[ RadSafe ] Biogeochemistry

Dan McCarn hotgreenchile at gmail.com
Fri Feb 17 02:23:06 CST 2012 

TRY AGAIN - my keyboard is dying thanks to a cup of tea that i spilled
yesterday - so bear with me.

Hi Jerry -

Selenium hangs in there with uranium, molybdenum, arsenic, cobalt and a few
other redox-sensitive metals in regional redox-controlled roll-fronts. The
reduced mineral phases are less soluble than the oxidized phases. This a
very important issues when water is used for irrigation. Crop uptake is
controlled by the soil concentration.  When irrigation water is used for
decades, build-up of contaminants occurs depending on the 'leaching
coefficient' of the soil for that contaminant. Some contaminants
concentrate more effectively, selenium being one of them.  Calcium and
radium are others. Drainage areas, especially interior-drained ponds in the
basin, can accumulate significant quantities. I presume that was the cause
of the sick ducks.

The periphery of large basins contains generally oxidized sediments. The
interior portions are often either primarily reduced from organic
materials, iron sulfides, or there is faulting allowing H2S and
hydrocarbons to migrate upward creating a reduced environment (or any
combination of these items). The interface is the locus of mineralization
of the redox -sensitive metals. In other basins, the epigenetic uranium
deposits in Kazakhstan are similar to those in the Texas Gulf Coast in that
H2S is the primary reductant and the deposits are spatially related to deep
faulting in the basin - or 'down to the coast' faulting in Texas.

When the water resources of these basins are utilized for
farming, inadvertent remobilization from these deposits can occur.  Any
farmland that has been irrigated for decades will build-up materials in
soils from the groundwater.  This may cause pedogenic caliches, salt
build-up, etc. as well as issues with selenium, uranium, or radium.

But there are very specific geological / hydrogeochemical mechanisms that
concentrate various metals. Anthropogenic remobilization via high-volume
irrigation pumping can cause these pre-concentrated materials to be
remobilized.

I was once asked about the cause of uranium in the Central Valley - I used
my diagrams for the San Luis Valley (Alamosa Basin) - to demonstrate the
mechanisms. It was the same story.

