AW: [ RadSafe ] Cameron's refutation of "Alara Does Work"

[John Jacobus]

Siding with Dr. Cameron does not make them right.  Dr.
Boice is a highly respected epidemiologist.  Dr.
Cameron, and others are not.  

The p value is related to the mathematics of the data.
 It does quantify how biased the data is.  However, I
would not expect you to understand that point.

--- howard long <hflong at pacbell.net> wrote:

> Pollycove and others (with far more "standing"than
> myself)
>   have reviewed (for DDP presentations)
> studies"shedding doubt " on Cameron's assertions by
> Boice and others. They sided strongly with Cameron.
>    
>    "'Healthy worker effect" was the only serious
> contention. We all believe the p was far too small
> to invalidate conclusion of hormesis. Definite
> benfit came from the 0.5 rem added "essential trace
> element" of Cameron: ionizing radiation. 
>    
>   Also, benefit to rats and cells in studies
> reviewed by Pollycove and his neat explanation of
> biologic defense stimulation ( mind-boggling 9
> orders of magnitude 
>   more oxygen-caused free radicals than the
> radiation - stimulated defenses). This
>    also confirmed hormesis.
>    
>   The one question (raised by a radsafer) which made
> me double check the p effectors was:
>   "Could applicants with questionable health have
> been steered away from exposure by admitting
> physicians?" I believe this is possible, but not
> with sufficient power.
>    
>   Howard Long
> 
> John Jacobus <crispy_bird at yahoo.com> wrote:
>   Rainer,
> I would say that the Boice paper, J Radiol Prot.
> 2001
> Dec; 21(4);400-3, detailing the limitations of the
> shipyard worker study should shed doubt on Dr.
> Cameron's assertions. 
> 
> --- Rainer.Facius at dlr.de wrote:
> 
> > Thank you Howard, I know this paper, as well as I
> > have studied to quite some degree Matanoski's
> > original report.
> > 
> > Yet, in the current context I was asking John
> > Jacobus for references to published work
> > (putatively) refuting Cameron's arguments.
> > 
> > Kind regards, Rainer
> > 
> > ________________________________
> > 
> > Von: radsafe-bounces at radlab.nl im Auftrag von
> howard
> > long
> > Gesendet: Fr 21.04.2006 17:48
> > An: John Jacobus; Facius, Rainer;
> > jjcohen at prodigy.net; mike.bohan at yale.edu;
> > radsafe at radlab.nl
> > Betreff: [ RadSafe ] Cameron's refutation of
> "Alara
> > Does Work" 
> > 
> >
>
http://www.ecolo.org/documents/documents_in_english/low-dose-NSWS-shipyard.pdf
> > 
> > is the most recent and I believe , the best
> > representation of Cameron's work, presented by his
> > long time assistant, Sponsler.
> > 
> > Howard Long
> > 
> > John Jacobus wrote:
> > Rainer,
> > I believe that he was asked to review the shipyard
> > worker study due to his expertise in dosimetry.
> > 
> > I will have to look through my docuements to find
> > appropriate papers to reference or send. I will
> try
> > and find specific referecnes that cite Dr.
> Cameron's
> > conclusions about this study. Like you and others
> on
> > this list, I do cannot spend all my time
> monitoring
> > this list and reponding to every message.
> > 
> > Nevertheless, the report itself can be found at
> > http://cedr.lbl.gov/shipyard.pdf
> > 
> > An abstract of the report was published in
> Radiaton
> > Research, 133, 126-127 (1993) or I can send a
> copy.
> > 
> > A review of the study was published in J Radiol
> > Prot.,
> > 2001 Dec; 21(4):400-3 or I can send a copy.
> > 
> > Unfortunately, I forsee that this will lead to
> > another
> > long debate on the LNT and hormesis. Nevertheless,
> I
> > will try and restrict my input. I have a life
> beyond
> > this list.
> > 
> > --- Rainer.Facius at dlr.de wrote:
> > 
> > > John:
> > >
> > > Please, could you provide some references to
> > > published work where the debate counter
> Cameron's
> > > arguments has been documented.
> > >
> > > Also, if I remember correctly, Cameron served on
> > the
> > > external referee board which closely supervised
> > > Matanoski's nuclear shipyard study. I find it
> > > difficult to imagine that he was called without
> > > quite some professional standing also in
> > > epidemiology - but of course I may err here.
> > >
> > > Kind regards, Rainer
> > 
> > 
> 
> 
> +++++++++++++++++++
> "A scientist's aim in a discussion with his
> colleagues is not to persuade, but to clarify." 
> Leo Szilard
> -- John
> John Jacobus, MS
> Certified Health Physicist
> e-mail: crispy_bird at yahoo.com
> 
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+++++++++++++++++++
"A scientist's aim in a discussion with his colleagues is not to persuade, but to clarify." 
Leo Szilard
-- John
John Jacobus, MS
Certified Health Physicist
e-mail:  crispy_bird at yahoo.com

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