[ RadSafe ] Nuclear Physics Political Demise at Oregon State University

Sat Mar 26 15:34:15 CDT 2011

Howard et al., 

I did not mean for my reply to Franz to go out to the RADSAFE community, but I did not write anything offensive to any of the parties involved,  I hope. My only excuse is that it was 1:30 AM when I sent the note and I did not notice the reply went to RADSAFE instead of just Franz until it was too late.

I respectfully decline your invitation to insert myself in this rhubarb. I do not know whether the allegations are true in whole or in part and have no way of knowing. Both Kathy and Jack are experienced, knowledgeable, and respected scientists who do not need to hear from me on this topic.

I do not wish to write any more on the matter.

Bob

-----Original Message-----
From: radsafe-bounces at health.phys.iit.edu [mailto:radsafe-bounces at health.phys.iit.edu] On Behalf Of Howard
Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2011 12:03 PM
To: The International Radiation Protection (Health Physics) MailingList
Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] Nuclear Physics Political Demise at Oregon State University

Bob,
Please ask your friends Kathy Higby and Jack Higginbotham to respond to the allegations at www.oregonstateoutrage.com by copy of this.
PhD student Robinson has foresworn  confidentiality and states his case there.

If unchanged, political discrimination so serious would keep citizenry from believing health physicists generally. All your credentials would be questioned, especially with the public skepticism fed by alarmists right now.

Howard Long

On Mar 26, 2011, at 1:27 AM, "Bob Cherry" <bobcherry at satx.rr.com> wrote:

> It is nice to hear from you, Franz.
> 
> Hitler, thankfully, made many serious blunders. If he had made fewer, 
> I agree that World War 2 would have included Britain's defeat. Because 
> of the distances involved and the large American economy, I doubt that 
> he would ever have occupied any part of North America, but he would 
> have made the world a scary place.
> 
> However, if he had developed nuclear weapons, the confrontations 
> between the United States and the Hitler Empire would have been much 
> more serious than the Cold War between the West and the Soviet Union. 
> I doubt that the "Hitler Cold War" would have ended peaceably.
> 
> Conjectures on this topic can go on endlessly. The best I can say is 
> the world is a much better place without Hitler in it.
> 
> Returning to the main topic of this thread, I am appalled about what I 
> am hearing about the Nuclear Engineering Program at Oregon State University.
> Kathy Higley and Jack Higginbotham are both friends of mine and I have 
> never had any reason to doubt the integrity of either. I hope the 
> story is not true. We are only hearing one side of it, so I am 
> reserving my opinion for the moment.
> 
> Bob
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: radsafe-bounces at health.phys.iit.edu
> [mailto:radsafe-bounces at health.phys.iit.edu] On Behalf Of Franz 
> Schönhofer
> Sent: Friday, March 25, 2011 5:10 PM
> To: 'The International Radiation Protection (Health Physics) MailingList'
> Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] Nuclear Physics Political Demise at Oregon 
> StateUniversity
> 
> Bob,
> 
> I appreciate your thoughtful message. I have the impression that 
> Howard Long is a very nice person, maybe the ideal family doctor, but 
> sorry to say he seems to lack some knowledge in radiation protection and history.......
> 
> Let me start my answer with a standard statement of mine: If this 
> Adolf Hitler had not been so extremely silly to suppress Jews, to 
> persecute them, to force the more wealthy to emigrate and to kill the 
> poor ones, he would in my opinion have won the war. The "brain drain" 
> was so unbelievable, that whole university and research institutions 
> were without their leaders and even the second and third row. "German 
> science" had to be thaught - neglecting all the principles of modern 
> physics. Scientists had to work on the nuclear bomb (or at least a 
> reactor), but were not allowed to use Einsteins equation, because this 
> was Jewish science. Just one of many examples.
> 
> If you look at the people involved in the construction of nuclear 
> bombs, you will find almost only European emigrants, not only from 
> Germany, most of them being jews.
> 
> I am very interested in the history of nuclear physics and especially 
> nuclear energy and bombs. I have a large collection of books on this 
> topic, partly bought during my many visits to the USA, especially at 
> Los Alamos, Santa Fe, and at the book store of the Atomic Museum in 
> Albuquerque. I have been twice in Hiroshima, once in Nagasaki, I 
> succeeded a few years ago to visit the Trinity Site, have been three 
> weeks on Mururoa as the head of the terrestrial working group of the 
> IAEA, was heavily involved in the aftermath of the Chernobyl accident 
> both nationally and internationally etc. I try to distill from all 
> those vast amount of informations a picture of the whole for myself 
> and I sincerely believe that I am now able to judge nuclear accidents, nuclear war etc.
> 
> Immediately after WW II there was a race between the US and the 
> Sovjetunion to capture the most important German scientists. Just for 
> an example: The USA succeeded to capture Wernher von Braun. The 
> Sovjets got a lot of nuclear scientists, but information is very 
> scarce on their contribution to the Sovjet bombs (except Klaus Fuchs) and the rockets.
> 
> As for your question on chemistry and biology I do not have any 
> detailed information. There is no doubt that the same as for 
> physicists occurred to them. If they were jewish it did not matter 
> what their profession was - ancient history, egyptology, school 
> teachers, mathematicians, etc. - they lost their jobs, were expelled or killed.
> Sorry these are the terrible facts. Has the world learnt anything from it?
> For more information, please contact me again. I am not almighty, so I 
> cannot tell you about the accurate content of books.
> 
> Best wishes,
> Franz
> Franz Schoenhofer, PhD
> MinRat i.R.
> Habicherg. 31/7
> A-1160 Wien/Vienna
> AUSTRIA
> 
> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: radsafe-bounces at health.phys.iit.edu
> [mailto:radsafe-bounces at health.phys.iit.edu] Im Auftrag von 
> bobcherry at satx.rr.com
> Gesendet: Freitag, 25. März 2011 21:17
> An: The International Radiation Protection (Health Physics) Mailing 
> List
> Betreff: Re: [ RadSafe ] Nuclear Physics Political Demise at Oregon 
> StateUniversity
> 
> "Germany also had political command of science in the past, with great 
> harm to science."
> This is true to some extent for science in general. However, the 
> greatest harm, ironically and appropriately IMO, was to German science specifically.
> Many, if not most, of the best German physicists, including Einstein, 
> left Germany for better (i.e., safer) conditions. This was of great 
> benefit to American science in particular. This "lost" generation of 
> German physicists made great lasting contributions in their new 
> countries, both in their own right and in their education and 
> mentorship of subsequent generations of physicists. German physics, 
> once the greatest in the world, has not recovered from this exodus.
> 
> I don't know about other basic sciences. Did something similar occur 
> in chemistry and biology?
> 
> Bob C
> 
> ---- garyi at trinityphysics.com wrote: 
> 
>> Howard,Thanks very much for sharing this.  Because it is a nuclear 
>> physics
>> 
> program, the relevance is obvious.  If it was a medical school, I 
> would still be interested but
>> Iwould expect the medical
> 
>> professionals to take the lead in any intervention or investigation.
> 
>> 
>> -Gary Isenhower
> 
>> On 24 Mar 2011 at 19:09, Howard wrote:
>> 
>> Franz,
> 
>> Germany also had political command of science in the past, with great 
>> harm to science. I do not agree that policial bribery to determine 
>> scientific degree (or obstruction thereof) is
> 
>> "geographically very confined" and should be ignored if not in one's own institution.
> 
>> Howard Long
> 
>> 
>> On Mar 24, 2011, at 4:31 PM, Franz Schönhofer
> <franz.schoenhofer at chello.at> wrote:
> Howard et al.,
> Do you really think that this geographically very confined political
>>> 
> story is appropriate for a so called "International Radiation 
> Protection (Health Physics) Mailing List"? I do not think so.
> 
>>> Franz
> 
>>> Franz Schoenhofer, PhD
>>> MinRat i.R.
> 
>>> Habicherg. 31/7
> 
>>> A-1160 Wien/Vienna
> 
>>> AUSTRIA
> 
>>> 
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