[ RadSafe ] Wind Turbine effect on local Meteorology - "RIP"[Reduction Insolance Phenonmenon]

Tue Nov 8 18:52:30 CST 2011

Wow! This is truly interesting.

Thanks!

Jim Darrough

-----Original Message-----
From: radsafe-bounces at health.phys.iit.edu
[mailto:radsafe-bounces at health.phys.iit.edu] On Behalf Of Jeff Terry
Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2011 12:36 PM
To: The International Radiation Protection (Health Physics) Mailing List
Cc: The International Radiation Protection (Health Physics) Mailing List;
The International Radiation Protection (Health Physics) Mailing List
Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] Wind Turbine effect on local Meteorology -
"RIP"[Reduction Insolance Phenonmenon]

In case anyone wants to see what I am talking about. 

Here is a link to a picture. 

http://www.popsci.com/technology/article/2010-01/wind-turbines-leave-clouds-
and-energy-inefficiency-their-wake

Jeff

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 8, 2011, at 2:33 PM, Jeff Terry <terryj at iit.edu> wrote:

> Wow Chris,
> 
> There must be some fast moving trees in the UK to form contrails off the
leaves. 
> 
> Jeff
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Nov 8, 2011, at 2:20 PM, "Busby, Chris" <C.Busby at ulster.ac.uk> wrote:
> 
>> That is what trees do and it is a good thing. So when they cut all the
trees down, the windmills substitute and the farmers are happy. 
>> But someone once argued that the real problem with windmills is that they
make the earth spin more slowly (ballerina effect). Im surprised you dont
use that one. 
>> Chris
>> 
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: radsafe-bounces at agni.phys.iit.edu on behalf of Jeff Terry
>> Sent: Mon 07/11/2011 19:04
>> To: SAFarber at optonline.net; The International Radiation Protection
(Health Physics) Mailing List
>> Cc: The International Radiation Protection (Health Physics) Mailing
List
>> Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] Wind Turbine effect on local Meteorology - 
>> "RIP"[Reduction Insolance Phenonmenon]
>> 
>> I have driven down Interstate 65 in Indiana through the contrails from
the windmills. It can be the only point in the state where it is "raining."
>> 
>> Jeff
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> On Nov 7, 2011, at 12:52 PM, Stewart Farber <SAFarber at optonline.net>
wrote:
>> 
>>> The info below is not a Satire.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> A fascinating photo is seen below, showing that when air has a 
>>> relative humidity close to the dewpoint, it will be cooled by large 
>>> commercial wind turbines as energy is abstracted from the air 
>>> sweeping the blades to below the dewpoint, which results in:
>>> 
>>> Cloud formation [and  reduced ground level temperatures, and reduced 
>>> solar insolation]  many miles downstream of the wind turbines.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> See:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> http://wattsupwiththat.com/2011/04/28/the-wind-turbine-albedo-effect
>>> /
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I have a modest suggestion for the name of this effect:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> "Reduction Insolation Phenomenon"  [ RIP ]
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> As a humorous thought, if there are people downwind of a wind 
>>> turbine farm, and they have solar panels, the cloud cover created by 
>>> the energy abstracted from the wind in producing wind generated 
>>> electricity,  will reduce solar insolation due to INCREASED  Albedo. 
>>> This will DECREASE solar panel generated electricity since less 
>>> sunlight will be incident on their solar panels -on average.  In the 
>>> right conditions, there would also be some increased snow formation 
>>> downwind of a large wind turbine as air is cooled below the dewpoint to
the point snow, or freezing rain, can form.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> This occurrence is but another example of the  "Law of Unintended 
>>> Consequences". See the Wiki review comment below about the somewhat 
>>> analogous effect of artificial clouds created by contrails from jet 
>>> traffic or the obscuring of insolation by smoke from burning oil 
>>> wells in Kuwait, that dropped the ground level temp under the 
>>> obscuring clouds of smoke by as much as 10 degrees C!! The clouds 
>>> formed by wind turbines near groud level will have much less effect 
>>> than a cloud formed a higher altitudes, but there will be local 
>>> albedo and solar insolation effects from wind turbines under certain 
>>> conditions,  reducing sunlight at ground level. Cool in so many ways!
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> FROM WIKIPEDIA:
>>> 
>>> Cloud albedo <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloud_albedo>  has 
>>> substantial influence over atmospheric temperatures. Different types 
>>> of clouds exhibit different reflectivity, theoretically ranging in 
>>> albedo from a minimum of near 0 to a maximum approaching 0.8. "On 
>>> any given day, about half of Earth is covered by clouds, which reflect
more sunlight than land and water.
>>> Clouds keep Earth cool by reflecting sunlight, but they can also 
>>> serve as blankets to trap warmth."
>>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albedo#cite_note-livescience-23> [24]
>>> 
>>> Albedo and climate in some areas are affected by artificial clouds, 
>>> such as those created by the contrails 
>>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contrail>  of heavy commercial airliner
traffic.
>>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albedo#cite_note-uww-24> [25] A study 
>>> following the burning of the Kuwaiti oil fields during Iraqi 
>>> occupation showed that temperatures under the burning oil fires were 
>>> as much as 10oC colder than temperatures several miles away under clear
skies.
>>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albedo#cite_note-harvard-25> [26]
>>> 
>>> 25.  ^ <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albedo#cite_ref-uww_24-0>
>>> http://facstaff.uww.edu/travisd/pdf/jetcontrailsrecentresearch.pdf
>>> 
>>> 26. ^ <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albedo#cite_ref-harvard_25-0>
>>> <http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/1992JGR....9714565C> "The Kuwait oil 
>>> fires as seen by Landsat".  Adsabs.harvard.edu. 1991-05-30.
>>> http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/1992JGR....9714565C. Retrieved 2011-08-19.
>>> 
>>> ===========================
>>> 
>>> So I might encourage other people to waste their time, I welcome any 
>>> suggestions for an Acronym for this phenomenon of increased cloud 
>>> formation, decreased temperatures, and lowered solar insolation 
>>> downwind of wind turbine farms.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> The "winner" [ or perhaps "loser" depending on your point of view, 
>>> or anyone that wants it for some unknown reason]  will receive a pdf 
>>> copy of my 1982, but still timely, LOBA [Loss of Blade Accident] 
>>> Satire and the hilarious Letters-to-the-Editor responses from people 
>>> who didn't understand a Satire when they read it.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Stewart Farber, MSPH
>>> 
>>> Farber Medical Solutions, LLC
>>> 
>>> Bridgeport, CT 06606
>>> 
>>> email: SAFarber at optonline.net
>>> 
>>> 203-441-8433
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
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