at a Californian lab. The US Department of Energy is planning to double the amount of plutonium that can be stored at the Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory in California. Under new rules announced last week, the nuclear-weapons lab can keep up to 1,400 kilograms, or enough for around 300 bombs. Not surprisingly, antinuclear activists are up in arms about having so much bomb-grade metal in such a heavily populated area. But researchers who want the US nuclear-weapons laboratories to set a good example for the rest of the world should be equally dismayed at the plan. Since 1992, the United States has maintained a moratorium on the testing and development of new nuclear weapons. There's no real need for this research lab, which accommodates an outstanding civilian research programme next to its weapons-related activity, to be playing with this quantity of plutonium. Livermore is expected to use some of the expanded inventory in nuclear-weapons research, including experiments at the National Ignition Facility (NIF), a massive laser facility that will recreate some of the conditions inside nuclear weapons at detonation. The facility's original function was to perform such experiments on hydrogen isotopes, rather than plutonium. Officials at the Department of Energy never formally excluded the option of using plutonium in the NIF, but a 1995 report prepared by scientists in the department's non-proliferation office warned that its use at the facility could be seen as provocative by other nations. The other main reason why Livermore wants to hold more plutonium, according to energy-department documents, is that it will start to lay the groundwork for the renewed mass production of plutonium pits, used in US nuclear weapons. Livermore will be charged with developing new technologies for manufacturing the pits, for use at a proposed industrial-sized production facility. But questions remain over whether this facility is either necessary or appropriate, and this year Congress declined to appropriate the money needed to begin planning for its construction. Most of Livermore's new plutonium stocks would be shipped there from the Los Alamos National Laboratory in New Mexico, where the Department of Energy's track record in handling plutonium does not inspire much confidence. According to a report released on 29 November by the Institute for Energy and Environmental Research, a watchdog group based near Washington DC, Los Alamos has managed to lose between 300 kg and 600 kg of the material over the years. The group suggests that much of it was dumped indiscriminately in the desert during the early days of the nuclear age, or was mislabelled when shipped off elsewhere for long-term storage. And Livermore has had its own problems with plutonium. In January, its plutonium facility, where scientists work with the metal under heavily controlled conditions, was shut down amid safety concerns. Problems cited at the time included cracks in the building's ventilation systems and poorly constructed 'hot boxes' for handling the metal. The facility was allowed to reopen at a reduced capacity last month. The laboratory is wasting its time researching pit production for a facility that may never actually be built. In light of all this, Livermore's plan to double its inventory of plutonium is ill-advised. A case for plutonium experiments at the NIF has not been made, even to review groups that have the security clearance needed to assess it. And the laboratory is wasting its time researching pit production for a facility that may never actually be built. For a mixed-use scientific facility in a residential area, 700 kg of plutonium is enough, already +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From didi at tgi-sci.com Thu Dec 8 11:02:30 2005 From: didi at tgi-sci.com (=?ISO-8859-5?Q?Dimiter=20Popoff?=) Date: Thu, 08 Dec 2005 19:02:30 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Re: Editorial: No convincing evidence to increase Pu at LLNL Message-ID: <20051208170230.1079.qmail@server318.com> Frankly I do not see the difference it would make to the public if they store 700 rather than 1400 kg - or am I missing something? Yet another easy to use attention grabber, I suppose. Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ > -------Original Message------- > From: John Jacobus > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Editorial: No convincing evidence to increase Pu at LLNL > Sent: Dec 08 '05 17:59 > > >From Nature 438, 712 (8 December 2005) > > Enough, already > > Abstract:No convincing case has been made for > increasing the amount of plutonium held at a > Californian lab. > > The US Department of Energy is planning to double the > amount of plutonium that can be stored at the Lawrence > Livermore National Laboratory in California. Under new > rules announced last week, the nuclear-weapons lab can > keep up to 1,400 kilograms, or enough for around 300 > bombs. > > Not surprisingly, antinuclear activists are up in arms > about having so much bomb-grade metal in such a > heavily populated area. But researchers who want the > US nuclear-weapons laboratories to set a good example > for the rest of the world should be equally dismayed > at the plan. > > Since 1992, the United States has maintained a > moratorium on the testing and development of new > nuclear weapons. There's no real need for this > research lab, which accommodates an outstanding > civilian research programme next to its > weapons-related activity, to be playing with this > quantity of plutonium. > > Livermore is expected to use some of the expanded > inventory in nuclear-weapons research, including > experiments at the National Ignition Facility (NIF), a > massive laser facility that will recreate some of the > conditions inside nuclear weapons at detonation. The > facility's original function was to perform such > experiments on hydrogen isotopes, rather than > plutonium. Officials at the Department of Energy never > formally excluded the option of using plutonium in the > NIF, but a 1995 report prepared by scientists in the > department's non-proliferation office warned that its > use at the facility could be seen as provocative by > other nations. > > The other main reason why Livermore wants to hold more > plutonium, according to energy-department documents, > is that it will start to lay the groundwork for the > renewed mass production of plutonium pits, used in US > nuclear weapons. Livermore will be charged with > developing new technologies for manufacturing the > pits, for use at a proposed industrial-sized > production facility. But questions remain over whether > this facility is either necessary or appropriate, and > this year Congress declined to appropriate the money > needed to begin planning for its construction. > > Most of Livermore's new plutonium stocks would be > shipped there from the Los Alamos National Laboratory > in New Mexico, where the Department of Energy's track > record in handling plutonium does not inspire much > confidence. According to a report released on 29 > November by the Institute for Energy and Environmental > Research, a watchdog group based near Washington DC, > Los Alamos has managed to lose between 300 kg and 600 > kg of the material over the years. The group suggests > that much of it was dumped indiscriminately in the > desert during the early days of the nuclear age, or > was mislabelled when shipped off elsewhere for > long-term storage. > > And Livermore has had its own problems with plutonium. > In January, its plutonium facility, where scientists > work with the metal under heavily controlled > conditions, was shut down amid safety concerns. > Problems cited at the time included cracks in the > building's ventilation systems and poorly constructed > 'hot boxes' for handling the metal. The facility was > allowed to reopen at a reduced capacity last month. > > The laboratory is wasting its time researching pit > production for a facility that may never actually be > built. > In light of all this, Livermore's plan to double its > inventory of plutonium is ill-advised. A case for > plutonium experiments at the NIF has not been made, > even to review groups that have the security clearance > needed to assess it. And the laboratory is wasting its > time researching pit production for a facility that > may never actually be built. For a mixed-use > scientific facility in a residential area, 700 kg of > plutonium is enough, already > > +++++++++++++++++++ > "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." > "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer > > -- John > John Jacobus, MS > Certified Health Physicist > e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From don.mercado at lmco.com Thu Dec 8 11:40:03 2005 From: don.mercado at lmco.com (Mercado, Don) Date: Thu, 08 Dec 2005 09:40:03 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] High court backs 'sloshed' trucker Message-ID: <3D92CA467E530B4E8295214868F840FE81F637@emss01m12.us.lmco.com> Cindy Bloom wrote: "All that safety stuff" is to help us avoid situations where it is "all that hazardous." The problem comes when it *can't* be "all that hazardous." Safety stuff is supplied to comfort the employees and can't provide additional protection. The RF *can't* be hazardous, but the employees complain to the union and upper management if they don't get all these layers of safety for something that they -perceive- may harm them. I've explained until I'm blue in the face, brought in outside consultants, etc. that the stuff isn't harmful, but they still think its going to kill them. It was relatively easy to provide the safety stuff, temporarily assuage their fears, so it was done. I've resisted the additional layers of safety as unnecessary, expensive, and increases the chance of a human-in-the-loop failure of the system. That has happened and it decreases credibility of the system, which requires more fixes, more complexity and more chances of failure, and on and on. It is difficult to be a safety guy and say, "No, don't give it to them." I try, but it doesn't always work. Providing safety equipment when it isn't necessary is alarmist and overemphasizes the relative risk of the hazard. Its like putting up lead walls for a lab that only handles uCi quantities of Fe-55. Kind of like being an anti-nuke! "But it is also important to counsel those workers, who are extremely uncomfortable with the idea of a given risk, to consider looking/training for a type of employment that does not include the risk of concern. It's important to remind people that worrying about risk can be a health risk in itself, too." Who wants to represent management and tell a union worker that they can't have safety equipment, their phobias may be the source of their ills, and if that makes them uncomfortable to go find another job? ;^) Don From jjcohen at prodigy.net Thu Dec 8 12:17:43 2005 From: jjcohen at prodigy.net (jjcohen at prodigy.net) Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2005 10:17:43 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Re: Editorial: No convincing evidence to increase Pu atLLNL References: <20051208170230.1079.qmail@server318.com> Message-ID: <001301c5fc23$af6c6a60$25dce245@domainnotset.invalid> Dimiter, To a technologically ignorant public, any amount of plutonium is deadly. Twice as much is twice as dangerous. Unfortunately, LLNL officials cannot effectively defend their plutonium operations without the possibility of breaching security. Anyway, they probably do not want to, because the increased level of public concern allows them to obtain increased budgets ostensibly to control this "serious hazard". Jerry Cohen. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dimiter Popoff" To: Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 9:02 AM Subject: [ RadSafe ] Re: Editorial: No convincing evidence to increase Pu atLLNL > Frankly I do not see the difference it would make to the public > if they store 700 rather than 1400 kg - or am I missing something? > Yet another easy to use attention grabber, I suppose. > > Dimiter > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments > > http://www.tgi-sci.com > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > -------Original Message------- > > From: John Jacobus > > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Editorial: No convincing evidence to increase Pu at LLNL > > Sent: Dec 08 '05 17:59 > > > > >From Nature 438, 712 (8 December 2005) > > > > Enough, already > > > > Abstract:No convincing case has been made for > > increasing the amount of plutonium held at a > > Californian lab. > > > > The US Department of Energy is planning to double the > > amount of plutonium that can be stored at the Lawrence > > Livermore National Laboratory in California. Under new > > rules announced last week, the nuclear-weapons lab can > > keep up to 1,400 kilograms, or enough for around 300 > > bombs. > > > > Not surprisingly, antinuclear activists are up in arms > > about having so much bomb-grade metal in such a > > heavily populated area. But researchers who want the > > US nuclear-weapons laboratories to set a good example > > for the rest of the world should be equally dismayed > > at the plan. > > > > Since 1992, the United States has maintained a > > moratorium on the testing and development of new > > nuclear weapons. There's no real need for this > > research lab, which accommodates an outstanding > > civilian research programme next to its > > weapons-related activity, to be playing with this > > quantity of plutonium. > > > > Livermore is expected to use some of the expanded > > inventory in nuclear-weapons research, including > > experiments at the National Ignition Facility (NIF), a > > massive laser facility that will recreate some of the > > conditions inside nuclear weapons at detonation. The > > facility's original function was to perform such > > experiments on hydrogen isotopes, rather than > > plutonium. Officials at the Department of Energy never > > formally excluded the option of using plutonium in the > > NIF, but a 1995 report prepared by scientists in the > > department's non-proliferation office warned that its > > use at the facility could be seen as provocative by > > other nations. > > > > The other main reason why Livermore wants to hold more > > plutonium, according to energy-department documents, > > is that it will start to lay the groundwork for the > > renewed mass production of plutonium pits, used in US > > nuclear weapons. Livermore will be charged with > > developing new technologies for manufacturing the > > pits, for use at a proposed industrial-sized > > production facility. But questions remain over whether > > this facility is either necessary or appropriate, and > > this year Congress declined to appropriate the money > > needed to begin planning for its construction. > > > > Most of Livermore's new plutonium stocks would be > > shipped there from the Los Alamos National Laboratory > > in New Mexico, where the Department of Energy's track > > record in handling plutonium does not inspire much > > confidence. According to a report released on 29 > > November by the Institute for Energy and Environmental > > Research, a watchdog group based near Washington DC, > > Los Alamos has managed to lose between 300 kg and 600 > > kg of the material over the years. The group suggests > > that much of it was dumped indiscriminately in the > > desert during the early days of the nuclear age, or > > was mislabelled when shipped off elsewhere for > > long-term storage. > > > > And Livermore has had its own problems with plutonium. > > In January, its plutonium facility, where scientists > > work with the metal under heavily controlled > > conditions, was shut down amid safety concerns. > > Problems cited at the time included cracks in the > > building's ventilation systems and poorly constructed > > 'hot boxes' for handling the metal. The facility was > > allowed to reopen at a reduced capacity last month. > > > > The laboratory is wasting its time researching pit > > production for a facility that may never actually be > > built. > > In light of all this, Livermore's plan to double its > > inventory of plutonium is ill-advised. A case for > > plutonium experiments at the NIF has not been made, > > even to review groups that have the security clearance > > needed to assess it. And the laboratory is wasting its > > time researching pit production for a facility that > > may never actually be built. For a mixed-use > > scientific facility in a residential area, 700 kg of > > plutonium is enough, already > > > > +++++++++++++++++++ > > "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." > > "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer > > > > -- John > > John Jacobus, MS > > Certified Health Physicist > > e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > _______________________________________________ > > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From jimm at WPI.EDU Thu Dec 8 12:56:12 2005 From: jimm at WPI.EDU (Muckerheide, James) Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2005 13:56:12 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Nuclear "debate" at the Montreal Climate Conference Message-ID: <71A6142F930A1E4C9300D4088D9765C854D366@EXCHDB.admin.wpi.edu> Friends, This makes a strong report on the "debate" as articulated by Patrick Moore and his former associates, in a significant venue, along with the "related article." Regards, Jim Muckerheide =================== http://www.cnsnews.com/news/viewstory.asp?Page=%5CCulture%5Carchive%5C200512% 5CCUL20051208b.html Nuclear Energy Debate Turns Radioactive at Climate Conference By Marc Morano CNSNews.com Senior Staff Writer December 08, 2005 Montreal (CNSNews.com) - Nuclear energy would reduce the world's dependence on fossil fuels and help cut greenhouse gas emissions, said advocates at the United Nations Climate Change Conference in Montreal. "Expanding nuclear energy is one way that we can actually [reduce] reliance on fossil fuels in a big way," said Patrick Moore, a founding member of Greenpeace. Moore left the group in the 1980s after becoming disillusioned with what he considered the group's radical approach to environmental concerns. He currently heads the Canadian-based environmental advocacy group Greenspirit Strategies, and he blames liberal green groups for halting the expansion of nuclear energy. "It is the environmental movement itself that is the primary impediment to the reduction of CO2 emission and fossil fuel consumption because they refuse to support the obvious alternatives" (nuclear power and hydro power), Moore told Cybercast News Service. Moore's pro-nuclear discussion at the U.N. conference on Monday evening drew skepticism and jeers from his former environmental colleagues. Moore, who rejects alarmist predictions of human-caused "global warming," also praised the United States for refusing to ratify the Kyoto Protocol, calling the treaty "a colossal waste of time and money." (See related article ) But it was Moore's promotion of nuclear energy that met swift resistance by the movement he helped to found. "History has shown [nuclear energy] is a problematic technology," said Kaisa Kosonen, an energy campaigner for Greenpeace Nordic, told Cybercast News Service. Kosonen wants to see existing nuclear power phased out. She warned that creating more nuclear material creates attractive targets for terrorists. "I would not take that risk," she said. Friends of the Earth International (FOEI) shared Greenpeace's anti-nuclear position. "We don't support it. [Nuclear] represents a massive challenge, not only economically, but radioactive waste still represents a massive problem and quite frankly it's not particularly popular with the public," said Catherine Pearce, an international climate campaigner for FOEI. Both Greenpeace and FOEI want to encourage the world to turn to renewable energy sources such as solar and wind power. Fossil fuels currently make up about 85 percent of the world's energy consumption, followed by nuclear and hydro power at seven percent each. Only one percent of energy consumption comes from sources such as solar, wind and geothermal, according to Moore. "We don't see any scenario where windmills and solar panels alone can solve the problem [of fossil fuel dependence,]" Moore said. Moore praised nuclear energy for its reactor safety record and waste storage methods. He also dismissed concerns about two high-profile nuclear reactor accidents in the past. "[Pennsylvania's] Three Mile Island was a success story," he said. "Radiation did not escape from Three Mile Island [in 1979]," Moore said, because a containment structure prevented radioactive leakage. "[The Soviet Union's] Chernobyl [accident] was a sad accident waiting to happen because of the Soviet design and bad management," Moore said of the 1986 incident that killed 56 people. Moore also dismissed fears of a nuclear plant being the target of terrorism. "Sure there is a possibility of nuclear terrorism, but all technology can be used for harm," he said. "You don't ban technologies that are being used for good purposes just because they can also be used for evil," he added. Anti-nuclear movies such as the Jane Fonda's "The China Syndrome" in 1979 further raised public fears about nuclear energy, Moore said. "We have a population that is more afraid of nuclear when its record is far safer than many other technologies that we have," he said. "There is no basis for this fear. Nuclear is safe." More than 8,000 government leaders, environmentalists and scientists are attending the U.N. conference to discuss ways of further limiting greenhouse gases beyond the provision set out in the Kyoto Protocol. Organizers are calling the conference, which runs until Dec. 9, the largest meeting since the Kyoto Climate Change Conference in 1997. See Related Articles: Former Greenpeace Co-Founder Praises US for Rejecting Kyoto (Dec. 8, 2005) From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Thu Dec 8 14:36:47 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2005 12:36:47 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Article: Neutron science: Back on track? Message-ID: <20051208203647.649.qmail@web54307.mail.yahoo.com> >From Nature 438, 730-731 (8 December 2005) Neutron science: Back on track? Karen Fox (Karen Fox is a science writer based in Washington DC.) Top of pageAbstractNext June, a $1.4-billion neutron-scattering facility will come online in the United States. Karen Fox finds out whether this machine really can breathe fresh life into the ageing Tennessee lab that is its home. Oak Ridge National Laboratory is more than 60 years old and, until recently, it looked that way. Despite its track record in nuclear research, the host of wildlife that wanders on campus, and the pretty sunsets over the rolling hills of eastern Tennessee, it looked unlikely to entice the energetic people who are the lifeblood of any great laboratory. Salvation may be at hand. The Spallation Neutron Source (SNS), the largest scientific facility to be built in the United States for a decade, will become operational at Oak Ridge by next June. The $1.4-billion machine will generate neutron beams by firing high-energy protons at liquid mercury. Hundreds of visiting researchers are expected to descend on the laboratory and use these beams to probe the structures of molecules and crystals. "What this brings to the table is the opportunity to do an entirely new class of experiment," says Jack Rush, who retired earlier this year as director of neutron scattering at the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST) in Gaithersburg, Maryland. Researchers around the world will be keen to assess the popularity and capabilities of the new facility. Once there would have been no question about the usefulness of such a resource. But in the two decades since the US Department of Energy (DOE) first planned a neutron facility at Oak Ridge, the options available for mapping molecular and crystalline structures have widened. Facilities that use X-rays to probe these structures, such as the Advanced Photon Source at Argonne National Laboratory in Illinois, have become vastly more powerful. Meanwhile, the number of researchers who work with neutrons has declined as several ageing neutron-source facilities have closed. Despite this, Japan is building a research facility similar to the SNS at Tokai, which will be ready in 2007. European plans for an even more advanced spallation source hit political setbacks a couple of years ago; their proponents are keen to revive them as a way of preserving the continent's long-standing lead in neutron science. Building excitement At Oak Ridge, the new neutron source is generating a palpable buzz. The facility managers are aware that many potential users of the technique have learned to live without it. So to bring them to a site far from the universities where they work will require exceptional management and technical support. "You can have a philosophy of 'if you build it, they will come'," says Paul Butler, team leader for NIST's small-angle neutron-scattering instrument. "But in my experience that doesn't work. You have to do more." Butler is on the SNS users group committee, formed when construction began in 1999, to make sure the neutron source goes that extra mile to meet scientists' needs. Oak Ridge managers know they face a challenge. They anticipate that just a few hundred researchers will use the facility during its first two years of operation, while its neutron output slowly ramps up to its full potential. But they expect this to build up to 2,000 users a year by 2015, as researchers currently accustomed to using advanced X-ray sources begin to be converted to the subtler and sometimes complementary charms of neutrons. Supporters of the neutron source say that it does things that other mapping tools can't do. X-rays bounce off electrons, and so scatter much more spectacularly from heavier elements that have many electrons than from lighter ones, such as hydrogen, which has only one. It has been estimated that, as a result, the placement of about half of the hydrogen atoms in published protein structures derived from X-ray studies are not known. Neutrons interact directly with nuclei, making lighter atoms easy to identify. Structured approach Dean Myles, head of structural biology at Oak Ridge, points out that another advantage of dealing with nuclei, rather than electrons, is the ability to distinguish between different isotopes of the same element. This means that researchers can, for example, use deuterium ? a heavy isotope of hydrogen ? as a marker for the position of a particular atom in a molecule or structure. "I liken it to a black cat in a snow field," says Myles. Because neutron sources can map structures over time, a molecule labelled with deuterium could, for instance, be watched as it wanders across the surface of a sample that mimics a cell membrane. Oak Ridge is keen to teach its users the chemical tricks necessary for such work, and the lab is also growing bacteria in deuterium-rich media so that they produce deuterated proteins. Neutrons can also probe magnetic moments in solids and phenomena such as high-temperature superconductivity. Theories explaining superconductivity can be tested by mapping the position and movement of oscillations of the magnetic moment at a range of different atomic energy levels, Rush says. And the SNS should be able to collect these data some ten times more quickly than existing neutron facilities, owing to its high neutron flux. This high flux level ? up to 1017 neutrons per square centimetre per second ? will also allow users of the facility to extract useful information from smaller samples. This, says Rush, is a valuable capacity for people studying things in short supply, such as proteins or newly developed polymers. The facility also incorporates specialized equipment to cater for different research needs. One instrument will place samples under extremely high pressure, helping planetary scientists who want to model the hydrogen-rich interior of Jupiter. Until now, it has been a struggle to reach pressures above 25 kilobars simply because of a lack of beam intensity at neutron sources, says Richard Nelmes, who specializes in high-pressure neutron science at ISIS, the British neutron facility near Oxford, which is currently the most powerful spallation source in the world. For Oak Ridge ? the largest of the DOE's civilian laboratories ? the new facility provides a badly needed opportunity to regain scientific momentum. "It's a little bit of an engine you get rolling," says Jeff Wadsworth, Oak Ridge's director. "It generates an optimism that feeds on itself." Face lift Oak Ridge was built in 1943 to produce uranium and plutonium for the Manhattan Project, and a major new facility hasn't been added since the high-flux isotope reactor was built in 1966. "There was first-class research and great people, but it looked like a decrepit 1950s lab," says Thomas Mason, who joined the SNS project at Oak Ridge in 1998, becoming the lab's associate director three years later. "People weren't working with state-of-the-art facilities." Next year's opening is the culmination of a prolonged struggle to rectify that. Back in 1984, a National Academy of Sciences panel recommended the distribution of various scientific facilities to different DOE labs, with the largest one ? a proposed advanced neutron-source reactor ? allocated to Oak Ridge. But in 1995 Congress halted the $2.9-billion project just before construction began. The DOE decided to build a less expensive, accelerator-based neutron source instead: the SNS. Developed as a joint project between a number of the department's laboratories, including Los Alamos in New Mexico and Brookhaven in New York state, it was decided to locate the facility at Oak Ridge, in the home state of then-vice-president Al Gore. After construction began, Oak Ridge's management contract was taken over by the University of Tennessee and Battelle, a contract research organization based in Ohio. The new management team has been working hard to secure extra investment for the lab: for instance, it has borrowed $115 million from private banks to build associated infrastructure, including a new centre for computational sciences. On the back of that, Oak Ridge has won leadership of a large DOE supercomputing initiative. "There is a substantial amount of risk that goes along with the debt," says Wadsworth. "But we believed it would help to attract more contracts and to grow our business, and so far we've been successful." Ultimately, Oak Ridge will measure its success by its ability to attract world-quality researchers ? both as visitors and as staff. "You put enough bright people together and interesting things happen," says Butler. "There are all these buildings going up on the hill, and then you put in these people and resources, and add 1,500 users with all their new ideas." In these gentle southern hills, he predicts, "it's going to be a melting pot of ideas, bubbling away". +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From jimm at WPI.EDU Thu Dec 8 15:48:35 2005 From: jimm at WPI.EDU (Muckerheide, James) Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2005 16:48:35 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] (no subject) Message-ID: <71A6142F930A1E4C9300D4088D9765C854D3D2@EXCHDB.admin.wpi.edu> Friends, FYI. This was distributed on another mailing list by Paul Primavera. Thanks, Paul! Note the references to the work of Zbigniew Jaworowski, Sohei Kondo, and Bernie Cohen! Regards, Jim Muckerheide =================== http://www.techcentralstation.com/092805C.html Deadly Assumptions: Radiation and Risk By Theo Richel Published 09/28/2005 A new report tells us that the number of future cancer deaths as a consequence of the disaster in Chernobyl has been adjusted downward from tens or even hundreds of thousands to 4,000. But even this estimate may be way too high. It is quite likely that Russian health statisticians will one day have to register a cancer deficit among the people who were irradiated in 1986 -- that many people in the area do not have cancer as a result of their extra doses of radiation. This is the view of Prof. Dr. Zbigniew Jaworowski, from Poland, a longtime member of the United Nations Scientific Commission on the Effects of Atomic Radiation (Unscear) and author of hundreds of studies in the peer reviewed radiological literature. In 1986 he was responsible for the distribution of supplemental Iodine to 18 million Poles (to protect their thyroid glands), but afterwards he considered those and other measures a complete waste of time and money. Only about 140 people around the reactor received very high doses (28 of them died as a result), the rest of the population received an extra dose that was lower than normal background radiation (some were evacuated, to a place where natural background radiation was substantially higher). The 4,000 future cancer cases, Jaworowski tells me over the phone, "are just a theoretical construction. We will never see them." One reason for this is that epidemiologists lack the instruments to identify these people in the group of 600,000 that received extra radiation. But more important is that these cancer deaths will never occur. Or better: no doubt some of these people will develop cancer but it will have nothing to do with the radiation they received from the exploding power plant. The massive (some might say hysterical) reaction to the explosion in Chernobyl has its roots in the year 1958, when radiation scientists concluded that any amount of radiation could be dangerous and thus should be avoided. They had their data from the consequences of the nuclear bombs that fell on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. They had calculated the doses that the people in different circles around Ground Zero had received and correlated those with statistics of disease and death. A straight line emerged, which seemed to confirm a dose effect relationship: the more radiation one receives the higher the chance of death. Not completely, however. Some people had received an amount of radiation that was about 50-100 times the normal, natural, background radiation that the rest of the Japanese receive (about 2.5 milliSieverts/year). In this group of so called Habakushas (bomb survivors) they could not find enough cancer deaths to create a decent statistic that showed radiation is carcinogenic even at these low doses. So the straight line of dose and effect suddenly stopped. The graphic should have read: No more data available but instead the scientists simply assumed that the dose-effect relationship would continue: any amount of radiation is dangerous. There is no level below which radiation is safe (a threshold) it was claimed, and they called it the LNT-hypothesis for "Linear No-Threshold." So soon after the devastating explosions of the two bombs this reasoning may be understandable, but even at the time several scientists protested it. A scientist bases work on data, not on assumptions, they said, but they were ignored. The LNT-hypothesis still has no scientific basis, but it is nevertheless the rule and the major cause of the disaster that Chernobyl ultimately became. In the past half century it became clear that there are many places on earth where background radiation is 50, 100 or more times higher than the sea level average of 2.5 milliSievert. Parts of Iran and India and China, the beaches of Brazil, parts of Central Europe, the southwest of France, Norway. In all these places epidemiological studies were started and they produced a remarkably consistent picture: the people there have either the same or a slightly lower chance of cancer compared to their less-irradiated countrymen. They live just as long or a little bit longer. Studies among radiologists and workers in nuclear factories gave similar results: a little extra radiation is either harmless or beneficial. And the same goes for studies of accidental exposure: high levels are dangerous, lower levers are harmless or are even beneficial. Researcher Sohei Kondo found in Hiroshima and Nagasaki that some people have a higher life expectancy after the bomb and a lower chance of cancer. And in Chernobyl it is shown again: the thousands of liquidators -- the firemen and emergency workers -- have the same chance of cancer as the average Russian population (somewhat lower, though not significant). This is why Jaworowski is convinced that the 4,000 radiation-induced cancer victims will never materialize in Chernobyl. The authors of the report of the Chernobyl Forum make much of the sociological and psychological problems of the 350,000 people evacuated from the area. The evacuation has disrupted their lives, they have no knowledge of radiation, are fatalistic, have adopted "poverty lifestyles" (e.g. alcoholism). These problems are probably very real but the focus should not be so much on Russians who have no clue about radiation, but on the scientists who started the scare in the first place: those who are responsible for the continuation of the LNT-hypothesis. If you are told that "any amount" of radiation is dangerous, then it is not illogical to be scared when you are in the vicinity of "any amount" of radiation. The whole, enormous rescue operation, the evacuations, everything that happened in the past 20 years was inspired by the LNT-hypothesis, by an assumption that low levels of radiation are dangerous. Many billions were spent. Belarus and the Ukraine together claim that they have lost a total of $400 billion. These countries may not be known for accuracy, but these numbers give an indication of the enormous sums involved (the international community also contributed considerably). It is clear now that many of these billions were wasted; no extra lives were saved with them. Research has shown that the average amount of money a hospital in the US spends to save a life is $44,000. That implies that if you waste a billion dollars you do not have enough money to keep more than 20,000 people alive. These are the real ethics of radiation protection (or protection against any other risk). If you spend your money on small risks you have nothing left for the big risks. And that is exactly what radiation scientists have forced us to do. The rescue operations in Chernobyl saved lives at a price of $2.5 billion each, according to Jaworowski. The scientists who support the LNT-hypothesis are confronted with the darker side of their views, since the next Chernobyl-like disaster is waiting to happen. Not an explosion of a nuclear power plant, but another wave of useless measures to protect us against the dangers of radiation. Several governments in Europe are now preparing measures to ventilate houses where the concentrations of the natural radioactive gas radon are too high. The dangers are exaggerated. An Austrian scientist found that the LNT-based prognosis of radon deaths in his country exceeds the real numbers of total mortality from all causes. Other researchers have shown that many so-called radon deaths are in fact tobacco-deaths. American researcher Bernard Cohen has shown that a very low level of radon is correlated with a higher chance of cancer. Meanwhile many thousands of people in Germany, Poland, the Czech Republic and Japan visit radon spas to breath radioactive air for their health (and these benefits are scientifically confirmed). It is already known that these measures to ventilate homes will divert money from more worthy causes and the number of lives saved will be negligible. From JGinniver at aol.com Thu Dec 8 16:49:33 2005 From: JGinniver at aol.com (JGinniver at aol.com) Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2005 17:49:33 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] other radionuclide impurities in Co-60 sources Message-ID: <46.76823f57.30ca127d@aol.com> Does anyone on the list have any information, or references to publications that can provide information on the manufacture of Cobalt-60 sources. In particular whether Cobalt enriched steel is used and if so what other radionuclides may be produced at the same time e.g. Fe-55 or Ni-63. Regards, Julian From maurysis at ev1.net Thu Dec 8 19:29:09 2005 From: maurysis at ev1.net (Maury Siskel) Date: Thu, 08 Dec 2005 19:29:09 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] One upon a time in a land far away .... Message-ID: <4398DDE5.4030701@ev1.net> 64 years 7 DEC From joseroze at netvision.net.il Fri Dec 9 02:29:26 2005 From: joseroze at netvision.net.il (Jose Julio Rozental) Date: Fri, 09 Dec 2005 11:29:26 +0300 Subject: [ RadSafe ] IAEA text References: <46.76823f57.30ca127d@aol.com> Message-ID: <00d501c5fc9a$acf30ce0$840118ac@userqzqxd9wnct> Colleagues two recent IAEA doc available to download "Management of Waste from the Use of Radioactive Materials in Medicine, Industry, Agriculture, Research and Education Safety Guide" April 2005. IAEA Safety Standards Series No. WS-G-2.7 http://www-pub.iaea.org/MTCD/publications/PDF/Pub1217_web.pdf "Overview of Training Methodology for Accident Management at Nuclear Power Plants." April 2005. IAEA TECDOC Series No. 1440. http://www-pub.iaea.org/MTCD/publications/PDF/TE_1440_web.pdf Jose Julio Rozental joseroze at netvision.net.il Israel From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Fri Dec 9 04:13:48 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Fri, 9 Dec 2005 10:13:48 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] NRC staff appears to have the fixed the problem with their web site In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051209101348.66294.qmail@web26408.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear colleague, It appears NRC software specialists fixed the problem with their site. I had access today. The site is accessible from other servers in India also. The problem persisted for several weeks. You may try today and let me know. Regards K.S.Parthasarathy Rogers Brent wrote: Dear Colleagues For the past while, I've been unable to access the NRC website (www.nrc.gov). I get a "server not responsing" error page. Has this been the same for everyone, or possibly because I'm attempting to connect from an overseas server? Any NRC-types out there know when the site will be accessible again? Brent Rogers Manager Radiation Operations Unit NSW Environment Protection Authority Department of Environment and Conservation *+61 2 9995 5986 *+61 2 9995 6603 * PO Box A290 Sydney South 1232 This email is intended for the addressee(s) named and may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then delete it immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of the individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority states them to be the views of the Department of Environment and Conservation (NSW). _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. From EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV Fri Dec 9 07:06:25 2005 From: EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV (Baratta, Edmond J) Date: Fri, 9 Dec 2005 08:06:25 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] other radionuclide impurities in Co-60 sources Message-ID: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA5C@orsnewea002.fda.gov> Check with MDS Nordion of Canada. They make Co-60 sources for irradiation and other uses. Edmond J. Baratta Radioactivity/Radiation Safety Officer Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 Fax: 781-729-3593 edmond.baratta at fda.gov -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of JGinniver at aol.com Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 5:50 PM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] other radionuclide impurities in Co-60 sources Does anyone on the list have any information, or references to publications that can provide information on the manufacture of Cobalt-60 sources. In particular whether Cobalt enriched steel is used and if so what other radionuclides may be produced at the same time e.g. Fe-55 or Ni-63. Regards, Julian _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Fri Dec 9 07:42:49 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Fri, 9 Dec 2005 05:42:49 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Article; PET/CT shows potential for detecting unknown primary cancers Message-ID: <20051209134249.94062.qmail@web54304.mail.yahoo.com> >From a news service I belong to. Note that each subject already had a cancer or was treated for a secondary lesion. I heard that the typical PET/CT scan was about $3,000 The original is at http://www.auntminnie.com/index.asp?Sec=sup&Sub=mol&Pag=dis&ItemId=69097&wf=529 PET/CT shows potential for detecting unknown primary cancers 12/8/2005 By: Jonathan S. Batchelor Detecting the primary lesion in patients presenting with cancer and an unknown primary is one of the more demanding tasks in diagnostic medical imaging. It's imperative that the primary be identified so that the patient can receive therapy that is adequate for the malignancy. Generally, the most common unknown primary cancers are adenocarcinoma, squamous cell carcinoma, and poorly differentiated carcinoma. At the recent RSNA conference in Chicago, a pair of presentations put PET/CT to the task of detecting unknown primary cancers. Dr. Mehmet ?ks?z from the department of radiology at the Katharinen Hospital in Stuttgart, Germany, investigated the impact of coregistered F-18 FDG-PET/CT imaging on the identification and exact anatomic localization of primary tumors. "One of the major disadvantages in the past was the lack of exact anatomic localization of F-18 FDG-PET foci, leading to several false-positive findings," ?ks?z said. His research team evaluated 87 consecutive F-18 FDG-PET/CT exams of 43 patients with metastatic cervical adenopathy and 44 patients with extracervical metastases. The scans were conducted on a Discovery LS PET/CT system (GE Healthcare, Chalfont St. Giles, U.K.) one hour after intravenous injection of 360 MBq of F-18 FDG. According to ?ks?z, the group assessed whether a possible primary tumor could be identified by PET or only in the fused images of the PET/CT system. The team also sought to determine if the localization of lesions by CT contributed to therapeutic management. ?ks?z said that a possible primary tumor, determined by F-18 FDG foci, was detected in 35 cases, or 42% of the cohort. In 21 of these cases, nontumor-like lesions were found in the PET/CT images. However, in the remaining 14 cases tumor-like lesions were depicted and histologically identified as five ear, nose, and throat (ENT) tumors; two gastric wall tumors; two cases of thyroid cancer; and one case each of cancer of the esophagus, mandible, breast, ovary, and kidney. In the 14 patients with primary lesions, nine had disseminated FDG foci, observed ?ks?z. He added that in four of these nine patients, the PET/CT images showed potential local complications, which needed additional therapeutic measures. Overall, the researchers' use of PET/CT allowed them to definitely identify 16% (14 of 87 patients) of the primary lesions in cancer of unknown origin. ?ks?z attributed the success to capability of the PET/CT system to precisely localize pathological F-18 FDG uptake via its CT component. He said that this made the histological verification by biopsy easier for the clinicians, particularly in complex anatomic areas such as the ENT region. In the second RSNA presentation, Dr. Stefano Fanti, from the nuclear medicine department, PET unit, at the Policlinico S. Orsola-Malpighi in Bologna, Italy, presented the results of a study carried out to evaluate the role of FDG-PET/CT for detecting unknown primary cancer in patients with biopsy-proven secondary lesions. His group's study population consisted of 36 patients, 14 female and 22 male with a mean age of 64.5 years. All the patients had at least one biopsied secondary lesion, a negative physical examination, and negative or inconclusive conventional imaging tests performed on modalities such as CT, ultrasound, or MR. Fanti said that 15 of these patients had adenocarcinoma; seven patients had a nondefined epithelial carcinoma, six had squamous cell carcinoma, two were determined to have poorly differentiated carcinoma, and one patient each had transitional cell carcinoma, a germ cell tumor, a flat cell tumor, melanoma, a spinocellular carcinoma, and a spindle cell carcinoma. Each patient underwent a FDG-PET/CT scan on a Discovery LS PET/CT and their results were evaluated by the team, according to Fanti. The Italian team showed that in 44% of the patients, 17 cases, PET/CT detected the primary occult lesion. This was found in the lung of seven patients, the tongue of two patients, and one each in the testis, tonsil, ovary, biliary system, colon, hypopharynx, tongue, and pharynx of the remaining patients. In one case, noted Fanti, PET/CT detected an equivocal gastric hypermetabolic area consistent with primary lesion but, as gastroscopy was negative, this finding was not considered definitive. In 53% of the patients, 18 cases, PET/CT was