[ RadSafe ] Yucca Mountain / o.4 Sv extra radiation over 10years.... / Miller and McClain, 2007

Sun Jul 6 05:41:36 CDT 2008

I had one of these types of letters sent to my CEO once.  

Anyone remember that Gofman disciple L.H. Ricciuti, who was always on about
nuclear contamination of Niagara Falls and pretty much the whole of Western
New York?  

I asked him once to clarify a statement he made on Radsafe and he sent an
e-mail to my CEO asking why I, a public servant, had so much time on my
hands that I'd be able to spend it correcting his grammar (something I
didn't actually do, I just needed him to clarify!).  

Don't see L.H. around the traps any more.  I wonder if that's one of James'
early pseudonyms.  Or maybe James is a pseudonym for L.H.!  Now that I think
about it, I've never actually seen them together... 

Brent Rogers
Sydney Australia

-----Original Message-----
From: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl [mailto:radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl] On Behalf
Of ROY HERREN
Sent: Sunday, 6 July 2008 11:06 AM
To: James Salsman; radsafelist; Dan McCarn; Steven Dapra;
Rainer.Facius at dlr.de
Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] Yucca Mountain / o.4 Sv extra radiation over
10years.... / Miller and McClain, 2007

James,

   Why do you owe Dr. Franta an apology?  Simply because what you did was to
take his personal opinion (free speech) from this very public forum and make
it into a personal attack on his very livelihood.  Do you recall the Golden
Rule, "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you"?  

>What does it say about an industry that speaking with an employer in a
situation like that is frowned on?

I am not suggesting anything, nor am I threatening, but how would you feel
if "everyone" on this mailing list who has taken exception to something that
you have written over the years were to take it upon themselves to contact
your employer about their many grievances with you?  I don't think your
employer would appreciate such an action, and I certainly don't think that
you would enjoy the potential negative outcome.  There is nothing "magic"
about common decency!  Just ask yourself before you do something, if you
would be upset if someone did to you whatever it is that you are planning. 
If the answer is that you wouldn't appreciate the action, then  reconsider
the action before hitting the ""Send" button.  We should all impose self
constraint in regards to our "rights to free association and speech". 
Our rights should end when they start to trample on anothers rights. 
You know full well that you could have cost Dr. Franta his job, his
 very means of making a living.  You trampled on his rights!  Dr. Franta
didn't represent his "free speech" public opinion as being that of his
employer, therefore you didn't have any need to drag his employer into the
fray other than your own malicious intent to inflict harm.  Simple put, you
owe Dr. Franta an apology because you let your anger cause you to launch a
personal vendetta.

Roy Herren 

Roy Herren wrote:

> Have you publicly apologized as of yet to Dr. Franta for having contacted
his company's CEO?

>Why?  If someone accused you of trying to help terrorists, would you
>magically lose your right to free association and speech?  Would you
>magically lose your right to complain to the accuser's management?
>What does it say about an industry that speaking with an employer in a
>situation like that is frowned on?

----- Original Message ----
From: James Salsman <BenjB4 at gmail.com>
To: radsafelist <radsafe at radlab.nl>; Dan McCarn <hotgreenchile at gmail.com>;
ROY HERREN <royherren2005 at yahoo.com>; Steven Dapra <sjd at swcp.com>;
Rainer.Facius at dlr.de
Sent: Saturday, July 5, 2008 3:10:06 AM
Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] Yucca Mountain / o.4 Sv extra radiation over 10
years.... / Miller and McClain, 2007

Dan McCarn wrote:

> Mike Brennan has sufficiently answered your question....

No, Mike's answer of "zero" is wrong and foolish.  He hasn't even
begun to enumerate all of the ways spent fuel has entered the
environment.  For example, that answer also omits this:

http://www.mindfully.org/Nucs/Plutonium-Found-Munitions.htm

> I tend to believe that you offer your seeming ignorance as part of a
ruse....

Ha!  You accuse me of feigned ignorance but neither you nor anyone
else has been able to offer an accurate figure for the rate at which
spent fuel has and is expected to enter the environment.

> This was one of my IAEA projects back in the 80s in the
> IAEA's Division of Nuclear Fuel Cycle to characterize all
> non-reactor nuclear fuel cycle facilities in the world.

Then why are you unable to state a number?

Rainer Facius wrote:

> not a single of the references you provided addresses HERITABLE effects?

Incorrect.  As Dr. Cedervall almost correctly pointed out: "A
teratogen may also, but not necessarily, be a _mutagen_ and therefore
could give heritable ... defects"
http://lists.radlab.nl/pipermail/radsafe/2008-July/010513.html  (His
"necessarily" part is wrong -- a mutagen is a mutagen and a
teratogenic mutagen has the mechanism of action in the germ cells.)
The Miller and McClain 2007 review clearly indicate mutations and
other chromosome aberrations, and their findings have been adopted by
the U.S. National Research Council:

http://books.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=11979&page=90

Roy Herren wrote:

> Have you publicly apologized as of yet to Dr. Franta for having contacted
his company's CEO?

Why?  If someone accused you of trying to help terrorists, would you
magically lose your right to free association and speech?  Would you
magically lose your right to complain to the accuser's management?
What does it say about an industry that speaking with an employer in a
situation like that is frowned on?

Steven Dapra wrote:

> According to McDiarmid et al., so few chromosomal aberrations were
> found that they couldn't perform linear regression on them.

What do you think the relation is between the ability to perform
linear regression and confirmation of their existence?

>  it has become patently obvious to me that you *can't* read reports.

Steve, three months ago you were trying to convince us that uranyl
wasn't teratogenic.  How long do you intend to keep playing the fool?
If you have a problem with the way Miller and McClain characterized
McDairmid's results, please email or phone her at her office.  She is
on Eastern time and returning from her vacation on Monday.

James Salsman

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