Re: The "From" bug strikes again :-)

[Jim Muckerheide <jmuckerheide@delphi.com>]

To clarify the previous url:

>>>>>>>>>>>>>
 Captives of Their Fantasies: The German Atomic Bomb Scientists 
 Irving M. Klotz Department of Chemistry, Northwestern University, Evanston,
IL 60208-3113 

 When the Nazi government collapsed in May, 1945, an Allied intelligence
mission took into custody nine of the German scientists who played key roles
in the German atomic bomb project. Under great secrecy these men were confined
in a large country house, Farm Hall, near Cambridge (England), and their
conversations were recorded surreptitiously by hidden microphones in every
room. The transcripts were kept TOP SECRET for 47 years and were finally
released recently. They give fascinating insights into the personalities of
the guests and invaluable information on what the Germans really understood
about the physics and chemistry of a nuclear reactor and an atomic bomb. 

 The Farm Hall transcripts clearly establish that (a) the Germans on August 6,
1945 did not believe that the Allies had exploded an atomic bomb over
Hiroshima that day; (b) they never succeeded in constructing a self-sustaining
nuclear reactor; (c) they were confused about the differences between an
atomic bomb and a reactor; (d) they did not know how to correctly calculate
the critical mass of a bomb; (e) they thought that "plutonium" was probably
element 91. The Farm Hall transcripts contradict the self-serving and
sensationalist writings about German efforts that have appeared during the
past fifty years. 


 Citation: Klotz, Irving M. Captives of Their Fantasies: The German Atomic
Bomb Scientists J. Chem. Educ. 1997 74 204.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

And the note that Heisenberg was one of those detained. Dr. Sohei Kondo, then
a physics student and entered Hiroshima a few days after the bomb, has said
that the Japanese were then not able to consider making a bomb.

Many Japanese acknowledge that the bomb stopped the war and saved many
Japanese lives (likely more than US lives). A recent documentary on Discovery
Channel (older history) showed that even after the second bomb there were
serious questions of whether to stop the war, and makes the case that the
prime motivator to the Japanese leadership, from their own sources, was the
Russian entry into the war and effective invasions into Japanese-held
territory, and that more directed threatened the actual invasion and loss of
Japan to the Russian instead of the Americans.

The Hiroshima Museum is very credible. It shows Hiroshima's war role and that,
while it had not likely been bombed because of being selected as an a-bomb
target, the great devastation and loss of life of the fire bombings on Tokyo
and other cities did not make Hiroshima unique in facing the ravages of the
war. (Of course, this also applies to Dresden and other German cities hit by
successive waves of incendiary bombs from more than a thousand bombers in a
night - timed to hit people after they had emerged from the previous attack.
There is perhaps ever greater question about that campaign as valid war
targets.)

Regards, Jim
muckerheide@mediaone.net
========================

ruth_weiner wrote:
> 
> I believe that the bombing of the plant at Peenemunde effectively ended the
> German nuclear weapons program.  There was, however, no particular question
> that the Germans had Czechoslovakian uranium.  They went for the Baku oil
> fields, which might have given them the energy resources to enrich uranium
> sufficiently.
> 
> To add a lighter note to this thread, I commend to RADSAFERs two Tom Lehrer
> songs: "Werner von Braun" and "In the Land of the Old AEC."
> 
> Ruth Weiner
> ruth_weiner@msn.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jim Muckerheide <jmuckerheide@delphi.com>
> To: Multiple recipients of list <radsafe@romulus.ehs.uiuc.edu>
> Date: Tuesday, August 08, 2000 11:59 AM
> Subject: The "From" bug strikes again :-)
> 
> >See, e.g.,:
> >>From a bio note on Heisenberg:
> >http://www-groups.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/~history/Mathematicians/Heisenberg.html
> >
> >"During the Second World War he headed the unsuccessful German nuclear
> weapons
> >project. He worked with Otto Hahn, one of the discoverers of nuclear
> fission,
> >on the development of a nuclear reactor but failed to develop an effective
> >program for nuclear weapons. Whether this was because of lack of resources
> or
> >a lack of a desire to put nuclear weapons in the hands of the Nazis, it is
> >unclear.
> >
> >After the war he was interned in Britain with other leading German
> scientists.
> >However he returned to Germany in 1946 when he was appointed director of
> the
> >Max Planck Institute for Physics and Astrophysics at Göttingen. In 1958 the
> >Institute moved to Munich and Heisenberg continued as its director.
> >
> >But, see also:
> >http://jchemed.chem.wisc.edu/journal/issues/1997/feb/abs204.html
> >
> >Another ref:
> >http://www.csr.utexas.edu/personal/leuliette/HTML/book_1099.html
> >
> >Regards, Jim
> >muckerheide@mediaone.net
> >========================
> >
> >Franz Schoenhofer wrote:
> >>
> >> At 08:14 08.08.2000 -0500, you wrote:
> >> >I believe way beyond the shadow of a doubt that President Truman made
> the
> >> correct decision.  My Father and wife's father were posed to invade the,
> >> then Japanese aggressor (who knows I or my wife might have never been). I
> >> sincerely believe that the people of Japan, who now represent a new
> >> generation, have new ideals and this is good. The one question for
> everyone
> >> I have is that do they remember that Germany and Japan during WW II were
> >> developing their own capability for nuclear destruction.
> >>
> >> There was not the slightest chance for Germany or Japan to develop a
> >> nuclear bomb. Germany had an assembly of uranium, where a small
> >> multiplication of neutrons could be achieved, no self-sustaining chain
> >> reaction was possible. There was no technology to enrich uranium or to
> >> breed plutonium, therefore no access to the necessary fissile material.
> >> There was during the last years of WWII no money and no infrastructure
> >> available for such a development. Japan was far behind Germany regarding
> >> nuclear research, I am not sure that they even knew about the theoretical
> >> possibility.
> >>
> >> I know, that it has been often been used nearly as an excuse, that the
> USA
> >> was suspicious that a nuclear bomb was under construction in Germany -
> but
> >> was and is a myth and counter intelligence should have known better.
> >>
> >> Franz
> >>
> >> Franz Schoenhofer
> >> Habicherg. 31/7
> >> A-1160 Vienna
> >> Austria
> >> Tel.: +43-1-495 53 08
> >> Fax.: same number
> >> mobile phone: +43-664-338 0 333
> >> e-mail: schoenho@via.at
> >>
> >> Please note my new telephone number at my office!
> >>
> >> Office:
> >> Ministerialrat Dr. Franz Schoenhofer
> >> Federal Ministry of Agriculture, Forestry, Environment and Water
> Management
> >> Radiation Protection Department (BMLFUW I/8 U)
> >> Radetzkystr. 2
> >> A-1031 Vienna
> >> AUSTRIA
> >>
> >> phone: -43-1-71100-4458
> >> fax: -43-1-7122331
> >************************************************************************
> >The RADSAFE Frequently Asked Questions list, archives and subscription
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> 
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