not conclusive for detecting the primary occult lesion, he said. Fanti, like ?ks?z, attributed the team's success to detecting unknown primary lesions to the utilization of PET/CT. "This may be due to the correlation of metabolic data provided by the PET scan and the morphological data provided by CT attenuation correction, making it easier for the reader to study anatomically complicated areas such as the head, neck, pelvis, and abdomen," he said. By Jonathan S. Batchelor AuntMinnie.com staff writer December 8, 2005 +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From joseroze at netvision.net.il Fri Dec 9 09:02:07 2005 From: joseroze at netvision.net.il (Jose Julio Rozental) Date: Fri, 09 Dec 2005 18:02:07 +0300 Subject: [ RadSafe ] other radionuclide impurities in Co-60 sources References: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA5C@orsnewea002.fda.gov> Message-ID: <028c01c5fcd1$878d5c80$840118ac@userqzqxd9wnct> Look at COBALT-60 PRODUCTION IN CANDU POWER REACTORS http://www.nuclearfaq.ca/malkoskie_cobalt_paper.pdf If you understand spanish look at PRODUCCI?N Y SERVICIOS DE ASISTENCIA TECNOL?GICA http://www.cnea.gov.ar/cac/ci/02_8cap5.pdf Jose Julio Rozental joseroze at netvision.net.il Israel ----- Original Message ----- From: "Baratta, Edmond J" To: ; Sent: Friday, December 09, 2005 4:06 PM Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] other radionuclide impurities in Co-60 sources > Check with MDS Nordion of Canada. They make Co-60 sources for irradiation > and other uses. > > > Edmond J. Baratta > Radioactivity/Radiation Safety Officer > Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 > Fax: 781-729-3593 > edmond.baratta at fda.gov > > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf > Of JGinniver at aol.com > Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 5:50 PM > To: radsafe at radlab.nl > Subject: [ RadSafe ] other radionuclide impurities in Co-60 sources > > Does anyone on the list have any information, or references to publications > > that can provide information on the manufacture of Cobalt-60 sources. In > particular whether Cobalt enriched steel is used and if so what other > radionuclides may be produced at the same time e.g. Fe-55 or Ni-63. > > Regards, > Julian > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the > RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Fri Dec 9 09:07:57 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Fri, 9 Dec 2005 07:07:57 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Abstract: Age-at-exposure effects on risk estimates for non-cancer mortality in the Japanese atomic bomb survivors Message-ID: <20051209150757.58248.qmail@web54311.mail.yahoo.com> Age-at-exposure effects on risk estimates for non-cancer mortality in the Japanese atomic bomb survivors Wei Zhang, Colin R Muirhead and Nezahat Hunter 2005 J. Radiol. Prot. 25 393-404 Abstract: http://www.iop.org/EJ/abstract/-alert=1221/0952-4746/25/4/003 Full text PDF: http://www.iop.org/EJ/article/-alert=1221/0952-4746/25/4/003/jrp5_4_003.pdf Statistically significant increases in non-cancer disease mortality with radiation dose have been observed among survivors of the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. The increasing trends arise particularly for diseases of the circulatory, digestive, and respiratory systems. Rates for survivors exposed to a dose of 1 Sv are elevated by about 10%, a smaller relative increase than that for cancer. The aetiology of this increased risk is not yet understood. Neither animal nor human studies have found clear evidence for excess non-cancer mortality at the lower range of doses received by A-bomb survivors. In this paper, we examine the age and time patterns of excess risks in the A-bomb survivors. The results suggest that the excess relative risk of non-cancer disease mortality might be highest for exposure at ages 30-49 years, and that those exposed at ages 0-29 years might have a very low excess relative risk compared with those exposed at older ages. The differences in excess relative risk for different age-at-exposure groups imply that the dose response relationships for non-cancer disease mortality need to be modelled with adjustment for age-at-exposure. +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From jim.dukelow at pnl.gov Fri Dec 9 17:26:18 2005 From: jim.dukelow at pnl.gov (Dukelow, James S Jr) Date: Fri, 09 Dec 2005 15:26:18 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Abstract: Age-at-exposure effects on risk estimates fornon-cancer mortality in the Japanese atomic bomb survivors Message-ID: I thank John Jacobus for providing a link to this interesting paper. I have a few comments following a first pass through the Zhang et al. paper. This appears to be an example of the old adage that if you torture a data set long enough it will tell you what you want to hear. Perhaps national policy should be that we torture neither prisoners/detainees nor data sets. Table 1 of the paper gives numbers of subjects and numbers of non-cancer death for various dose ranges. I have added a calculation of the death rate per 1000 subjects for each dose range <0.005 Sv 37458 subjects 12660 deaths 337.98 deaths per 1000 0.005 to 0.1 Sv 31648 deaths 10650 deaths 336.51 deaths per 1000 0.1 to 0.2 Sv 5732 subjects 1975 deaths 344.56 deaths per 1000 0.2 to 0.5 Sv 6332 subjects 2226 deaths 351.55 deaths per 1000 0.5 to 1 Sv 3983 subjects 1292 deaths 324.38 deaths per 1000 1 to 2 Sv 927 subjects 274 deaths 295.58 deaths per 1000 2 to 4 Sv 228 subjects 56 deaths 245.61 deaths per 1000 Totals 86308 subjects 29133 deaths 337.55 deaths per 1000 A Chi-square test (df = 6) of the hypothesis that excess relative risk per Sv (ERR) = 0 for the overall data set is rejected the two-tailed 2% level, but the reason for rejection is that ERR = 0 over-predicts deaths in the 0.5 Sv to 4 Sv groups. Chi-square tests of hypotheses with ERR > 0 would be rejected at even higher levels (that is smaller values of the tail probabilities alpha). The hypothesis that ERR has a small negative value would be accepted, but I haven't had a chance yet to calculate the range of such ERR values. Looking at the rest of the paper, most values of ERR calculated for the dozens (hundreds?) of confidence intervals reports have confidence intervals that include negative values of ERR. A few of the calculated ERRs are positive with positive confidence intervals. Several ERRs are negative, but all have confidence intervals including ERR = 0. The authors appear to be using standard methods of epidemiology, which is another story. No corrections appear to have been made for multiple tests of hypothesis. The authors manage to extract a scary abstract from this trash. Best regards. Jim Dukelow Pacific Northwest National Laboratory Richland, WA jim.dukelow at pnl.gov These comments are mine and have not been reviewed and/or approved by my management or by the U.S. Department of Energy. -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of John Jacobus Sent: Friday, December 09, 2005 7:08 AM To: radsafe; know_nukes at yahoogroups.com Subject: [ RadSafe ] Abstract: Age-at-exposure effects on risk estimates fornon-cancer mortality in the Japanese atomic bomb survivors Age-at-exposure effects on risk estimates for non-cancer mortality in the Japanese atomic bomb survivors Wei Zhang, Colin R Muirhead and Nezahat Hunter 2005 J. Radiol. Prot. 25 393-404 Abstract: http://www.iop.org/EJ/abstract/-alert=1221/0952-4746/25/4/003 Full text PDF: http://www.iop.org/EJ/article/-alert=1221/0952-4746/25/4/003/jrp5_4_003. pdf Statistically significant increases in non-cancer disease mortality with radiation dose have been observed among survivors of the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. The increasing trends arise particularly for diseases of the circulatory, digestive, and respiratory systems. Rates for survivors exposed to a dose of 1 Sv are elevated by about 10%, a smaller relative increase than that for cancer. The aetiology of this increased risk is not yet understood. Neither animal nor human studies have found clear evidence for excess non-cancer mortality at the lower range of doses received by A-bomb survivors. In this paper, we examine the age and time patterns of excess risks in the A-bomb survivors. The results suggest that the excess relative risk of non-cancer disease mortality might be highest for exposure at ages 30-49 years, and that those exposed at ages 0-29 years might have a very low excess relative risk compared with those exposed at older ages. The differences in excess relative risk for different age-at-exposure groups imply that the dose response relationships for non-cancer disease mortality need to be modelled with adjustment for age-at-exposure. +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From JPreisig at aol.com Sat Dec 10 22:57:49 2005 From: JPreisig at aol.com (JPreisig at aol.com) Date: Sat, 10 Dec 2005 23:57:49 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Space Travel (Fission, Fusion, etc.) Message-ID: <1a2.416b3dd7.30cd0bcd@aol.com> Hmmmmmm, This is from: jpreisig at aol.com . Greetings Radsafers!!!! Hope all is well with you. A while back, someone was asking about travel to the Moon and/or Mars, and Cosmic Rays and all that. The Radsafe archives should have considerable e-mail discussion of these matters, especially concerning the use of fission/fusion propulsion. Consult the archives, if you wish. For fundamental discussions of Cosmic Rays, charged particles, neutral particles, please read: Patterson & Thomas "Accelerator Health Physics" and the Accelerator Health Physics course notes by Coissairt. Flights to Mars using chemical propulsion probably take too long for sane astronauts. Fission/Fusion propulsion flights would probably be quicker. Mr./Dr. Facius's recent comments about cosmic rays are probably in the recent radsafe archives. Clearly, if one uses fission/fusion propulsion, one might have to limit maximum spacecraft accelerations, to not injure astronauts. I don't know how reasonable it is to have an extra shielded area in a spacecraft, because I don't know how quickly astronauts could be warned about dangerous cosmic rays, solar flares and the like. Such cosmic ray phenomena might possibly be lethal. Space flight is still a dangerous business --- if one examines the early Mercury (NASA) capsules, one will probably appreciate the bravery of the Mercury astronauts. Clearly, charged particles will be shielded using high Z materials, and neutrons can be shielded using hydrogenous materials (polyethylene, water, etc.). As for somebody's son wanting to be a spacecraft pilot, Go For It. NASA's websites probably have information on Pilot and/or mission specialist requirements. If your kid has eyeglasses already, think about not applying. NASA pilots need considerable flight hour training and pilot (hour) experience. There is at least one fission propelled spacecraft (recent vintage--- Prometheus???). See the internet for more information. Best wishes for safe and happy holidays....INL (formerly INEL --- USA) appears to be getting the nod for US reactor development for future US reactors. Take care. Joseph R. (Joe) Preisig, Ph.D. From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Sun Dec 11 09:27:39 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Sun, 11 Dec 2005 07:27:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Abstract: Age-at-exposure effects on risk estimates fornon-cancer mortality in the Japanese atomic bomb survivors In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051211152739.68915.qmail@web54310.mail.yahoo.com> Jim, Glad you appreciated seeing this paper, and thank you for the comments. I am not an epidemologist, and appreciate any comments as that other-than-cancer risks have appeared and will continue to appear in the literature. I would appreciate any comments on the validity of the results for comparison. --- "Dukelow, James S Jr" wrote: > > I thank John Jacobus for providing a link to this > interesting paper. > > I have a few comments following a first pass through > the Zhang et al. > paper. > > This appears to be an example of the old adage that > if you torture a > data set long enough it will tell you what you want > to hear. Perhaps > national policy should be that we torture neither > prisoners/detainees > nor data sets. > > Table 1 of the paper gives numbers of subjects and > numbers of non-cancer > death for various dose ranges. I have added a > calculation of the death > rate per 1000 subjects for each dose range > > <0.005 Sv 37458 subjects 12660 deaths 337.98 > deaths per 1000 > 0.005 to 0.1 Sv 31648 deaths 10650 deaths > 336.51 deaths per 1000 > 0.1 to 0.2 Sv 5732 subjects 1975 deaths 344.56 > deaths per 1000 > 0.2 to 0.5 Sv 6332 subjects 2226 deaths 351.55 > deaths per 1000 > 0.5 to 1 Sv 3983 subjects 1292 deaths 324.38 > deaths per 1000 > 1 to 2 Sv 927 subjects 274 deaths 295.58 > deaths per 1000 > 2 to 4 Sv 228 subjects 56 deaths 245.61 > deaths per 1000 > > Totals 86308 subjects 29133 deaths > 337.55 deaths per 1000 > > A Chi-square test (df = 6) of the hypothesis that > excess relative risk > per Sv (ERR) = 0 for the overall data set is > rejected the two-tailed 2% > level, but the reason for rejection is that ERR = 0 > over-predicts deaths > in the 0.5 Sv to 4 Sv groups. Chi-square tests of > hypotheses with ERR > > 0 would be rejected at even higher levels (that is > smaller values of the > tail probabilities alpha). The hypothesis that ERR > has a small negative > value would be accepted, but I haven't had a chance > yet to calculate the > range of such ERR values. > > Looking at the rest of the paper, most values of ERR > calculated for the > dozens (hundreds?) of confidence intervals reports > have confidence > intervals that include negative values of ERR. A > few of the calculated > ERRs are positive with positive confidence > intervals. Several ERRs are > negative, but all have confidence intervals > including ERR = 0. > > The authors appear to be using standard methods of > epidemiology, which > is another story. No corrections appear to have > been made for multiple > tests of hypothesis. > > The authors manage to extract a scary abstract from > this trash. > > Best regards. > > Jim Dukelow > Pacific Northwest National Laboratory > Richland, WA > jim.dukelow at pnl.gov > > These comments are mine and have not been reviewed > and/or approved by my > management or by the U.S. Department of Energy. > > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl > [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On > Behalf Of John Jacobus > Sent: Friday, December 09, 2005 7:08 AM > To: radsafe; know_nukes at yahoogroups.com > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Abstract: Age-at-exposure > effects on risk estimates > fornon-cancer mortality in the Japanese atomic bomb > survivors > > Age-at-exposure effects on risk estimates for > non-cancer mortality in > the Japanese atomic bomb survivors > Wei Zhang, Colin R Muirhead and Nezahat Hunter > 2005 J. Radiol. Prot. 25 393-404 > > Abstract: > http://www.iop.org/EJ/abstract/-alert=1221/0952-4746/25/4/003 > > Full text PDF: > http://www.iop.org/EJ/article/-alert=1221/0952-4746/25/4/003/jrp5_4_003. > pdf > . . . +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From BScott at lrri.org Sun Dec 11 15:42:13 2005 From: BScott at lrri.org (Scott, Bobby) Date: Sun, 11 Dec 2005 14:42:13 -0700 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Comments on thyroid cancer paper by E. Cardis et al. Message-ID: <5219BF1785792545A95B0401000AF6EF02C7B603@neuvo.lobos.lrri.org> Comments on Thyroid Cancer Paper by E. Cardis et al. Paper: E. Cardis et al., Risk of Cancer After Exposure to I-131 in Childhood Journal: Journal of the National Cancer Institute Vol. 97, No. 10 pages 724-732, May 18, 2005. The authors carried out a population-based, case-control study of thyroid cancer in Belarus and the Russian Federation to evaluate the risk of thyroid cancer after exposure to radioactive iodine (mainly I-131) from the 1986 Chernobyl accident and to investigate environmental and host factors that may modify the risk. The study involved 276 case patients with thyroid cancer through 1998 and 1300 matched control subjects, all younger than 15 years at the time of the Chernobyl accident. Linear and linear-quadratic excess relative risk models were fit to the data using conditional logistic regression. A strong dose-response relationship was found between the calculated absorbed radiation dose to the thyroid received in childhood and thyroid cancer (P<0.001). A linear dose-response relationship was stated to have been observed up to 1.5 - 2 Gy. This e-mail questions the claim of a linear dose-response relationship in light of the large errors associated with the derived odd ratios (OR) and also questions the methods used for employing nonlinear dose-response models. The data reported in Figure 1 of the paper that were used to obtain odds ratio (an estimate of relative risk) are provided below: Dose interval (mGy), cases in the interval, controls in the interval: Interval 0-15 mGy, cases=16, controls=138; Interval 16-199 mGy, cases=76, controls=503; Interval 200-399 mGy, cases=40, controls=200; Interval 400-599 mGy, cases=31, controls=141; Interval 600-799 mGy, cases=29; controls=92; Interval 800-999 mGy, cases=26, controls=67; Interval 1000-1249 mGy, case=14, controls=60; Interval 1250-1499 mGy, cases=10, controls=22; Interval 1500-1999 mGy, cases=10, controls=23; Interval 2000-2999 mGy, cases=15, controls=25; Interval 3000 mGy and larger, cases=9, controls=29; OR was apparently evaluated relative to the interval 0-15 mGy. The crude OR I get for the interval 16-199 mGy is: 1.303 (0.736, 2.307). The two values within the parenthesis defines the 95% confidence interval. Note that the result is not significant > 0 and based on the lower confidence value is consistent with the possibility of either a threshold or a hormetic response. Neither a threshold or hormetic model were considered by the researchers. The indicated results related to the threshold and hormetic models are especially important in that there was no actual unexposed group. Not having an unexposed group and using a case-control study design can greatly favor LNT over threshold and hormetic models. Also, given that reconstructed doses (dose estimates) are likely at best crude approximations, doses for some persons stated to be in the dose interval 0-15 mGy could be much higher. The OR results I got appear to differ from those reported by Cardis et al. However, how they got their OR values was not explained in their paper. Possibly some unreported adjustments were made. The excess relative risk (RR) model used by Cardis et al. for OR (an estimate of RR) had the structure: OR = 1 + beta*D + gamma*D*D, where D is the individual absorbed dose (usual definition in risk assessment). Beta and gamma are fixed model parameters. In the regression analysis, the above equation was apparently regressed against average dose for each dose group. A fixed observed OR was assigned to each dose interval. Please note that this implies that OR averaged over each dose interval was assumed. For the linear model (gamma=0), there is no problem because average OR (here indicated as Av{OR}) equals 1 + beta*Av{D}, where Av{} again indicates average. However, for gamma not equal to zero, Av{OR} is not only a function of Av{D}, but also a function of Av{D*D}. Av{OR} is not a function of Av{D}*Av{D} as was apparently used by Cardis et al. (systematic error in model application?). Thus, conclusions obtained by the authors related to application of the linear-quadratic function may not be valid. For some analyses, instead of use of the excess RR model the authors used and exponential form of OR, where OR = exp(beta*D + gamma*D*D + ...). However, they apparently did not realize that in using this exponential model that Av{OR} does not equal exp(beta*Av{D} + gamma*Av{D}*Av{D} + ...), but has a more complicated structure that should have been used. Thus, results reported by the authors based on this modeling may not be valid. Radsafe Digest readers, comments on the above would be welcomed. Sincerely, Bobby R. Scott, Ph.D. Senior Scientist Lovelace Respiratory Research Institute 2425 Ridgecrest Drive SE Albuquerque, NM 87108 USA From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Sun Dec 11 16:23:30 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Sun, 11 Dec 2005 14:23:30 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Comments on thyroid cancer paper by E. Cardis et al. In-Reply-To: <5219BF1785792545A95B0401000AF6EF02C7B603@neuvo.lobos.lrri.org> Message-ID: <20051211222330.29467.qmail@web54312.mail.yahoo.com> Dr. Scott, Have you sent a letter to the Journal of the National Cancer Institute? It would seem to me that any challenges or questions you have in the data should be made to the editors and those involved with the review of this article. They should respond to your concerns. If the principal authors do not know about your questions, how can they respond? --- "Scott, Bobby" wrote: > Comments on Thyroid Cancer Paper by E. Cardis et al. > > > > > Paper: E. Cardis et al., Risk of Cancer After > Exposure to I-131 in > Childhood > > Journal: Journal of the National Cancer Institute > Vol. 97, No. 10 pages > 724-732, May 18, 2005. > > > > The authors carried out a population-based, > case-control study of > thyroid cancer in Belarus and the Russian Federation > to evaluate the > risk of thyroid cancer after exposure to radioactive > iodine (mainly > I-131) from the 1986 Chernobyl accident and to > investigate environmental > and host factors that may modify the risk. The > study involved 276 case > patients with thyroid cancer through 1998 and 1300 > matched control > subjects, all younger than 15 years at the time of > the Chernobyl > accident. Linear and linear-quadratic excess > relative risk models were > fit to the data using conditional logistic > regression. A strong > dose-response relationship was found between the > calculated absorbed > radiation dose to the thyroid received in childhood > and thyroid cancer > (P<0.001). A linear dose-response relationship was > stated to have been > observed up to 1.5 - 2 Gy. > > . . . > > Radsafe Digest readers, comments on the above would > be welcomed. > > > > Sincerely, > > Bobby R. Scott, Ph.D. > > Senior Scientist > > Lovelace Respiratory Research Institute > > 2425 Ridgecrest Drive SE > > Albuquerque, NM 87108 USA > > > > > > === message truncated === +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Sun Dec 11 20:08:22 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2005 02:08:22 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Comments on scientific papers must also be subjected to peer review In-Reply-To: <20051211222330.29467.qmail@web54312.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20051212020822.57519.qmail@web26414.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Friends, I agree with John. Very few of us have the expertise in epidemiology to evaluate the comments. Even if we are experts, it is appropriate that the comments or any analysis should appear in open literature; ideally in the same journal. That way the authors of the original paper will get a chance to respond, even to re-analyse their data. This is not to dismiss the validity of the comments or analysis in the present instance. Regards, K.S.Parthasarathy Raja Ramanna fellow Department of Atomic Energy India John Jacobus wrote: Dr. Scott, Have you sent a letter to the Journal of the National Cancer Institute? It would seem to me that any challenges or questions you have in the data should be made to the editors and those involved with the review of this article. They should respond to your concerns. If the principal authors do not know about your questions, how can they respond? --- "Scott, Bobby" wrote: > Comments on Thyroid Cancer Paper by E. Cardis et al. > > > > > Paper: E. Cardis et al., Risk of Cancer After > Exposure to I-131 in > Childhood > > Journal: Journal of the National Cancer Institute > Vol. 97, No. 10 pages > 724-732, May 18, 2005. > > > > The authors carried out a population-based, > case-control study of > thyroid cancer in Belarus and the Russian Federation > to evaluate the > risk of thyroid cancer after exposure to radioactive > iodine (mainly > I-131) from the 1986 Chernobyl accident and to > investigate environmental > and host factors that may modify the risk. The > study involved 276 case > patients with thyroid cancer through 1998 and 1300 > matched control > subjects, all younger than 15 years at the time of > the Chernobyl > accident. Linear and linear-quadratic excess > relative risk models were > fit to the data using conditional logistic > regression. A strong > dose-response relationship was found between the > calculated absorbed > radiation dose to the thyroid received in childhood > and thyroid cancer > (P<0.001). A linear dose-response relationship was > stated to have been > observed up to 1.5 - 2 Gy. > > . . . > > Radsafe Digest readers, comments on the above would > be welcomed. > > > > Sincerely, > > Bobby R. Scott, Ph.D. > > Senior Scientist > > Lovelace Respiratory Research Institute > > 2425 Ridgecrest Drive SE > > Albuquerque, NM 87108 USA > > > > > > === message truncated === +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- Yahoo! Messenger NEW - crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail From maurysis at ev1.net Mon Dec 12 02:50:12 2005 From: maurysis at ev1.net (Maury Siskel) Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2005 02:50:12 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Googling World Energy Reserves Message-ID: <439D39C4.7050000@ev1.net> http://www.lewrockwell.com/walker/walker16.html Links to an interesting perspective of energy and especially nuclear power. Wish I could correctly evaluate the validity or correctness of the Walker's cited data, but that is beyond my knowledge. I am convinced that energy prices include a very large fear/apprehension premium and that there is no shortage (neither present nor prospective) of energy raw materials (i.e., gas, coal, etc). I would like to read the opinions of others on this List who might be inclined to comment. Cheers, Maury&Dog maurysis at ev1.net From mark.hogue at srs.gov Mon Dec 12 08:30:23 2005 From: mark.hogue at srs.gov (mark.hogue at srs.gov) Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2005 09:30:23 -0500 Subject: Fw: [ RadSafe ] Comments on thyroid cancer paper by E. Cardis et al. Message-ID: Bobby, Thank you for the interesting post. It seems appropriate to me that you post this relevant question. I don't have an immediate response to your technical questions, but would like to offset the discouraging responses posted so far: 1. One post suggested you should write to the journal rather than Radsafe. Obviously, you know about journal correspondence and are just determining if there is a proper case. Some people on Radsafe feel they have to respond to every post though and will state the obvious if they know nothing else. 2. The other post stated that there is very little knowledge of epidemiology on Radsafe. I hope this is not true, but it is bizarre to discourage a technical post amid the irrelevant nuisance posts on the basis that this one is too hard to think about. Good luck in your endeavor. Mark G. Hogue, CHP mark.hogue at srs.gov "But we surely overrate the usefulness of what we like to call "stimulation" and underrate the need for time, peace of mind, mature reflection." - Susan Haack "DISCLAIMER: The opinions expressed are mine and do not necessarily represent Westinghouse Savannah River Co. or the United States Department of Energy." "Scott, Bobby" Sent by: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl 12/11/2005 04:42 PM To cc Subject [ RadSafe ] Comments on thyroid cancer paper by E. Cardis et al. Comments on Thyroid Cancer Paper by E. Cardis et al. Paper: E. Cardis et al., Risk of Cancer After Exposure to I-131 in Childhood Journal: Journal of the National Cancer Institute Vol. 97, No. 10 pages 724-732, May 18, 2005. The authors carried out a population-based, case-control study of thyroid cancer in Belarus and the Russian Federation to evaluate the risk of thyroid cancer after exposure to radioactive iodine (mainly I-131) from the 1986 Chernobyl accident and to investigate environmental and host factors that may modify the risk. The study involved 276 case patients with thyroid cancer through 1998 and 1300 matched control subjects, all younger than 15 years at the time of the Chernobyl accident. Linear and linear-quadratic excess relative risk models were fit to the data using conditional logistic regression. A strong dose-response relationship was found between the calculated absorbed radiation dose to the thyroid received in childhood and thyroid cancer (P<0.001). A linear dose-response relationship was stated to have been observed up to 1.5 - 2 Gy. This e-mail questions the claim of a linear dose-response relationship in light of the large errors associated with the derived odd ratios (OR) and also questions the methods used for employing nonlinear dose-response models. The data reported in Figure 1 of the paper that were used to obtain odds ratio (an estimate of relative risk) are provided below: Dose interval (mGy), cases in the interval, controls in the interval: Interval 0-15 mGy, cases=16, controls=138; Interval 16-199 mGy, cases=76, controls=503; Interval 200-399 mGy, cases=40, controls=200; Interval 400-599 mGy, cases=31, controls=141; Interval 600-799 mGy, cases=29; controls=92; Interval 800-999 mGy, cases=26, controls=67; Interval 1000-1249 mGy, case=14, controls=60; Interval 1250-1499 mGy, cases=10, controls=22; Interval 1500-1999 mGy, cases=10, controls=23; Interval 2000-2999 mGy, cases=15, controls=25; Interval 3000 mGy and larger, cases=9, controls=29; OR was apparently evaluated relative to the interval 0-15 mGy. The crude OR I get for the interval 16-199 mGy is: 1.303 (0.736, 2.307). The two values within the parenthesis defines the 95% confidence interval. Note that the result is not significant > 0 and based on the lower confidence value is consistent with the possibility of either a threshold or a hormetic response. Neither a threshold or hormetic model were considered by the researchers. The indicated results related to the threshold and hormetic models are especially important in that there was no actual unexposed group. Not having an unexposed group and using a case-control study design can greatly favor LNT over threshold and hormetic models. Also, given that reconstructed doses (dose estimates) are likely at best crude approximations, doses for some persons stated to be in the dose interval 0-15 mGy could be much higher. The OR results I got appear to differ from those reported by Cardis et al. However, how they got their OR values was not explained in their paper. Possibly some unreported adjustments were made. The excess relative risk (RR) model used by Cardis et al. for OR (an estimate of RR) had the structure: OR = 1 + beta*D + gamma*D*D, where D is the individual absorbed dose (usual definition in risk assessment). Beta and gamma are fixed model parameters. In the regression analysis, the above equation was apparently regressed against average dose for each dose group. A fixed observed OR was assigned to each dose interval. Please note that this implies that OR averaged over each dose interval was assumed. For the linear model (gamma=0), there is no problem because average OR (here indicated as Av{OR}) equals 1 + beta*Av{D}, where Av{} again indicates average. However, for gamma not equal to zero, Av{OR} is not only a function of Av{D}, but also a function of Av{D*D}. Av{OR} is not a function of Av{D}*Av{D} as was apparently used by Cardis et al. (systematic error in model application?). Thus, conclusions obtained by the authors related to application of the linear-quadratic function may not be valid. For some analyses, instead of use of the excess RR model the authors used and exponential form of OR, where OR = exp(beta*D + gamma*D*D + ...). However, they apparently did not realize that in using this exponential model that Av{OR} does not equal exp(beta*Av{D} + gamma*Av{D}*Av{D} + ...), but has a more complicated structure that should have been used. Thus, results reported by the authors based on this modeling may not be valid. Radsafe Digest readers, comments on the above would be welcomed. Sincerely, Bobby R. Scott, Ph.D. Senior Scientist Lovelace Respiratory Research Institute 2425 Ridgecrest Drive SE Albuquerque, NM 87108 USA _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From Peter.Sandgren at po.state.ct.us Mon Dec 12 08:34:54 2005 From: Peter.Sandgren at po.state.ct.us (Sandgren, Peter) Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2005 09:34:54 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Sternglass and a goat Message-ID: WTNH.com - Anti-Millstone activists bring iconic goat to town (Sternglass to appear at press conference) http://www.wtnh.com/Global/story.asp?S=4231555 Peter Sandgren Connecticut Department of Emergency Management & Homeland Security Radiological Emergency Preparedness (REP) GIS Operations phone (860) 566-4586 fax (860) 566-6017 "Most people are about as happy as they make up their minds to be." -- Abraham Lincoln From BScott at lrri.org Mon Dec 12 15:00:00 2005 From: BScott at lrri.org (Scott, Bobby) Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2005 14:00:00 -0700 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Comments on scientific papers must also be subjected to peer review Message-ID: <5219BF1785792545A95B0401000AF6EF02C7B60D@neuvo.lobos.lrri.org> Colleagues: I plan to submit a letter to the editor of the JNCI related to the paper by E. Cardis et al. on thyroid cancer after the Chernobyl accident. For readers of the Radsafe Digest that may have an interest, I have a pdf version of my seminar given on November 10, 2005 at Los Alamos National Laboratory entitled "The LNT Hypothesis May Have Outlived Its Usefulness". The seminar presents evidence that diagnostic X rays (e.g., CT scans, mammograms, chest X-rays), elevated natural background radiation, and radon in our homes may be protecting us from cancer and possibly also from other diseases via activating cooperative protective processes. The protection is attributed to the low-LET component of the dose in case of radon and background radiation. I would be happy to e-mail the pdf version of the seminar to interested persons. Sincerely, Bobby R. Scott ________________________________ From: parthasarathy k s [mailto:ksparth at yahoo.co.uk] Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 7:08 PM To: John Jacobus; Scott, Bobby; radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: Comments on scientific papers must also be subjected to peer review Friends, I agree with John. Very few of us have the expertise in epidemiology to evaluate the comments. Even if we are experts, it is appropriate that the comments or any analysis should appear in open literature; ideally in the same journal. That way the authors of the original paper will get a chance to respond, even to re-analyse their data. This is not to dismiss the validity of the comments or analysis in the present instance. Regards, K.S.Parthasarathy Raja Ramanna fellow Department of Atomic Energy India From didi at tgi-sci.com Mon Dec 12 15:26:20 2005 From: didi at tgi-sci.com (=?ISO-8859-5?Q?Dimiter=20Popoff?=) Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2005 23:26:20 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Googling World Energy Reserves Message-ID: <20051212212620.16998.qmail@server318.com> Maury, I am not going to comment on the link you posted, but here is the bit of information I have: about 10 years ago, I knew from insiders that the costs per kWh at Kozloduy NPP were something between 1.5 and 2.5 cents (I just do not remember precisely). Now they are cheerfully selling us their product at >10 cents/kWh; just try asking about the costs and you'll be drowned in as much pointless babble as it takes to bore you away (I am sure this is the standard procedure not only here). Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ > -------Original Message------- > From: Maury Siskel > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Googling World Energy Reserves > Sent: Dec 12 '05 10:50 > > http://www.lewrockwell.com/walker/walker16.html > > Links to an interesting perspective of energy and especially nuclear > power. Wish I could correctly evaluate the validity or correctness of > the Walker's cited data, but that is beyond my knowledge. I am > convinced that energy prices include a very large fear/apprehension > premium and that there is no shortage (neither present nor prospective) > of energy raw materials (i.e., gas, coal, etc). > > I would like to read the opinions of others on this List who might be > inclined to comment. > Cheers, > Maury&Dog maurysis at ev1.net > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From kaleissa at kacst.edu.sa Mon Dec 12 16:04:40 2005 From: kaleissa at kacst.edu.sa (Khalid Aleissa) Date: Tue, 13 Dec 2005 01:04:40 +0300 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Spirulina plantensis Message-ID: <00b501c5ff68$0d1ccc80$9501810a@KALEISSA> I really want to know any experience of any radsafer about Spirulina plantensis and its behavior with heavy elements and Uranium. Also, if there is any DNA aberration observation in correlation with the uptake. Regards. Khalid Aleissa From loc at icx.net Mon Dec 12 16:17:04 2005 From: loc at icx.net (Susan Gawarecki) Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2005 17:17:04 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Conspiracy theory could be on right wavelength Message-ID: <439DF6E0.3000506@icx.net> I've seen a lot of material posted on RadSafe that would qualify for Goldacre's "Bad Science" column. Enjoy! Susan Conspiracy theory could be on right wavelength http://www.guardian.co.uk/life/badscience/ Ben Goldacre Saturday December 10, 2005 The Guardian The reason that I am so fabulously wealthy (girls) is, of course, that I am paid by the government and the pharmaceutical industry to rubbish alternative therapies and MMR conspiracy theorists, and so maintain what you humanities graduates like to call "the hegemony". After last week's excellent "magnetic wine improver" debunking I seem to be deluged with Bad Science projects being lined up for publication in academic journals. King among them all is On the Effectiveness of Aluminium Foil Helmets: An Empirical Study by Ali Rahimi et al, of the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. You will all doubtless be familiar with the use of radio signals by the government to monitor your thoughts and control your behaviour. Aluminium helmets and hat-linings have been recommended in the conspiracy theory community for many years as a protective measure against this government interference. However, although theoretically plausible, until now the foil hat had, surprisingly, never been experimentally validated. Rahimi et al have healed this gap using a network analyser and a directional antenna to calculate the ability of each of three aluminum helmet designs to reduce the strength of the radio signals entering the brains of a sample group of four individuals. The receiver antenna was placed at various places on the cranium of each experimental subject: over the frontal, occipital and parietal lobes. Measurements were taken, once with the helmet off, and once with the helmet on. As per best practice, the foil helmets were constructed with the double layering technique described elsewhere in the literature. The network analyser then plotted the amount by which the signal was attenuated - or reduced - by the foil hats, across a wide range of frequencies. Their results are more startling than anyone could possibly have predicted. Although the helmets did reduce the strength of the signal by around 10dB across most of the spectrum, there was an unexpected second finding: the helmets did in fact amplify signals, in certain very specific frequency ranges, by a huge 30dB at 2.6GHz, and by 20dB around 1.5GHz. What are those frequencies used for? I'll tell you. The 1.5GHz range coincides almost perfectly with frequencies allocated to the US government, between 1.2 Ghz and 1.4 Ghz. "According to the FCC," explain the authors, "these bands are supposedly reserved for 'radio location' (ie, GPS), and other communications with satellites." And what about the other frequency that's amplified into your brain? "The 2.6 Ghz band coincides with mobile phone technology. Though not affiliated by government, these bands are at the hands of multinational corporations." To the authors of the paper, the meaning of all this is very clear. "Statistical evidence suggests the use of helmets may in fact enhance the government's invasive abilities," they conclude. "We speculate that the government may in fact have started the helmet craze for this reason." To me, it's a lot simpler than that. This paper is itself a transparent attempt by the government to prevent us from taking simple and effective protective measures. Keep wearing the helmets. Unless, of course, what the alternative therapy conspiracy theorists say about me is true. ? Full references available at www.badscience.net Please send your bad science to bad.science at guardian.co.uk From Rainer.Facius at dlr.de Mon Dec 12 18:11:23 2005 From: Rainer.Facius at dlr.de (Rainer.Facius at dlr.de) Date: Tue, 13 Dec 2005 01:11:23 +0100 Subject: [ RadSafe ] "much sought after" Brazilian 70 mSv/a HBRA Message-ID: <1B5EBED4E01074419C07EEF9D3802FDA159030@exbe02.intra.dlr.de> Ballot by feet? "Additionally, the highest annual dose rate, 70 mSv, was found at Areia Preta beach (Guarapari) and the hazard indices reach about 350 times the limit recommended by OECD (1979). Guarapari and some sites of the south Esp?rito Santo State show towns built on the monazite sand region along the Atlantic coast in Brazil, which is one of the most widely known high background radiation areas in the world. The Areia Preta beach in Guarapari, which means black sand in Portuguese, is so much sought after by Brazilian people for their alleged benefits to health that they come from long distances to spend their vacations on the black sands." p. 195 Veiga R, Sanches N, Anjos R M, Macario K, Bastos J, Iguatemy M, Aguiar J G, Santos A M A, Mosquera B, Carvalho C, Baptista Filho M, Umisedo N K, Measurement of natural radioactivity in Brazilian beach sands. Radiation Measurements 41#2(2006)189-196 Regards, Rainer From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Tue Dec 13 10:36:45 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Tue, 13 Dec 2005 08:36:45 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Comments on scientific papers must also be subjected to peer review In-Reply-To: <5219BF1785792545A95B0401000AF6EF02C7B60D@neuvo.lobos.lrri.org> Message-ID: <20051213163645.53530.qmail@web54304.mail.yahoo.com> Dr. Scott, I hope you will keep us appraised of all responses that agree with and opposed to your letter on this article. --- "Scott, Bobby" wrote: > Colleagues: > > > > I plan to submit a letter to the editor of the JNCI > related to the paper > by E. Cardis et al. on thyroid cancer after the > Chernobyl accident. > > > > For readers of the Radsafe Digest that may have an > interest, I have a > pdf version of my seminar given on November 10, 2005 > at Los Alamos > National Laboratory entitled "The LNT Hypothesis May > Have Outlived Its > Usefulness". The seminar presents evidence that > diagnostic X rays > (e.g., CT scans, mammograms, chest X-rays), elevated > natural background > radiation, and radon in our homes may be protecting > us from cancer and > possibly also from other diseases via activating > cooperative protective > processes. The protection is attributed to the > low-LET component of the > dose in case of radon and background radiation. I > would be happy to > e-mail the pdf version of the seminar to interested > persons. > > > > Sincerely, > > Bobby R. Scott > > > > ________________________________ > > From: parthasarathy k s [mailto:ksparth at yahoo.co.uk] > > Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 7:08 PM > To: John Jacobus; Scott, Bobby; radsafe at radlab.nl > Subject: Comments on scientific papers must also be > subjected to peer > review > > > > Friends, > > I agree with John. Very few of us have the expertise > in epidemiology to > evaluate the comments. Even if we are experts, it > is appropriate that > the comments or any analysis should appear in open > literature; ideally > in the same journal. That way the authors of the > original paper will get > a chance to respond, even to re-analyse their data. > This is not to > dismiss the validity of the comments or analysis in > the present > instance. > +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From RadSafeInst at cableone.net Tue Dec 13 20:36:10 2005 From: RadSafeInst at cableone.net (RadSafeInst) Date: Tue, 13 Dec 2005 20:36:10 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Hormesis Message-ID: <004901c60057$24dd3770$7cc85c45@yourfulkl1oh2q> Thank you, Jim Muckerheide, for your work in support of sanity and science! I read your web page and skimmed your books on hormetic data today, and was amazed at the effort that required. Keep up your fight against LNT. If you don't mind, tell the list where they can get some of your material.................. Ed Battle From Tom_Johnston at nymc.edu Wed Dec 14 09:05:21 2005 From: Tom_Johnston at nymc.edu (Johnston, Thomas) Date: Wed, 14 Dec 2005 10:05:21 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Monitoring cadavers at Medical Schools Message-ID: <70C50B8807B54A429AC206E83A3BA6BC0B84D96C@mail.nymc.edu> Question? What procedure, if any, is in place to monitor cadavers upon arrival at your Medical School, for radioactive material? Thomas P. Johnston Radiation Safety Officer New York Medical College Valhalla, NY 10595 914-594-4448 office 914-594-3665 fax 914-557-5950 mobile tom_johnston at nymc.edu From lboing at anl.gov Wed Dec 14 09:38:38 2005 From: lboing at anl.gov (Boing, Lawrence E.) Date: Wed, 14 Dec 2005 09:38:38 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] (no subject) Message-ID: <637FE1FE13221C4F8BFC590A42B8478921C9DA@NE-EXCH.ne.anl.gov> Looking for the names of larger radioanalytical labs for environmental samples in the Las Vegas area. L Boing Lawrence E. (Larry) Boing Argonne National Laboratory 9700 South Cass Avenue Argonne, IL 60439 P-630.252.6729 F-630.252.7577 lboing at anl.gov http://www.dd.anl.gov/ http://www.orau.gov/ddsc/ From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Wed Dec 14 09:54:50 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Wed, 14 Dec 2005 07:54:50 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Monitoring cadavers at Medical Schools In-Reply-To: <70C50B8807B54A429AC206E83A3BA6BC0B84D96C@mail.nymc.edu> Message-ID: <20051214155450.71139.qmail@web54304.mail.yahoo.com> Tom, First, check the chart. We had a cadaver that had I-125 prostate seed implants. (It was the first we have had with implants.) They started to remove the organs when they found "these little particles in the prostate." The corpse had the implants 2 years, as noted in the medical chart, before he died and was shipped to us. We supplied the morgue with a thin-window NaI probe and meter, but I would not swear they check each cadaver. --- "Johnston, Thomas" wrote: > Question? > > What procedure, if any, is in place to monitor > cadavers upon arrival at > your Medical School, for radioactive material? > > > > > > Thomas P. Johnston > > Radiation Safety Officer > > New York Medical College > > Valhalla, NY 10595 > > 914-594-4448 office > > 914-594-3665 fax > > 914-557-5950 mobile > > tom_johnston at nymc.edu > > +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From james at bovik.org Wed Dec 14 14:37:05 2005 From: james at bovik.org (James Salsman) Date: 14 Dec 2005 20:37:05 -0000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] where to refer birth defect victims? Message-ID: <20051214203705.11097.qmail@bovik.org> > From: im4gbayp at yahoo.com > Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 8:37 AM > >... Our son-in-law served in Desert Storm and was exposed to several > chemicals. On his return home we all were concerns about the > chemicals he was exposed to, exposed to several chemicals - I can't > recall all the types. > > Our 1st granddaughter, born 1992, was born with a very small hole in > her spine, showed no other effects of her dads exposer to chemicals. > Our 2st granddaughter, born 1993, was born with a very smal hole in > her spine, showed no other effects of her dads exposer to chemicals. > We were aware of Vet's children born with Spina Bifida, parent who > served in Desert Storm. > > My request to all Vets now is: > > Our 1st granddaughter, born 1992 - now 13, has been diagnosed with > Childhood soft tissue sarcoma, the very rare type. I've been search > the web for any and all information about this cancer. I came across > a small article related to Desert Storm Vets & chemical exposer and > their children developing cancers, there was a small piece that > mentioned soft tissue Sarcoma. Doctors, Cancer Research Hospitals etc > have been working hard on this cancer - very little information is > known about this rare cancer. > > "Please" does any Vet have ANY information on Vet's children and > cancers and can provide us links. > > We don't have much time, she is seriously ill, will be under going > Chemo and radiation very soon. > > Please sent links to my e-mail address: im4gbayp at yahoo.com. If you > are aware of other families please forward this request. > > Please keep Destiny in your prayers, we love her so very much. She is > a good child - loved by family, friends, neighbors, teachers, her > doctors. She helps other's always, mentor to LD children, never curl > to others. She does not speak about her illness, does not want to > worry others. > > Note: my husband - Destiny's papa, retired from the US Army, served > mostly out of Ft.Campbell 22 years, in 1990. > > Thank you for taking time to read this, Thank you for any information > that can be sent to us. > > Destiny's grandmother Perhaps Drs. Johnson and Parkhurst should be required to sort this all out? Or maybe, as Dr. Rabbe has suggested, the public should not have access to such information because we might misinterpret it. http://www.annalsofepidemiology.org/article/PIIS1047279701002459/abstract Sincerely, James Salsman From frantaj at aecl.ca Thu Dec 15 09:31:06 2005 From: frantaj at aecl.ca (Franta, Jaroslav) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 10:31:06 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] " Port Hope responds to LLRW survey " Message-ID: <0F8BD87EE693D411A1A500508BAC86F70B4F5273@sps13.aecl.ca> Port Hope responds to LLRW survey Port Hope Evening Guide, Tue 13 Dec 2005 Karen Lloyd To most Port Hope residents, low-level radioactive waste is still the biggest issue facing their community. But according to the results of a public attitude survey conducted in October, which polled 351 Ward 1 and Ward 2 residents, the public is more confident than ever that historic waste can be managed safely for the long term. The results also show a marked increase in awareness of the Port Hope Area Initiative, says project communications officer Sue Stickley. "We got a very good response to the calls," she said, pointing out that unlike the previous three annual surveys, many people were willing and eager to respond. The survey, conducted by IntelliPulse, a public affairs and marketing research firm, engaged by the the Low-Level Radioactive Waste Management Office (LLRWMO) made 2,455 calls to get the number of responses it required. The first public attitudes survey conducted in 2001 required pollsters to call more 10,000 residents in order to get 500 responses. "Fewer calls to conduct a survey is indicative that people are becoming more and more confident and aware," said Ms. Stickley. In fact 79 per cent of them said they knew at least something about radioactive waste in their community. Yet living in a community dealing with LLRW is not something many residents, less than 30 per cent, appear to dwell on. But not dwelling on the issue doesn't mean they do not consider it important. Similar to 2004, 29 per cent of them identify the presence of this historic waste as a key issue facing the community. The same percentage feels it contributes to a negative image. However, satisfaction with living in Port Hope remains high. Over 90 per cent of those polled report being very or somewhat satisfied with living here. They say it's a quiet community with friendly people. They enjoy the scenery, and say the downtown area is "wonderful." When asked what they liked least about the community, some said the presence of LLRW. But concerns also included taxes, their proximity to Northumberland Hills Hospital located in Cobourg and according to one respondent, "There's nothing I don't like about it." While confident that the waste can be safely managed at the proposed facility -- located north of Highway 401 west of Baulch road -- they still have concerns that include, the proximity of community, the transportation of the waste and whether the management site will safely store the waste. One person said, "I don't have any fears about it. We're all going to go sometime." Another person said, "The next generation could forget about it or neglect it and things will start to corrode." The most frequently mentioned concerns relate to public health and safety, transportation, protection against environmental contamination and safely containing the waste. The purpose of this annual survey is to find out how knowledgeable residents are about the initiative to manage the waste, to identify and track public issues and concerns and to assess the LLRWMO's performance in meeting the community's needs. The results of the survey will be studied by LLRWMO staff and applied to community programs and newsletters to better inform residents. "We want to deal with the issues the public is interested," said Ms. Stickley, adding they want to be informed, they want the facility, when it's built, to be monitored, and they want to continue to provide the the LLRWMO with their input. Analysis of the survey responses indicates that the more knowledgeable people are, the more confident they are about the project, and keeping them informed is exactly what the LLRWMO intends to do. Over the past four years, more and more residents appear to feel the LLRWMO does a "very good" or "good" job of addressing their questions. Over four-fifths of the respondents said they are satisfied with the accessibility of the information and the manner in which they are able to provide input. Eighty-five per cent say their input was considered at least partially by the LLRWMO. The poll also found that both the LLRWMO and independent scientists are the preferred sources for reliable information about the Port Hope Area Initiative. The complete public attitude surveys can be reviewed at the new location of the Project Information Exchange at 196 Toronto Road in Port Hope. From 1 to 5 p.m. Monday to Friday visitors can drop-in, discuss their views and pick up information on the Port Hope Area Initiative. CONFIDENTIAL AND PRIVILEGED INFORMATION NOTICE This e-mail, and any attachments, may contain information that is confidential, subject to copyright, or exempt from disclosure. Any unauthorized review, disclosure, retransmission, dissemination or other use of or reliance on this information may be unlawful and is strictly prohibited. AVIS D'INFORMATION CONFIDENTIELLE ET PRIVIL?GI?E Le pr?sent courriel, et toute pi?ce jointe, peut contenir de l'information qui est confidentielle, r?gie par les droits d'auteur, ou interdite de divulgation. Tout examen, divulgation, retransmission, diffusion ou autres utilisations non autoris?es de l'information ou d?pendance non autoris?e envers celle-ci peut ?tre ill?gale et est strictement interdite. From didi at tgi-sci.com Thu Dec 15 09:34:17 2005 From: didi at tgi-sci.com (=?ISO-8859-5?Q?Dimiter=20Popoff?=) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 17:34:17 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Wikipedia survives research test Message-ID: <20051215153417.30996.qmail@server318.com> Somewhat off topic, but recently there was a thread on that, perhaps it will be of some interest. The free online resource Wikipedia is about as accurate on science as the Encyclopedia Britannica, a study shows. The British journal Nature examined a range of scientific entries on both works of reference and found few differences in accuracy. Wikipedia is produced by volunteers, who add entries and edit any page. But it has been criticised for the correctness of entries, most recently over the biography of prominent US journalist John Seigenthaler. ...... Full text at http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/4530930.stm Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Thu Dec 15 09:33:58 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 07:33:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Article: Australian law could force nuclear dump on territory Message-ID: <20051215153358.296.qmail@web54304.mail.yahoo.com> >From Nature Nature 438, 902 (15 December 2005) at http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v438/n7070/full/438902a.html Australian law could force nuclear dump on territory Australia has moved closer to selecting a permanent site for the nation's first nuclear waste dump. On 8 December, the Australian government passed legislation allowing the facility to be built at one of three sites in the Northern Territory. The decision has angered local communities and indigenous people's groups, and follows years of wrangling between federal and state governments over where to put the site. State political pressure killed an earlier proposal to house the facility in South Australia. The new federal legislation will overrule any opposition from the Northern Territory government. The site will serve as a repository for nuclear waste from agencies such as the Australian Nuclear Science and Technology Organisation, which runs the country's only nuclear reactor near Sydney. Australia's nuclear waste is currently stored in universities, hospitals and research facilities across the country. +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Thu Dec 15 10:43:12 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 08:43:12 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Press Release: 220 Radioactive Sources Removed From Georgia School Message-ID: <20051215164312.75782.qmail@web54315.mail.yahoo.com> This was pointed out to me through another list server. The whole body irradiator where I worked was orginially loaded with 320,000 Ci of Co-60. NNSA Press Release - 220 Radioactive Sources Removed >From Georgia College http://www.nnsa.doe.gov/docs/newsreleases/2005/PR_2005-12-13_NA-05-33.htm ========== FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE December 13, 2005 220 Radioactive Sources Removed From Georgia School Material that could have been be used for "dirty bombs" is now safe and secure WASHINGTON, D.C. - The National Nuclear Security Administration (NNSA) announced today the removal of 68,000 curies of radioactive cobalt-60 from the Neally Nuclear Research Center at the Georgia Institute of Technology campus in downtown Atlanta. The successful operation was recently completed and the material has been secured. The 220 sealed sources of cobalt-60 were recovered in three separate loads by the Los Alamos National Laboratory (LANL) for NNSA's Global Threat Reduction Initiative (GTRI) program and sent to the Nevada Test Site for permanent disposal. The material had been used by the school for research in the fields of materials science, genetics, radiation shielding, and biological materials processing, and was housed in a 15-foot deep pool that provided shielding. Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory also provided support for the operation. NNSA Administrator Linton F. Brooks commended the operation, saying it was important to keep dirty bomb material safe and secure from terrorists. "It is critical to our national security efforts that excess and unwanted radiological sources be disposed of in a responsible manner. Together, NNSA and two of our national laboratories have safely disposed of material from Georgia Tech that could have been used for dirty bombs. We will continue aggressively working to keep this kind of material out of the hands of terrorists," he said. One of NNSA's top priorities is removing and securing materials that pose a safety hazard and national security risk. To date, NNSA has recovered almost 12,000 radiation sources and placed them in safe and secure storage away from the public and environmentally sensitive areas. The effort is managed by the LANL Nuclear Nonproliferation Division. Following the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, the Bush administration accelerated the recovery of unwanted radioactive sources and material that could be used to make a dirty bomb. LANL supports the GTRI program by assisting in the recovery and disposition of excess, unwanted, and/or abandoned radioactive sealed sources and other radioactive material. Sources containing radioactive plutonium, americium, cesium, cobalt and strontium have been recovered from medical, agricultural, research and industrial locations throughout the nation. Established by Congress in 2000, NNSA is a semi-autonomous agency within the U.S. Department of Energy responsible for enhancing national security through the military application of nuclear energy. NNSA maintains and enhances the safety, security, reliability and performance of the U.S. nuclear weapons stockpile without nuclear testing; works to reduce global danger from weapons of mass destruction; provides the U.S. Navy with safe and effective nuclear propulsion; and responds to nuclear and radiological emergencies in the U.S. and abroad. Media Contacts: Bryan Wilkes, NNSA (202) 586-7371 Release No. NA-05-33 ===== +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From frantaj at aecl.ca Thu Dec 15 11:46:08 2005 From: frantaj at aecl.ca (Franta, Jaroslav) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 12:46:08 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] AGR fuel dimensions ? Message-ID: <0F8BD87EE693D411A1A500508BAC86F70B4F5279@sps13.aecl.ca> Hello, Would someone please send me the dimensions (overall, pin diameter, etc.) for British AGR reactor fuel ? Thanks in advance. Jaro Franta, P.Eng. Tel.: (514) 875-3444 Montr?al, Qu?bec frantaj at aecl.ca <><><><><><><><><><><> CONFIDENTIAL AND PRIVILEGED INFORMATION NOTICE This e-mail, and any attachments, may contain information that is confidential, subject to copyright, or exempt from disclosure. Any unauthorized review, disclosure, retransmission, dissemination or other use of or reliance on this information may be unlawful and is strictly prohibited. AVIS D'INFORMATION CONFIDENTIELLE ET PRIVIL?GI?E Le pr?sent courriel, et toute pi?ce jointe, peut contenir de l'information qui est confidentielle, r?gie par les droits d'auteur, ou interdite de divulgation. Tout examen, divulgation, retransmission, diffusion ou autres utilisations non autoris?es de l'information ou d?pendance non autoris?e envers celle-ci peut ?tre ill?gale et est strictement interdite. From Gerald.Rood at shawgrp.com Thu Dec 15 12:33:29 2005 From: Gerald.Rood at shawgrp.com (Rood, Gerald) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 12:33:29 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Employment Opportunity Message-ID: <298F12649A19A1409E97F864573090B0C74AC3@entbtrxmb02.shawgrp.com> Shaw Environmental and Infrastructure, Inc., a subsidiary of The Shaw Group, Inc., is a leading, full-service, environmental and facilities management firm that recognizes that it takes a group of highly talented and motivated individuals working together to achieve the kind of outstanding results we continue to accomplish through technical quality. We are currently seeking the following in our St. Louis, MO offices: Project Scientist 3 - Reference # 129621 Position summary: This individual will direct the radiation protection foreman and technicians in the implementation of the site radiological protection program at a project in St. Louis. This individual will be accountable to ensure that work is conducted in accordance with the Site Safety and Health Plan, site Radiological Work Instructions, U.S. Army Corps of Engineers requirements, and the requirements of 10CFR20. This individual must possess good communication and organizational skills, must be flexible and receptive to change, be willing to act as a mentor to employees under their direction, and be capable of motivating others by example. Requirements: The ideal candidate will possess a Bachelor of Science degree in health physics, environmental science, or engineering; and a minimum of four years experience in the implementation of an operational health physics program. This individual should also possess experience in the remediation of radioactively-contaminated soils, MARSSIM radiation survey and soil sampling protocols, and the use of GIS equipment and associated software. You can go directly to the position description, by cutting & pasting the below link into your browser: http://www.recruitingsite.com/csbsites/shaweandi/JobDescription.asp?Site ID=10175&JobNumber=129621 Shaw Environmental & Infrastructure, Inc. offers competitive starting salaries and an attractive benefits package. Please forward your resume via our website at www.shawgrp.com select the Careers tab, Shaw E & I Career Opportunities, search on Ref. No.1296211. EEO M/F/D/V. Gerald J. Rood Project Radiation Safety Officer Shaw Environmental and Infrastructure, Inc. 110 James S. McDonnell Blvd. Hazelwood, MO 63042 314.895.2262 direct 314.565.6352 cell 314.895-2200 fax ----------------------------------------- *****************Internet Email Confidentiality Footer****************** Privileged/Confidential Information may be contained in this message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this message (or responsible for delivery of the message to such person), you may not copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, you should destroy this message and notify the sender by reply email. Please advise immediately if you or your employer do not consent to Internet email for messages of this kind. Opinions, conclusions and other information in this message that do not relate to the official business of The Shaw Group Inc. or its subsidiaries shall be understood as neither given nor endorsed by it. _______________________________________________________________________ _ The Shaw Group Inc. http://www.shawgrp.com From cobdw at tds.net Thu Dec 15 14:09:20 2005 From: cobdw at tds.net (cobdw at tds.net) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 20:09:20 +0000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Prep class for CHP EXAM Message-ID: <20051215200920.FZXF23063.outaamta02.mail.tds.net@smtp.tds.net> I am interested in attending a prep class for Part 1 of the CHP Exam. Any information leading me to where I may attend such a class would be greatly appreciated. I currently reside near Oak Ridge, TN so the closer the better but I will travel for the class. Thank you in advance, Douglas Coble Project Manager Chase Environmental Group Knoxville, TN dcoble at chaseenv.com From JGinniver at aol.com Thu Dec 15 14:58:31 2005 From: JGinniver at aol.com (JGinniver at aol.com) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 15:58:31 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Press Release: 220 Radioactive Sources Removed From Georgia S... Message-ID: <19a.42331e8f.30d332f7@aol.com> >From recent investigations into the properties of Co-60 sources It would appear that these sources were pieces of neutron activated metal. Does anyone have a feel for how easy it is to vaporise these in an explosion? If they can't be vaporised there is little risk of an inhalation hazard from a "dirty bomb" containing these sources. Instead there would be shards of metal that would be easy to identify and remove. The real risk of injury to the public would have been from explosion I would have thought that the greatest risk from terrorists obtaining these sources would be if they could expose them for a prolonged period of time in a public area without anyone knowing. But given that their loss would have been noted, the chance of exposing them for an extended period would have been small as they would have been easy to detect using airborne or ground based systems. While I do think that it appropriate to dispose of redundant sources to a suitable facility and in a timely fashion, I don't think that these types of sources are the greatest risk for dirty bombs, and it isn't helpful to suggest that they are. Any thoughts? Julian From Jim_Hardeman at dnr.state.ga.us Thu Dec 15 15:52:27 2005 From: Jim_Hardeman at dnr.state.ga.us (Jim Hardeman) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 16:52:27 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Press Release: 220 Radioactive Sources Removed From Georgia S... Message-ID: Julian et al. I don't think vaporization would have been the problem. We DID do some analyses prior to the 1996 Olympic Games in Atlanta that indicated that a small, determined hostile force (don't want to say too much here, but along the lines of what was specified in DBT at the time) could have caused an incident that would have ejected some of the sources from the pool and/or caused the pool water (i.e. the shielding) to go away. Due to the radiation levels, it is doubtful that anyone could have just walked out with one of these sources ... they probably wouldn't have walked too far before CNS set in. IMHO, the homeland security aspects of this source removal were greatly overplayed. The source removal was a pre-planned part of the decommissioning of the Neely (Nuclear) Research Center in anticipation of its demolition. My $0.02 worth ... Jim Hardeman, Manager Environmental Radiation Program Environmental Protection Division Georgia Department of Natural Resources 4220 International Parkway, Suite 100 Atlanta, GA 30354 (404) 362-2675 Fax: (404) 362-2653 E-mail: Jim_Hardeman at dnr.state.ga.us >>> 12/15/2005 15:58:31 >>> >From recent investigations into the properties of Co-60 sources It would appear that these sources were pieces of neutron activated metal. Does anyone have a feel for how easy it is to vaporise these in an explosion? If they can't be vaporised there is little risk of an inhalation hazard from a "dirty bomb" containing these sources. Instead there would be shards of metal that would be easy to identify and remove. The real risk of injury to the public would have been from explosion I would have thought that the greatest risk from terrorists obtaining these sources would be if they could expose them for a prolonged period of time in a public area without anyone knowing. But given that their loss would have been noted, the chance of exposing them for an extended period would have been small as they would have been easy to detect using airborne or ground based systems. While I do think that it appropriate to dispose of redundant sources to a suitable facility and in a timely fashion, I don't think that these types of sources are the greatest risk for dirty bombs, and it isn't helpful to suggest that they are. Any thoughts? Julian _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au Thu Dec 15 15:00:53 2005 From: Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au (Rogers Brent) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 08:00:53 +1100 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Wikipedia survives research test Message-ID: Just to add my own anecdotal experience, I recently Googled "Pebble Bed Reactor", out of intellectual curiosity, and chose the Wikipedia entry for it. Although I can't vouch for the accuracy of the article (I was just learning the info myself), I did find it to be very useful. It was written in what I consider to be that right balance of not being overly scholarly, yet not dumbed down either. In other word, just right if you want to gain useful knowledge without being confronted with differential equations. I have, and will continue to recommend the article to people wanting to learn more about this new reactor technology. Brent Rogers Manager Radiation Operations Unit NSW Environment Protection Authority Department of Environment and Conservation *+61 2 9995 5986 *+61 2 9995 6603 * PO Box A290 Sydney South 1232 -----Original Message----- From: Dimiter Popoff [mailto:didi at tgi-sci.com] Sent: Friday, 16 December 2005 2:34 AM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] Wikipedia survives research test Somewhat off topic, but recently there was a thread on that, perhaps it will be of some interest. The free online resource Wikipedia is about as accurate on science as the Encyclopedia Britannica, a study shows. The British journal Nature examined a range of scientific entries on both works of reference and found few differences in accuracy. Wikipedia is produced by volunteers, who add entries and edit any page. But it has been criticised for the correctness of entries, most recently over the biography of prominent US journalist John Seigenthaler. ...... Full text at http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/4530930.stm Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ This email is intended for the addressee(s) named and may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then delete it immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of the individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority states them to be the views of the Department of Environment and Conservation (NSW). From royherren2005 at yahoo.com Thu Dec 15 19:04:15 2005 From: royherren2005 at yahoo.com (ROY HERREN) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 17:04:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Slightly off subject article...DOE Atmospheric Radiation Measurement program mobile facility moves to Niger Message-ID: <20051216010415.37908.qmail@web81611.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Public release date: 15-Dec-2005 Contact: Chris Burroughs coburro at sandia.gov 505-844-0948 DOE/Sandia National Laboratories DOE Atmospheric Radiation Measurement program mobile facility moves to Niger Sandia researcher Mark Ivey spends a week in Africa on site survey for climate monitoring equipmentAfter a six-month stint taking cloud and aerosol measurements at Point Reyes National Seashore on the California coast, a mobile suite of climate monitoring equipment was moved to Niamey, Niger, in October for a year's deployment there. Going along to help survey the site and prepare for the deployment of the climate monitoring equipment was Sandia National Laboratories engineer Mark Ivey, who spent a week in the West African country. Sandia is a National Nuclear Security Administration lab. ARM - for Atmospheric Radiation Measurement - is the largest global climate change research program supported by the U.S. Department of Energy (DOE). It was created in 1989 as part of the Global Change Research Program to help resolve scientific uncertainties related to global change, focusing on the role of clouds. ARM has three permanent research sites around the globe, plus the ARM Mobile Facility (AMF) that recently was deployed to Niger. "This is the mobile unit's second deployment," Ivey says. "For the next year, the ARM Mobile Facility will be measuring cloud properties, solar and thermal radiation, and meteorological conditions at the surface." He adds that a multi-national experiment is investigating how mineral dust from the Sahara and biomass burning play a role in the West African monsoon and the climate in general. The belief is that these aerosols, as well as deep tropical convection in the sub-Saharan wet season, have a big impact on climate in that region, and possibly well beyond Africa. "This experiment will help us better understand how solar and thermal radiation are transferred in the atmosphere when deep convection and aerosols are present," Ivey says. While the mobile unit will be taking climate measurements on the ground, a European satellite positioned over the Sahara will be taking them from the sky. The combined measurements will provide the first well-sampled, direct estimates of changes of solar and thermal radiation across the atmosphere. The mobile unit will also be used to study the impact of clouds, aerosol, and water vapor on the surface. Niger is one of the hottest countries in the world, with heat so intense that it often causes rain to evaporate before it hits the ground. Ivey calls the Sahara "the biggest dust aerosol generator on the planet." Teams from the participating organizations will be spending time at the research site on a rotating basis. A program technician will be there for more than a year to take care of the equipment and work with local meteorological observers. Ivey, a member of the first rotation team, arrived in Niamey, Niger's capital, on Oct. 11, three days after a chartered 747 jumbo jet carrying the equipment landed at the airport. The AMF equipment includes seven containers, each 8 feet tall, 8 feet wide, between 12 and 20 feet long, and 5,000-10,000 pounds. One extra container with equipment will arrive in January. A separate container for batteries and other types of potentially hazardous materials was shipped from California to Niger, taking 12 weeks to get there by sea. The mobile unit has its own power generation, communication system, and state-of-the-art climate measurement instrumentation. Ivey worked closely with colleagues at Los Alamos National Laboratory in planning the Niger deployment. His involvement in the ARM Program dates back to the late 1990s when he led a team at Sandia that designed, built, and integrated ARCS - Atmospheric Radiation and Cloud Stations. The ARCS systems are still used at the Tropical Western Pacific ARM sites, and two ARCS vans were included in the AMF deployment in Niger. Among Ivey's responsibilities as part of the first working team at the Niger sites was the on-site electrical engineering expertise required to install and operate the Mobile Facility. The U.S. Embassy in Niamey assisted with obtaining the formal procurement contracts required for local communications, utility, and meteorological support services. ARM players The Atmospheric Radiation Measurement (ARM) Mobile Unit is part of the African Monsoon Multidisciplinary Analysis (AMMA) research program that is scheduled to be in Niger for seven years. However, the ARM unit will be there only one year to support a Department of Energy-funded experiment called RADAGAST, short for Radiative Atmospheric Divergence using the ARM Mobile Facility, GERB Data, and AMMA Stations. The principal investigator for RADAGAST is Anthony Slingo from the University of Reading in the UK. The ARM team includes science colleagues from DOE national laboratories Sandia, Los Alamos, Pacific Northwest (PNNL), Argonne, and Brookhaven; the Australian Bureau of Meteorology; and several other countries. PNNL initially designed and built the mobile unit, then turned the completed unit over to LANL for deployment. Sandia is handling engineering issues related to operations. The ARM program is funded through DOE's Office of Science. ARM facilities The DOE Atmospheric Radiation Measurement (ARM) Program established permanent instrumented research sites at three locales around the world for studying cloud formation and their influence on climate. Recently designated as "user facilities" by DOE, the ARM Climate Research Facility is now available to visiting scientists for experimentation. The three regional sites include the Southern Great Plains site near the Oklahoma/Kansas border; the Tropical Western Pacific locale consisting of sites at Darwin, Australia, Manus Island, Papua New Guinea, and Nauru Island; and the North Slope of Alaska sites at Barrow and Atqasuk. There is no fee for scientists using the facilities or data. However, to qualify for ARM funding for any incremental costs associated with an experiment, they must submit proposals to the ACRF Science Board, which reviews the proposals based on scientific merit and the feasibility and costs associated with using the facility. The board then provides recommendations to DOE for a final decision. ### Sandia is a multiprogram laboratory operated by Sandia Corporation, a Lockheed Martin company, for the U.S. Department of Energy's National Nuclear Security Administration. With main facilities in Albuquerque, N.M., and Livermore, Calif., Sandia has major R&D responsibilities in national security, energy and environmental technologies, and economic competitiveness. Release and image are available at http://www.sandia.gov/news-center/news-releases/2005/environ-waste-mgmt/arm.html Sandia media contact: Chris Burroughs, coburro at sandia.gov, (505) 844-0948 Sandia technical contact: Mark Ivey, mdivey at sandia.gov, (505) 284-9092 Sandia National Laboratories' World Wide Web home page is located at http://www.sandia.gov. Sandia news releases, news tips, science photo gallery, and periodicals can be found at the News Center button. --------------------------------- Roy Herren --------------------------------- Yahoo! Shopping Find Great Deals on Holiday Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping From wesvanpelt at att.net Thu Dec 15 20:37:23 2005 From: wesvanpelt at att.net (Wesley) Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 21:37:23 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Wikipedia survives research test In-Reply-To: Message-ID: All, I have made much use of www.Wikipedia.com , and find it quite accurate. As a hobby, I have been reading about cosmology, general relativity, string theory, etc. For example, the wiki site below seems very authentic to me. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_relativity Best regards, Wes Wesley R. Van Pelt, PhD, CIH, CHP Wesley R. Van Pelt Associates, Inc. ................ The free online resource Wikipedia is about as accurate on science as the Encyclopedia Britannica, a study shows. The British journal Nature examined a range of scientific entries on both works of reference and found few differences in accuracy. Wikipedia is produced by volunteers, who add entries and edit any page. But it has been criticised for the correctness of entries, most recently over the biography of prominent US journalist John Seigenthaler. ...... From Bill.Garner at ky.gov Fri Dec 16 08:16:49 2005 From: Bill.Garner at ky.gov (Garner, Bill (CHFS DPH Franklin)) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 09:16:49 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Blast at Russian Nuclear Plant Kills One Message-ID: <0F75F9887A43FE4A9CCE712A74AD19D3027BCB73@agency29.eas.ds.ky.gov> Blast at Russian Nuclear Plant Kills One By IRINA TITOVA, Associated Press Writer 33 minutes ago An explosion at a Russian nuclear power plant complex killed one worker and badly hurt two others, but Russia's nuclear agency said Friday no reactors were affected. The Rosenergoatom agency said radiation levels remained normal as the reactor in that part of the Leningrad nuclear plant was undergoing repairs and was not in operation. But Thursday's blast threw a spotlight on what environmentalists called uncontrolled operations at Russian nuclear sites. The blast happened in a smelter at the plant in the closed nuclear town of Sosnovy Bor, 50 miles west of the northern city of St. Petersburg. The smelter is operated by Ekomet-S, a company reprocessing scrap metal. "The enterprise ... functions illegally because there was no mandatory (state) environmental impact assessment on its construction," Dmitry Artamonov, head of the St. Petersburg branch of Greenpeace, told The Associated Press. He said Greenpeace had complained against Ekomet-S to the Sosnovy Bor prosecutors' office but it took no action. The nuclear plant has four units, or reactors, in all. Rosenergoatom said that the smelter was on the grounds of the plant's second unit, and plant spokesman Sergei Averyanov said it was about half a mile from the reactor. Oleg Bodrov, a physicist who heads the Green World ecological group in Sosnovy Bor, said that the reactor was only some 700 yards from the smelter, which is about 50 yards from a liquid radioactive waste pond. A 33-year-old worker died of his injuries Friday morning, and two others were injured, Yuri Lameko, chief doctor of the Sosnovy Bor hospital, told the AP. "There were no violations of safety levels and operating conditions of the energy units of the Leningrad nuclear plant," Rosenergoatom said in a statement. The second unit had been shut down for planned major repairs in July, it said. The plant spokesman, Averyanov, said that the blast had caused molten metal to spurt out of the smelter. Usually Ekomet-S reprocesses scrap with low levels of radioactivity, but on Thursday the metal was clear of radiation, Averyanov said. He blamed the blast on violations of technical and production rules. Bodrov said Ekomet-S began operating two years ago and was in violation of the law since it had undergone no state environmental impact assessment. When the firm was founded, the only environmental monitoring laboratory in the town of 65,000 was shut down for lack of funding, he said. "There is no independent environmental monitoring in the nuclear city of Sosnovy Bor," Bodrov said. He said this was the second accident to occur at Ekomet-S. The first happened in summer 2003, injuring some workers. In March 1992, an accident at the Sosnovy Bor plant caused radioactive gases and iodine to be leaked into the air, according to nuclear watchdog groups. One of the reactors at the 30-year-old plant is of the same type as the one at the Chernobyl nuclear power plant that exploded in Soviet Ukraine in 1986 in the world's worst nuclear accident. The station is the main supplier of electricity to St. Petersburg, and there are plans to transport some of its power to Finland. Sosnovy Bor, a center of nuclear technology, was founded 25 years ago and has 60,000 people. In addition to the nuclear plant, the town is home to a regional radioactive waste reservoir, and an experimental laboratory and training center for nuclear submarines. Almost everyone in Sosnovy Bor, which means Pine Forest, is connected with nuclear technology, and most are not native to the region. In an unrelated development, Chechen prosecutors said they have opened a criminal investigation into the improper storage of radioactive waste by a state-owned company, Prosecutors said a "catastrophic radioactivity situation" had developed at the Grozny Chemical Factory in the breakaway province in southern Russia. Grozny is Chechnya's capital. Radiation levels at one storage center at the plant are 58,000 times higher than normal, the Russian Prosecutor General's office said Friday. "It's a threat to the population because the leadership of the plant is taking no steps whatsoever to remove the radioactive material or isolate access to the plant," Chechen Prosecutor Valery Kuznetsov said. Copyright (c) 2005 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. The information contained in the AP News report may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed without the prior written authority of The Associated Press. Bill Garner Radioactive Materials Specialist Radioactive Materials Section Radiation Health Branch 275 East Main Street Mailstop HS1CA Frankfort, Kentucky 40621 502-564-3700 EXT. 4515 Fax: 502-564-1492 This e-mail including any attachments, is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential information that is legally privileged and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified that any review, use, disclosure, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. <> From mcnaught at lanl.gov Fri Dec 16 08:34:06 2005 From: mcnaught at lanl.gov (Michael McNaughton) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 07:34:06 -0700 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Wikipedia survives research test In-Reply-To: <200512160324.jBG3O0Q0011731@proofpoint2.lanl.gov> References: <200512160324.jBG3O0Q0011731@proofpoint2.lanl.gov> Message-ID: <6.0.0.22.2.20051216072940.022352c8@esh-mail.lanl.gov> At 07:37 PM 12/15/2005, Wesley wrote: >I have made much use of www.Wikipedia.com , >and find it quite accurate. I suggest the "depleted uranium" entry would benefit from contributions by Radsafe subscribers. mike Mike McNaughton Los Alamos National Lab. email: mcnaught at LANL.gov or mcnaughton at LANL.gov phone: 505-667-6130; page: 505-664-7733 From rstrickert at signaturescience.com Fri Dec 16 09:06:42 2005 From: rstrickert at signaturescience.com (Strickert, Rick) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 09:06:42 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Blast at Russian Nuclear Plant Kills One Message-ID: <7D5C72A07835EB4085063AD8555F05DE01211C1B@ss-mail2.corp.signaturescience.com> Inside the AP report: "The blast happened in a smelter at the plant... Rosenergoatom said that the smelter was on the grounds of the plant's second unit, and plant spokesman Sergei Averyanov said it was about half a mile from the reactor." Another posting (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,178896,00.html) of the AP report included the agency's claim that the second unit was shut down for major repairs in July. Now if a toilet at the smelter had backed up, the AP article could have included "area highly contaminated" in its sensationalist headline. Rick Strickert Austin, TX From Jim_Hardeman at dnr.state.ga.us Fri Dec 16 10:03:39 2005 From: Jim_Hardeman at dnr.state.ga.us (Jim Hardeman) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 11:03:39 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Documentation request Message-ID: Colleagues * Does anybody out there have a manual for an Eberline MS-3 mini scaler, preferably in a form (PDF) that can be e-mailed? Thanks! Jim Hardeman, Manager Environmental Radiation Program Environmental Protection Division Georgia Department of Natural Resources 4220 International Parkway, Suite 100 Atlanta, GA 30354 (404) 362-2675 Fax: (404) 362-2653 E-mail: Jim_Hardeman at dnr.state.ga.us From didi at tgi-sci.com Fri Dec 16 11:54:15 2005 From: didi at tgi-sci.com (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Dimiter=20Popoff?=) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 19:54:15 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Radiation alert at Chechen plant Message-ID: <20051216175415.1479.qmail@server318.com> Actually I see this report as yet another example of how this should not be done - 58000 times, "at one place" (how big a place?), "in Chernobyl" (where exactly in Chernobyl?) etc. ----- Prosecutors in Chechnya have opened a criminal investigation after finding "catastrophic" levels of radioactivity at a chemical factory. Investigators say the radiation - in one place reportedly 58,000 times the usual level - poses a danger to people in the region's capital, Grozny. The case has also raised fears militants could take radioactive waste to use in a so-called "dirty bomb". The plant has reportedly not been secured since Russia bombed it in 1999. For years, rebels in Chechnya have been fighting a separatist struggle against Russian forces. They have been blamed for bomb attacks on airliners in Moscow, and the deadly sieges at a school in Beslan, North Ossetia, and in a Moscow theatre. 'No safety steps' Chechen prosecutors say radioactive materials have been improperly stored at the Grozny Chemical Factory, run by the Chechen Oil and Chemical Industry, and that a "catastrophic radioactivity situation" has developed. "It's a threat to the population because the leadership of the plant is taking no steps whatsoever to remove the radioactive material or isolate access to the plant," prosecutor Valery Kuznetsov said on Friday, according to the Associated Press. The Russian prosecutor general's office said between 27 and 29 radioactive elements had been identified at the plant, with the cobalt-60 isotope considered particularly dangerous. Radioactive materials have a variety of uses in the manufacturing industry. If not disposed of properly, they can pose a serious threat to people nearby. The radioactive cloud released by the explosion at the Chernobyl nuclear plant in Ukraine in 1986 may be responsible for 4,000 deaths, according to a recent study. The radioactivity at one storage centre in the Grozny plant is half that recorded at Chernobyl, Rossiya state television said. Vladimir Slivyak of the Ecodefense environmental group in Moscow urged the Russian government to remove and secure radioactive materials from the plant as a matter of urgency, warning of the dangers of them falling into the wrong hands. -------- >From http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4535452.stm . Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ From LNMolino at aol.com Fri Dec 16 16:07:35 2005 From: LNMolino at aol.com (LNMolino at aol.com) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 17:07:35 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: <241.3cd60f5.30d494a7@aol.com> recently eBay the online auction site has "banned radioactive" items from their site. In a recent letter to a person offering unprocessed ores on the site (a seemingly common practice) the following statement was made by eBay. "Please also remember that anything that has a specific activity greater than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is not permitted on eBay under any conditions." So to that end I pose this question. Why the above "limit" what makes 70 Bq the "magic number" or rather might there be a "scientific basis for such a "limit"? Thanks. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino at aol.com 979-690-7559 (Office) 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the original author. From maurysis at ev1.net Fri Dec 16 16:37:18 2005 From: maurysis at ev1.net (Maury Siskel) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 16:37:18 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Wikipedia and DU Message-ID: <43A3419E.4050004@ev1.net> If one does a search of Wikipedia for [ depleted uranium ] (without brackets) then 140 items will be cited. I've shown the first four and the last citation with Wikipedia's relevancy scores. "depleted uranium" Relevancy: 100.0% - - Depleted Uranium Relevancy: 100.0% - - Depleted uranium Relevancy: 92.9% - - Depleted uranium ammunition Relevancy: 81.8% - - ................ Geology of the Moon Relevancy: 0.1% - - Wikipedia has been useful to me from time to time and I've encountered no apparent errors. However, surely it would benefit all concerned if any subject matter experts on this List would review/contribute Wikipedia entries. Cheers, Maury&Dog From jjcohen at prodigy.net Fri Dec 16 18:09:33 2005 From: jjcohen at prodigy.net (jjcohen at prodigy.net) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 16:09:33 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question References: <241.3cd60f5.30d494a7@aol.com> Message-ID: <001601c6029e$2998b5c0$5330e345@domainnotset.invalid> Several years ago, we did a study for the NRC, that recommended that anything <1.0 nci/g (regardless of the radionuclides(s) involved) could be considered "essentially not radioactive" for regulatory purposes. They did not accept the recommendation, largely due to prevailing LNT beliefs. Just out of curiosity, does anyone know of any dire health and safety consequence that might have resulted if this recommendation had been implemented. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, December 16, 2005 2:07 PM Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question > recently eBay the online auction site has "banned radioactive" items from > their site. In a recent letter to a person offering unprocessed ores on the site > (a seemingly common practice) the following statement was made by eBay. > > "Please also remember that anything that has a specific activity greater > than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is not permitted on eBay under > any conditions." > > So to that end I pose this question. Why the above "limit" what makes 70 Bq > the "magic number" or rather might there be a "scientific basis for such a > "limit"? > > Thanks. > > Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET > FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI > LNMolino at aol.com > 979-690-7559 (Office) > 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) > 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) > > "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" > > The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the > author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or > organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I > specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its > stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials > retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the > original author. > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From radsafe at painahawaii.com Fri Dec 16 18:16:44 2005 From: radsafe at painahawaii.com (Andrew Buchan) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 14:16:44 -1000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MOSFET Dosimetry Message-ID: Anyone have any experience using off the shelf prepackaged MOSFETS for dosimetry? Please contact me off list. Thank you, Andrew Andrew Buchan Pa'ina Hawaii POBOX 30542 Tel: 808-834-0496 Honolulu, HI 96744 Fax:808-834-0578 radsafe at painahawaii.com www.painahawaii.com From JGinniver at aol.com Fri Dec 16 18:18:07 2005 From: JGinniver at aol.com (JGinniver at aol.com) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 19:18:07 EST Subject: Fwd: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: <6a.63f180b4.30d4b33f@aol.com> Whoops, forgot to include the list in the original reply. Sorry! From DonJordan at ramservicesinc.com Fri Dec 16 17:27:06 2005 From: DonJordan at ramservicesinc.com (Don Jordan) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 17:27:06 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question References: <241.3cd60f5.30d494a7@aol.com> Message-ID: <009101c60298$3ca022d0$4501a8c0@RAMSERVICE1> 70 Bq/g was the old DOT limit for treating an item as non-radioactive. It has been replaced by isotope-specific limits, so some of the things that ebay might allow would now have to be shipped as limited quantities. Somebody should tell them. Don Jordan From GRMarshall at philotechnics.com Fri Dec 16 19:03:49 2005 From: GRMarshall at philotechnics.com (Glenn R. Marshall) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 20:03:49 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: <5B0DA358D2061D47A3BB00647C29D12F28F036@tnor-fpe.philotechnics.int> Probably because under the "old" U.S. DOT regulations (before 10/1/2004), anything over .002 uCi/g was considered radioactive material for transportation purposes; material having a lower specific activity was exempt from regulation as a hazardous material. Of course use of that limit today has no regulatory basis. Glenn Marshall, CHP -----Original Message----- From: LNMolino at aol.com [mailto:LNMolino at aol.com] Sent: Friday, December 16, 2005 5:08 PM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question recently eBay the online auction site has "banned radioactive" items from their site. In a recent letter to a person offering unprocessed ores on the site (a seemingly common practice) the following statement was made by eBay. "Please also remember that anything that has a specific activity greater than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is not permitted on eBay under any conditions." So to that end I pose this question. Why the above "limit" what makes 70 Bq the "magic number" or rather might there be a "scientific basis for such a "limit"? Thanks. