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Re: To cert. or not to cert.?

To: radsafe@romulus.ehs.uiuc.edu, Multiple recipients of list <radsafe@romulus.ehs.uiuc.edu>
Subject: Re: To cert. or not to cert.?
From: rkathren@tricity.WSU.edu (Ron L. Kathren)
Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 17:07:55 -0800 (PST)
Re Neal Zapp's comment:

>I'm stating
>that it's possible to receive medical board certification without a
>requisite period of employment as a staff physician in the area of your
>certification.

Possible, perhaps; likely, no.  Medical certifying boards require a specific
residency in addition to internship.  This is certainly analagous to the
experience requirements for both the P.E> and CHP exams.

We refer to board certified or qualifed physicians; why not refer to board
certified HP's.  This does not mean that those HP's who are not certified
are not HP's, any more than a physician who is not board certifdied is not a
physician.  

Ron Kathren

 

At 09:49 AM 2/17/99 -0600, ZAPP, NEAL (JSC-SD) wrote:
>Since I found the last sentence of my post in another message, let me make
>clear the point that wanted to make, that way I can't be accidentally
>misunderstood.  My argument is a little different than that offered in the
>message holding my sentence, so I want to make the distinction.  With regard
>to degrees, they indicate what they indicate, that a person has been through
>a program of formal education in a particular area.  Whether or not that
>education prepares that person for a particular level of responsibility in
>the workplace is up to the person who does the hiring.  This part I think is
>pretty much without debate.  I have a very specific problem with requiring
>ABHP or other certification to consider an HP qualified.  It's because this
>certification is different from that required of a lawyer, and depending on
>the specialty involved, in some cases that of a physician.  The cert.'s we
>require of doctors and lawyers are easier to get.  Once you pass the bar,
>you're a lawyer, regardless of how long you've been interested in law.  Once
>you pass the written and oral examination delivered by the state medical
>board, you're board certified of course assuming you were a doctor going in.
>If you take it in your first year of residency out of med school, or after
>your twentieth year of practicing medicine, makes no difference.  And yes, I
>do realize that the rules can be and are different not only in different
>states but with regard to different specialties in medicine.  I'm not making
>a flat statement that we should all go into medicine or law, I'm stating
>that it's possible to receive medical board certification without a
>requisite period of employment as a staff physician in the area of your
>certification.  I say nothing about an individual's ability to pass the
>tests, or about their adherence to any oath or pledge of morality.  My
>problem is with declaring a certification that itself requires that a person
>have been working for a specified period of time in a capacity in which I
>understand the case to have been made that he or she wouldn't be hired
>without the certification.  It's the age-old catch twenty-two:  How can I
>get the requisite five years as an HP to sit if I can't get hired as an HP
>without the cert.?  I'm not denying that any of the certificates (P.E., CHP,
>etc.) that have been tossed around are evidence that a person who holds one
>or more must know the field well to have passed the tests.  What I will deny
>is the converse, that anyone who doesn't have one doesn't deserve to have
>one, and that they do not know the field well.  Or that I with a good
>educational background and less than five years experience due to age am
>incapable of contributing in any more than a tech. role, so I can't get the
>experience I need to get the cert. to get the job to get the experience I
>need to get the cert.  I'm perfectly willing to learn in the real world
>those things that I couldn't have been taught by a school.  I'm perfectly
>willing to defer to people who in some cases have been doing this longer
>than I've been breathing.  I'm not willing to be told that it's impossible
>for me, regardless of how hard I work, to be considered "qualified" in my
>field.  Just to be complete, let me say once more that I'm working towards
>my very own little CHP stamp, so I see the need to demonstrate competency.
>I just don't think that that demonstration is limited to any one piece of
>paper.  I'm not even sure at this point that anyone has said it should be,
>that's just the feeling I got reading a few of these things while I was
>probably supposed to be working in the field of health physics.
>
>What we see depends mainly on what we look for.-John Lubbock
>
>
>E. Neal Zapp
>NASA/JSC, Radiation Biology
>Bldg. 37, Rm. 167
>(281) 483-2244 (O)
>(713) 765-2193 (P)
>
>Any opinions expressed herein, or incorrect assertions, are attributable
>only to me.  Not to you, not to him, not to her, not to them, not to us, to
>me.  Noone else could possibly be this brain-dead without having the plug
>pulled, so it must be me.
>
>
>
>
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>end
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