Dan ii

>
>
> On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 12:36 AM, Jerry Cohen <jjc105 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Dear Dan, Joe, et al,
>> Wow! And here I thought that I was the only one interested the
>> biogeochemistry.
>> Since you mention the central valley of California, a few years ago there
>> was a
>> flurry of interest in the news media here regarding Selenium
>> contamination.
>> Agricultural crops in the central valley are produced almost entirely by
>> irrigation. Over time , the naturally occuring selenium in the soil was
>> leached
>>  by irrigation waters and concentrated in catch basins where the water was
>> collected. Migrating ducks landed in these waters, drank the water and got
>> selenium poisoning. The media had a "field day" showing pictures of the
>> sick and
>> struggling ducks. State legislators became upset with the situation. A
>> proposed
>> solution called for draining the catch pond into the SF Bay. Legislators
>> opposed
>> this action fearing exposure of the fish to this toxin. A simple
>> calculation
>> that I did on the net concentration levels in the bay indicated that these
>> levels would be about the same as EPA drinking water standands for
>> selenium.
>> Finally, the politicians became interested in other subjects and the
>> problem
>> went away.
>> Other areas where biogeochemistry is important would include: iodine
>> deficiency
>> in certain midwest areas causing a "goiter belt", and discovery of areas
>> in
>> Texas with high fluoride levels in the drinking water and low incidence of
>> dental cavities. Too bad that the USGS found such studies to be
>> insufficiently
>> green. The study methodologies would have shed some interesting light on
>> the
>> potential consequences of nuclear waste repositories.
>> Jerry
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
>> From: Dan McCarn <hotgreenchile at gmail.com>
>> To: Jerry Cohen <jjcohen at prodigy.net>; The International Radiation
>> Protection
>> (Health Physics) Mailing List <radsafe at health.phys.iit.edu>
>> Sent: Thu, February 16, 2012 9:01:01 PM
>> Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] Biogeochemistry
>>
>> Dear Jerry:
>>
>> There are 1/2 billion dollars worth of crops produced in the area - you do
>> the math.  Given that the Central Valley in California has a similar
>> hydrogeological  / geochemical setting with localized
>> uranium features associated with redox traps, then that's another target
>> for a similar investigation.  The San Luis Valley produces a large
>> quantity
>> of potatoes - so it could become, pardon the pun, a 'hot potato' issue.
>> The farmers of the area happen to be pretty handy with firearms, and this
>> could impact their livelihood (taking their view), so their trigger
>> fingers
>> could get 'itchy'.  They might be a might bit nervous about anyone doing a
>> study. I have done litigation investigations in some corners of the USA
>> where I was escorted by armed officers during the entire duration of the
>> study.
>>
>> Yes, I think that the results could be highly unpopular, but the realities
>> are that there is likely to be minimal risk. The worst case scenario that
>> I
>> can imagine would be a number of sections of land would be removed from
>> active production.  For me it is odd to think that whereas mining is
>> highly
>> regulated and the 'incidental' production and farming use of contaminated
>> waters would be a serious offence, the farming community
>> is virtually insulated legally from identical consequences.
>>
>> I tried to get funding support a number of years ago - around 2004, but
>> could find no one really interested. If you, or others in the RadSafe
>> community know of a source of funding, please tell me and I could increase
>> my pay from -zero- on this project to something I could live on.  The
>> analytical budget for the soil / water samples are not insignificant.
>>
>> Dan ii
>>
>> Dan W McCarn, Geologist
>> 108 Sherwood Blvd
>> Los Alamos, NM 87544-3425
>> +1-505-672-2014 (Home – New Mexico)
>> +1-505-670-8123 (Mobile - New Mexico)
>> HotGreenChile at gmail.com (Private email) HotGreenChile at gmail dot com
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 5:13 PM, Jerry Cohen <jjc105 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> > Dan,
>> > It seems to me that the study you are considering on the transport of
>> > hazardous  minerals could gain some very valuable information. So why
>> > aren't you
>> > getting funding support? Hay isn't very expensive. Do the bureaucrats
>> fear
>> > the
>> > you mightobtain some politically unpopular information?? Good Luck,
>> > Jerry
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ________________________________
>> > From: Dan McCarn <hotgreenchile at gmail.com>
>> > To: Jerry Cohen <jjcohen at prodigy.net>; The International Radiation
>> > Protection
>> > (Health Physics) Mailing List <radsafe at health.phys.iit.edu>; Malcolm
>> > Siegel
>> > <msiegel51 at yahoo.com>; Malcolm D Siegel <mdsiegel at unm.edu>
>> > Sent: Thu, February 16, 2012 1:51:15 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] Biogeochemistry
>> >
>> > Dear Jerry:
>> >
>> > I worked on the peer review of the YM Site Characterization Report years
>> > ago.  I was disappointed that there was not more information
>> > on comparative 'natural' risk including that of pre-existing uranium
>> > features or areas in the flow path of the YM computer models that did
>> not
>> > address published high favorability for surficial uranium deposits
>> > (non-pedogenic calcrete type). In fact, there was no mention of these
