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Re: Cohen's Fallacy
> From: "Rad health" <healthrad@HOTMAIL.COM>
>
> Jim,
>
> I don't defend Dr. Cohen's study at all.
No kidding. But my (perhaps too-cryptic) English seems confuse you too.
I meant that instead of Cohen's hundreds of individual, independent, studies
that produce significant, confirmed, substantiated, results that correlate
actual radon and lung cancer in real populations (that are also confirmed by
many independent studies with independent data), you defend Field's one very
small, poor, unconfirmed "study," unreplicated (and likely unreplicable).
No one who knows anything about statistical analysis can/will do that.
Also, that you seem to just make up "data" in your statements (like "There
is a huge inverse correlation in Cohen's county level data between smoking
and radon. It is also likely correlated within the county level with such
other factors as socioeconomic level." Refs?) as though they are meaningful
or relevant, but which seem to be just more disinformation for EPA's
political/funding purposes (but may just be lack of knowledge of analytical
basics - using "epidemiology" to obfuscate the lack of statistical validity
in the basis for trashing Cohen). Cohen has 50 years at the heart of
science, performing and publishing rigorous, valid, analyses, still stand
against the "establishment" that produces disinformation to con scientific
and numeric illiterates (innumerates) - mostly "policy-makers" but the
non-specialist technical community as well.
I don't know where you're a student, but when (if) you get beyond your
brainwashing in some Samet kind of Epi Dept., you can sue to get your money
back. I'm sure Cohen would be a highly credible witness for the plaintiff.
Reminds me of Steve Wing, essentially a Sociology major with a statistics
course, manipulating a small anomaly in a small group into an
establishment-funded "career. "
Jim
>The inverse relationship was
> published both in the first paper by Field and later acknowledged by Dr.
> Cohen on this list. I am merely stating the facts as presented. My post was
> in response to Ruth's question. I
>
> Don
>
>> From: Muckerheide <muckerheide@MEDIAONE.NET>
>> Reply-To: Muckerheide <muckerheide@MEDIAONE.NET>
>> To: <radsafe@list.vanderbilt.edu>
>> Subject: Re: Cohen's Fallacy
>> Date: Sun, 27 Jan 2002 20:51:33 +0000
>>
>> From: "Rad health" <healthrad@HOTMAIL.COM>
>>
>>> There is a huge inverse correlation in Cohen's county level data between
>>> smoking and radon. It is also likely correlated within the county level
>>> with such other factors as socioeconomic level. Cohen can not account
>> for
>>> these within county correlations for even one county and the
>> correlations
>>> are not linear among counties.
>>>
>>> Don
>>
>> Don,
>>
>> I'd ask for data, but you seem to just "make it up" as you go. Yet you
>> arbitrarily defend one small, unreplicated (unreplicable?), study with poor
>> dose data (that depends solely on dose data for credible results), in a
>> poor
>> location (maybe intentional by the funding agencies?), that is contrary to
>> voluminous, established, substantial data, as "defining" radon dose effects
>> to support the EPA/radon industry. It seems that people who understand and
>> apply data and statistical analysis to reflect the real world, instead of
>> preordained conclusions, can't buy it.
>>
>> Jim Muckerheide
>>
>>
>>>> From: RuthWeiner@aol.com
>>>> To: healthrad@hotmail.com, radsafe@list.vanderbilt.edu
>>>> Subject: Re: Cohen's Fallacy
>>>> Date: Sun, 27 Jan 2002 16:11:17 EST
>>>>
>>>> In a message dated 1/27/02 10:22:58 AM Mountain Standard Time,
>>>> healthrad@HOTMAIL.COM writes:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> smoking status and residential radon are uncorrelated within each
>>>>> county (which seems unlikely),
>>>>
>>>> Now maybe I am stupid, but what these authors seem to be saying is that
>>>> residential radon and smoking status are correlated; e.g., higher radon
>>>> levels occur in houses where there are smokers. Did they mean to say
>> that
>>>> the EFFECT of smoking and residential radon are synergistic? Or did
>> they
>>>> really mean what they said, which can only be interpreted that smokers
>> get
>>>> some radon exposure from smoking?
>>>>
>>>> Given the imprecision of the language, I am not sure what conclusions
>> can
>>>> be
>>>> drawn.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Ruth Weiner, Ph. D.
>>>> ruthweiner@aol.com
>>>
>>>
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>
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