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino at aol.com 979-690-7559 (Office) 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the original author. _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From Jim_Hardeman at dnr.state.ga.us Fri Dec 16 17:17:00 2005 From: Jim_Hardeman at dnr.state.ga.us (Jim Hardeman) Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 18:17:00 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: Lou * 70 Bq/g "used" to be the magic number under DOT Hazardous Materials regulations. Until 2003 (I think) "radioactive material" was defined under DOT regulations as anything exceeding 70 Bq/g (.002 microcurie per gram). Current DOT radioactive materials regulations contain nuclide-specific exemption limits, some greater than 70 Bq/g and others less. One popular item on eBay is "radioactive marbles" containing uranium. My wife, who teaches physics labs at a local community college, bought some of these a few years back for a radioactivity lab ... and we routinely order old Fiesta-ware for show and tell items. Well, guess what? The exemption limit for natural uranium is 1 Bq/g, not 70 ... but in order to be considered "radioactive material" you also have to exceed the "Activity Limit for Exempt Consignment" ... in this case 1,000 Bq. Per 49 CFR 173.403, "Radioactive material means any material containing radionuclides where both the activity concentration and the total activity in the consignment exceed the values specified in the table in Sec. 173.436 or values derived according to the instructions in Sec. 173.433." You can look up these references at http://www.gpoaccess.gov/cfr/retrieve.html For the record, the "old" DOT exemption language in 49 CFR 173.403 used to read "Radioactive material means any material having a specific activity greater than 70 Bq per gram (0.002 microcurie per gram) (see definition of "specific activity'')." Jim Hardeman, Manager Environmental Radiation Program Environmental Protection Division Georgia Department of Natural Resources 4220 International Parkway, Suite 100 Atlanta, GA 30354 (404) 362-2675 Fax: (404) 362-2653 E-mail: Jim_Hardeman at dnr.state.ga.us >>> 12/16/2005 17:07:35 >>> recently eBay the online auction site has "banned radioactive" items from their site. In a recent letter to a person offering unprocessed ores on the site (a seemingly common practice) the following statement was made by eBay. "Please also remember that anything that has a specific activity greater than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is not permitted on eBay under any conditions." So to that end I pose this question. Why the above "limit" what makes 70 Bq the "magic number" or rather might there be a "scientific basis for such a "limit"? Thanks. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino at aol.com 979-690-7559 (Office) 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the original author. _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From joseroze at netvision.net.il Sat Dec 17 03:31:24 2005 From: joseroze at netvision.net.il (Jose Julio Rozental) Date: Sat, 17 Dec 2005 12:31:24 +0300 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question References: <241.3cd60f5.30d494a7@aol.com> Message-ID: <006101c602ec$a9f019e0$840118ac@userqzqxd9wnct> GO TO RADSAFE SITE 3 March 1997 to understand the reason why 70 Bq per gram was selected http://www.vanderbilt.edu/radsafe/9703/msg00016.html GO TO RADSAFE SITE 22 Nov 2000 and find part of the answer -- today's approach http://www.vanderbilt.edu/radsafe/0011/msg00367.html Jose Julio Rozental joseroze at netvision.net.il Israel ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, December 17, 2005 1:07 AM Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question > recently eBay the online auction site has "banned radioactive" items from > their site. In a recent letter to a person offering unprocessed ores on the site > (a seemingly common practice) the following statement was made by eBay. > > "Please also remember that anything that has a specific activity greater > than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is not permitted on eBay under > any conditions." > > So to that end I pose this question. Why the above "limit" what makes 70 Bq > the "magic number" or rather might there be a "scientific basis for such a > "limit"? > > Thanks. > > Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET > FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI > LNMolino at aol.com > 979-690-7559 (Office) > 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) > 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) > > "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" > > The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the > author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or > organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I > specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its > stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials > retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the > original author. > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au Sun Dec 18 03:11:44 2005 From: Brent.Rogers at environment.nsw.gov.au (Rogers Brent) Date: Sun, 18 Dec 2005 20:11:44 +1100 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: Does anyone know if the post-2003 specific activity thresholds are in line with or itdentical to the IAEA document BSS-115 (BSS = Basic Safety Series)? Brent Rogers Manager Radiation Operations Unit NSW Environment Protection Authority Department of Environment and Conservation *+61 2 9995 5986 *+61 2 9995 6603 * PO Box A290 Sydney South 1232 -----Original Message----- From: Don Jordan [mailto:DonJordan at ramservicesinc.com] Sent: Saturday, 17 December 2005 10:27 AM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] Activity question 70 Bq/g was the old DOT limit for treating an item as non-radioactive. It has been replaced by isotope-specific limits, so some of the things that ebay might allow would now have to be shipped as limited quantities. Somebody should tell them. Don Jordan _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ This email is intended for the addressee(s) named and may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then delete it immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of the individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority states them to be the views of the Department of Environment and Conservation (NSW). From Orion1111 at aol.com Sun Dec 18 20:56:37 2005 From: Orion1111 at aol.com (Orion1111 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 18 Dec 2005 21:56:37 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Edward W. Webster (1922-2005) Message-ID: <1a4.454fc5ad.30d77b65@aol.com> Dear friends and colleagues, The worlds of medical physics and health physics mourns the passing of one of its cherished leaders, Edward W. Webster, on the very early morning of December 17th. "Ted" as he was affectionately known by friends and colleagues, was the fifth president of the AAPM, in 1964. Receiving the ACR Gold medal in 1991, the Coolidge Award in 1983 and giving the 1992 Lauriston S. Taylor Lecture were among Ted's very many honors. Condolences may be extended to his wife, Dorothea, and daughter, Sue MacPhee and family at the following email address: _jcmacphee at verizon.net_ (mailto:jcmacphee at verizon.net) Sincerely, Bob Gorson From luke.mccormick at dhs.gov Mon Dec 19 07:37:37 2005 From: luke.mccormick at dhs.gov (Mccormick, Luke I) Date: Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:37:37 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: 70 Bq used to be where DOT defined something as radioactive for transportation. ____________________Reply Separator____________________ Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Author: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl Date: 12/16/2005 5:07 PM recently eBay the online auction site has "banned radioactive" items from their site. In a recent letter to a person offering unprocessed ores on the site (a seemingly common practice) the following statement was made by eBay. "Please also remember that anything that has a specific activity greater than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is not permitted on eBay under any conditions." So to that end I pose this question. Why the above "limit" what makes 70 Bq the "magic number" or rather might there be a "scientific basis for such a "limit"? Thanks. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino at aol.com 979-690-7559 (Office) 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the original author. _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From bsdnuke at gmail.com Mon Dec 19 08:53:31 2005 From: bsdnuke at gmail.com (Scott Davidson) Date: Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:53:31 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Does anyone know if the post-2003 specific activity thresholds are in line with or itdentical to the IAEA document BSS-115 (BSS = Basic Safety Series)? Yes, the HM-230 change was supposed to do that. On 12/18/05, Rogers Brent wrote: > > Does anyone know if the post-2003 specific activity thresholds are in line > with or itdentical to the IAEA document BSS-115 (BSS = Basic Safety > Series)? > > Brent Rogers > Manager Radiation Operations Unit > NSW Environment Protection Authority > Department of Environment and Conservation > *+61 2 9995 5986 > *+61 2 9995 6603 > * PO Box A290 Sydney South 1232 > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Don Jordan [mailto:DonJordan at ramservicesinc.com] > Sent: Saturday, 17 December 2005 10:27 AM > To: radsafe at radlab.nl > Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] Activity question > > > 70 Bq/g was the old DOT limit for treating an item as non-radioactive. It > has been replaced by isotope-specific limits, so some of the things that > ebay might allow would now have to be shipped as limited quantities. > Somebody should tell them. > > Don Jordan > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > the > RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > visit: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > > This email is intended for the addressee(s) named and may contain > confidential and/or privileged information. > > If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then > delete it immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of the > individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority > states them to be the views of the Department of Environment and > Conservation (NSW). > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From obbugg at gsp.net Mon Dec 19 09:17:38 2005 From: obbugg at gsp.net (O.Bruce Bugg) Date: Mon, 19 Dec 2005 10:17:38 -0500 Subject: Spam:Re: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: Two possible exceptions: Cf-252 and Mo-99 in the U.S. A1 = 0.1 TBq (2.7 Ci) and A2 = 0.001 TBq (0.027 Ci) for Cf-252 for domestic use. A2 = 0.74 TBq (20 Ci) for Mo-99 for domestic use. Also, there were some rounding errors in the A1/A2 tables from TBq to Ci; the SI units are the regulatory standard. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Capt. Bruce Bugg Georgia Department of Public Safety Motor Carrier Compliance Division P.O. Box 1456 Atlanta , GA 30371-1456 Phone: 404.624.7211 or 7210 Fax: 404.624.7295 e-mail: obbugg(at)gsp.net [replace "(at)" with "@"] -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Scott Davidson Sent: Monday, December 19, 2005 09:54 To: Rogers Brent Cc: Don Jordan; radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: Spam:Re: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Does anyone know if the post-2003 specific activity thresholds are in line with or itdentical to the IAEA document BSS-115 (BSS = Basic Safety Series)? Yes, the HM-230 change was supposed to do that. From jjcohen at prodigy.net Mon Dec 19 10:12:05 2005 From: jjcohen at prodigy.net (jjcohen at prodigy.net) Date: Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:12:05 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question References: Message-ID: <000401c604b6$f55fe7e0$f0ffe245@domainnotset.invalid> I believe the original question related to the scientific/technical basis for the 70Bq level rather than the administrative/bureaucratic basis. Why was 70bq selected-- as opposed to 10, 50, 100, or 63.749 Bq ??? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mccormick, Luke I" To: ; Sent: Monday, December 19, 2005 5:37 AM Subject: Re:[ RadSafe ] Activity question > > 70 Bq used to be where DOT defined something as radioactive for > transportation. > > ____________________Reply Separator____________________ > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question > Author: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl > Date: 12/16/2005 5:07 PM > > > > > recently eBay the online auction site has "banned radioactive" > items from > their site. In a recent letter to a person offering unprocessed > ores on the site > (a seemingly common practice) the following statement was made > by eBay. > > "Please also remember that anything that has a specific > activity greater > than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is not permitted > on eBay under > any conditions." > > So to that end I pose this question. Why the above "limit" what > makes 70 Bq > the "magic number" or rather might there be a "scientific basis > for such a > "limit"? > > Thanks. > > Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET > FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI > LNMolino at aol.com > 979-690-7559 (Office) > 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) > 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) > > "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" > > The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the > author and the > author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person > or > organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or > associated with unless I > specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is > intended only for its > stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential > materials > retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the > public domain by the > original author. > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and > understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other > settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From luke.mccormick at dhs.gov Mon Dec 19 11:01:51 2005 From: luke.mccormick at dhs.gov (Mccormick, Luke I) Date: Mon, 19 Dec 2005 12:01:51 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: You are making the assumption that bureaucrats used a scientific/technical basis for setting the level. My guess is that it probably had to do with either a 1 nCi commodity like a lantern mantle or a detectability issue. ____________________Reply Separator____________________ Subject: Re: Re:[ RadSafe ] Activity question Author: Date: 12/19/2005 11:12 AM I believe the original question related to the scientific/technical basis for the 70Bq level rather than the administrative/bureaucratic basis. Why was 70bq selected-- as opposed to 10, 50, 100, or 63.749 Bq ??? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mccormick, Luke I" To: ; Sent: Monday, December 19, 2005 5:37 AM Subject: Re:[ RadSafe ] Activity question > > 70 Bq used to be where DOT defined something as radioactive for > transportation. > > ____________________Reply Separator____________________ > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question > Author: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl > Date: 12/16/2005 5:07 PM > > > > > recently eBay the online auction site has "banned radioactive" > items from > their site. In a recent letter to a person offering unprocessed > ores on the site > (a seemingly common practice) the following statement was made > by eBay. > > "Please also remember that anything that has a specific > activity greater > than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is not permitted > on eBay under > any conditions." > > So to that end I pose this question. Why the above "limit" what > makes 70 Bq > the "magic number" or rather might there be a "scientific basis > for such a > "limit"? > > Thanks. > > Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET > FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI > LNMolino at aol.com > 979-690-7559 (Office) > 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) > 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) > > "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" > > The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the > author and the > author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person > or > organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or > associated with unless I > specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is > intended only for its > stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential > materials > retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the > public domain by the > original author. > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and > understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other > settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From BLHamrick at aol.com Mon Dec 19 19:50:52 2005 From: BLHamrick at aol.com (BLHamrick at aol.com) Date: Mon, 19 Dec 2005 20:50:52 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: <287.28a1552.30d8bd7c@aol.com> I also think that when it comes to setting low-level threshholds, scientists recognize there is little difference between 10, 50, 70 or 100 Bq/g, but you have to settle on some number eventually for regulatory purposes. Barbara L. Hamrick, CHP, JD In a message dated 12/19/2005 9:33:52 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, luke.mccormick at dhs.gov writes: You are making the assumption that bureaucrats used a scientific/technical basis for setting the level. My guess is that it probably had to do with either a 1 nCi commodity like a lantern mantle or a detectability issue. ____________________Reply Separator____________________ Subject: Re: Re:[ RadSafe ] Activity question Author: Date: 12/19/2005 11:12 AM I believe the original question related to the scientific/technical basis for the 70Bq level rather than the administrative/bureaucratic basis. Why was 70bq selected-- as opposed to 10, 50, 100, or 63.749 Bq ??? From Fred.Dawson199 at mod.uk Tue Dec 20 03:09:00 2005 From: Fred.Dawson199 at mod.uk (Dawson, Fred Mr) Date: Tue, 20 Dec 2005 09:09:00 -0000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] NS reports Bomb-disposal robot scoops up radioactive source Message-ID: Bomb-disposal robot scoops up radioactive source http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn8480 A robot designed for bomb disposal has rolled to the rescue of a US military lab and fixed a jammed radiation source that was too powerful for humans to approach. The Gamma Irradiation Facility at White Sands Missile Range in New Mexico uses a cobalt-60 radiation source the size of a salt shaker to test how electronic components will hold up under high radiation. Normally, technicians use air to blow the source out of a shielded chamber and through a metal tube, then reverse the process when finished. But in late October, the source got stuck in the tube, and no amount of air would budge it. The radiation from the source would be lethal to a human in just 30 seconds, and was too strong to be approached even in a protective suit. So White Sands officials called Sandia National Laboratory in Albuquerque, New Mexico, to see if their robot could help. "We called these guys and they came down and worked their magic," says Larry Furrow, a White Sands spokesman. Hope on a rope Sandia brought in a 270-kilogram bomb-disposal robot, dubbed Mighty Mouse, that rolls on treads and has a long articulated arm. At first the robot could not get the cylinder unstuck, and then after 90 minutes its electronics began to fail, and it had to be hauled out of the room with a rope. The next day the Sandia team made trips to local DIY stores and modified the robot's arm so that it could unscrew a metal plate and get at the radioactive cylinder from a different direction. Eventually the robot cleared the tube and the radiation source was blown back into its container. Gamma radiation does not leave metal radioactive, so the robot was not permanently damaged and has since been restored to full working order, a Sandia spokesman said. Furrow said the Gamma Irradiation Facility is also now operating normally Fred Dawson Fred Dawson Health Physics Assistant Director & Team Leader Directorate of Safety & Claims 6-D-30 MOD Main Building Whitehall, LONDON SW1A 2HB email dsc-hpad at mod.uk http://www.mod.uk/dsc/ From robert.atkinson at genetix.com Tue Dec 20 05:20:40 2005 From: robert.atkinson at genetix.com (Robert Atkinson) Date: Tue, 20 Dec 2005 11:20:40 -0000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question Message-ID: 70Bq was not selected; it is a conversion and round down from 2nCi. I'd guess that if the limit had been set in Becquerel's it would have been 50 or 100. Robert Atkinson. -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of jjcohen at prodigy.net Sent: 19 December 2005 16:12 To: Mccormick, Luke I; LNMolino at aol.com; radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: Re: Re:[ RadSafe ] Activity question I believe the original question related to the scientific/technical basis for the 70Bq level rather than the administrative/bureaucratic basis. Why was 70bq selected-- as opposed to 10, 50, 100, or 63.749 Bq ??? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mccormick, Luke I" To: ; Sent: Monday, December 19, 2005 5:37 AM Subject: Re:[ RadSafe ] Activity question > > 70 Bq used to be where DOT defined something as radioactive for > transportation. > > ____________________Reply Separator____________________ > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question > Author: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl > Date: 12/16/2005 5:07 PM > > > > > recently eBay the online auction site has "banned radioactive" > items from > their site. In a recent letter to a person offering unprocessed > ores on the site > (a seemingly common practice) the following statement was made > by eBay. > > "Please also remember that anything that has a specific > activity greater > than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is not permitted > on eBay under > any conditions." > > So to that end I pose this question. Why the above "limit" what > makes 70 Bq > the "magic number" or rather might there be a "scientific basis > for such a > "limit"? > > Thanks. > > Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET > FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI > LNMolino at aol.com > 979-690-7559 (Office) > 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) > 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) > > "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" > > The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the > author and the > author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person > or > organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or > associated with unless I > specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is > intended only for its > stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential > materials > retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the > public domain by the > original author. > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and > understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other > settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ Any opinions expressed in this email are those of the individual and not necessarily Genetix Ltd (Genetix) or any company associated with it. This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and solely for the use of the intended recipient. If you are not the intended recipient or the person responsible for delivering to the intended recipient, be advised that you have received this email in error and that any use is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify Genetix by telephone on +44 (0)1425 624600. The unauthorised use, disclosure, copying or alteration of this message is strictly forbidden. This mail and any attachments have been scanned for viruses prior to leaving the Genetix network. Genetix will not be liable for direct, special, indirect or consequential damages as a result of any virus being passed on, or arising from alteration of the contents of this message by a third party. From danny.mcclung at louisville.edu Tue Dec 20 09:15:38 2005 From: danny.mcclung at louisville.edu (Danny K McClung) Date: Tue, 20 Dec 2005 10:15:38 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RSO Recharges for University and/or Govt. programs Message-ID: I have sent this around before, but now it is CRUNCH TIME with administration. Any input will be appreciated. Previous repliers (you know who you are) need not reply again. Thanks in advance and Seasons Greetings! Greetings Colleagues: We here at UofL are curious about how the rest of the group makes ends meet. More specifically, how do you raise your operating budget? We currently have a recharge system that includes RAM package receipt and personnel dosimetry. We do not charge for anything else at this time, as we are only responsible for raising a portion of our own funds. We have had discussion on this topic with some of you previously (SEURSO conference, Apr '05, here in Louisville). We now wish to include everyone who frequents the AMRSO and RADSAFE list. We will compile a summary of this information in an Excel document and share it with the group after replies are received. Please provide a list of services you are charging for and the dollar amounts. Any other pertinent information is welcome. Thanks in advance for your participation. Danny K. McClung, RRPT Health Physicist/Asst. RSO ******************** University of Louisville Radiation Safety Office 319 Abraham Flexner Way Room 102, Building 55A Louisville, KY 40202 502-852-5231 (phone) 502-852-8911 (fax) GO CARDS !! From jim_hoerner at hotmail.com Wed Dec 21 20:18:39 2005 From: jim_hoerner at hotmail.com (Jim Hoerner) Date: Wed, 21 Dec 2005 21:18:39 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 Message-ID: [Sorry if this has already been posted to RadSafe; I get the digest. I would appreciate any solid debunking, which should probably be fairly easy since Mangano's calulator has been broken for a while. I don't have the time to do it myself in the near future. Thanks. - JH] Article Published: Tuesday, December 20, 2005 - 2:15:20 AM EST Radiation levels measured in rainwater Editor of the Reformer: Vermont state health official Larry Crist is quoted as saying there has been no increase in environmental radiation levels near the Vermont Yankee nuclear plant since the 1970s, when the plant opened ("Studies differ on radiation levels near VY," Reformer, Nov. 29). Crist's claim contradicts what the federal Environmental Protection Agency has found across the nation. The EPA measures levels of beta-emitting radiation in rainwater each month at about 50 U.S. locations. Since the late 1980s, average beta levels have risen about 40 percent around the nation (one can see reports on www.epa.gov/narel, environmental radiation data). While no EPA monitoring stations are located in Vermont, the closest ones are in Concord, N.H. and Hartford Conn., 50 and 60 miles from Vermont Yankee. Beta levels in both locations are increasing, similar to the nation. The EPA finding that beta levels are rising corresponds to our research group's study of Strontium-90 in baby teeth, the levels of which jumped around the nation since the late 1980s. Nuclear reactors in this country are aging, and being operated more of the time. Vermont Yankee, the 10th oldest of 103 U.S. reactors, has operated at 95 percent of capacity in the past six years, versus only 83 percent before that. Meanwhile, cancer death rates in Windham County are rising even though they are falling elsewhere in the state. We need to understand whether running an old reactor like Vermont Yankee into the ground is putting more radiation into our environment and bodies and making us more likely to become cancer victims. Health officials like Crist need to present their results publicly, to better understand these crucial matters. Joseph J. Mangano, National Coordinator Radiation and Public Health Project Norristown, Pa., Dec. 5 http://www.reformer.com/Stories/0,1413,102~8855~3173752,00.html -- Hold the door for the stranger behind you. When the driver in the adjacent lane signals to get over, slow down. Smile and say "hi" to the folks you pass on the sidewalk. Give blood. Volunteer. From JGinniver at aol.com Thu Dec 22 08:19:32 2005 From: JGinniver at aol.com (JGinniver at aol.com) Date: Thu, 22 Dec 2005 09:19:32 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 Message-ID: <241.429a130.30dc0ff4@aol.com> In a message dated 22/12/2005 02:32:41 GMT Standard Time, jim_hoerner at hotmail.com writes: www.epa.gov/narel, environmental radiation data The above link doesn't work. I've had a cursory look and think that this is the link to the data that is referenced in the article. _http://www.epa.gov/narel/radnet/erdonline.html_ (http://www.epa.gov/narel/radnet/erdonline.html) The article states SNIP>The EPA measures levels of beta-emitting radiation in rainwater each month at about 50 U.S. locations. Since the late 1980s, average beta levels have risen about 40 percent around the nation The EPA finding that beta levels are rising corresponds to our research group's study of Strontium-90 in baby teeth, the levels of which jumped around the nation since the late 1980s. Dear Colleagues The 1st Human, Life and Radiation Conference (HLR-2006) and the 3rd Asia Pacific Conference on Risk Management for Preventive Medicine joint meeting will be held at the President Museum, Rafsanjan, Iran from Sunday, October 29 through Tuesday, October 31, 2006. The deadline for abstract submission for Human, Life and Radiation Young Investigator Award is approaching! Please note that the *Feb 2, 2006* deadline cannot be extended. In case you have any comments/questions regarding the submission of abstracts and/or abstract selection criteria, please don't hesitate to contact the HLR-2006 secretarial office. Further information can be found on the conference home page at URL: http://hlrjournal.f2g.net/hlr2006 Best regards SMJ Mortazavi, Ph.D Associate Professor HLR-2006 Scientific Secretary HLR Conference Secretariat Office, Central Building of Rafsanjan University of Medical Sciences Imam Ali Blvd. Rafsanjan, Iran Tel: 98-391-822-0054 Fax: 98-391-822? 0053 E-mail: hlr2006 at hlrjournal.f2g.net Home page: http://hlrjournal.f2g.net/hlr2006 From ograabe at ucdavis.edu Thu Dec 22 17:22:19 2005 From: ograabe at ucdavis.edu (Otto G. Raabe) Date: Thu, 22 Dec 2005 15:22:19 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6.0.1.1.2.20051222145015.02ee0dc8@mailbox.ucdavis.edu> At 06:18 PM 12/21/2005, Jim Hoerner sent: >[We need to understand whether running an old reactor like Vermont Yankee >into the ground is putting more radiation into our environment and bodies >and making us more likely to become cancer victims. Health officials like >Crist need to present their results publicly, to better understand these >crucial matters. > >Joseph J. Mangano, > >National Coordinator >Radiation and Public Health Project >Norristown, Pa., Dec. 5 ***************************************************** December 22., 2005 Mangano's statement is seriously in error. The average American gets 1 mrem per day EDE from natural and normal background sources. People in Colorado may get up to 3 mrem EDE per day (mostly from inhaled radon decay products). The total ANNUAL dose to Americans from nuclear power, fallout (including Sr-90 found in teeth by RPHP), and all nuclear technolgies is about 3 mrem EDE PER YEAR (ICRP 93). If Mangano and his group were correct, we would have to evacuate Colorado and several other higher radiation States. Actually, Colorado has one of the lowest cancer rates of all the States (47th out of 50). As all nuclear power HP's know, there are no serious releases of Sr-90 (or other metabolizable radionuclides) to the environment from Nuclear Power stations. Otto ********************************************** Prof. Otto G. Raabe, Ph.D., CHP Center for Health & the Environment University of California, Davis One Shields Avenue Davis, CA 95616 E-Mail: ograabe at ucdavis.edu Phone: (530) 752-7754 FAX: (530) 758-6140 *********************************************** From mavrokp at otenet.gr Fri Dec 23 10:23:41 2005 From: mavrokp at otenet.gr (Paris M) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 18:23:41 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] IAEA Printed Material Stolen? Message-ID: <000201c607e1$e79deac0$e1b2673e@HP26370125339> I would like to pose a security question concerning printed IAEA material (IAEA Publications). If IAEA downloadable and printed material like TECDOCS and SAFETY SERIES is mysteriously missing or perhaps stolen then what can we conclude from the security point of view? What actions (if any) must follow? With Appreciation PIM Medical Physicist From sandyfl at earthlink.net Fri Dec 23 11:13:55 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 09:13:55 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] IAEA Printed Material Stolen? In-Reply-To: <000201c607e1$e79deac0$e1b2673e@HP26370125339> Message-ID: <43ABBFD3.20939.C6DB3@localhost> On 23 Dec 2005 at 18:23, Paris M wrote: > I would like to pose a security question concerning printed IAEA > material (IAEA Publications). > > If IAEA downloadable and printed material like TECDOCS and SAFETY > SERIES is mysteriously missing or perhaps stolen then what can we > conclude from the security point of view? > > What actions (if any) must follow? I am not sure what you are asking. I assume that the documents you are referring to our on-line and available from the IAEA website. If that is the case, are these documents not public information? Are these downloadable from a log-on with password? If the documents are not available, perhaps there is a server issue, or, the link to the documents have been removed. I am not sure that this is a security issue, and if these are public domain documents, there is definitely not a security issue. Perhaps you can provide additional details? ---------------------------------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From didi at tgi-sci.com Fri Dec 23 11:39:36 2005 From: didi at tgi-sci.com (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Dimiter=20Popoff?=) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 19:39:36 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Re: IAEA Printed Material Stolen? Message-ID: <20051223173936.24654.qmail@server318.com> I am really inexperienced in that administrative sort of things, but stealing downloadable (publically available, if I understand it correctly) material strikes me as pointless? Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ > -------Original Message------- > From: Paris M > Subject: [ RadSafe ] IAEA Printed Material Stolen? > Sent: Dec 23 '05 18:23 > > I would like to pose a security question concerning printed IAEA material (IAEA Publications). > > If IAEA downloadable and printed material like TECDOCS and SAFETY SERIES is mysteriously missing or perhaps stolen then what can we conclude from the security point of view? > > What actions (if any) must follow? > > > > With Appreciation > > PIM > > Medical Physicist > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From idias at interchange.ubc.ca Fri Dec 23 11:42:29 2005 From: idias at interchange.ubc.ca (John R Johnson) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 09:42:29 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] IAEA Printed Material Stolen? In-Reply-To: <000201c607e1$e79deac0$e1b2673e@HP26370125339> Message-ID: PIM What do you mean by "mysteriously missing or perhaps stolen"? _________________ John R Johnson, Ph.D. ***** President, IDIAS, Inc 4535 West 9-Th Ave Vancouver B. C. V6R 2E2 (604) 222-9840 idias at interchange.ubc.ca ***** or most mornings Consultant in Radiation Protection TRIUMF 4004 Wesbrook Mall Vancouver B. C. V6R 2E2 (604) 222-1047 Ext. 6610 Fax: (604) 222-7309 johnsjr at triumf.ca -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl]On Behalf Of Paris M Sent: December 23, 2005 8:24 AM To: RadiatSafety Subject: [ RadSafe ] IAEA Printed Material Stolen? I would like to pose a security question concerning printed IAEA material (IAEA Publications). If IAEA downloadable and printed material like TECDOCS and SAFETY SERIES is mysteriously missing or perhaps stolen then what can we conclude from the security point of view? What actions (if any) must follow? With Appreciation PIM Medical Physicist _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From goldinem at songs.sce.com Fri Dec 23 12:09:54 2005 From: goldinem at songs.sce.com (goldinem at songs.sce.com) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 10:09:54 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 Message-ID: Regarding the Mangano claim that Vermont rainwater gross beta levels have increased over the years (due presumably to the operation of Vermont Yankee), Health Physics just published a paper on the analysis of 22 years of air samples in New York State (Health Phys. 90 (1): 31-37; 2006. Kitto, et al, Long-Term Monitoring of Radioactivity in Surface Air and Deposition in New York State). Great stuff, all kinds of conclusions about how weather patterns affect gross beta and airborne cosmogenic radioactivity. Note the sample locations were selected in part because of proximity to three New York nuclear power plant sites. However, the only anthropogenic (wow, what a word) radionuclides were correlated with sewage sludge incineration and a tritium-processing facility. Also noteworthy, some analyses were conducted specifically for Sr-90 and/or Sr-89. Nothing was ever detected in any samples so "they will not be discussed further." So much for increasing trends in environmental strontium and baby teeth. By the way, the final argument by Mangano about "increased generation" by these "aging" power plants is actually quite wrong. When plants run well, as indicated by a 95% capacity factor, airborne releases are typically reduced. Startups and shutdowns are usually responsible for greater effluent releases. So the "increased" Sr-90 in rainwater (if true, which I doubt) is negatively correlated with Vermont Yankee's operation. Plus I'm quite sure that VY's Radiological Environmental Monitoring Program confirms no radiological impact from plant operation on the local environs. Eric M. Goldin, CHP From farbersa at optonline.net Fri Dec 23 15:26:10 2005 From: farbersa at optonline.net (farbersa at optonline.net) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 16:26:10 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Happy Holidays to all: If it were not for the fact that Mangano is so effective in fooling gullible members of the media and the public with his unscientific claims related to his being a 2nd generation Sternglass wannabe, his "claims" would be laughable. However, in relation to his claims, the EPA has not even had a consistent network of rainwater monitoring over the past 20 years because there has been nothing worth monitoring outside of a brief period in the aftermath of the Chernobyl accident. As an example of the absurdity of Mangano's environmental radioactivity claims in relation to Vermont Yankee, back in 1989-90, I carried out a small study of Cs-137 in woodash derived from home fireplace burning of mature hardwoods all over the US. Several samples were collected from Vermont. One came from my own fireplace at a vacation home I had in Warren, VT over 100 miles from Vermont Yankee. The Cs-137 measured was approx. 