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Re: Pu Toxicity vs DDT
Great answer, Ron! Thanks much!!!
jim.dunlap@guardian.brooks.af.mil
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: Pu Toxicity vs DDT
Author: radsafe@romulus.ehs.uiuc.edu at guardian
Date: 1/28/99 1:36 PM
Adding to the ongoing discussion, it be should noted that the comparison is
of the ACUTE toxicities of Pu and DDT -- a deterministic effect with a
threshold. On this basis, many substances are indeed more toxic than
plutonium. However, when a comparison is made of toxicity on the basis of
nondeterministic (ie stochastic) lethal effects for which there is no
threshold (eg lung cancers for inhaled particles; bone sarcoma induction),
small intakes of plutonium are far more likely to induce such effects than
would DDT. Thus on this basis Pu is far more toxic than DDT. Dose, route
of entry, and end point all need to be considered in the overall evaluation
of toxicity; acute toxicity is a deterministic effect for which there is
indeed a threshold, but Pu gets its high toxicity from its potential for
stochastic long term effects.
On a philosophical note, as scientists and especially as health physicists,
playing such comparison games is a pointless exercise, and potentially
seriously misleading to the lay person.
Ron Kathren, CHP, DEE
Professor and Director
United States Transuranium and Uranium Registries
Washington State University
2710 University Drive
Richland, WA 99352
509-375-5643
509-375-1817 FAX
At 12:52 PM 1/28/99 -0600, Minnema, Douglas wrote:
>Gus,
>
>I suggest that you look at the dose to the GI tract itself. It is quite
>significant. Although I don't remember the exact number right now, I
>seem to recall estimates that 0.5g (Pu-239 equivalent) ingested, if
>finely divided, might cause acute lethality.
>
>Obviously, it would be strongly dependent upon the form. Large chunks
>would self-shield more.
>
>Doug Minnema, CHP
>Defense Programs, DOE
><Douglas.Minnema@ns.doe.gov>
>
>what few thoughts i have are truly my own.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Potter, Charles [SMTP:capotte@sandia.gov]
> Sent: Thursday, January 28, 1999 12:27 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list
> Subject: RE: Pu Toxicity vs DDT
>
> The f1 for Pu is 10^-3 (10^-5 for oxides), so almost all of any
> ingested Pu
> is not absorbed and excreted in the feces.
>
> Now if we gave everybody just a little to eat...think of the $$$ we
> could
> save on disposal! :)
>
> C. A. Gus Potter
> Sandia National Laboratories
> Albuquerque, New Mexico
> (505) 844-2750
> capotte@sandia.gov
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mike Dempsey [mailto:mdempsey@lanl.gov]
> Sent: Thursday, January 28, 1999 10:08 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list
> Subject: Pu Toxicity vs DDT
>
>
> A thread I wish to start is: What is the name of the Nobel Prize
> Winner
> (Chemistry?) who is making the claim that Pu is NOT the most toxic
> substance on earth, as many would have us believe. I have read it
> several
> times but his name escapes me. The story goes that he will put a
> million
> dollars down on the table along with a gram of Pu and a gram of DDT.
> He
> will eat the Pu and you eat the DDT, the winner walks away from the
> table
> alive with the money. What is his name and does anyone have any
> further
> details?
>
> Thanks in advance...
>
>
> Clearly my own opinion
>
> Mike Dempsey dempsey@lanl.gov
>
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