>> > features in the Site Characterization report nor geochemical traps that
>> > would interact with the solute flow in the far-field.
>> >
>> > There are potential models of concentration / anthropogene
>> remobilization
>> > (e.g. via high volume irrigation) that were not considered.
>> >
>> > I published on one such model (indirectly) looking at induced
>> anthropogene
>> > remobilization of uranium / radium via high-volume wells in proximity to
>> > from regional redox-controlled roll-fronts in the Alamosa Basin. This
>> paper
>> > can be found in an IAEA proceedings:
>> >
>> > McCarn, Dan W. (2004): Scoping Calculations: Natural and anthropogenic
>> > multi-pathway risks associated with naturally occurring uranium
>> > mineralization in aquifers;
>> > *IAEA-TECDOC-1396<
>> > http://www-pub.iaea.org/MTCD/publications/PDF/te_1396_web.pdf>
>> > *, pp.289-315.
>> >
>> > http://www-pub.iaea.org/MTCD/publications/PDF/te_1396_web.pdf
>> >
>> > I am currently preparing to obtain additional data from the project
>> area to
>> > support the project and additional risk calculations.  I will be doing a
>> > gamma survey (250-500 line kilometres) across the surface expression of
>> the
>> > regional redox front to determine the amount of radium deposited
>> > in agricultural soils.  The survey will inform a soil / water sampling
>> > program and perhaps samples of crops.  Since the area has been actively
>> > irrigated for over 100 years from groundwater, I feel there is a strong
>> > likelihood of significant build-up of radium and perhaps other redox
>> > sensitive elements (Se, As ,Mo etc.)  Whereas radium is not 'redox
>> > sensitive', it is incorporated in both uraninite (UO2) and coffinite
>> > (U(SiO4
>> > )0.9(OH)0.4), the most likely uranium minerals present.  Uranium itself
>> > will likely not concentrate in the soil zone because of the highly
>> > oxidizing conditions of desert soils. I have data from an analogy of the
>> > San Luis Valley in Kazakhstan, where I have detailed trenching data in
>> > similar soils.  The uranium tends to be easily mobilized vertically
>> whereas
>> > the radium and progeny tends to remain in the upper soil zone.
>> >
>> > Since this work is being funded from my own back pocket, it will
>> probably
>> > go a bit slower than a commercial operation! But I'm starting to test my
>> > data collection systems and will be employing my horse for the gamma
>> > survey.  He only charges me hay & oats!
>> >
>> > Dan ii
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 1:45 PM, Jerry Cohen <jjc105 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > >
>> > > Dear Dan,
>> > > Several years ago, I proposed a study for the DOE comparing the
>> potential
>> > > risk resulting from the existence, in the state of Nevada, of areas
>> with
>> > > heavy concentrations of naturally occuring Arsenic as compared with
>> the
>> > > potential health effects from the Yucca mountain Waste Repository. I
>> was
>> > > informed that such information would be irrelavent. Apparenty, the
>> > > rejection of YM had nothing to do with it's potential risk. Given this
>> > > situation, I wonder why the government pursued the project, spending
>> > > enormous budgets on health effects studies, despite the sure knowledge
>> > that
>> > > the project would fail--and the idea that naturally occurring mineral
>> > > formations in the state were more dangerous than a nuclear waste
>> > repository
>> > > was more than the DOE could handle.
>> > > Jerry Cohen
>> > >
>> > > ------------------------------
>> > > *From:* Dan McCarn <hotgreenchile at gmail.com>
>> > > *To:* Jerry Cohen <jjcohen at prodigy.net>; The International Radiation
>> > > Protection (Health Physics) Mailing List <radsafe at health.phys.iit.edu
>> >
>> > > *Sent:* Thu, February 16, 2012 12:22:09 PM
>> > > *Subject:* Re: [ RadSafe ] Biogeochemistry
>> > >
>> > > Dear Jerry:
>> > >
>> > > It was part of the "Greening of the USGS" which occurred during the
>> > > Clinton administration.  Basically, all geologists who were resource
>> > > analysts, minerals geologists and their ilk were forced-out of the
>> USGS
>> > to
>> > > make way for others.
>> > >
>> > > I am familiar with their work in the 80s, but they all disappeared.
>> > >
>> > > Dan ii
>> > >
>> > > On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 1:08 PM, Jerry Cohen <jjc105 at yahoo.com>
>> wrote:
>> > >
>> > >> Dan,
>> > >> Several years ago, as I recall, the USGS, had a group, I believe in
>> > >> Denver, who
>> > >> studied the health effects of naturally occuring toxic materials
>> > (arsenic,
>> > >> mercury, radium, etc.) They did some interesting work and published a
>> > >> monograph
>> > >> on the subject. Somehow this area of study fell out favor and the
>> group
>> > no
>> > >> longer exists. Are you familiar with this work, and do you know what
>> > >> happened?
>> > >> Jerry Cohen
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> ________________________________
>> > >> From: Dan McCarn <hotgreenchile at gmail.com>
>> > >> To: The International Radiation Protection (Health Physics)
>> MailingList
>> > >> <radsafe at health.phys.iit.edu>
>> > >> Sent: Thu, February 16, 2012 3:35:13 AM
>> > >> Subject: Re: [ RadSafe ] Theme session on Geohealth at the 2012 Rocky
>> > >> Mountain
>> > >> Section GSA meeting.
>> > >>
>> > >> Dear Malcolm:
>> > >>
>> > >> I will be submitting an abstract - I'll have it to you tomorrow.
>> > >>
>> > >> Dan ii
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> On Wed, Jan 11, 2012 at 9:27 PM, Dan W McCarn <
>> hotgreenchile at gmail.com
>> > >> >wrote:
>> > >>
>> > >> > ** ** ** ** **