15,000 picoCuries per kg of ash after hardwoods grown from the area around Warren, VT were burned and analyzed by quantitative gamma spec analysis. Another sample of wood ash collected from the burning of mature hardwoods growing around Vermont Yankee, was found to have only 1,500 picoCuries of Cs-137 per kg of woodash --or 1/10 the concentration of Cs-137 100 miles to the north, no where near a nuclear plant. Hmmmm. All the Cs-137 being measured in woodash in my study was derived from the deposition of fallout from open air testing of nuclear weapons which ended [except for a few small open air tests by the Chinese] and the Chernobyl fallout in 1986 [which added about 1% to the pre-existing Cs-137 deposition in New England based on my extensive review of environmental rad data gathered around all the nuclear plants in New England]. Actual areal deposition of Cs-137 around New England is fairly constant and cannot account for the 10 fold variability of Cs-137 measured in woodash from samples only 100 miles apart. The factors that appear to make a difference in the Cs-137 level in biomass are the potassium levels in soil [low K, high Cs-137 uptake] and the stable Cs variability [high stable Cs in soil, high uptake of Cs-137 from soil to plant -too complex to explain this counterintuitive behavior here] in soil from one location to another. Any Sr-90 deposition in the environment would be in proportion to the Cs-137 given the relatively constant ratio of Sr-90/Cs-137 in fresh fallout. So given the 10 fold lower concentration of Cs-137 in biomass near Vermont Yankee measured in woodash, are we to conclude that being in the proximity to a nuclear plant operating almost 20 years since 1972 to 1990, reduced Cs-137 [and perhaps Sr-90] in the environment?? :-) Perhaps the intake of air into the Vermont Yankee plant, and its filtration before discharge up the stack cleans up the local environment? Offered for your amusement only. But we could make an argument of this sort that has absolutely no significance if we wanted to have some fun and mislead gullible readers. If we wanted to play the games Mangano enjoys playing, we could argue based on real environmental data that running a nuclear plant for 20 or so years reduces Cs-137 in the nearby environment dramatically vs. a background area 100 miles away. Is this true. Of course not. It is just an indication of how variable environmental radioactivity including Cs-137 and Sr-90 in biomass and other biota can be from one location to another. If you pick your data points selectively, or look at narrow windows of time for one set of measurements vs. another, you can make "conclusions" that appear credible on a first glance, but which are only supported by that one set of data. Going back to 1972, the National Academy of Science harshly criticicized Dr. Ernest Sternglass and his inflammatory claims because his claims were based on choosing only data which supported his hypothesis and ignoring data which did not. Mangano has learned a lot from his mentor Dr. Sternglass and is doing the same intellectually dishonest, and unscientific manipulations that led to Dr. Sternglass being chastised in an Appendix to the National Academy of Sciences 1972 Biological Effects of Ionizing Radiation [BEIR] report. Stewart Farber, MS Public Health Consulting Scientist radproject at optonline.net [203] 367-0791 ----- Original Message ----- From: goldinem at songs.sce.com Date: Friday, December 23, 2005 1:09 pm Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 > > Regarding the Mangano claim that Vermont rainwater gross beta > levels have > increased over the years (due presumably to the operation of Vermont > Yankee), Health Physics just published a paper on the analysis of > 22 years > of air samples in New York State (Health Phys. 90 (1): 31-37; > 2006. Kitto, > et al, Long-Term Monitoring of Radioactivity in Surface Air and > Depositionin New York State). Great stuff, all kinds of > conclusions about how > weather patterns affect gross beta and airborne cosmogenic > radioactivity.Note the sample locations were selected in part > because of proximity to > three New York nuclear power plant sites. However, the only > anthropogenic(wow, what a word) radionuclides were correlated with > sewage sludge > incineration and a tritium-processing facility. Also noteworthy, some > analyses were conducted specifically for Sr-90 and/or Sr-89. > Nothing was > ever detected in any samples so "they will not be discussed > further." So > much for increasing trends in environmental strontium and baby teeth. > > By the way, the final argument by Mangano about "increased > generation" by > these "aging" power plants is actually quite wrong. When plants > run well, > as indicated by a 95% capacity factor, airborne releases are typically > reduced. Startups and shutdowns are usually responsible for greater > effluent releases. So the "increased" Sr-90 in rainwater (if > true, which I > doubt) is negatively correlated with Vermont Yankee's operation. > Plus I'm > quite sure that VY's Radiological Environmental Monitoring Program > confirmsno radiological impact from plant operation on the local > environs. > Eric M. Goldin, CHP > From gaitan at impulsedevices.com Fri Dec 23 15:30:07 2005 From: gaitan at impulsedevices.com (Felipe Gaitan) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 13:30:07 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Background from Static Electricity in Tritium counters Message-ID: Dear Radsafers, Does any body have a suggestion for minimizing the effects of static electricity in tritium counters? I'm using glass vials. The effect has become obvious since the weather turned cold and subsequently the air became drier. I can measure the background slowing decreasing over a couple of days as long as I leave the vial in the counter. As soon as I take it out and then put it back, the background counts jump up again, sometimes by as much as a factor of two. It appears to affect some vials and not others. Thanks for your help, Felipe -- D. Felipe Gaitan, Ph.D. Chief Scientific Officer Impulse Devices, Inc. 13366 Grass Valley Av. Unit H Grass Valley, CA 95945 Phone: 530-273-6500 Ext. 112 Fax: 806-498-6731 email: gaitan at impulsedevices.com From bobcat167 at earthlink.net Fri Dec 23 16:28:03 2005 From: bobcat167 at earthlink.net (Bob) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 15:28:03 -0700 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Background from Static Electricity in Tritium counters In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <012601c60810$24073970$6601a8c0@Bob> Felipe - Try using laundry anti-static wipes (or anti-static spray applied to a lab wipe). You might also need to consider treating the carriers (racks) as well. Do make sure, though, to verify that there are no residues that impact the optical integrity of the scintillation vials. Bob Shannon Kaiser Analytical Management Services Broomfield Colorado 303-432-1137 -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Felipe Gaitan Sent: Friday, December 23, 2005 2:30 PM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] Background from Static Electricity in Tritium counters Dear Radsafers, Does any body have a suggestion for minimizing the effects of static electricity in tritium counters? I'm using glass vials. The effect has become obvious since the weather turned cold and subsequently the air became drier. I can measure the background slowing decreasing over a couple of days as long as I leave the vial in the counter. As soon as I take it out and then put it back, the background counts jump up again, sometimes by as much as a factor of two. It appears to affect some vials and not others. Thanks for your help, Felipe -- D. Felipe Gaitan, Ph.D. Chief Scientific Officer Impulse Devices, Inc. 13366 Grass Valley Av. Unit H Grass Valley, CA 95945 Phone: 530-273-6500 Ext. 112 Fax: 806-498-6731 email: gaitan at impulsedevices.com _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From JGinniver at aol.com Fri Dec 23 16:27:03 2005 From: JGinniver at aol.com (JGinniver at aol.com) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 17:27:03 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Background from Static Electricity in Tritium counters Message-ID: <25c.42dca3b.30ddd3b7@aol.com> Felipe, Am I correct in thinking that you are taling about a liquid scintillation counter? If so it might be worth providing details of the model of counter, make of vials, scintillant cocktail as the issue might be relevant to one of these. I've not encountered problems in the past using both polythene and glass vials. Regards, Julian From lists at richardhess.com Fri Dec 23 16:41:47 2005 From: lists at richardhess.com (Richard L. Hess) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 17:41:47 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Background from Static Electricity in Tritium counters In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <7.0.0.16.2.20051223173227.09914ca8@richardhess.com> Dear Dr. Gaitan, Years and years ago, a product called the Zerostat was made in England. It looks ever so much like a white gun with a large chrome trigger. In the front of the gun is a needle and inside is a piezo electric crystal of some flavour. You squeeze the trigger and it ionizes the air which drains off static. It was originally designed for helping to clean phono records. I have used it for helping with static cling on my wife's dresses. Although it is still working, it wasn't up to the challenge of a large cardboard box filled with foam packing peanuts at 35% RH at 21C. I ended up using a vacuum cleaner and sacrificing a bag to getting all of them out of my room. Anyway, if you could use something like this to discharge the static before the measurement, I wonder if that would help. There is also a spray called "Static Guard" that my wife now uses with her clothes. She prefers that to me shooting her with invisible ions . The Zerostat stays next near my turntable, although I won't admit to restoring discs commercially as I do tapes. I don't know if these excess ions will affect your measurements in other ways, but it's one way of getting rid of small static charges. Another way -- and I suspect that you don't want any of this loose in your facility -- was in the 1960s, you used to be able to purchase anti-static brushes that had a block of polonium in them (I hope I remembered that correctly--it's been close to 40 years since I saw one of those in action). These were for cleaning negatives in photographic darkrooms. Finally, the electronics manufacturing and repair industries have a wide variety of tools and protocols for draining static charges as many semiconductor devices are sensitive to static discharge. There are mats, wrist straps, and I don't know what else, as I've never actually had to spec one of these workstations other than generically. (i.e. provide industry-standard static-safe circuit board rework station). Cheers and best of the season to everyone! Richard At 04:30 PM 12/23/2005, Felipe Gaitan wrote: >Dear Radsafers, > >Does any body have a suggestion for minimizing the effects of static >electricity in tritium counters? > >I'm using glass vials. The effect has become obvious since the >weather turned cold and subsequently the air became drier. I can >measure the background slowing decreasing over a couple of days as >long as I leave the vial in the counter. As soon as I take it out >and then put it back, the background counts jump up again, sometimes >by as much as a factor of two. It appears to affect some vials and not others. Richard L. Hess richard at richardhess.com Aurora, Ontario, Canada http://www.richardhess.com/ Detailed contact information: http://www.richardhess.com/tape/contact.htm From sandyfl at earthlink.net Fri Dec 23 20:06:08 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 18:06:08 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] FBI Official Defends Radiation Monitoring Message-ID: <43AC3C90.2093.45B5BD@localhost> FBI Official Defends Radiation Monitoring WASHINGTON - A classified radiation monitoring program, conducted without warrants, has targeted private U.S. property in an effort to prevent an al-Qaida attack, federal law enforcement officials confirmed Friday. While declining to provide details including the number of cities and sites monitored, the officials said the air monitoring took place since the Sept. 11 attacks and from publicly accessible areas ? which they said made warrants and court orders unnecessary. U.S. News and World Report first reported the program on Friday. The magazine said the monitoring was conducted at more than 100 Muslim sites in the Washington, D.C., area ? including Maryland and Virginia suburbs ? and at least five other cities when threat levels had risen: Chicago, Detroit, Las Vegas, New York and Seattle. The magazine said that at its peak, three vehicles in Washington monitored 120 sites a day, nearly all of them Muslim targets identified by the FBI. Targets included mosques, homes and businesses, the magazine said. The revelation of the surveillance program came just days after The New York Times disclosed that the Bush administration spied on suspected terrorist targets in the United States without court orders. President Bush has said he approved the program to protect Americans from attack. Ibrahim Hooper, spokesman for the Council on American-Islamic Relations, a Washington-based civil rights group, said Friday the program "comes as a complete shock to us and everyone in the Muslim community." "This creates the appearance that Muslims are targeted simply for being Muslims. I don't think this is the message the government wants to send at this time," he said. Hooper said his organization has serious concerns about the constitutionality of monitoring on private property without a court order. Brian Roehrkasse, a Justice Department spokesman, said Friday that the administration "is very concerned with a growing body of sensitive reporting that continues to show al-Qaida has a clear intention to obtain and ultimately use chemical, biological, radiological and nuclear" weapons or high energy explosives. To meet that threat, the government "monitors the air for imminent threats to health and safety," but acts only on specific information about a potential attack without targeting any individual or group, he said. "FBI agents do not intrude across any constitutionally protected areas without the proper legal authority," the spokesman said. In a 2001 decision, the Supreme Court ruled 5-4 that police must get warrants before using devices that search through walls for criminal activity. That decision struck down the use without a warrant of a heat-sensing device that led to marijuana charges against an Oregon man. Roehrkasse said the Justice Department believes that case does not apply to air monitoring in publicly accessible areas. Two federal law enforcement officials, speaking on condition of anonymity because the program is classified, said the monitoring did not occur only at Muslim-related sites. Douglas Kmiec, a professor of constitutional law at Pepperdine University, said the location of the surveillance matters when determining if a court order is needed. "The greatest expectation of privacy is in the home," said Kmiec, a Justice Department official under former presidents Ronald Reagan and George H.W. Bush. "As you move away from the home to a parking lot or a place of public accommodation or an office, there are a set of factors that are a balancing test for the court," he said. Despite federal promises to inform state and local officials of security concerns, that never formally happened with the radiation monitoring program, said an official who spoke on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the information. The official said that after discussions with attorneys, some state and local authorities decided the surveillance was legal, equating it to air quality monitors set up around Washington that regularly sniff for suspicious materials. "They weren't targeting specific people, they were just doing it by random, driving around (commercial) storage sheds and parking lots," the official said. Asked about the program's status, the official said, "I'd understood it had been stopped or significantly rolled back" as early as eight months ago. Such information-sharing with state and local officials is the responsibility of the Homeland Security Department, which spokesman Brian Doyle said was not involved in the program. ------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 E-Mail: sperle at dosimetry.com E-Mail: sandyfl at earthlink.net Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From jim_hoerner at hotmail.com Sat Dec 24 08:06:48 2005 From: jim_hoerner at hotmail.com (Jim Hoerner) Date: Sat, 24 Dec 2005 09:06:48 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] 'Twas the night before Christmas (recycled humor?) Message-ID: An oldie, but a goodie... -------- Original Message ---------------- Man oh man did those stink, Norm. I can do better than that with half my brain tied behind my back. Considering I only have half a brain to start with, that would be quite a handicap. "Rudolph the glowing green reindeer"... Nah. I got it... Here's an original one by me. It stinks, too, so don't bother telling me about it. Saint Nuke and all that. If you enjoy witty humor, you'll hate this. Apologies to Clement Clarke Moore... 'Twas the night before Christmas, when all through the home, Not a lightbulb was burning, 9th night, none shone; The stockings were hung by the chimney with care, They hoped that their neighbors' firewood could be shared; The children were nestled, shivering in their beds, While visions of spoiled pudding haunted their heads; And mamma in her 'kerchief, and I in silk pants, We cursed what had led to this, UNINFORMED ANTI-NUKE RANTS. When out on the lawn, there arose such a clatter, I sprang from the bed to see what was the matter. Away to the window, I flew like a blue flash, Tore open the shutters and threw up the sash. The moon on the breast of the new-fallen snow, A nice, warm, almost Cherenkov-like glow, The solar panels on the roof were producing no power, Because of the snow, and clouds, and the sun doesn't shine at this hour. I looked in the backyard, watching the motionless turbine. I was about to give up all hope for a nice gust of wind. When, what to my wondering eyes should appear, But a miniature sleigh, and eight radioactive reindeer. With a little old driver, so lively and astute, I knew in a moment, IT MUST BE SAINT NUKE. Fast as thermal neutrons, his coursers they came, And he whistled, and shouted, and called them by name; "Now, EINSTEIN! Now, FERMI! Now, PROTON and NEUTRON! On, ATOM! on STRONG FORCE! on, FISSION and FUSION! To the top of the porch! To the top of the wall! Now dash away! Dash away! Dash away all!" Like steam from the cooling towers used to fly, Westchester would not approve as they mounted to the sky, So over to Indian Point, the coursers they flew, With the sleigh full of uranium dioxide, AND SAINT NUCLEUS TOO. And then, in a twinkling, I saw in the distance, The fat man take to his slide rule, what a powerful prince. As I drew in my hand, and was turning around, Into the containment Saint Nucleus went with a bound. He was dressed all in white, from his head to his foot, His protective clothes were not tarnished with ashes and soot; A bundle of UO2 he had flung into the core, He looked into his dosimeter, and then went back for more. The thoughts in his head were really rather droll, He decided to give all the naughty anti-nukes MUCH-DESERVED COAL; He had a broad face and a little round belly, That shook when he laughed like a detector of GeLi. He was chubby and plump, a jolly elf, even if old, And I laughed when I saw him, in spite of the cold; A wink of his eye and a twist of his head, Soon erased all of my irrational fears and dread; He spoke not a word, but went straight to his work, And filled ALL THE CORE; then turned with a jerk, He laid finger to nose, as if to itch, Then he bolted to the control room, where he FLIPPED THE SWITCH; He sprang to his sleigh, to his team he gave a nod, And away they all flew, after raising the last control rod. THANK GOODNESS WE'RE SAVED! No more frost burn or blight! Happy Christmas to all, and to all, GOOD LIGHT! Best wishes for happiness, peace, health, and propserity to all! Particularly, those unable to be with their families for the holidays, folks who aren't rich like me (I eat every day), and any folks whom I have wronged. Jim -- Hold the door for the stranger behind you. When the driver in the adjacent lane signals to get over, slow down. Smile and say "hi" to the folks you pass on the sidewalk. Give blood. Volunteer. --- In Know_Nukes at y..., Norman Cohen wrote: >Subject: anti-nuke carols >Date: Fri Dec 14, 2001 2:05 pm >From the Indian Point folks: (Rudolph the Red Nose Reindeer) In the city of Buchanan There?s a greedy company They own the local nuke plant Really close to you and me None of the other nuke plants Going back in history (are) located near such heavy Population density Then one day the NRC Said something is not right Indian Point your corner stones Are de-gra-ded RED tonight None of the other nuke plants Going back in history (are) located near such heavy Population density (I Have a Little Dreidel) We have a little nuke plant We wish would go away But they don?t want to close it They think it still can pay Close it close it close it Please make it go away Close it close it close it So we can dance and play (Jingle Bells) Shut down nukes Shut down nukes We don?t need the power Guarded by security That costs more by the hour Shut down nukes Shut down nukes We don?t need the power Now?s the time to close the plants Before it all goes sour We don?t need the fear We don?t need the risk We don?t need the vulner?bility to terrorists We can close them down We can do what?s right We can find alternatives That let us sleep at night Shut down nukes? (Silent Night) Indian Point Indian Point Radiation does anoint Mothers fathers daughters and sons Radiation affects everyone How can we sleep in peace How can we sleep in peace (We Wish You a Merry Christmas) We wish you would shut the nuke plants We wish you would shut the nuke plants We wish you would shut the nuke plants For a Happy New Year (2X) Petitions we bring to you NRC We wish you would shut the nuke plants For a happy New Year From bobcat167 at earthlink.net Sat Dec 24 15:43:48 2005 From: bobcat167 at earthlink.net (Bob Shannon) Date: Sat, 24 Dec 2005 14:43:48 -0700 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <015a01c608d3$218c91e0$6601a8c0@Bob> Excerpted paragraph from the editorial in the Brattleboro Reformer: Crist's claim contradicts what the federal Environmental Protection Agency has found across the nation. The EPA measures levels of beta-emitting radiation in rainwater each month at about 50 U.S. locations. Since the late 1980s, average beta levels have risen about 40 percent around the nation (one can see reports on www.epa.gov/narel, environmental radiation data). I was intrigued to hear about a dramatic rise in gross beta activity in rainwater so I decided to followed Mr. Mangano's invitation to take a look at the referenced data. I accessed the database (downloaded all >10,000 gross beta results for precipitation at 67 different locations from the ten different EPA regions since 1977 - an exercise in patience). I figured that the best way to start would be to check for a trend in the data. I excluded all data prior 1990 (thus the time frame coincides with that referenced) and normalized all the results for each location to the earliest result from that location. I plotted all 6200+ normalized results on a single chart and fit a trendline to the data. Based on my (admittedly quick and dirty) analysis of what appears to be the same dataset used by Mr. Mangano, I would conclude that there is no evidence of a positive trend, let alone indications of a 40% increase in gross beta since the late 1980's. In fact, the fitted line trends slightly downward. The slope is so negligible, though, that I would more fairly characterize it as 'flat'. (Without spending more time doing statistics, I decided to let it be at that.) Originally, I expected that if there was a change in Gross Beta results, the result would possibly an artifact of changes in calibration nuclides, etc., over the years and that I might have to dig into the isotopic data to get a more meaningful answer. For the time being though, I guess I won't invest any more time looking for evidence to corroborate a trend that does not appear to exist. If I am missing something, I still have a whole lot of data here. Let me know and I can take a second run at the data. Bob Shannon BobShannon91 at earthlink.net Kaiser Analytical Management Services Broomfield, Colorado 303-432-1137 -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Jim Hoerner Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2005 7:19 PM To: Know_Nukes at yahoogroups.com Cc: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 [Sorry if this has already been posted to RadSafe; I get the digest. I would appreciate any solid debunking, which should probably be fairly easy since Mangano's calulator has been broken for a while. I don't have the time to do it myself in the near future. Thanks. - JH] Article Published: Tuesday, December 20, 2005 - 2:15:20 AM EST Radiation levels measured in rainwater Editor of the Reformer: Vermont state health official Larry Crist is quoted as saying there has been no increase in environmental radiation levels near the Vermont Yankee nuclear plant since the 1970s, when the plant opened ("Studies differ on radiation levels near VY," Reformer, Nov. 29). Crist's claim contradicts what the federal Environmental Protection Agency has found across the nation. The EPA measures levels of beta-emitting radiation in rainwater each month at about 50 U.S. locations. Since the late 1980s, average beta levels have risen about 40 percent around the nation (one can see reports on www.epa.gov/narel, environmental radiation data). While no EPA monitoring stations are located in Vermont, the closest ones are in Concord, N.H. and Hartford Conn., 50 and 60 miles from Vermont Yankee. Beta levels in both locations are increasing, similar to the nation. The EPA finding that beta levels are rising corresponds to our research group's study of Strontium-90 in baby teeth, the levels of which jumped around the nation since the late 1980s. Nuclear reactors in this country are aging, and being operated more of the time. Vermont Yankee, the 10th oldest of 103 U.S. reactors, has operated at 95 percent of capacity in the past six years, versus only 83 percent before that. Meanwhile, cancer death rates in Windham County are rising even though they are falling elsewhere in the state. We need to understand whether running an old reactor like Vermont Yankee into the ground is putting more radiation into our environment and bodies and making us more likely to become cancer victims. Health officials like Crist need to present their results publicly, to better understand these crucial matters. Joseph J. Mangano, National Coordinator Radiation and Public Health Project Norristown, Pa., Dec. 5 http://www.reformer.com/Stories/0,1413,102~8855~3173752,00.html -- Hold the door for the stranger behind you. When the driver in the adjacent lane signals to get over, slow down. Smile and say "hi" to the folks you pass on the sidewalk. Give blood. Volunteer. _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From BLHamrick at aol.com Sat Dec 24 19:30:10 2005 From: BLHamrick at aol.com (BLHamrick at aol.com) Date: Sat, 24 Dec 2005 20:30:10 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 Message-ID: <294.2c61f11.30df5022@aol.com> In a message dated 12/24/2005 2:00:48 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, bobcat167 at earthlink.net writes: Originally, I expected that if there was a change in Gross Beta results, the result would possibly an artifact of changes in calibration nuclides, etc., over the years and that I might have to dig into the isotopic data to get a more meaningful answer. For the time being though, I guess I won't invest any more time looking for evidence to corroborate a trend that does not appear to exist. If I am missing something, I still have a whole lot of data here. Let me know and I can take a second run at the data. Thank you for taking the time to do this. I really wanted to, but knew I just didn't have the time right now. I expected to find pretty much what you describe. No trend. The problem with Mangano-types is that they can often get away with histrionic claims, because actually doing the work to examine the data is very tedious and time-consuming, and most professional HPs simply don't have that kind of "spare" time to spend, solely to refute these types of claims. In truth, I expect that if we did make a concerted professional effort to put some of this nonsense to rest, we would actually save time and money in the long run. Barbara L. Hamrick, CHP, JD From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Sat Dec 24 21:37:40 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Sat, 24 Dec 2005 19:37:40 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question In-Reply-To: <001601c6029e$2998b5c0$5330e345@domainnotset.invalid> Message-ID: <20051225033740.55443.qmail@web54313.mail.yahoo.com> Jerry, It appears that 70Bq/g (approximately 2 nCi/gm is more liberal than your < 1.0 nCi/gm. Obviously, the LNT had no part in the NRC's decision, otherwise they would have picked your more conservative limit. --- jjcohen at prodigy.net wrote: > Several years ago, we did a study for the NRC, that > recommended that > anything <1.0 nci/g (regardless of the > radionuclides(s) involved) could be > considered "essentially not radioactive" for > regulatory purposes. They did > not accept the recommendation, largely due to > prevailing LNT beliefs. Just > out of curiosity, does anyone know of any dire > health and safety > consequence that might have resulted if this > recommendation had been > implemented. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Friday, December 16, 2005 2:07 PM > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Activity question > > > > recently eBay the online auction site has "banned > radioactive" items from > > their site. In a recent letter to a person > offering unprocessed ores on > the site > > (a seemingly common practice) the following > statement was made by eBay. > > > > "Please also remember that anything that has a > specific activity greater > > than 70 Bq per gram (.002 microcurie per gram) is > not permitted on eBay > under > > any conditions." > > > > So to that end I pose this question. Why the above > "limit" what makes 70 > Bq > > the "magic number" or rather might there be a > "scientific basis for such a > > "limit"? > > > > Thanks. > > > > Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET > > FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI > > LNMolino at aol.com > > 979-690-7559 (Office) > > 979-412-0890 (Cell Phone) > > 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) > > > > "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" > > > > The comments contained in this E-mail are the > opinions of the author and > the > > author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak > for any person or > > organization that I am in any way whatsoever > involved or associated with > unless I > > specifically state that I am doing so. Further > this E-mail is intended > only for its > > stated recipient and may contain private and or > confidential materials > > retransmission is strictly prohibited unless > placed in the public domain > by the > > original author. > > _______________________________________________ > > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe > mailing list > > > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to > have read and understood > the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe > and other settings > visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing > list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have > read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be > found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe > and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL ? Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com From MosheK at sviva.gov.il Sun Dec 25 03:22:48 2005 From: MosheK at sviva.gov.il (=?windows-1255?Q?=EE=F9=E4_=F7=F8=EF____Moshe_Keren?=) Date: Sun, 25 Dec 2005 11:22:48 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Radiation detectors at ports Message-ID: <2724DA0176E72D40880EB245D28AFC5001196B93@moe_exch.sviva.gov.il> Happy Hanuca to all, This was posted at May 16: "Robert Bonner, commissioner of U.S. Customs and Border Protection, told a Senate subcommittee on homeland security that since the first such devices were installed in May 2000, they had picked up over 10,000 radiation hits in vehicles or cargo shipments entering the country. All proved harmless." Has any one an idea what were the radiation levels caused those hits, was cargo type considered (bannanas, fertilizers, etc.), what about patients with residues of radioactive material or implanted barchitherapy sources? Regards, Moshe Keren ISRAEL From mavrokp at otenet.gr Sun Dec 25 12:59:09 2005 From: mavrokp at otenet.gr (Paris M) Date: Sun, 25 Dec 2005 20:59:09 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] IAEA Printed Material Stolen? References: Message-ID: <000701c60985$69e31d30$c46aa7c3@HP26370125339> Mysteriously=Impossible to determine how and when the IAEA documents have disappeared form a certain place. Missing =the first logical conclusion is that this material has been lost Stolen= failure of all efforts to find the printed material (and a few VERY weird events) forces me to examine the extreme (?) possibility of being stolen ----- Original Message ----- From: "John R Johnson" To: "Paris M" ; "RadiatSafety" Sent: Friday, December 23, 2005 7:42 PM Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] IAEA Printed Material Stolen? > PIM > > What do you mean by "mysteriously missing or perhaps stolen"? > > _________________ > John R Johnson, Ph.D. > ***** > President, IDIAS, Inc > 4535 West 9-Th Ave > Vancouver B. C. > V6R 2E2 > (604) 222-9840 > idias at interchange.ubc.ca > ***** > or most mornings > Consultant in Radiation Protection > TRIUMF > 4004 Wesbrook Mall > Vancouver B. C. > V6R 2E2 > (604) 222-1047 Ext. 6610 > Fax: (604) 222-7309 > johnsjr at triumf.ca > > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl]On > Behalf > Of Paris M > Sent: December 23, 2005 8:24 AM > To: RadiatSafety > Subject: [ RadSafe ] IAEA Printed Material Stolen? > > > I would like to pose a security question concerning printed IAEA material > (IAEA Publications). > > If IAEA downloadable and printed material like TECDOCS and SAFETY SERIES > is > mysteriously missing or perhaps stolen then what can we conclude from the > security point of view? > > What actions (if any) must follow? > > > > With Appreciation > > PIM > > Medical Physicist > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > the > RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > visit: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > > From bobcherry at cox.net Mon Dec 26 13:05:25 2005 From: bobcherry at cox.net (bobcherry at cox.net) Date: Mon, 26 Dec 2005 14:05:25 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 Message-ID: <20051226190359.DCYI29285.eastrmmtao03.cox.net@[172.18.52.8]> Stewart's comment below gave me an idea. Internet newsgroups and listservers often have awards voted upon by their members. Should Radsafe have an annual "St******ss Disinformation Award"? Actually, I am hesitant to name it after anyone for liability reasons. If this is deemed a good idea, we would have to come up with an appropriate name, a nomination process, a voting process, and, hopefully, a process for publicizing it to the media. Just a thought, and I am not prepared to run this program. Bob >>If it were not for the fact that Mangano is so effective in fooling gullible members of the media and the public with his unscientific claims related to his being a 2nd generation Sternglass wannabe, From jimm at WPI.EDU Mon Dec 26 17:57:10 2005 From: jimm at WPI.EDU (Muckerheide, James) Date: Mon, 26 Dec 2005 18:57:10 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 Message-ID: <71A6142F930A1E4C9300D4088D9765C85FF7C9@EXCHDB.admin.wpi.edu> You could call it the "Sternman and Gofass Disinformation Award"!? :-) Regards, Jim Muckerheide > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On > Behalf Of bobcherry at cox.net > Sent: Monday, December 26, 2005 2:05 PM > To: radsafe at radlab.nl > Subject: Re: Re: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 > > Stewart's comment below gave me an idea. Internet newsgroups and > listservers often have awards voted upon by their members. Should Radsafe > have an annual "St******ss Disinformation Award"? > > Actually, I am hesitant to name it after anyone for liability reasons. If > this is deemed a good idea, we would have to come up with an appropriate > name, a nomination process, a voting process, and, hopefully, a process > for publicizing it to the media. > > Just a thought, and I am not prepared to run this program. > > Bob > > > >>If it were not for the fact that Mangano is so effective in fooling > gullible > members of the media and the public with his unscientific claims related > to his > being a 2nd generation Sternglass wannabe, > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Mon Dec 26 18:34:52 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 00:34:52 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980; disinformation must be corrected by relentless effort In-Reply-To: <20051226190359.DCYI29285.eastrmmtao03.cox.net@[172.18.52.8]> Message-ID: <20051227003452.99488.qmail@web26409.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear friends, Specialists in health physics and radiological protection are members of a totally isolated community. Most of them have a smug feeling that a few individuals remaining in isolation cannot do much damage. The individuals who come up with fresh findings to stoke the fears of lay public knew exactly what they are doing. They must be nailed not by isolating them, but by following them up constantly. It is a thankless job. Instituting " disinformation awards" may make them martyrs. Specialists may identify these "martyrs", effortlessly. But what about the public who willingly become victims of their propaganda. We will be successful only if they are exposed by the discerning members of the public. Those who wanted to scare the public choose the right subject, the right audience and proceed with their task with evangelic zeal. Their arguments seldom stand scientific scrutiny. Their task is easy. All they have to do is to appeal to the heart and not to the head. While they address women, they talk about leukemic children, birth defects,generations which will suffer from unknown maladies! I understand that many surveys have shown that women are more sympathetic to their cause. The biggest problem we face is isolation from the mainstream. When we get well integrated into the community at large,our credibility will improve, public will trust us.Those who promoted "nuclear" science and related technology in the early years contributed immensely, but part of these contributions was admittedly negative. It will take years of effort to remove ignorance. A geiger counter put to effective use can dispel ignorance; glossy brochures may not. My two cents worth K.S.Parthasarathy Raja Ramanna Fellow Department of Atomic Energy GN 18, Vikram Sarabhai Bhavan Mumbai 400094 bobcherry at cox.net wrote: Stewart's comment below gave me an idea. Internet newsgroups and listservers often have awards voted upon by their members. Should Radsafe have an annual "St******ss Disinformation Award"? Actually, I am hesitant to name it after anyone for liability reasons. If this is deemed a good idea, we would have to come up with an appropriate name, a nomination process, a voting process, and, hopefully, a process for publicizing it to the media. Just a thought, and I am not prepared to run this program. Bob >>If it were not for the fact that Mangano is so effective in fooling gullible members of the media and the public with his unscientific claims related to his being a 2nd generation Sternglass wannabe, _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- Yahoo! Messenger NEW - crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail From Peter.Sandgren at po.state.ct.us Tue Dec 27 08:17:24 2005 From: Peter.Sandgren at po.state.ct.us (Sandgren, Peter) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 09:17:24 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 Message-ID: I hope some of you learned folks have also sent your highly informative letters to the publications that have seen fit to print Mangano's unscientific claims. For my 2 cents, I believe that anybody who announces he/she has scientific and controversial "information" to share will always find a reporter or newspaper to put their claims in print. The best defense and the strongest safeguard we have is the knowledge and experience of you folks on radsafe. For every distorted claim that makes it into print, if two or three letters (with supporting scientific references) come to contradict those claims, at least one of those letters will be printed, and rad-fearful minds will be calmed. These email rebuttals that come into radsafe could, with a little polishing, go far to hold back the tide of fear that threatens to close nuclear plants around the country. So, thanks to all of you who take the time to write! Please keep it up, and send them on to the newspapers. Most papers will accept email letters as long as the name and address (and credentials!) of the writer are included. Happy New Year to all, Peter Sandgren -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of farbersa at optonline.net Sent: Friday, December 23, 2005 4:26 PM To: goldinem at songs.sce.com Cc: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 Happy Holidays to all: If it were not for the fact that Mangano is so effective in fooling gullible members of the media and the public with his unscientific claims related to his being a 2nd generation Sternglass wannabe, his "claims" would be laughable. However, in relation to his claims, the EPA has not even had a consistent network of rainwater monitoring over the past 20 years because there has been nothing worth monitoring outside of a brief period in the aftermath of the Chernobyl accident. As an example of the absurdity of Mangano's environmental radioactivity claims in relation to Vermont Yankee, back in 1989-90, I carried out a small study of Cs-137 in woodash derived from home fireplace burning of mature hardwoods all over the US. Several samples were collected from Vermont. One came from my own fireplace at a vacation home I had in Warren, VT over 100 miles from Vermont Yankee. The Cs-137 measured was approx. 15,000 picoCuries per kg of ash after hardwoods grown from the area around Warren, VT were burned and analyzed by quantitative gamma spec analysis. Another sample of wood ash collected from the burning of mature hardwoods growing around Vermont Yankee, was found to have only 1,500 picoCuries of Cs-137 per kg of woodash --or 1/10 the concentration of Cs-137 100 miles to the north, no where near a nuclear plant. Hmmmm. All the Cs-137 being measured in woodash in my study was derived from the deposition of fallout from open air testing of nuclear weapons which ended [except for a few small open air tests by the Chinese] and the Chernobyl fallout in 1986 [which added about 1% to the pre-existing Cs-137 deposition in New England based on my extensive review of environmental rad data gathered around all the nuclear plants in New England]. Actual areal deposition of Cs-137 around New England is fairly constant and cannot account for the 10 fold variability of Cs-137 measured in woodash from samples only 100 miles apart. The factors that appear to make a difference in the Cs-137 level in biomass are the potassium levels in soil [low K, high Cs-137 uptake] and the stable Cs variability [high stable Cs in soil, high uptake of Cs-137 from soil to plant -too complex to explain this counterintuitive behavior here] in soil from one location to another. Any Sr-90 deposition in the environment would be in proportion to the Cs-137 given the relatively constant ratio of Sr-90/Cs-137 in fresh fallout. So given the 10 fold lower concentration of Cs-137 in biomass near Vermont Yankee measured in woodash, are we to conclude that being in the proximity to a nuclear plant operating almost 20 years since 1972 to 1990, reduced Cs-137 [and perhaps Sr-90] in the environment?? :-) Perhaps the intake of air into the Vermont Yankee plant, and its filtration before discharge up the stack cleans up the local environment? Offered for your amusement only. But we could make an argument of this sort that has absolutely no significance if we wanted to have some fun and mislead gullible readers. If we wanted to play the games Mangano enjoys playing, we could argue based on real environmental data that running a nuclear plant for 20 or so years reduces Cs-137 in the nearby environment dramatically vs. a background area 100 miles away. Is this true. Of course not. It is just an indication of how variable environmental radioactivity including Cs-137 and Sr-90 in biomass and other biota can be from one location to another. If you pick your data points selectively, or look at narrow windows of time for one set of measurements vs. another, you can make "conclusions" that appear credible on a first glance, but which are only supported by that one set of data. Going back to 1972, the National Academy of Science harshly criticicized Dr. Ernest Sternglass and his inflammatory claims because his claims were based on choosing only data which supported his hypothesis and ignoring data which did not. Mangano has learned a lot from his mentor Dr. Sternglass and is doing the same intellectually dishonest, and unscientific manipulations that led to Dr. Sternglass being chastised in an Appendix to the National Academy of Sciences 1972 Biological Effects of Ionizing Radiation [BEIR] report. Stewart Farber, MS Public Health Consulting Scientist radproject at optonline.net [203] 367-0791 ----- Original Message ----- From: goldinem at songs.sce.com Date: Friday, December 23, 2005 1:09 pm Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 > > Regarding the Mangano claim that Vermont rainwater gross beta > levels have > increased over the years (due presumably to the operation of Vermont > Yankee), Health Physics just published a paper on the analysis of > 22 years > of air samples in New York State (Health Phys. 90 (1): 31-37; > 2006. Kitto, > et al, Long-Term Monitoring of Radioactivity in Surface Air and > Depositionin New York State). Great stuff, all kinds of > conclusions about how > weather patterns affect gross beta and airborne cosmogenic > radioactivity.Note the sample locations were selected in part > because of proximity to > three New York nuclear power plant sites. However, the only > anthropogenic(wow, what a word) radionuclides were correlated with > sewage sludge > incineration and a tritium-processing facility. Also noteworthy, some > analyses were conducted specifically for Sr-90 and/or Sr-89. > Nothing was > ever detected in any samples so "they will not be discussed > further." So > much for increasing trends in environmental strontium and baby teeth. > > By the way, the final argument by Mangano about "increased > generation" by > these "aging" power plants is actually quite wrong. When plants > run well, > as indicated by a 95% capacity factor, airborne releases are typically > reduced. Startups and shutdowns are usually responsible for greater > effluent releases. So the "increased" Sr-90 in rainwater (if > true, which I > doubt) is negatively correlated with Vermont Yankee's operation. > Plus I'm > quite sure that VY's Radiological Environmental Monitoring Program > confirmsno radiological impact from plant operation on the local > environs. > Eric M. Goldin, CHP > _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From DonJordan at ramservicesinc.com Tue Dec 27 08:50:36 2005 From: DonJordan at ramservicesinc.com (Don Jordan) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 08:50:36 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Background from Static Electricity in Tritium counters References: Message-ID: <002c01c60af4$e5cea160$4501a8c0@RAMSERVICE1> Using natural latex gloves causes a lot of static problems. Switching to nitrile gloves will solve the problem. I believe that vinyl gloves also do not cause static, but I have not used them. The fabric softener wipes will eventually deposit a lot of crud in your scintillation counter. My experience with static is that one gets very erratic counts. In one count you'll get 10,000 counts, the next one will be a few hundred, and the one after that will be 20,000. The problem you describe sounds more like chemiluminescence, except for the increase when you remove a vial from the counter. This sounds more like phosphorescence caused by fluorescent lights or direct sunlight. Don Jordan RAM Services, Inc. 510 County Highway V Two Rivers, WI 54241 DonJordan at ramservicesinc.com Voice: +1-920-686-3889 From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Tue Dec 27 10:27:54 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 08:27:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051227162754.86101.qmail@web54308.mail.yahoo.com> Peter, I think your idea is good, but most people on this list would rather talk the subject to death within the list. --- "Sandgren, Peter" wrote: > I hope some of you learned folks have also sent your > highly informative > letters to the publications that have seen fit to > print Mangano's > unscientific claims. For my 2 cents, I believe that > anybody who > announces he/she has scientific and controversial > "information" to share > will always find a reporter or newspaper to put > their claims in print. > > The best defense and the strongest safeguard we have > is the knowledge > and experience of you folks on radsafe. For every > distorted claim that > makes it into print, if two or three letters (with > supporting scientific > references) come to contradict those claims, at > least one of those > letters will be printed, and rad-fearful minds will > be calmed. These > email rebuttals that come into radsafe could, with a > little polishing, > go far to hold back the tide of fear that threatens > to close nuclear > plants around the country. So, thanks to all of you > who take the time > to write! Please keep it up, and send them on to > the newspapers. Most > papers will accept email letters as long as the name > and address (and > credentials!) of the writer are included. > > Happy New Year to all, > Peter Sandgren > > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl > [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On > Behalf Of farbersa at optonline.net > Sent: Friday, December 23, 2005 4:26 PM > To: goldinem at songs.sce.com > Cc: radsafe at radlab.nl > Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels > Up 40% Since 1980 > > Happy Holidays to all: > > If it were not for the fact that Mangano is so > effective in fooling > gullible members of the media and the public with > his unscientific > claims related to his being a 2nd generation > Sternglass wannabe, his > "claims" would be laughable. > > However, in relation to his claims, the EPA has not > even had a > consistent network of rainwater monitoring over the > past 20 years > because there has been nothing worth monitoring > outside of a brief > period in the aftermath of the Chernobyl accident. > > As an example of the absurdity of Mangano's > environmental radioactivity > claims in relation to Vermont Yankee, back in > 1989-90, I carried out a > small study of Cs-137 in woodash derived from home > fireplace burning of > mature hardwoods all over the US. Several samples > were collected from > Vermont. One came from my own fireplace at a > vacation home I had in > Warren, VT over 100 miles from Vermont Yankee. The > Cs-137 measured was > approx. 15,000 picoCuries per kg of ash after > hardwoods grown from the > area around Warren, VT were burned and analyzed by > quantitative gamma > spec analysis. > > Another sample of wood ash collected from the > burning of mature > hardwoods growing around Vermont Yankee, was found > to have only 1,500 > picoCuries of Cs-137 per kg of woodash --or 1/10 the > concentration of > Cs-137 100 miles to the north, no where near a > nuclear plant. Hmmmm. > > All the Cs-137 being measured in woodash in my study > was derived from > the deposition of fallout from open air testing of > nuclear weapons which > ended [except for a few small open air tests by the > Chinese] and the > Chernobyl fallout in 1986 [which added about 1% to > the pre-existing > Cs-137 deposition in New England based on my > extensive review of > environmental rad data gathered around all the > nuclear plants in New > England]. Actual areal deposition of Cs-137 around > New England is > fairly constant and cannot account for the 10 fold > variability of Cs-137 > measured in woodash from samples only 100 miles > apart. The factors that > appear to make a difference in the Cs-137 level in > biomass are the > potassium levels in soil [low K, high Cs-137 uptake] > and the stable Cs > variability [high stable Cs in soil, high uptake of > Cs-137 from soil to > plant -too complex to explain this counterintuitive > behavior here] in > soil from one location to another. > > Any Sr-90 deposition in the environment would be in > proportion to the > Cs-137 given the relatively constant ratio of > Sr-90/Cs-137 in fresh > fallout. So given the 10 fold lower concentration of > Cs-137 in biomass > near Vermont Yankee measured in woodash, are we to > conclude that being > in the proximity to a nuclear plant operating almost > 20 years since 1972 > to 1990, reduced Cs-137 [and perhaps Sr-90] in the > environment?? :-) > Perhaps the intake of air into the Vermont Yankee > plant, and its > filtration before discharge up the stack cleans up > the local > environment? Offered for your amusement only. But > we could make an > argument of this sort that has absolutely no > significance if we wanted > to have some fun and mislead gullible readers. > > If we wanted to play the games Mangano enjoys > playing, we could argue > based on real environmental data that running a > nuclear plant for 20 or > so years reduces Cs-137 in the nearby environment > dramatically vs. a > background area 100 miles away. Is this true. Of > course not. It is just > an indication of how variable environmental > radioactivity including > Cs-137 and Sr-90 in biomass and other biota can be > from one location to > another. If you pick your data points selectively, > or look at narrow > windows of time for one set of measurements vs. > another, you can make > "conclusions" that appear credible on a first > glance, but which are > only supported by that one set of data. > > Going back to 1972, the National Academy of Science > harshly criticicized > Dr. Ernest Sternglass and his inflammatory claims > because his claims > were based on choosing only data which supported his > hypothesis and > ignoring data which did not. Mangano has learned a > lot from his mentor > Dr. Sternglass and is doing the same intellectually > dishonest, and > unscientific manipulations that led to Dr. > Sternglass being chastised in > an Appendix to the National Academy of Sciences 1972 > Biological Effects > of Ionizing Radiation [BEIR] report. > > > Stewart Farber, MS Public Health > Consulting Scientist > radproject at optonline.net > [203] 367-0791 > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: goldinem at songs.sce.com > Date: Friday, December 23, 2005 1:09 pm > Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up > 40% Since 1980 > > > > > Regarding the Mangano claim that Vermont rainwater > gross beta > > levels have > > increased over the years (due presumably to the > operation of Vermont > > Yankee), Health Physics just published a paper on > the analysis of > > 22 years > > of air samples in New York State (Health Phys. 90 > (1): 31-37; > === message truncated === +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL ? Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com From sandyfl at earthlink.net Tue Dec 27 11:24:16 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 09:24:16 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 In-Reply-To: <20051227162754.86101.qmail@web54308.mail.yahoo.com> References: Message-ID: <43B10840.19659.4930FF@localhost> On 27 Dec 2005 at 8:27, John Jacobus wrote: > I think your idea is good, but most people on this > list would rather talk the subject to death within the > list. John, It's a good thing that there is LNT, Linear Non-Threshold to "pain", per your comment above! ---------------------------------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From franz.schoenhofer at chello.at Tue Dec 27 11:47:27 2005 From: franz.schoenhofer at chello.at (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Franz_Sch=F6nhofer?=) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 18:47:27 +0100 Subject: AW: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP In-Reply-To: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA4A@orsnewea002.fda.gov> Message-ID: <001a01c60b0d$9d63c680$bf572fd5@pc1> Edmond and RADSAFErs, Having returned from a longer stay in Tunesia I find information about the most recent, ridiculous TFP nonsense on RADSAFE - it is a good laugh. As to the analytical aspects of determination of Sr-90 in teeth: We carried out a research programme on retrospective determination of Sr-90 in red-deer antlers (an excellent bioindicator!!) in order to determine the environmental contamination by Sr-90 during the late fifties up to the mid 90's. We developed a method in which we used 1 to 2 g of material from the antlers, using the ultra low-level liquid scintillation counter "Quantulus" and this amount was more than sufficient to perform at least two parallel determinations. The laboratory which performs Sr-90 analyses for the TFP uses a "Quantulus" and as far as I have been able to gather information about the chemical separation methods used, Ra-226 is separated (and anyway hardly present in teeth) and correct protocols are followed. Therefore the results seem to me to be trustworthy. The "gag" with the TFP is that it is an excellent example for how correct data can be easily used to support nonsensical claims, to distort facts, to make ridiculous correlations "confirming" totally wrong statements and how to manipulate scientific evidence and results for self-serving purposes. Best regards, Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone -43-0699-1168-1319 ---------------------------------------------------------------- > -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] Im > Auftrag von Baratta, Edmond J > Gesendet: Dienstag, 06. Dezember 2005 14:47 > An: 'Norm Cohen'; Know_Nukes at yahoogroups.com; Radsafe > Betreff: RE: [ RadSafe ] Seabrook Nukes and cancers: TFP > > I'm always amazed how data is obtained from 'baby' teeth. What 'low- > level' > method is used to for the deter minion of Strontium-90. The U.S. > Environmental Protection Agency had listed as the limits of detection for > Strontium-90 as 2 pCi/kg (0.074 Bq/kg). Certainly the amount of sample > used > must be very small. Do they combine a large amount of teeth or are they > from individual teeth? I would be interested in knowing more about this > method. > From EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV Tue Dec 27 11:57:21 2005 From: EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV (Baratta, Edmond J) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 12:57:21 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Radiation detectors at ports Message-ID: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA7F@orsnewea002.fda.gov> There are several products that cause detectors to register. One is any fruit that contains potassium (Potassium-40) such as bananas. Ceramic tiles contain naturally occurring radionuclides. Concentrated fruit juices and 'wild' mushrooms that contain both Cesium-137 and Potassium-40 from Eastern Europe and/or the former Republics of the USSR. Edmond J. Baratta Radiation Safety Officer Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 Fax: 781-729-3593 edmond.baratta at fda.gov The above are my comments and not those of my Agency! -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of MosheK at sviva.gov.il Sent: Sunday, December 25, 2005 4:23 AM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] Radiation detectors at ports Happy Hanuca to all, This was posted at May 16: "Robert Bonner, commissioner of U.S. Customs and Border Protection, told a Senate subcommittee on homeland security that since the first such devices were installed in May 2000, they had picked up over 10,000 radiation hits in vehicles or cargo shipments entering the country. All proved harmless." Has any one an idea what were the radiation levels caused those hits, was cargo type considered (bannanas, fertilizers, etc.), what about patients with residues of radioactive material or implanted barchitherapy sources? Regards, Moshe Keren ISRAEL _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From LNMolino at aol.com Tue Dec 27 12:23:02 2005 From: LNMolino at aol.com (LNMolino at aol.com) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 13:23:02 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Funny one Message-ID: <8e.34c9a19e.30e2e086@aol.com> The Physics of Santa and His Reindeer No known species of reindeer can fly. BUT there are 300,000 species of living organisms yet to be classified, and while most of these are insects and germs, this does not COMPLETELY rule out flying reindeer which only Santa has ever seen. There are two billion children (persons under 18) in the world. BUT since Santa doesn't appear to handle the Muslim, Hindu, Jewish and Buddhist children, that reduces the workload to 15% of the total ? There are two according to Population Reference Bureau. At an average (census) rate of 3.5 children per household, that's per house homes. One presumes there's at least one good child in each. Santa has 31 hours of Christmas to work with, thanks to the different time zones and the rotation of the earth, assuming he travels east to west (which seems logical). This works out to Santa has 31 h per second. This is to say that for each Christian household with good children, Santa has 1/1000th of a second to park, hop out of the sleigh, jump down the chimney, fill the stockings, distribute the remaining presents under the tree, eat whatever snacks have been left, get back up the chimney, get back into the sleigh and move on to the next house. Assuming that each of these This is to s stops are evenly distributed around the earth (which, of course, we know to be false but for the purposes of our calculations we will accept), we are now talking about stops ar per household, a total trip of 75? million miles, not counting stops to do what most of us must do at least once every per ho plus feeding and etc. This means that Santa's sleigh is moving at 650 miles per second, 3,000 times the speed of sound. For purposes of comparison, the fastest man-made vehicle on earth, the Ulysses space probe, moves at a poky This means t per second - a conventional reindeer can run, tops, per secon per hour. If every one of the 91.8 million homes with good children were to put out a single chocolate chip cookie and an If every glass of glass o the total calories (needless to say other vitamins and minerals) would be approximately the total c (100 for the cookie, give or take, and 125 for the milk, give or take). Multiplying the number of calories per house by the number of homes (225 x 91.8 x 1000000), we get the total number of calories Santa consumes that night, which is 20,655,000,000 calories. To break it down further, (100 is equal to is equal to Dividing our total number of calories by the number of calories in a pound (20655000000/3500) and we get the number of pounds Santa gains, 5901428.6, which is Dividing ou The payload on the sleigh adds another interesting element. Assuming that each child gets nothing more than a medium-sized lego set (two pounds), the sleigh is carrying 321,300 tons, not counting Santa, who is invariably described as overweight. On land, conventional reindeer can pull no more than The payload Even granting that "flying reindeer" (see above) could pull TEN TIMES the normal amount, we cannot do the job with eight, or even nine. We need 214,200 reindeer. This increases the payload (not even counting the weight of the sleigh) - to 353,430 tons. Again, for comparison - this is four times the weight of the Queen Elizabeth. 353,000 tons traveling at Even gra per second creates enormous air resistance - this will heat the reindeer up in the same fashion as spacecraft per seco the earth's atmosphere. The lead pair of reindeer will absorb the earth's atm joules of energy. Per second. Each. In short, they will burst into flame almost instantaneously, exposing the reindeer behind them, and create deafening sonic booms in their wake. The entire reindeer team will be vaporized within In short, they w of a second. Santa, meanwhile, will be subjected to centrifugal forces 17,500.06 times greater than gravity. A 250-pound Santa (which seems ludicrously slim) would be pinned to the back of his sleigh by 4,315,015 pounds of force. In conclusion: If Santa ever DID deliver presents on Christmas Eve, he's dead now. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino at aol.com 979-690-7559 (Office) 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the original author. From farbersa at optonline.net Tue Dec 27 12:54:41 2005 From: farbersa at optonline.net (farbersa at optonline.net) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 13:54:41 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Peter, Your suggestion is a good one. However, just debunking exaggerated or erroneous claims after the fact while vitally important is not enough. It's also important that nuclear endeavors find creative, impactful ways using radiation issues to reach the public, gain their interest, and get across the points that are vital to the public and regulators not fearing every Bq or stray photo bouncing around. On the first point about debunking critics, unfortunately, this objective is made all the more difficult by the fact that corporations that have the most to gain by highlighting the errors and even lies of critics often try to keep a low profile and avoid the public debate. I've sadly witnessed the latter issue, time and again. In one case, I was invited by one company to debate Dr. Najarian who had authored a "study" published by the Boston Globe "Spotlight Investigation Team" claiming a 10 fold excess of leukemia among the Portsmouth Naval Shipyard workers. I put in a request to my then employer to engage in this activity which would have involved an on-air debate on a Boston radio station with the VA physician Najarian who authored the study. I carefully noted in my request I would do it on my own time, would mention I was speaking as a private citizen, and would do it at a time approved by my supervisor so as not to interfere with any priority work. Shortly after making the request to participate in this on-air debate, I was summoned to the Chairman's office of my "public benefit corporation" employer and found myself in a room with a dozen lawyers positioned down the length of a 40 foot table with the Chairman on one end of the table and me on the other. I was told point blank by the Chairman of this multiple nuclear plant operator [and the largest non-Federal power generating company in the US]: "I want you to understand one thing regarding your request. If it ever comes to my attention that you have a made a statement in favor of nuclear energy, you will no longer be an employee of the XY Power Authority." I asked if I might ask one question and was told yes. My question was: "Why?" The answer was: "The Governor of this State does not approve of nuclear energy." Case closed. Subsequently, it took 10 years after a study was dragged out by NIOSH, for it to put out a study where the claims of Najerian were found lacking, and the results criticizing the original claims of a 10 fold excess of leukemia, were buried in the literature with essentially no public outreach. This tendency of many corporations to think that if they avoid getting into the fray and engaging their critics and at the extreme their enemies intent on destroying them, is a large part of why nuclear endeavors have withered. Most companies will not provide any time or support to technical people to get involved in debunking critics and as I have seen will often interfere with a staffperson who is willing to do it on their own time and initiative. Many years later, after I authored a satire during the 1988 election campaign on the "health hazards of Strepdukakis antinucleosis", I was invited to give a talk to the New England Chapter of the ANS on any subject I wished. Put together a talk about my personal experiences in trying to do various things in nuclear public information -some which turned out to be positive, some negative in terms of my corporate employers. The title of this talk was: "Nuclear Power and Public Information -- Suicide on the Installment Plan." The title says a lot about what the nuclear industry has and has not done in promoting its own, and the publics interest regarding the incentives for nuclear technologies. Regarding the Cs-137 in wood ash study I mentioned in a prior post. This study ended up being criticized by my then employer whose PR manager told reporters who inquired after I gave a paper about the results to an annual meeting of the HPS in Washington in 1991 [after going thru the paper approval process of my employer, having it peer reviewed by other staff, etc.] that it was not supported by the company, and that the company was "distancing itself" from the study. Nonetheless, I arranged to speak with dozens of reporters who wanted information about the subject from my home and was able to get dozens of articles in the popular press [newspapers, periodicals including Organic Gardening Magazine with a monthly paid subscriber base of 1,000,000 at the time] highlighting that despite wood ash having been found to have up to 20,000 picoCuries per kg of ash, it presented a trivial dose and a trivial risk. However, wastes of this concentration from nuclear plants and hospitals were having to be disposed of as radwaste at great cost. These results proved irresistable to the public and companies like the pulp and paper industry which generates tens of millions of tons of wood ash per year approached me and wanted the environmental lab with which I was affiliated to perform gamma spectroscopy analyses of the ash so this Wisconson based paper company had some data on the Cs-137 in their wood ash. My employer refused to do these radiological analyses. The paper company involved in making this request then asked me what kind of scam was I running where I raise a potential problem and then would not help them get some analyses done? Good question. Related to this same issue, the Nuclear Safety Advisor to the State of Maine called me to discuss my survey. He told me that the public was bombarding his office with questions about radioactivity in wood ash after about 3 or 4 Maine papers ran lengthy stories on the issue highlighting the inconsistent regulation of hospital and nuclear plant wastes vs. other radioactive waste streams. He said he had gotten multiple calls from upset Maine residents who had called my employer, asked to get some information, or talk to someone about the results and had their calls routed to the PR Manager. The callers were told the company, my employer, would not discuss the issue with any callers. Hmmmm, curioser and curioser. There was an underlying reason why the nuclear company involved would not talk about radioactivity in wood ash as I later found out which related to the use of biomass in power generation by certain utilities who did not want the issue to get any attention. A 50 MW[ e] biomass plant generates on the order of 1,000 cubic meters of woodash per year. The disposal of this ash can be made a lot more complicated if it is viewed as a waste, rather than mixed with manure and spread on the fields of large organic farming coops for soil amendment to replenish depleted potassium So once again, rather than a nuclear company establishing an optimal relationship with interested members of the public, other companies, and regulators on a radiation related risk perception issue, where they would have been able to develop a good working relationship based on their expertise, the nuclear endeavor ended up looking like it had something to hide by refusing to talk with the various publics involved. Another perfect example of "natching defeat from the jaws of victory" as is said. Too bad. Regards and Best Wishes for getting it right in the New Year, Stewart Farber, MS Public Health Consulting Scientist The Prometheus Group, LLC [203] 367-0791 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sandgren, Peter" Date: Tuesday, December 27, 2005 9:17 am Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 > I hope some of you learned folks have also sent your highly > informativeletters to the publications that have seen fit to print > Mangano'sunscientific claims. For my 2 cents, I believe that > anybody who > announces he/she has scientific and controversial "information" to > sharewill always find a reporter or newspaper to put their claims > in print. > > The best defense and the strongest safeguard we have is the knowledge > and experience of you folks on radsafe. For every distorted claim > thatmakes it into print, if two or three letters (with supporting > scientificreferences) come to contradict those claims, at least > one of those > letters will be printed, and rad-fearful minds will be calmed. These > email rebuttals that come into radsafe could, with a little polishing, > go far to hold back the tide of fear that threatens to close nuclear > plants around the country. So, thanks to all of you who take the time > to write! Please keep it up, and send them on to the newspapers. > Mostpapers will accept email letters as long as the name and > address (and > credentials!) of the writer are included. > > Happy New Year to all, > Peter Sandgren > > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On > Behalf Of farbersa at optonline.net > Sent: Friday, December 23, 2005 4:26 PM > To: goldinem at songs.sce.com > Cc: radsafe at radlab.nl > Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 > > Happy Holidays to all: > > If it were not for the fact that Mangano is so effective in fooling > gullible members of the media and the public with his unscientific > claims related to his being a 2nd generation Sternglass wannabe, his > "claims" would be laughable. > > However, in relation to his claims, the EPA has not even had a > consistent network of rainwater monitoring over the past 20 years > because there has been nothing worth monitoring outside of a brief > period in the aftermath of the Chernobyl accident. > > As an example of the absurdity of Mangano's environmental > radioactivityclaims in relation to Vermont Yankee, back in 1989- > 90, I carried out a > small study of Cs-137 in woodash derived from home fireplace > burning of > mature hardwoods all over the US. Several samples were collected from > Vermont. One came from my own fireplace at a vacation home I had in > Warren, VT over 100 miles from Vermont Yankee. The Cs-137 measured was > approx. 15,000 picoCuries per kg of ash after hardwoods grown from the > area around Warren, VT were burned and analyzed by quantitative gamma > spec analysis. > > Another sample of wood ash collected from the burning of mature > hardwoods growing around Vermont Yankee, was found to have only 1,500 > picoCuries of Cs-137 per kg of woodash --or 1/10 the concentration of > Cs-137 100 miles to the north, no where near a nuclear plant. Hmmmm. > > All the Cs-137 being measured in woodash in my study was derived from > the deposition of fallout from open air testing of nuclear weapons > whichended [except for a few small open air tests by the Chinese] > and the > Chernobyl fallout in 1986 [which added about 1% to the pre-existing > Cs-137 deposition in New England based on my extensive review of > environmental rad data gathered around all the nuclear plants in New > England]. Actual areal deposition of Cs-137 around New England is > fairly constant and cannot account for the 10 fold variability of > Cs-137 > measured in woodash from samples only 100 miles apart. The factors > thatappear to make a difference in the Cs-137 level in biomass are the > potassium levels in soil [low K, high Cs-137 uptake] and the > stable Cs > variability [high stable Cs in soil, high uptake of Cs-137 from > soil to > plant -too complex to explain this counterintuitive behavior here] in > soil from one location to another. > > Any Sr-90 deposition in the environment would be in proportion to the > Cs-137 given the relatively constant ratio of Sr-90/Cs-137 in fresh > fallout. So given the 10 fold lower concentration of Cs-137 in biomass > near Vermont Yankee measured in woodash, are we to conclude that being > in the proximity to a nuclear plant operating almost 20 years > since 1972 > to 1990, reduced Cs-137 [and perhaps Sr-90] in the environment?? > :-) > Perhaps the intake of air into the Vermont Yankee plant, and its > filtration before discharge up the stack cleans up the local > environment? Offered for your amusement only. But we could make an > argument of this sort that has absolutely no significance if we wanted > to have some fun and mislead gullible readers. > > If we wanted to play the games Mangano enjoys playing, we could argue > based on real environmental data that running a nuclear plant for > 20 or > so years reduces Cs-137 in the nearby environment dramatically vs. a > background area 100 miles away. Is this true. Of course not. It > is just > an indication of how variable environmental radioactivity including > Cs-137 and Sr-90 in biomass and other biota can be from one > location to > another. If you pick your data points selectively, or look at narrow > windows of time for one set of measurements vs. another, you can make > "conclusions" that appear credible on a first glance, but which are > only supported by that one set of data. > > Going back to 1972, the National Academy of Science harshly > criticicizedDr. Ernest Sternglass and his inflammatory claims > because his claims > were based on choosing only data which supported his hypothesis and > ignoring data which did not. Mangano has learned a lot from his mentor > Dr. Sternglass and is doing the same intellectually dishonest, and > unscientific manipulations that led to Dr. Sternglass being > chastised in > an Appendix to the National Academy of Sciences 1972 Biological > Effectsof Ionizing Radiation [BEIR] report. > > > Stewart Farber, MS Public Health > Consulting Scientist > radproject at optonline.net > [203] 367-0791 > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: goldinem at songs.sce.com > Date: Friday, December 23, 2005 1:09 pm > Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 > > > > > Regarding the Mangano claim that Vermont rainwater gross beta > > levels have > > increased over the years (due presumably to the operation of Vermont > > Yankee), Health Physics just published a paper on the analysis > of > > 22 years > > of air samples in New York State (Health Phys. 90 (1): 31-37; > > 2006. Kitto, > > et al, Long-Term Monitoring of Radioactivity in Surface Air and > > Depositionin New York State). Great stuff, all kinds of > > conclusions about how > > weather patterns affect gross beta and airborne cosmogenic > > radioactivity.Note the sample locations were selected in part > > because of proximity to > > three New York nuclear power plant sites. However, the only > > anthropogenic(wow, what a word) radionuclides were correlated > with > > sewage sludge > > incineration and a tritium-processing facility. Also > noteworthy, some > > analyses were conducted specifically for Sr-90 and/or Sr-89. > > Nothing was > > ever detected in any samples so "they will not be discussed > > further." So > > much for increasing trends in environmental strontium and baby > teeth.> > > By the way, the final argument by Mangano about "increased > > generation" by > > these "aging" power plants is actually quite wrong. When plants > > run well, > > as indicated by a 95% capacity factor, airborne releases are > typically> reduced. Startups and shutdowns are usually > responsible for greater > > effluent releases. So the "increased" Sr-90 in rainwater (if > > true, which I > > doubt) is negatively correlated with Vermont Yankee's operation. > > > Plus I'm > > quite sure that VY's Radiological Environmental Monitoring > Program > > confirmsno radiological impact from plant operation on the local > > environs. > > Eric M. Goldin, CHP > > > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and > understoodthe RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > From franz.schoenhofer at chello.at Tue Dec 27 15:54:16 2005 From: franz.schoenhofer at chello.at (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Franz_Sch=F6nhofer?=) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 22:54:16 +0100 Subject: AW: RE: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <007a01c60b30$1887da50$bf572fd5@pc1> Stewart, I have said it over and over again and will continue to do so: Nuclear power and radioactivity is not a scientific issue. It is a political one. You confirm it. Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone -43-0699-1168-1319 > -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] Im > Auftrag von farbersa at optonline.net > Gesendet: Dienstag, 27. Dezember 2005 19:55 > An: Sandgren, Peter > Cc: Philip.Mikan at po.state.ct.us; radsafe at radlab.nl > Betreff: Re: RE: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 > > Hi Peter, > Your suggestion is a good one. However, just debunking exaggerated or > erroneous claims after the fact while vitally important is not enough. > It's also important that nuclear endeavors find creative, impactful ways > using radiation issues to reach the public, gain their interest, and get > across the points that are vital to the public and regulators not fearing > every Bq or stray photo bouncing around. > > On the first point about debunking critics, unfortunately, this objective > is made all the more difficult by the fact that corporations that have the > most to gain by highlighting the errors and even lies of critics often try > to keep a low profile and avoid the public debate. > > I've sadly witnessed the latter issue, time and again. In one case, I was > invited by one company to debate Dr. Najarian who had authored a "study" > published by the Boston Globe "Spotlight Investigation Team" claiming a 10 > fold excess of leukemia among the Portsmouth Naval Shipyard workers. I > put in a request to my then employer to engage in this activity which > would have involved an on-air debate on a Boston radio station with the VA > physician Najarian who authored the study. I carefully noted in my > request I would do it on my own time, would mention I was speaking as a > private citizen, and would do it at a time approved by my supervisor so as > not to interfere with any priority work. > > Shortly after making the request to participate in this on-air debate, I > was summoned to the Chairman's office of my "public benefit corporation" > employer and found myself in a room with a dozen lawyers positioned down > the length of a 40 foot table with the Chairman on one end of the table > and me on the other. I was told point blank by the Chairman of this > multiple nuclear plant operator [and the largest non-Federal power > generating company in the US]: > > "I want you to understand one thing regarding your request. If it ever > comes to my attention that you have a made a statement in favor of nuclear > energy, you will no longer be an employee of the XY Power Authority." > > I asked if I might ask one question and was told yes. My question was: > "Why?" > > The answer was: "The Governor of this State does not approve of nuclear > energy." Case closed. > > Subsequently, it took 10 years after a study was dragged out by NIOSH, > for it to put out a study where the claims of Najerian were found lacking, > and the results criticizing the original claims of a 10 fold excess of > leukemia, were buried in the literature with essentially no public > outreach. > > This tendency of many corporations to think that if they avoid getting > into the fray and engaging their critics and at the extreme their enemies > intent on destroying them, is a large part of why nuclear endeavors have > withered. Most companies will not provide any time or support to > technical people to get involved in debunking critics and as I have seen > will often interfere with a staffperson who is willing to do it on their > own time and initiative. > > Many years later, after I authored a satire during the 1988 election > campaign on the "health hazards of Strepdukakis antinucleosis", I was > invited to give a talk to the New England Chapter of the ANS on any > subject I wished. Put together a talk about my personal experiences in > trying to do various things in nuclear public information -some which > turned out to be positive, some negative in terms of my corporate > employers. The title of this talk was: > > "Nuclear Power and Public Information -- Suicide on the Installment Plan." > > The title says a lot about what the nuclear industry has and has not done > in promoting its own, and the publics interest regarding the incentives > for nuclear technologies. > > Regarding the Cs-137 in wood ash study I mentioned in a prior post. This > study ended up being criticized by my then employer whose PR manager told > reporters who inquired after I gave a paper about the results to an annual > meeting of the HPS in Washington in 1991 [after going thru the paper > approval process of my employer, having it peer reviewed by other staff, > etc.] that it was not supported by the company, and that the company was > "distancing itself" from the study. Nonetheless, I arranged to speak with > dozens of reporters who wanted information about the subject from my home > and was able to get dozens of articles in the popular press [newspapers, > periodicals including Organic Gardening Magazine with a monthly paid > subscriber base of 1,000,000 at the time] highlighting that despite wood > ash having been found to have up to 20,000 picoCuries per kg of ash, it > presented a trivial dose and a trivial risk. However, wastes of this > concentration from nuclear plants and hospitals > were having to be disposed of as radwaste at great cost. > > These results proved irresistable to the public and companies like the > pulp and paper industry which generates tens of millions of tons of wood > ash per year approached me and wanted the environmental lab with which I > was affiliated to perform gamma spectroscopy analyses of the ash so this > Wisconson based paper company had some data on the Cs-137 in their wood > ash. My employer refused to do these radiological analyses. The paper > company involved in making this request then asked me what kind of scam > was I running where I raise a potential problem and then would not help > them get some analyses done? Good question. > > Related to this same issue, the Nuclear Safety Advisor to the State of > Maine called me to discuss my survey. He told me that the public was > bombarding his office with questions about radioactivity in wood ash after > about 3 or 4 Maine papers ran lengthy stories on the issue highlighting > the inconsistent regulation of hospital and nuclear plant wastes vs. other > radioactive waste streams. He said he had gotten multiple calls from > upset Maine residents who had called my employer, asked to get some > information, or talk to someone about the results and had their calls > routed to the PR Manager. The callers were told the company, my employer, > would not discuss the issue with any callers. Hmmmm, curioser and > curioser. There was an underlying reason why the nuclear company involved > would not talk about radioactivity in wood ash as I later found out which > related to the use of biomass in power generation by certain utilities who > did not want the issue to get any attention. A 50 MW[ > e] biomass plant generates on the order of 1,000 cubic meters of woodash > per year. The disposal of this ash can be made a lot more complicated > if it is viewed as a waste, rather than mixed with manure and spread on > the fields of large organic farming coops for soil amendment to replenish > depleted potassium > > So once again, rather than a nuclear company establishing an optimal > relationship with interested members of the public, other companies, and > regulators on a radiation related risk perception issue, where they would > have been able to develop a good working relationship based on their > expertise, the nuclear endeavor ended up looking like it had something to > hide by refusing to talk with the various publics involved. Another > perfect example of "natching defeat from the jaws of victory" as is said. > Too bad. > > > Regards and Best Wishes for getting it right in the New Year, > > Stewart Farber, MS Public Health > Consulting Scientist > The Prometheus Group, LLC > [203] 367-0791 From franz.schoenhofer at chello.at Tue Dec 27 17:21:24 2005 From: franz.schoenhofer at chello.at (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Franz_Sch=F6nhofer?=) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 00:21:24 +0100 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Information on TFP etc. urgently needed Message-ID: <007c01c60b3c$411cfd40$bf572fd5@pc1> Dear RADSAFErs, I need urgently some information about the TFP and ?publications? of the ?scientists? involved in it and other nonsense like the ?elevated gross-beta? story, Sternglass etc.: Does anybody know about papers of these persons which have been published in peer reviewed journals? (I think to remember that recently one journal has been mentioned on RADSAFE which published something about the TFP.) Has anybody the link to the description of the Sr-90 analytical method at hand? I know that it exists and I commented at RADSAFE about it, stating that it seems to be o.k., but I obviously lost the link. Please no arguments why those ?scientists? are wrong, I have myself more than enough and even better ones than I read at RADSAFE recently. Thanks! Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 From ksparth at yahoo.co.uk Tue Dec 27 18:27:16 2005 From: ksparth at yahoo.co.uk (parthasarathy k s) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 00:27:16 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Background from Static Electricity in Tritium counters In-Reply-To: <002c01c60af4$e5cea160$4501a8c0@RAMSERVICE1> Message-ID: <20051228002716.17798.qmail@web26406.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Don, I found that I did not mark a copy of my response to all. Since it may be of interest to all handling liquid scintillation counters let me mark a copy for all. "A research group in a University in India, while carrying out study of photosynthesis using plankton grown in an atmosphere CO2 labelled with C-14, experienced serious background fluctuations. Some of the amateurs inthe group felt that they discovered some new effect. They were getting more counts than what was estmated from the activity in the sample! It took some time for them to identify the source. Plankton exposed to light glows for some time. The erratic background got stabilized after they kept the samples to be counted in the light tight liquid scintillation counter for a few days! K.S.Parthasarathy" Don Jordan wrote: Using natural latex gloves causes a lot of static problems. Switching to nitrile gloves will solve the problem. I believe that vinyl gloves also do not cause static, but I have not used them. The fabric softener wipes will eventually deposit a lot of crud in your scintillation counter. My experience with static is that one gets very erratic counts. In one count you'll get 10,000 counts, the next one will be a few hundred, and the one after that will be 20,000. The problem you describe sounds more like chemiluminescence, except for the increase when you remove a vial from the counter. This sounds more like phosphorescence caused by fluorescent lights or direct sunlight. Don Jordan RAM Services, Inc. 510 County Highway V Two Rivers, WI 54241 DonJordan at ramservicesinc.com Voice: +1-920-686-3889 _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ --------------------------------- To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. From hflong at pacbell.net Tue Dec 27 18:31:15 2005 From: hflong at pacbell.net (howard long) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 16:31:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Hope for science, vs "US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980" In-Reply-To: <007a01c60b30$1887da50$bf572fd5@pc1> Message-ID: <20051228003115.65033.qmail@web81806.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Franz, scientific facts used in nuclear power do not go away. Politicians do. Happy New Year Howard Long Franz Sch?nhofer wrote: Stewart, I have said it over and over again and will continue to do so: Nuclear power and radioactivity is not a scientific issue. It is a political one. You confirm it. Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone -43-0699-1168-1319 From BLHamrick at aol.com Tue Dec 27 19:47:09 2005 From: BLHamrick at aol.com (BLHamrick at aol.com) Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 20:47:09 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] RE: Mangano: US Beta Levels Up 40% Since 1980 Message-ID: It is not just corporate America, but also the government agencies (who, in my opinion, have a duty to address these issues head on), that decline to provide appropriate information in public fora, because they are afraid of political fallout, so to speak. Barbara In a message dated 12/27/2005 12:59:24 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, farbersa at optonline.net writes: On the first point about debunking critics, unfortunately, this objective is made all the more difficult by the fact that corporations that have the most to gain by highlighting the errors and even lies of critics often try to keep a low profile and avoid the public debate. From luke.mccormick at dhs.gov Wed Dec 28 07:32:55 2005 From: luke.mccormick at dhs.gov (Mccormick, Luke I) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 08:32:55 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Radiation detectors at ports Message-ID: Radiation hits at the border are common and are usually mundane; a container of bananas, Italian granite, TV set components from China, ceramic bathroom fixtures. Most all of the radiopharmaceuticals are shipped into this country. At Bota alone we hit on 25 people per month who have gone to Mexico either after having radiotherapy or to obtain cheap radiotherapy. Utensils made of contaminated steel, as well as radioactive commodities such as lantern mantles have been stopped. By "harmless" the commissioner meant none were dirty bombs or nuclear weapons. ____________________Reply Separator____________________ Subject: [ RadSafe ] Radiation detectors at ports Author: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl Date: 12/25/2005 4:22 AM Happy Hanuca to all, This was posted at May 16: "Robert Bonner, commissioner of U.S. Customs and Border Protection, told a Senate subcommittee on homeland security that since the first such devices were installed in May 2000, they had picked up over 10,000 radiation hits in vehicles or cargo shipments entering the country. All proved harmless." Has any one an idea what were the radiation levels caused those hits, was cargo type considered (bannanas, fertilizers, etc.), what about patients with residues of radioactive material or implanted barchitherapy sources? Regards, Moshe Keren ISRAEL _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Wed Dec 28 08:48:08 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 06:48:08 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Article: Scientists Try to Resolve Nuclear Problem With an Old Technology Made New Again Message-ID: <20051228144808.7129.qmail@web54305.mail.yahoo.com> I apologize is this has been posted before. From the New York Times, at http://www.nytimes.com/2005/12/27/science/27nuke.html?th&emc=th ------------------------------------------------------------------ December 27, 2005 Scientists Try to Resolve Nuclear Problem With an Old Technology Made New Again By MATTHEW L. WALD WASHINGTON, Dec. 25 - Decades ago, scientists and engineers thought it would be easy enough to deal with the radioactive waste from nuclear power plants: sort out and save the small portion that was reusable, and put the rest in a hole in the ground. It did not work out that way. Reprocessing the waste proved to be both expensive and risky: the main material being scavenged, plutonium, is a nuclear bomb fuel. And that hole in the ground - the proposed Yucca Mountain repository in Nevada - is years behind schedule, bogged down in politics and environmental disputes. Even if it opens, it will be far too small for the amount of waste that is being generated. So last month, Congress voted $50 million for the Energy Department to explore a new kind of reprocessing, one that would reuse a much larger fraction of the waste. The idea is extremely ambitious. It would require perfecting not only a new method of reprocessing, but also a new class of reactors to burn the salvaged material. Still, proponents said it would have two great advantages: It would mean that Yucca Mountain would be big enough to accommodate the waste that could not be recycled. And it would make Yucca easier to open, because the material still to be buried would generate less heat in the centuries to come. "Reprocessing, or processing spent fuel before it's put in the repository, is a very good way to buy time," said Roger W. Gale, a former Energy Department official who is now an electricity consultant. "It's a fail-safe in case we continue to have problems with Yucca Mountain." Many experts are skeptical that the new strategy, which would involve separating the components of spent fuel and putting the salvaged material in reactors using higher-energy neutrons, will work. Another former Energy Department official, Robert Alvarez, noted that the idea of reprocessing had been around for at least 40 years, each time with a different rationale. "Once, it was part of breeder program," Mr. Alvarez said, referring to a scheme to use reactors to make more nuclear fuel than the reactor consumed. "Then it became a proliferation thing," with supporters reasoning that such a system would safely consume materials that could be used for a bomb. "And now it's a waste-management thing," he said. "But the whole problem is they're pouring money into something that's cutting-edge for the late 1960's." Some scientists argue that recycling is essential. At a recent Washington forum on nuclear waste and its possible uses, Phillip J. Finck, deputy associate director of the Argonne National Laboratory, an Energy Department complex, said that by 2010, long before Yucca Mountain can open (if, indeed, it ever does), the United States would have more than the 70,000 metric tons of fuel that will fit there. Moreover, Mr. Finck argued, without recycled fuel, the world will have to rely on finite reserves of uranium. At the forum, sponsored by the Foundation for Nuclear Studies of Washington, Ernest J. Moniz, a physics professor at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology and a former under secretary of energy, said that if the world built enough reactors to provide energy without contributing to global warming, a new Yucca Mountain would be needed every three and a half years. But Professor Moniz and others expressed caution about reprocessing. Frank N. von Hippel, a physicist at Princeton, said that a new generation of reactors would cost tens of billions of dollars and that it would be a long time before it was clear that reprocessed fuel was needed. The fuel to be reprocessed would be too radioactive to move very far; hence the idea was that the reprocessing plant would be adjacent to the reactor. Ivan Oelrich, vice president of the Federation of American Scientists, said that building scores of new reactors, with a reprocessing plant adjacent, was unlikely, and that while opening Yucca would be hard, switching to this kind of reprocessing was "trading one difficult political problem for an impossible problem." Still, concern over global warming and the increase in natural gas prices have given hope to nuclear advocates, who want new waste techniques as well as new reactors. The reprocessing strategy is subtle - to extract more use out of used fuel and to reduce the heat created by waste that cannot be recycled and still has to be buried. The heat is not a problem in the first few decades, when a repository could be left open for ventilation. The harder time is the next 1,500 years, when heat would be given off by longer-lived radioactive materials, mostly a category called actinides, and also the isotopes that are created as those actinides go through radioactive decay. Heat, not volume or weight, determines the physical capacity of Yucca or any other underground repository, because designers want to keep the repository below the boiling point of water. Above the boiling point, the resulting steam could damage the containers and possibly the rock as well. Reprocessing means chopping up nuclear fuel and separating the ingredients, uranium that was not used in the reactor and other elements that were created in the reactor and could be used as fuel, including plutonium and neptunium. Gulf Oil tried to do that in the early 60's in West Valley, in upstate New York, but dropped it as uneconomical, leaving the taxpayers with a cleanup bill of more than $1 billion. At that plant, and at plants still operated in Britain and France, the plutonium is recovered by chemical separation. The new plan is for "electrometallurgical" reprocessing, in which giant electrodes are inserted in a mix of waste components, somewhat like electroplating. The salvaged materials include uranium 235, the isotope used in bombs, which splits easily, and uranium 238, which makes up more than 99 percent of uranium in nature but is harder to split. One use of uranium 238 in a reactor is as a "fertile" material that can absorb stray neutrons and become plutonium 239, which can be used in reactors and bombs. But existing reactors split the uranium using "thermal" neutrons. The new ones would use "fast" neutrons, which travel thousands of times as fast. The current generation of American power reactors uses water to slow the neutrons to the speed optimal for splitting uranium 235. The water also carries off the heat, which is used to make electricity. Fast neutrons, in contrast, have enough energy to split uranium 238. But to make use of them, reactors would need a heat transfer fluid that does not slow down the neutrons, probably molten sodium. The water-based reactors are kept under high pressure to keep the water from boiling. A sodium reactor could run with the sodium at atmospheric pressure. At some point, the sodium has to be run through a heat exchanger, a cluster of thin-walled metal tubes, to give off its energy to ordinary water, which turns to steam and spins a turbine for electricity. And if there is a leak and the sodium and water come into contact, the sodium burns. There are other problems. Plutonium and neptunium are potential bomb fuels; the risk that they might be illicitly diverted, or that other countries might follow the United States' example and build their own reprocessing centers, led two presidents, Gerald R. Ford and Jimmy Carter, to block General Electric from opening a reprocessing center in Morris, Ill. Further, the companies that run reactors are showing no interest in new kinds of reactors and little interest in plutonium. When the Energy Department decided to get rid of some surplus weapons-type plutonium by turning it into nuclear fuel, no utilities would take it, even at no charge. The Tennessee Valley Authority finally agreed to take the fuel. It described the transaction as selling the government "irradiation services." Copyright 2005 The New York Times Company +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL ? Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com From franz.schoenhofer at chello.at Wed Dec 28 14:00:54 2005 From: franz.schoenhofer at chello.at (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Franz_Sch=F6nhofer?=) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 21:00:54 +0100 Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Message-ID: <00cf01c60be9$698fe000$bf572fd5@pc1> Dear RADSAFErs, Thanks to those who gave me hints and links which help me with my first questions. The next question is, whether anybody has data available about the concentration of Radium-226 (and Ra-228) in human teeth and/or bones. One of the links showed, that actually the Ra-226 was not separated contrary to what I had in memory. The description of the analytical process in one of the links was further obscured by false information about the instrument used (Quantulus). Therefore I would like to estimate what the error in Sr-90 concentration could be when not taking Ra-226 into account. Of course I know, that the Ra-226 concentration will depend on the environment ? as well as the Sr-90 concentration. One more question to the US-American RADSAFErs: I find a Joseph J. Mangano, MPH MBA not only as the National Coordinator of the RPHP website, but also as an author of ?Radioactive Strontium-90 in baby teeth of New Jersey children and the link with cancer: A special report. I know that MBA means ?Master of Business Administration?, but what does MPH mean? Master of Physics? Master of Philosophy? That MBA does not really point towards a scientific background seems to be clear, but does MPH? Thanks again for a very fast reply. Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 From jimm at WPI.EDU Wed Dec 28 14:25:50 2005 From: jimm at WPI.EDU (Muckerheide, James) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 15:25:50 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Message-ID: <71A6142F930A1E4C9300D4088D9765C85FF7DC@EXCHDB.admin.wpi.edu> Master of Public Health Regards, Jim Muckerheide =================== > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On > Behalf Of Franz Sch?nhofer > Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:01 PM > To: RADSAFE > Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions > > Dear RADSAFErs, > > > > Thanks to those who gave me hints and links which help me with my first > questions. The next question is, whether anybody has data available about > the concentration of Radium-226 (and Ra-228) in human teeth and/or bones. > One of the links showed, that actually the Ra-226 was not separated > contrary > to what I had in memory. The description of the analytical process in one > of > the links was further obscured by false information about the instrument > used (Quantulus). Therefore I would like to estimate what the error in Sr- > 90 > concentration could be when not taking Ra-226 into account. Of course I > know, that the Ra-226 concentration will depend on the environment - as > well > as the Sr-90 concentration. > > > > One more question to the US-American RADSAFErs: I find a Joseph J. Mangano, > MPH MBA not only as the National Coordinator of the RPHP website, but > also > as an author of "Radioactive Strontium-90 in baby teeth of New Jersey > children and the link with cancer: A special report. I know that MBA means > "Master of Business Administration", but what does MPH mean? Master of > Physics? Master of Philosophy? That MBA does not really point towards a > scientific background seems to be clear, but does MPH? > > > > Thanks again for a very fast reply. > > > > Franz > > > > Franz Schoenhofer > > PhD, MR iR > > Habicherg. 31/7 > > A-1160 Vienna > > AUSTRIA > > phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 > > phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 > > > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From kerrembaev at yahoo.com Wed Dec 28 14:26:25 2005 From: kerrembaev at yahoo.com (Emil) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 12:26:25 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] (chernobyl mushrooms)Re: Radiation detectors at ports Message-ID: <20051228202625.23101.qmail@web51611.mail.yahoo.com> Greetings, What MDA's are you talking about? Concentrated juices and "wild" mushrooms from the eastern Europe would alarm? I don't think so! I counted on HPGe gamma spec a...huuuge 10 pound-er mushroom in Chernobyl in 1988, just traces of Cs-137 a few pCi/g. We eat it!!! After that I had whole body counts done at 15 USA plants(some counts 1 hour long) and they never showed ANY traces of Cs-137. Just potassium-40 :-) I just left Vegas but if I still were there, I would bet 1000:1 on: "No port screening system would alarm on Chernobyl mushrooms". If you worked with gamma counting systems, you would know that we are talking about "Environmental" levels pCi of Cs-137, it is less than 1 dpm.... I can imagine scenario when somebody brought Chernobyl mushrooms and you counted it in lab conditions with low BKG. Field units..... I don't think so. Regards, Emil. > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 12:57:21 -0500 > From: "Baratta, Edmond J" > Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] Radiation detectors at ports > To: '??? ??? Moshe Keren' , > radsafe at radlab.nl > Message-ID: > <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA7F at orsnewea002.fda.gov> > Content-Type: text/plain > > There are several products that cause detectors to register. One > is any > fruit that contains potassium (Potassium-40) such as bananas. > Ceramic tiles > contain naturally occurring radionuclides. Concentrated fruit > juices and > 'wild' mushrooms that contain both Cesium-137 and Potassium-40 from > Eastern > Europe and/or the former Republics of the USSR. > > > Edmond J. Baratta > Radiation Safety Officer > Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 > Fax: 781-729-3593 > edmond.baratta at fda.gov > > The above are my comments and not those of my Agency! > > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] > On Behalf > Of MosheK at sviva.gov.il > Sent: Sunday, December 25, 2005 4:23 AM > To: radsafe at radlab.nl > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Radiation detectors at ports > > Happy Hanuca to all, > > This was posted at May 16: > > "Robert Bonner, commissioner of U.S. Customs and Border Protection, > told a > Senate subcommittee on homeland security that since the first such > devices > were installed in May 2000, they had picked up over 10,000 > radiation hits in > vehicles or cargo shipments entering the country. All proved > harmless." > > Has any one an idea what were the radiation levels caused those > hits, was > cargo type considered (bannanas, fertilizers, etc.), what about > patients > with residues of radioactive material or implanted barchitherapy > sources? > > Regards, > > Moshe Keren > > ISRAEL > __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL ? Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com From jmarshall.reber at comcast.net Wed Dec 28 14:26:32 2005 From: jmarshall.reber at comcast.net (J. Marshall Reber) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 15:26:32 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions In-Reply-To: <00cf01c60be9$698fe000$bf572fd5@pc1> Message-ID: <3BD5FCF0-77E0-11DA-B6C3-0003939BB85A@comcast.net> From one website: MPH Master of Public Health (conferee) or Masters in Public Health (program). From another website: Also an abbreviation for the Master of Public Health degree. People in an MPH program learn about topics such as nutrition, epidemiology, health education, occupational health, and so on. MPH programs usually require a year or two of study, depending in part on whether students go full-time or part-time. Some people enter MPH programs straight out of college; others earn an MPH while they're in medical school or law school; still others are practicing doctors or nurses who have returned to school to broaden their understanding of public health issues. Graduates of MPH programs can work in a variety of fields; people with an MPH alone frequently work as nutritionists, administrators, or policymakers; people with a doctoral degree often work as scientists, doctors, nurses, or lawyers with a special focus on public health. From ncohen12 at comcast.net Wed Dec 28 14:31:38 2005 From: ncohen12 at comcast.net (Norm Cohen) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 15:31:38 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions In-Reply-To: <00cf01c60be9$698fe000$bf572fd5@pc1> Message-ID: Masters in Public Health. Norm Coalition for Peace and Justice; UNPLUG Salem Campaign, 321 Barr Ave, Linwood; NJ08221; 609-601-8583 -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Franz Sch?nhofer Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:01 PM To: RADSAFE Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Dear RADSAFErs, Thanks to those who gave me hints and links which help me with my first questions. The next question is, whether anybody has data available about the concentration of Radium-226 (and Ra-228) in human teeth and/or bones. One of the links showed, that actually the Ra-226 was not separated contrary to what I had in memory. The description of the analytical process in one of the links was further obscured by false information about the instrument used (Quantulus). Therefore I would like to estimate what the error in Sr-90 concentration could be when not taking Ra-226 into account. Of course I know, that the Ra-226 concentration will depend on the environment ? as well as the Sr-90 concentration. One more question to the US-American RADSAFErs: I find a Joseph J. Mangano, MPH MBA not only as the National Coordinator of the RPHP website, but also as an author of ?Radioactive Strontium-90 in baby teeth of New Jersey children and the link with cancer: A special report. I know that MBA means ?Master of Business Administration?, but what does MPH mean? Master of Physics? Master of Philosophy? That MBA does not really point towards a scientific background seems to be clear, but does MPH? Thanks again for a very fast reply. Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From crispy_bird at yahoo.com Wed Dec 28 15:12:51 2005 From: crispy_bird at yahoo.com (John Jacobus) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 13:12:51 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions In-Reply-To: <71A6142F930A1E4C9300D4088D9765C85FF7DC@EXCHDB.admin.wpi.edu> Message-ID: <20051228211251.87027.qmail@web54304.mail.yahoo.com> How about Master of Public Hype. --- "Muckerheide, James" wrote: > Master of Public Health > > Regards, Jim Muckerheide > =================== > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl > [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On > > Behalf Of Franz Sch?nhofer > > Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:01 PM > > To: RADSAFE > > Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions > > > > Dear RADSAFErs, > > > > +++++++++++++++++++ "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer -- John John Jacobus, MS Certified Health Physicist e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com __________________________________ Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year. http://brand.yahoo.com/cybergivingweek2005/ From franz.schoenhofer at chello.at Wed Dec 28 15:18:43 2005 From: franz.schoenhofer at chello.at (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Franz_Sch=F6nhofer?=) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 22:18:43 +0100 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH Message-ID: <00dc01c60bf4$47f433f0$bf572fd5@pc1> Dear collegues, Thank you for your multiple responses, which interpret MPH as ?Master of Public Health?. Not really an exciting title for somebody who submits ?scientific? papers on radiation protection. Once again RADSAFE has proved to be the ultimate source of information! Now I wait for responses for the first part of my inquiry .. Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 From franz.schoenhofer at chello.at Wed Dec 28 15:19:37 2005 From: franz.schoenhofer at chello.at (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Franz_Sch=F6nhofer?=) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 22:19:37 +0100 Subject: AW: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions In-Reply-To: <20051228211251.87027.qmail@web54304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <00e101c60bf4$6b108b90$bf572fd5@pc1> This would apply to the person I mentioned....... Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone -43-0699-1168-1319 > -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: John Jacobus [mailto:crispy_bird at yahoo.com] > Gesendet: Mittwoch, 28. Dezember 2005 22:13 > An: Muckerheide, James; Franz Sch?nhofer; RADSAFE > Betreff: RE: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions > > How about Master of Public Hype. > > --- "Muckerheide, James" wrote: > > > Master of Public Health > > > > Regards, Jim Muckerheide > > =================== > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl > > [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On > > > Behalf Of Franz Sch?nhofer > > > Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:01 PM > > > To: RADSAFE > > > Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions > > > > > > Dear RADSAFErs, > > > > > > > > +++++++++++++++++++ > "Efforts and courage are not enough without purpose and direction." > "John F. Kennedy, U.S. President and former Naval Officer > > -- John > John Jacobus, MS > Certified Health Physicist > e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year. > http://brand.yahoo.com/cybergivingweek2005/ From wattsa at ohio.edu Wed Dec 28 15:34:21 2005 From: wattsa at ohio.edu (Alan Watts) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 16:34:21 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions In-Reply-To: <00cf01c60be9$698fe000$bf572fd5@pc1> References: <00cf01c60be9$698fe000$bf572fd5@pc1> Message-ID: <113769093.1135787661@dhcp-110-041.cns.ohiou.edu> MPH is a Masters of Public Health. I think that is more related to food borne illnesses and diseases. Alan Alan Watts RSO Ohio University --On Wednesday, December 28, 2005 9:00 PM +0100 Franz Sch?nhofer wrote: > Dear RADSAFErs, > > > > Thanks to those who gave me hints and links which help me with my first > questions. The next question is, whether anybody has data available about > the concentration of Radium-226 (and Ra-228) in human teeth and/or bones. > One of the links showed, that actually the Ra-226 was not separated > contrary to what I had in memory. The description of the analytical > process in one of the links was further obscured by false information > about the instrument used (Quantulus). Therefore I would like to estimate > what the error in Sr-90 concentration could be when not taking Ra-226 > into account. Of course I know, that the Ra-226 concentration will depend > on the environment ? as well as the Sr-90 concentration. > > > > One more question to the US-American RADSAFErs: I find a Joseph J. > Mangano, MPH MBA not only as the National Coordinator of the RPHP > website, but also as an author of ?Radioactive Strontium-90 in baby teeth > of New Jersey children and the link with cancer: A special report. I know > that MBA means ?Master of Business Administration?, but what does MPH > mean? Master of Physics? Master of Philosophy? That MBA does not really > point towards a scientific background seems to be clear, but does MPH? > > > > Thanks again for a very fast reply. > > > > Franz > > > > Franz Schoenhofer > > PhD, MR iR > > Habicherg. 31/7 > > A-1160 Vienna > > AUSTRIA > > phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 > > phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 > > > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood > the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings > visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From NSSIHOU at aol.com Wed Dec 28 19:44:34 2005 From: NSSIHOU at aol.com (NSSIHOU at aol.com) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 20:44:34 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Background from Static Electricity in Tritium counters Message-ID: <157.5e4fedd1.30e49982@aol.com> The problem with the scint vials in liquid scintillation sounds more like chemoluminescence than static charge. bob gallagher NSSI From JPreisig at aol.com Wed Dec 28 20:57:17 2005 From: JPreisig at aol.com (JPreisig at aol.com) Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 21:57:17 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Static Electricity Message-ID: <261.45f44d9.30e4aa8d@aol.com> Hmmmmmm, This is from: jpreisig at aol.com . Hi Radsafers, Static electricity in the laboratory??? How about installing a (highly stable) humidifier for the wintertime??? Has anyone tried this??? Brookhaven AGS/RHIC news: Seems like the heavy ion accelerator run for 2005-2006 is in peril. Cashflow problems at Brookhaven. See their website. A human capital crisis in accelerator health physics??? Perhaps??? LHC is being built at CERN. A linear collider is eventually slated for Fermilab. The Spallation Neutron Source is being constructed at Oak Ridge (ORNL). Are any other actual construction projects slated for the USA??? Well, enjoy 2006. Regards, Joseph (Joe) R. Preisig, Ph.D. From farbersa at optonline.net Wed Dec 28 23:34:23 2005 From: farbersa at optonline.net (farbersa at optonline.net) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 00:34:23 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH In-Reply-To: <00dc01c60bf4$47f433f0$bf572fd5@pc1> References: <00dc01c60bf4$47f433f0$bf572fd5@pc1> Message-ID: Many MPH or MSPH programs involve extensive coursework in biostatistics and epidemiology so don't be too quick to dismiss an analysis of some issue based solely on the individual having an MPH degree. I have no idea what coursework or concentration within Public Health Mr. Mangano may have had. In my own case, having taken a two year MSPH degree with a concentration in Air Pollution Control, the program involved a core of courses in Micrometerology, Civil Engineering, Chemical Engineering and two years of coursework in biostatistics and a year course in Epidemiology, and various electives like Radiological Health, as well as a research thesis to develop an ultrasensitive technique for measuring ambient Hg in air and running an air monitoring network for a time. My program also involved all the basic Public Health courses [Public Health Practice, Environmental Sciences] which might be more common alone in a one year MPH degree. Happy New Year to all, Stewart Farber, MS Public Health [Air Pollution Control] UMass Amherst School of Public Health '73 [203] 367-0791 ----- Original Message ----- From: Franz Sch?nhofer Date: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 4:18 pm Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH > Dear collegues, > > > > Thank you for your multiple responses, which interpret MPH as > ?Master of > Public Health?. Not really an exciting title for somebody who submits > ?scientific? papers on radiation protection. > > > > Once again RADSAFE has proved to be the ultimate source of > information! > > > Now I wait for responses for the first part of my inquiry .. > > > > Franz > > > > Franz Schoenhofer > > PhD, MR iR > > Habicherg. 31/7 > > A-1160 Vienna > > AUSTRIA > > phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 > > phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 > > > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and > understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other > settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV Thu Dec 29 07:57:13 2005 From: EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV (Baratta, Edmond J) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 08:57:13 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Message-ID: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA84@orsnewea002.fda.gov> Good morning Franz: I had asked that question earlier about Strontium-90. The amount of Radium-226 in foods (where it would be ingested from) was been shown to be <0.037 Bq/kg). The U.S. Public Health Service in the 60's (1964-1967) did Studies on Diets of children. It was reported in "Evaluation of Radium-226 in Total Diet Samples, June 1964 to July 1967" U.S. Public Health Service, Radiological Health Data and Reports 6:371-377 (1969). Also similar work was done by Fisenne, J.M.and H. W. Walker "Radium-226 in the Diet in two Cities", U.S. AEC Report HASL-24 (1970). Strontium-90 in bones was also done during that time. The samples were taken from accident victims. The samples were much larger and it did show the trend that younger person's Strontium-90 content was higher than older ones. The article was "Strontium-90 in Human Bone from infancy to Adulthood 1962-1963" by Gaffney, G.W. et al, Radiological Health Data and Reports, 7:383-386 (1966). This was during the during the above ground weapons testing days. The samples of infants teeth are very small and unless they are composited, it is difficult to see how they could measure these low levels. Ed Edmond J. Baratta Radiation Safety Officer Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 Fax: 781-729-3593 edmond.baratta at fda.gov -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Franz Sch?nhofer Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:01 PM To: RADSAFE Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Dear RADSAFErs, Thanks to those who gave me hints and links which help me with my first questions. The next question is, whether anybody has data available about the concentration of Radium-226 (and Ra-228) in human teeth and/or bones. One of the links showed, that actually the Ra-226 was not separated contrary to what I had in memory. The description of the analytical process in one of the links was further obscured by false information about the instrument used (Quantulus). Therefore I would like to estimate what the error in Sr-90 concentration could be when not taking Ra-226 into account. Of course I know, that the Ra-226 concentration will depend on the environment - as well as the Sr-90 concentration. One more question to the US-American RADSAFErs: I find a Joseph J. Mangano, MPH MBA not only as the National Coordinator of the RPHP website, but also as an author of "Radioactive Strontium-90 in baby teeth of New Jersey children and the link with cancer: A special report. I know that MBA means "Master of Business Administration", but what does MPH mean? Master of Physics? Master of Philosophy? That MBA does not really point towards a scientific background seems to be clear, but does MPH? Thanks again for a very fast reply. Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From Sreenivas.Komanduri at dep.state.nj.us Thu Dec 29 08:36:15 2005 From: Sreenivas.Komanduri at dep.state.nj.us (Sreenivas Komanduri) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 09:36:15 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Key chain radiation detectors Message-ID: My question is about 'toy' like radiation detectors a couple of them being marketed on the internet. Pictures show real small, can be attached to the key ring of your car keys and they are marketed as 'dirty bomb detectors'. Does anyone have any experience of having bought and used them for any purpose such as training or demo etc.? Would you please share your experience? I believe this may not be the first time this is being asked, you may send your replies to me directly. Thanks. Vas Komanduri; Ph.D. NJ Department of Environmental Protection Office of Quality Assurance 9 Ewing Street P.O Box 424 Trenton, NJ 08625 Phone: (609) 984 - 0855 Fax: (609) 777 - 1774 -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: Sreenivas Komanduri.vcf URL: From sandyfl at earthlink.net Thu Dec 29 09:36:57 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 07:36:57 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH In-Reply-To: References: <00dc01c60bf4$47f433f0$bf572fd5@pc1> Message-ID: <43B39219.28389.547552F@localhost> On 29 Dec 2005 at 0:34, farbersa at optonline.net wrote: > Many MPH or MSPH programs involve extensive coursework in > biostatistics and epidemiology so don't be too quick to dismiss an > analysis of some issue based solely on the individual having an MPH > degree. I agree! Dr. Phil Plato, formerly at University of Michigan and responsible for the first Draft NVLAP Program, and also responsible for leading the 1st Performance Test Lab back in the '80s, has a MPH. Sad how some automatically judge a person by their credentials, without any real evidence, background or knowledge. Not very scientific ... is it? ------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 E-Mail: sperle at dosimetry.com E-Mail: sandyfl at earthlink.net Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From sandyfl at earthlink.net Thu Dec 29 10:27:53 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 08:27:53 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] China's $8 Billion Nuclear Deal Postponed Indefinitely Message-ID: <43B39E09.27190.576000D@localhost> Index: China's $8 Billion Nuclear Deal Postponed Indefinitely University of California Wins Los Alamos Contract Town Has Nuclear-Powered Plans ====================================== China's $8 Billion Nuclear Deal Postponed Indefinitely BEIJING, China (Dec. 20) - China will miss a year-end deadline for handing out an $8 billion contract to build four nuclear reactors, and plans to postpone its choice indefinitely, an industry source close to the bidding said on Tuesday. Pittsburgh-based Westinghouse Electric Co., France's Areva and Russia's Atomstroiexport are vying for the contract to build China's first third-generation reactors. Beijing's original plan was to make a final decision by the end of this year but officials have decided to put it off because of the high price of the foreign reactors, the source said. Even though China was considering importing only those parts of the plants that could not be produced domestically, the prices offered by the bidders were still considered unreasonably high. "There will be no new deadline for the decision. When the government announces the result will depend on how the talks are going," he added. During a visit to France earlier this month, Premier Wen Jiabao indicated Paris would have to improve its offer in terms of both price and transfer of nuclear technology, the source said, adding the same message had been passed to other bidders. "The ball has been kicked to the foreign side again. We will wait and see how they react," he said. Industry officials have said both Westinghouse's AP 1000 and Areva's EPR technology are very competitive, while the Russian offer is less so. In contrast with the delay in introducing foreign technology, Beijing is accelerating the construction of nuclear reactors that use existing domestic technology. Work began last week on the second phase of the Ling'ao plant in southern Guangdong province. It will put two 1.0-gigawatt reactors into commercial operation in 2010 and 2011. "These projects have nothing to do with the third-generation technology and will not be influenced by it," the source said. The energy-guzzling nation plans to invest some 400 billion yuan ($49.56 billion) in building around 30 new nuclear reactors by 2020, bringing its total installed nuclear capacity to 40 gigawatts. It currently has nine working reactors that supply around 2.3 percent of its electricity, but aims to boost the amount of power it gets from nuclear plants to 4 percent within 15 years. -------------------- University of California Wins Los Alamos Contract LOS ALAMOS, N.M. (Dec. 21) - The University of California has retained the contract to manage troubled Los Alamos National Laboratory, the Energy Department announced Wednesday. The contract to run the nation's pre-eminent nuclear lab had gone out to bid earlier this year for the first time in the lab's 63-year history. Energy Secretary Samuel Bodman said UC, which will team with Bechtel Corp., had prevailed in its bid over a rival team comprised of Lockheed Martin and the University of Texas. --------------- Town Has Nuclear-Powered Plans USA TODAY (Dec. 19) - Some people here have lived their whole lives in the shadow of the twin cooling towers of the Bellefonte Nuclear Plant. Their fathers and grandfathers helped build the facility, which the Tennessee Valley Authority began constructing in the 1970s but never completed. The TVA operates three other nuclear plants within a 125-mile radius, so many here are comfortable with the idea of a nuclear neighbor. They celebrated in September when a consortium of utility companies chose Bellefonte as one of two sites for new nuclear plants. "Everybody from 35 to 40 years old that grew up around this county in the '70s, they've seen the towers, they knew what it was," says Tommy Bryant, 36, a utility company manager whose father worked a construction job at Bellefonte. "Most people are really glad about what they're planning." Americans' confidence in nuclear power waned after the partial meltdown of a reactor at Pennsylvania's Three Mile Island in 1979 and the explosion in 1986 at the Chernobyl plant in Ukraine that spread radioactive material across Europe. Today, surging demand for electricity, concerns about air pollution and the Bush administration's push to reduce the nation's dependence on foreign oil are prompting renewed interest in nuclear energy. President Bush signed an energy bill in August that includes extensive subsidies and incentives for the industry. The bill contains subsidies for construction delays, offers loan guarantees to utilities and limits industry liability for accidents. Scottsboro is one of several communities around the USA that are wooing utility companies that build nuclear plants, eager to tap the economic benefits of an industry attempting a comeback. More demand for electricity The USA's existing 103 nuclear plants produce about 20% of the nation's power. "To maintain that 20%, we will have to add new nuclear plants, because the demand is going to go up," says Marilyn Kray, president of NuStart Energy, the consortium that has selected sites near Scottsboro and Port Gibson, Miss., for new nuclear plants. Towns that also vied for the plants were Aiken, S.C.; St. Francisville, La.; Lusby, Md.; and Scriba, N.Y. Industry opponents say new nuclear plants aren't economically feasible without huge federal subsidies. Protecting plants from terrorists and disposing of spent fuel, which remains lethal for 250,000 years, are also top concerns. "The nuclear power champions are now looking to hook up an umbilical cord to the U.S. Treasury and the American taxpayer to jump-start their all-but-moribund industry," says Paul Gunter of the Nuclear Information and Resource Service in Washington, D.C. "This is a failed technology. The fact the Cheney-Bush administration is looking to lead us back into this quagmire is more a relapse than a revival." The industry promotes nuclear power as a non-polluting form of energy that doesn't consume finite fuels such as coal and natural gas. But the main selling point for Scottsboro is economic: 2,400 to 2,800 jobs during a three- to four-year construction period, followed by 400 to 600 full-time jobs once the plant starts operating, Scottsboro Mayor Dan Deason says. "That's going to be a tremendous shot in the arm," he says. 'We will leave here' Scottsboro is football and bass-fishing country. Fans declare allegiance to the University of Alabama Crimson Tide or the Auburn University Tigers. Lake Guntersville hosts 100 largemouth bass- fishing tournaments a year. This town of about 15,000 is the county seat and one of 13 municipalities in Jackson County. Each of those cities' governments passed resolutions supporting a new nuclear facility at Bellefonte, says Rick Roden, CEO of the Greater Jackson County Chamber of Commerce. That's partly because people here are familiar with TVA nuclear plants near Athens, Ala., Soddy-Daisy, Tenn., and Spring City, Tenn., says Goodrich Rogers, who recruits new industry as head of the Jackson County Economic Development Authority. "We understand the technology," Rogers says. "We've all got friends who work at nuclear power plants. They come to Sunday school with us, and none of them glow in the dark." Not everyone is eager to see NuStart move ahead. "If it comes, we will leave here," says Carol Womacks, 52, a former flight attendant who has lived here for 18 years. Her house is about 5 miles from Bellefonte. Womacks worries about an accident. "I don't think the city is prepared," she says. Local opposition has not yet galvanized because people in Alabama don't believe nuclear plants are actually going to happen, says Stephen Smith, executive director of the Southern Alliance for Clean Energy, an environmental and energy policy group based in Knoxville, Tenn. "There will be more organized opposition as more people get up to speed on it," he says. Economic linchpin Scottsboro's fortunes have long been tied to Bellefonte. "In the mid- to late '70s, when TVA was moving ahead with Bellefonte, this was one of the fastest-growing places in Alabama," Roden says. Bellefonte never opened because "the projected demand for electricity did not materialize," TVA board Chairman Bill Baxter says. During the mid-1980s, after many textile jobs disappeared and TVA decided not to finish the Bellefonte plant, unemployment soared to 23%. The local economy is more diverse now. There's even a building boom. An eight-screen movie theater is planned, as is an $8 million, 320- acre industrial park. Tourism is up 22% the past three years, and unemployment is 4%. NuStart's Kray says the plan is to "start from scratch" at the Bellefonte site, building twin reactors using safer, more efficient technology developed since the 1970s. Her consortium, made up of nine utilities, two nuclear reactor manufacturers and the TVA, will apply for plant licenses from the Nuclear Regulatory Commission. At Scottsboro, Kray says, the application probably will be submitted in late 2007. If the NRC approves, construction could begin in 2011 and be completed by 2015. After NuStart narrowed its list of potential sites to six, the competition heated up, Kray says: "What we were surprised at was the level of enthusiasm and the overwhelming support we received." "All six states made substantive offers," NuStart spokesman Carl Crawford says. "They were in the hundreds of millions of dollars in incentives." ------------------ Blast at Russian Nuclear Plant Kills One ST. PETERSBURG, Russia AP (Dec. 16) - Molten metal splashed from a smelter at a Russian nuclear power plant, killing one worker and severely burning two others, but authorities said Friday that no reactors were affected and no radiation escaped. While relatively minor, the accident Thursday occurred on the same day prosecutors announced a "catastrophic radioactivity situation" involving improperly stored materials at a chemical factory in the southern Russian region of Chechnya. The incidents were the latest to draw questions about how Russia stores, handles and disposes of nuclear materials and waste in the wake of the 1986 explosion of a reactor at Chernobyl that spewed out radioactivity for days in the world's worst civilian atomic accident. "The level of nuclear safety, although it has been significantly increased after the Chernobyl disaster, is still not sufficient," said Vladimir Slivyak at Ecodefense, a Russian environmental group. "They used to think that there is no need for extra safety measures and they still think that now." The smelter accident happened at the Leningrad electricity generating station in the closed nuclear town of Sosnovy Bor, 50 miles west of St. Petersburg. Russia's nuclear agency, Rosenergoatom, initially reported an explosion. It later changed course and described the incident as a "splash." It said radiation levels remained normal. The Norwegian environmental group Bellona, a longtime critic of Russia's nuclear programs, and officials in nearby Finland also said they had not detected any spread of radiation. A 33-year-old worker died of injuries Friday, and two others were injured, Yuri Lameko, chief doctor of the Sosnovy Bor hospital, told The Associated Press. The Emergency Situations Ministry said two of those involved suffered burns over 90 percent of their bodies. Rosenergoatom said the smelter - run by a scrap metal reprocessing company called Ekomet-S - is on the grounds of the plant's second unit, where a reactor was shut down for repairs in July. The plant has four reactors in all, including one of the same type that blew up in Chernobyl during the Soviet era. Plant spokesman Sergei Averyanov said the smelter is a half-mile from the reactor. Oleg Bodrov, a physicist who heads the Green World ecological group in Sosnovy Bor, said the facility is also about 150 feet from a covered liquid radioactive waste pond. Averyanov blamed the accident on violations of technical and production rules. Bodrov accused Ekomet-S, which also reprocesses metal from nuclear submarines and disassembled oil and gas pipelines, of violating environmental laws. He also complained a lack of funding had caused the shutdown of the only environmental monitoring laboratory in the town of 65,000. "There is no independent environmental monitoring in the nuclear city of Sosnovy Bor," Bodrov said, adding that he visited the Ekomet-S facility Friday afternoon and found radiation levels were normal. He said Ekomet-S workers told him more than two tons of molten metal were in the smelter and several hundred pounds splashed out for unknown reasons. He said a previous accident involving Ekomet-S injured two workers in summer 2003. In March 1992, an accident at the power plant let radioactive gases and iodine leak into the air, according to nuclear watchdog groups. Experts and environmentalists say Russia's nuclear industries and companies that handle radioactive materials have improved procedures in the years since the Soviet collapse. Washington has provided an estimated $7 billion the past 14 years to help Russia and other former Soviet republics destroy and safeguard atomic weapons. Still, Russia's nuclear industries, which often escape detailed federal monitoring, are prone to industrial accidents. Russian prosecutors opened a criminal investigation Thursday into the improper storage of radioactive materials by a state-owned company in the Chechen capital, Grozny. Tests found radiation at the Grozny Chemical Factory, which stands not far from residential buildings and a bus station, exceeded normal levels by tens of thousands of times, prosecutors said. They called it a "catastrophic radioactivity situation." Nikolai Petrov of the Carnegie Moscow Center said that situation smacked of "the usual disorder and negligence" by Russian officials in dealing with potentially harmful materials. ------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 E-Mail: sperle at dosimetry.com E-Mail: sandyfl at earthlink.net Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From hflong at pacbell.net Thu Dec 29 10:36:03 2005 From: hflong at pacbell.net (howard long) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 08:36:03 -0800 (PST) Subject: [ RadSafe ] Key chain radiation detectors - Insurance for all HPs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051229163603.56408.qmail@web81806.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I wear the Nukalert (details at www.Nukalert.com) I met the inventor at a meeting of Doctors for Disaster Preparedness, which has investigated, supports and even helps fund distribution to first responders (c$100). Simply, it indicates time before 100 Rad at that level of total radiation, enabling putting mass and distance between the holder and source with confidence that no damaging dose results, and thus no panic disaster. I also have a palmRAD 907 Nuclear Radiation Meter (c $550), details at www.berkeleynucleonics.com which would need a user with more knowledge of the effects of radiation. Howard Long Sreenivas Komanduri wrote: My question is about 'toy' like radiation detectors a couple of them being marketed on the internet. Pictures show real small, can be attached to the key ring of your car keys and they are marketed as 'dirty bomb detectors'. Does anyone have any experience of having bought and used them for any purpose such as training or demo etc.? Would you please share your experience? I believe this may not be the first time this is being asked, you may send your replies to me directly. Thanks. Vas Komanduri; Ph.D. NJ Department of Environmental Protection Office of Quality Assurance 9 Ewing Street P.O Box 424 Trenton, NJ 08625 Phone: (609) 984 - 0855 Fax: (609) 777 - 1774 BEGIN:VCARD VERSION:2.1 X-GWTYPE:USER FN:Komanduri, Sreenivas TEL;WORK:609-984-0855 ORG:;Env. Regulation EMAIL;WORK;PREF;NGW:Sreenivas.Komanduri at dep.state.nj.us N:Komanduri;Sreenivas END:VCARD _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From bobcat167 at earthlink.net Thu Dec 29 10:41:39 2005 From: bobcat167 at earthlink.net (Bob Shannon) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 09:41:39 -0700 Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions In-Reply-To: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA84@orsnewea002.fda.gov> Message-ID: <000001c60c96$be3fd580$6601a8c0@Bob> I have taken some time to look through the Radsafe archives but to no avail. So I would like to pose this question again. At some point several years ago, there was a semi-detailed description of the method being used by the tooth fairy project to analyze teeth for Sr. Can anyone point me to this post? Thanks! Bob Shannon Kaiser Analytical Management Services 303-432-1137 -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Baratta, Edmond J Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 6:57 AM To: 'Franz Sch?nhofer'; RADSAFE Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Good morning Franz: I had asked that question earlier about Strontium-90. The amount of Radium-226 in foods (where it would be ingested from) was been shown to be <0.037 Bq/kg). The U.S. Public Health Service in the 60's (1964-1967) did Studies on Diets of children. It was reported in "Evaluation of Radium-226 in Total Diet Samples, June 1964 to July 1967" U.S. Public Health Service, Radiological Health Data and Reports 6:371-377 (1969). Also similar work was done by Fisenne, J.M.and H. W. Walker "Radium-226 in the Diet in two Cities", U.S. AEC Report HASL-24 (1970). Strontium-90 in bones was also done during that time. The samples were taken from accident victims. The samples were much larger and it did show the trend that younger person's Strontium-90 content was higher than older ones. The article was "Strontium-90 in Human Bone from infancy to Adulthood 1962-1963" by Gaffney, G.W. et al, Radiological Health Data and Reports, 7:383-386 (1966). This was during the during the above ground weapons testing days. The samples of infants teeth are very small and unless they are composited, it is difficult to see how they could measure these low levels. Ed Edmond J. Baratta Radiation Safety Officer Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 Fax: 781-729-3593 edmond.baratta at fda.gov -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Franz Sch?nhofer Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:01 PM To: RADSAFE Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Dear RADSAFErs, Thanks to those who gave me hints and links which help me with my first questions. The next question is, whether anybody has data available about the concentration of Radium-226 (and Ra-228) in human teeth and/or bones. One of the links showed, that actually the Ra-226 was not separated contrary to what I had in memory. The description of the analytical process in one of the links was further obscured by false information about the instrument used (Quantulus). Therefore I would like to estimate what the error in Sr-90 concentration could be when not taking Ra-226 into account. Of course I know, that the Ra-226 concentration will depend on the environment - as well as the Sr-90 concentration. One more question to the US-American RADSAFErs: I find a Joseph J. Mangano, MPH MBA not only as the National Coordinator of the RPHP website, but also as an author of "Radioactive Strontium-90 in baby teeth of New Jersey children and the link with cancer: A special report. I know that MBA means "Master of Business Administration", but what does MPH mean? Master of Physics? Master of Philosophy? That MBA does not really point towards a scientific background seems to be clear, but does MPH? Thanks again for a very fast reply. Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From Floyd.Flanigan at nmcco.com Thu Dec 29 11:53:29 2005 From: Floyd.Flanigan at nmcco.com (Flanigan, Floyd) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 11:53:29 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Key chain radiation detectors Message-ID: <7A9B2084CC9CEC45828E829CBF20D6380AD66A@enex02.ft.nmcco.net> Is there any associated nomenclature which might identify these 'detectors'? Or perhaps a link to the marketing site? Floyd W. Flanigan B.S.Nuc.H.P. -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Sreenivas Komanduri Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 8:36 AM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] Key chain radiation detectors My question is about 'toy' like radiation detectors a couple of them being marketed on the internet. Pictures show real small, can be attached to the key ring of your car keys and they are marketed as 'dirty bomb detectors'. Does anyone have any experience of having bought and used them for any purpose such as training or demo etc.? Would you please share your experience? I believe this may not be the first time this is being asked, you may send your replies to me directly. Thanks. Vas Komanduri; Ph.D. NJ Department of Environmental Protection Office of Quality Assurance 9 Ewing Street P.O Box 424 Trenton, NJ 08625 Phone: (609) 984 - 0855 Fax: (609) 777 - 1774 From ncohen12 at comcast.net Thu Dec 29 12:09:23 2005 From: ncohen12 at comcast.net (Norm Cohen) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 13:09:23 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] sr90 from noble gases Message-ID: Guys and gals, Somewhere I read that sr90 could be produced from the decay of noble gases emitted from nuke plants. What can you all tell me about this? Norm Coalition for Peace and Justice; UNPLUG Salem Campaign, 321 Barr Ave, Linwood; NJ08221; 609-601-8583 From Sreenivas.Komanduri at dep.state.nj.us Thu Dec 29 12:19:53 2005 From: Sreenivas.Komanduri at dep.state.nj.us (Sreenivas Komanduri) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 13:19:53 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Key chain radiation detectors Message-ID: There are two 'key chain detectors' I came across. Here are the links . www.nukepills.com and www.nukalert.com There is no nomenclature I could find, except 'dirty bomb detector' as I see. >>> "Flanigan, Floyd" 12/29/2005 12:53 PM >>> Is there any associated nomenclature which might identify these 'detectors'? Or perhaps a link to the marketing site? Floyd W. Flanigan B.S.Nuc.H.P. -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Sreenivas Komanduri Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 8:36 AM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] Key chain radiation detectors My question is about 'toy' like radiation detectors a couple of them being marketed on the internet. Pictures show real small, can be attached to the key ring of your car keys and they are marketed as 'dirty bomb detectors'. Does anyone have any experience of having bought and used them for any purpose such as training or demo etc.? Would you please share your experience? I believe this may not be the first time this is being asked, you may send your replies to me directly. Thanks. Vas Komanduri; Ph.D. NJ Department of Environmental Protection Office of Quality Assurance 9 Ewing Street P.O Box 424 Trenton, NJ 08625 Phone: (609) 984 - 0855 Fax: (609) 777 - 1774 From idias at interchange.ubc.ca Thu Dec 29 12:51:14 2005 From: idias at interchange.ubc.ca (John R Johnson) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 10:51:14 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions In-Reply-To: <000001c60c96$be3fd580$6601a8c0@Bob> Message-ID: Bob et al The concentrations of radium in bones is 260 mBq/Kg Ra-226 in 31 countries and 39-230 mBq/Kg Ra-228 in the US. This and other numbers are in UNSCEAR at http://www.unscear.org/reports/2000_1.html Happy New Year _________________ John R Johnson, Ph.D. ***** President, IDIAS, Inc 4535 West 9-Th Ave Vancouver B. C. V6R 2E2 (604) 222-9840 idias at interchange.ubc.ca ***** or most mornings Consultant in Radiation Protection TRIUMF 4004 Wesbrook Mall Vancouver B. C. V6R 2E2 (604) 222-1047 Ext. 6610 Fax: (604) 222-7309 johnsjr at triumf.ca -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl]On Behalf Of Bob Shannon Sent: December 29, 2005 8:42 AM To: 'RADSAFE' Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions I have taken some time to look through the Radsafe archives but to no avail. So I would like to pose this question again. At some point several years ago, there was a semi-detailed description of the method being used by the tooth fairy project to analyze teeth for Sr. Can anyone point me to this post? Thanks! Bob Shannon Kaiser Analytical Management Services 303-432-1137 -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Baratta, Edmond J Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 6:57 AM To: 'Franz Sch?nhofer'; RADSAFE Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Good morning Franz: I had asked that question earlier about Strontium-90. The amount of Radium-226 in foods (where it would be ingested from) was been shown to be <0.037 Bq/kg). The U.S. Public Health Service in the 60's (1964-1967) did Studies on Diets of children. It was reported in "Evaluation of Radium-226 in Total Diet Samples, June 1964 to July 1967" U.S. Public Health Service, Radiological Health Data and Reports 6:371-377 (1969). Also similar work was done by Fisenne, J.M.and H. W. Walker "Radium-226 in the Diet in two Cities", U.S. AEC Report HASL-24 (1970). Strontium-90 in bones was also done during that time. The samples were taken from accident victims. The samples were much larger and it did show the trend that younger person's Strontium-90 content was higher than older ones. The article was "Strontium-90 in Human Bone from infancy to Adulthood 1962-1963" by Gaffney, G.W. et al, Radiological Health Data and Reports, 7:383-386 (1966). This was during the during the above ground weapons testing days. The samples of infants teeth are very small and unless they are composited, it is difficult to see how they could measure these low levels. Ed Edmond J. Baratta Radiation Safety Officer Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 Fax: 781-729-3593 edmond.baratta at fda.gov -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Franz Sch?nhofer Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:01 PM To: RADSAFE Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Dear RADSAFErs, Thanks to those who gave me hints and links which help me with my first questions. The next question is, whether anybody has data available about the concentration of Radium-226 (and Ra-228) in human teeth and/or bones. One of the links showed, that actually the Ra-226 was not separated contrary to what I had in memory. The description of the analytical process in one of the links was further obscured by false information about the instrument used (Quantulus). Therefore I would like to estimate what the error in Sr-90 concentration could be when not taking Ra-226 into account. Of course I know, that the Ra-226 concentration will depend on the environment - as well as the Sr-90 concentration. One more question to the US-American RADSAFErs: I find a Joseph J. Mangano, MPH MBA not only as the National Coordinator of the RPHP website, but also as an author of "Radioactive Strontium-90 in baby teeth of New Jersey children and the link with cancer: A special report. I know that MBA means "Master of Business Administration", but what does MPH mean? Master of Physics? Master of Philosophy? That MBA does not really point towards a scientific background seems to be clear, but does MPH? Thanks again for a very fast reply. Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From Sreenivas.Komanduri at dep.state.nj.us Thu Dec 29 13:56:50 2005 From: Sreenivas.Komanduri at dep.state.nj.us (Sreenivas Komanduri) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 14:56:50 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Key chain radiation detectors Message-ID: Floyd, See the links to marketing sites below. www.nukepills.com and www.nukalert.com You will have to ask the manufacturers on nomenclature. My understanding is either a 'civil defense meter' or a 'dirty bomb detector'. >>> "Flanigan, Floyd" 12/29/2005 12:53 PM >>> Is there any associated nomenclature which might identify these 'detectors'? Or perhaps a link to the marketing site? Floyd W. Flanigan B.S.Nuc.H.P. -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Sreenivas Komanduri Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 8:36 AM To: radsafe at radlab.nl Subject: [ RadSafe ] Key chain radiation detectors My question is about 'toy' like radiation detectors a couple of them being marketed on the internet. Pictures show real small, can be attached to the key ring of your car keys and they are marketed as 'dirty bomb detectors'. Does anyone have any experience of having bought and used them for any purpose such as training or demo etc.? Would you please share your experience? I believe this may not be the first time this is being asked, you may send your replies to me directly. Thanks. Vas Komanduri; Ph.D. NJ Department of Environmental Protection Office of Quality Assurance 9 Ewing Street P.O Box 424 Trenton, NJ 08625 Phone: (609) 984 - 0855 Fax: (609) 777 - 1774 _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From ograabe at ucdavis.edu Thu Dec 29 14:14:26 2005 From: ograabe at ucdavis.edu (Otto G. Raabe) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 12:14:26 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Key chain radiation detectors In-Reply-To: <7A9B2084CC9CEC45828E829CBF20D6380AD66A@enex02.ft.nmcco.net > References: <7A9B2084CC9CEC45828E829CBF20D6380AD66A@enex02.ft.nmcco.net> Message-ID: <6.0.1.1.2.20051229121246.02af05b0@mailbox.ucdavis.edu> At 09:53 AM 12/29/2005, Flanigan, Floyd wrote: >Is there any associated nomenclature which might identify these >'detectors'? Or perhaps a link to the marketing site? **************************************************** This one is said to habe been shown at the 2003 HPS Annual Meeting: >http://www.nukalert.com/ Otto ********************************************** Prof. Otto G. Raabe, Ph.D., CHP Center for Health & the Environment (Street Address: Bldg. 3792, Old Davis Road) University of California, Davis, CA 95616 E-Mail: ograabe at ucdavis.edu Phone: (530) 752-7754 FAX: (530) 758-6140 *********************************************** From ncohen12 at comcast.net Thu Dec 29 14:16:31 2005 From: ncohen12 at comcast.net (Norm Cohen) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 15:16:31 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions In-Reply-To: <000001c60c96$be3fd580$6601a8c0@Bob> Message-ID: Bob It was a few years ago. As I recall, I emailed Dr Hari Sharma of the Univ of Toronto who was doing the actual TFP tests, and psoted his answers to the radsafe list. There may have been some personal communication from individual radsafers to Dr Sharma. I no longer have Sr Sharma's email addy, but I'm sure an enterprising radsafer could dig it up & ask him your questions. Norm Coalition for Peace and Justice; UNPLUG Salem Campaign, 321 Barr Ave, Linwood; NJ08221; 609-601-8583 -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Bob Shannon Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 11:42 AM To: 'RADSAFE' Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions I have taken some time to look through the Radsafe archives but to no avail. So I would like to pose this question again. At some point several years ago, there was a semi-detailed description of the method being used by the tooth fairy project to analyze teeth for Sr. Can anyone point me to this post? Thanks! Bob Shannon Kaiser Analytical Management Services 303-432-1137 -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Baratta, Edmond J Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 6:57 AM To: 'Franz Sch?nhofer'; RADSAFE Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Good morning Franz: I had asked that question earlier about Strontium-90. The amount of Radium-226 in foods (where it would be ingested from) was been shown to be <0.037 Bq/kg). The U.S. Public Health Service in the 60's (1964-1967) did Studies on Diets of children. It was reported in "Evaluation of Radium-226 in Total Diet Samples, June 1964 to July 1967" U.S. Public Health Service, Radiological Health Data and Reports 6:371-377 (1969). Also similar work was done by Fisenne, J.M.and H. W. Walker "Radium-226 in the Diet in two Cities", U.S. AEC Report HASL-24 (1970). Strontium-90 in bones was also done during that time. The samples were taken from accident victims. The samples were much larger and it did show the trend that younger person's Strontium-90 content was higher than older ones. The article was "Strontium-90 in Human Bone from infancy to Adulthood 1962-1963" by Gaffney, G.W. et al, Radiological Health Data and Reports, 7:383-386 (1966). This was during the during the above ground weapons testing days. The samples of infants teeth are very small and unless they are composited, it is difficult to see how they could measure these low levels. Ed Edmond J. Baratta Radiation Safety Officer Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 Fax: 781-729-3593 edmond.baratta at fda.gov -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Franz Sch?nhofer Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:01 PM To: RADSAFE Subject: [ RadSafe ] TFP - next questions Dear RADSAFErs, Thanks to those who gave me hints and links which help me with my first questions. The next question is, whether anybody has data available about the concentration of Radium-226 (and Ra-228) in human teeth and/or bones. One of the links showed, that actually the Ra-226 was not separated contrary to what I had in memory. The description of the analytical process in one of the links was further obscured by false information about the instrument used (Quantulus). Therefore I would like to estimate what the error in Sr-90 concentration could be when not taking Ra-226 into account. Of course I know, that the Ra-226 concentration will depend on the environment - as well as the Sr-90 concentration. One more question to the US-American RADSAFErs: I find a Joseph J. Mangano, MPH MBA not only as the National Coordinator of the RPHP website, but also as an author of "Radioactive Strontium-90 in baby teeth of New Jersey children and the link with cancer: A special report. I know that MBA means "Master of Business Administration", but what does MPH mean? Master of Physics? Master of Philosophy? That MBA does not really point towards a scientific background seems to be clear, but does MPH? Thanks again for a very fast reply. Franz Franz Schoenhofer PhD, MR iR Habicherg. 31/7 A-1160 Vienna AUSTRIA phone (international) -43-699-1168-1319 phone (national) 0699-1168-1319 _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From idias at interchange.ubc.ca Thu Dec 29 14:50:13 2005 From: idias at interchange.ubc.ca (John R Johnson) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 12:50:13 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] sr90 from noble gases In-Reply-To: <200512292025.jBTKPpwD022944@mta6.mail-relay.ubc.ca> Message-ID: Norm et al Sr-90 (halflife ~= 27 years) is the progeny of Rb-90 (halflife ~= 3 minutes) which is the progeny of Kr-90 (halflife ~= 35 seconds). All 3 are fission products so the amount of Sr-90 produced from decay will depend on the time and filtering of that fission gases have. John _________________ John R Johnson, Ph.D. ***** President, IDIAS, Inc 4535 West 9-Th Ave Vancouver B. C. V6R 2E2 (604) 222-9840 idias at interchange.ubc.ca ***** or most mornings Consultant in Radiation Protection TRIUMF 4004 Wesbrook Mall Vancouver B. C. V6R 2E2 (604) 222-1047 Ext. 6610 Fax: (604) 222-7309 johnsjr at triumf.ca -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl]On Behalf Of Norm Cohen Sent: December 29, 2005 10:09 AM To: 'RADSAFE' Subject: [ RadSafe ] sr90 from noble gases Guys and gals, Somewhere I read that sr90 could be produced from the decay of noble gases emitted from nuke plants. What can you all tell me about this? Norm Coalition for Peace and Justice; UNPLUG Salem Campaign, 321 Barr Ave, Linwood; NJ08221; 609-601-8583 _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From GRAHNK at comcast.net Thu Dec 29 14:55:58 2005 From: GRAHNK at comcast.net (GRAHNK at comcast.net) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 20:55:58 +0000 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH Message-ID: <122920052055.14716.43B44D5E00099B1E0000397C2206824693B5B2B8BEADB9@comcast.net> Thanks Sandy, As a graduate of the University of Michigan Radiation Protection Program, and one of Phil Plato's students, I can tell you that rad protection requirements for graduation for either an MS or an MPH degree were identical and included a thesis and an internship. The MPH takes a semester longer because of the additional required coursework in General Environmental Health, Epidemiology, and Biostatistics. The MPH is administered by the School of Public Health, and the MS is administered by the Rackham Graduate School. Essentially no difference. Kelly F. Grahn (MS, Uof M SPH '89) Radioactive Materials Specialist Illinois Emergency Management Agency Division of Nuclear Safety, Bureau of Environmental Safety 800 Weyrauch Street West Chicago, IL 60185 phone 630-293-6348 fax 630-293-6349 cell 630-947-2721 24 Hour: 217-782-7860 -------------- Original message -------------- From: "Sandy Perle" > On 29 Dec 2005 at 0:34, farbersa at optonline.net wrote: > > > Many MPH or MSPH programs involve extensive coursework in > > biostatistics and epidemiology so don't be too quick to dismiss an > > analysis of some issue based solely on the individual having an MPH > > degree. > > I agree! Dr. Phil Plato, formerly at University of Michigan and > responsible for the first Draft NVLAP Program, and also responsible > for leading the 1st Performance Test Lab back in the '80s, has a MPH. > > Sad how some automatically judge a person by their credentials, > without any real evidence, background or knowledge. Not very > scientific ... is it? > > ------------------------------------- > Sandy Perle > Senior Vice President, Technical Operations > Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. > 2652 McGaw Avenue > Irvine, CA 92614 > > Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 > Fax:(949) 296-1144 > > E-Mail: sperle at dosimetry.com > E-Mail: sandyfl at earthlink.net > > Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ > Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the > RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From loc at icx.net Thu Dec 29 16:47:29 2005 From: loc at icx.net (Susan Gawarecki) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 17:47:29 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Spallation Neutron Source Amazing Science Facts Message-ID: <43B46781.6050200@icx.net> Spallation Neutron Source Amazing Science Facts OAK RIDGE, Tenn. Dec. 22, 2005 -- The New Year is bringing the science community a grand present: The Spallation Neutron Source at Oak Ridge National Laboratory. On schedule for completion in 2006, the Department of Energy's new science facility will provide researchers with the world's most powerful and most advanced tool for analyzing a host of materials with neutrons. As they home in on the fruition of seven years of construction, SNS staff members have compiled the following list of SNS Amazing Science Facts to illustrate what's in store for the neutron science community once this state-of-the-art, world-class materials research facility starts up around mid-year. Read on and prepare to say "Wow." Around the world: The energy of the SNS's proton beam, expressed in terms of voltage, is 1 billion electron volts. That is equivalent to 666 million 1.5-volt D-cell batteries joined end to end. Such a string of these batteries would nearly reach around the Earth! Fast off the line: The proton beam accelerates through the linear accelerator (linac) from a standstill to approximately 90 percent of the speed of light in two microseconds! Now that's cold: The SNS's linac takes advantage of superconducting technology: Approximately two-thirds of the linac's total 1000 feet is at superconducting temperature, chilled with liquid helium to 2 degrees above absolute zero, or 2 Kelvin. How cold is that? By comparison, a December night-game spectator at the Green Bay Packers' Lambeau Field should dress to endure a comparatively toasty 275 Kelvin! Flurry of punches: Following 1,060 turns around an accumulator ring, 150 trillion accelerated protons (150,000,000,000,000) strike the target in a pulse that lasts only one millionth of a second. These pulses strike the target 60 times per second! Ouch: The pulses strike the target vessel at enough energy to release neutrons from atoms--neutrons that are then used for research. That energy is similar to a 200-pound block of steel hitting the vessel at 50 mph! Over the horizon: The SNS requires the tuning of the beam lines to be so precise that the Earth's curvature was factored into the construction of the linear accelerator?a tiny but critical difference of 7 millimeters from one end of the 1,000-foot linac to the other! Fine as frog's hair: All components on the SNS that comprise the accelerator and the target, independent of size, shape and weight, are installed to specifications within a mite-sized 2/10 of a millimeter! Plugged in: Beam power in the linac is 1.4 megawatts, enough juice to power 1,400 homes. It will require 42 megawatts of electricity to generate those 1.4 megawatts of beam power. The total SNS electric bill will be, at current rates, $10 million a year, or enough power to serve a town of roughly 30,000! Admiration from afar: The SNS will increase the number and intensity of neutrons for research by factors from 10- to 100-fold. So intense that, once the SNS is operational, no one will ever again enter the target bay. All maintenance operations inside the target--even changing light bulbs--will be performed remotely, with state-of-the-art robotic manipulators Because they have to be performed robotically, all anticipated remote operations inside the target facility, for the 40-year design life of the SNS, have been planned and practiced beforehand! Thick as a brick: Shielding over the tunnel into the target facility "monolith" consists of 7 feet of steel and 2 feet of concrete. The target facility floor is 5 feet thick. There are 12 million pounds of steel shielding in the monolith alone, and 4 million pounds of concrete! Chock full o'neutrons: The SNS is the first facility to use pure mercury as a target material. Why? The liquid mercury can be continuously circulated, thus dissipating the enormous heat and energy. Mercury is also rich in neutrons--the average mercury nucleus has 120 neutrons--and consequently, has a very large mass. The target's 20 tons of mercury is only one cubic meter in size! Come together: Five Department of Energy Office of Science laboratories--Argonne, Berkeley, Brookhaven, Jefferson and Los Alamos--participated with Oak Ridge in the design of the SNS project. The $1.4 billion Basic Energy Sciences project has been constructed on time and on budget with an excellent safety record. But the most remarkable aspect of the SNS is the science that will be performed there in the years ahead. Researchers from the United States and abroad--an estimated 2,000 a year--are poised to come to the SNS to study materials that will form the basis for new technologies in telecommunications, manufacturing, transportation, information, biotechnology and health. This broad range of scientific impact will strengthen the nation?s economy, energy security and national security. Oak Ridge National Laboratory is a multiprogram laboratory managed for the Department of Energy by UT-Battelle. From jmarshall.reber at comcast.net Thu Dec 29 17:21:15 2005 From: jmarshall.reber at comcast.net (J. Marshall Reber) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 18:21:15 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA Message-ID: Holy Moly! A pickup truck carrying EMPTY radioactive and biohazard containers turns over but the highway is shut down for hours because the driver can't speak English and verify their emptyness. From StevenFrey at aol.com Thu Dec 29 17:35:27 2005 From: StevenFrey at aol.com (StevenFrey at aol.com) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 18:35:27 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] sr90 from noble gases Message-ID: <222.5793db6.30e5ccbf@aol.com> We certainly can, Norm. Your question shows that you don't understand this science. With due respect, why should we waste our time educating you? You don't trust any of us in here, anyway. We're all nuclear liars in your mind. Recommendation: enroll in a radiation sciences program at a credible college or university. See. Learn. Do. You might even enjoy the academic journey toward enlightenment. Your old friend, Steve In a message dated 12/29/2005 3:52:10 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, ncohen12 at comcast.net writes: Guys and gals, Somewhere I read that sr90 could be produced from the decay of noble gases emitted from nuke plants. What can you all tell me about this? Norm Coalition for Peace and Justice; UNPLUG Salem Campaign, 321 Barr Ave, Linwood; NJ08221; 609-601-8583 _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From radiation at cox.net Thu Dec 29 21:29:47 2005 From: radiation at cox.net (Mitchell W. Davis) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 21:29:47 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH In-Reply-To: <43B39219.28389.547552F@localhost> Message-ID: <20051230032748.MWUU4002.centrmmtao06.cox.net@yourae066c3a9b> Sandy wrote: Sad how some automatically judge a person by their credentials, without any real evidence, background or knowledge. Not very scientific ... is it? Or lack there of (the illustrious "piece of paper"...Seems I raised the hackles of many on here sometime back about the requirement for a BS (take that however you wish) degree as a requirement to become a CHP). Seems credentials were the ONLY thing that meant an individual was "qualified" to sit for the CHP exam. What is sad is that so many take stock in a piece of paper than an individual's true knowledge base. Was this argument hypocrisy? I do believe it was. Mitchell Davis, RRPT (Soon to be RN and leaving this industry for greener pastures) Midland, TX -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of Sandy Perle Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 9:37 AM To: Franz Sch?nhofer; farbersa at optonline.net Cc: RADSAFE Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] MPH On 29 Dec 2005 at 0:34, farbersa at optonline.net wrote: > Many MPH or MSPH programs involve extensive coursework in > biostatistics and epidemiology so don't be too quick to dismiss an > analysis of some issue based solely on the individual having an MPH > degree. I agree! Dr. Phil Plato, formerly at University of Michigan and responsible for the first Draft NVLAP Program, and also responsible for leading the 1st Performance Test Lab back in the '80s, has a MPH. Sad how some automatically judge a person by their credentials, without any real evidence, background or knowledge. Not very scientific ... is it? ------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 E-Mail: sperle at dosimetry.com E-Mail: sandyfl at earthlink.net Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From sandyfl at earthlink.net Thu Dec 29 21:37:13 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 19:37:13 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH In-Reply-To: <20051230032748.MWUU4002.centrmmtao06.cox.net@yourae066c3a9b> References: <43B39219.28389.547552F@localhost> Message-ID: <43B43AE9.30179.CC71508@localhost> On 29 Dec 2005 at 21:29, Mitchell W. Davis wrote: > Seems I raised the > hackles of many on here sometime back about the requirement for a BS > (take that however you wish) degree as a requirement to become a CHP). > Seems credentials were the ONLY thing that meant an individual was > "qualified" to sit for the CHP exam. What is sad is that so many take > stock in a piece of paper than an individual's true knowledge base. > Was this argument hypocrisy? I do believe it was. Mitchell, I hope that you'e not putting me in the camp of those that push for a degree before the CHP can be pursued. I for one stated that to me I'd rather have a person working for me who has an extensive knowledge of whatever field they are in when compared to many with a specific degree. In my 21 years at FPL, I worked with many who did not have a degree, but were the individuals I'd put my confidence in when a significant problem arose. However, there are many instances where a degree is essential. For whatever reason, when in front of a jury, the credentials are absolutely necessary, when very technical issues are discussed. I don't always agree that this is the case, but in many instances it is. There's nothing wrong with credentials. However, the case we're discussing here is criticism of an individual because of what is credentials are perceived to be. That is not correct either. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From radiation at cox.net Thu Dec 29 21:50:31 2005 From: radiation at cox.net (Mitchell W. Davis) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 21:50:31 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH In-Reply-To: <43B43AE9.30179.CC71508@localhost> Message-ID: <20051230034809.LVRD613.centrmmtao03.cox.net@yourae066c3a9b> No Sandy I was not putting you in "the camp"...And I appreciate your understand of true knowledge base. As far as credentials go, would you agree that the credential of CHP is the most significant in our field and would stand up in a litigious environment regardless of college degree? Mitch Davis -----Original Message----- From: Sandy Perle [mailto:sandyfl at earthlink.net] Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 9:37 PM To: 'Franz Sch?nhofer'; farbersa at optonline.net; Mitchell W. Davis Cc: 'RADSAFE' Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] MPH On 29 Dec 2005 at 21:29, Mitchell W. Davis wrote: > Seems I raised the > hackles of many on here sometime back about the requirement for a BS > (take that however you wish) degree as a requirement to become a CHP). > Seems credentials were the ONLY thing that meant an individual was > "qualified" to sit for the CHP exam. What is sad is that so many take > stock in a piece of paper than an individual's true knowledge base. > Was this argument hypocrisy? I do believe it was. Mitchell, I hope that you'e not putting me in the camp of those that push for a degree before the CHP can be pursued. I for one stated that to me I'd rather have a person working for me who has an extensive knowledge of whatever field they are in when compared to many with a specific degree. In my 21 years at FPL, I worked with many who did not have a degree, but were the individuals I'd put my confidence in when a significant problem arose. However, there are many instances where a degree is essential. For whatever reason, when in front of a jury, the credentials are absolutely necessary, when very technical issues are discussed. I don't always agree that this is the case, but in many instances it is. There's nothing wrong with credentials. However, the case we're discussing here is criticism of an individual because of what is credentials are perceived to be. That is not correct either. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From sandyfl at earthlink.net Thu Dec 29 21:59:19 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 19:59:19 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH In-Reply-To: <20051230034809.LVRD613.centrmmtao03.cox.net@yourae066c3a9b> References: <43B43AE9.30179.CC71508@localhost> Message-ID: <43B44017.20222.CDB51E1@localhost> On 29 Dec 2005 at 21:50, Mitchell W. Davis wrote: > As far as credentials go, would you > agree that the credential of CHP is the most significant in our field > and would stand up in a litigious environment regardless of college > degree? I personally don't subscribe to the notion that the CHP behind one's name is the most significant validation point, be it in the work environment or in a court litigation. I think what is important is the entire picture, and the CHP is certainly one of the important factors. A CHP is like any other individual, and their expertise may be in one or several areas. Therefore, unless they have real experience to go along with the CHP, they're only as good as what they read about, and not actually living the subject. Those who I've had the most respect for in my power reactor days are those who not only didn't have a CHP, but no degree at all. They did know how to solve problems though, and I know too many CHPs, Ph.Ds and others who simply can't think on their feet. In other words, unless they have the map in front of them, they trip over their own feet. I want to reiterate that this is not a generalization. It is based on my 35 years in the industry. Maybe I'm getting too cynical in my old age! :) ---------------------------------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From didi at tgi-sci.com Thu Dec 29 22:52:22 2005 From: didi at tgi-sci.com (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Dimiter=20Popoff?=) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 06:52:22 +0200 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Re: Rt. 9 in MA Message-ID: <20051230045222.10639.qmail@server318.com> Seems to be a plague nowadays... These days I heard an English football coach complain that some of his substitute players were running wild over the pitch rather than take the position he had told them because they did not speak a word English. Just imagine the guy slowly giving his explanations to a nodding player and his face seconds after the player takes off... His English was not the easiest to understand, though - came close (well, not too close) to my limit. At least when interviewed by the media. Unlike another, more famous colleague of his, who hopelessly crosses this limit of mine. The fact that he is Scottish does not alter much since he is the only Scottsman I fail to understand so far over the radio... But wait, not so long ago, when I thought he was the only person speaking on the BBC some language I could not understand his team was joined by an English youth, a very talented player, whose speech is a duplica of that of his Scottish coach as far as my input channels are concerned... :-) :-) :-) Have a lot of fun during the upcoming year, Dimiter ------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments http://www.tgi-sci.com ------------------------------------------------------ > -------Original Message------- > From: J. Marshall Reber > Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA > Sent: Dec 30 '05 01:21 > > Holy Moly! A pickup truck carrying EMPTY radioactive and biohazard > containers turns over but the highway is shut down for hours because the > driver can't speak English and verify their emptyness. > > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > From sandyfl at earthlink.net Thu Dec 29 23:03:01 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 21:03:01 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <43B44F05.10262.D15A2C6@localhost> On 29 Dec 2005 at 18:21, J. Marshall Reber wrote: > highway is shut down for hours because the > driver can't speak English and verify their emptyness And there wasn't a detector in sight! Anyone really believe that we're ready to handle a real radiation type incident! If one should ever occur, it will make the response to Hurricane Katrina look like a walk in the park! ---------------------------------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From obbugg at gsp.net Fri Dec 30 07:40:21 2005 From: obbugg at gsp.net (O.Bruce Bugg) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 08:40:21 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA Message-ID: Any links to other news articles? The only ones I found don't mention a language barrier. http://www.boston.com/news/local/massachusetts/articles/2005/12/29/truck _rollover_causing_problems_on_route_9/ Two stories http://www.thebostonchannel.com/newsarchive/5710505/detail.html and http://www1.whdh.com/news/articles/local/BOS11702/ indicate that there were meters present. With what I understand to be THE major manufacturer of radiopharmaceuticals in the greater Boston area, one would hope that responders are a little better versed. But maybe not, because like everywhere else, the number of incidents involving radioactive materials transport is virtually non-existent. I think I've been to four in Georgia in 20 years, and one of those was precipitated by theft of the courier vehicle. If the driver ever carries Yellow-III, then he needs CDL and is subject to the English language requirements of the Motor Carrier Safety Regulations. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Capt. Bruce Bugg Georgia Department of Public Safety Motor Carrier Compliance Division P.O. Box 1456 Atlanta , GA 30371-1456 Phone: 404.624.7211 or 7210 Fax: 404.624.7295 e-mail: obbugg(at)gsp.net [replace "(at)" with "@"] -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of J.Marshall Reber Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 18:21 To: RadSafe Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA Holy Moly! A pickup truck carrying EMPTY radioactive and biohazard containers turns over but the highway is shut down for hours because the driver can't speak English and verify their emptyness. _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From jmarshall.reber at comcast.net Fri Dec 30 07:54:18 2005 From: jmarshall.reber at comcast.net (J. Marshall Reber) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 08:54:18 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA In-Reply-To: Message-ID: My source of info was a TV news report. On Friday, December 30, 2005, at 08:40 , O.Bruce Bugg wrote: > Any links to other news articles? The only ones I found don't mention a > language barrier. From LNMolino at aol.com Fri Dec 30 07:55:19 2005 From: LNMolino at aol.com (LNMolino at aol.com) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 08:55:19 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA Message-ID: <42.77a94626.30e69647@aol.com> In a message dated 12/30/2005 7:52:49 A.M. Central Standard Time, obbugg at gsp.net writes: With what I understand to be THE major manufacturer of radiopharmaceuticals in the greater Boston area, one would hope that responders are a little better versed. I think you'd be wrong to hope that and foolish to believe it was true! I agree BTW that it's the shear lack of incidents even in 2005 post 9/11 with all the WMD/CBRNE training and money and at times hype that causes the "failures" we see like this. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino at aol.com 979-690-7559 (Office) 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the original author. From jmarshall.reber at comcast.net Fri Dec 30 08:02:28 2005 From: jmarshall.reber at comcast.net (J. Marshall Reber) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 09:02:28 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA In-Reply-To: <43B44F05.10262.D15A2C6@localhost> Message-ID: The TV news mentioned the use of a "geiger counter by the suited, state HazMat Team; the implication was the highway was shut down until they arrived and assessed the situation. The other implication was that the first responders had no ability to assess the radiation. On Friday, December 30, 2005, at 12:03 , Sandy Perle wrote: > And there wasn't a detector in sight! From blc+ at pitt.edu Fri Dec 30 09:03:19 2005 From: blc+ at pitt.edu (Bernard Cohen) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 10:03:19 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] sr90 from noble gases In-Reply-To: <01LX51BVTFB000SO17@mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu> References: <01LX51BVTFB000SO17@mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu> Message-ID: <43B54C37.8080805@pitt.edu> Kr-90 decays into Rb-90 which decays into Sr-90, but the half life of Kr-90 is only 33 seconds, so it would have to diffuse out of the fuel pin (if that pin was defective) and carried with the water to the point where a small fraction of the water is diverted to and through the demineralizer bed before its decay products could escape removal in the demineralizer bed. Only a tiny fraction of Kr-90 atoms could do all of this within their 33 second half life limitation. Norm Cohen wrote: >Guys and gals, > >Somewhere I read that sr90 could be produced from the decay of noble gases >emitted from nuke plants. What can you all tell me about this? > > > >Norm > > > >Coalition for Peace and Justice; UNPLUG Salem Campaign, 321 Barr Ave, >Linwood; NJ08221; 609-601-8583 > > > >_______________________________________________ >You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > >Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > >For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > > From joel.baumbaugh at navy.mil Fri Dec 30 09:07:26 2005 From: joel.baumbaugh at navy.mil (Baumbaugh, Joel SPAWAR) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 07:07:26 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] MPH Message-ID: <7DB6DF83D2CD9140ADA0622B1A05BF2F0166797E@nawespscez02.nadsuswe.nads.navy.mil> All, I started reading this "thread" a little late (too much to read, too little time), but I agree with Kelly's explanation below. I have both an MHP AND a MPH from San Diego State University. Both degree programs were, in my opinion, equally rigorous and quite complementary in their outlook/viewpoint on the world around us. I also TOTALLY agree with Sandy's observation of those with degrees not always being able to think on their feet (i.e. being totally dependent on their book-learning). Some of the "STUPIDEST" (not a politically correct word, I know) people I've ever met have the letters BS, MS, PHD and MD after their names, and some of the smartest have, or should have had, SHK (school of hard knocks) after theirs. My personal opinion only, not necessarily that of my employer (the U.S. Navy)... Joel Baumbaugh SSC-SD. Thanks Sandy, As a graduate of the University of Michigan Radiation Protection Program, and one of Phil Plato's students, I can tell you that rad protection requirements for graduation for either an MS or an MPH degree were identical and included a thesis and an internship. The MPH takes a semester longer because of the additional required coursework in General Environmental Health, Epidemiology, and Biostatistics. The MPH is administered by the School of Public Health, and the MS is administered by the Rackham Graduate School. Essentially no difference. -------------- Original message -------------- From: "Sandy Perle" > On 29 Dec 2005 at 0:34, farbersa at optonline.net wrote: > > > Many MPH or MSPH programs involve extensive coursework in > > biostatistics and epidemiology so don't be too quick to dismiss an > > analysis of some issue based solely on the individual having an MPH > > degree. > > I agree! Dr. Phil Plato, formerly at University of Michigan and > responsible for the first Draft NVLAP Program, and also responsible > for leading the 1st Performance Test Lab back in the '80s, has a MPH. > > Sad how some automatically judge a person by their credentials, > without any real evidence, background or knowledge. Not very > scientific ... is it? > > From sandyfl at earthlink.net Fri Dec 30 09:23:25 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 07:23:25 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA In-Reply-To: References: <43B44F05.10262.D15A2C6@localhost> Message-ID: <43B4E06D.10714.85ACB@localhost> On 30 Dec 2005 at 9:02, J. Marshall Reber wrote: > The other implication was that the first responders had no ability to > assess the radiation. Thanks for update ... the above seems to be the norm, unfortunately. Taking hours to clear an area where there was "most likely" no radiation readings, and I assume there were no residual readings from whatever the empty cannistres carried, is unacceptable. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From LNMolino at aol.com Fri Dec 30 11:34:10 2005 From: LNMolino at aol.com (LNMolino at aol.com) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 12:34:10 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA Message-ID: <66.66169e2b.30e6c992@aol.com> In a message dated 12/30/2005 10:37:30 A.M. Central Standard Time, jmarshall.reber at comcast.net writes: "geiger counter by the suited, state HazMat Team To me there is also an issue over "suited". Did anyone see the Level of Protection worn? I bet it was way more than Anti- C's as in likely Level A. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino at aol.com 979-690-7559 (Office) 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the original author. From EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV Fri Dec 30 11:56:15 2005 From: EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV (Baratta, Edmond J) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 12:56:15 -0500 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA Message-ID: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA86@orsnewea002.fda.gov> The Massachusetts State Police have detectors in their Patrol Cars!! Edmond J. Baratta Radiation Safety Officer Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 Fax: 781-729-3593 edmond.baratta at fda.gov -----Original Message----- From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf Of J. Marshall Reber Sent: Friday, December 30, 2005 9:02 AM To: sandyfl at earthlink.net Cc: RadSafe Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA The TV news mentioned the use of a "geiger counter by the suited, state HazMat Team; the implication was the highway was shut down until they arrived and assessed the situation. The other implication was that the first responders had no ability to assess the radiation. On Friday, December 30, 2005, at 12:03 , Sandy Perle wrote: > And there wasn't a detector in sight! _______________________________________________ You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ From d-i-menchaca at tamu.edu Fri Dec 30 12:09:27 2005 From: d-i-menchaca at tamu.edu (Menchaca, Daniel I) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 12:09:27 -0600 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Job Opportunity at Texas A&M University. Message-ID: <9D876F823E07C64C945268B8D245671173DCC5@vpfn4.tamu.edu> All, Here is a posting for a Health Physicist at Texas A&M University in College Station, Texas. It is a full-time job with benefits. To view the job posting, navigate to http://tamujobs.tamu.edu/ and select 'Search Postings' on the left navigation pane. Enter 060502 in the 'N.O.V. Number' search box, press the 'Search' button and the job should pop up. To review the specifics (or apply), click on 'View' in the Position Title box. To apply, select 'Apply for This Position'. Please do not send resumes directly to me, I can only consider applicants who apply through the web site. Regards, Dan Daniel I. Menchaca, MS, CHP Radiological Safety Environmental Health and Safety Department (EHSD) Texas A&M University 4472 TAMU College Station, Texas 77843-4472 Voice: 979-845-0063 Fax: 979-845-1348 mailto:d-i-menchaca at tamu.edu http://ehsd.tamu.edu From LNMolino at aol.com Fri Dec 30 14:46:30 2005 From: LNMolino at aol.com (LNMolino at aol.com) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 15:46:30 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA Message-ID: <26d.360d8d1.30e6f6a6@aol.com> In a message dated 12/30/2005 1:14:11 P.M. Central Standard Time, sandyfl at earthlink.net writes: Thanks for update ... the above seems to be the norm, unfortunately. Taking hours to clear an area where there was "most likely" no radiation readings, and I assume there were no residual readings from whatever the empty canisters carried, is unacceptable. >From my perspective it's more likely an inability to accurately assess any reading that is gotten background or above background. A trained dog can operate a meter, you have to have someone that can interpret said readings then make a decision on actions or inactions with some type of realistic risk assessment in place. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino at aol.com 979-690-7559 (Office) 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the original author. From LNMolino at aol.com Fri Dec 30 15:18:18 2005 From: LNMolino at aol.com (LNMolino at aol.com) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 16:18:18 EST Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA Message-ID: <242.487680d.30e6fe1a@aol.com> In a message dated 12/30/2005 3:14:48 P.M. Central Standard Time, EBARATTA at ORA.FDA.GOV writes: The Massachusetts State Police have detectors in their Patrol Cars!! And their level of training and UNDERSTANDING of the units use and limitations and intent of such use? Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino at aol.com 979-690-7559 (Office) 979-690-7562 (Office Fax) "A Texan with a Jersey Attitude" The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless I specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for its stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the original author. From sandyfl at earthlink.net Fri Dec 30 17:53:57 2005 From: sandyfl at earthlink.net (Sandy Perle) Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 15:53:57 -0800 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA In-Reply-To: <26d.360d8d1.30e6f6a6@aol.com> Message-ID: <43B55815.22726.1DBC33A@localhost> On 30 Dec 2005 at 15:46, LNMolino at aol.com wrote: > A trained dog can operate a meter, you have to have someone that can > interpret said readings then make a decision on actions or inactions > with some type of realistic risk assessment in place. I agree absolutely. The problem is there are detectors out there, but the majority of those using the detectors don't have a clue as to what the readings mean. Hence, businesses and roads continue to be closed for hours where there is no need to do so. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Sandy Perle Senior Vice President, Technical Operations Global Dosimetry Solutions, Inc. 2652 McGaw Avenue Irvine, CA 92614 Tel: (949) 296-2306 / (888) 437-1714 Extension 2306 Fax:(949) 296-1144 Global Dosimetry Website: http://www.dosimetry.com/ Personal Website: http://sandy-travels.com/ From joseroze at netvision.net.il Sat Dec 31 01:05:51 2005 From: joseroze at netvision.net.il (Jose Julio Rozental) Date: Sat, 31 Dec 2005 10:05:51 +0300 Subject: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA References: <2DCD5C7845865A4DA541502677F6CD569BDA86@orsnewea002.fda.gov> Message-ID: <008a01c60dd8$a4a1c500$840118ac@userqzqxd9wnct> IAEA Training customs, police http://www.iaea.org/NewsCenter/Features/NuclearSecurity/index.html http://www.iaea.org/Publications/Factsheets/English/nuclsecurity.pdf http://www.iaea.org/NewsCenter/News/2005/securityconf.html http://www.iaea.org/NewsCenter/News/2005/nuclear_security.html Jose Julio Rozental joseroze at netvision.net.il Israel ----- Original Message ----- From: "Baratta, Edmond J" To: "'J. Marshall Reber'" ; Cc: "RadSafe" Sent: Friday, December 30, 2005 8:56 PM Subject: RE: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA > The Massachusetts State Police have detectors in their Patrol Cars!! > > Edmond J. Baratta > Radiation Safety Officer > Tel. No. 781-729-5700 x 728 > Fax: 781-729-3593 > edmond.baratta at fda.gov > > -----Original Message----- > From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf > Of J. Marshall Reber > Sent: Friday, December 30, 2005 9:02 AM > To: sandyfl at earthlink.net > Cc: RadSafe > Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] Rt. 9 in MA > > The TV news mentioned the use of a "geiger counter by the suited, state > HazMat Team; the implication was the highway was shut down until they > arrived and assessed the situation. The other implication was that the > first responders had no ability to assess the radiation. > > On Friday, December 30, 2005, at 12:03 , Sandy Perle wrote: > > > And there wasn't a detector in sight! > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the > RadSafe rules. These can be found at: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: > http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ > _______________________________________________ > You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list > > Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and understood the RadSafe rules. These can be found at: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/radsaferules.html > > For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings visit: http://radlab.nl/radsafe/ >