Re: Nova - Dirty Bombs - London Scenario question

[John Jacobus <crispy_bird@YAHOO.COM>]

While I think we can argue about the engineering and health physics aspects (we do that well), we need to look at the non-technical issues.  As the show pointed out, if such a radiological spill occurred, what would be the publics response.  I am using the term "spill," because that is what happened in Goiania.  This issue is the real value of the show, not producing problems for health physicists to solve.

 High Plains Drifter <magna1@jps.net> wrote:

Stewart, thanks for posting the values they gave in the show. I wonder, if
a terrorist(s) after assembling a 2,000 Curie dirty bomb could even drive a
vehicle, but then again they may have access to an abandoned laboratory with
a hot cell, that has been awaiting decommission approval in California.
BTW, if the CsCl was in a DOE rod capsule (in the USA nearly all are DOE
derived, I believe), just cutting them open and collecting the power (?)
would leave a trail and expose the persons to lethal doses. If the rods
were attached to the dynamite or place between the sticks of dynamite or
inside plastique, the rods would most likely be flung away without severe
damage and dispersal of just a fraction of their contents.

I was dismayed at the lack of common sense and attention to the physics of
the scenario's. Overall more talk was given to the "sound bytes" in! volving
cancer risk and doses that were hyped, but actually trivial. Evidently, the
science expert for the show has never seen or measured the dose rates at
TENORM sites, which for much of the world are unregulated.

My exasperations at the situation in California is based on current
experience in the D&D field, and years of experience dealing with DHS and
other regulatory bodies.

Dean Chaney, CHP
Fairfield, CA

None of the above is to be construed as the position of
my employer or members of my extended family.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Stewart Farber"
To: "High Plains Drifter" ; "Radsafe"

Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 2:19 PM
Subject: Re: Nova - Dirty Bombs - London Scenario question


> Hi all:
>
> I listened to the NOVA "special" last night and found it remarkable how
> sensationalistic it ! was. It seemed their intent was to maximize public
panic if
> and when anyone sets off a bomb involving any amount of radioactivity, no
matter
> how trivial. For example, a stick of dynamite in a bucket of woodash
obtained
> from Northern Florida would disperse 300,000 picoCuries of Cs-137 [10 kg
of ash
> at 30,000 pCi/kg] or a total of about 11,000 Bq of Cs-137. If this were
done,
> would the authorities want to tear down London or New York because some of
it is
> contaminated to "above background" levels? I'm not being facetious.
Thousands of
> tons of radioactive woodash [with greatly elevated Cs-137 levels of on the
order
> of 20,000 pCi/kg ash] from wood burning power plants in New England are
being
> mixed with manure today and spread on organic farming coop fields with no
> concern. Laughable actually as to the disconnect between organic gardening
use of
> Cs-137 laden woodas! h and the hysteria about a dirty bomb's impact on a
wide area.
>
> The scenario NOVA dramatized last night involved a whole lot more Cs-137,
or a
> source with 74,000 GBq of Cs-137 [2000 Ci] as I recall them mentioning.
For a
> point source of Cs-137 this equates to about 6.6E6 R/hr at 1 cm. If the
> terrorists spent 1 hour at say 2 feet from this unshielded source [??? a
wag
> assumption] in fabricating the bomb and transporting it they would receive
about
> 7,000 R whole body.
>
> Does anyone on the list have any feel for how quickly a person would be
> incapacitated by receiving 7,000 to 10,000 R whole body?
>
> The exposure to the hands and fingers of these terrorists fabricating such
a bomb
> would have been much higher --perhaps 500,000 R for 10 minutes of handling
in
> fabrication. Would these terrorists even have been able to drive a few
hours
> after handl! ing a 2,000 Ci Cs-137 source for the time it would take to
fabricate a
> bomb and transport it to the point of use??
>
> Stewart Farber, MSPH
>
>
> =======================
> 2/26/03 8:08:14 AM, High Plains Drifter wrote:
> >
> > I watched the NOVA "Dirty Bomb" program Tuesday night and came away
with the
> > following thoughts:
> >
> >
> > *Technical details about post bomb explosion risks were fragmented and
> > interspersed with statistical mumbo jumbo that left one with the
feeling
> > that any amount of radiation is hazardous.
> > Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, and more
>
>
>

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-- John
John Jacobus, MS
Certified Health Physicist
e-mail:  crispy_bird@yahoo.com

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