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Dear RADSAFE colleagues:****
>> > >> >
>> > >> > ** **
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Malcolm Siegel of the **School** of **Medicine**, ****University**
>> of
>> > >> **New
>> > >> > Mexico**** has asked me to forward the following meeting
>> announcement
>> > to
>> > >> > RADSAFE:  GSA is the Geological Society of America.****
>> > >> >
>> > >> > ** **
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Please respond to Malcolm directly at mdsiegel at unm.edu ****
>> > >> >
>> > >> > ** **
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Dan ii -- Dan W McCarn, Geologist ****
>> > >> >  ------------------------------
>> > >> >
>> > >> > ** **
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Dear Colleagues:****
>> > >> >
>> > >> > ** **
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Please consider submitting an abstract to the following Theme
>> Session
>> > on
>> > >> > Geohealth at the 2012 Rocky Mountain Section GSA meeting.****
>> > >> >
>> > >> > ** **
>> > >> >
>> > >> > T-5. Arsenic, Uranium and Radionuclides: Geology and Health
>> Impacts in
>> > >> > the Southwest and Rocky Mountains Convener: Malcolm Siegel, School
>> of
>> > >> > Medicine, ****University** of **New Mexico********
>> > >> >
>> > >> > ** **
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Concentrations of carcinogenic arsenic and radium and nephrotoxic
>> > >> uranium
>> > >> > are naturally high in rocks and waters in many parts of the Navajo
>> > >> Nation
>> > >> > and in the Southwest and **Rocky Mountain States**. Development of
>> > >> > mineral resources and urbanization has led to significant
>> pollution in
>> > >> > several areas. Populations may be exposed to these substances via
>> > >> > inhalation, ingestion and dermal routes. Evaluation of health
>> effects
>> > >> due
>> > >> > to past and potential future exposures has political, social and
>> > >> economic
>> > >> > implications and requires collaboration among earth scientists,
>> civil
>> > >> > engineers and health professionals. This session will bring
>> together
>> > >> > researchers from academic, government and private agencies to
>> examine
>> > >> > various dimensions of topics such as past and proposed uranium
>> mining
>> > >> and
>> > >> > the impact of new drinking water regulations for arsenic and
>> > >> radionuclides
>> > >> > on communities in this area.  The meeting will be held May 9-12 in
>> > ****
>> > >> > Albuquerque**, **NM****. The link to the meeting is:****
>> > >> >
>> > >> > ** **
>> > >> >
>> > >> > http://www.geosociety.org/Sections/rm/2012mtg/****
>> > >> >
>> > >> > ** **
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Abstracts can be submitted until Feb 14, 2012 at: ****
>> > >> >
>> > >> > http://www.geosociety.org/Sections/rm/2012mtg/techProg.htm****
>> > >> >
>> > >> > ** **
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Please note that I have moved from Sandia National Labs to the
>> > >> ****School*
>> > >> > * of **Medicine**** at UNM; my new contact information is below.
>> > Thank
>> > >> > you and Happy New Year.  ****
>> > >> >
>> > >> > ** **
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Malcolm   ****
>> > >> >
>> > >> > ** **
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Malcolm Siegel, Ph.D., M.P.H. ****
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Environmental Geochemistry and Epidemiology ****
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Department of Internal Medicine Division of Epidemiology and
>> > >> Biostatistics
>> > >> > ****
>> > >> >
>> > >> > ****University** of **New Mexico**** mdsiegel at unm.edu
>> > >> msiegel51 at yahoo.com
>> > >> > 505-688-3716****
>> > >> >
>> > >> > ** **
>> > >> >
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> --
>> > >> Dan ii
>> > >>
>> > >> Dan W McCarn, Geologist
>> > >> 108 Sherwood Blvd
>> > >> Los Alamos, NM 87544-3425
>> > >> +1-505-672-2014 (Home – New Mexico)
>> > >> +1-505-670-8123 (Mobile - New Mexico)
>> > >> HotGreenChile at gmail.com (Private email) HotGreenChile at gmail dot
>> com
>> > >> _______________________________________________
>> > >> You are currently subscribed to the RadSafe mailing list
>> > >>
>> > >> Before posting a message to RadSafe be sure to have read and
>> understood
>> > >> the
>> > >> RadSafe rules. These can be found at:
>> > >> http://health.phys.iit.edu/radsaferules.html
>> > >>
>> > >> For information on how to subscribe or unsubscribe and other settings
>> > >> visit:
>> > >> http://health.phys.iit.edu
>> > >> _______________________________________________
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>> > >>
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>> > >> the RadSafe rules. These can be found at:
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>> > >>
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>> > >> visit: http://health.phys.iit.edu
>> > >>
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > _______________________________________________
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>
>
>
> --
> Dan ii
>
> Dan W McCarn, Geologist
> 108 Sherwood Blvd
> Los Alamos, NM 87544-3425
> +1-505-672-2014 (Home – New Mexico)
> +1-505-670-8123 (Mobile - New Mexico)
> HotGreenChile at gmail.com (Private email) HotGreenChile at gmail dot com
>
>


-- 
Dan ii

Dan W McCarn, Geologist
108 Sherwood Blvd
Los Alamos, NM 87544-3425
+1-505-672-2014 (Home – New Mexico)
+1-505-670-8123 (Mobile - New Mexico)
HotGreenChile at gmail.com (Private email) HotGreenChile at gmail dot com

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