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RE: Non-CHPs in the health physics job market - Opportunities are present
Radsafers,
In the amount of time that this ridiculous debate has continued, a person
could have earned a bachelor's degree. Apparently one should major in
Debate or Rhetoric to be "certified" to post to this list. Are you all
that bored? If so, I would consider devoting my energy to finding a new
job rather than blathering on in an argument that can't be won. I have a
bachelors degree in health physics and 15 years of work experience, but am
not certified. Does anyone know, can you "purchase" your certification
from Western States University, or anywhere else for that matter?
Gordon Axt
Health Physicist
University of Iowa
100 HPO
(319)335-8503
gordon-axt@uiowa.edu
-----Original Message-----
From: Armstrong, Jason A [SMTP:JAArmstr@MAIL.BHI-ERC.COM]
Sent: Monday, January 27, 2003 4:46 PM
To: Radsafe
Subject: RE: Non-CHPs in the health physics job market - Opportunities
are present
With all this talk about CHP and non-CHP I find really entertaining.
If you really want to take the exam, "purchase" a degree from Western
States
University. I understand with a resume and approximately $2000 you get a
degree that the AAHP qualifies you as being "educationally" ready to sit.
I
have no doubt that some of those Western Stater's are going to pass the
exam.
Just my opinions.
Jason
-----Original Message-----
From: Mitchell Davis [mailto:radiation@cox.net]
Sent: Monday, January 27, 2003 1:51 PM
To: William V Lipton
Cc: Rob Gunter; Radsafe
Subject: Re: Non-CHPs in the health physics job market - Opportunities
arepresent
Ok folks....Let me elaborate...
Let me start by apologizing to Mr. Gunter for apparently misreading or
misinterpreting his original post. Also let me apologize for the length of
this post but there are several points I want to make.
As to Mr. Lipton's assertion that I was whining, I really wasn't. I was
simply voicing my opinion on a subject I feel strongly about. If voicing
an
opinion on a subject is considered whining, then I believe all individuals
(myself included) who post on this list would have a continuous trail of
tears running down their faces.
Next, let me say I meant no disrespect to anyone holding a degree. I
applaud anyone fortunate enough to succeed in furthering their education.
Perhaps I was not clear in my original post. As far as the "worthless
piece
of paper" comment, I was referring to my own personal situation. For
individuals who gained their basic health physics knowledge from getting
their BS, I can understand why they hold it in such high regard. I
personally did not gain my knowledge through that venue. I have been to
college (through the Thomas Edison program mentioned in one post) and only
need 18-20 hrs to finish. No coursework that I have been required to take
or any I have left (with the exception of perhaps calculus) has or will
increase my level of knowledge of HP. I was given credit for those thanks
to my Navy training and my NRRPT. So for ME it is worthless (with the
exception I would then be "qualified" to sit for the CHP exam). Why did I
not finish you may ask? Because things like a mortgage, kids, a hectic
career which required large amounts of travel came along ( and no..I'm not
whining...just listing some reasons why I haven't finished). I have found
other ways that expand the mind, feeds the soul and broadens ones views and
opinions. These include experience, training courses provided by employers
and the personal desire to expand my knowledge of HP by taking the
initiative to learn on my own (at my age I don't need an instructor telling
me what I need to learn...I know my strengths, weaknesses and what I like).
I am at a point in my life now where completing my degree is possible. If
nothing else, I can then sit for the exam and perhaps work on my masters
(there I'll learn something!!).
I sat for Part 1 back in 1996 trying to grandfather in before the degree
requirements came into effect. Due to similar reasons cited above my one
weeks preparation for the exam proved fateful. I missed passing by 4
points
(guess it was that Chem. 101 I never took that did me in!!). Regardless, I
feel confidant about my HP knowledge with the results of my exam score and
it was all done with no formal hp education other than that which I
mentioned previously. For those who assert that my "apparent" lack of
understanding of why I need a degree is a good indication that I do, I say
Hogwash. For me personally, the only reason I NEED a degree is to become a
CHP. Period!!
I still believe that having a BS does not necessarily a good CHP make. It
shows an individual has the ability to complete an ordered set or sequence
of steps but does not guarantee their knowledge (believe me I have worked
with too many BSHP grads who didn't even grasp the basics). IMHO, the
pinnacle success in our profession is obtaining the title of CHP. How is
that obtained? By sitting for and successfully completing an exam deemed
appropriate by the ABHP. If an individual has the necessary experience
requirement and can pass the exam, they should be certified. Having a BS
degree, again IMHO, in no way shape or form ensures that an individual can
pass. A few folks that responded to my post are of the opinion that all
things being equal (CHP w/degree vs. CHP w/o degree) that the degree wins
every time. I disagree strongly. More and more companies these days (and
I
see this everyday) are saying in their posting requirements that the want a
degree but go on to say " or other combination of experience or education".
I think this is what the ABHP should do. Evaluate each candidate on
his/her
OVERALL experience and education. Having a BS does not make you a
CHP...Passing the exam does!! As far as litigation support, a CHP is THE
quintessential representative of the HP profession. His/her undergraduate
history is irrelevant.
For those of you who have been able to obtain your BS, MS, Ph.D, JD, etc, I
applaud and congratulate you on a job well done. You and your friends and
family should be very proud. All I ask is that you don't blanket discount
those of us not yet (for whatever reason) fortunate enough to match your
accomplishment. Most of us are trying and we would make some damn good
CHP's in the interim (and no...I'm still not whining).
Respectfully,
Mitchell W. Davis, RRPT
Health Physicist
915-697-3523
915-349-4824 Cell
radiation@cox.net <mailto:radiation@cox.net>
----- Original Message -----
From: William V <mailto:liptonw@dteenergy.com> Lipton
To: Mitchell Davis <mailto:radiation@cox.net>
Cc: Rob Gunter <mailto:rgunter@SEC-TN.COM> ; Radsafe
<mailto:radsafe@list.vanderbilt.edu>
Sent: Friday, January 24, 2003 6:10 AM
Subject: Re: Non-CHPs in the health physics job market - Opportunities
arepresent
If you had one, I doubt you'd consider a college degree "a useless piece of
paper..." While higher education isn't everything, it's a unique
accomplishment which generally cannot be duplicated "in the trenches..."
Thinking that you don't need more education is a sure sign that you do.
Rather than whining, I suggest you go back to school.
The opinions expressed are strictly mine.
It's not about dose, it's about trust.
Curies forever.
Bill Lipton
liptonw@dteenergy.com <mailto:liptonw@dteenergy.com>
Mitchell Davis wrote:
... I think it is a travesty that these experienced HP's ( of which I am)
with years of on the job experience are not allowed to become CHP's just
because (in most cases) they don't have a useless piece of paper that
taught
them nothing about HP hanging on the wall ( no offence to my colleagues who
have this). Why is it so important that a CHP have a BS degree? ...
Mitchell W. Davis, RRPT
Health Physicist
915-697-3523
915-349-4824 Cell
radiation@cox.net <mailto:radiation@cox.net>
-----
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