[ RadSafe ] Sternglass => Manganoscaremongering=>was:RE:Sci.Am. about Fukushima and US Pacific NW infantmortality
franz.schoenhofer at chello.at
franz.schoenhofer at chello.at
Sat Jul 9 11:14:16 CDT 2011
Dear Steven,
Why are you upset about the "non-answers" or wrong ones? I noticed since several weeks that almost
anything distributed by me on RASAFE is blocked.
Hope this helps
Best regards,
Franz
> July 8
>
> This does nothing to address anything that I said. I have
> already dismantled your article claiming additional leukemias in the
> aftermath of Chernobyl, and the one you offer below is probably no
> better than the earlier one. Please cite something other than your own work.
>
> How about an explanation of the most common causes of death
> as I asked about below?
>
> Steven Dapra
>
>
> At 01:21 PM 7/8/2011, you wrote:
>
> >The question of the effects on foetus and babies is very much an
> >open one. ICRP does not look at effects like these as
> >they concentrate on cancer as an end point. I have already
> >suggested there is an effect seen in infant leukmeia. There are
> >other effects also as we reviewed below. The effects on sex ratio
> >have been discussed.
> >C
> >
> >
> >Busby C.C. (2009) Very Low Dose Fetal Exposure to Chernobyl
> >Contamination Resulted in Increases in Infant Leukemia in Europe and
> >Raises Questions about Current Radiation Risk Models. International
> >Journal of Environmental Research and Public Health.; 6(12):3105-3114.
> >
> >Busby Chris, Lengfelder Edmund, Pflugbeil Sebastian, Schmitz
> >Feuerhake, Inge (2009) The evidence of radiation effects in embryos
> >and fetuses exposed by Chernobyl fallout and the question of dose
> >response. Medicine, Conflict, Survival 25(1) 18-39
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: radsafe-bounces at agni.phys.iit.edu on behalf of Steven Dapra
> >Sent: Fri 08/07/2011 02:39
> >To: The International Radiation Protection (Health Physics) Mailing List
> >Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] Sternglass => Mangano scaremongering
> >=>was:RE:Sci.Am. about Fukushima and US Pacific NW infant mortality
> >
> >July 7
> >
> > (See my interspersed comments marked as "SD")
> >
> >Steven Dapra
> >
> >
> >At 10:42 AM 7/7/2011, you wrote:
> > >The paper by Whyte shows increases in infant mortality , neonatal
> > >mortality and stillbirths in the USA and also in England and Wales
> > >over a long period of time.
> > >
> > >Whyte,R.K (1992) `First Day Neonatal Mortality since 1935: A
> > >Re-examination of the Cross Hypothesis', British Medical Journal,
> > 304: 343-6.
> > >
> > >This is a longer period than was considered by Ernest Sternglass,
> > >who she cites in her paper. Sternglass was writing in 1971.
> >
> > Whyte cited Sternglass. Sternglass did not write in
> >1971. The Proceedings were held in 1969, and Whyte so states in her
> >citation (no. 32). The citation was to the "Proceedings of the ninth
> >annual Hanford biology symposium at Richland Washington, May 5-8,
> >1969." Whyte gives the germane page numbers as pp. 693-717. These
> >Proceedings appear to be available at the local university library,
> >and I will make a concerted effort to examine them over the weekend
> >and report to RADSAFE on whatever I find.
> >
> > You may also want to try this:
> >Evidence for Low-Level Radiation Effects on the Human Embryo and
> >Fetus, in Radiation Biology of the Fetal and Juvenile Mammal,
> >Proceedings of the 9th Annual Hanford Biology Symposium, May 5-8,
> >1969, pp. 681-692, AEC Symposium Vol. 16, Ed. by M.R. Sikov and D.D.
> >Mahlum, Division of Technical Information U.S.AEC, 1969 (.CONF-690501).
> >
> > Note the different page numbers. This citation is near the
> >bottom of the page at
> ><http://www.radiation.org/reading/ejsternglasspubs.html>. (SD)
> >
> > >What she shows in her paper is that there were increases in all
> > >these indicators over the period of the fallout 1959-63, not just in
> > >USA but also in England and Wales. Dapra's explanation that it was
> > >something about blacks in New York was n[ . . . ] [edited, so my
> > >posting will go through --- SD] as it also happened in England and Wales.
> >
> > This was *not* my explanation. I was quoting from a letter
> >to the editor of the British Medical Journal, and I gave the
> >citation. It is: Sepkowitz, S. (Letter to the editor); British
> >Medical Journal, 304: 776; March 21, 1992. (SD)
> >
> > >There is no need for any other reference apart from Whyte: the
> > >graphs are there to see and her conclusions also.
> >
> > I included the other references for the benefit of parties
> >who may have wanted to know about the ensuing discussion of Whyte's
> >paper. (SD)
> >
> > >Incidentally, the fallout was highest in Wales because of the high
> > >rainfall the Sr90 was 3 times higher and was measured by the
> > >Agricultural Research Council. In Wakes the infant mortality was a
> > >sharp peak. I obtained all the causes of death from the Registrar
> > >General for England and Wales in 1994 to see what they died of. The
> > >most common cause was congenital heart defects.
> >
> > What was the most common cause of death for the 20 y before
> >1945, and the 20 y after Cross published his 1973 paper on first day
> >mortality in England, Wales, and the United States? (Citation to
> >Cross is "Cost of preventing retrolental fibroplasia?", Lancet 1978,
> >ii:954-6.) We could use some historical perspective on this. (SD)
> >
> > >The trend followed the Sr90 in milk exactly. Sr 90 was also examined
> > >in mice by Luning and Frolen in Sweden:
> > >
> > >Luning K.G, Frolen, H., Nelson, A and Roennbaeck, C. (1963),
> > >'Genetic effects of Strontium-90 on immature germ cells in mice.'
> > >Nature No 4980 199: 303-4
> > >Luning, K. G., Frolen, H., Nelson, A., and Ronnback, C. (1963),
> > >`Genetic Effects of Strontium-90 Injected into Male Mice', Nature,
> > >No 4864 197: 304-5.
> > >
> > >They compared it with Cs-137. The baby mice died after the Sr90 but
> > >not the Cs137. Smirnova and Lyaginskaya in 1969 did the same
> > >experiment in rats (inject father, unexposed mother) and the dead
> > >babies had heart defects.
> > >
> > >Smirnova, E. I. and Lyaginska, A. M. (1969), `Heart Development of
> > >Sr-90 Injured Rats', in Y. I. Moskalev and Y. I. Izd (eds.),
> > >Radioaktiv Izotopy Organizs (Moscow: Medizina), 348.
> > >
> > >I wrote all this up in my 1995 book Wings of Death.
> > >
> > >Busby, C. C. (1995), Wings of Death: Nuclear Pollution and Human
> > >Health (Aberystwyth: Green Audit)
> > >
> > >I will get round to publishing it sometime.
> > >
> > >Chris
>
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--
Franz Schoenhofer, PhD, MinRat
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